You can now try Ramy’s scary outlanding on Lake Tahoe golf course on Condor

[Bret Hess]

Ramy completed the real-life very challenging outlanding in a tailwind, uphill. His glider had a little damage from a groundloop. I’m guessing he did the groundloop because he was very close to the trees at the end of the fairway. See the golf course in satellite view and his landing track at https://drive.google.com/file/d/1B8YlV-KQrDmisj8yo1cLuaAlnEC0vCgH/view?usp=sharing. It's the fairway furthest east.

Jim Ketcham and I removed the randomly-generated trees from the previous Condor Truckee landscape version (2.1) of the landscape that were covering most of that golf course, and put trees where they should be lining the fairways, from the satellite image. The golf course is also now an “airport” but you can’t take off from there.

In Truckee v 2.2 with the trees in Condor accurately placed the outlanding is challenging, especially the first time.
___________________________________

Try the outlanding yourself! It’s great practice.

You need the Truckee v2.2 landscape (came out this week). Get it from Condor Club (updater) or at skylinescondor.com/landscapes

Condor task for Ramy’s tailwind conditions: Starts over Truckee at 4900 ft AGL, you can easily glide to the golf course. 7 kt wind from the south:
https://www.condor-club.eu/showtask/0/?id=15852
or http://199.192.98.227:8080/landscapes-zip/Truckee-Tahoe_Jul_25_2020_golf_course_landing.fpl

Condor task for random wind practice. Starts 1000 ft AGL over the golf course. Quickly judge the wind direction and choose which fairway to land on. https://www.condor-club.eu/showtask/0/?id=15854 or http://199.192.98.227:8080/landscapes-zip/Lake_Tahoe_golf_course_land_random_wind_1000 _ftAGL.fpl

If you want to add a “fear factor” for realism, before your first try call up a friend and promise to pay him or a charity some large sum if you crash on your first try :). Or post here your $ amount first and then try it and tell us how it went. It works.

Ramy, can we improve anything?

More background:

Here’s the discussion on Ramy’s flight: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.aviation.soaring/c/AadCMlOeak0/m/LUctfNEnBAAJ

See Ramy Y’s description in his notes for the track: https://www.onlinecontest.org/olc-3.0/gliding/flightinfo.html?dsId=8033935 .

[Bret Hess]

Correction: reading Ramy's description again, the ground loop was from some bushes he caught. But still, he's close to the trees at the end!

[Bret Hess]

Here's a link again to the random wind practice task...the previous link didn't paste well:

http://199.192.98.227:8080/landscapes-zip/Lake_Tahoe_golf_course_land_random_wind_1000_ftAGL .fpl

[Ramy[_2_]]

Well, thanks, I am honored, although not sure I deserve this honor ;)
I shouldn’t have put myself in this situation to start with...
I should add that walking and checking this golf course few years ago and concluding I can probably land there in emergency made it less challenging and scary than it would be otherwise.
You can see photos of the final stopping place in the following link. The nose pointing to the same direction of landing after a full 360 degrees ground loop after hitting small bush with rocks with the right wing tip.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/kdsmqgofehvfdy5/AAAchUQbiHIUQq4D5QASrb_La?dl=0
My glider is flying again after Danny at Williams repaired it in less than 3 weeks.

Ramy

[Eric Greenwell[_4_]]

Ramy wrote on 8/18/2020 2:18 PM:
> Well, thanks, I am honored, although not sure I deserve this honor ;)
> I shouldn’t have put myself in this situation to start with...
> I should add that walking and checking this golf course few years ago and concluding I can probably land there in emergency made it less challenging and scary than it would be otherwise.
> You can see photos of the final stopping place in the following link. The nose pointing to the same direction of landing after a full 360 degrees ground loop after hitting small bush with rocks with the right wing tip.
> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/kdsmqgofehvfdy5/AAAchUQbiHIUQq4D5QASrb_La?dl=0
> My glider is flying again after Danny at Williams repaired it in less than 3 weeks.

Sometimes, I wish my 18M glider was a 15M glider, so it would fit onto more
runways and into more landing areas. And, if I ever had to do a field retrieve,
I'd probably wish it were a 13.5M glider :^)

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1

[Ramy[_2_]]

I should also add that there is a 6ft pole in the middle of the fairway effectively cutting the width by half. You can see it in one of the photos.
Also I am not sure if I already shared the 3D replay of my flight and landing on Ayvri https://ayvri.com/scene/d9kd8vxqj2/ckd2u6exh00013b5qxkq4d22p
(Note that Ayvri is showing 500 feet lower altitude, probably using standard pressure altitude)

Anyway, again, I am not proud of my decision making in the last 20 min of the flight which resulted in this landing. I am hoping to never repeat that and plan to maintain safer margins.

Ramy

[2G]

On Tuesday, August 18, 2020 at 2:49:00 PM UTC-7, Ramy wrote:
> I should also add that there is a 6ft pole in the middle of the fairway effectively cutting the width by half. You can see it in one of the photos.
> Also I am not sure if I already shared the 3D replay of my flight and landing on Ayvri https://ayvri.com/scene/d9kd8vxqj2/ckd2u6exh00013b5qxkq4d22p
> (Note that Ayvri is showing 500 feet lower altitude, probably using standard pressure altitude)
>
> Anyway, again, I am not proud of my decision making in the last 20 min of the flight which resulted in this landing. I am hoping to never repeat that and plan to maintain safer margins.
>
> Ramy

That pole is the 150 yard marker (from the green) that is on most fairways other than par 3s. They are usually made of 1.5" PVC pipe, so they will break, but may do damage to the leading edge.

Was the glider moved after you stopped, or is that its final position?

Tom

[Ramy[_2_]]

This was final stop. Would have made the green if I didn’t ground loop...

Ramy

[John Cochrane[_3_]]

Ramy:
A big thanks for posting the story, the trace, and the live view. You've really helped us all learn from this. From the animation it seems pretty clear your goose was cooked the minute you got through the 50 gap. Slowly losing at Sergio's, slowly losing at the hang glider ridge, there is nothing to do. Congratulations on breaking the accident chain. Making that landing took some great airmanship at the end of a long day.
John Cochrane BB

[Eric Greenwell[_4_]]

John Cochrane wrote on 8/19/2020 6:49 AM:
> Ramy:
> A big thanks for posting the story, the trace, and the live view. You've really helped us all learn from this. From the animation it seems pretty clear your goose was cooked the minute you got through the 50 gap. Slowly losing at Sergio's, slowly losing at the hang glider ridge, there is nothing to do. Congratulations on breaking the accident chain. Making that landing took some great airmanship at the end of a long day.
> John Cochrane BB
>
And I'm thinking the 40 degree landing flaps on the ASG29 were important, too.
They are a big reason I bought an ASW 20 in the 80's and an ASH26E in the 90s.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1

[[email protected]]

> Making that landing took some great airmanship at the end of a long day.

Great main wheel skid mark from the 'fly it sideways' breaking action!

Especially nice there is no matching mark for the tail. Nicely flown all the way to full stop.

Any grass/dirt in the main wheel bead between the tire and rim?

[kinsell]

On 8/19/20 9:32 AM, wrote:
>> Making that landing took some great airmanship at the end of a long day.
>
> Great main wheel skid mark from the 'fly it sideways' breaking action!
>
> Especially nice there is no matching mark for the tail. Nicely flown all the way to full stop.
>
> Any grass/dirt in the main wheel bead between the tire and rim?
>

Just out of curiosity, how upset were the people at the golf course?

[Ramy[_2_]]

There was no one playing at the fairway when I landed. The folks you see in the pictures came out from the nearby homes, including the golf course owner. Of course I explained that I only landed there after overflying it to verify there was no one there. Not only they were not upset, but they were very friendly and helpful, brought me water and helped me move the glider and break it down. The owner was concerned about possible damage to the fairway but after looking at the skid marks he shrugged it off.

Ramy