182 questions

[Paul Anton]

I am hoping to tap some of the expertise here to solve a problem I have run
into.

I am a retired guy who was called by a local Part 141 school to fill in as
their flightline mechanic until they could find a permanent A&P. They have
an early 182RG (serial 141) that has an ongoing electrical problem.

My first question concerns the ammeter. I have definitely confirmed that the
ammeter is defective. It appears like the ENTIRE gage cluster will have to
be replaced. The parts manual shows that the original gage is not available.
A supersession was listed which also consisted of a single gage. However
when this was pursued it was not available as a single replacement.

So my question is has anyone come up with a solution for a single defective
gage in this cluster that does not involve replacing the entire thing? How
about an instrument shop that would rebuild the ammeter? I have been unable
to find an instrument shop that would bother with an ammeter.


Here's my second question. I think the reason the ammeter broke is that it
simply wore out. The voltage and hence the current is constantly varying.
The original ammeter needle was oscillating so much that you couldn't tell
if the system was charging or not. I put a test ammeter in series and the
although the ammeter could be read, it was still oscillating. A check with
an analog meter showed fluctuations that increased in frequency as the RPM
was increased. Ditto for increasing the load. A scope shows about 900 mv
peak.

Persons before me have replaced the alternator and regulator. (a note here,
the regulator is the simple 3 wire unit)
All grounds were cleaned and remade.

Any hints of where I should begin my search would be greatly appreciated. I
have to pull this beast out of the hanger to run it up. With out Northwest
weather I haven't had two clear days to work on it outside and I'm too old
and stiff to do a lot under the panel. So any hints or experience of a
similar trouble would really be appreciated.

I'm going to jumper the alternator field portion of the dual master switch
to start with but beyond that ----------------


Thanks in advance

Paul Anton

[Cy Galley]

Do you have an oscilloscope. Check the alternator output wave form. I'll
bet that you have at least one bad diode.


--
Cy Galley - Chair,
AirVenture Emergency Aircraft Repair
A Service Project of Chapter 75
EAA Safety Programs Editor - TC
EAA Sport Pilot

"Paul Anton" > wrote in message
...
>I am hoping to tap some of the expertise here to solve a problem I have run
>into.
>
> I am a retired guy who was called by a local Part 141 school to fill in as
> their flightline mechanic until they could find a permanent A&P. They have
> an early 182RG (serial 141) that has an ongoing electrical problem.
>
> My first question concerns the ammeter. I have definitely confirmed that
> the ammeter is defective. It appears like the ENTIRE gage cluster will
> have to be replaced. The parts manual shows that the original gage is not
> available. A supersession was listed which also consisted of a single
> gage. However when this was pursued it was not available as a single
> replacement.
>
> So my question is has anyone come up with a solution for a single
> defective gage in this cluster that does not involve replacing the entire
> thing? How about an instrument shop that would rebuild the ammeter? I have
> been unable to find an instrument shop that would bother with an ammeter.
>
>
> Here's my second question. I think the reason the ammeter broke is that it
> simply wore out. The voltage and hence the current is constantly varying.
> The original ammeter needle was oscillating so much that you couldn't tell
> if the system was charging or not. I put a test ammeter in series and the
> although the ammeter could be read, it was still oscillating. A check with
> an analog meter showed fluctuations that increased in frequency as the RPM
> was increased. Ditto for increasing the load. A scope shows about 900 mv
> peak.
>
> Persons before me have replaced the alternator and regulator. (a note
> here, the regulator is the simple 3 wire unit)
> All grounds were cleaned and remade.
>
> Any hints of where I should begin my search would be greatly appreciated.
> I have to pull this beast out of the hanger to run it up. With out
> Northwest weather I haven't had two clear days to work on it outside and
> I'm too old and stiff to do a lot under the panel. So any hints or
> experience of a similar trouble would really be appreciated.
>
> I'm going to jumper the alternator field portion of the dual master switch
> to start with but beyond that ----------------
>
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> Paul Anton
>

[John_F]

You did not say what was wrong with the amp meter.
If you replace the cluster Cessna will make sure that owner's pocket
will be picked clean because you will have to replace the fuel $ender$
also.
I have fixed several amp meters that had high resistance by just
tightening up the terminal nuts on the back of the case. The fiber
shoulder washers compress after a few years and remove the clamping
pressure on the shunt inside the case of the ammeter. This increases
the resistance from the terminals to the shunt and makes it run hot
and have too much voltage drop. This can cause all sorts of
interesting intermittent problems.
I would also look at the 60 amp alternator breaker. With age they
tend to trip at much lower currents and have too much voltage drop.

You can verify this with a 4 wire Kelvin ohm meter setup.
With a one amp load every millivolt is one milliohm of resistance.
John

On Wed, 11 May 2005 18:29:29 -0700, "Paul Anton" >
wrote:

>I am hoping to tap some of the expertise here to solve a problem I have run
>into.
>
>I am a retired guy who was called by a local Part 141 school to fill in as
>their flightline mechanic until they could find a permanent A&P. They have
>an early 182RG (serial 141) that has an ongoing electrical problem.
>
>My first question concerns the ammeter. I have definitely confirmed that the
>ammeter is defective. It appears like the ENTIRE gage cluster will have to
>be replaced. The parts manual shows that the original gage is not available.
>A supersession was listed which also consisted of a single gage. However
>when this was pursued it was not available as a single replacement.
>
>So my question is has anyone come up with a solution for a single defective
>gage in this cluster that does not involve replacing the entire thing? How
>about an instrument shop that would rebuild the ammeter? I have been unable
>to find an instrument shop that would bother with an ammeter.
>
>
>Here's my second question. I think the reason the ammeter broke is that it
>simply wore out. The voltage and hence the current is constantly varying.
>The original ammeter needle was oscillating so much that you couldn't tell
>if the system was charging or not. I put a test ammeter in series and the
>although the ammeter could be read, it was still oscillating. A check with
>an analog meter showed fluctuations that increased in frequency as the RPM
>was increased. Ditto for increasing the load. A scope shows about 900 mv
>peak.
>
>Persons before me have replaced the alternator and regulator. (a note here,
>the regulator is the simple 3 wire unit)
>All grounds were cleaned and remade.
>
>Any hints of where I should begin my search would be greatly appreciated. I
>have to pull this beast out of the hanger to run it up. With out Northwest
>weather I haven't had two clear days to work on it outside and I'm too old
>and stiff to do a lot under the panel. So any hints or experience of a
>similar trouble would really be appreciated.
>
>I'm going to jumper the alternator field portion of the dual master switch
>to start with but beyond that ----------------
>
>
>Thanks in advance
>
>Paul Anton
>

[Tom Cummings]

Contact Air-Parts of Lock Haven at
http://www.airpartsoflockhaven.com/index.html
Their website has a parts catalog and they repair instruments also. They
repair my Cessna oil temp gauge.
Tom
"Paul Anton" > wrote in message
...
>I am hoping to tap some of the expertise here to solve a problem I have run
>into.
>
> I am a retired guy who was called by a local Part 141 school to fill in as
> their flightline mechanic until they could find a permanent A&P. They have
> an early 182RG (serial 141) that has an ongoing electrical problem.
>
> My first question concerns the ammeter. I have definitely confirmed that
> the ammeter is defective. It appears like the ENTIRE gage cluster will
> have to be replaced. The parts manual shows that the original gage is not
> available. A supersession was listed which also consisted of a single
> gage. However when this was pursued it was not available as a single
> replacement.
>
> So my question is has anyone come up with a solution for a single
> defective gage in this cluster that does not involve replacing the entire
> thing? How about an instrument shop that would rebuild the ammeter? I have
> been unable to find an instrument shop that would bother with an ammeter.
>
>
> Here's my second question. I think the reason the ammeter broke is that it
> simply wore out. The voltage and hence the current is constantly varying.
> The original ammeter needle was oscillating so much that you couldn't tell
> if the system was charging or not. I put a test ammeter in series and the
> although the ammeter could be read, it was still oscillating. A check with
> an analog meter showed fluctuations that increased in frequency as the RPM
> was increased. Ditto for increasing the load. A scope shows about 900 mv
> peak.
>
> Persons before me have replaced the alternator and regulator. (a note
> here, the regulator is the simple 3 wire unit)
> All grounds were cleaned and remade.
>
> Any hints of where I should begin my search would be greatly appreciated.
> I have to pull this beast out of the hanger to run it up. With out
> Northwest weather I haven't had two clear days to work on it outside and
> I'm too old and stiff to do a lot under the panel. So any hints or
> experience of a similar trouble would really be appreciated.
>
> I'm going to jumper the alternator field portion of the dual master switch
> to start with but beyond that ----------------
>
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> Paul Anton
>

[[email protected]]

> >
> >Persons before me have replaced the alternator and regulator. (a
note here,
> >the regulator is the simple 3 wire unit)
> >All grounds were cleaned and remade.

It would be interesting to know why the alternator and regulator
were replaced in the first place. Perhaps the same problem? I'd check
that old pull-type master switch to see if the alternator control side
of it is dirty and letting the alternator relay fall open or chatter.
Those old switches had grease in them that got hard with age and
collected dust.

Dan

[[email protected]]

Forget my last post about the pull-type master switch. I didn't
read the original post well enough to see that it was a 182RG, not a
182. Big difference in years. I'm still working on the first cup of
coffee this morning.
We have 182RG serial 122. No alternator problems.

Dan