WOW, look at this engine

[Shin Gou]

http://www.greenengtech.com/index.htm

Click on the "English" button on the left.

The company claims it's a revolutionary six-stroke rotary engine.
120hp, 60lbs. Are they kidding me or what?

[Steve Foley]

Check out the two-o'clock photo under applications.

http://www.greenengtech.com/application.htm

I wonder if they're in the same league.


"Shin Gou" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> http://www.greenengtech.com/index.htm
>
> Click on the "English" button on the left.
>
> The company claims it's a revolutionary six-stroke rotary engine.
> 120hp, 60lbs. Are they kidding me or what?
>

[[email protected]]

I hope this is for real, but I somehow doubt it, it's probably one of
those neverending development projects. Also, with that little weight
compared to comprable powered engines, unless an aircraft is
specifically designed for this engine just for weight and balance's
sake you'd have to put at least 100 pounds of dead weight on the nose
or move the engine forward a good couple of feet.

Steve Foley wrote:
> Check out the two-o'clock photo under applications.
>
> http://www.greenengtech.com/application.htm
>
> I wonder if they're in the same league.
>
>
> "Shin Gou" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> > http://www.greenengtech.com/index.htm
> >
> > Click on the "English" button on the left.
> >
> > The company claims it's a revolutionary six-stroke rotary engine.
> > 120hp, 60lbs. Are they kidding me or what?
> >

[Richard Isakson]

"Shin Gou" wrote ...
> http://www.greenengtech.com/index.htm
>
> Click on the "English" button on the left.
>
> The company claims it's a revolutionary six-stroke rotary engine.
> 120hp, 60lbs. Are they kidding me or what?
>

Why would you believe *anything* this company tells you? Here you have an
engine that hasn't even run, that can't be lighter or more efficient than a
fourstroke and who's principale are seeking investors and customers to send
them money for an idea that doesn't exist, yet you're ready endorse them?
Magic engines come and go but they never work. From an engineering point of
view, the world is the way the world is for a reason. You can push at the
side box but you can't jump out of it.

This unpopular viewpoint brought to you by:
Rich

[Richard Isakson]

"Richard Riley" wrote ...
> I wonder how the thousands of employees at
> Stavatti Aerospace are doing... http://www.stavatti.com/

But Richard, they MUST be real. They have a way cool website.

Rich

[MJC]

Yup. This attempt to attract "Green" investors is getting pretty close to
the equivilant of the 419 Nigerian scam emails we all keep getting.
www.ebolamonkeyman.com

MJC
"Richard Isakson" > wrote in message
...
> "Shin Gou" wrote ...
> > http://www.greenengtech.com/index.htm
> >
> > Click on the "English" button on the left.
> >
> > The company claims it's a revolutionary six-stroke rotary engine.
> > 120hp, 60lbs. Are they kidding me or what?
> >
>
> Why would you believe *anything* this company tells you? Here you have an
> engine that hasn't even run, that can't be lighter or more efficient than
a
> fourstroke and who's principale are seeking investors and customers to
send
> them money for an idea that doesn't exist, yet you're ready endorse them?
> Magic engines come and go but they never work. From an engineering point
of
> view, the world is the way the world is for a reason. You can push at the
> side box but you can't jump out of it.
>
> This unpopular viewpoint brought to you by:
> Rich
>
>

[Richard Isakson]

"Richard Riley" wrote ...
> On Thu, 26 May 2005 09:21:18 -0700, "Richard Isakson"
> > wrote:
>
> :"Richard Riley" wrote ...
> :> I wonder how the thousands of employees at
> :> Stavatti Aerospace are doing... http://www.stavatti.com/
> :
> :But Richard, they MUST be real. They have a way cool website.
>
> Other people have thought the same thing...
>
> http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/stories/1998/08/24/story1.html


And what's the only product this company produces? Drums. Stavatti
Percussion makes drums. This guy could give Cambell a run for his money.

Rich

[jerry wass]

Richard Riley wrote:
> On Thu, 26 May 2005 07:32:22 -0700, "Richard Isakson"
> > wrote:
>
> :"Shin Gou" wrote ...
> :> http://www.greenengtech.com/index.htm
> :>
> :> Click on the "English" button on the left.
> :>
> :> The company claims it's a revolutionary six-stroke rotary engine.
> :> 120hp, 60lbs. Are they kidding me or what?
> :>
> :
> :Why would you believe *anything* this company tells you? Here you have an
> :engine that hasn't even run, that can't be lighter or more efficient than a
> :fourstroke and who's principale are seeking investors and customers to send
> :them money for an idea that doesn't exist, yet you're ready endorse them?
> :Magic engines come and go but they never work. From an engineering point of
> :view, the world is the way the world is for a reason. You can push at the
> :side box but you can't jump out of it.
>
> Heck, I can't even get their java applet heavy website to run.
>
> Yet more vaporware. I wonder how the thousands of employees at
> Stavatti Aerospace are doing... http://www.stavatti.com/

I dunno, but I bet they could sell small ones as japanese throwing
knives/stars..

[Anthony W]

Richard Isakson wrote:
> "Richard Riley" wrote ...
>
>>I wonder how the thousands of employees at
>>Stavatti Aerospace are doing... http://www.stavatti.com/
>
>
> But Richard, they MUST be real. They have a way cool website.
>
> Rich

They remind me a lot of Moller...

Tony

[Alan Baker]

In article >,
Richard Riley > wrote:

> On Thu, 26 May 2005 07:32:22 -0700, "Richard Isakson"
> > wrote:
>
> :"Shin Gou" wrote ...
> :> http://www.greenengtech.com/index.htm
> :>
> :> Click on the "English" button on the left.
> :>
> :> The company claims it's a revolutionary six-stroke rotary engine.
> :> 120hp, 60lbs. Are they kidding me or what?
> :>
> :
> :Why would you believe *anything* this company tells you? Here you have an
> :engine that hasn't even run, that can't be lighter or more efficient than a
> :fourstroke and who's principale are seeking investors and customers to send
> :them money for an idea that doesn't exist, yet you're ready endorse them?
> :Magic engines come and go but they never work. From an engineering point of
> :view, the world is the way the world is for a reason. You can push at the
> :side box but you can't jump out of it.
>
> Heck, I can't even get their java applet heavy website to run.
>
> Yet more vaporware. I wonder how the thousands of employees at
> Stavatti Aerospace are doing... http://www.stavatti.com/

Now that's some impressive delusion!

--
Alan Baker
Vancouver, British Columbia
"If you raise the ceiling 4 feet, move the fireplace from that wall
to that wall, you'll still only get the full stereophonic effect
if you sit in the bottom of that cupboard."

[[email protected]]

Shin Gou wrote:
> http://www.greenengtech.com/index.htm
>
> Click on the "English" button on the left.
>
> The company claims it's a revolutionary six-stroke rotary engine.
> 120hp, 60lbs. Are they kidding me or what?

Actually, the answer to that question is helpfully provided in their
FAQ, question 5, "What will consultants probably say when I ask them
about the Green Engine?" With answer "They will say we are smoking
crack."

Well, actually, their answer is a bit more long-winded:

There is an engineering phenomenon that most all consultants disagree
with each other, and there is a great deal of prejudice or competition
between any of the various technologies. (I.E. Turbine specialists
discount piston technology and vice versa). Furthermore, few
consultants will give a positive report on any technology they are not
directly involved with because of liability. Also, any consultant has a
limited expertise dependent on their actual "hands on" experience, and
outside experts can only get very limited basic information about a new
technology which is being under development (Normally the most
important technology would never be showed by owner). It seems that you
ask a steam engine expert for questions about the jet engine.

[Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired]

Anthony W wrote:

> Richard Isakson wrote:
>
>> "Richard Riley" wrote ...
>>
>>> I wonder how the thousands of employees at
>>> Stavatti Aerospace are doing... http://www.stavatti.com/
>>
>>
>>
>> But Richard, they MUST be real. They have a way cool website.
>>
>> Rich
>
>
> They remind me a lot of Moller...
>
> Tony

They even have have a picture of Moller's sky car.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired.

[Morgans]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> I hope this is for real, but I somehow doubt it, it's probably one of
> those neverending development projects. Also, with that little weight
> compared to comprable powered engines, unless an aircraft is
> specifically designed for this engine just for weight and balance's
> sake you'd have to put at least 100 pounds of dead weight on the nose
> or move the engine forward a good couple of feet.

Shoot, if that is the only problem, just stack the rotors, and make an
engine with 4 times the power, or whatever is needed for it to weigh the
same as the engine it is replacing. More power is seldom a BIG problem, if
it does not weigh too much.

I hope this engine is for real, and it comes to market. It does look
interesting, and possible, to me.
--
Jim in NC

[Ernest Christley]

Shin Gou wrote:
> http://www.greenengtech.com/index.htm
>
> Click on the "English" button on the left.
>
> The company claims it's a revolutionary six-stroke rotary engine.
> 120hp, 60lbs. Are they kidding me or what?
>

I'm not sure, but I want to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume
that is a redundant question?

Look at what they are proposing. A long sliding vane in a tight slot.
This sliding vane composes one entire side of the combustion chamber.
Can you imagine the side load placed on that cantilevered beam? How
thick would the vane have to be to not bend under such loads? And now
that you've made it thicker (and heavier), what are you going to make
the sidewalls out of to withstand the centifugal loads and sliding
friction? And now it has to slide in and out of slot while loaded.
Ever tried to put a side load and a beam and slide it in a slot? And did
you look at the steep curve in the sidewall that will force the vane in?
Is there any doubt in your mind that the vane will simply be sheared off?

They're not trying to kid anyone. Either they are totally honest, and
completely ignorant of what the inside of an engineering class looks
like, or they are looking to scam some venture capitalist.

--
This is by far the hardest lesson about freedom. It goes against
instinct, and morality, to just sit back and watch people make
mistakes. We want to help them, which means control them and their
decisions, but in doing so we actually hurt them (and ourselves)."

[Anthony W]

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired wrote:

>> They remind me a lot of Moller...
>>
>> Tony
>
>
> They even have have a picture of Moller's sky car.
>
> Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired.

Maybe zoomer will tast fly it. ;o)

Tony

[Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired]

Anthony W wrote:

> Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired wrote:
>
>>> They remind me a lot of Moller...
>>>
>>> Tony
>>
>>
>>
>> They even have have a picture of Moller's sky car.
>>
>> Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired.
>
>
> Maybe zoomer will tast fly it. ;o)
>
> Tony

If he hasn't already.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

[Sport Pilot]

Richard Isakson wrote:
> "Shin Gou" wrote ...
> > http://www.greenengtech.com/index.htm
> >
> > Click on the "English" button on the left.
> >
> > The company claims it's a revolutionary six-stroke rotary engine.
> > 120hp, 60lbs. Are they kidding me or what?
> >
>
> Why would you believe *anything* this company tells you? Here you have an
> engine that hasn't even run, that can't be lighter or more efficient than a
> fourstroke and who's principale are seeking investors and customers to send
> them money for an idea that doesn't exist, yet you're ready endorse them?
> Magic engines come and go but they never work. From an engineering point of
> view, the world is the way the world is for a reason. You can push at the
> side box but you can't jump out of it.
>
> This unpopular viewpoint brought to you by:
> Rich

Yep, a perfect green engine. Infinitely efficent, cause it doesn't run.

[Anthony W]

Sport Pilot wrote:

>
> Yep, a perfect green engine. Infinitely efficent, cause it doesn't run.

It must have been invented by Al Gore.

Tony

[ower]

Anthony W wrote:
> Sport Pilot wrote:
>
> >
> > Yep, a perfect green engine. Infinitely efficent, cause it doesn't run.
>
> It must have been invented by Al Gore.
>
> Tony
>
Are you sure it's not an invention of mr. George dubbleU B.
A big hoax.

[Anthony W]

ower wrote:
> Anthony W wrote:
>
>>Sport Pilot wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Yep, a perfect green engine. Infinitely efficent, cause it doesn't run.
>>
>>It must have been invented by Al Gore.
>>
>>Tony
>>
>
> Are you sure it's not an invention of mr. George dubbleU B.
> A big hoax.

No, I'm sure it has more to do with the guy that wrote a environmental
book full of junk science and said he invented the Internet.

Tony

[[email protected]]

If you're interested in something along these lines, check out the
Rand-Cam engine. I believe the Rand-Cam has actually run.

Neal

www.regtech.com

[Corky Scott]

On Sat, 28 May 2005 15:57:02 GMT, Anthony W >
wrote:

>No, I'm sure it has more to do with the guy that wrote a environmental
>book full of junk science and said he invented the Internet.
>
>Tony

Tony, do you understand what Gore actually did regarding the internet,
or do you just parrot this old myth because it's sounds like such a
great line?

Corky Scott

[Jerry Springer]

Corky Scott wrote:
> On Sat, 28 May 2005 15:57:02 GMT, Anthony W >
> wrote:
>
>
>>No, I'm sure it has more to do with the guy that wrote a environmental
>>book full of junk science and said he invented the Internet.
>>
>>Tony
>
>
> Tony, do you understand what Gore actually did regarding the internet,
> or do you just parrot this old myth because it's sounds like such a
> great line?
>
> Corky Scott


http://www.firstmonday.dk/issues/issue5_10/wiggins/


http://www.sethf.com/gore/



More information than anyone would ever want to know about Al Gore and
the internet.

Jerry

[Sport Pilot]

Jerry Springer wrote:
> Corky Scott wrote:
> > On Sat, 28 May 2005 15:57:02 GMT, Anthony W >
> > wrote:
> >
> >
> >>No, I'm sure it has more to do with the guy that wrote a environmental
> >>book full of junk science and said he invented the Internet.
> >>
> >>Tony
> >
> >
> > Tony, do you understand what Gore actually did regarding the internet,
> > or do you just parrot this old myth because it's sounds like such a
> > great line?
> >
> > Corky Scott
>
>
> http://www.firstmonday.dk/issues/issue5_10/wiggins/
>
>
> http://www.sethf.com/gore/
>
>
>
> More information than anyone would ever want to know about Al Gore and
> the internet.
>
> Jerry

Larry Roberts was the inventor of the internet with his INTERface
Message Processor. This is where the name for the internet began.
Though the Military called it officially as the ARPANET, it has been
called the internet since its inception in 1969. What Gore sponsored
was an early version of the Web. Obviously he didn't have a clue as to
what his in this bill as he didn't enven know the proper name.

[Corky Scott]

On 31 May 2005 05:40:01 -0700, "Sport Pilot" >
wrote:

>Larry Roberts was the inventor of the internet with his INTERface
>Message Processor. This is where the name for the internet began.
>Though the Military called it officially as the ARPANET, it has been
>called the internet since its inception in 1969. What Gore sponsored
>was an early version of the Web. Obviously he didn't have a clue as to
>what his in this bill as he didn't enven know the proper name.

Thank you for this information "Sport Pilot" but my point wasn't who
literally invented the internet, it was that Gore has been unfairly
characterized as having claimed he had done so. In fact he never said
that, but some people love to hate him so that they continue to throw
out that quote anyway. It played well in the conservative talk shows.

Corky Scott

[Sport Pilot]

Corky Scott wrote:
> On 31 May 2005 05:40:01 -0700, "Sport Pilot" >
> wrote:
>
> >Larry Roberts was the inventor of the internet with his INTERface
> >Message Processor. This is where the name for the internet began.
> >Though the Military called it officially as the ARPANET, it has been
> >called the internet since its inception in 1969. What Gore sponsored
> >was an early version of the Web. Obviously he didn't have a clue as to
> >what his in this bill as he didn't enven know the proper name.
>
> Thank you for this information "Sport Pilot" but my point wasn't who
> literally invented the internet, it was that Gore has been unfairly
> characterized as having claimed he had done so. In fact he never said
> that, but some people love to hate him so that they continue to throw
> out that quote anyway. It played well in the conservative talk shows.
>
> Corky Scott

Gore said he "took the inititive to invent the internet". Which means
he claimed he invented the internet. Thing is he was confused about
exactly what he did take initive on. Not only was he dishonest, he was
stupid, he never was able to explain what he was talking about.

[Gig 601XL Builder]

"Corky Scott" > wrote in message
...
> On 31 May 2005 05:40:01 -0700, "Sport Pilot" >
> wrote:
>
>>Larry Roberts was the inventor of the internet with his INTERface
>>Message Processor. This is where the name for the internet began.
>>Though the Military called it officially as the ARPANET, it has been
>>called the internet since its inception in 1969. What Gore sponsored
>>was an early version of the Web. Obviously he didn't have a clue as to
>>what his in this bill as he didn't enven know the proper name.
>
> Thank you for this information "Sport Pilot" but my point wasn't who
> literally invented the internet, it was that Gore has been unfairly
> characterized as having claimed he had done so. In fact he never said
> that, but some people love to hate him so that they continue to throw
> out that quote anyway. It played well in the conservative talk shows.
>
> Corky Scott
>
>

What Gore said was, "I took the initiative in creating the Internet." and it
played well everywhere from Leno to Rush to The New York Times.

It was a really stupid thing to say.

[Sport Pilot]

Sorry, he said he created the internet, not invented it. So what?

[Corky Scott]

On 31 May 2005 07:05:48 -0700, "Sport Pilot" >
wrote:

>Gore said he "took the inititive to invent the internet". Which means
>he claimed he invented the internet. Thing is he was confused about
>exactly what he did take initive on. Not only was he dishonest, he was
>stupid, he never was able to explain what he was talking about.

"Snopes.com" explains it best:

Claim: Vice-President Al Gore claimed that he "invented" the
Internet.

Status: False.

Origins: Despite the derisive references that continue even today,
Al Gore did not claim he "invented" the Internet, nor did he say
anything that could reasonably be interpreted that way. The "Al Gore
said he 'invented' the Internet" put-downs were misleading,
out-of-context distortions of something he said during an interview
with Wolf Blitzer on CNN's "Late Edition" program on 9 March 1999.
When asked to describe what distinguished him from his challenger for
the Democratic presidential nomination, Senator Bill Bradley of New
Jersey, Gore replied (in part):
During my service in the United States Congress, I took the initiative
in creating the Internet. I took the initiative in moving forward a
whole range of initiatives that have proven to be important to our
country's economic growth and environmental protection, improvements
in our educational system.

Clearly, although Gore's phrasing was clumsy (and perhaps
self-serving), he was not claiming that he "invented" the Internet (in
the sense of having designed or implemented it), but that he was
responsible, in an economic and legislative sense, for fostering the
development the I also invented the microphone technology that we now
know as the Internet. To claim that Gore was seriously trying to take
credit for the "invention" of the Internet is, frankly, just silly
political posturing that arose out of a close presidential campaign.
Gore never used the word "invent," and the words "create" and "invent"
have distinctly different meanings — the former is used in the sense
of "to bring about" or "to bring into existence" while the latter is
generally used to signify the first instance of someone's thinking up
or implementing an idea. (To those who say the words "create" and
"invent" mean exactly the same thing, we have to ask why, then, the
media overwhelmingly and consistently cited Gore as having claimed he
"invented" the Internet, even though he never used that word, and
transcripts of what he actually said were readily available.)

If President Eisenhower had said in the mid-1960s that he, while
President, "created" the Interstate Highway System, we would not have
seen dozens and dozens of editorials lampooning him for claiming he
"invented" the concept of highways or implying that he personally went
out and dug ditches across the country to help build the roadway.
Everyone would have understood that Ike meant he was a driving force
behind the legislation that created the highway system, and this was
the very same concept Al Gore was expressing about himself with his
Internet statement.

Again, thanks to Snopes.com for the above comment.

Corky Scott

[Sport Pilot]

The people is obviously bias. I see no diferance in saying "I invented
the internet" and "I took the initiative to create the internet".
Since he was obviously talking about creating a single internet network
or line, as with a highway system, to create and invent is the same
thing. You cannot create something that does not exist if not
invented. You cannot invent without creating something. They are only
differant when talking a smaller scale. You can create a new canopener
that has been made before, but you can only invent it if it had not
been made, but in so doing you will have created one unit. Since the
internet is a new system the words have the same meaning.

The arguement about President Eisenhower is moot because he never said
it. Since Eisenhower actually had a head on his shouders I doubt he
would have made such a gaffe. If so he would have been able to explain
it. Gore didn't seem to have a clue that his legislation was about the
Web, and that the internet had been invented almost two decades before
his legislation.

[Richard Isakson]

"Corky Scott" wrote ...
> "Snopes.com" explains it best:
>
> Claim: Vice-President Al Gore claimed that he "invented" the
> Internet.
>
> Status: False.
<snip>
> Gore never used the word "invent," and the words "create" and "invent"
> have distinctly different meanings - the former is used in the sense
> of "to bring about" or "to bring into existence" while the latter is
> generally used to signify the first instance of someone's thinking up
> or implementing an idea.

So it's a matter of what the definition of 'is' is ... I mean 'create' is.
Exactly what, if anything, did Gore do to 'create' the internet?

Rich

[Corky Scott]

On 31 May 2005 11:28:59 -0700, "Sport Pilot" >
wrote:

>The arguement about President Eisenhower is moot because he never said
>it. Since Eisenhower actually had a head on his shouders I doubt he
>would have made such a gaffe. If so he would have been able to explain
>it. Gore didn't seem to have a clue that his legislation was about the
>Web, and that the internet had been invented almost two decades before
>his legislation.

Sport Pilot, you must have read the explanation a little bit too
quickly, the Eisenhower comment was meant as a comparison, not a
statement of fact.

Here's the statement:

"If President Eisenhower had said in the mid-1960s that he, while
President, "created" the Interstate Highway System, we would not have
seen dozens and dozens of editorials lampooning him for claiming he
"invented" the concept of highways or implying that he personally went
out and dug ditches across the country to help build the roadway.
Everyone would have understood that Ike meant he was a driving force
behind the legislation that created the highway system, and this was
the very same concept Al Gore was expressing about himself with his
Internet statement. "

The last sentence makes the comparison, it means that Gore was
intending to say that he supported the development of the internet
when it needed support. Granted it was tooting his own horn a bit but
that's what politicians do, and he was after all in a race for
nomination as president of the USA.

Once it got subverted by the talkshow's though, it became conservative
gospel that Al Gore was caught bragging he'd invented the internet.
And he did not say that.

Corky Scott

[Morgans]

> More information than anyone would ever want to know about Al Gore and
> the internet.
>
> Jerry



Well, since I don't really want to know enough about Al to slog through two
pages of links, how abut you summarize it?
--
Jim in NC

[Gig 601XL Builder]

"Corky Scott" > wrote in message
...
> On 31 May 2005 11:28:59 -0700, "Sport Pilot" >
> wrote:
>
>>The arguement about President Eisenhower is moot because he never said
>>it. Since Eisenhower actually had a head on his shouders I doubt he
>>would have made such a gaffe. If so he would have been able to explain
>>it. Gore didn't seem to have a clue that his legislation was about the
>>Web, and that the internet had been invented almost two decades before
>>his legislation.
>
> Sport Pilot, you must have read the explanation a little bit too
> quickly, the Eisenhower comment was meant as a comparison, not a
> statement of fact.
>
> Here's the statement:
>
> "If President Eisenhower had said in the mid-1960s that he, while
> President, "created" the Interstate Highway System, we would not have
> seen dozens and dozens of editorials lampooning him for claiming he
> "invented" the concept of highways or implying that he personally went
> out and dug ditches across the country to help build the roadway.
> Everyone would have understood that Ike meant he was a driving force
> behind the legislation that created the highway system, and this was
> the very same concept Al Gore was expressing about himself with his
> Internet statement. "
>
> The last sentence makes the comparison, it means that Gore was
> intending to say that he supported the development of the internet
> when it needed support. Granted it was tooting his own horn a bit but
> that's what politicians do, and he was after all in a race for
> nomination as president of the USA.
>
> Once it got subverted by the talkshow's though, it became conservative
> gospel that Al Gore was caught bragging he'd invented the internet.
> And he did not say that.
>
> Corky Scott


First, Eisenhower was President when the interstate highway system was
funded and his direct intervention in the political process had a lot to do
with it.

Gore was a Senator long after the Internet had been created and I have yet
to hear what bill he sponsored or even voted for though I'm sure several
went through the Senate during his terms in office.

Let's say for a moment he did sponsor or vote for a bill that did something
to help the Internet grow. I'm sure he also during his time in the Senate
voted for a highway bill. Does that make it an honest statment for him to
say "He helped create the Interstate system"?

[Corky Scott]

On Tue, 31 May 2005 15:17:27 -0500, "Gig 601XL Builder"
<wr.giacona@coxDOTnet> wrote:

>Let's say for a moment he did sponsor or vote for a bill that did something
>to help the Internet grow. I'm sure he also during his time in the Senate
>voted for a highway bill. Does that make it an honest statment for him to
>say "He helped create the Interstate system"?

Granted, he could have used words more carefully: he could have said
"I sponsored a bill to fund further development of the internet" which
would have been more clear, and unassailable.

But he didn't. It may have been what he meant to say, but I guess it
didn't sound presidential enough at the time. Never the less, it
seems obvious, at least to me, that he did not intend to claim that he
had invented the internet.

Corky Scott

[wmbjk]

On Tue, 31 May 2005 15:17:27 -0500, "Gig 601XL Builder"
<wr.giacona@coxDOTnet> wrote:

>Gore was a Senator long after the Internet had been created and I have yet
>to hear what bill he sponsored or even voted for though I'm sure several
>went through the Senate during his terms in office.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7746308/

**************
The Associated Press
Updated: 9:25 a.m. ET May 5, 2005

NEW YORK - Al Gore may have been lampooned for taking credit in the
Internet's development, but organizers of the Webby Awards for online
achievements don't find it funny at all.

In part to "set the record straight," they will give Gore a lifetime
achievement award for three decades of contributions to the Internet,
said Tiffany Shlain, the awards' founder and chairwoman.

"It's just one of those instances someone did amazing work for three
decades as congressman, senator and vice president and it got spun
around into this political mess," Shlain said.

Vint Cerf, undisputedly one of the Internet's key inventors, will give
Gore the award at a June 6 ceremony in New York.

"He is indeed due some thanks and consideration for his early
contributions," Cerf said.

Gore, who boasted in a CNN interview he "took the initiative in
creating the Internet," was only 21 when the Internet was born out of
a Pentagon project.

But after joining Congress eight years later, he promoted high-speed
telecommunications for economic growth and supported funding increases
for the then-fledging network, according to the International Academy
of Digital Arts and Sciences, which presents the annual awards.

He popularized the term "information superhighway" as vice president.
Copyright 2005 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This
material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
******************

[Gig 601XL Builder]

"Corky Scott" > wrote in message
...
> On Tue, 31 May 2005 15:17:27 -0500, "Gig 601XL Builder"
> <wr.giacona@coxDOTnet> wrote:
>
>>Let's say for a moment he did sponsor or vote for a bill that did
>>something
>>to help the Internet grow. I'm sure he also during his time in the Senate
>>voted for a highway bill. Does that make it an honest statment for him to
>>say "He helped create the Interstate system"?
>
> Granted, he could have used words more carefully: he could have said
> "I sponsored a bill to fund further development of the internet" which
> would have been more clear, and unassailable.
>
> But he didn't. It may have been what he meant to say, but I guess it
> didn't sound presidential enough at the time. Never the less, it
> seems obvious, at least to me, that he did not intend to claim that he
> had invented the internet.
>
> Corky Scott

I'll assail the hell out of it. What bill did he sponsor?

But you aren't who that comment was aimed at it was the aimed at the great
unwashed masses and he thought for some reason he would get away with trying
to make those great unwashed masses beleive he created the internet.

[Montblack]

("Gig 601XL Builder" wrote)
[snip]
> First, Eisenhower was President when the interstate highway system was
> funded and his direct intervention in the political process had a lot to
> do with it.


Agreed.

Ike was there at the beginning and saw the project through after the war.

<http://www.princeton.edu/~howarth/304.Projects/Scott/Pages/interstates.html>

(snips from the story)
In reviewing the history of the interstate system, it seems that Eisenhower
was the true steamroller behind the laying of federal interstates! In 1896,
only 150,000 miles of the nation's 2.1 million miles of roads were surfaced
in any form, which was normally brick, wood, or stone. In 1919, the U.S.
Army commissioned a trans-continental motor vehicle convoy. A Lt. Dwight
David Eisenhower volunteered for the trip. Starting in Washington DC, they
arrived in San Francisco 62 days later.

Remembering his 1919 Army trip plus his reaction to how quickly German (and
later, Allied) troops could move around that country in World War 2 on the
autobahns (built in 1935), Eisenhower pressed for a national highway system.
While he wanted such a system, he didn't start it as is commonly believed.
What made the idea catch on was his ability to convince people that this was
a national, not state, issue. After his transcontinental Army trip he
thought a national network of two-lane, paved roads would be sufficient, and
in the 1930's that was probably true. That changed after he saw the speed
and efficiency offered by the four-lane German autobahns.


Montblack

[Anthony W]

Corky Scott wrote:
> On 31 May 2005 05:40:01 -0700, "Sport Pilot" >
> wrote:
>
>
>>Larry Roberts was the inventor of the internet with his INTERface
>>Message Processor. This is where the name for the internet began.
>>Though the Military called it officially as the ARPANET, it has been
>>called the internet since its inception in 1969. What Gore sponsored
>>was an early version of the Web. Obviously he didn't have a clue as to
>>what his in this bill as he didn't enven know the proper name.
>
>
> Thank you for this information "Sport Pilot" but my point wasn't who
> literally invented the internet, it was that Gore has been unfairly
> characterized as having claimed he had done so. In fact he never said
> that, but some people love to hate him so that they continue to throw
> out that quote anyway. It played well in the conservative talk shows.
>
> Corky Scott

If Gore wasn't always trying to take credit for stuff he had little to
nothing to do with, then he wouldn't be the laughing stock of the late
night talk shows.

Tony

[Anthony W]

Gig 601XL Builder wrote:

> I'll assail the hell out of it. What bill did he sponsor?
>
> But you aren't who that comment was aimed at it was the aimed at the great
> unwashed masses and he thought for some reason he would get away with trying
> to make those great unwashed masses beleive he created the internet.


I tossed my notes away a couple years ago but there were many time Gore
claimed he had been somewhere and done something and later it was proved
false.

There's something wrong with a person that does this. It's acceptable
in a child but not after the age of ten.

Tony

[Anthony W]

Morgans wrote:
>>More information than anyone would ever want to know about Al Gore and
>>the internet.
>>
>>Jerry
>
>
>
>
> Well, since I don't really want to know enough about Al to slog through two
> pages of links, how abut you summarize it?

It's unreliable; not all of the computer information is correct...

Tony

[Jerry Springer]

Morgans wrote:
>>More information than anyone would ever want to know about Al Gore and
>>the internet.
>>
>>Jerry
>
>
>
>
> Well, since I don't really want to know enough about Al to slog through two
> pages of links, how abut you summarize it?

If you are to lazy to do a little research then explain why I should do
it for you? If you don't want to read the information available then
that is your problem not mine. I notice from several of your posts you
don't like to be bothered looking at available information.

Jerry

[Jerry Springer]

Anthony W wrote:

> Morgans wrote:
>
>>> More information than anyone would ever want to know about Al Gore and
>>> the internet.
>>>
>>> Jerry
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Well, since I don't really want to know enough about Al to slog
>> through two
>> pages of links, how abut you summarize it?
>
>
> It's unreliable; not all of the computer information is correct...
>
> Tony

That is true, just like much of the information posted here in RAH is
unreliable. People have to read and research and decide what to believe
or not to believe.

Jerry

[Morgans]

"Jerry Springer" > wrote
>
> If you are to lazy to do a little research then explain why I should do
> it for you?

As I stated, I could give a rat's a** about Al Gore. He is washed up, for
good reason, IMHO.

> If you don't want to read the information available then
> that is your problem not mine.

Fine. As I stated, I don't want to. Not your "problem" in any case. You
made it your problem, not me. If no one wants to take the time, in copy and
pasting some of the more pertenant stuff, I'll go without. It would get
more discussion, if it was something to read, instead of some blind links.

As a rule, I don't do blind links. I never know what is there. Sure,
somone could hide some nasties, in the guise as real information. I'm not
the only one to skip reading the links, I'll bet.

I'm not sure how "look at this engine" got to Al, anyway.

> I notice from several of your posts you
> don't like to be bothered looking at available information.

Oh? News to me, if it is anything having to do with flying. *That* is why
I'm here. If some discussion morphs into meaningless drivel like this, and
It is there to read, O.K., but I'm not going to search for it.

Chill out, man! Not a big deal, one way or the other!
--
Jim in NC

[Richard Isakson]

Well, reading through some of Jerry Springer's links it seems that Gore
urged, and argued, and talked but he never actually DID anything. He never
created a single bill that helped 'create' the internet. The closest he
seems to come is he co-sponsered a spending bill that also included some
national backbone spending in the mix.

What did Gore do to 'create' the internet? Nothing.

Rich

[Corky Scott]

On Tue, 31 May 2005 20:36:41 -0700, "Richard Isakson"
> wrote:

>What did Gore do to 'create' the internet? Nothing.
>
>Rich

This turns out to be a false impression Rich. In case you missed it
I'm reposting this relevant information:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7746308/

**************
The Associated Press
Updated: 9:25 a.m. ET May 5, 2005

NEW YORK - Al Gore may have been lampooned for taking credit in the
Internet's development, but organizers of the Webby Awards for online
achievements don't find it funny at all.

In part to "set the record straight," they will give Gore a lifetime
achievement award for three decades of contributions to the Internet,
said Tiffany Shlain, the awards' founder and chairwoman.

"It's just one of those instances someone did amazing work for three
decades as congressman, senator and vice president and it got spun
around into this political mess," Shlain said.

Vint Cerf, undisputedly one of the Internet's key inventors, will give
Gore the award at a June 6 ceremony in New York.

"He is indeed due some thanks and consideration for his early
contributions," Cerf said.

Gore, who boasted in a CNN interview he "took the initiative in
creating the Internet," was only 21 when the Internet was born out of
a Pentagon project.

But after joining Congress eight years later, he promoted high-speed
telecommunications for economic growth and supported funding increases
for the then-fledging network, according to the International Academy
of Digital Arts and Sciences, which presents the annual awards.

He popularized the term "information superhighway" as vice president.
Copyright 2005 The Associated Press.

Credit to Richard Isakson for ferreting this information out.

Corky (not nothing) Scott

[LCT Paintball]

> There's something wrong with a person that does this. It's acceptable in
> a child but not after the age of ten.
>
> Tony

No, it's not. It's called a lie. My children get punished for lying, and I
don't care how old they are.

[Sport Pilot]

Corkey,
I understood the explaination about Eisenhower, however it is not an
excuse for lying. But it is moot because he never said that. If he
had you most likely would have seen the left wing making fun of him,
since he didn't say it you cannot prove that they would not have. But
one thing is for sure he wouldn't have said that he invented paved
roads, which is tantamount to what Gore said. If he had you could be
sure he would have been ridiculed and laughed at.

The point about Gore is that he claimed to start legislation to create
the internet. But the legislation did nothing to create a sysetem
already in use two decades before the legislation came out.

IMO Gore meant to say he created the World Wide Web. Which would be
another lie, but at least he wouldn't have been as stupid.

[Sport Pilot]

What Gore said was stupid. It would have been the same as Eisenhower
saying "I created paved roads!".

[Corky Scott]

On 1 Jun 2005 07:22:55 -0700, "Sport Pilot" > wrote:

> I understood the explaination about Eisenhower, however it is not an
>excuse for lying.

>The point about Gore is that he claimed to start legislation to create
>the internet. But the legislation did nothing to create a sysetem
>already in use two decades before the legislation came out.
>
>IMO Gore meant to say he created the World Wide Web. Which would be
>another lie, but at least he wouldn't have been as stupid.

Well, he did not claim that either. What existed at the time that
Gore began his support was not the internet as we know it today, but
Gore apparently could see it's potential, and that's what he was
trying to promote.

This person says it better than I can, but I have a feeling that you
are determined to believe that Gore fully intended to brag that he and
he alone invented the internet despite the substantial evidence to the
contrary:


http://web.archive.org/web/20040104090503/http://commons.somewhere.com/rre/2000/RRE.Al.Gore.and.the.Inte.html

Corky Scott

[Richard Isakson]

"Corky Scott" wrote ...
> On Tue, 31 May 2005 20:36:41 -0700, "Richard Isakson"
> wrote:
>
> >What did Gore do to 'create' the internet? Nothing.
> >
> >Rich
>
> This turns out to be a false impression Rich. In case you missed it
> I'm reposting this relevant information:
>
> http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7746308/

Corky,

Don't the verbs that are used in these articles bother you? He promoted, he
argued, he urged, he talked ... These aren't doing verbs and it's not like
there was opposition to what he was saying. There's no great political
courage here. He grabbed a safe topic and made it a center of his political
career. Later, running for president, he promoted himself for taking this
safe position. As you can see from the discussion going on in this group,
that's not the kind of thing that impresses people.

Rich

[Sport Pilot]

Corky Scott wrote:
> On 1 Jun 2005 07:22:55 -0700, "Sport Pilot" > wrote:
>
> > I understood the explaination about Eisenhower, however it is not an
> >excuse for lying.
>
> >The point about Gore is that he claimed to start legislation to create
> >the internet. But the legislation did nothing to create a sysetem
> >already in use two decades before the legislation came out.
> >
> >IMO Gore meant to say he created the World Wide Web. Which would be
> >another lie, but at least he wouldn't have been as stupid.
>
> Well, he did not claim that either. What existed at the time that
> Gore began his support was not the internet as we know it today, but
> Gore apparently could see it's potential, and that's what he was
> trying to promote.
>
> This person says it better than I can, but I have a feeling that you
> are determined to believe that Gore fully intended to brag that he and
> he alone invented the internet despite the substantial evidence to the
> contrary:
>
>
> http://web.archive.org/web/20040104090503/http://commons.somewhere.com/rre/2000/RRE.Al.Gore.and.the.Inte.html
>
> Corky Scott

Corkey,
The internet was in wide use in the 80's. Hell I used a card reader
in the early 70's that was plugged into a mainframe from a branch of a
university to the main univercity via the internet. The internet is
simply a network that is cordinated via routers. It is not the
software that is on the internet. Gore later said that he helped write
a bill that promoted the World Wide Web, computers for servers and a
search engine for that graphical interface. Before that the internet
was mostly character based like the first MS-Dos computers. But Gore
claimed he created the internet which was created two decades before he
got involved.

[[email protected]]

Sport Pilot wrote:
> Sorry, he said he created the internet, not invented it. So what?

No, he didn't say that no matter how many times you claim he did.

--

FF

[[email protected]]

Sport Pilot wrote:
> The people is obviously bias. I see no diferance in saying "I invented
> the internet" and "I took the initiative to create the internet".

That is because you do not understand, or choose to misrepresent,
plain English.

> Since he was obviously talking about creating a single internet network
> or line, as with a highway system, to create and invent is the same
> thing.

No, he was obviously talking about taking the initiative in moving
forward a whole range of initiatives that have proven to be important
to our country's economic growth and environmental protection,
improvements in our educational system.

Why is that obvious? Becuase tht is just what he said, that's why.

--

FF

[Gig 601XL Builder]

> wrote in message
ups.com...
>
>
> Sport Pilot wrote:
>> Sorry, he said he created the internet, not invented it. So what?
>
> No, he didn't say that no matter how many times you claim he did.
>
> --
>
> FF
>

Fred, Gore did say "I took the initiative in creating the Internet." There
are plenty of cites for this up thread. Hell, even Corky admits he said
that.

[[email protected]]

Gig 601XL Builder wrote:
>
>
> But you aren't who that comment was aimed at it was the aimed at the great
> unwashed masses and he thought for some reason he would get away with trying
> to make those great unwashed masses beleive he created the internet.

That's even more preposterous that SP's idiocy.

I suppose you are one of those claiming 1013 productions was trying to
fool the public into believing that the X-Files were true stories
because they began each episode with the caption "The truth is out
there."

--

FF

[[email protected]]

Anthony W wrote:
>
>
> If Gore wasn't always trying to take credit for stuff he had little to
> nothing to do with, then he wouldn't be the laughing stock of the late
> night talk shows.
>
>

Such as?

--

FF

[[email protected]]

Anthony W wrote:
> ...
>
> I tossed my notes away a couple years ago but there were many time Gore
> claimed he had been somewhere and done something and later it was proved
> false.

How convenient. You sure your dog didnt eat them?

>
> There's something wrong with a person that does this. It's acceptable
> in a child but not after the age of ten.
>

Like, the proof exists I just can't find it is mature?

--

FF

[[email protected]]

Sport Pilot wrote:
> Corkey,
> I understood the explaination about Eisenhower, however it is not an
> excuse for lying.

Then you do not understand the explanation. If you did, you would
undstand taht eisenhower would not have been lying.


> But it is moot because he never said that. If he
> had you most likely would have seen the left wing making fun of him,
> since he didn't say it you cannot prove that they would not have.

> But
> one thing is for sure he wouldn't have said that he invented paved
> roads, which is tantamount to what Gore said.

No, that is not tatmount to what Gore said. It isn't even at all
like what Gore said.

>
> The point about Gore is that he claimed to start legislation to create
> the internet. But the legislation did nothing to create a sysetem
> already in use two decades before the legislation came out.

Close. He claims to have pushed the legislatino forward, not initiated
it. Evidenlty he was refering the Web, incorrectly, and the internet.
Actually if you think about it, a lot of people do. Some, like
GWB, even claim there are multiple internets.

>
> IMO Gore meant to say he created the World Wide Web.

No, that is not your opinion. Obviously you are lying about you
opinon.

--

FF

[[email protected]]

Corky Scott wrote:
> ...
>
> This person says it better than I can, but I have a feeling that you
> are determined to believe that Gore fully intended to brag that he and
> he alone invented the internet despite the substantial evidence to the
> contrary:

Nah, He doesn;t believe that. He's lying.

--

FF

[[email protected]]

Gig 601XL Builder wrote:
> > wrote in message
> ups.com...
> >
> >
> > Sport Pilot wrote:
> >> Sorry, net,he said he created the inter not invented it. So what?
> >
> > No, he didn't say that no matter how many times you claim he did.
> >
> > --
> >
> > FF
> >
>
> Fred, Gore did say "I took the initiative in creating the Internet." There
> are plenty of cites for this up thread. Hell, even Corky admits he said
> that.

Right. Gore did not say "he created the internet".

--

FF

[Matt Whiting]

Corky Scott wrote:

> But after joining Congress eight years later, he promoted high-speed
> telecommunications for economic growth and supported funding increases
> for the then-fledging network, according to the International Academy
> of Digital Arts and Sciences, which presents the annual awards.

Supporting the extension of the internet isn't even close to "inventing" it.


Matt

[[email protected]]

Matt Whiting wrote:
> Corky Scott wrote:
>
> > But after joining Congress eight years later, he promoted high-speed
> > telecommunications for economic growth and supported funding increases
> > for the then-fledging network, according to the International Academy
> > of Digital Arts and Sciences, which presents the annual awards.
>
> Supporting the extension of the internet isn't even close to "inventing" it.
>

Right.

Ever say something that was technically incorrect when answering
a series of questions on the fly?

--

FF

[[email protected]]

Sport Pilot wrote:
>
>
> Gore said he "took the inititive to invent the internet". Which means
> he claimed he invented the internet.

No, that doesn't mean he claims he invented the internet. It means
you do not understand or choose to misrepresent plain English.

Suppose Eisenhower had said that after observing the effectiveness of
the German Autobahn, he had taken the initiative to create the
interstate
highway system. Would you say that was equivalent to Eisenhower
claiming
to have invented highways?

--

FF

[Matt Whiting]

wrote:

>
> Matt Whiting wrote:
>
>>Corky Scott wrote:
>>
>> > But after joining Congress eight years later, he promoted high-speed
>>
>>>telecommunications for economic growth and supported funding increases
>>>for the then-fledging network, according to the International Academy
>>>of Digital Arts and Sciences, which presents the annual awards.
>>
>>Supporting the extension of the internet isn't even close to "inventing" it.
>>
>
>
> Right.
>
> Ever say something that was technically incorrect when answering
> a series of questions on the fly?
>

No, I've never run for office. :-)

Matt

[Bob Kuykendall]

Earlier, Richard Isakson wrote:

> ...These aren't doing verbs...

I don't believe that. Talking, urging, supporting, those are what
politicians do; even the ones who are acually doing what we want them
to do. They are the tools of trade in politics; they are part and
parcel of representing a constituency in what is left of a
representative government.

To my way of thinking, looking for more concrete actions like "build,"
"invent," "develop," "make," or "modify" in the world of politics is
akin to looking for verbs like "represent," "promote," and "envision"
in the world of rough carpentry. Sure, there are going to be many that
do it, but I doubt that it features prominently in the job description.

Here's another tack that might be fertile ground for discussion: Would
we have sent a man to the moon if it were not for Jack Kennedy? I think
that it would be safe to say that without strong Presidental support
for the lunar program it is more than a little likely that NASA's
detractors in the House and Senate would have quashed the whole thing.
And of course, it opens the floor to discussions about whether Kennedy
ought to be credited with having "invented the Saturn 5..."

Thanks, and best regards to all,

Bob K.
http://www.hpaircraft.com

[Anthony W]

Gig 601XL Builder wrote:
> > wrote in message
> ups.com...
>
> Fred, Gore did say "I took the initiative in creating the Internet." There
> are plenty of cites for this up thread. Hell, even Corky admits he said
> that.

If Gore had actually written a bill that promoted the Internet or the
World Wide Web, then he could have made that statement but it would have
still been overstating his efforts.

All he did was vote for a bill that some one else wrote and that's like
saying some one that voted for Clinton took the initiative with Monica
Lewinsky. As usual, Gore was taking credit for something some one else
had done.

Tony

[[email protected]]

Anthony W wrote:
> ...
>
> All he did was vote for a bill that some one else wrote and that's like
> saying some one that voted for Clinton took the initiative with Monica
> Lewinsky. As usual, Gore was taking credit for something some one else
> had done.
>

So why's he getting the award?

--

FF

[Mark Hickey]

wrote:

>Sport Pilot wrote:
>>
>> Gore said he "took the inititive to invent the internet". Which means
>> he claimed he invented the internet.
>
>No, that doesn't mean he claims he invented the internet. It means
>you do not understand or choose to misrepresent plain English.
>
>Suppose Eisenhower had said that after observing the effectiveness of
>the German Autobahn, he had taken the initiative to create the
>interstate
>highway system. Would you say that was equivalent to Eisenhower
>claiming
>to have invented highways?

Close - the correct analogy would be if President Carter said it...
which would be as silly as Gore's indisputably silly comment.

He could have said "I've consistently pushed for funding to develop
the internet" and been fine. But he didn't, so here we are.

Mark "but what's 20 years in political years?" Hickey

[Mark Hickey]

Anthony W > wrote:

>Gig 601XL Builder wrote:
>> > wrote in message
>> ups.com...
>>
>> Fred, Gore did say "I took the initiative in creating the Internet." There
>> are plenty of cites for this up thread. Hell, even Corky admits he said
>> that.
>
>If Gore had actually written a bill that promoted the Internet or the
>World Wide Web, then he could have made that statement but it would have
>still been overstating his efforts.
>
>All he did was vote for a bill that some one else wrote and that's like
>saying some one that voted for Clinton took the initiative with Monica
>Lewinsky. As usual, Gore was taking credit for something some one else
>had done.

So I'm guessing at least 60 or 70 other senators could say they "took
the initiative in creating the Internet", and be equally (in)accurate.
Most of 'em would probably have the good taste to say "we" instead of
"I", though even those who wrote the bill couldn't really say they did
anything other than help fund development (since creation of the thing
was a long distant memory already by that time).

Mark "there's no "I" in "Senate"" Hickey

[Sport Pilot]

Well, there is that tobbaco he planted, hoed, topped, etc. But he
never actually worked in the field.

[[email protected]]

Sport Pilot wrote:
> Well, there is that tobbaco he planted, hoed, topped, etc. But he
> never actually worked in the field.

Who?

--

FF

[[email protected]]

Sport Pilot wrote:
> Well, there is that tobbaco he planted, hoed, topped, etc. But he
> never actually worked in the field.

Who?

--

FF

[Sparkle]

Matt Whiting wrote:

> Corky Scott wrote:
>
> > But after joining Congress eight years later, he promoted high-speed
>
>> telecommunications for economic growth and supported funding increases
>> for the then-fledging network, according to the International Academy
>> of Digital Arts and Sciences, which presents the annual awards.
>
>
> Supporting the extension of the internet isn't even close to "inventing"
> it.

Wow! After all this, somebody's *still* putting "inventing" in quotes.

We already saw the real quote:
"During my service in the United States Congress, I took the initiative
in creating the Internet."

[Corky Scott]

On Wed, 01 Jun 2005 22:15:19 GMT, Matt Whiting >
wrote:

>Corky Scott wrote:
>
> > But after joining Congress eight years later, he promoted high-speed
>> telecommunications for economic growth and supported funding increases
>> for the then-fledging network, according to the International Academy
>> of Digital Arts and Sciences, which presents the annual awards.
>
>Supporting the extension of the internet isn't even close to "inventing" it.
>
>
>Matt

That is ***EXACTLY*** right Matt, he did NOT say he invented the
internet.

Corky Scott

[Sport Pilot]

Corky Scott wrote:
> On Wed, 01 Jun 2005 22:15:19 GMT, Matt Whiting >
> wrote:
>
> >Corky Scott wrote:
> >
> > > But after joining Congress eight years later, he promoted high-speed
> >> telecommunications for economic growth and supported funding increases
> >> for the then-fledging network, according to the International Academy
> >> of Digital Arts and Sciences, which presents the annual awards.
> >
> >Supporting the extension of the internet isn't even close to "inventing" it.
> >
> >
> >Matt
>
> That is ***EXACTLY*** right Matt, he did NOT say he invented the
> internet.
>
> Corky Scott

Wow, after all this someone doesn't understand that in the context Gore
used "inventing" is synonymous with "creating".

[Corky Scott]

On 2 Jun 2005 05:15:24 -0700, "Sport Pilot" > wrote:

>Wow, after all this someone doesn't understand that in the context Gore
>used "inventing" is synonymous with "creating".

Sport Pilot, what's going on here? Are you deliberately flipping the
words around or are you typing a bit too fast for your mind to see
what you are writing?

At no time did Gore say "I invented the internet".

I think you meant to write 'Wow, after all this someone doesn't
understand that in the context Gore used "creating" (SIC) is
synonymous with "inventing".'

One more time, in the context of the discussion in which it was said
it's obvious he was talking about his efforts to promote and fund the
concept of the internet through his office in congress. Right wing
blowhards view it as their job to pick apart or misconstrue everything
possible that opposition candidates say so as to portray them in the
worst light possible. They've gotten very good at it, and Gore was
regretibly adept at giving them fodder to rip up.

So what are you building, Sport Pilot?

Corky Scott

[Gig 601XL Builder]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
>
>
> Gig 601XL Builder wrote:
>>
>>
>> But you aren't who that comment was aimed at it was the aimed at the
>> great
>> unwashed masses and he thought for some reason he would get away with
>> trying
>> to make those great unwashed masses beleive he created the internet.
>
> That's even more preposterous that SP's idiocy.
>
> I suppose you are one of those claiming 1013 productions was trying to
> fool the public into believing that the X-Files were true stories
> because they began each episode with the caption "The truth is out
> there."
>
> --

*plonk*

[Anthony W]

Sport Pilot wrote:

> Wow, after all this someone doesn't understand that in the context Gore
> used "inventing" is synonymous with "creating".


While true, it doesn't matter because there was no initiative involved
on his part. The bigger part of the lie was saying that he did
something to help the Internet when no one else was.

The truth is he took no initiative and didn’t create anything. If he
had looked into the Internet and saw something worth promoting and then
done something about it, that would have been initiative. All he did
was jump on the bandwagon that some one else got rolling. It might have
been worth saying so but he had to try and make it into more than it was.

Tony

[[email protected]]

Sport Pilot wrote:
> Corky Scott wrote:
> > On Wed, 01 Jun 2005 22:15:19 GMT, Matt Whiting >
> > wrote:
> >
> ...
> > >
> > >Supporting the extension of the internet isn't even close to "inventing" it.
> > >
> > >
> > >Matt
> >
> > That is ***EXACTLY*** right Matt, he did NOT say he invented the
> > internet.
> >
> > Corky Scott
>
> Wow, after all this someone doesn't understand that in the context Gore
> used "inventing" is synonymous with "creating".


You mispelt "in the context Gore used "creating" is synonymous
with "politically supporting".

Unless of course, you were _deliberately_ attempting to mislead the
unwashed masses.

--

FF

[[email protected]]

Anthony W wrote:
>
> The truth is he took no initiative and didn't create anything. If he
> had looked into the Internet and saw something worth promoting and then
> done something about it, that would have been initiative. All he did
> was jump on the bandwagon that some one else got rolling. It might have
> been worth saying so but he had to try and make it into more than it was.
>

So why is he getting the award?

--

FF

[Sport Pilot]

wrote:
> Sport Pilot wrote:
> > Corky Scott wrote:
> > > On Wed, 01 Jun 2005 22:15:19 GMT, Matt Whiting >
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > ...
> > > >
> > > >Supporting the extension of the internet isn't even close to "inventing" it.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Matt
> > >
> > > That is ***EXACTLY*** right Matt, he did NOT say he invented the
> > > internet.
> > >
> > > Corky Scott
> >
> > Wow, after all this someone doesn't understand that in the context Gore
> > used "inventing" is synonymous with "creating".
>
>
> You mispelt "in the context Gore used "creating" is synonymous
> with "politically supporting".
>
> Unless of course, you were _deliberately_ attempting to mislead the
> unwashed masses.
>
> --
>
> FF

Are you trying to show off your stupidity? I find no words I
MISSPELLED!

However you error looks particularly stupid.

[Anthony W]

wrote:
>
> Anthony W wrote:
>
>>The truth is he took no initiative and didn't create anything. If he
>>had looked into the Internet and saw something worth promoting and then
>>done something about it, that would have been initiative. All he did
>>was jump on the bandwagon that some one else got rolling. It might have
>>been worth saying so but he had to try and make it into more than it was.
>>
>
>
> So why is he getting the award?

The only award he's getting is ex-VP for life.

Tony

[Matt Whiting]

Sparkle wrote:

> Matt Whiting wrote:
>
>> Corky Scott wrote:
>>
>> > But after joining Congress eight years later, he promoted high-speed
>>
>>> telecommunications for economic growth and supported funding increases
>>> for the then-fledging network, according to the International Academy
>>> of Digital Arts and Sciences, which presents the annual awards.
>>
>>
>>
>> Supporting the extension of the internet isn't even close to
>> "inventing" it.
>
>
> Wow! After all this, somebody's *still* putting "inventing" in quotes.
>
> We already saw the real quote:
> "During my service in the United States Congress, I took the initiative
> in creating the Internet."

Invent and create are pretty close cousins. My comment applies equally
well to create. I didn't think he'd used the word invent which is why I
had it in quotes as I wasn't sure it was strictly correct. So, let me
restate: Supporting the extension of the internet isn't even close to
creating it.

Happy?


Matt

[[email protected]]

Matt Whiting wrote:
>
>
> Invent and create are pretty close cousins. My comment applies equally
> well to create. I didn't think he'd used the word invent which is why I
> had it in quotes as I wasn't sure it was strictly correct. So, let me
> restate: Supporting the extension of the internet isn't even close to
> creating it.
>

The actual verb he used was neither invent nor create.

--

FF

[John Halpenny]

Sport Pilot wrote:

> Sorry, he said he created the internet, not invented it. So what?

Last week I created the patio that is in my back yard. I did'nt invent
it.


--

John Halpenny

Truth is stranger than fiction.
This is why writers and readers prefer fiction.

[Sparkle]

wrote:

>
> Matt Whiting wrote:
>
>>
>>Invent and create are pretty close cousins. My comment applies equally
>>well to create.

Matt, I took the initiative a few years ago and invented my own
computer. Bought all the pieces, took `em home, and invented a computer
out of them!

> I didn't think he'd used the word invent which is why I
>>had it in quotes as I wasn't sure it was strictly correct. So, let me
>>restate: Supporting the extension of the internet isn't even close to
>>creating it.
>>
>
>
> The actual verb he used was neither invent nor create.

What was it then? Took?

[[email protected]]

Sparkle wrote:
> wrote:
>
> >
> > Matt Whiting wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>Invent and create are pretty close cousins. My comment applies equally
> >>well to create.
>
> Matt, I took the initiative a few years ago and invented my own
> computer. Bought all the pieces, took `em home, and invented a computer
> out of them!
>
> > I didn't think he'd used the word invent which is why I
> >>had it in quotes as I wasn't sure it was strictly correct. So, let me
> >>restate: Supporting the extension of the internet isn't even close to
> >>creating it.
> >>
> >
> >
> > The actual verb he used was neither invent nor create.
>
> What was it then? Took?

Yes.

If one wishes to understand Gore's statment, and clearly not everyone
does want to understand it, one needs to consider it in the context
of the question he was asked. He was asked about his qualifications
for political office. 'Inventing' or 'creating' the internet, in the
sense of the technological work, would be irrelevent to his
qualifications
for political office. So clearly, that is not what he meant.

--

FF

[Matt Whiting]

Sparkle wrote:
> wrote:
>
>>
>> Matt Whiting wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Invent and create are pretty close cousins. My comment applies equally
>>> well to create.
>
>
> Matt, I took the initiative a few years ago and invented my own
> computer. Bought all the pieces, took `em home, and invented a computer
> out of them!

More like assembled a computer rather than created it.


Matt

[Bob Kuykendall]

Earlier, Richard Riley wrote:

> Now he's religated...

I got ligated once. But it never happened again.

[Sparkle]

wrote:

>>>The actual verb he used was neither invent nor create.
>>
>>What was it then? Took?
>
> Yes.
>
> If one wishes to understand Gore's statment, and clearly not everyone
> does want to understand it, one needs to consider it in the context
> of the question he was asked. He was asked about his qualifications
> for political office. 'Inventing' or 'creating' the internet, in the
> sense of the technological work, would be irrelevent to his
> qualifications
> for political office. So clearly, that is not what he meant.

It's so obvious... now.

What were you waiting for??

[[email protected]]

Sparkle wrote:
> wrote:
>
> >>>The actual verb he used was neither invent nor create.
> >>
> >>What was it then? Took?
> >
> > Yes.
> >
> > If one wishes to understand Gore's statment, and clearly not everyone
> > does want to understand it, one needs to consider it in the context
> > of the question he was asked. He was asked about his qualifications
> > for political office. 'Inventing' or 'creating' the internet, in the
> > sense of the technological work, would be irrelevent to his
> > qualifications
> > for political office. So clearly, that is not what he meant.
>
> It's so obvious... now.
>
> What were you waiting for??

Give a man enough rope....

--

FF