Fatal Glider Crash in Wurtsboro, New York

[Waveguru]

Can anybody give us any more information on this crash? Minor damage, but the pilot died?

A private Schweizer SGS 1-35, glider, registration N2878H, impacted the terrain shortly after tow release at Wurtsboro-Sullivan County Airport (N82), Wurtsboro, New York.
The glider sustained minor damage according to the FAA and the sole pilot onboard was fatally injured.
- Photo shows an example Schweizer SGS 1-35, but not the accident glider, photo via NATIONAL SOARING MUSEUM. ( Aviation Accidents / This Day in History )


Boggs

[[email protected]]

On Monday, June 7, 2021 at 4:40:54 PM UTC-4, Waveguru wrote:
> Can anybody give us any more information on this crash? Minor damage, but the pilot died?
>
> A private Schweizer SGS 1-35, glider, registration N2878H, impacted the terrain shortly after tow release at Wurtsboro-Sullivan County Airport (N82), Wurtsboro, New York.
> The glider sustained minor damage according to the FAA and the sole pilot onboard was fatally injured.
> - Photo shows an example Schweizer SGS 1-35, but not the accident glider, photo via NATIONAL SOARING MUSEUM. ( Aviation Accidents / This Day in History )
>
>
> Boggs
This is all we have for now:
https://dailyvoice.com/new-york/putnam/police-fire/glider-pilot-dies-following-crash-at-hudson-valley-airport-police-say/810368/

RO

[Hank Nixon]

On Monday, June 7, 2021 at 5:10:13 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> On Monday, June 7, 2021 at 4:40:54 PM UTC-4, Waveguru wrote:
> > Can anybody give us any more information on this crash? Minor damage, but the pilot died?
> >
> > A private Schweizer SGS 1-35, glider, registration N2878H, impacted the terrain shortly after tow release at Wurtsboro-Sullivan County Airport (N82), Wurtsboro, New York.
> > The glider sustained minor damage according to the FAA and the sole pilot onboard was fatally injured.
> > - Photo shows an example Schweizer SGS 1-35, but not the accident glider, photo via NATIONAL SOARING MUSEUM. ( Aviation Accidents / This Day in History )
> >
> >
> > Boggs
> This is all we have for now:
> https://dailyvoice.com/new-york/putnam/police-fire/glider-pilot-dies-following-crash-at-hudson-valley-airport-police-say/810368/
>
> RO
Local info from eye witness describes PTT( very rough at that point in the day), followed shortly thereafter by cartwheel impact with ground while maneuvering to
try to land.
Very sad
UH

[R[_4_]]

Do you mean 'PIOs'.....?
R

[Papa3[_2_]]

On Monday, June 7, 2021 at 4:40:54 PM UTC-4, Waveguru wrote:
> Can anybody give us any more information on this crash? Minor damage, but the pilot died?
>
> A private Schweizer SGS 1-35, glider, registration N2878H, impacted the terrain shortly after tow release at Wurtsboro-Sullivan County Airport (N82), Wurtsboro, New York.
> The glider sustained minor damage according to the FAA and the sole pilot onboard was fatally injured.
> - Photo shows an example Schweizer SGS 1-35, but not the accident glider, photo via NATIONAL SOARING MUSEUM. ( Aviation Accidents / This Day in History )
>
>
> Boggs

Replace "minor" with "major". As Hank mentioned, a premature termination of tow (PT3) for as yet unknown reason at a critical altitude with attempted, unsuccessful, 180 return to airport.

[Waveguru]

Can we get any details on the pilot, like age, currency, and number of hours PIC?


Boggs

[Hank Nixon]

On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:12:12 PM UTC-4, Waveguru wrote:
> Can we get any details on the pilot, like age, currency, and number of hours PIC?
>
>
> Boggs

64 years old. Not very current. Not known.
UH

[Semantics Michael]

On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:41:30 PM UTC-5, Hank Nixon wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:12:12 PM UTC-4, Waveguru wrote:
> > Can we get any details on the pilot, like age, currency, and number of hours PIC?
> >
> >
> > Boggs
> 64 years old. Not very current. Not known.
> UH

What does "not very current mean"?

[Semantics Michael]

On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:41:30 PM UTC-5, Hank Nixon wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:12:12 PM UTC-4, Waveguru wrote:
> > Can we get any details on the pilot, like age, currency, and number of hours PIC?
> >
> >
> > Boggs
> 64 years old. Not very current. Not known.
> UH

What does "not very current" mean and how do these personal details relate to this accident?
Mr. Boggs and Mr. Nixon: What is your age, currency and PIC time? I assume you don't mind sharing.

[Bob W.]

On 6/8/21 1:04 PM, Semantics Michael wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:41:30 PM UTC-5, Hank Nixon wrote:
>> On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:12:12 PM UTC-4, Waveguru wrote:
>>> Can we get any details on the pilot, like age, currency, and number of hours PIC?
>>>
>>>
>>> Boggs
>> 64 years old. Not very current. Not known.
>> UH
>
> What does "not very current" mean and how do these personal details relate to this accident?
> Mr. Boggs and Mr. Nixon: What is your age, currency and PIC time? I assume you don't mind sharing.
>

To me, one of three - currency - would seem potentially, perhaps
directly, pertinent in the case of a(n alleged) PTT followed by a
cartwheeling return to earth. Were there off-field options ahead or to
the sides? If so, why risk a cartwheel? Absence of currency? Convenience
of retrieve? Etc. Inquiring minds and all that...

Similarly, though perhaps arguably, a lower time PIC with no or limited
off-field landing experience might make "not the best" post-release
decision(s).

For the record, I know zero about the geography of the crash site, and
consider myself "an inquiring mind."

YMMV.

Bob W.

[Papa3[_2_]]

On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 3:04:10 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:41:30 PM UTC-5, Hank Nixon wrote:
> > On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:12:12 PM UTC-4, Waveguru wrote:
> > > Can we get any details on the pilot, like age, currency, and number of hours PIC?
> > >
> > >
> > > Boggs
> > 64 years old. Not very current. Not known.
> > UH
> What does "not very current" mean and how do these personal details relate to this accident?
> Mr. Boggs and Mr. Nixon: What is your age, currency and PIC time? I assume you don't mind sharing.

Actually, I think Hank's info (Nixon) is public domain. Just go to the Soaring Hall of Fame and look under the letter "N". https://www.soaringmuseum.org/hall-of-fame.php

Who is phlyi... @gmail.com, anyway???

[R[_4_]]

On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 3:04:10 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:41:30 PM UTC-5, Hank Nixon wrote:
> > On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:12:12 PM UTC-4, Waveguru wrote:
> > > Can we get any details on the pilot, like age, currency, and number of hours PIC?
> > >
> > >
> > > Boggs
> > 64 years old. Not very current. Not known.
> > UH
> What does "not very current" mean and how do these personal details relate to this accident?
> Mr. Boggs and Mr. Nixon: What is your age, currency and PIC time? I assume you don't mind sharing.

[R[_4_]]

> What does "not very current" mean and how do these personal details relate to this accident?
> Mr. Boggs and Mr. Nixon: What is your age, currency and PIC time? I assume you don't mind sharing.

Calm down Phyllis......nobody is being trashed here...just beginning an inquiry into possibilities and probabilities to learn why we loss a soaring brother. Speculations, normally held in check, does no harm to a dead pilot. Any pilot worth his salt searches for answers because they could save his life one day.
This thread will not be squelching opinions, but encouraging ideas.
R

[Waveguru]

I am 68, I have many thousands of hours in gliders and I fly many hours every week.


Boggs

[Semantics Michael]

> > > > Can we get any details on the pilot, like age, currency, and number of hours PIC?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Boggs
> > > 64 years old. Not very current. Not known.
> > > UH
> > What does "not very current" mean and how do these personal details relate to this accident?
> > Mr. Boggs and Mr. Nixon: What is your age, currency and PIC time? I assume you don't mind sharing.

Oh my, I'm not trying to impugn anyone's reputation! I just asked a question what "Not very current" means? According to the FAA a pilot is fully current once they satisfy the biennial Flight Review requirement. Perhaps "proficiency" was the intended descriptor? If so, how does one measure it and how do we know we and others have enough of it? Does anyone (maybe the SSF) know the relationship between "experience" and risk of accidents? Is it low-timers, rusty pilots, or those high-timers that fly with more narrow (less forgiving) margins? Maybe older pilots?

[Jim N]

The FAA out of Boston, just recently, presented a webinar on this very thing. I believe it's available via YouTube

Jim

[Semantics Michael]

On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 6:16:31 PM UTC-5, Jim N wrote:
> The FAA out of Boston, just recently, presented a webinar on this very thing. I believe it's available via YouTube
>
> Jim

This the one? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hj7sjJi6zJ4

Thanks,
Phyllis

[Hank Nixon]

On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 3:04:10 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:41:30 PM UTC-5, Hank Nixon wrote:
> > On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:12:12 PM UTC-4, Waveguru wrote:
> > > Can we get any details on the pilot, like age, currency, and number of hours PIC?
> > >
> > >
> > > Boggs
> > 64 years old. Not very current. Not known.
> > UH
> What does "not very current" mean and how do these personal details relate to this accident?
> Mr. Boggs and Mr. Nixon: What is your age, currency and PIC time? I assume you don't mind sharing.

"Not very current" means to me a low amount of recent flight activity. Almost always a factor that increases risk.
My info: 7700hrs in gliders (just under 13000 landings) 60 hours and about 100 landings in last 60 days. I did 20 tows
on the day of the accident at a site 11 miles away. Some info I have relayed is from other sources with knowledge I
trust.
UH

[Semantics Michael]

Not absolutely certain, but I believe this is the obituary for our lost pilot. What a loss to his family, medical profession and his extreme charity.

https://www.legacy.com/obituaries/nytimes/obituary.aspx?n=khanh-nguyen&pid=198964579

[R[_4_]]

On Wednesday, June 9, 2021 at 8:46:37 AM UTC-4, Hank Nixon wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 3:04:10 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:41:30 PM UTC-5, Hank Nixon wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:12:12 PM UTC-4, Waveguru wrote:
> > > > Can we get any details on the pilot, like age, currency, and number of hours PIC?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Boggs
> > > 64 years old. Not very current. Not known.
> > > UH
> > What does "not very current" mean and how do these personal details relate to this accident?
> > Mr. Boggs and Mr. Nixon: What is your age, currency and PIC time? I assume you don't mind sharing.
> "Not very current" means to me a low amount of recent flight activity. Almost always a factor that increases risk.
> My info: 7700hrs in gliders (just under 13000 landings) 60 hours and about 100 landings in last 60 days. I did 20 tows
> on the day of the accident at a site 11 miles away. Some info I have relayed is from other sources with knowledge I
> trust.
> UH

How many flights were UNPAID as a instructor? An approximate guess will suffice.
R

[Semantics Michael]

> How many flights were UNPAID as a instructor? An approximate guess will suffice.
> R

OK, I give in. My question has been deleted as it has been perceived as a personal attack. My apologies.

[R[_4_]]

On Wednesday, June 9, 2021 at 2:33:16 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > How many flights were UNPAID as a instructor? An approximate guess will suffice.
> > R
> OK, I give in. My question has been deleted as it has been perceived as a personal attack. My apologies.

I would bet Dr. Nguyen, as a man who saves lives, would be glad we are discussing his tragedy to improve safety, save lives.
R

[Eric Greenwell[_4_]]

On 6/9/2021 11:19 AM, R wrote:
> On Wednesday, June 9, 2021 at 8:46:37 AM UTC-4, Hank Nixon wrote:
>> On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 3:04:10 PM UTC-4, wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:41:30 PM UTC-5, Hank Nixon wrote:
>>>> On Tuesday, June 8, 2021 at 12:12:12 PM UTC-4, Waveguru wrote:
>>>>> Can we get any details on the pilot, like age, currency, and number of hours PIC?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Boggs
>>>> 64 years old. Not very current. Not known.
>>>> UH
>>> What does "not very current" mean and how do these personal details relate to this accident?
>>> Mr. Boggs and Mr. Nixon: What is your age, currency and PIC time? I assume you don't mind sharing.
>> "Not very current" means to me a low amount of recent flight activity. Almost always a factor that increases risk.
>> My info: 7700hrs in gliders (just under 13000 landings) 60 hours and about 100 landings in last 60 days. I did 20 tows
>> on the day of the accident at a site 11 miles away. Some info I have relayed is from other sources with knowledge I
>> trust.
>> UH
>
> How many flights were UNPAID as a instructor? An approximate guess will suffice.

Now, that question does seem far from related to the accident, i.e, irrelevant. Basically,
anyone that's done a lot of soaring AND twice as many landings as flying hours has done a
huge amount of instruction, and totally deserves more than what he was paid.

--
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1

[R[_4_]]

I got a little sidetrack at UH numbers and a life of serving the common good.
So, why did the good Dr. get off tow early?
R

[[email protected]]

On Wednesday, June 9, 2021 at 4:01:45 PM UTC-4, R wrote:
> I got a little sidetrack at UH numbers and a life of serving the common good.
> So, why did the good Dr. get off tow early?
> R
Good point R, glad to see you pop your head up again. The Purist, old Bob

[Delta8]

May or may not be relevant to this accident but June Soaring magazine cover has a Risk level assessment article worth a look .