Oshkosh camping

[keepitrunning]

Last time I was there I parked my airplane in the homebuilt parking and
camped next to it. I am wondering if a friend flew in with me in a
production aircraft, could we park together in the homebuilt parking or
would they have to go off with the production parking. Can you camp in the
production parking area?

Thanks for any info.
Gary

[Scott]

They will (most likely) make the production aircraft park in the North
40 unless it is considered a classic, then it will be in the
antique/classic section. The other alternative would be for you to park
in the general aviation North 40 parking area.

keepitrunning wrote:
> Last time I was there I parked my airplane in the homebuilt parking and
> camped next to it. I am wondering if a friend flew in with me in a
> production aircraft, could we park together in the homebuilt parking or
> would they have to go off with the production parking. Can you camp in the
> production parking area?
>
> Thanks for any info.
> Gary
>
>

[Ron Natalie]

keepitrunning wrote:
> Last time I was there I parked my airplane in the homebuilt parking and
> camped next to it. I am wondering if a friend flew in with me in a
> production aircraft, could we park together in the homebuilt parking or
> would they have to go off with the production parking. Can you camp in the
> production parking area?

Anybody can camp in the North 40 (spam can) parking area. Homebuilt,
classic or otherwise. You often see people who would qualify for
showplane camping parked up there for the exact reason you have.

It used to be that homebuilts could park in with the classics, but
since the homebuilts got their own camping area there seems to be
some rift between the two communities. Never hurts to ask once
you get there, but be prepared to deal with the least common denominator.

The North 40 isn't that bad. I parked there two years. There's
no blasted PA system and your much closer to the off-field services
(Restaurants, groceries).

[Matt Whiting]

Ron Natalie wrote:

> The North 40 isn't that bad. I parked there two years. There's
> no blasted PA system and your much closer to the off-field services
> (Restaurants, groceries).

I've only been to OSH once, in 1995 to see the WWII birds. I parked and
camped for two nights in the north 40 with my 182 tail against the fence
by the hangar owned or maybe just used that week, by Kermit Weeks. It
was a nice location, although it was either a bus ride or very long walk
to get to the heart of the action.

The only real complaint I had was the lousy toilet and shower facilties.
The shower trailers had about 25% of the capacity required and I don't
think they were cleaned even once a day. The grass had been mowed right
before the start of the show (I arrived on the first day) and the
trailers were soon tracked full of grass which clogged up the shower
drains and made things a mess. And it stayed that way for the two days
that I camped. My friend and I got a room at the dorms for the rest of
our five day stay and that was much nicer although a little warm and
night with no AC. However, the dorm restrooms and showers were quite
nice as dorms go and were kept very clean by the staff.


Matt

[Tedstriker]

>
>Anybody can camp in the North 40 (spam can) parking area. Homebuilt,
>classic or otherwise. You often see people who would qualify for
>showplane camping parked up there for the exact reason you have.
>
>It used to be that homebuilts could park in with the classics, but
>since the homebuilts got their own camping area there seems to be
>some rift between the two communities. Never hurts to ask once
>you get there, but be prepared to deal with the least common denominator.
>
>The North 40 isn't that bad. I parked there two years. There's
>no blasted PA system and your much closer to the off-field services
>(Restaurants, groceries).

Do they have showers/bathrooms in that North 40 parking area just like
in homebuilt camping? I haven't done the camping thing there yet, and
was wondering, are the showers/bathrooms overly crowded in the
morning? that is, do you have to stand in line just to get inside?
Not having that PA system sounds nice, as do being closer to the
services. I guess up there, you're out of walking distance to the
show.

[Kyle Boatright]

"Tedstriker" > wrote in message
...
>
>>
>>Anybody can camp in the North 40 (spam can) parking area. Homebuilt,
>>classic or otherwise. You often see people who would qualify for
>>showplane camping parked up there for the exact reason you have.
>>
>>It used to be that homebuilts could park in with the classics, but
>>since the homebuilts got their own camping area there seems to be
>>some rift between the two communities. Never hurts to ask once
>>you get there, but be prepared to deal with the least common denominator.
>>
>>The North 40 isn't that bad. I parked there two years. There's
>>no blasted PA system and your much closer to the off-field services
>>(Restaurants, groceries).
>
> Do they have showers/bathrooms in that North 40 parking area just like
> in homebuilt camping? I haven't done the camping thing there yet, and
> was wondering, are the showers/bathrooms overly crowded in the
> morning? that is, do you have to stand in line just to get inside?
> Not having that PA system sounds nice, as do being closer to the
> services. I guess up there, you're out of walking distance to the
> show.

There are a couple of block shower houses in the North 40. I've camped
there several times and liked the ability to camp by the airplane. In the
homebuilt, antique, and classic areas, my experience is that you've gotta be
an early arriver to stake out enough room for an airplane and tent.
Otherwise, the plane will end up in showplane parking, with the tent a few
hundred yards away, crammed up against a bunch of other tents.

[Ron Natalie]

Tedstriker wrote:

>
> Do they have showers/bathrooms in that North 40 parking area just like
> in homebuilt camping? I haven't done the camping thing there yet, and
> was wondering, are the showers/bathrooms overly crowded in the
> morning? that is, do you have to stand in line just to get inside?
> Not having that PA system sounds nice, as do being closer to the
> services. I guess up there, you're out of walking distance to the
> show.

There's one permanent shower building similar to the one in the
classic area or the ones over in Scholler. I think they have a
second WMI shower trailer (similar to the one by the Hangar cafe)
over on the north side of 27-9.

[Roger]

On Wed, 08 Jun 2005 03:42:24 GMT, "keepitrunning"
> wrote:

>Last time I was there I parked my airplane in the homebuilt parking and
>camped next to it. I am wondering if a friend flew in with me in a
>production aircraft, could we park together in the homebuilt parking or
>would they have to go off with the production parking. Can you camp in the
>production parking area?

First, Production would have to be old enought to qualify for at
least contemporary. I've forgotten the year for each qualification,
but it was 60 or 61 when I was there so it's probably about 65 by now.

Yes, you can camp in the production area (North 40).
I always went about a week before the fly-in and set up camp about 4
or 5 places West o the showers in the Antique/classic/contemporary
parking even though I rented a room in an air-conditioned home just
about a half a block North of Baslers.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com
>
>Thanks for any info.
>Gary
>

[Ron Natalie]

Kyle Boatright wrote:
> In the
> homebuilt, antique, and classic areas, my experience is that you've gotta be
> an early arriver to stake out enough room for an airplane and tent.
> Otherwise, the plane will end up in showplane parking, with the tent a few
> hundred yards away, crammed up against a bunch of other tents.
>

Not true. The parking area fills up faster than campign which goes on
practically forever to the south. Those people camped in the trees
(alternatively known as Sally's Alley or Calcutta depenidng on who you
ask) chose to camp there away from their aircraft. Many of them are
volunteers for the Vintage division.

[Morgans]

"Ron Natalie" > wrote

Those people camped in the trees
> (alternatively known as Sally's Alley or Calcutta depenidng on who you
> ask) chose to camp there away from their aircraft.

Biggest reason, I'll guess, is shade.
--
Jim in NC

[Ron Natalie]

Morgans wrote:
> "Ron Natalie" > wrote
>
> Those people camped in the trees
>
>>(alternatively known as Sally's Alley or Calcutta depenidng on who you
>>ask) chose to camp there away from their aircraft.
>
>
Shade is a big factor, but it's a social area too. As I said many
of them are part of the volunteer crew. "Sally" operates a cooperative
kitchen there as well.

[Matt Whiting]

Tedstriker wrote:

>>Anybody can camp in the North 40 (spam can) parking area. Homebuilt,
>>classic or otherwise. You often see people who would qualify for
>>showplane camping parked up there for the exact reason you have.
>>
>>It used to be that homebuilts could park in with the classics, but
>>since the homebuilts got their own camping area there seems to be
>>some rift between the two communities. Never hurts to ask once
>>you get there, but be prepared to deal with the least common denominator.
>>
>>The North 40 isn't that bad. I parked there two years. There's
>>no blasted PA system and your much closer to the off-field services
>>(Restaurants, groceries).
>
>
> Do they have showers/bathrooms in that North 40 parking area just like
> in homebuilt camping? I haven't done the camping thing there yet, and
> was wondering, are the showers/bathrooms overly crowded in the
> morning? that is, do you have to stand in line just to get inside?
> Not having that PA system sounds nice, as do being closer to the
> services. I guess up there, you're out of walking distance to the
> show.

I did when I was there in 1995. The first morning, I got to the showers
about 7:00 and waited probably 30 minutes. The next morning I got there
before 6:00 and only waited a couple of minutes. The rest of the week
I stayed in the dorms and didn't wait at all! :-)


Matt

[Roger]

On Thu, 09 Jun 2005 06:02:54 -0400, Ron Natalie >
wrote:

>Kyle Boatright wrote:
>> In the
>> homebuilt, antique, and classic areas, my experience is that you've gotta be
>> an early arriver to stake out enough room for an airplane and tent.
>> Otherwise, the plane will end up in showplane parking, with the tent a few
>> hundred yards away, crammed up against a bunch of other tents.
>>
>
>Not true. The parking area fills up faster than campign which goes on
>practically forever to the south. Those people camped in the trees
>(alternatively known as Sally's Alley or Calcutta depenidng on who you
>ask) chose to camp there away from their aircraft. Many of them are
>volunteers for the Vintage division.

Don't they fill up all the way South to the airport boundary fence
which is well beyond the end of the runway? Now that is the middle of
nowhere<:-))

I've always been able to get into showplane camping, but they always
question the age of the Deb which looks like a modern F-33, but was
built in 59.

Of course that does fill up early on, but you don't need to get there
a week ahead of time like I usually did.

BTW, what color is your Navion, Ron?

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

[Ron Natalie]

Roger wrote:

> BTW, what color is your Navion, Ron?
>
Dark blue. There hare pictures on Honeck's web site
or http://www.margynatalie.com

[Tedstriker]

For anyone that has actually slept in a tent at OSH, does it cool off
enough at night to sleep comfortably? If it's muggy all night, I might
just blast off and fly my homebuilt somewhere and get an air
conditioned hotel room. My plane is fast, so even if I have to go as
far as Milwalkee, it's no big deal. I just don't want to make
reservations, then have to deal with not being able to make it due to
weather enroute from SC. If I wait around until it's dark, and late,
then find out it's too hot to sleep well, im stuck in misery, misery
misery. Sweating all night.

[Ed Sullivan]

On Fri, 10 Jun 2005 22:24:42 -0400, Tedstriker
> wrote:

>
>
>For anyone that has actually slept in a tent at OSH, does it cool off
>enough at night to sleep comfortably? If it's muggy all night, I might
>just blast off and fly my homebuilt somewhere and get an air
>conditioned hotel room. My plane is fast, so even if I have to go as
>far as Milwalkee, it's no big deal. I just don't want to make
>reservations, then have to deal with not being able to make it due to
>weather enroute from SC. If I wait around until it's dark, and late,
>then find out it's too hot to sleep well, im stuck in misery, misery
>misery. Sweating all night.

I slept in a tent in 1991 and it was O.K. if you didn't get in the
bag. We had to go to bed at sundown because the mosquitos come out in
droves. I then got up about midnite or a little later and took a
shower which wasn't crowded at that time. I then went back and lay
down til sunrise and got out and looked at stuff before the crowds
were up. I was camped in the show camping which was right next to the
theatre in the woods. They'd let you park a homebuilt in there then,
but I think it has changed since then.

Ed Sullivan

[Morgans]

"Tedstriker" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> For anyone that has actually slept in a tent at OSH, does it cool off
> enough at night to sleep comfortably?

Usually, yes. Take a sheet along. I also took a small battery pack, like
you use to charge up a car battery, and hooked a small fan to it, and hung
it it the top of my tent.

> If it's muggy all night, I might
> just blast off and fly my homebuilt somewhere and get an air
> conditioned hotel room.

Gotta leave by 19:00, so you have to decide well before then. Also, you
might arrive the next day, to find that the field is full. I wouldn't risk
it, if it were me, for the seldom problem of not cooling off at night.

>My plane is fast, so even if I have to go as
> far as Milwalkee, it's no big deal. I just don't want to make
> reservations, then have to deal with not being able to make it due to
> weather enroute from SC. If I wait around until it's dark, and late,
> then find out it's too hot to sleep well, im stuck in misery, misery
> misery. Sweating all night.

I feel your pain, but it's all so worth it. Hang in there.
--
Jim in NC

[Montblack]

("Tedstriker" wrote)
[snip]
> For anyone that has actually slept in a tent at OSH, does it cool off
> enough at night to sleep comfortably?


Last year was PERFECT (Wed-Sun) ...there was a Saturday late night storm.
Many people noted the total lack of mosquitoes for the week - the blood
sucking kind. Sleeping weather was very good.

I showered at night - no lines, cools you down, cleans you up from the day's
sun screen and sweat ...sleep like a baby. Trick I found works good for me
when it's hot and muggy, I use a bath towel on my pillow - for some reason I
sweat less that way.

In 2003 I stayed in the dorms (Thur-Sun). Prior to my arrival, the grounds
were hit hard by a few storms, some with straight line winds. Thursday
evening the N40 was 1/3 full. Had another storm roll through my first night
in the dorm - LOUD. By Friday evening the N40 was a almost empty. Broken
tents were piled 6-feet deep next to the dumpsters!! People pitched their
broken tent's, so to speak, and flew home.

Mosquitoes were light in 2003. Temps - not hot.

There was an OSH a few years ago that generated some I Survived Oshkosh _ _
_ _ t-shirts. Don't recall the year?


Montblack

[Tedstriker]

On Sat, 11 Jun 2005 00:18:17 -0500, "Montblack"
> wrote:

>("Tedstriker" wrote)
>[snip]
>> For anyone that has actually slept in a tent at OSH, does it cool off
>> enough at night to sleep comfortably?
>
>
>Last year was PERFECT (Wed-Sun) ...there was a Saturday late night storm.
>Many people noted the total lack of mosquitoes for the week - the blood
>sucking kind. Sleeping weather was very good.
>
>I showered at night - no lines, cools you down, cleans you up from the day's
>sun screen and sweat ...sleep like a baby. Trick I found works good for me
>when it's hot and muggy, I use a bath towel on my pillow - for some reason I
>sweat less that way.
>
>In 2003 I stayed in the dorms (Thur-Sun). Prior to my arrival, the grounds
>were hit hard by a few storms, some with straight line winds. Thursday
>evening the N40 was 1/3 full. Had another storm roll through my first night
>in the dorm - LOUD. By Friday evening the N40 was a almost empty. Broken
>tents were piled 6-feet deep next to the dumpsters!! People pitched their
>broken tent's, so to speak, and flew home.
>
>Mosquitoes were light in 2003. Temps - not hot.
>
>There was an OSH a few years ago that generated some I Survived Oshkosh _ _
>_ _ t-shirts. Don't recall the year?
>
>
>Montblack

Hmm... The way I've always gone in the past, that is take the
airlines to MKE, then rent a car and drive in doesn't sound so bad
again.

[Tedstriker]

On Fri, 10 Jun 2005 22:53:26 -0400, "Morgans"
> wrote:

>
>"Tedstriker" > wrote in message
g
>it it the top of my tent.
>
>> If it's muggy all night, I might
>> just blast off and fly my homebuilt somewhere and get an air
>> conditioned hotel room.
>
>Gotta leave by 19:00, so you have to decide well before then. Also, you
>might arrive the next day, to find that the field is full. I wouldn't risk
>it, if it were me, for the seldom problem of not cooling off at night.
>

Do they close the airport to departues at 19:00? or is that just how
soon to leave to get somewhere else before dark?

that woud be a bummer if one left by air, to go to a hotel, then
couldn't get back in to the fly-in. But I don't think I'll have that
problem, being in a homebuilt/showplane. They usually want all those
they can get. And mine qualifies for that front and center parking
area they've reserved for past champions, and those with over a
thousand hours total time. Mine has about 1,650.

[RST Engineering]

That would have been 1995 ... the year Gail and I met at Oshkosh. As I
recall, we had trouble sleeping also ... but probably not for the same
reason {;-)

Jim


>
> There was an OSH a few years ago that generated some I Survived Oshkosh _
> _
> _ _ t-shirts. Don't recall the year?
>

[[email protected]]

Airport closes just before sunset at about 1900. Period. DO NOT try to
extricate yourself from a parking spot and find a runway in the dark
with literally thousands of people lounging, walking, relaxing or
milling about. It is an accident waiting to happen. We used to try and
park aircraft in the dark in the bad old days, and it was not worth the
risk to anyone. If you want to leave, wait until the am and leave when
the airport reopens just after sunrise.

Regards,
Ryan
Madison, WI
Co-Chairman, EAA Flight Line Operations

Tedstriker wrote:
> On Fri, 10 Jun 2005 22:53:26 -0400, "Morgans"
> > wrote:
>
> >
> >"Tedstriker" > wrote in message
> g
> >it it the top of my tent.
> >
> >> If it's muggy all night, I might
> >> just blast off and fly my homebuilt somewhere and get an air
> >> conditioned hotel room.
> >
> >Gotta leave by 19:00, so you have to decide well before then. Also, you
> >might arrive the next day, to find that the field is full. I wouldn't risk
> >it, if it were me, for the seldom problem of not cooling off at night.
> >
>
> Do they close the airport to departues at 19:00? or is that just how
> soon to leave to get somewhere else before dark?
>
> that woud be a bummer if one left by air, to go to a hotel, then
> couldn't get back in to the fly-in. But I don't think I'll have that
> problem, being in a homebuilt/showplane. They usually want all those
> they can get. And mine qualifies for that front and center parking
> area they've reserved for past champions, and those with over a
> thousand hours total time. Mine has about 1,650.

[Tedstriker]

On 11 Jun 2005 06:57:13 -0700, wrote:

>Airport closes just before sunset at about 1900. Period. DO NOT try to
>extricate yourself from a parking spot and find a runway in the dark
>with literally thousands of people lounging, walking, relaxing or
>milling about. It is an accident waiting to happen. We used to try and
>park aircraft in the dark in the bad old days, and it was not worth the
>risk to anyone. If you want to leave, wait until the am and leave when
>the airport reopens just after sunrise.
>
>Regards,
>Ryan
>Madison, WI
>Co-Chairman, EAA Flight Line Operations

Excellent point, the thought of taxiing a plane in the dark with all
those people milling around is a nightmare just thinking about it!

Shuttling in and out of OSH daily by air to a hotel in another city
doesn't sound that effiecient. I've done it at Lakeland, where I
would fly over to Tampa to get a hotel. I'd just get in the takeoff
line right after the airshow ended. And make sure to get back before
it started the next day. But they don't get so full that they have to
turn airplanes away like Oshkosh has in the past. But attendance has
been waneing lately, so maybe that won't be the case. Well, we all
know Lakeland's attendance is waneing, but I'm not so sure about OSH.

[Matt Whiting]

Tedstriker wrote:
>
> For anyone that has actually slept in a tent at OSH, does it cool off
> enough at night to sleep comfortably? If it's muggy all night, I might
> just blast off and fly my homebuilt somewhere and get an air
> conditioned hotel room. My plane is fast, so even if I have to go as
> far as Milwalkee, it's no big deal. I just don't want to make
> reservations, then have to deal with not being able to make it due to
> weather enroute from SC. If I wait around until it's dark, and late,
> then find out it's too hot to sleep well, im stuck in misery, misery
> misery. Sweating all night.

The two nights I camped there the evening temps were in the upper 60s
and very comfortable. The third night, it thunderstormed and blew down
many tents. Fortunately, I was in the dorms that night! :-)

Also, I was lucky in that my tent didn't get blown down, but it was one
of few that survived. I think it was the rail road spikes that I use
for tent pegs that helped. My friend was kidding me about the weight
when we loaded the Skylane as I carry them in an ammo box and the box
weighs probably 25 lbs. However, when we got to the grounds that
morning and saw my tent stil standing strong and saw the other people
setting up their tents, drying out their sleeping bags, etc., he stopped
kidding me about my tent pegs.

Flying in and out each day probably isn't a bad option, but when the
traffic is heavy, you may spend a while getting in and out each time.
Hard to be an air conditioned hotel room though in the summer in OSH.


Matt

[Matt Whiting]

RST Engineering wrote:

> That would have been 1995 ... the year Gail and I met at Oshkosh. As I
> recall, we had trouble sleeping also ... but probably not for the same
> reason {;-)

Yes, 1995 had some wicked storms. Uh, Jim, that isn't called sleeping. :-)


Matt

[Cy Galley]

The Tower and field closes at 8 P.M. according to the NOTAM


--
Cy Galley - Chair,
AirVenture Emergency Aircraft Repair - for 34 years!
A Service Project of Chapter 75
EAA Safety Programs Editor - TC
EAA Sport Pilot


"Tedstriker" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 10 Jun 2005 22:53:26 -0400, "Morgans"
> > wrote:
>
>>
>>"Tedstriker" > wrote in message
> g
>>it it the top of my tent.
>>
>>> If it's muggy all night, I might
>>> just blast off and fly my homebuilt somewhere and get an air
>>> conditioned hotel room.
>>
>>Gotta leave by 19:00, so you have to decide well before then. Also, you
>>might arrive the next day, to find that the field is full. I wouldn't
>>risk
>>it, if it were me, for the seldom problem of not cooling off at night.
>>
>
> Do they close the airport to departues at 19:00? or is that just how
> soon to leave to get somewhere else before dark?
>
> that woud be a bummer if one left by air, to go to a hotel, then
> couldn't get back in to the fly-in. But I don't think I'll have that
> problem, being in a homebuilt/showplane. They usually want all those
> they can get. And mine qualifies for that front and center parking
> area they've reserved for past champions, and those with over a
> thousand hours total time. Mine has about 1,650.

[Morgans]

"Tedstriker" > wrote
>
> Do they close the airport to departues at 19:00? or is that just how
> soon to leave to get somewhere else before dark?

Yes, the airport is closed to arrivals and departures.
>
> that woud be a bummer if one left by air, to go to a hotel, then
> couldn't get back in to the fly-in. But I don't think I'll have that
> problem, being in a homebuilt/showplane. They usually want all those
> they can get. And mine qualifies for that front and center parking
> area they've reserved for past champions, and those with over a
> thousand hours total time. Mine has about 1,650.

Yea, you will have a parking spot, but I don't know where people that come
with showplanes, sleep.
--
Jim in NC

[Morgans]

"Cy Galley" > wrote in message news:pBKqe.37615

> The Tower and field closes at 8 P.M. according to the NOTAM


Damn, I hate it when my memory goes to hell!

I should have looked it up, rather than relying on memory. Sorry, OP.
--
Jim in NC

[Roger]

On Thu, 09 Jun 2005 23:44:43 -0400, Ron Natalie >
wrote:

>Roger wrote:
>
>> BTW, what color is your Navion, Ron?
>>
>Dark blue. There hare pictures on Honeck's web site
>or http://www.margynatalie.com

When I was going through the Oshkosh photos the other night I came
across some that were shot near dark with the pyrotechnic displays
(bomb runs) and there is one of a guy standing in a Navion watching
the display, but as I recall that one was mostly white with blue trim.
It would have been parked to the East and just north of the Quonset
hut "as I recall".

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

[Roger]

On Sat, 11 Jun 2005 20:09:37 -0400, "Morgans"
> wrote:

>
>"Tedstriker" > wrote
>>
>> Do they close the airport to departues at 19:00? or is that just how
>> soon to leave to get somewhere else before dark?
>
> Yes, the airport is closed to arrivals and departures.
>>
>> that woud be a bummer if one left by air, to go to a hotel, then
>> couldn't get back in to the fly-in. But I don't think I'll have that
>> problem, being in a homebuilt/showplane. They usually want all those
>> they can get. And mine qualifies for that front and center parking
>> area they've reserved for past champions, and those with over a
>> thousand hours total time. Mine has about 1,650.
>
>Yea, you will have a parking spot, but I don't know where people that come
>with showplanes, sleep.

Show plane camping which is (or was) the same area as the
Antique/Classic/Contemporary.

I've seen many a spot reserved in there, so I suppose you could stake
out your spot, and come back to it. A Cozy parked next to me did that
twice. They had a nice air conditioned room at a friends place about
a half hour flight out.

Me? I just don't enjoy flying that Ripon Arrival. I don't mind flying
close to other airplanes, but I want it to be with some one I know
well doing the flying. At least the Deb has a wide speed range and a
low stall speed coupled with relatively light wing loading.

I've never had a problem getting out, BUT you have to be ready to
leave at the end of the air show. That means packed up, with the
plane pulled out into the space between the rows. You have to wait
for the ground crew to spot you and then guide you to the taxiway. No
engine starting until the ground crew tells you to start. That is
done with the plane pulled out into the area between the rows of
planes and pointed parallel to the rows so you don't blow any one away
when you do start. the year it was so hot and dry, you couldn't see
more than about 50 feet behind me when I started the Deb. It took
darn near two pails of water to wash the windows before leaving.

I file IFR, but usually put the pink sheet of paper on the floor and
depart VFR.

If you are nice and polite and contact the ground crew ahead of time
and are ready to go as soon as the field opens you can be one of the
first out.

Early on you don't have the rush to get out as you do on Saturday and
Sunday. You need to have your shh... er ... stuff together, radios on
frequency, watch the flag men, and be ready to do what you are told,
when you are told and it'll run smooth as clock work.

They are usually either two or three deep at the hold and two abreast.
They alternate left and right sides. When they say go, you firewall
it and had out. Depending on speed watch for passing traffic or being
passed. If departure is on 36 that right turn just before the tower
can be interesting if you are on the left. <:-)) You do learn to
"stay on your side of the runway" until about time to turn.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

[Roger]

>
>There was an OSH a few years ago that generated some I Survived Oshkosh _ _
>_ _ t-shirts. Don't recall the year?

There have been several of those, but back in about 98 or 99 they had
a heat index of over 111 degrees and no wind. Miserable is an
understatement. At least I was working in the Homebuilders
Headquarters which had air conditioning in the break room. I spent
about half the afternoon sitting on the floor in there.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

>
>
>Montblack

[[email protected]]

Oops, I meant 2000 too, not 1900.
(I didn't look it up either...)
DOH!

Ryan

[Rich S.]

"Roger" > wrote in message
...
> There have been several of those, but back in about 98 or 99 they had
> a heat index of over 111 degrees and no wind.

Remember that one well, do I. It was 1999. During the airshow in the
afternoon, folks were dropping like flies. The aid wagons were on the go
constantly.

Rich S.

[Corky Scott]

On Fri, 10 Jun 2005 22:24:42 -0400, Tedstriker
> wrote:

>
>For anyone that has actually slept in a tent at OSH, does it cool off
>enough at night to sleep comfortably? If it's muggy all night, I might
>just blast off and fly my homebuilt somewhere and get an air
>conditioned hotel room. My plane is fast, so even if I have to go as
>far as Milwalkee, it's no big deal. I just don't want to make
>reservations, then have to deal with not being able to make it due to
>weather enroute from SC. If I wait around until it's dark, and late,
>then find out it's too hot to sleep well, im stuck in misery, misery
>misery. Sweating all night.

I was there in '95 and it was smoking hot all day every day, and
extremely uncomfortable in the tent at night. Not sure I slept much
while I was there.

The night before we left, a front and storms passed through and the
temperature moderated considerably. We chased the front to the east
the next day through ever clearing weather and managed to get home by
evening.

It was so hot the several days I was there, you worried about leaving
any skin exposed. People would walk by looking like they were about
to drop.

Not much you can do about it but stay out of the sun. Sleeping at
night in the tent was difficult. That's the way the weather goes, it
could be very nice, very rainy or very hot. Or it could be all three
during the time you're there.

Corky Scott

[Tedstriker]

On Mon, 13 Jun 2005 07:54:11 -0400, Corky Scott
> wrote:

>
>
>I was there in '95 and it was smoking hot all day every day, and
>extremely uncomfortable in the tent at night. Not sure I slept much
>while I was there.
>
>The night before we left, a front and storms passed through and the
>temperature moderated considerably. We chased the front to the east
>the next day through ever clearing weather and managed to get home by
>evening.
>
>It was so hot the several days I was there, you worried about leaving
>any skin exposed. People would walk by looking like they were about
>to drop.
>
>Not much you can do about it but stay out of the sun. Sleeping at
>night in the tent was difficult. That's the way the weather goes, it
>could be very nice, very rainy or very hot. Or it could be all three
>during the time you're there.
>
>Corky Scott
>

I remember that year, and how hot is was. I remember sweat pouring
down from my head and into my eyes and burning. But I had driven from
Milwaulkee, and had a car to go to a hotel in Appleton, so that was
nice to have. Paper Valley Inn. But I checked, and they have just
about doubled their rates from what I paid back then. One year, not
too long ago, I stayed in Omro, and it was okay. At least the A/C
worked. But when you checked in, they ask you if you have a gun, if
you say no, they give you one. Camping is starting to look like a last
resort option only.

[Corky Scott]

On Mon, 13 Jun 2005 10:52:53 -0400, Tedstriker
> wrote:

> One year, not
>too long ago, I stayed in Omro, and it was okay. At least the A/C
>worked. But when you checked in, they ask you if you have a gun, if
>you say no, they give you one. Camping is starting to look like a last
>resort option only.

Lordy, what was the gun supposed to be used for?

Here's another option, rent an RV that has air and drive it to
Oshkosh. Many's the RV I walked past at night that year listening to
the drone of their APU's running the AC.

Corky Scott

[Paul Dow (Remove Caps in mail address)]

I'm trying the dorms at Lawrence University in Appleton this year. $65
for a double room. Share bathroom with only 1 other room. And air
conditioned. The place is only about 3 years old. Singles are sold
out, but it looks like they still have double rooms. I haven't stayed
there before, so I'm only going by what's on their web site, but it
looks like a good value.

http://www.lawrence.edu/community/eaa.Shtml

Tedstriker wrote:

>
>
> I remember that year, and how hot is was. I remember sweat pouring
> down from my head and into my eyes and burning. But I had driven from
> Milwaulkee, and had a car to go to a hotel in Appleton, so that was
> nice to have. Paper Valley Inn. But I checked, and they have just
> about doubled their rates from what I paid back then. One year, not
> too long ago, I stayed in Omro, and it was okay. At least the A/C
> worked. But when you checked in, they ask you if you have a gun, if
> you say no, they give you one. Camping is starting to look like a last
> resort option only.

[Montblack]

("Paul Dow (Remove Caps in mail address)" wrote)
[snip]
> I'm trying the dorms at Lawrence University in Appleton this year. $65
> for a double room. Share bathroom with only 1 other room. And air
> conditioned.

> http://www.lawrence.edu/community/eaa.Shtml


IIRC Jack, Steve and Pops stayed there last year. They got eaten alive by
the bus fees - each way. He did not like that part of it. Otherwise he was
ok with Appleton.


Montblack

[Paul Dow (Remove Caps in Address)]

Thanks for the warning, but we got a rental car. Fortunatly the friend
that's coming along found cheap airfares to Chicago $178, vs $320 from
Bradley to Appleton. We got these back in Feb. I thought there would be
summer sales, but the price just kept going up. We figure with the
change plane time and the short flight, it's only about 1 hour extra to
drive.

I know the experience of taking the LST isn't the same as flying
ourselves in, but at least it will save some $.

Montblack wrote:
> ("Paul Dow (Remove Caps in mail address)" wrote)
> [snip]
>
>> I'm trying the dorms at Lawrence University in Appleton this year.
>> $65 for a double room. Share bathroom with only 1 other room. And air
>> conditioned.
>
>
>> http://www.lawrence.edu/community/eaa.Shtml
>
>
>
> IIRC Jack, Steve and Pops stayed there last year. They got eaten alive
> by the bus fees - each way. He did not like that part of it. Otherwise
> he was ok with Appleton.
>
>
> Montblack

[John]

"Paul Dow (Remove Caps in mail address)" >
wrote:

>I'm trying the dorms at Lawrence University in Appleton this year. $65
>for a double room. Share bathroom with only 1 other room. And air
>conditioned. The place is only about 3 years old. Singles are sold
>out, but it looks like they still have double rooms. I haven't stayed
>there before, so I'm only going by what's on their web site, but it
>looks like a good value.
>
>http://www.lawrence.edu/community/eaa.Shtml


Please clarify for me. The $65 for a double room is a "double
occupancy" rate (i.e. $130 for a room with two beds)? Yes?

Thanks

[Paul Dow]

Nope. It's $65 for the room. That's $32.50 each person per day.

Of course you could tell the person you're there with that it's $130 a
night for the room. Then it's free for you :-)

John wrote:
> "Paul Dow (Remove Caps in mail address)" >
> wrote:
>
>
>>I'm trying the dorms at Lawrence University in Appleton this year. $65
>>for a double room. Share bathroom with only 1 other room. And air
>>conditioned. The place is only about 3 years old. Singles are sold
>>out, but it looks like they still have double rooms. I haven't stayed
>>there before, so I'm only going by what's on their web site, but it
>>looks like a good value.
>>
>>http://www.lawrence.edu/community/eaa.Shtml
>
>
>
> Please clarify for me. The $65 for a double room is a "double
> occupancy" rate (i.e. $130 for a room with two beds)? Yes?
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
>

[[email protected]]

This year is shaping up to be pretty warm. It was 92 in Madison, WI
today. OSH is only 4 weeks away!

[Cy Galley]

It will cool off by then


I hope!! <GRIN>

> wrote in message
ups.com...
> This year is shaping up to be pretty warm. It was 92 in Madison, WI
> today. OSH is only 4 weeks away!
>

[Joe Camp]

On Sat, 25 Jun 2005 02:45:28 GMT, "Cy Galley" >
wrote:

>It will cool off by then
>
>
>I hope!! <GRIN>
>

Oh, it will, since it will be a month closer to winter, the temps
will drop considerably.

[Chris Schmelzer]

In article >,
Joe Camp > wrote:

> On Sat, 25 Jun 2005 02:45:28 GMT, "Cy Galley" >
> wrote:
>
> >It will cool off by then
> >
> >
> >I hope!! <GRIN>
> >
>
> Oh, it will, since it will be a month closer to winter, the temps
> will drop considerably.



Right....sure....

Plan on temps between 70s and high 90s with dewpoints in the 70s...

Summer in the midwest can be VERY fickle...But plan on unbearable heat..

--
Chris Schmelzer, MD
Capt, 110th Fighter Michigan ANG
University of Michigan Hospitals
Ann Arbor, MI

[Roger]

On Mon, 27 Jun 2005 13:28:40 -0400, Chris Schmelzer >
wrote:

>In article >,
> Joe Camp > wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 25 Jun 2005 02:45:28 GMT, "Cy Galley" >
>> wrote:
>>
>> >It will cool off by then
>> >
>> >
>> >I hope!! <GRIN>
>> >
>>
>> Oh, it will, since it will be a month closer to winter, the temps
>> will drop considerably.
>
>
>
>Right....sure....
>
>Plan on temps between 70s and high 90s with dewpoints in the 70s...

Usually<:-))

>
>Summer in the midwest can be VERY fickle...But plan on unbearable heat..

The odds are on the heat, but I remember being hunkered down behind
the windshield of the welcome wagon with the hope that this was going
to be our last run of the day. I had a wool sweater on with a jacket
over it and I was still shivering.

I remember waiting for the buss at the terminal using an umbrella to
keep dry and a coat to keep warm.

I remember laying under the wing of the Deb thinking, "My GAWD it's
hot, I'll never make it back to my room". I barely had enough energy
to roll over to watch the air show from under the wing.

I remember it being too hot to even lay in a tent next to the airplane
for shade.

I also remember when we had a heat index of over 111. Of course that
was the same day my wife was riding her bike from some where out on
the Green Bay peninsula to Manitowoc where she'd catch the ferry
across to Ludington and then drive home.

I remember winds at 30 knots shifting from off the nose on 27 to 180
and the plane starting to skid at just about rotation speed. I
remember the temperature in the clouds as we climbed out was still
above 80. Only when ATC had us climb to 8000 (east bound) for traffic
avoidance over Lake Michigan did it drop to near 70.
..
Plan on heat and the odds will be with you, but expect almost
anything.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

[David J. Zera]

Roger,

I SO understand the below!!!

Dave J. Zera
Co-Chairman
Safety / Flight line
Airventure 2005
"Roger" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 27 Jun 2005 13:28:40 -0400, Chris Schmelzer >
> wrote:
>
>>In article >,
>> Joe Camp > wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, 25 Jun 2005 02:45:28 GMT, "Cy Galley" >
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> >It will cool off by then
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >I hope!! <GRIN>
>>> >
>>>
>>> Oh, it will, since it will be a month closer to winter, the temps
>>> will drop considerably.
>>
>>
>>
>>Right....sure....
>>
>>Plan on temps between 70s and high 90s with dewpoints in the 70s...
>
> Usually<:-))
>
>>
>>Summer in the midwest can be VERY fickle...But plan on unbearable heat..
>
> The odds are on the heat, but I remember being hunkered down behind
> the windshield of the welcome wagon with the hope that this was going
> to be our last run of the day. I had a wool sweater on with a jacket
> over it and I was still shivering.
>
> I remember waiting for the buss at the terminal using an umbrella to
> keep dry and a coat to keep warm.
>
> I remember laying under the wing of the Deb thinking, "My GAWD it's
> hot, I'll never make it back to my room". I barely had enough energy
> to roll over to watch the air show from under the wing.
>
> I remember it being too hot to even lay in a tent next to the airplane
> for shade.
>
> I also remember when we had a heat index of over 111. Of course that
> was the same day my wife was riding her bike from some where out on
> the Green Bay peninsula to Manitowoc where she'd catch the ferry
> across to Ludington and then drive home.
>
> I remember winds at 30 knots shifting from off the nose on 27 to 180
> and the plane starting to skid at just about rotation speed. I
> remember the temperature in the clouds as we climbed out was still
> above 80. Only when ATC had us climb to 8000 (east bound) for traffic
> avoidance over Lake Michigan did it drop to near 70.
> .
> Plan on heat and the odds will be with you, but expect almost
> anything.
>
> Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
> (N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
> www.rogerhalstead.com

[ubenhadd]

I have been at OSH when the temps were in the teens and in the 90-90+'s, all
in the same week. We usually pitch the tent in a high spot in Camp
Scholler, on a bigger than the tent ground tarp, then take a tarp that gives
a minimum of a 4' drip ring around the tent and tie it off to stakes. This
guarantees a dry and windstorm proof tent.

Store your clothes either inside a car trunk or in plastic bags as the
humidity spikes int he afternoon.

As for sleeping......after walking in the HOT sun all day, enjoying the
evening festivities, grabbing a shower around 10PM to Midnight, I crawl my
naked butt into sheets placed inside my open sleeping bag (it can get really
cool here too) and don't even roll until that pesky 7AM morning drone flyby
to wake us all up.

If worse comes, let the storms rage (and they will) but we are always high
and dry.

Can't make it this year.... ;-(
Brian
"Ed Sullivan" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 10 Jun 2005 22:24:42 -0400, Tedstriker
> > wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >For anyone that has actually slept in a tent at OSH, does it cool off
> >enough at night to sleep comfortably? If it's muggy all night, I might
> >just blast off and fly my homebuilt somewhere and get an air
> >conditioned hotel room. My plane is fast, so even if I have to go as
> >far as Milwalkee, it's no big deal. I just don't want to make
> >reservations, then have to deal with not being able to make it due to
> >weather enroute from SC. If I wait around until it's dark, and late,
> >then find out it's too hot to sleep well, im stuck in misery, misery
> >misery. Sweating all night.
>
> I slept in a tent in 1991 and it was O.K. if you didn't get in the
> bag. We had to go to bed at sundown because the mosquitos come out in
> droves. I then got up about midnite or a little later and took a
> shower which wasn't crowded at that time. I then went back and lay
> down til sunrise and got out and looked at stuff before the crowds
> were up. I was camped in the show camping which was right next to the
> theatre in the woods. They'd let you park a homebuilt in there then,
> but I think it has changed since then.
>
> Ed Sullivan
>
>

[Morgans]

"ubenhadd" > wrote

>We usually pitch the tent in a high spot in Camp
> Scholler, on a bigger than the tent ground tarp,

Putting a tent on a tarp with some of the tarp sticking out, is a recipe for
the tarp to catch some water, and pool it, then having it leak through the
floor. Normally, you roll up the tarp so it is slightly under the edge of
the tent, and if possible, put some leaves or dirt under the edge of the
tarp, to insure that rain does not drip down the sides of the tent, and find
its way onto the top of the tarp.

Careful how loudly you say "a wind proof tent." I have seen winds at OSH
that will blow down ANYTHING, unless extra lines are added, and firmly
staked.
--
Jim in NC

[RST Engineering]

I *specifically* remember in 200(1?) when we were still giving forums in
tents as opposed to concrete blockhouses standing on the top of a canvas
forums tent in the morning mist giving the forum. Those suckers were guyed
with 1½" ropes and staked with 1" rebar 6' into the ground and they STILL
blew down.

"The show must go on."

Jim

>
> Careful how loudly you say "a wind proof tent." I have seen winds at OSH
> that will blow down ANYTHING, unless extra lines are added, and firmly
> staked.
> --
> Jim in NC
>

[Morgans]

"RST Engineering" > wrote

> Those suckers were guyed
> with 1½" ropes and staked with 1" rebar 6' into the ground and they STILL
> blew down.

Amen, brother Jim. Amazing how the wind thinks a tent is a sail, and can
send them "sailing away."

The most I hope for is wind resistant. I also try to make it so the sucker
falls down, just before it breaks down.
--
Jim in NC