Lake Winnepausaukee

[Skylune]

Does anyone know why planes are landing on this lake? There are alot of
boaters and kayakers around, and it seems like a risky thing to do.

When the planes land on the lake, do Coast Guard regulations or the FAR's
apply?

[Mike Rapoport]

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> Does anyone know why planes are landing on this lake? There are alot of
> boaters and kayakers around, and it seems like a risky thing to do.
>
> When the planes land on the lake, do Coast Guard regulations or the FAR's
> apply?
>

Floatplanes pretty much have the same right to operate on public waterways
as the white-trash powerboaters.

Mike
MU-2

[Skylune]

Do you think the pilot would be upset if I took my formula 27 pc, which
weighs in at about 10,500 pounds and has twin 350s and created some nice
wake action for him to make the touchdowns more exciting?

I think I have right of way on the lake, but the FARs provide me no
guidance.

[John Godwin]

"Skylune" > wrote in
lkaboutaviation.com
:

> When the planes land on the lake, do Coast Guard regulations or
> the FAR's apply?

Seaplanes are subject to the Coast Guard regulations during water
operations and FAR 91.115


--

[[email protected]]

Skylune,

Once on the water, normal water right of way rules apply although some
(depending on location) speed limits are waived for the aircraft during
takeoff and landing.

>From a safety standpoint, it seems that a trained pilot who has
undergone federal testing procedures on operation of her or his craft
both in the air and one the water (including planning and making
allowances for watercraft), just might be a little safer than those
operating watercraft and who haven't had to take any sort of formal
training or testing and about 30-40% of whom are drinking while
operating their watercraft.

Don't know why you'd want to discriminate in favor of aircraft when you
go create wakes, I'm sure the boaters would love it, too.

[Bob Gardner]

The FARS are irrelevant when a float plane is on the surface...the marine
rules of the road apply. They virtually mirror the FAR ROW rules, however.

According to the maritime rules of the road, a 10,000 ton tanker doing 16
knots is supposed to cede the right-of-way to a sailboat crossing from its
right...but common sense tells the sailboat operator that the tanker can't
possibly maneuver or stop quickly enough. Same thing is true of floatplanes
on the water...if they are accelerating for takeoff, they have the REAL
right-of-way, no matter where the crossing traffic is. Landing is much the
same thing...the pilot of the plane doesn't have many options once he is on
short final. It's only when a floatplane is taxiing on the water that the
maritime rules make sense.

We have a ton of seaplane operations on relatively small Lake Union in
Seattle (and on larger Lake Washington) and everyone seems to make the
necessary accomodations.

Bob Gardner
USCG (Ret)

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> Do you think the pilot would be upset if I took my formula 27 pc, which
> weighs in at about 10,500 pounds and has twin 350s and created some nice
> wake action for him to make the touchdowns more exciting?
>
> I think I have right of way on the lake, but the FARs provide me no
> guidance.
>

[Jose]

> Do you think the pilot would be upset if I took my formula 27 pc, which
> weighs in at about 10,500 pounds and has twin 350s and created some nice
> wake action for him to make the touchdowns more exciting?

A pilot in a similar state of mind could make your boating equally exciting.

I'd venture that the same rules would apply to the boater whether he was
harassing a seaplane or a rowboat.

> This is an important national security topic, despite what that moron Phil
> Boyer says.

Despite what appears to be your desire to hook fish behind a boat, I'd
ask why you think this. Especially considering the potentially =huge=
amount of explosive that the interstates could carry directly to the
hearts of all our major cities via rented trucks.

Jose
--
"Never trust anything that can think for itself, if you can't see where
it keeps its brain."
(chapter 10 of book 3 - Harry Potter).
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

[Skylune]

Well, actually in NH you do need a boating certificate to operate legally.
And boaters do get arrested for DWI. Lake Winni is heavily patrolled, so
drunken boaters will get caught.

But I get your point; drunken boaters are a hazard.

By the way, when a private pilot gets into his/her plane, who checks to
see if he/she is drunk or otherwise intoxicated? Two years ago, right
here in my little state of New Hampshire, a guy got drunk, had an
altercation with the cops, got a restraining order against him, and then
flew his plane from Nashua Airport into his wife's house! Its on the NTSB
website. One of my favorite stories.....

[George Patterson]

Skylune wrote:
>
> By the way, when a private pilot gets into his/her plane, who checks to
> see if he/she is drunk or otherwise intoxicated?

The same guy who checks to see if you're sober before you get into your car.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

[Skylune]

It hasn't become a major issue yet (despite the seaplane that flipped over
on the lake a few weeks back -- i think the NTSB blamed it on a wake), but
I have witnessed some seaplanes coming uncomfortably close to powerboaters
and even kayakers. How on earth can a pilot see if there is a kayaker
where he/she intends to land??

Its hard enough to see these kayakers when you on the water (although my
trusty Furuno usually picks them up), so i don't see how a landing plane
can possibly see them.

[STEVEN SIMPSON]

Now ,I like that statement.Good one Gorge.
"George Patterson" > wrote in message
news:FiHre.5847$fa3.921@trndny01...
> Skylune wrote:
>>
>> By the way, when a private pilot gets into his/her plane, who checks to
>> see if he/she is drunk or otherwise intoxicated?
>
> The same guy who checks to see if you're sober before you get into your
> car.
>
> George Patterson
> Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
> and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
> Because she smells like a new truck.

[Bob Gardner]

If you have a few minutes, Google seaplanes + right of way. Lots of good
stuff,

Bob Gardner

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> It hasn't become a major issue yet (despite the seaplane that flipped over
> on the lake a few weeks back -- i think the NTSB blamed it on a wake), but
> I have witnessed some seaplanes coming uncomfortably close to powerboaters
> and even kayakers. How on earth can a pilot see if there is a kayaker
> where he/she intends to land??
>
> Its hard enough to see these kayakers when you on the water (although my
> trusty Furuno usually picks them up), so i don't see how a landing plane
> can possibly see them.
>

[Gig 601XL Builder]

Does anyone know why boaters and kayakers are floating on this lake? There
are a few of
planes around, and it seems like a risky thing to do.

When the boats are on the lake, do ALWAYS ignore Coast Guard regulations or
are they just drunk?

[George Patterson]

Skylune wrote:
>
> Its hard enough to see these kayakers when you on the water (although my
> trusty Furuno usually picks them up), so i don't see how a landing plane
> can possibly see them.

I suggest you go up in a light plane and check the situation out. You'd be
surprised how excellent the visibility is from the pointy end.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

[George Patterson]

Gig 601XL Builder wrote:
>
> When the boats are on the lake, do ALWAYS ignore Coast Guard regulations or
> are they just drunk?

Neither one. They would probably ignore them, but they don't know what the regs
are. Being drunk helps, of course.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

[Skylune]

That's a good one. You fly boys want control of the lakes too! Get Phil
Boyer on it immediately!

Such attitudes beget groups like Stop the Noise, Plane Sense, etc.

[Skylune]

As a certified control freak, I wouldn't fly in a light plane for any
reason, especially considering how dangerous they are. I would fly in a
double engine plane with a very well trained, professional pilot, of
course, but that clearly rules you out....

[[email protected]]

Yep, there are badly screwed up people throughout humanity.
Fortunately, drunk flying is so very rare that it makes the news while
drunk driving and boating is so commonplance that it is largely ignored
by the media.

[Steven P. McNicoll]

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
>
> Do you think the pilot would be upset if I took my formula 27 pc, which
> weighs in at about 10,500 pounds and has twin 350s and created some nice
> wake action for him to make the touchdowns more exciting?
>

He'd probably go around. What do you find satisfying about being an
asshole?


>
> I think I have right of way on the lake, but the FARs provide me no
> guidance.
>

I believe seaplanes are supposed to avoid all other traffic.

[[email protected]]

Actually, kayakers are quite easy to spot when landing. Being above
the lake gives one an excellent perspective and allows you to see very
small boats that may be tough to see from another boat (as a kayaker
myself, I'm far more worried about drunk powerboaters who aren't
looking out or can't see me because of the structure of their boats
than I am about seaplanes - I also know that the pilots really, really
don't want to hit anybody or anything because the aircraft structure is
light enough that it's going to come out the definite loser). Keep in
mind that there is no voodoo to being "above" something, you don't
suddenly become blind, you actually have a better perspective. It's
like the lifeguard at the beach on the elevated platform, she or he can
see the swimming area far more effectively than at or close to water
level. On landing I can also see the kids in the inner tubes or
floats, right on the surface of the water, or swimmers who have decided
to swim across the lake, that I would have a heck of a time seeing from
a boat sitting on the surface. (That's why ships used to have a crow's
nest, so the lookout could things that couldn't be seen from the deck.)

"Close" is an opinion. For example, I will land a seaplane at a right
angle fairly "close" behind a powerboat that is going away from me to
my left or right, because his distance from me is increasing and even
if he stops, we still have adequate separation. If the boat is
converging with my course, I'm going to stay a long ways away, because
the boat may very well be faster than my airplane. As to a kayak or
canoe, "close" is looked at in two ways - 1) I do not want to land
close enough to the kayak or canoe that my wake (even though it is
pretty small) will cause a problem or that I will scare the boater, so
I'm going to establish a path that lets the boater predict where I'm
going and that I'm not a threat to him and 2) far enough away that even
if the boater starts paddling for all he or she is worth, the boat
can't possibly get close enough to me that there is any risk of
collision. An onlooker, hampered by the foreshortening of distance
from the surface, may come to the conclusion that the airplane and the
boat are far closer than they actually are. It's like watching the
horse teams or drill teams from the perspective of the viewing stand,
the people or horses pass each other with plenty of distance for
safety, but the angle of the viewer makes it look much closer than it
is.

[Steven P. McNicoll]

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
>
> It hasn't become a major issue yet (despite the seaplane that flipped over
> on the lake a few weeks back -- i think the NTSB blamed it on a wake), but
> I have witnessed some seaplanes coming uncomfortably close to powerboaters
> and even kayakers. How on earth can a pilot see if there is a kayaker
> where he/she intends to land??
>
> Its hard enough to see these kayakers when you on the water (although my
> trusty Furuno usually picks them up), so i don't see how a landing plane
> can possibly see them.
>

Well, if that's the case, then it's in the best interest of the kayaker to
move out of the way of the seaplane, right-of-way be damned.

By the way, it's Winnipesaukee, not Winnepausaukee.

[Skylune]

That is absurd. Every day there are stories about drunk drivers and/or
boaters. Thing is, they get CAUGHT. That is the distinction.

Now, I know that certain pilots have this superiority complex thing. I
think it is mostly the $3500/21 day pilots, and not the pros.

Remember this, if you land your plane on the lake, you follow OUR rules,
and i can legally come within 200 feet of you at any speed I choose.
When I see a rude pilot try to muscle his way onto the lake, I am going to
exercise MY legal right to boat. And my 27PC with both screws turning
around 4100 rpms can put out a mean wake. Then you can whine to your boy
Phil Boyer.

[gregg]

Skylune wrote:

> Does anyone know why planes are landing on this lake? There are alot of
> boaters and kayakers around, and it seems like a risky thing to do.
>
> When the planes land on the lake, do Coast Guard regulations or the FAR's
> apply?


I had heard from a CFI that ther eis a fly in occasionally, and they meet up
in some bay. He told me they also do that in Winter when the lake freezes
over.


--
Saville

Replicas of 15th-19th century nautical navigational instruments:

http://home.comcast.net/~saville/backstaffhome.html

Restoration of my 82 year old Herreshoff S-Boat sailboat:

http://home.comcast.net/~saville/SBOATrestore.htm

Steambending FAQ with photos:

http://home.comcast.net/~saville/Steambend.htm

[Bob Noel]

In article utaviation.com>,
"Skylune" > wrote:

> That's a good one. You fly boys want control of the lakes too! Get Phil
> Boyer on it immediately!
>
> Such attitudes beget groups like Stop the Noise, Plane Sense, etc.

troll

--
Bob Noel
no one likes an educated mule

[Steven P. McNicoll]

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
>
> Remember this, if you land your plane on the lake, you follow OUR rules,
> and i can legally come within 200 feet of you at any speed I choose.
> When I see a rude pilot try to muscle his way onto the lake, I am going to
> exercise MY legal right to boat. And my 27PC with both screws turning
> around 4100 rpms can put out a mean wake. Then you can whine to your boy
> Phil Boyer.
>

Do you advocate rudeness for all boaters? Why do you feel your legal rights
are greater than the pilot's legal rights?

[STEVEN SIMPSON]

What a great bunch we have here.
"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> That is absurd. Every day there are stories about drunk drivers and/or
> boaters. Thing is, they get CAUGHT. That is the distinction.
>
> Now, I know that certain pilots have this superiority complex thing. I
> think it is mostly the $3500/21 day pilots, and not the pros.
>
> Remember this, if you land your plane on the lake, you follow OUR rules,
> and i can legally come within 200 feet of you at any speed I choose.
> When I see a rude pilot try to muscle his way onto the lake, I am going to
> exercise MY legal right to boat. And my 27PC with both screws turning
> around 4100 rpms can put out a mean wake. Then you can whine to your boy
> Phil Boyer.
>

[Bushleague]

Both:

Back in season full swing as the drunken yuppies take to the waters in
Cape Cod Bay and surrounding waters. ASCC dispatched four aircraft
to distressed boaters this week who were too messed up to realize that
they were out of fuel, or could not select a tank with fuel. License
boaters? Absatively.

Have a great one!
Bush


On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 15:53:39 -0500, "Gig 601XL Builder"
<wr.giacona@coxDOTnet> wrote:

>
>Does anyone know why boaters and kayakers are floating on this lake? There
>are a few of
>planes around, and it seems like a risky thing to do.
>
>When the boats are on the lake, do ALWAYS ignore Coast Guard regulations or
>are they just drunk?
>

[Peter R.]

Skylune wrote:

> When I see a rude pilot try to muscle his way onto the lake, I am going to
> exercise MY legal right to boat. And my 27PC with both screws turning
> around 4100 rpms can put out a mean wake. Then you can whine to your boy

Why the large chip on your shoulder, trollboy? Having trouble making
your monthly payment on that boat? Or is it the fact that you are
unable to use your dual screw Tupperware 45% of every year when the
great waterways of NH freeze over?

Oh, I know: You just returned from a long day of scraping Zebra
Mussels off the hull...


--
Peter

[Peter Duniho]

"Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
ink.net...
>
> "Skylune" > wrote in message
> lkaboutaviation.com...
>> [nothing interesting]
>
> [took the bait]

Frankly, you guys need to wise up to the fact that "Skylune" is the best
troll we've seen in awhile. He says stuff just stupid enough to get a
response, but not so clearly whacked out for the regulars here to killfile
him.

Look at all the traffic he's managed to generate with his idiotic posts.
Everyone's falling over themselves to correct him, when the best way to put
him in his place would be to just ignore him.

I look forward to when the rest of you have wised up. :) I admit, it took
me a few posts, but I've already figured it out. :p

Pete

[S Narayan]

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> As a certified control freak, I wouldn't fly in a light plane for any
> reason, especially considering how dangerous they are. I would fly in a
> double engine plane with a very well trained, professional pilot, of
> course, but that clearly rules you out....
>

Are you suggesting you have control over a "very well trained, professional
pilot" in a "double" engined plane or are you suggesting that they don't
crash? Perhaps you should read up on the Aspen crash a few years ago.

[Peter R.]

Steven wrote:

> Now ,I like that statement.Good one Gorge

NWPILOT, is that you? I thought you left the newsgroup?

--
Peter

[Matt Barrow]

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> As a certified control freak, I wouldn't fly in a light plane for any
> reason, especially considering how dangerous they are. I would fly in a
> double engine plane with a very well trained, professional pilot, of
> course, but that clearly rules you out....
>
Troll....PLONK!!

[George Patterson]

Peter R. wrote:
>
> Oh, I know: You just returned from a long day of scraping Zebra
> Mussels off the hull...

Naw .. he just got the bill from the marina getting it ready for summer and into
the water.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

[Paul Tomblin]

In a previous article, Bob Noel > said:
>In article utaviation.com>,
> "Skylune" > wrote:
>> That's a good one. You fly boys want control of the lakes too! Get Phil
>> Boyer on it immediately!
>>
>> Such attitudes beget groups like Stop the Noise, Plane Sense, etc.
>
>troll

You're only *now* realizing that? Everything this idiot has posted has
been a deliberate troll, and the only amusement I'm getting out of this
group these days is seeing how many people are falling over themselves
trying to respond to him.

--
Paul Tomblin > http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
"There is always a way."
-- Rick Grant (quoting RCAF pilot training)

[Mike Rapoport]

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> Do you think the pilot would be upset if I took my formula 27 pc, which
> weighs in at about 10,500 pounds and has twin 350s and created some nice
> wake action for him to make the touchdowns more exciting?
>
> I think I have right of way on the lake, but the FARs provide me no
> guidance.
>

You are responsible for your wake and you don't have right of way over much
of anything in a powerboat.

Mike
MU-2

[Mike Rapoport]

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> That is absurd. Every day there are stories about drunk drivers and/or
> boaters. Thing is, they get CAUGHT. That is the distinction.
>
> Now, I know that certain pilots have this superiority complex thing. I
> think it is mostly the $3500/21 day pilots, and not the pros.
>
> Remember this, if you land your plane on the lake, you follow OUR rules,
> and i can legally come within 200 feet of you at any speed I choose.
> When I see a rude pilot try to muscle his way onto the lake, I am going to
> exercise MY legal right to boat. And my 27PC with both screws turning
> around 4100 rpms can put out a mean wake. Then you can whine to your boy
> Phil Boyer.
>

Another white trash boater.

Mike
Lives on a lake.

[Rob]

Hear, hear!

-R

STEVEN SIMPSON wrote:
> Now ,I like that statement.Good one Gorge.
> "George Patterson" > wrote in message
> news:FiHre.5847$fa3.921@trndny01...
> > Skylune wrote:
> >>
> >> By the way, when a private pilot gets into his/her plane, who checks to
> >> see if he/she is drunk or otherwise intoxicated?
> >
> > The same guy who checks to see if you're sober before you get into your
> > car.
> >
> > George Patterson
> > Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
> > and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
> > Because she smells like a new truck.

[Rob]

i dont know what would make you think that butt i have a prety god idea

I did also think George made an eloquent statement, though. :)

-R


Peter R. wrote:
> Steven wrote:
>
> > Now ,I like that statement.Good one Gorge
>
> NWPILOT, is that you? I thought you left the newsgroup?
>
> --
> Peter

[Doug]

The FAA doesn't have jurisdiction over operations landing rights water.
There are some basic right of way rules in 91.115, but it is the same
as basic boating right of way rules.

The question of whether landing a Seaplane on a lake almost alway comes
down to this. What agency has juridiction over the boating on the lake?
Even though a Seaplane isn't really a boat, the agency that controls
the recreation on the lake is the one that would control the Seaplane
landing rules on the lake. Seaplanes are only subject to Coast Guard
rules if the Coast Guard has jurisdiction over the water way, which is
NOT always the case, it just depends..It can be the county, city, state
or some Federal agency, all depends on who manages the recreation on
the lake.

I usually recommend a pilot contemplating landing on a lake he isn't
sure about, call the agency that administers the boat ramp, checks for
life vests, etc. If you can't find out who that is, visit the local
marina or boat ramp and ask around.

As a Seaplane owner, I tend to think that Seaplanes are no worse than
power boats. They don't cause particuarly big wakes. And their
operations on the lake are fairly infrequent compared to boating
operations. The usual complaint is noise, which is a consideration.
Careful choice of take off and landing will usually limit noise to
reasonable levels.

So far as seeing a kayak goes, an object as large as a kayak is no
problem for a Seaplane to see. Contrary to what most people think,
Seaplanes don't need special "sea lanes" or landing zones on the lake.
They just pick a spot that is open and become like a boat once they
land. Technically Seaplanes usually aren't considered "water vessels"
which usually excempts them from any speed limitations on water
vessels. There is always some question whether a Seaplane can land on a
lake that doesn't expressly permit Seaplane usage, but doesn't have a
rule against it either. This one is best worked out on a case by case
basis, using common sense.

[[email protected]]

I've always wondered why folks will spend so much money to burn all
that fuel to run very large engines on a boat when the things are just
so darned slow and limited to movement in two dimensions. Maybe it's
so they can make a great deal of noise, erode shorelines with their
wake, leak gasoline and oil into the water and upset as many people as
possible who are simply out to have a nice day on a lake in their boats
and airplanes that have far smaller engines. .

Or are large engines on a boat an attempt to compensate for some sort
of physical shortcoming? It's one of those Freudian questions that
keep occurring when you hear loud boaters exercising their perceived
legal rights to create large wakes and offend as many people as humanly
possible.

It's sad that so many of those noisy, big engine boaters seem to have
day jobs at Burger King. Perhaps that accounts for their overt
hostility to other recreational users of lakes and generally whiny
natures.

A person just can't help but wonder and stay out of the way of nutballs
in big, loud boats that create big wakes while moving slowly.

[John Godwin]

wrote in
oups.com:

> I've always wondered why folks will spend so much money to burn
> all that fuel to run very large engines on a boat when the things
> are just so darned slow and limited to movement in two dimensions.
> Maybe it's so they can make a great deal of noise, erode
> shorelines with their wake, leak gasoline and oil into the water
> and upset as many people as possible who are simply out to have a
> nice day on a lake in their boats and airplanes that have far
> smaller engines. .

No, it's to make up for the small size of their genitals.

--

[Judah]

"Skylune" > wrote in
lkaboutaviation.com:

> Do you think the pilot would be upset if I took my formula 27 pc, which
> weighs in at about 10,500 pounds and has twin 350s and created some nice
> wake action for him to make the touchdowns more exciting?
>
> I think I have right of way on the lake, but the FARs provide me no
> guidance.


Will you be upset when his prop hits your formula 27pc at 1500 RPM?

[BTIZ]

Both have right of way on the lake.
BT

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> Do you think the pilot would be upset if I took my formula 27 pc, which
> weighs in at about 10,500 pounds and has twin 350s and created some nice
> wake action for him to make the touchdowns more exciting?
>
> I think I have right of way on the lake, but the FARs provide me no
> guidance.
>

[BTIZ]

you sure it was not your wake?

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> It hasn't become a major issue yet (despite the seaplane that flipped over
> on the lake a few weeks back -- i think the NTSB blamed it on a wake),

[BTIZ]

you obviously do not know George to make such a statement

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> As a certified control freak, I wouldn't fly in a light plane for any
> reason, especially considering how dangerous they are. I would fly in a
> double engine plane with a very well trained, professional pilot, of
> course, but that clearly rules you out....
>

[BTIZ]

Alton Bay, north end
BT

"gregg" > wrote in message
...
> Skylune wrote:
>
>> Does anyone know why planes are landing on this lake? There are alot of
>> boaters and kayakers around, and it seems like a risky thing to do.
>>
>> When the planes land on the lake, do Coast Guard regulations or the FAR's
>> apply?
>
>
> I had heard from a CFI that ther eis a fly in occasionally, and they meet
> up
> in some bay. He told me they also do that in Winter when the lake freezes
> over.
>
>
> --
> Saville
>
> Replicas of 15th-19th century nautical navigational instruments:
>
> http://home.comcast.net/~saville/backstaffhome.html
>
> Restoration of my 82 year old Herreshoff S-Boat sailboat:
>
> http://home.comcast.net/~saville/SBOATrestore.htm
>
> Steambending FAQ with photos:
>
> http://home.comcast.net/~saville/Steambend.htm
>

[Morgans]

> > Its hard enough to see these kayakers when you on the water (although my
> > trusty Furuno usually picks them up), so i don't see how a landing plane
> > can possibly see them.
> >
>
> Well, if that's the case, then it's in the best interest of the kayaker to
> move out of the way of the seaplane, right-of-way be damned.

Hell, the planes just run over them, if you are in one of them. You are the
one that wanted to see a plane crash, aren't you?

By the way, since you will not fly in light aircraft, (not you, Stephen) and
this group is about piloting, and you are interested in neither of these,
your welcome is wearing out. Why don't you get the frick out of here?
--
Jim in NC

[Morgans]

"Peter R." > wrote in message

> Steven wrote:
>
> > Now ,I like that statement.Good one Gorge
>
> NWPILOT, is that you? I thought you left the newsgroup?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
idiot-idiot-idiot-idiot-idiot-idiot-idiot-idiot-idiot-idiot-idiot-idiot
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--

That would explain a LOT. What a looser. Get a life.

[Morgans]

"Mike Rapoport" > wrote

> Another white trash boater.
>
> Mike
> Lives on a lake.

Second that. Don't get me started.

The other current blight is on the lakes today, is "personal water craft."

What it is it they say, about the size and speed of your power boat, being
inversely proportional to the size of your penis?
--
Jim in NC
Grew up on the Great Lakes, sailing.
Stinkpots are for sissies that can't handle a real boat.

[Steven P. McNicoll]

"Morgans" > wrote in message
...
>
> Hell, the planes just run over them, if you are in one of them. You are
> the
> one that wanted to see a plane crash, aren't you?
>

No.

[Mike Rapoport]

"Peter Duniho" > wrote in message
...
> "Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
> ink.net...
>>
>> "Skylune" > wrote in message
>> lkaboutaviation.com...
>>> [nothing interesting]
>>
>> [took the bait]
>
> Frankly, you guys need to wise up to the fact that "Skylune" is the best
> troll we've seen in awhile. He says stuff just stupid enough to get a
> response, but not so clearly whacked out for the regulars here to killfile
> him.
>
> Look at all the traffic he's managed to generate with his idiotic posts.
> Everyone's falling over themselves to correct him, when the best way to
> put him in his place would be to just ignore him.
>
> I look forward to when the rest of you have wised up. :) I admit, it
> took me a few posts, but I've already figured it out. :p
>
> Pete

Your right! The interesting thing is that I knew he was trolling and
responded anyway!

Mike
MU-2

[Skylune]

Why are most pilots old fat slobs that can't do real sports?

[Skylune]

At least I don't need to check the cowling for bird droppings like the
little flying go carters!

[Skylune]

Thanks for your serious response, unlike some of the Yo-yo's here.

A question: Can sea-planes land on any lake, or are there designated
lakes and areas on the lakes where they can land?

I used to boat in the ocean off of Long Island, and a cool sea-plane used
to take off from Mattituck and land in the Peconic. Once, he was pretty
close to an area that is known for shoaling, and I was wondering if he
knew that.

[Skylune]

Yeah, like you can fly your stupid Mooneys at 1000 feet over peoples homes.
What an idiot. Its amazing.

[Skylune]

We actually swim, kayak, fish, etc. What do you $100 hamburger fools do?
Pollute with your leaded gas and wreak general havoc all around the
airports.

[Skylune]

"Right of way be damned." That pretty much sums it up.

When you are in your little TPA, i hope you have the same attitude when
some 70 year old pilot just barges right in, or when some slow C-150 is
doing a super wide pattern and creates havoc.

[Skylune]

I was wondering the same thing about the guys who fly Mooneys. About their
"perceived" right to create a damned racket for 10 miles round....

[Skylune]

I agree that Boyer is a troll. We have that in common.

[Skylune]

Well i agree with that. Boaters should be licensed and annually certified.
We wouldn't want a circus like what goes on a Fitchburg Airport!

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
utaviation.com>,
"Skylune" > wrote:

> At least I don't need to check the cowling for bird droppings like the
> little flying go carters!


Yes, that is true -- all YOU have to do is look in the mirror.

--
Remove _'s from email address to talk to me.

[Skylune]

Yeah. Those damn PWCs are a real pain. They are to boating what GA is to
commercial aviation.

[Peter Duniho]

"Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
ink.net...
> Your right! The interesting thing is that I knew he was trolling and
> responded anyway!

Like I said, he's one of the best we've seen in awhile. :) But he's still
a troll.

[Skylune]

I guess I should be insulted. Sorry, though, you flying go-carters are
nothing but an annoyance.

[Skylune]

Have you heard the term "group-think?"

[your name]

> Yeah, like you can fly your stupid Mooneys at 1000 feet over peoples homes.
> What an idiot. Its amazing.
>
pohj0hy0

[Skylune]

Of course *wink wink* you all keep it at minimum 1000 feet at all times,
since the FAA is monitoring every move.....

[Darrel Toepfer]

Steven P. McNicoll wrote:

> By the way, it's Winnipesaukee, not Winnepausaukee.

Isn't that where the Blues Brothers played?

[John Gaquin]

"Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
>>
>
> Another white trash boater.


...... and Lake Winni is just about the white trash boater HQ of NE.

[Skylune]

Yeah, those stupid sea plane idiots and cigarette boat fools have ruined
it.

I'm going take my 27 PC back to the ocean where it belongs. That lake is
nuts. The state wants to put speed limits on the lake (45 mph). They
definitely should.

[John Gaquin]

"Skylune" > wrote in message

> Does anyone know why planes are landing on this lake?

Nice troll. Got everyone gabbing.

Since you've tossed out various comments about "right of way" and pilots and
airplanes, yet have managed to post nothing that indicates any knowledge on
your part, I'll give you a little something to chew on:

While approaching to land, the seaplane is a plane, and is subject to the
FARs and a myriad of other Federal statutes pertaining to aircraft, as are
you and all the other vessels nearby who may have an impact on the
operation. Recklessly interfering with aircraft operation may get you
points among your buds at your marina, but not with the USDoJ.

When the seaplane has landed, it is a boat, and is subject to the Navigation
Rules -- USCG Comdtinst M16672.2 -- as are all the other vessels on Winni,
including yours. Don't waste you time browsing the book [you may find it
gets complicated], just go directly to Rule 2. It covers all the manly bs
pumpers who think they know what they can get away with, and why.

[Jessica Taylor]

Skylune wrote:

> That is absurd. Every day there are stories about drunk drivers and/or
> boaters. Thing is, they get CAUGHT. That is the distinction.

Many of drunk drivers who are caught have been caught before and before. And
that's just the times that they were caught.

Aviation has its own method of weeding out the stupid very quickly.

[Judah]

"Skylune" > wrote in
lkaboutaviation.com:

> Of course *wink wink* you all keep it at minimum 1000 feet at all times,
> since the FAA is monitoring every move.....

Actually, you don't have to keep it at minumum 1000 feet at all times.

But I would be willing to bet that there are many more drivers who drive
faster than the speed limit than there are pilots who fly below minimum
safe altitudes.

If you live anywhere near the Mass Pike, where even the cops confuse the
Interstate signs for the Speed Limit signs, you would realize your double
standard and grow up.

[Judah]

"Skylune" > wrote in
lkaboutaviation.com:

> I was wondering the same thing about the guys who fly Mooneys. About
> their "perceived" right to create a damned racket for 10 miles
> round....

Are you one of those guys that calls the cops to complain about the noise
that the guy next door makes when he mows his lawn or blows his leaves, and
then complains two weeks later that his yard is overgrown because he hasn't
cut it since you called the cops on him?

[Jessica Taylor]

Skylune wrote:

>
> But I get your point; drunken boaters are a hazard.

They sure are. And pilots, commercial or not, do not have to deal with such
boaters, for example http://tinyurl.com/cku33


(nice shorts, Ted)

[Doug]

There are three cases:
1. Seaplane landing expressly forbidden
2. Seaplane landing permitted (sometimes with restrictions)
3. Seaplane landing neither forbidden nor permitted, in which case
Common Law prevails (what is commonly done). If it is commonly done,
then it is ok. You don't need a law that says you can walk on a
sidewalk, people commonly walk there, you don't need a law, you have a
right by common law.

Each lake has it's own set of rules. All depends on the agency that
manages the lake, the neighbors, the laws of the state etc.

[Cub Driver]

Assuming you mean Winnipesaukee in New Hampshire, there is a seaplane
base at Alton Bay.

Not only is it a seaplane base, but it is an FAA-approved ice runway
in the winter, the only such dual-use 'port in the United States.




On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 15:40:18 -0400, "Skylune" >
wrote:

>Does anyone know why planes are landing on this lake? There are alot of
>boaters and kayakers around, and it seems like a risky thing to do.
>
>When the planes land on the lake, do Coast Guard regulations or the FAR's
>apply?


-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
the blog: www.danford.net
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

[Cub Driver]

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 13:18:33 -0700, "Bob Gardner" >
wrote:

>It's only when a floatplane is taxiing on the water that the
>maritime rules make sense.

Much as is the case with airships, gliders, and powered aircraft, the
maritime rules of the road provide that the least maneuverable ship
has the right of way. From what I have seen of floatplanes, that would
be the floatplane!


-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
the blog: www.danford.net
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

[Mike Rapoport]

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> Why are most pilots old fat slobs that can't do real sports?
>
Like powerboating?

[George Patterson]

BTIZ wrote:
> you obviously do not know George .....

and I intend to keep it that way. :-)

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

[Skylune]

Thank you for a serious response. Some of the obnoxious replys I received
got me aggravated.

[Skylune]

"White Trash Boater" Thats funny. Are you in this picture?

http://www.worcesterapa.org/gallery/2003-02-06-WAPA-Meeting/tn/DSC00044.JPG.index.shtml

[Skylune]

No, knucklehead. Never have, never will. I do complain about rude boaters
(cigarette boaters generally, and pilots though -- usually the idiots who
rent the Mooney's and wreak havoc).

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
utaviation.com>,
"Skylune" > wrote:

> Thank you for a serious response. Some of the obnoxious replys I received
> got me aggravated.

As if some of YOUR posts haven't been obnoxious.

--
Remove _'s from email address to talk to me.

[John Larson]

One could ask the same question of the boaters.
Why are you spoiling this great seaplane landing area.

The fact is, the lake belongs to all, even the obnoxious drunk speed
boaters. I fear them more than any seaplane.

(Skylune, why is it all of your posts seem like trolls?)



"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> Does anyone know why planes are landing on this lake? There are alot of
> boaters and kayakers around, and it seems like a risky thing to do.
>
> When the planes land on the lake, do Coast Guard regulations or the FAR's
> apply?
>

[John Larson]

Did Skylune actually say he was a certified "freak?"

I would agree, Skylune. That you are, and troll to boot.


"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> As a certified control freak, I wouldn't fly in a light plane for any
> reason, especially considering how dangerous they are. I would fly in a
> double engine plane with a very well trained, professional pilot, of
> course, but that clearly rules you out....
>

[John Larson]

I think I found this dolt on the Internet. Go to

www.skylune_is_a_troll.com

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
>I guess I should be insulted. Sorry, though, you flying go-carters are
> nothing but an annoyance.
>

[John Larson]

Or, the same guy who checks Skylune's med's every evening at the asylum.


"George Patterson" > wrote in message
news:FiHre.5847$fa3.921@trndny01...
> Skylune wrote:
>>
>> By the way, when a private pilot gets into his/her plane, who checks to
>> see if he/she is drunk or otherwise intoxicated?
>
> The same guy who checks to see if you're sober before you get into your
> car.
>
> George Patterson
> Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
> and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
> Because she smells like a new truck.

[Steven P. McNicoll]

"John Larson" <None ...> wrote in message
...
>
> (Skylune, why is it all of your posts seem like trolls?)
>

It's because he's a troll.

[John Larson]

This guy posts as ditkopf on the IPilot site, seems to have a modicum of
pilot knowledge and loves to troll there too.

I read a post that indicated he was dumped out of the Emery program and has
developed a hate relationship against small aircraft.


"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> No, knucklehead. Never have, never will. I do complain about rude
> boaters
> (cigarette boaters generally, and pilots though -- usually the idiots who
> rent the Mooney's and wreak havoc).
>

[Steven P. McNicoll]

"John Larson" <None ...> wrote in message
...
>
> This guy posts as ditkopf on the IPilot site, seems to have a modicum of
> pilot knowledge and loves to troll there too.
>
> I read a post that indicated he was dumped out of the Emery program and
> has developed a hate relationship against small aircraft.
>

He seems determined to give boaters a bad name as well.

[Peter Duniho]

"John Larson" <None ...> wrote in message
...
>I think I found this dolt on the Internet. Go to
>
> www.skylune_is_a_troll.com

Why would I do that? It would just be more time wasted for him. Life's too
short.

Hell...the time I spent to reply to your post is iffy in terms of being
worthwhile. :)

[Skylune]

You read that, eh? I guess it must be true if a GA "pilot" said it.
Funny, but I have never even heard of the "Emery program." Is that one of
those be a pilot in a month schools?

What I am, if you want to pigeon hole me, is an anti aviation activist. I
am in favor of much stricter rules governing GA. I flew about 15 hours out
of FRG, and realized that this is definitely not for weekend warriors that
occassionally take to the skies.

Some of you guys sure aren't the brightest bulbs in the pack. That's y I
would only fly with professional, commercial pilots.

[John Gaquin]

"Skylune" > wrote in message
>
> Some of you guys sure aren't the brightest bulbs in the pack. That's y I
> would only fly with professional, commercial pilots.

LOL

[George Patterson]

Peter Duniho wrote:
>
> Hell...the time I spent to reply to your post is iffy in terms of being
> worthwhile. :)

If you had fun, that helps make a waste of time worthwhile.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

[George Patterson]

John Larson wrote:
>
> (Skylune, why is it all of your posts seem like trolls?)

'Cause he hates us. He says he got about 15 hours training, got scared, and has
decided to lobby for rules getting us "amateurs" out of the skies.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

[Jose]

> That's y I
> would only fly with professional, commercial pilots.

Why would you fly with a commercial pilot?? I get too many commercials
already, what with web pop-ups, spam, TV and radio ads, and most of the
newspaper is taken up with ink touting the latest gizmos or skin
treatments. Even taxicabs are experimenting with ads in the passenger
section.

Sheesh, and now you want to fly with ads in the cockpit??

"Good evening, this is Captain Clarence Over, we'll be flying at an
altitude of thirty eight thousand feet, weather at our destination is
light rain and seventy three degrees. There's a sale on underware at
Macy's in the mall right next to the airport, six ninety nine for two
pair if you use your Macy's charge card. So just sit back, enjoy a nice
cold CocaCola as we whisk you to your destination. Please turn off all
electronic devices, including iPods, for takeoff. iPod is the official
music player of SellemAll Airlines, purchase a stylish iPod today!
Flight attendants have a limited stock on hand, so hurry!

This message sponsored by MegaMessages, your advertising source for all
altitudes! To advertise with MegaMessages, simply call 900-992-7433.
We'll take it from there.

Jose
--
"Never trust anything that can think for itself, if you can't see where
it keeps its brain."
(chapter 10 of book 3 - Harry Potter).
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

[Skylune]

OK, enough of you fools. "Got scared.." LOL. What I said: it is not
possible to become proficient enough to handle all the situations you will
encounter in the air if you are one of those weekend pilots.

Weird how warped, and thin skinned some of you pilots are.

As far as the life insurance exclusion policy, several of you other
knucklehead posters denied this existed. Of course this too is totally
wrong. See below for example....

Listen, I could care less what you guys do for fun, as long as it doesn't
affect others. But it does. Some of us are sick of paying taxes for
runway improvements at GA airports, having small planes zoom over our
houses, the arrogant little jerk Phil Boyer, planes crashing into
buildings, roadways, etc., little 14 year olds taking planes for joy rides
because there IS NO SECURITY, etc.




Report in fatal plane crash released


By Kurt Johnson


The National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) has issued its preliminary
report on the May 28 plane crash that killed Taylor resident Clayton
Young.



The report is available on the NTSB's Web site, www.ntsb.gov, in the
aviation accident database.



The preliminary report lists only the most basic facts of the case and is
subject to change. Craig Hatch, the NTSB air safety investigator
investigating the accident, said he would file a more thorough "factual
report" within six months of the accident and that a "probable cause"
report would be made available to the public within three months of the
factual report.



The preliminary report lists the weather conditions of the day of the
crash, the details of the plane and some witness statements.



"Several witnesses reported that the airplane appeared 'normal' and
started to climb just prior to impact with powerlines ...," according to
the report. "The witnesses observed the airplane for approximately a
quarter mile, 'with pieces falling off,' until the airplane subsequently
collided with rising terrain. The majority of airplane was consumed by a
post-crash fire."



Young's life insurance policy did not cover accidents occurring in planes
he piloted, according to his family.



He left behind a wife, Emmi, and five children.



According to a friend of the family, Young's death came before he was able
to send out his bills and invoices for the plumbing work he had done in
May. Those who wish to pay outstanding bills are asked to contact Emmi at
(512) 352-3548.



A memorial fund for Young has been established at City National Bank.

[Montblack]

("Skylune" wrote)
[snip]
> ...little 14 year olds taking planes for joy rides because there IS NO
> SECURITY, etc.


Cars have security - kids break into them without a problem. Even without
keys, they then manage to override that (secondary) steering wheel security
layer. How could this happen? I thought cars were (double) locked - and thus
secure?

People are constantly being killed and (severely) injured by car thieves
blowing through intersections, crossing medians, going the wrong way down
streets, plowing into stopped traffic, plowing into pedestrians, etc.

Want to ramp up SECURITY to address this little FACT rather than chasing
scary shadows?


Montblack

[S Narayan]

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> OK, enough of you fools. "Got scared.." LOL. What I said: it is not
> possible to become proficient enough to handle all the situations you will
> encounter in the air if you are one of those weekend pilots.

What situations? How the hell would you know anything about proficiency? You
ran.
15hrs. Sounds like you got scared after your first solo.
>
> Weird how warped, and thin skinned some of you pilots are.

It would not be the case if you came in to a aviation group with a better
attitude.

>
> As far as the life insurance exclusion policy, several of you other
> knucklehead posters denied this existed. Of course this too is totally
> wrong. See below for example....

I can see that happening with fresh pilots who haven't quite figured all the
ramifications of their hobby.

>
> Listen, I could care less what you guys do for fun, as long as it doesn't
> affect others. But it does. Some of us are sick of paying taxes for
> runway improvements at GA airports, having small planes zoom over our
> houses, the arrogant little jerk Phil Boyer, planes crashing into
> buildings, roadways, etc., little 14 year olds taking planes for joy rides
> because there IS NO SECURITY, etc.
>

You are frothing here. Please try to be coherent.

I am sick of those noisy weed-whackers or lawn mowers every weekend. Maybe
you could start a crusade against those as well. Hey, if you live near an
airport, deal with it, if not, move! In most places the airport was there
and the houses encroached onto its "influence area". Last time planes
crashed into buildings and killed people it was commercial jets. I bet you
would have loved to be on of those planes (you know with the "professional,
commercial pilots")

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
utaviation.com>,
"Skylune" > wrote:

> You read that, eh? I guess it must be true if a GA "pilot" said it.
> Funny, but I have never even heard of the "Emery program." Is that one of
> those be a pilot in a month schools?
>
> What I am, if you want to pigeon hole me, is an anti aviation activist. I
> am in favor of much stricter rules governing GA. I flew about 15 hours out
> of FRG, and realized that this is definitely not for weekend warriors that
> occassionally take to the skies.


What "Skylune" is, is a jerk! Fe can't do it, so he wants to make it
impossible for those of us who CAN. He makes ignorant pronouncements as
if they are gospel and breathes hate.

I am glad that I do not have to share the sky with "Skylune."

> Some of you guys sure aren't the brightest bulbs in the pack. That's y I
> would only fly with professional, commercial pilots.

If they knew they had him aboard, they would boot him off.

--
Remove _'s from email address to talk to me.

[RomeoMike]

Skylune wrote:
> OK, enough of you fools. "Got scared.." LOL. What I said: it is not
> possible to become proficient enough to handle all the situations you will
> encounter in the air if you are one of those weekend pilots.

Yes, you got scared because you were not smart enough to learn how to
handle the situations you allude to. Then loss of self esteem >> got big
boat to inflate ego >> needs to punish GA by being an "activist" and
trolling a newsgroup. I'm ashamed I jumped into this and so should
everyone else.

[Jose]

> What I said: it is not
> possible to become proficient enough to handle all the situations you will
> encounter in the air if you are one of those weekend pilots.

You are completely right. However, if you are one of =these= weekend
pilots, you can easily become proficient enough.

Jose
--
"Never trust anything that can think for itself, if you can't see where
it keeps its brain."
(chapter 10 of book 3 - Harry Potter).
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

[George Patterson]

Skylune wrote:
> OK, enough of you fools. "Got scared.." LOL. What I said: it is not
> possible to become proficient enough to handle all the situations you will
> encounter in the air if you are one of those weekend pilots.

In other words, YOU couldn't hack it, so you've decided that nobody else can either.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

[Morgans]

"Steven P. McNicoll" > wrote
>
> No.

I know you aren't the one wanting to see a crash. I put in there, a (not
you Stephen), because the only way I see this other poster, is when someone
(you) replies to his post. He is a loon of loons.
--
Jim in NC

[Judah]

"Skylune" > wrote in
lkaboutaviation.com:

> What I am, if you want to pigeon hole me, is an anti aviation
> activist. I am in favor of much stricter rules governing GA. I flew
> about 15 hours out of FRG, and realized that this is definitely not
> for weekend warriors that occassionally take to the skies.

Exactly how many hours of driving did you have before you decided what
level of experience and consistency would be required to ensure proficiency
in that task?

At 15 hours of flying, you barely scraped the surface.

I find it interesting how you can make such a judgement when you have such
a limited exposure and lack of experience. What exactly is your anti-
aviation goal? What types of rules would you like to see governing GA? What
problem are you trying to solve? And what direct benefit will you see from
it?

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article >,
Judah > wrote:

> "Skylune" > wrote in
> lkaboutaviation.com:
>
> > What I am, if you want to pigeon hole me, is an anti aviation
> > activist. I am in favor of much stricter rules governing GA. I flew
> > about 15 hours out of FRG, and realized that this is definitely not
> > for weekend warriors that occassionally take to the skies.
>
> Exactly how many hours of driving did you have before you decided what
> level of experience and consistency would be required to ensure proficiency
> in that task?
>
> At 15 hours of flying, you barely scraped the surface.
>
> I find it interesting how you can make such a judgement when you have such
> a limited exposure and lack of experience. What exactly is your anti-
> aviation goal? What types of rules would you like to see governing GA? What
> problem are you trying to solve? And what direct benefit will you see from
> it?


I have encountered "Skylune's" type before. They are usually washouts
who have adopted a contemptuous, arrogant attitude toward those of us
who persevered and learned.

I doubt that "Skylune" even got to solo, because he just couldn't put it
all together. As a result, he believes that, since a "smart, fast
learner" like himself couldn't get it, the others who have persevered
and succeeded MUST have inferior abilities and therefore should not be
allowed into the hallowed skies.

--
Remove _'s from email address to talk to me.

[mike regish]

Sure glad *you're* not still flying.

mike regish

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> You read that, eh? I guess it must be true if a GA "pilot" said it.
> Funny, but I have never even heard of the "Emery program." Is that one of
> those be a pilot in a month schools?
>
> What I am, if you want to pigeon hole me, is an anti aviation activist. I
> am in favor of much stricter rules governing GA. I flew about 15 hours
> out
> of FRG, and realized that this is definitely not for weekend warriors that
> occassionally take to the skies.
>
> Some of you guys sure aren't the brightest bulbs in the pack. That's y I
> would only fly with professional, commercial pilots.
>

[mike regish]

"Skylune" > wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
> OK, enough of you fools. "Got scared.." LOL. What I said: it is not
> possible to become proficient enough to handle all the situations you will
> encounter in the air if you are one of those weekend pilots.

Maybe not you, but the rest of us do just fine.
>
> Weird how warped, and thin skinned some of you pilots are.

Weird how ignorant some people are when comparing their own abilities to
those of others.
>
> As far as the life insurance exclusion policy, several of you other
> knucklehead posters denied this existed. Of course this too is totally
> wrong. See below for example....

My life insurance covers me...even in the plane.
>
> Listen, I could care less what you guys do for fun, as long as it doesn't
> affect others. But it does. Some of us are sick of paying taxes for
> runway improvements at GA airports, having small planes zoom over our
> houses, the arrogant little jerk Phil Boyer, planes crashing into
> buildings, roadways, etc., little 14 year olds taking planes for joy rides
> because there IS NO SECURITY, etc.

Yeah. I also think boats and RV's (the BIG gas guzzlers-not the winged kind)
should be banned too. And then there are ATV's, motorcycles, yada, yada,
yada.

mike regish

[Bob Noel]

In article >,
"mike regish" > wrote:

> Yeah. I also think boats and RV's (the BIG gas guzzlers-not the winged kind)
> should be banned too. And then there are ATV's, motorcycles, yada, yada,

hey - what's the problem with motorcycles?

--
Bob Noel
no one likes an educated mule

[mike regish]

Well, I have a Harley. I'm sure that's nuttin' but noise to this guy.

mike regish

"Bob Noel" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> "mike regish" > wrote:
>
>> Yeah. I also think boats and RV's (the BIG gas guzzlers-not the winged
>> kind)
>> should be banned too. And then there are ATV's, motorcycles, yada, yada,
>
> hey - what's the problem with motorcycles?
>
> --
> Bob Noel
> no one likes an educated mule
>

[Skylune]

Plane Takes Off Without Pilot

POSTED: 5:22 pm EDT June 20, 2005
UPDATED: 6:30 pm EDT June 20, 2005

BETHEL TOWNSHIP, Pa. -- A small plane crashed into a Lebanon County
neighborhood Monday afternoon.

Slideshow


Pictures


The small prop plane took off without its pilot and ended up in Bethel
Township, not too far from the Farmer's Pride Airport.

The 1940 J-3 airplane took off through a field, missed some trees, went
between two houses and ended up in the middle of the road.

Pilot Ron Snyder started the propeller by himself. That's a job that
usually requires two people. The plane did not get into the air, but it
did taxi across a field and then Airport Road, taking out a light pole and
damaging its wing.

Snyder is a retired commercial pilot.

"I just watched it and I tried to get in there and get the throttle back.
Of course, I couldn't. I just watched it take off. I just tried to make
sure there wasn't anybody over there -- not that I could do anything about
it, but there wasn't anybody there and I thought it was going to hit those
trees, but it got right in between the trees and cart-wheeled," Snyder
said.

No one was hurt. The light pole, a stop sign and the plane were the only
property damaged. The plane might be a loss. Snyder said the plane was
worth about $30,000.

A representative from the Federal Aviation Administration is on the scene
and will do a full investigation.

[Matt Barrow]

"mike regish" > wrote in message
...
> Well, I have a Harley. I'm sure that's nuttin' but noise to this guy.
>
To a lot of other people, too.

If you can find it, read Dave Barry's piece on Harley riders. :~)

[[email protected]]

Skylune wrote:
> Plane Takes Off Without Pilot
>
>
>
> The small prop plane took off without its pilot and ended up in Bethel
> Township, not too far from the Farmer's Pride Airport.
>
> The 1940 J-3 airplane took off through a field, missed some trees, went
> between two houses and ended up in the middle of the road.
>
>
> "I just watched it and I tried to get in there and get the throttle back.
> Of course, I couldn't. I just watched it take off. I just tried to make
> sure there wasn't anybody over there -- not that I could do anything about
> it, but there wasn't anybody there and I thought it was going to hit those
> trees, but it got right in between the trees and cart-wheeled," Snyder
> said.
>
> No one was hurt. The light pole, a stop sign and the plane were the only
> property damaged. The plane might be a loss. Snyder said the plane was
> worth about $30,000.
>
> A representative from the Federal Aviation Administration is on the scene
> and will do a full investigation.

This is what us neophytes call the crash zone.

JG