Another Cambridge 302 logger bug

[[email protected]]

Sorry if this is already well known, but it had me stumped for a week
or so and I may have lost one flight log. I've looked around and I
believe this is different than noted in this newsgroup previously,
since this occurs with the latest Cambridge 302 firmware (2.6.3).

Apparently there is a bug in all Cambridge 302 units (maybe also 302A
units, I don't know) that can stop log file being downloaded once the
logger memory gets full of flights, there is a workaround to clear all
of the logger memory (losing any undownloaded flights). My frustration
with Cambridge is that they admitted to having known about this problem
"for quite a while" but apparently don't consider their
customer's important enough to let everybody know about the
workaround before this problem bites them. (boy you can tell I'm grumpy
and have not had my caffine this morning...)

I've been having problems downloading log files from my 302. The iPAQ
PDA running the latest Cambridge download utility reports "Cannot get
FAT" (or was that "Cannot allocate FAT"?) in a dialogue box, when
you dismiss the dialogue box the flight log list is blank. It's been
possible to mess around resetting the PDA and power cycling the
Cambridge in the past to get it to download log files, but the last two
flights I cannot download at all. In my case Cambridge supplied a
terminal emulator utility for the iPAQ so I could go into the 302
command line mode and do a "clear log" command.

Cambrige have a software guy working on this but no expectation of when
they will have fix. You can reach Cambridge through the support form on
their website www.cambridge-aero.com or telephone them, both Gary
Kammerer in support and Arthur Chapman are well aware of this problem.
I will credit Cambridge that they do respond fast when you contact
them.


Darryl Ramm
DG-303 Acro 6DX

[Marc Ramsey]

wrote:
> Apparently there is a bug in all Cambridge 302 units (maybe also 302A
> units, I don't know) that can stop log file being downloaded once the
> logger memory gets full of flights, there is a workaround to clear all
> of the logger memory (losing any undownloaded flights). My frustration
> with Cambridge is that they admitted to having known about this problem
> "for quite a while" but apparently don't consider their
> customer's important enough to let everybody know about the
> workaround before this problem bites them. (boy you can tell I'm grumpy
> and have not had my caffine this morning...)

It's apparently not that simple, as it hasn't happened to our 302 in the
3 or 4 years we've had it, despite the fact that we never issue a "clear
log" command. The memory fills, and the older flights simply disappear
from the list as time goes on...

Marc

[[email protected]]

Well damn, I wish I'd had that coffee before shooting my mouth off.
I was not out to shoot Cambridge, but that is how the post reads. I
love the Cambridge 302, this is a really nice unit. I replaced another
brand expensive European flight computer earlier this year with this
unit and would do so again in a heartbeat. I really like the netto
vario, simple operation of the logger, the great integration with
WinPilot Pro, and this unit has been rock solid (Including in a
unbelievably hot cockpit with ground temperatures well over 100F where
both of my iPAQ PDAs wedged themselves and refuse to reset and the
Cambridge 302 works just fine - and because of this I'm in the
process of installing a 303 nav display to back up the PDA.).

Yes Marc you are correct, I talked more with Cambridge staff today and
I need to correct my claim that this is a problem with all units. This
problem may occur if you start to fill the memory in the 302,
apparently only some 302s. In my case I've flown around 6,000 km with
my 302 since installing it earlier this year, that's a lot of hours
and I'm running with the default 4 second sample rate, a lot of
samples. Apparently if there is a problem the symptoms start with
seeing intermittent "Cannot ... FAT" errors on the utility software
when trying to connect to the 302 to download log files. Indeed I'd
been seeing this for a few weeks intermittently and had always blamed
my iPAQ PDA's. This problem can continue and become more frequent as
it did in my case. Anyhow the workaround of clearing memory in the 302
is easy, and can be done when intermittent FAT errors occur (meaning
you should be able to download any log files before clearing memory).
And Cambridge is working on a permanent fix.

Darryl Ramm
DG-303 Acro 6DX

[David Walsh]

Darryl,

2.63 is the latest firmware. FAT = File Allocation Table. I seem to
remember this being discussed in the news group 2 or 3 years ago.

As I remember 302's don't use FAT for file management, but Microsoft
products do. I am guessing your iPAQ or storage card is out of memory.

302's have a ton of memory, enough to store a year or more worth of
flights before it starts over writing old files. I have not lost a
file yet, even after updating the firmware

Just guessing your iPAQ is out of memory or you need to put a new copy
of the utility down on your iPAQ. I bet Paul Remde ( Cambridge Rep )
can help you solve your problem.

Sincerely,
David Walsh

wrote:
> Sorry if this is already well known, but it had me stumped for a week
> or so and I may have lost one flight log. I've looked around and I
> believe this is different than noted in this newsgroup previously,
> since this occurs with the latest Cambridge 302 firmware (2.6.3).
>
> Apparently there is a bug in all Cambridge 302 units (maybe also 302A
> units, I don't know) that can stop log file being downloaded once the
> logger memory gets full of flights, there is a workaround to clear all
> of the logger memory (losing any undownloaded flights). My frustration
> with Cambridge is that they admitted to having known about this problem
> "for quite a while" but apparently don't consider their
> customer's important enough to let everybody know about the
> workaround before this problem bites them. (boy you can tell I'm grumpy
> and have not had my caffine this morning...)
>
> I've been having problems downloading log files from my 302. The iPAQ
> PDA running the latest Cambridge download utility reports "Cannot get
> FAT" (or was that "Cannot allocate FAT"?) in a dialogue box, when
> you dismiss the dialogue box the flight log list is blank. It's been
> possible to mess around resetting the PDA and power cycling the
> Cambridge in the past to get it to download log files, but the last two
> flights I cannot download at all. In my case Cambridge supplied a
> terminal emulator utility for the iPAQ so I could go into the 302
> command line mode and do a "clear log" command.
>
> Cambrige have a software guy working on this but no expectation of when
> they will have fix. You can reach Cambridge through the support form on
> their website www.cambridge-aero.com or telephone them, both Gary
> Kammerer in support and Arthur Chapman are well aware of this problem.
> I will credit Cambridge that they do respond fast when you contact
> them.
>
>
> Darryl Ramm
> DG-303 Acro 6DX
>

[Brian Iten]

I received a FAT error this past Saturday and it took
me three attempts to download my flight file. Guess
I need to clear out the memory. Can this be done with
the utility program?
Brian Iten
MB1

[[email protected]]

David

Thanks for your suggestions. My understanding rom talkign to Cambridge
is what I'm describing is not related to space on the PDA. I have a two
large PDAs (iPAQ hx4700) with almost 1GB free on the SD cards, most of
the iPAQ flash store and most of RAM free and the problem occurs with
both PDAs.

How much the 302 stores before wrapping depends on the sample rate and
how many hours you fly. In my case I'm very lucky to be flying enough
that the Cambridge (or any other logger) won't store "a years worth of
flights" before wrapping (and even if it does wrap the problem I am
describing does not affect all 302s).

Thanks


Darryl Ramm

[[email protected]]

Hi Brian

Although as another poster pointed out there have been other causes of
FAT errors in the past (lack of space on your PDA), however I suspect
you saw the same intermittent failures I did, especially if they just
cleared themselves up without you having to make more space on your
PDA. So while I definitely do not speak for Cambridge support I'd
suggest you do clear the log memory.

The workaround is to type the "clear log" command at the 302 command
prompt, and to do this again if you suspect you are getting close to
filling the log memory space - that should be a while. There is no way
to do this from within the standard Cambridge utility software (a good
idea given you don't want to do this accidently). To do this you need a
terminal emulator hooked up to the 302 serial port and literally type
"clear log" at the "cmd>" prompt. Cambridge can supply you with a
terminal emulation utility for an iPAQ/Windows Mobile PDA. I would
expect other terminal emultors, including things like hyperterm on a
Windows PC should work fine. If you have problems I'm sure Gary at
Cambridge support can help or post back here.

Cheers


Darryl Ramm

[fw.unt]

Hi Darryl

I agree, the C302 is a superbe instrument.
We have two C302 with 2.63 and one with 2.52 and not yet seen this
problem. But thanks for the hint with the terminal programm. I have a
demo program called zterm for the IPAQ. Very handy software - it
sleeps for 15 seconds sometimes, because of the demo.
One problem I see with log files is, that it takes a long time to
download them to the IPAQ. We also have filser LX instruments and it
takes much less time. Do you have the same experience?

Thanks FW.


wrote in message . com>...
> Sorry if this is already well known, but it had me stumped for a week
> or so and I may have lost one flight log. I've looked around and I
> believe this is different than noted in this newsgroup previously,
> since this occurs with the latest Cambridge 302 firmware (2.6.3).
>
> Apparently there is a bug in all Cambridge 302 units (maybe also 302A
> units, I don't know) that can stop log file being downloaded once the
> logger memory gets full of flights, there is a workaround to clear all
> of the logger memory (losing any undownloaded flights). My frustration
> with Cambridge is that they admitted to having known about this problem
> "for quite a while" but apparently don't consider their
> customer's important enough to let everybody know about the
> workaround before this problem bites them. (boy you can tell I'm grumpy
> and have not had my caffine this morning...)
>
> I've been having problems downloading log files from my 302. The iPAQ
> PDA running the latest Cambridge download utility reports "Cannot get
> FAT" (or was that "Cannot allocate FAT"?) in a dialogue box, when
> you dismiss the dialogue box the flight log list is blank. It's been
> possible to mess around resetting the PDA and power cycling the
> Cambridge in the past to get it to download log files, but the last two
> flights I cannot download at all. In my case Cambridge supplied a
> terminal emulator utility for the iPAQ so I could go into the 302
> command line mode and do a "clear log" command.
>
> Cambrige have a software guy working on this but no expectation of when
> they will have fix. You can reach Cambridge through the support form on
> their website www.cambridge-aero.com or telephone them, both Gary
> Kammerer in support and Arthur Chapman are well aware of this problem.
> I will credit Cambridge that they do respond fast when you contact
> them.
>
>
> Darryl Ramm
> DG-303 Acro 6DX

[[email protected]]

I'm pretty sure the Cambridge is running at 4800 baud. I think Filsner
products default to 19.2k Baud. You are probably just seeing the Baud
rate difference. I'm not sure what flow control the Cambridge uses when
downloading files and I'm not sure if it is possible or safe to
increase the baud rate. I know there is a command to set the baud rate
on the 302 via the serial port but I'm not sure how to do it on the PDA
end with the 3UTIQ... utility. I think some of the other log download
tools have easy ways to set baud rates. You would also need to change
the baud rate on whatever flight computer software you are using
(Winpilot in my case). Personally I don't find it a problem and
probably don't want to mess with it, I start the log download after
landing and it finishes long before I am ready to pull my PDA out the
cockpit.

Darryl