Intercom Question

[[email protected]]

We just joined a flying club with a 1976 Piper Warrior. The airplane has a
two-place intercom. I own four headsets and plan to occasionally take
friends up in the back seats. Is there such a thing as an adapter I could
plug into one of the existing headset jacks that I could then plug three
headsets into?
Scott Wilson

[RST Engineering]

It would help if you would post the make and model of intercom.

Jim



> wrote in message ...
> We just joined a flying club with a 1976 Piper Warrior. The airplane has
> a
> two-place intercom. I own four headsets and plan to occasionally take
> friends up in the back seats. Is there such a thing as an adapter I could
> plug into one of the existing headset jacks that I could then plug three
> headsets into?
> Scott Wilson

[[email protected]]

Dang, I posted my request just before going out to fly the plane and I just
got back to see your reply. I'll go by there and get the make/model as
soon as I can, maybe tomorrow.
Scott Wilson

[Thomas Borchert]

> The airplane has a
> two-place intercom.
>

Are you sure? Mostly, these are four-place-units with the backseats
simply not wired. Try and get them to do that. And yes, the make and
model would help.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Jim Burns]

We've got a 4 place intercom in our Aztec. When we carry 6 people, we use Y
adapter/splitter cords on the center seats to supply intercom to the rear
seats.
Jim Burns


> wrote in message ...
> We just joined a flying club with a 1976 Piper Warrior. The airplane has
a
> two-place intercom. I own four headsets and plan to occasionally take
> friends up in the back seats. Is there such a thing as an adapter I could
> plug into one of the existing headset jacks that I could then plug three
> headsets into?
> Scott Wilson

[[email protected]]

On 6-Aug-2005, "RST Engineering" > wrote:

> It would help if you would post the make and model of intercom.
>
> Jim

That would be a Sigtronics SPA-400 STO, mounted in a 1976 PA28-161 Warrior.
The instructor that checked me out in the airplane had a nifty adapter he
said he picked up at Radio Shack that allowed my wife riding in back to plug
in the headphone portion of her headset in a "Y" adapter and so share his
intercom audio jack. It didn't have anything for the microphone plug
though, so she couldn't talk to us, she could just listen in on our
conversation. That very nearly became a problem as she got queasy while I
was flying steep turns, stalls and slow flight and she couldn't tell us.
She made it without tossing her cookies until we landed, and on the
taxi-back to take off again (very short runway) she got my attention and let
me know she needed to get out of the plane, NOW!!!! This concerns me as I
have some friends who have never been in an airplane of any sort and want me
to give them a ride. I am worried if the one who will be riding in back
gets ill I won't know until too late.
Soctt Wilson

[RST Engineering]

Y adapters for the headphones are easy. Y adapters for the microphones are
well nigh impossible.

What does Sigtronics have to say about extending the intercom to the back
seats?

Jim




> wrote in message ...
>
> On 6-Aug-2005, "RST Engineering" > wrote:
>
>> It would help if you would post the make and model of intercom.
>>
>> Jim
>
> That would be a Sigtronics SPA-400 STO, mounted in a 1976 PA28-161
> Warrior.
> The instructor that checked me out in the airplane had a nifty adapter he
> said he picked up at Radio Shack that allowed my wife riding in back to
> plug
> in the headphone portion of her headset in a "Y" adapter and so share his
> intercom audio jack. It didn't have anything for the microphone plug
> though, so she couldn't talk to us, she could just listen in on our
> conversation.

[Dave S]

wrote:
> On 6-Aug-2005, "RST Engineering" > wrote:
>
>
>>It would help if you would post the make and model of intercom.
>>
>>Jim
>
>
> That would be a Sigtronics SPA-400 STO, mounted in a 1976 PA28-161 Warrior.

http://www.sigtronics.com/air/spa.html

This intercom is likey a 4 place intercom. The additional two ports can
be added and signed off by a knowledgeable A&P as a minor alteration
with a logbook entry. A few dollars in parts and I cant see how it would
be more than a few hours in labor. The owner or his designee could even
do it if they have the skills, and have it signed off by their regular
mechanic.

The instructions and schematics are at:
http://www.sigtronics.com/air/pdf/spa-400.pdf


....so she couldn't talk to us, she could just listen in on our
> conversation. That very nearly became a problem as she got queasy while I
> was flying steep turns, stalls and slow flight and she couldn't tell us. ...
I am worried if the one who will be riding in back
> gets ill I won't know until too late.
> Soctt Wilson

Scott, I would be concerned that you took a non-pilot (ok, I am ASSUMING
the wife is a non-pilot) up on a flight where you were going to be doing
stalls, steep turns and slow flight. These can be quite uncomfortable
for a non-pilot, and they "feel" much different from the back seat
(different sight picture, different position relative to the "fulcrum
point" for the control surfaces).

I am just a low time guy with about 450 hrs or so, but the few times I
have been near airsickness have been in the BACK while someone up front
was doing maneuvers (or was a bad stick in general).


Whenever you take folks up, especially if its a rough day or poor
visibility day, check on them early and often for discomfort, and modify
the flight to the point of aborting if you have to. It sure beats
scrubbing puke out of carpets or washing it out of a flight bag.

Dave

[Wizard of Draws]

On 8/7/05 5:31 PM, in article
et, "Dave S"
> wrote:
>
> Whenever you take folks up, especially if its a rough day or poor
> visibility day, check on them early and often for discomfort, and modify
> the flight to the point of aborting if you have to. It sure beats
> scrubbing puke out of carpets or washing it out of a flight bag.
>
> Dave
>

I have a plastic bag as a permanent item in my flight bag for use as an
airsickness bag. I never know when I'm gonna make myself or my passengers
sick from my lousy flying.
--
Jeff 'The Wizard of Draws' Bucchino

Cartoons with a Touch of Magic�
http://www.wizardofdraws.com

More Cartoons with a Touch of Magic�
http://www.cartoonclipart.com

[Morgans]

"RST Engineering" < wrote

> Y adapters for the headphones are easy. Y adapters for the microphones
are
> well nigh impossible.

How about a true Rube Goldberg solution?

Use the Y for the headsets, and make up two boxes (and wires to go from the
front to the back) that has a cord to plug into the intercom and a jack
receptacle and a momentary switch(with a normally open and normally closed)
in each one. Press the button, and you get to talk, and cut out the
possibility of the other mic being hot at the same instant. Make two; one
for each side.

I know, Jim; try not to cringe! (I can see you doing it, right now!) <g>
--
Jim in NC

[Jose]

> It didn't have anything for the microphone plug
> though, so she couldn't talk to us, she could just listen in on our
> conversation.

A regular microphone (the aviation kind) work in the microphone plugs of
an intercom (at least all the ones I've used), and the push-to-talk
allows the person to talk (on the intercom) but not transmit (test this
first on your setup!). The mike can be passed around in back.

Jose
--
Quantum Mechanics is like this: God =does= play dice with the universe,
except there's no God, and there's no dice. And maybe there's no universe.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

[Morgans]

"Jose" > wrote
>
> A regular microphone (the aviation kind) work in the microphone plugs of
> an intercom (at least all the ones I've used), and the push-to-talk
> allows the person to talk (on the intercom) but not transmit (test this
> first on your setup!). The mike can be passed around in back.

Yeah, but, but, but.....
My solution is more complicated! <g>

It does let people sit back and enjoy, with just pushing a button they all
hold in their hands.
--
Jim in NC

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN]

Wizard of Draws wrote:
> I have a plastic bag as a permanent item in my flight bag for use as an
> airsickness bag. I never know when I'm gonna make myself or my passengers
> sick from my lousy flying.


I keep my headsets in plastic ziplock bags. If somebody has to puke, it's use
one of the bags or use a parachute.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

[George Patterson]

wrote:
> We just joined a flying club with a 1976 Piper Warrior. The airplane has a
> two-place intercom. I own four headsets and plan to occasionally take
> friends up in the back seats. Is there such a thing as an adapter I could
> plug into one of the existing headset jacks that I could then plug three
> headsets into?

You can pick up a portable 4-place intercom. Plug that into the co-pilot's jacks
and plug the other three headsets into the passenger jacks of the intercom.
Features like "crew isolate" will be a handicap in the portable unit.

George Patterson
Give a person a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a person to
use the Internet and he won't bother you for weeks.

[Jim Burns]

The Y adapters we've got have both mic and headphones. I'm trying to find
where we got them. I know it was off the web, and I think the place was in
Arizona. They weren't cheap, but they do the trick. I'll keep digging.
Jim B

[Jim Burns]

http://www.pilotproduct.com/page2.htm

Has several options. Not what we have, but similar.
Jim B

"Jim Burns" > wrote in message
...
> The Y adapters we've got have both mic and headphones. I'm trying to find
> where we got them. I know it was off the web, and I think the place was
in
> Arizona. They weren't cheap, but they do the trick. I'll keep digging.
> Jim B
>
>

[Thomas Borchert]

> That would be a Sigtronics SPA-400 STO,
>

That IS a four-place unit. If you're gonna stick with this rental
outfit, urge them to install the backseat plugs.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[john smith]

George Patterson wrote:
> You can pick up a portable 4-place intercom. Plug that into the
> co-pilot's jacks and plug the other three headsets into the passenger
> jacks of the intercom. Features like "crew isolate" will be a handicap
> in the portable unit.

You have to be careful doing that, George.
Sometimes it will introduce feedback between the two intercoms and/or
the radio when the PTT is depressed to transmit.

[CryptWolf]

> wrote in message ...
> We just joined a flying club with a 1976 Piper Warrior. The airplane has
a
> two-place intercom. I own four headsets and plan to occasionally take
> friends up in the back seats. Is there such a thing as an adapter I could
> plug into one of the existing headset jacks that I could then plug three
> headsets into?


I have an Avcomm AC-2EX portable 2 place intercom with the 4 place
adapter. I bought it when I was still a private student and seems to have
been a good investment. I know a couple of instructors who beat them
up on a daily basis. I've even had a use for the 4 place adapter.

In an airplane that has a 2 place intercom, we just plug it in normally
and run everything through the portable. This should work with virtually
any intercom that is compatible with aircraft audio. Remember that the
intercom has to produce the same electrically equivalent signals that a
standard headset would produce. Also any intercom has to accept the
normal signals that a standard headset would produce. Just be careful
of any pilot override switches if you plug the portable into the copilot
side.

With some portable intercoms it may be possible to use the empty jacks
of the built-in 2 place intercom. You'll have to test this to see if it
works
with your intercom.It depends on how the portable is designed and if it
passes the mike signals. If it does work, I'd suggest plugging the portable
into the copilot side as some intercoms have pilot override features you
might want to keep on the pilot side.

If you use a portable PTT switch, some are not wired for use with
intercoms and have to have the mike wired direct instead of switched.
You may or may not be able to disassemble it and make the change.
Not a problem for passengers, but it can be a gotcha for the pilot or
copilot if you haven't tested it with an intercom and don't have a
separate PTT jack on it.

I think that about covers intercoms and portables.

[[email protected]]

Here's what Sigtronics had to say:
<<Scott,
You can use the SPO-42 Portable Intercom as you mentioned in your e-mail
with the exception of not plugging the microphone plug into the hand mike
jack. If you want the co-pilot to transmit then plug the intercom into the
hand mike jack and plug two portable PTT switchs in the SPO-42.

The SPA-400 is a four place intercom and the other two positions can be
added to make it a four place intercom.

Sincerely,

Mark Kelley
Sigtronics Corporation
949 North Cataract Ave., #D
San Dimas, CA 91773
Phone: 909-305-9399
Fax: 909-305-9499
www.sigtronics.com>>

So what I'll do is wait until the owner of the Warrior in our flying club
gets back into town in a few weeks, and ask him if I can wire up the rear
seat positions from the existing intercom. If he says no, then I'll go with
the Avcomm portable that Mr Williams suggested, as it is a whole bunch
cheaper than Sigtronics'. Thanks everyone for the advice and comments.
By the way, the owner is in Florida now finishing up a Velocity he built
and is going to stay down there long enough to fly off the required local
flying time before he brings it back up here to Wisconsin.
Scott Wilson

[[email protected]]

Oh, believe me I warned my wife we wold be doing maneuvers that might make
her sick, but she wanted to come anyway. I told her several times before we
got in the airplane I was worried she'd get sick. During the flight I did
ask her frequently if she was doing okay, and she gave me the thumbs up each
time. Afterwards she told me she was doing okay during the stall and steep
turns, but got feeling sick while I was shooting some touch-and goes at
Waupaca, Wisconsin. Then we flew back to Brennand Airport, which has a very
tiny runway, and on the first landing and taxi-back is when she told me she
needed to get out of the airplane. She's flown with me almost every time
since I started flying again a year and a half ago, and this is only the
second time she has been sick. The first time she was riding up front, we
were getting bounced around by turbulence quite a bit, and airsickness came
on pretty suddenly. She was convinced that time it was something she'd
eaten for lunch, and not the rough air that did her in.
Scott Wilson


On 7-Aug-2005, Dave S > wrote:

> Scott, I would be concerned that you took a non-pilot (ok, I am ASSUMING
> the wife is a non-pilot) up on a flight where you were going to be doing
> stalls, steep turns and slow flight. These can be quite uncomfortable
> for a non-pilot, and they "feel" much different from the back seat
> (different sight picture, different position relative to the "fulcrum
> point" for the control surfaces).
>
> I am just a low time guy with about 450 hrs or so, but the few times I
> have been near airsickness have been in the BACK while someone up front
> was doing maneuvers (or was a bad stick in general).
>
>
> Whenever you take folks up, especially if its a rough day or poor
> visibility day, check on them early and often for discomfort, and modify
> the flight to the point of aborting if you have to. It sure beats
> scrubbing puke out of carpets or washing it out of a flight bag.
>
> Dave

[Thomas Borchert]

> She's flown with me almost every time
> since I started flying again a year and a half ago, and this is only the
> second time she has been sick.
>

I hope you are aware how lucky a man you are - and that you need to be
careful not to overdo it.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[[email protected]]

You'd better believe I know how lucky I am! Anyway, the reason she INSISTED
on coming along when I went up for the checkout ride was that she wants to
get her own license some day and figures she should be getting herself used
to the sensations. I've told her it is very different when you are at the
controls, but she wanted to do it anyway.
Scott W.


On 11-Aug-2005, Thomas Borchert > wrote:

> I hope you are aware how lucky a man you are - and that you need to be
> careful not to overdo it.
>
> --
> Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Morgans]

> wrote

She was convinced that time it was something she'd
> eaten for lunch, and not the rough air that did her in.

Could be. Also, colds, sinus infections with clogged up inner ears, and
other sickness can have a lot to do with one's ability to "hold on to your
lunch."
--
Jim in NC