GPS questions

[Jase Vanover]

Background... newly minted PPL, looking to ease navigation via GPS. I
actually find it cool to navigate via maps, compass and timepiece, but I
realize there is a lot more capability out there.

I'll be renting for awhile, so portability is important. I've done the
standard research (including searching prior posts on this newsgroup), but
still have a few questions that remain unanswered.

The Garmin 396 looks pretty awesome. I don't know if I'll fly enough to
warrant the Wx subscription, but I have a healthy respect for weather and so
lean towards it for the additional security.

The only downside I see in the 396 is screen size. I like what I've seen of
the Avmap (Jay... figure I can count on your endorsement here, based on
reading past postings). I think all it's missing vs. the 396 is weather.
Would be interesting to know if anyone has heard if this will be a soft
upgrade in the future. Also, I believe the Avmap is direct powered from the
plane, and I don't know if and how this will be possible on rental aircraft.
Any insight?

I've also run into the Flight Cheetah in my searches, though haven't found
much talk about it on the newsgroups. It seems to have everything, but I
hesitate to be a "test pilot" being a neophyte at flying to start with.

I won't say cost isn't an issue, but I have room enough to spare to pretty
much get whatever portable is best. I welcome any and all advice on the
issue. Thank you to all in advance.

[Kyle Boatright]

"Jase Vanover" > wrote in message
. ..
> Background... newly minted PPL, looking to ease navigation via GPS. I
> actually find it cool to navigate via maps, compass and timepiece, but I
> realize there is a lot more capability out there.
>
> I'll be renting for awhile, so portability is important. I've done the
> standard research (including searching prior posts on this newsgroup), but
> still have a few questions that remain unanswered.
>
> The Garmin 396 looks pretty awesome. I don't know if I'll fly enough to
> warrant the Wx subscription, but I have a healthy respect for weather and
> so lean towards it for the additional security.
>
> The only downside I see in the 396 is screen size. I like what I've seen
> of the Avmap (Jay... figure I can count on your endorsement here, based on
> reading past postings). I think all it's missing vs. the 396 is weather.
> Would be interesting to know if anyone has heard if this will be a soft
> upgrade in the future. Also, I believe the Avmap is direct powered from
> the plane, and I don't know if and how this will be possible on rental
> aircraft. Any insight?
>
> I've also run into the Flight Cheetah in my searches, though haven't found
> much talk about it on the newsgroups. It seems to have everything, but I
> hesitate to be a "test pilot" being a neophyte at flying to start with.
>
> I won't say cost isn't an issue, but I have room enough to spare to pretty
> much get whatever portable is best. I welcome any and all advice on the
> issue. Thank you to all in advance.

Personally, I think the WX feature is very handy, depending on where and
what you fly. I fly a high performance homebuilt with a wood prop. The high
performance part lets me overfly plenty of weather and to quickly get to and
through gaps in bad weather. However, the wood prop means I really, really,
need to avoid flying in rain. For me, XM weather is in my future, but maybe
after the "new" has worn off and the prices are a bit lower.

In your case, you need to figure out what having the weather overlay is
worth. You can buy a great aviation GPS for well under $500, although it
may not be in color and it may not have the very latest bells and whistles.
It'll still have a map, the databases, and all the other functionality. If
you go that route, you can probably buy that GPS today, wait a year and buy
today's top-of-the line GPS with weather capability (a 396, hypothetically),
and spend less total $ than you would just going out and buying the 396
today.

Something to think about. Of course, you may want/need the 396's
functionality today, and if that's the case, go for it. One appropriate tool
is far more useful than several tools that *almost* get the job done.

[Thomas Borchert]

Jase,

Have a look at the Lowrance Airmap 2000c, which has a bigger screen
than the Garmin but isn't quite as big as the Avmap - at a very
interesting price.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[John Doe]

"Kyle Boatright" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Jase Vanover" > wrote in message
> . ..
>> Background... newly minted PPL, looking to ease navigation via GPS. I
>> actually find it cool to navigate via maps, compass and timepiece, but I
>> realize there is a lot more capability out there.
>>
>> I'll be renting for awhile, so portability is important. I've done the
>> standard research (including searching prior posts on this newsgroup),
>> but still have a few questions that remain unanswered.
>>
>> The Garmin 396 looks pretty awesome. I don't know if I'll fly enough to
>> warrant the Wx subscription, but I have a healthy respect for weather and
>> so lean towards it for the additional security.
>>
>> The only downside I see in the 396 is screen size. I like what I've seen
>> of the Avmap (Jay... figure I can count on your endorsement here, based
>> on reading past postings). I think all it's missing vs. the 396 is
>> weather. Would be interesting to know if anyone has heard if this will be
>> a soft upgrade in the future. Also, I believe the Avmap is direct
>> powered from the plane, and I don't know if and how this will be possible
>> on rental aircraft. Any insight?
>>
>> I've also run into the Flight Cheetah in my searches, though haven't
>> found much talk about it on the newsgroups. It seems to have everything,
>> but I hesitate to be a "test pilot" being a neophyte at flying to start
>> with.
>>
>> I won't say cost isn't an issue, but I have room enough to spare to
>> pretty much get whatever portable is best. I welcome any and all advice
>> on the issue. Thank you to all in advance.
>
> Personally, I think the WX feature is very handy, depending on where and
> what you fly. I fly a high performance homebuilt with a wood prop. The
> high performance part lets me overfly plenty of weather and to quickly get
> to and through gaps in bad weather. However, the wood prop means I
> really, really, need to avoid flying in rain. For me, XM weather is in my
> future, but maybe after the "new" has worn off and the prices are a bit
> lower.
>
> In your case, you need to figure out what having the weather overlay is
> worth. You can buy a great aviation GPS for well under $500, although it
> may not be in color and it may not have the very latest bells and
> whistles. It'll still have a map, the databases, and all the other
> functionality. If you go that route, you can probably buy that GPS today,
> wait a year and buy today's top-of-the line GPS with weather capability (a
> 396, hypothetically), and spend less total $ than you would just going out
> and buying the 396 today.
>
> Something to think about. Of course, you may want/need the 396's
> functionality today, and if that's the case, go for it. One appropriate
> tool is far more useful than several tools that *almost* get the job done.
>

I tend to agree. I bought a Garmin 196 for less than $500 on ebay and it's
worked perfect for what I need today.

As a "newly minted PPL" I would avoid any weather that would require you to
even think about needing a 396. I've been flying just fine for almost 20
years without XM weather and the closer I go to bad weather the dumber I
feel after I land.

[Blueskies]

"Thomas Borchert" > wrote in message ...
> Jase,
>
> Have a look at the Lowrance Airmap 2000c, which has a bigger screen
> than the Garmin but isn't quite as big as the Avmap - at a very
> interesting price.
>
> --
> Thomas Borchert (EDDH)
>
>

This 2000c is a very good unit.

[Ronald Gardner]

As a new PPL your call to Flight Service should negate need for weather. Try
finding a used Garmin 295 on ebay. Not sure what they now go for but with the
new stuff out the prices should have dropped. I picked one up on a great deal
several years ago and I think it is great for PPL VFR. With the yoke mount it
does not cover up a large portion of instrument panel, but because it is close
to you the smaller screen is fine.

Ron Gardner

Jase Vanover wrote:

> Background... newly minted PPL, looking to ease navigation via GPS. I
> actually find it cool to navigate via maps, compass and timepiece, but I
> realize there is a lot more capability out there.
>
> I'll be renting for awhile, so portability is important. I've done the
> standard research (including searching prior posts on this newsgroup), but
> still have a few questions that remain unanswered.
>
> The Garmin 396 looks pretty awesome. I don't know if I'll fly enough to
> warrant the Wx subscription, but I have a healthy respect for weather and so
> lean towards it for the additional security.
>
> The only downside I see in the 396 is screen size. I like what I've seen of
> the Avmap (Jay... figure I can count on your endorsement here, based on
> reading past postings). I think all it's missing vs. the 396 is weather.
> Would be interesting to know if anyone has heard if this will be a soft
> upgrade in the future. Also, I believe the Avmap is direct powered from the
> plane, and I don't know if and how this will be possible on rental aircraft.
> Any insight?
>
> I've also run into the Flight Cheetah in my searches, though haven't found
> much talk about it on the newsgroups. It seems to have everything, but I
> hesitate to be a "test pilot" being a neophyte at flying to start with.
>
> I won't say cost isn't an issue, but I have room enough to spare to pretty
> much get whatever portable is best. I welcome any and all advice on the
> issue. Thank you to all in advance.

[Jay Honeck]

>> Have a look at the Lowrance Airmap 2000c, which has a bigger screen
>> than the Garmin but isn't quite as big as the Avmap - at a very
>> interesting price.
>
> This 2000c is a very good unit.

I agree -- and, in fact, we bought one at OSH '05, to replace our old
Lowrance Airmap 300.

If portability is necessary -- and a cigarette lighter is unavailable -- go
with the 2000c. It's not quite an AvMap -- nothing else is -- but the 2000c
has batteries that last between 2 and 5 hours, if needed.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Aluckyguess]

I have a 296. The terrain feature is nice. If you have the money get the 396
I tested one and it is incredible.
"Ronald Gardner" > wrote in message
...
> As a new PPL your call to Flight Service should negate need for weather.
> Try
> finding a used Garmin 295 on ebay. Not sure what they now go for but with
> the
> new stuff out the prices should have dropped. I picked one up on a great
> deal
> several years ago and I think it is great for PPL VFR. With the yoke
> mount it
> does not cover up a large portion of instrument panel, but because it is
> close
> to you the smaller screen is fine.
>
> Ron Gardner
>
> Jase Vanover wrote:
>
>> Background... newly minted PPL, looking to ease navigation via GPS. I
>> actually find it cool to navigate via maps, compass and timepiece, but I
>> realize there is a lot more capability out there.
>>
>> I'll be renting for awhile, so portability is important. I've done the
>> standard research (including searching prior posts on this newsgroup),
>> but
>> still have a few questions that remain unanswered.
>>
>> The Garmin 396 looks pretty awesome. I don't know if I'll fly enough to
>> warrant the Wx subscription, but I have a healthy respect for weather and
>> so
>> lean towards it for the additional security.
>>
>> The only downside I see in the 396 is screen size. I like what I've seen
>> of
>> the Avmap (Jay... figure I can count on your endorsement here, based on
>> reading past postings). I think all it's missing vs. the 396 is weather.
>> Would be interesting to know if anyone has heard if this will be a soft
>> upgrade in the future. Also, I believe the Avmap is direct powered from
>> the
>> plane, and I don't know if and how this will be possible on rental
>> aircraft.
>> Any insight?
>>
>> I've also run into the Flight Cheetah in my searches, though haven't
>> found
>> much talk about it on the newsgroups. It seems to have everything, but I
>> hesitate to be a "test pilot" being a neophyte at flying to start with.
>>
>> I won't say cost isn't an issue, but I have room enough to spare to
>> pretty
>> much get whatever portable is best. I welcome any and all advice on the
>> issue. Thank you to all in advance.
>

[Bob Fry]

Has Lowrance put terrain and/or obstacle data into their GPS yet?

[Newps]

Jay Honeck wrote:

>>>Have a look at the Lowrance Airmap 2000c, which has a bigger screen
>>>than the Garmin but isn't quite as big as the Avmap - at a very
>>>interesting price.
>>
>>This 2000c is a very good unit.
>
>
> I agree -- and, in fact, we bought one at OSH '05, to replace our old
> Lowrance Airmap 300.
>
> If portability is necessary -- and a cigarette lighter is unavailable -- go
> with the 2000c. It's not quite an AvMap -- nothing else is -- but the 2000c
> has batteries that last between 2 and 5 hours, if needed.

You can always hardwire it to the plane. I did that when I had Garmin
handhelds.

[Jay Honeck]

> Has Lowrance put terrain and/or obstacle data into their GPS yet?

Yes to obstacles. Terrain is an extra $99 option which is now available.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Thomas Borchert]

Jay,

> Terrain is an extra $99 option which is now available.
>

Do you have any pointers to where I could find this? On their website,
maybe?

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Jay Honeck]

>> Terrain is an extra $99 option which is now available.
>>
>
> Do you have any pointers to where I could find this? On their website,
> maybe?

Sorry, no. I'm just relaying what the Lowrance reps at OSH and the sales
reps at the CPA fly-in told me.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Chris G.]

I just bought a Lowrance Airmap 2000c and I like it. It comes with all
of the options needed to install the GPS in a plane, car, or permanent
mount somewhere. I have found some useful information in my new
experiences using it:

1) Buy rechargable batteries - NiMH, not NiCad. The alkalines don't
last very long, especially with the backlighting on "high".

2) Read the manual when it comes to using the mapping software that
comes with the unit. It's good, but the manual is needed to get full
capability out of it.

3) Buy a big SD-Ram card. The 32MB card that comes with it is not enough.

4) Call Lowrance and get a new db if yours is out of date within the
first 30 days after purchase for a free current db. (one-time good deal)

5) Enjoy it! It's a fun unit.

You can purchase it (for what I found to be a reasonable price) at
http://www.pacific-coast-avionics.com. I've bought a few items there
and they've always been really good to me.

Happy Landings,

Chris


Jay Honeck wrote:
>>>Terrain is an extra $99 option which is now available.
>>>
>>
>>Do you have any pointers to where I could find this? On their website,
>>maybe?
>
>
> Sorry, no. I'm just relaying what the Lowrance reps at OSH and the sales
> reps at the CPA fly-in told me.

[Dave Butler]

Jase Vanover wrote:
> Also, I believe the Avmap is direct powered from the
> plane, and I don't know if and how this will be possible on rental aircraft.
> Any insight?

As a practical matter, I think the Garmin 396 will require ship's power as well.
It has rechargables that recharge from your 12 v. outlet.

Dave

[10Squared]

Dave Butler wrote:

> Jase Vanover wrote:
>> Also, I believe the Avmap is direct powered from the
>> plane, and I don't know if and how this will be possible on rental
>> aircraft. Any insight?
>
> As a practical matter, I think the Garmin 396 will require ship's power as
> well. It has rechargables that recharge from your 12 v. outlet.
>
> Dave

The AvMap EKP-IV has backup battery capability to run the unit for about an
hour after loss of power. You supply your own AA rechargeables. In normal
use it's powered via the auxillary power receptacle a.k.a. cigar lighter.

One thing I have noted about my EKP-IV is that it produces radio noise on
the aviation frequencies.

[10Squared]

Morgans wrote:

>
> "10Squared" > wrote
>
>> One thing I have noted about my EKP-IV is that it produces radio noise on
>> the aviation frequencies.
>
> Hard to believe that an aviation GPS would cause problems with your
> aviation radios.

Yeah, that was my reaction. I noticed on my Icom IC-A23 handheld that I was
getting static on 122.8. I turned the squelch up all the way and that
didn't help. Turned off the AvMap and that cured the problem. Proximity to
the unit was a factor, but I haven't done any additional tests to quantify
the amount of interference or the specific sources of interference (power
cable, antenna, or cpu).

> Does it make noise on the batteries and the power converter?
>
> Power converters are often the source of much RF noise.

Not sure what you mean by power converter. There is a power cord for DC
power from the aircraft to the GPS. However, since the batteries are for
emergency use the only practical configuration is with the unit powered by
the aircraft power supply.

>
> I also would be interested in hearing from other EKP-IV owners, to see if
> they experience these problems, also. If not, it could be a problem with
> you radio installation.

Me too. And note too, AvMap Navigation has turned off their web forum on
their website.

[john smith]

> "10Squared" > wrote
>>One thing I have noted about my EKP-IV is that it produces radio noise on
>>the aviation frequencies.
>
> Morgans wrote:
> Hard to believe that an aviation GPS would cause problems with your aviation
> radios.
> Does it make noise on the batteries and the power converter?
> Power converters are often the source of much RF noise.
> I also would be interested in hearing from other EKP-IV owners, to see if
> they experience these problems, also. If not, it could be a problem with
> you radio installation.

It is a tablet computer with a gps receiver.
The power supply, processor clock and display driver are all sources of
RF noise.

[Morgans]

"10Squared" > wrote

> One thing I have noted about my EKP-IV is that it produces radio noise on
> the aviation frequencies.

Hard to believe that an aviation GPS would cause problems with your aviation
radios.

Does it make noise on the batteries and the power converter?

Power converters are often the source of much RF noise.

I also would be interested in hearing from other EKP-IV owners, to see if
they experience these problems, also. If not, it could be a problem with
you radio installation.
--
Jim in NC

[peter]

Dave wrote:
> As a practical matter, I think the Garmin 396 will require ship's power as well.
> It has rechargables that recharge from your 12 v. outlet.

Certainly it would be most convenient to plug it in if that's
available. But with a rated battery life of 5 - 15 hours depending on
backlight use it appears to be usable in rental planes without a
suitable outlet, especially if one brings along an extra charged
battery pack. OTOH, the one hour battery life on the Avmap seems
designed as an emergency backup in the event of an electrical power
failure.

[Jonathan Goodish]

In article . com>,
"peter" > wrote:
> > As a practical matter, I think the Garmin 396 will require ship's power as
> > well.
> > It has rechargables that recharge from your 12 v. outlet.
>
> Certainly it would be most convenient to plug it in if that's
> available. But with a rated battery life of 5 - 15 hours depending on
> backlight use it appears to be usable in rental planes without a
> suitable outlet, especially if one brings along an extra charged
> battery pack. OTOH, the one hour battery life on the Avmap seems
> designed as an emergency backup in the event of an electrical power
> failure.


Folks seem to be reporting battery life quite a bit less than 5 hours
when using XM on the 396. And, do you really want to shut down the GPS
in flight, change a battery, and power it back up again? Doesn't seem
too practical to me.

I suspect that you would see much better battery life on the 396 if you
did not use the XM features.



JKG

[Doug]

I highly recommend Garmin. They have GPS figured out and their customer
support is good (I recommend email, but phone works too). Used Garmins
go for a song. Get a black and white screen if you plan on running off
of batteries. ALL the Garmin's are really good. I have a 195. It is
getting a bit old in the tooth, but does pretty much everything I want,
though it does not have terrain height or antennaes on it. The latest
Garmins do that.

[Stubby]

Morgans wrote:
> "10Squared" > wrote
>
>...
>
> Power converters are often the source of much RF noise.
Yes. One of our cell phone rechargers wipes out the AM radio in the
car. The noise is especially noticeable when tuned to a weak station
near the bottom of the dial.

[RST Engineering]

I respectfully disagree with that. I was trying to download a pay-for
database update using Firefox and getting nowhere. I switched over to IE
and had no trouble. This is not common, but it is not unheard of if you
haven't written your web page code properly. Here is the cut and paste
answer I got back:

Thank you for contacting Garmin.

Our aviation database can work with the Firfox (Mozilla) browser. It has
been tested here and has worked you might want to check your proxy settings
otherwise it will work.

Best regards,

I don't call that a "good customer support". Besides lousy grammar and
spelling, it didn't help the customer solve the problem.



Jim




"Doug" > wrote in message
ups.com...
>I highly recommend Garmin. They have GPS figured out and their customer
> support is good (I recommend email, but phone works too).

[RST Engineering]

Repeat after me. A handheld is NOT an aircraft radio. Devices tested to
work with "normal" aircraft radios may or may not work with handhelds. The
designer did not intend the antenna of the radio to be less than a meter
from the device he tested.

A handheld is NOT an aircraft radio. Most of them do NOT have the noise
suppression capability OR the filtering of an aircraft radio.

Jim



"10Squared" > wrote in message
.. .
> Morgans wrote:


>
> Yeah, that was my reaction. I noticed on my Icom IC-A23 handheld that I
> was
> getting static on 122.8.

[Darrel Toepfer]

Thomas Borchert wrote:

> Do you have any pointers to where I could find this? On their website,
maybe?

Our new Lowrance 2000C arrived this week, terrain is an add-on that will
take place next month, it will be available through their dealers. I
know ours promised us a price lower than what Jay quoted...

He got the best deal on the original purchase though at Oshkosh...

[Jase Vanover]

Thank you to all for the tips. I got the Garmin 296. Basis for my decision
was...
- excellent advice that as a neophyte, my weather avoidance should be done
on the ground with FSS, not in the air with satellites (hence the 396 not
required).
- portability (battery power on the 296 vs. Airmap et al)
- resale should I need to upgrade in the future should be easy.

Thanks again to everyone for the insight.

Been playing with the 296 today... cool...


"Jase Vanover" > wrote in message
. ..
> Background... newly minted PPL, looking to ease navigation via GPS. I
> actually find it cool to navigate via maps, compass and timepiece, but I
> realize there is a lot more capability out there.

[Jay Honeck]

> Our new Lowrance 2000C arrived this week, terrain is an add-on that will
> take place next month, it will be available through their dealers. I know
> ours promised us a price lower than what Jay quoted...

Really? What price are they quoting now for terrain?

If it gets cheap enough, I may actually spring for it. (Even living in
Iowa! :-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Newps]

Jay Honeck wrote:

>>Our new Lowrance 2000C arrived this week, terrain is an add-on that will
>>take place next month, it will be available through their dealers. I know
>>ours promised us a price lower than what Jay quoted...
>
>
> Really? What price are they quoting now for terrain?
>
> If it gets cheap enough, I may actually spring for it. (Even living in
> Iowa! :-)

Jay, I've flown with the terrain feature of a GPS. It is a complete
waste of money for a VFR pilot. It's even useless out here where we
actually have terrain. If where you fly there is a lot of antennas and
you often scud run and are dodging these antennas then an obstruction
database may be of some use.

[Jay Honeck]

> Jay, I've flown with the terrain feature of a GPS. It is a complete waste
> of money for a VFR pilot. It's even useless out here where we actually
> have terrain. If where you fly there is a lot of antennas and you often
> scud run and are dodging these antennas then an obstruction database may
> be of some use.

Yeah, we've got the antennas depicted on both the AvMap and the Lowrance
2000c, and they're nice to have.

And some of 'em you don't even need to be scud running to hit. Those danged
things are thousands of feet tall around here!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[john smith]

Jay Honeck wrote:
> Yeah, we've got the antennas depicted on both the AvMap and the Lowrance
> 2000c, and they're nice to have.
> And some of 'em you don't even need to be scud running to hit. Those danged
> things are thousands of feet tall around here!

Flatlander!

[Newps]

Jay Honeck wrote:

>>Jay, I've flown with the terrain feature of a GPS. It is a complete waste
>>of money for a VFR pilot. It's even useless out here where we actually
>>have terrain. If where you fly there is a lot of antennas and you often
>>scud run and are dodging these antennas then an obstruction database may
>>be of some use.
>
>
> Yeah, we've got the antennas depicted on both the AvMap and the Lowrance
> 2000c, and they're nice to have.
>
> And some of 'em you don't even need to be scud running to hit. Those danged
> things are thousands of feet tall around here!

Last I heard the tallest man made structure was the TV antenna between
Fargo and Grand Forks at 2000 AGL. The vast majority of antennas are
much less than 1000.

[N93332]

"Newps" > wrote in message
...
> Last I heard the tallest man made structure was the TV antenna between
> Fargo and Grand Forks at 2000 AGL. The vast majority of antennas are much
> less than 1000.

Back in the 70's they built towers between Des Moines and Ames that were
2000 agl (2998msl). Looking at a Chicago sectional shows several antennae
around 1500-2000 agl in Jay's neighborhood.

[Don Tuite]

On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:18:42 -0600, Newps > wrote:

>
>Last I heard the tallest man made structure was the TV antenna between
>Fargo and Grand Forks at 2000 AGL. The vast majority of antennas are
>much less than 1000.

Just south of Sacramento, there is a cluster of four 2000-footers (The
southernmost two are 2049.) They're in the delta, so their absolute
height is the same as their AGL height. We've also got a 1500-footer
on top of a 3000-foot ridge between San Jose and Watsonville.

Otherwise, yes.

Don

[Darrel Toepfer]

Jay Honeck wrote:

> Really? What price are they quoting now for terrain?

Less than $100 on a near $200 item. Your acquisition price was
unbeatable and definitely "show" only...

> If it gets cheap enough, I may actually spring for it. (Even living in
> Iowa! :-)

Got at least a half a dozen towers near 2000' within 50 miles of me. Our
Airmap 1000 always showed the older ones, some updates didn't catch the
newest ones. Course it never warned you about hitting them...

[John Clear]

In article >,
Don Tuite > wrote:
>
>Just south of Sacramento, there is a cluster of four 2000-footers (The
>southernmost two are 2049.) They're in the delta, so their absolute
>height is the same as their AGL height. We've also got a 1500-footer
>on top of a 3000-foot ridge between San Jose and Watsonville.

I took some pics of the one on the ridge between Watsonville and
South County awhile back.

http://www.clear-prop.org/spot-the-tower/

Those ones in the delta are pretty impressive too. At least they
are painted in high visability colors. The one on the ridge is
flat grey.

John
--
John Clear - http://www.clear-prop.org/