Katrina

[W P Dixon]

Guys and Gals,
Take a moment tonight for thoughts and prayers for the folks on the Gulf
coast. Winds are now 160 knots. To our newsgroupers in the Mobile area I
sure hope yall have gotten out of Dodge. Let's all hope that things won't be
as bad as everyone is saying. Please do what you can to help the victims, I
am sure lots of our help will be needed and greatly appreciated.

--
Patrick Dixon
student SPL
aircraft structural mech

[Dan Luke]

"W P Dixon" wrote:

> To our newsgroupers in the Mobile area I sure hope yall have gotten
> out of Dodge.

Nah, still here.

At 06:30 local on the east side of Mobile Bay we're getting rain squalls
and winds 25G45kt.

Power at my house has blinked once.

--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

[Darrel Toepfer]

Dan Luke wrote:
> "W P Dixon" wrote:

>>To our newsgroupers in the Mobile area I sure hope yall have gotten
>>out of Dodge.
>
> Nah, still here.
>
> At 06:30 local on the east side of Mobile Bay we're getting rain squalls
> and winds 25G45kt.
>
> Power at my house has blinked once.

Dolphin Island is under 7' of water at this moment...

Winds haven't gotten higher than 30mph over here on the central/west
side of Lousiana...

[Marco Leon]

I find it amazing the wealth of info received from just one simple post as
compared to the newscasters on location. They have NOTHING to add in terms
of new info and sometimes are counterproductive by spreading rumours. It's
almost laughable what they're putting themselves through.

Good luck to you all down there.

Marco Leon

"Darrel Toepfer" > wrote in message
...
> Dan Luke wrote:
> > "W P Dixon" wrote:
>
> >>To our newsgroupers in the Mobile area I sure hope yall have gotten
> >>out of Dodge.
> >
> > Nah, still here.
> >
> > At 06:30 local on the east side of Mobile Bay we're getting rain squalls
> > and winds 25G45kt.
> >
> > Power at my house has blinked once.
>
> Dolphin Island is under 7' of water at this moment...
>
> Winds haven't gotten higher than 30mph over here on the central/west
> side of Lousiana...



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[Darrel Toepfer]

Marco Leon wrote:

> I find it amazing the wealth of info received from just one simple post as
> compared to the newscasters on location. They have NOTHING to add in terms
> of new info and sometimes are counterproductive by spreading rumours. It's
> almost laughable what they're putting themselves through.
>
> Good luck to you all down there.

Some 7 people unaccounted for in Grand Isle who wouldn't leave, 20'
storm surge there. Heard from the guys that were stuck on a jackup barge
there as well, they called into a Lafayette teevee station...

Reportly 114 mph winds at GI, 28' storm surge was predicted...

We just got our first rain here, few big drops but mostly drizzle...

[Don Tuite]

On Mon, 29 Aug 2005 15:19:32 -0400, "Marco Leon" <mmleon(at)yahoo.com>
wrote:

>I find it amazing the wealth of info received from just one simple post as
>compared to the newscasters on location. They have NOTHING to add in terms
>of new info and sometimes are counterproductive by spreading rumours. It's
>almost laughable what they're putting themselves through.

I expect the ham radio newsgroups are also informative.
>
>Good luck to you all down there.

Ditto.

Don

[Dan Luke]

"Darrel Toepfer" wrote:
>>
>> Good luck to you all down there.
>
> Some 7 people unaccounted for in Grand Isle who wouldn't leave, 20'
> storm surge there. Heard from the guys that were stuck on a jackup
> barge there as well, they called into a Lafayette teevee station...
>
> Reportly 114 mph winds at GI, 28' storm surge was predicted...
>
> We just got our first rain here, few big drops but mostly drizzle...

Hope you're ok over there, Darrel.

Just got my DSL service back at 13:30 local. Power is still off and
generators are humming all over the place.

My neighborhood is a much worse mess than it was after Ivan last year.
Many large trees are down and some houses are heavily damaged. Utility
lines and poles are down everywhere; stores are closed; gas is
scarce--and this is 90 miles from the path of the storm.

Pictures of the damage are trickling in from Mississippi and Louisiana.
This might be the worst Gulf storm all time in terms of property damage.

I hate hurricanes.

--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

[Darrel Toepfer]

Dan Luke wrote:

> Hope you're ok over there, Darrel.

Winds topped out at 30, no measurable rainfall... 4R7 - 126.7 nautical
miles west of New Orleans Lakefront. Picked up a few branches and
skimmed the leaves out of the pool a couple of times...

> Just got my DSL service back at 13:30 local. Power is still off and
> generators are humming all over the place.

Mine was running as soon as the power failed after Lili. Couple of days
later you could here several. After 4 days you could hear lots of them.
I replaced my 5.5kw gasoline, with a 30kw NG/LPG one. It got me and 2
neighbors through Lili though (burned nearly 100 gallons of gas). I
swore I'd have air conditioning through the next one though...

Cable was out for a week, DSL was only out for a few hours through the
whole thing...

> My neighborhood is a much worse mess than it was after Ivan last year.
> Many large trees are down and some houses are heavily damaged. Utility
> lines and poles are down everywhere; stores are closed; gas is
> scarce--and this is 90 miles from the path of the storm.

Lots of refugees here in Eunice. The ones from Thibodeaux returned home
yesterday...

> Pictures of the damage are trickling in from Mississippi and Louisiana.
> This might be the worst Gulf storm all time in terms of property damage.

Just got the ones of the Pemex rig bumping the Cochrane-Africatown USA
bridge there in Alabama...

> I hate hurricanes.

As do most of us...

[RST Engineering]

Does sort of give you ponder for thought when so many brides want hurricane
lamps on the front pews at their weddings. Perhaps a glint of what is in
store for the groom?

{;-)


Jim



> I hate hurricanes.

[George Patterson]

Darrel Toepfer wrote:
>
> I replaced my 5.5kw gasoline, with a 30kw NG/LPG one.

What did that set you back to install? Around here, it costs more for the
permits and installation than for the generator.

George Patterson
Give a person a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a person to
use the Internet and he won't bother you for weeks.

[Darrel Toepfer]

George Patterson wrote:
> Darrel Toepfer wrote:
>
>> I replaced my 5.5kw gasoline, with a 30kw NG/LPG one.
>
> What did that set you back to install? Around here, it costs more for
> the permits and installation than for the generator.

$300 to truck it from California, $3k for a '60's exrailroad 3 phase
with Ford inline 6 powering it. I'd been squabbling over the price with
the guy for 3 months over a 40kw. It got sold 3 days before I called to
make whatever deal I could...

The city gas department got in a tizzy for a bit saying it would stress
the meter, I told them we'd cross that bridge when it came to it. Never
got there yet, instantaneous consumption hardly registers...

I black plastic'd the ground, dug holes for the concrete pads and
backfilled with sand to level everything (leftover sand bags I didn't
really need as it turned out) and then poured a couple loads of
limestone over everything. Local crane company owed the family a favor,
they lifted it off the trailer and set it into place. Install cost was
just over nothing (in aviation dollars), and yet its priceless when the
need arises...

http://www.whodat.net/lili

I've run on it over 1/2 dozen times since it was installed in late 2002.
The price of NG/LPG sucks, but you don't have to worry about it going
bad like diesel and gasoline...

The city raised more cane about my steel roof, than the generator. When
I pointed to a 25 year old house down the street that was built with
one, they backed down and issued my permit. Nobody had ever noticed it
before... 'cept me of course...

The airport has no backup power (there is an abandoned tailered power
unit behind one hanger), the city hall is replacing theirs now that
they've discovered that its inadequate on multiple occasions...

I've got a friend that is getting self contained 15kw Chinese diesels
for just over $3k shipped. I helped him put it in place Saturday. 2 more
are sitting in New Orleans now, hopefully high and dry to the shippers
insurance company...

I bought that 5.5kw new back in '85 for under $400. Its paid for itself
tens of times over...

[john smith]

Any wagers on whether the National Business Aviation Association
convention is still be a "GO" for November 3-5 in New Orleans?

[sfb]

Don't plan on it. I saw one blurb saying it would be a month before they
will let residents back into town. The pumps can handle about 1" of rain
an hour. So they have to close the holes in the dikes, get power back to
the pumps, start pumping, and then start cleaning.

"john smith" > wrote in message
.. .
> Any wagers on whether the National Business Aviation Association
> convention is still be a "GO" for November 3-5 in New Orleans?

[George Patterson]

sfb wrote:
> I saw one blurb saying it would be a month before they
> will let residents back into town.

Bet they'll have even more trouble getting people to leave the next time they
want to evacuate someplace. AP is saying less than a week.

The pumps can handle about 1" of rain
> an hour. So they have to close the holes in the dikes, get power back to
> the pumps, start pumping, and then start cleaning.

While they're closing holes in the dikes, they'll be bringing in additional
pumps, some of which will have their own power supplies. Any major port will
have many of these.

George Patterson
Give a person a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a person to
use the Internet and he won't bother you for weeks.

[Dan Luke]

"George Patterson" wrote:

> While they're closing holes in the dikes, they'll be bringing in
> additional pumps, some of which will have their own power supplies.
> Any major port will have many of these.

On Interstate-10 in Mobile this morning, I saw at least a dozen Corps of
Engineers disaster response 18-wheelers headed west.

--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

[[email protected]]

George Patterson wrote:
> sfb wrote:
> > I saw one blurb saying it would be a month before they
> > will let residents back into town.
>
> Bet they'll have even more trouble getting people to leave the next time they
> want to evacuate someplace. AP is saying less than a week.
>

Normally I'd agree but this one was a real doozy- if you didn't get out
when you could, you'd be damn lucky to make it. If anything I think it
makes people take the orders more seriously. The real risk is
scrambling everybody and then having the thing go "poof" and just knock
over a few trees. Imagine if there were another 1m people in New
Orleans- we'd be looking at tsunami-scale casualties.

-cwk.

[john smith]

>>Bet they'll have even more trouble getting people to leave the next time they
>>want to evacuate someplace. AP is saying less than a week.

I don't think so.
The people in Florida learned some hard lessons last year.

[Bob Chilcoat]

I doubt that there are very many portable pumps with 6' piping. That's what
they have at the levees into Pontchatrain, lots of them.

--
Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)


"George Patterson" > wrote in message
news:OL3Re.7755$wE1.6377@trndny01...
> sfb wrote:
>> I saw one blurb saying it would be a month before they will let residents
>> back into town.
>
> Bet they'll have even more trouble getting people to leave the next time
> they want to evacuate someplace. AP is saying less than a week.
>
> The pumps can handle about 1" of rain
>> an hour. So they have to close the holes in the dikes, get power back to
>> the pumps, start pumping, and then start cleaning.
>
> While they're closing holes in the dikes, they'll be bringing in
> additional pumps, some of which will have their own power supplies. Any
> major port will have many of these.
>
> George Patterson
> Give a person a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a person to
> use the Internet and he won't bother you for weeks.

[George Patterson]

Bob Chilcoat wrote:
> I doubt that there are very many portable pumps with 6' piping.

I doubt that too; the ones with which I'm familiar tended to be 14" or smaller.
The larger ones with which I've dealt are not designed to be portable (they're
self-contained gasoline or diesel fire protection system pumps), but a small
crane can place one on a flatbed in jig time. They don't have to hook up to the
existing plumbing. Drop your inlet in on one side and drop your discharge line
on the lake side. Again, the pieces for this (including inlet screens) are
readily available in the fire protection world. One of the larger units can pump
water ten stories up through a 12" main.

In any case, as I said, any major port will have large portable pumps. The
largest are used for salvage operations.

George Patterson
Give a person a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a person to
use the Internet and he won't bother you for weeks.

[Hilton]

john smith wrote:
> Any wagers on whether the National Business Aviation Association
> convention is still be a "GO" for November 3-5 in New Orleans?

Not even close (IMHO). It's going to take weeks to close the holes, not
sure how long to pump the water out, then clean up, remove bodies and
debris, fight off diseases, start getting food and water back in, and so on.
Don't forget, there's still a pretty good chance another hurricane will
affect them soon.

This cleanup effort will be in the order of months, and to return to any
sort of tourism/conventions will take 1-2 years minimum, not 1-2 months.
Just my 5c.

Hilton

[Gig 601XL Builder]

It's official...
http://web.nbaa.org/public/cs/amc/2005/
New Orleans city officials today said it could take months before residents
evacuated from the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina would be allowed back into
the devastated city, prompting the National Business Aviation Association
(NBAA) to regrettably announce that conditions are forcing the Association
to move its 58th Annual Meeting & Convention from the city.

In acknowledging the necessity to move its Convention, NBAA expressed
sympathy for the citizens of New Orleans, and pledged to provide charitable
assistance to the city in the coming weeks.

“The NBAA and its Members join with the rest of America in expressing our
sorrow and concern for the people affected by this terrible tragedy,” said
NBAA President and CEO Ed Bolen. “It is unfortunate that we have no choice
but to move our Convention. However, we look forward to returning to New
Orleans when the city is again ready to accommodate our event.”





"Hilton" > wrote in message
ink.net...
> john smith wrote:
>> Any wagers on whether the National Business Aviation Association
>> convention is still be a "GO" for November 3-5 in New Orleans?
>
> Not even close (IMHO). It's going to take weeks to close the holes, not
> sure how long to pump the water out, then clean up, remove bodies and
> debris, fight off diseases, start getting food and water back in, and so
> on.
> Don't forget, there's still a pretty good chance another hurricane will
> affect them soon.
>
> This cleanup effort will be in the order of months, and to return to any
> sort of tourism/conventions will take 1-2 years minimum, not 1-2 months.
> Just my 5c.
>
> Hilton
>
>