PPL Services

[Nadeem Zahid]

I just want to clear some confusion reg. private pilot services.
I know that PP cannot charge for any services for compensation or hire
other than sharing the fuel cost. Can someone zoom little bit into it?
Specifically if someone (non-pilot) wants to rent an airplane (also if
he can rent at all?) or pay for that rental and requests for free pilot
service to pick up his son or daughter, will it be violation of the FAR?
IMO it will be...

/Nadeem

[N93332]

"Nadeem Zahid" > wrote in message
...
>I just want to clear some confusion reg. private pilot services.
> I know that PP cannot charge for any services for compensation or hire
> other than sharing the fuel cost. Can someone zoom little bit into it?
> Specifically if someone (non-pilot) wants to rent an airplane (also if he
> can rent at all?) or pay for that rental and requests for free pilot
> service to pick up his son or daughter, will it be violation of the FAR?
> IMO it will be...

My understanding is if a friend comes up to you and says "Hey, do you want
to fly me to Iowa City to see Jay's place?", that is not allowed but if you
tell your friend "Hey, I'm going to fly to Iowa City to see Jay's place,
wanna come with?", then you may split the costs. I guess it depends on who
speaks first whether it's allowed or not.

Also, there is a way to get compensated as a private pilot; get the Sport
Pilot CFI added on. You don't get paid to fly, but you can charge for the
training (and have to do it in a sport plane). Ask your local FSDO for
details.

-Greg B.

[BTIZ]

it would be in the US
BT
"Nadeem Zahid" > wrote in message
...
>I just want to clear some confusion reg. private pilot services.
> I know that PP cannot charge for any services for compensation or hire
> other than sharing the fuel cost. Can someone zoom little bit into it?
> Specifically if someone (non-pilot) wants to rent an airplane (also if he
> can rent at all?) or pay for that rental and requests for free pilot
> service to pick up his son or daughter, will it be violation of the FAR?
> IMO it will be...
>
> /Nadeem
>

[George Patterson]

Nadeem Zahid wrote:
>
> Specifically if someone (non-pilot) wants to rent an airplane (also if
> he can rent at all?) or pay for that rental and requests for free pilot
> service to pick up his son or daughter, will it be violation of the FAR?
> IMO it will be...

You are correct. There are two things you need to be aware of. First, there
needs to be a "common purpose"; that is, the pilot must at least claim to be
going there for the same reason as the passenger. This is based on case law and
will not be found in the FARs. Second, the pilot must pay at least his or her
full share of the expenses.

George Patterson
Give a person a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a person to
use the Internet and he won't bother you for weeks.

[Dave]

Don't charge for the gas, just charge him for a bag of peanuts. They might
be expensive peanuts, but if hes willing to pay for them, why not?

"Nadeem Zahid" > wrote in message
...
>I just want to clear some confusion reg. private pilot services.
> I know that PP cannot charge for any services for compensation or hire
> other than sharing the fuel cost. Can someone zoom little bit into it?
> Specifically if someone (non-pilot) wants to rent an airplane (also if he
> can rent at all?) or pay for that rental and requests for free pilot
> service to pick up his son or daughter, will it be violation of the FAR?
> IMO it will be...
>
> /Nadeem
>

[Robert M. Gary]

Who pays is only one test for whether an operation is 135 or private.
There are others including "holding out", "common purpose", etc. I
would say your example sounds more like 135 than private. Also, be
aware the the FAA has said that, in general, the ability to log time is
considered compensation. Some groups (such as Civil Air Patrol and some
glider groups) have specific wavers from the FAA for this.

-Robert, CFI

[Ronald Gardner]

Yep, the PP would be getting free use i.e. compensation for a flight. For
example I as a PP fly CAP SAR and cadet orientation flights. While these
orientation flights are not for me personally, the fact that the aircraft
and fuel are provided free of charge creates a compensated flight as far as
the FAA is concerned.

That sucks since all I wish to do is to educate kids a little, not to say
the 100's of hours I give to CAP free of charge for the SAR training and
missions.

Ron

Nadeem Zahid wrote:

> I just want to clear some confusion reg. private pilot services.
> I know that PP cannot charge for any services for compensation or hire
> other than sharing the fuel cost. Can someone zoom little bit into it?
> Specifically if someone (non-pilot) wants to rent an airplane (also if
> he can rent at all?) or pay for that rental and requests for free pilot
> service to pick up his son or daughter, will it be violation of the FAR?
> IMO it will be...
>
> /Nadeem

[Ronald Gardner]

CAP waiver has been pulled and is no longer valid per National HQ

Ron

"Robert M. Gary" wrote:

> Who pays is only one test for whether an operation is 135 or private.
> There are others including "holding out", "common purpose", etc. I
> would say your example sounds more like 135 than private. Also, be
> aware the the FAA has said that, in general, the ability to log time is
> considered compensation. Some groups (such as Civil Air Patrol and some
> glider groups) have specific wavers from the FAA for this.
>
> -Robert, CFI

[Nadeem Zahid]

Thanks all - so basically I got it that its better to not get into
this...:) I asked since someone wanted to give a surprise ride to his
kid to pick up 400 miles away and asked if i can fly for him.

Nadeem

Ronald Gardner wrote:
> Yep, the PP would be getting free use i.e. compensation for a flight. For
> example I as a PP fly CAP SAR and cadet orientation flights. While these
> orientation flights are not for me personally, the fact that the aircraft
> and fuel are provided free of charge creates a compensated flight as far as
> the FAA is concerned.
>
> That sucks since all I wish to do is to educate kids a little, not to say
> the 100's of hours I give to CAP free of charge for the SAR training and
> missions.
>
> Ron
>
> Nadeem Zahid wrote:
>
>
>>I just want to clear some confusion reg. private pilot services.
>>I know that PP cannot charge for any services for compensation or hire
>>other than sharing the fuel cost. Can someone zoom little bit into it?
>>Specifically if someone (non-pilot) wants to rent an airplane (also if
>>he can rent at all?) or pay for that rental and requests for free pilot
>>service to pick up his son or daughter, will it be violation of the FAR?
>>IMO it will be...
>>
>>/Nadeem
>
>

[ET]

Nadeem Zahid > wrote in
:

> Thanks all - so basically I got it that its better to not get into
> this...:) I asked since someone wanted to give a surprise ride to his
> kid to pick up 400 miles away and asked if i can fly for him.
>
> Nadeem
>
> Ronald Gardner wrote:
>> Yep, the PP would be getting free use i.e. compensation for a flight.
>> For example I as a PP fly CAP SAR and cadet orientation flights.
>> While these orientation flights are not for me personally, the fact
>> that the aircraft and fuel are provided free of charge creates a
>> compensated flight as far as the FAA is concerned.
>>
>> That sucks since all I wish to do is to educate kids a little, not to
>> say the 100's of hours I give to CAP free of charge for the SAR
>> training and missions.
>>
>> Ron
>>
>> Nadeem Zahid wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I just want to clear some confusion reg. private pilot services.
>>>I know that PP cannot charge for any services for compensation or
>>>hire other than sharing the fuel cost. Can someone zoom little bit
>>>into it? Specifically if someone (non-pilot) wants to rent an
>>>airplane (also if he can rent at all?) or pay for that rental and
>>>requests for free pilot service to pick up his son or daughter, will
>>>it be violation of the FAR? IMO it will be...
>>>
>>>/Nadeem
>>
>>
>
>

Just two words: Quiet & CASH..... It sucks that we have to lie and
conspire to get by unfair rules, but that's what we have to do....

--
-- ET >:-)

"A common mistake people make when trying to design something
completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete
fools."---- Douglas Adams