Color-blind

[Steph]

"Kathy" > wrote in message
...
> What do you advise for a color-blind pilot wannabe? How likely is it for
> someone who's color-blind to get a SODA?
>
> Kathy
>

I'm colour blind, and my license is endorsed "Daytime only, and functioning
radio in controlled airspace."
Otherwise no problem..........

[Jim Burns]

It sounds like you are already familiar with the SODA. My recommendation
would be to visit your local tower with a CFI and ask the controller to
flash the light gun at you, both red and green. Tell them to do it slowly.
Become familiar with what it looks like prior to doing the SODA test. Then
have your CFI call the FSDO to make the appointment. My main CFI is color
blind. The first time he tried the SODA the tower flashed very quickly, it
was actually the FSDO inspector that told them to slow down and then he had
no trouble with it.
Jim

"Kathy" > wrote in message
...
> What do you advise for a color-blind pilot wannabe? How likely is it for
> someone who's color-blind to get a SODA?
>
> Kathy
>
>

[Scott Skylane]

Kathy,

If you can tell the difference between the red, white, and green light
gun signals from a control tower, than you won't have any problem at
all. You can go to a local tower, and ask them to flash them at you for
reference.

Happy Flying!
Scott Skylane

[NW_PILOT]

"Kathy" > wrote in message
...
> What do you advise for a color-blind pilot wannabe? How likely is it for
> someone who's color-blind to get a SODA?
>
> Kathy
>
>

My friend is color blind they refused a second class but gave him a third
but he cannot see green/blue or something like that would fwd your e-mail to
him if you had one!

Steven Rhine
CP-ASEL-IA
CFI, ATP Student

[Kathy]

What do you advise for a color-blind pilot wannabe? How likely is it for
someone who's color-blind to get a SODA?

Kathy

[Sylvain]

Kathy wrote:
> What do you advise for a color-blind pilot wannabe? How likely is it for
> someone who's color-blind to get a SODA?

If I may (I am also color blind -- well, at least I was until
I got this letter from the FAA saying I was ok :-))

Go for it (at least if you are flying in USA, which I assume
since you are talking about SODA, regs elsewhere may not be as
good, except may be Australia thanks to Dr Pape);

If you fail the standard test that the AME gives you (most of
the time the Ishiara test, i.e., these silly mosaics thing),
you'll get a medical with a no night flying restriction (and
no using of color light signals at controlled airports);

Note though that this restriction won't prevent you from
completing the standard private pilot cursus and getting your
certificate since all the night flying requirements is (usually)
done with a CFI. Note that it is also possible to complete
your commercial certificate with the restriction on (I did it
before getting the waiver, there is a trick, let's see if the
readers know the regulations :-)

Now, there are a couple of ways to get a waiver (it is no longer
a SODA by the way). There are a number of alternative tests
that the FAA recognize as valid (AOPA has documentation about
these tests -- join AOPA now if you haven't already); e.g.,
Farnthworth lantern, D15, etc. the trick here is to find an
ophtalmo who has the whole battery of tests (rare -- try the
ophtalmo department of an university hospital); you can fail
them as many times as it takes, all you have to do is to pass
one of them successfully.

If that fails, you can then try the practical light gun test;
I would not recommend that as the first option for a couple
of reasons: one, you can fail this test only once; if you
fail twice, you are done, and won't ever be able to get
a waiver (usually, the first try is done during the day, and
the second one at night, which is easier); the second reason
is that even people with normal color vision routinely *fail*
this test (most people, color blind and normal vision alike,
tend to confuse the white and green lights); if possible
find a FSDO who has its own light gun rather than doing it
from the tower (and try to find one of these light gun beforehand
and play with it so you can see what white or green is supposed
to look like before the test -- I did it and it helps a lot);

if you succeed one of these tests, then you get a letter from
the FAA saying that you have passed one of the acceptable alternative
test, and you present this letter to the AME everytime you renew
your medical (it is valid for all classes of medical unlike a SODA
which can be limited to a given class);

in summary: talk to AOPA and don't worry too much. Oh, and
a good read on the subject:

http://www.aopa.com.au/infocentre/topicdocuments/colourvision.pdf

--Sylvain

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN]

Sylvain wrote:
> Kathy wrote:
>> What do you advise for a color-blind pilot wannabe? How likely is it for
>> someone who's color-blind to get a SODA?
>
> if you succeed one of these tests, then you get a letter from
> the FAA saying that you have passed one of the acceptable alternative
> test, and you present this letter to the AME everytime you renew
> your medical (it is valid for all classes of medical unlike a SODA
> which can be limited to a given class);
>
> in summary: talk to AOPA and don't worry too much. Oh, and
> a good read on the subject:
>
> http://www.aopa.com.au/infocentre/topicdocuments/colourvision.pdf



Just as a point of interest: I'm pushing 3000 hours now and I've never even
seen a light signal. Have any of you?

Heh heh... maybe I'm color blind after all <G>




--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

[Jon Woellhaf]

"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" > wrote in message
. ..

> Just as a point of interest: I'm pushing 3000 hours now and I've never
> even seen a light signal. Have any of you?

Yes. DIA's (KDEN) tower nearly blinded me with theirs at about five miles
out one night. Maybe they had it on Day -- assuming there's a day/night
setting. I asked to see it.

Jon

[Bob Noel]

In article >,
"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" > wrote:

> Just as a point of interest: I'm pushing 3000 hours now and I've never even
> seen a light signal. Have any of you?

yep - back in 1987 after my radios went tango-uniform.

--
Bob Noel
no one likes an educated mule

[Ken]

Sylvain wrote:
> ...
> if you succeed one of these tests, then you get a letter from
> the FAA saying that you have passed one of the acceptable alternative
> test, and you present this letter to the AME everytime you renew
> your medical (it is valid for all classes of medical unlike a SODA
> which can be limited to a given class);
>
> in summary: talk to AOPA and don't worry too much. Oh, and
> a good read on the subject:
>
> http://www.aopa.com.au/infocentre/topicdocuments/colourvision.pdf
>
> --Sylvain

I received a SODA for color blindness back before waivers were issued
for a color light gun test. It is limited to a 3rd class medical only.
What would be necessary to convert this SODA to a waiver that could be
used for a 2nd class medical?

Thanks in advance!
~Ken

[Sylvain]

Ken wrote:
> I received a SODA for color blindness back before waivers were issued
> for a color light gun test. It is limited to a 3rd class medical only.
> What would be necessary to convert this SODA to a waiver that could be
> used for a 2nd class medical?

I don't know, but I would ask the question to AOPA.

--Sylvain

[J. Severyn]

I'm over 2000 hours. The only time I've seen a light signal was at the FSDO
when I took the test to get my SODA.

John Severyn
KLVK
"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" > wrote in message
. ..
>
>
> Just as a point of interest: I'm pushing 3000 hours now and I've never
> even seen a light signal. Have any of you?
>
> Heh heh... maybe I'm color blind after all <G>
> --
> Mortimer Schnerd, RN
>
>
>
>

[Capt.Doug]

>"Kathy" wrote in message
> What do you advise for a color-blind pilot wannabe? How likely is it for
> someone who's color-blind to get a SODA?

There are different levels of color blindness. There are airline pilots with
medical waivers for color blindness. Talk to an experienced medical examiner
for your options.

D.

[Cub Driver]

On Mon, 10 Oct 2005 21:20:06 GMT, "Steph" >
wrote:

>I'm colour blind, and my license is endorsed "Daytime only, and functioning
>radio in controlled airspace."

Fascinating. What's with the radio requirement?

And isn't all airspace controlled on the east coast?

And what are you supposed to do if the radio conks?



-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
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the blog: www.danford.net
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

[Cub Driver]

On Mon, 10 Oct 2005 14:38:42 -0700, Sylvain > wrote:

>Note though that this restriction won't prevent you from
>completing the standard private pilot cursus and getting your
>certificate since all the night flying requirements is (usually)
>done with a CFI.

Getting a recreational certificate is also an option, seems to me.
With a bit of footwork, for the GA pilot without Bonanza ambitions,
there's little practical difference. Wouldn't be able to fly at night,
across open water (10 miles I think it is), or out of the country.


-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
the blog: www.danford.net
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

[Sylvain]

Cub Driver wrote:
> Getting a recreational certificate is also an option, seems to me.
> With a bit of footwork, for the GA pilot without Bonanza ambitions,
> there's little practical difference. Wouldn't be able to fly at night,
> across open water (10 miles I think it is), or out of the country.

....or above 10'000 feet or in controlled airspace or in aircraft
with more than 4 seats or with more than one pax and with a
sh*load of other restrictions (additional endorsements etc.) all
that for pretty much the same amount of work (and cost) as a
private; a private with non night flying would be equivalent
with what Europeans content themselves...

if radio goes nordo, you simply head for the nearest uncontrolled
airfield, no problem;

--Sylvain

[[email protected]]

Kathy
Color bli9ndness and color deficiency are two different things. Many
men have the later and not at all uncommon. For women and color
blindness I guess its a different thing? The SODA is simply a test for
white/green/red and one that I did back about 1970 after I had already
done numerous 1st class physicals! Did the light test at the tower with
a FSDO Inspector, passed it and have flown with that SODA ever since.
If you are indeed unable to see the difference in white/red/green, it
only keeps you limited to daytime flying, and not into controlled
fields that require light signals for no radio. Not a big deal.
Good luck
Ol Shy & Bashful
50+ years of flying 22,000+ hours

[[email protected]]

Kathy > wrote:
> What do you advise for a color-blind pilot wannabe? How likely is it for
> someone who's color-blind to get a SODA?

Very likely... I have one.
I had to take a "Demonstrated Test of Ability"... by taxiing out to
the end of the runway with an FAA Inspector, who had the tower shine
random nights at me... The aviation colors are so pure that I can
tell them apart. If you can tell them apart, you can identify them.
You don't have to be able to "see" the colors as the same color
they are shining... only be able to identify it as "color so and so".

:-)


Best regards,

Jer/ "Flight instruction and mountain flying are my vocation!" Eberhard

--
Jer/ (Slash) Eberhard, Mountain Flying Aviation, LTD, Ft Collins, CO
CELL 970 231-6325 EMAIL jer'at'frii.com WEB http://users.frii.com/jer/
C-206 N9513G, CFII Airplane&Glider, FAA-DEN Aviation Safety Counselor
CAP-CO Mission&Aircraft CheckPilot, BM218 HAM N0FZD, 234 Young Eagles!

[Kathy]

"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" > wrote in message
. ..

> Just as a point of interest: I'm pushing 3000 hours now and I've never
> even seen a light signal. Have any of you?
>
> Heh heh... maybe I'm color blind after all <G>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Mortimer Schnerd, RN
>
>
>
I have. My instructor asked the tower to give me light signals during one of
my night training sessions. Although I'm the original poster, I'm not a bit
color-blind (a good friend is). But I couldn't tell the color of that light.
It looked kind of yellowish to me. "What color is that light, and what do
you do?" my instructor asked. "I'm guessing it's green and I'm cleared to
land," I told him, "but if I didn't know, I couldn't tell. Does it look
green to you?" He looked at it a minute and hmphed and said, "Springs Tower,
Warrior 369 - what color is that light, anyway?"

I heard some years later that the light guns are so old and faded and dusty
that this is not an uncommon problem for pilots who see color perfectly
well. But since then, I'm up to 600 hours and no more light signals since -
thank heaven.

Kathy

[Mark Klebanoff]

On Tue, 11 Oct 2005 10:27:39 UTC, Cub Driver >
wrote:

> On Mon, 10 Oct 2005 21:20:06 GMT, "Steph" >
> wrote:
>
> >I'm colour blind, and my license is endorsed "Daytime only, and functioning
> >radio in controlled airspace."
>
> Fascinating. What's with the radio requirement?
>
> And isn't all airspace controlled on the east coast?
>
> And what are you supposed to do if the radio conks?

Basically it means you cannot use light guns for clearance. I'm
colorblind and have been flying for 25 years. While not being able
to fly at night is a major hassle, in those 25 years I've never needed
light guns anyway. And if I ever did, I'd probably consider it a bona
fide emergency anyway.

[Cub Driver]

On Tue, 11 Oct 2005 09:09:52 -0700, Sylvain > wrote:

>or in controlled airspace

I fly in controlled airspace whenever I like. All it takes is an
endorsement. As for 10,000 feet, do you think that a 59-year-old Cub
can really get up there? The views are all down here, anyhow.


-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
the blog: www.danford.net
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN]

Cub Driver wrote:
> I fly in controlled airspace whenever I like. All it takes is an
> endorsement. As for 10,000 feet, do you think that a 59-year-old Cub
> can really get up there? The views are all down here, anyhow.



Find a nice cumulonimbus and not only will that Cub climb to 10,000', you'll get
a view you're not likely to forget.




--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

[[email protected]]

> Kathy
I have a wavier , try looking a the lights at night with a person that
is not color-blind , not in the day , after you can identify the light
colors call your fsdo & make app. with a examiner at night not in the
daylight good luck
JON.

[[email protected]]

Kathy wrote:
> What do you advise for a color-blind pilot wannabe? How likely is it for
> someone who's color-blind to get a SODA?
>
> Kathy
I have a wavier , try looking a the lights at night with a person that
is not color-blind , not in the day , after you can identify the light
colors call your fsdo & make app. with a examiner at night not in the
daylight good luck
JON.