L33 Solo

[Jeff Runciman]

Hi Fellow Pilots,

My name is Jeff Runciman and I am a new sailplane pilot.
I probably have a couple of more hours left before
I get my licence. I currently have 135 hours powered,
35 hours ultralite, and about 450 hours of hang gliding
time. I am current in all except the ultralight. I
am looking at purchasing an L33 Solo. I am looking
for advise good and bad about the glider. I am also
looking for input on a first glider. I have about 24,000
to spend but need a trailer and one/two man rigging
gear. I don't need big time glide or performance but
would like a decent glide polar.

Any help would be apprciated.

Jeff

[BTIZ]

What you left out is.. what have you been taking your lessons in.. A SGS
233? or Grob 103 or ASK 21? If you've been taking lessons in a SGS 2-33 I
would recommend a few flights in a Grob or ASK before climbing into the L33.
The Grob or ASK is heavier than the L-33, but the "look angle" etc is more
realistic to the L-33 vs the SGS.

It is a nice "first glider", I have not heard anything good or bad about the
glider, I have heard that you need to watch the fuselage tailboom, don't
drop it or wrinkle it, a ground look could cause a wrinkle and that would
detract from it's strength and integrity.

Enjoy, BT

"Jeff Runciman" > wrote in message
...
> Hi Fellow Pilots,
>
> My name is Jeff Runciman and I am a new sailplane pilot.
> I probably have a couple of more hours left before
> I get my licence. I currently have 135 hours powered,
> 35 hours ultralite, and about 450 hours of hang gliding
> time. I am current in all except the ultralight. I
> am looking at purchasing an L33 Solo. I am looking
> for advise good and bad about the glider. I am also
> looking for input on a first glider. I have about 24,000
> to spend but need a trailer and one/two man rigging
> gear. I don't need big time glide or performance but
> would like a decent glide polar.
>
> Any help would be apprciated.
>
> Jeff
>
>
>
>

[Jeff Runciman]

The training has been in a 2-22. I will be flying
a few different aircraft before flying the L-33. If
there is another aircraft that might be better?

Jeff


At 02:48 14 November 2005, Btiz wrote:
>What you left out is.. what have you been taking your
>lessons in.. A SGS
>233? or Grob 103 or ASK 21? If you've been taking lessons
>in a SGS 2-33 I
>would recommend a few flights in a Grob or ASK before
>climbing into the L33.
>The Grob or ASK is heavier than the L-33, but the 'look
>angle' etc is more
>realistic to the L-33 vs the SGS.
>
>It is a nice 'first glider', I have not heard anything
>good or bad about the
>glider, I have heard that you need to watch the fuselage
>tailboom, don't
>drop it or wrinkle it, a ground look could cause a
>wrinkle and that would
>detract from it's strength and integrity.
>
>Enjoy, BT
>
>'Jeff Runciman' wrote in message
...
>> Hi Fellow Pilots,
>>
>> My name is Jeff Runciman and I am a new sailplane
>>pilot.
>> I probably have a couple of more hours left before
>> I get my licence. I currently have 135 hours powered,
>> 35 hours ultralite, and about 450 hours of hang gliding
>> time. I am current in all except the ultralight. I
>> am looking at purchasing an L33 Solo. I am looking
>> for advise good and bad about the glider. I am also
>> looking for input on a first glider. I have about
>>24,000
>> to spend but need a trailer and one/two man rigging
>> gear. I don't need big time glide or performance but
>> would like a decent glide polar.
>>
>> Any help would be apprciated.
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>

[Greg Arnold]

There are a lot of used glass ships in the mid-$20's, all with
performance significantly better than the L33. Take a look at the Wings
& Wheels want ads.


Jeff Runciman wrote:
> The training has been in a 2-22. I will be flying
> a few different aircraft before flying the L-33. If
> there is another aircraft that might be better?
>
> Jeff
>
>
> At 02:48 14 November 2005, Btiz wrote:
>> What you left out is.. what have you been taking your
>> lessons in.. A SGS
>> 233? or Grob 103 or ASK 21? If you've been taking lessons
>> in a SGS 2-33 I
>> would recommend a few flights in a Grob or ASK before
>> climbing into the L33.
>> The Grob or ASK is heavier than the L-33, but the 'look
>> angle' etc is more
>> realistic to the L-33 vs the SGS.
>>
>> It is a nice 'first glider', I have not heard anything
>> good or bad about the
>> glider, I have heard that you need to watch the fuselage
>> tailboom, don't
>> drop it or wrinkle it, a ground look could cause a
>> wrinkle and that would
>> detract from it's strength and integrity.
>>
>> Enjoy, BT
>>
>> 'Jeff Runciman' wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Hi Fellow Pilots,
>>>
>>> My name is Jeff Runciman and I am a new sailplane
>>> pilot.
>>> I probably have a couple of more hours left before
>>> I get my licence. I currently have 135 hours powered,
>>> 35 hours ultralite, and about 450 hours of hang gliding
>>> time. I am current in all except the ultralight. I
>>> am looking at purchasing an L33 Solo. I am looking
>>> for advise good and bad about the glider. I am also
>>> looking for input on a first glider. I have about
>>> 24,000
>>> to spend but need a trailer and one/two man rigging
>>> gear. I don't need big time glide or performance but
>>> would like a decent glide polar.
>>>
>>> Any help would be apprciated.
>>>
>>> Jeff
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>

[Matthieu]

I totally agree with Greg. An ASW 19 at 25k would be perfect. Sexier,
faster, sharper, almost 38:1 and some say safer and easier than the 33.
An ASW 15 or a Grob 102 would be nice too. If your budget is 25k you
could also share a Discuss with another pilot.

I am in the same situation. I was considering an LP49 between 5 and 7k
Canadian but it looks like it is not for sale anymore.

I am now considering an ASW 19. I just need it to actually be
available. I would share it with another person.

You should try to find a ship that you'll be able to fly 100+ hours a
year for the next 3 to 5 years. I feel the 33 is great but that is not
a machine that will keep you busy and learning for 5 years. You could
be tempted to upgrade after 1 year. I have heard it is very fun to fly
though.

[Gary Boggs]

You are very smart to not just buy the ship with the most performance as
Greg suggests as your first ship! The L-33 is a very good first ship. I
think a slow progression into high performance is a wise move. The amount
of fun you have has nothing to do with L/D! I think every glider pilot
should fly a 1-26 or something similar every year just to remember how much
fun a simple maneuverable ship is.


"Greg Arnold" > wrote in message
news:vdUdf.78$yp6.21@fed1read07...
> There are a lot of used glass ships in the mid-$20's, all with performance
> significantly better than the L33. Take a look at the Wings & Wheels want
> ads.
>
>
> Jeff Runciman wrote:
>> The training has been in a 2-22. I will be flying
>> a few different aircraft before flying the L-33. If
>> there is another aircraft that might be better?
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>>
>> At 02:48 14 November 2005, Btiz wrote:
>>> What you left out is.. what have you been taking your
>>> lessons in.. A SGS 233? or Grob 103 or ASK 21? If you've been taking
>>> lessons
>>> in a SGS 2-33 I would recommend a few flights in a Grob or ASK before
>>> climbing into the L33. The Grob or ASK is heavier than the L-33, but the
>>> 'look
>>> angle' etc is more realistic to the L-33 vs the SGS.
>>>
>>> It is a nice 'first glider', I have not heard anything
>>> good or bad about the glider, I have heard that you need to watch the
>>> fuselage
>>> tailboom, don't drop it or wrinkle it, a ground look could cause a
>>> wrinkle and that would detract from it's strength and integrity.
>>>
>>> Enjoy, BT
>>>
>>> 'Jeff Runciman' wrote in message ...
>>>> Hi Fellow Pilots,
>>>>
>>>> My name is Jeff Runciman and I am a new sailplane
>>>> pilot.
>>>> I probably have a couple of more hours left before
>>>> I get my licence. I currently have 135 hours powered,
>>>> 35 hours ultralite, and about 450 hours of hang gliding
>>>> time. I am current in all except the ultralight. I
>>>> am looking at purchasing an L33 Solo. I am looking
>>>> for advise good and bad about the glider. I am also
>>>> looking for input on a first glider. I have about
>>>> 24,000
>>>> to spend but need a trailer and one/two man rigging
>>>> gear. I don't need big time glide or performance but
>>>> would like a decent glide polar.
>>>>
>>>> Any help would be apprciated.
>>>>
>>>> Jeff
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>

[Matthieu]

I agree with you for the 1-26 because it is a sexy machine. But I have
heard several times that the L33 is not any easier or safer than a Grob
102. You are right though; I was also told that the L33 is more fun
than the 102.

We are not telling Jeff to buy a Jantar; just a 102 or an ASW 15.

If I was going for an older ship I would buy a KA6E.

In the UK it is not exceptional to go solo on the ASW 19. But they
don't learn on a 2-33 there ;-)

[Soar Stanton MN]

Jeff -

We have two L-33s at our gliderport, and they are loved by their owners, and
easy to fly. Solid ship all the way around and well supported by the
factory. Most remark that it is the quietest ship they have ever flown, and
comfortable.

One of these is available to rent so if you can wait till spring you can fly
it and see if you like the L-33. Don't be in a big hurry, there are always
gliders for sale.

Tom Rent
Stanton Airfield
Stanton, MN
www.soarmn.com/stanton/

[[email protected]]

Buy as much performance as you can afford. How about a Mosquito?
Easy to fly. Excellent stability. All automatic hookups. Very large range
of L/D. Will beat the pants off an L-33. $24000 is easily in the
Mosquito ballpark. My son has flown the Mosquito with a lot less
time than you have.
In my opinion - what to look for and priority
handling characteristics - 1
all automatic control hookups - 1
performance - 2
weight - 3
size - 3
condition - ? - that depends greatly on one's personality

The rest you can work the problem yourself, like one-man riggers
and good trailer fittings.

Jeff Runciman wrote in message >...
>The training has been in a 2-22. I will be flying
>a few different aircraft before flying the L-33. If
>there is another aircraft that might be better?
>
>Jeff
>
>

[Martin Gregorie]

Matthieu wrote:
>
> In the UK it is not exceptional to go solo on the ASW 19. But they
> don't learn on a 2-33 there ;-)
>
It is in my club (Cambridge). We train in all glass (Puchacz, G104,
ASK-21) and, after 5 initial solos and checks, transition to the Junior.
Its a nearly perfect early post-solo glider.

After 30 hours on the Junior we can migrate to a Pegasus or Discus.

I spent a happy year flying Juniors up to Silver C standard and then
moved to the Pegasus. If you're prepared to consider an ASW-19 you
should also look at a Pegasus 101 or 90. The 90 is later than the 101
and has self-connecting controls.


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. |
org | Zappa fan & glider pilot

[[email protected]]

I assume if you are looking for a good recreational glider that you
will not fly very often then the L-33 would be a good choice. I think
thats the reason my club (BRSS) got L-33s, because they are low
maintenance, very easy to fly, acceptable performance, and the metal
design lasts forever while taking a good beating.
One problem with purchasing any new plane is insurance coverage. For
me to fly a Mosquito I need 75hrs glider time before I can get insured
(for one company). Since you are low time as well you may have to deal
with the same obstacle, but they may take your other flight experience
into account.

Jeff Runciman wrote:
> Hi Fellow Pilots,
>
> My name is Jeff Runciman and I am a new sailplane pilot.
> I probably have a couple of more hours left before
> I get my licence. I currently have 135 hours powered,
> 35 hours ultralite, and about 450 hours of hang gliding
> time. I am current in all except the ultralight. I
> am looking at purchasing an L33 Solo. I am looking
> for advise good and bad about the glider. I am also
> looking for input on a first glider. I have about 24,000
> to spend but need a trailer and one/two man rigging
> gear. I don't need big time glide or performance but
> would like a decent glide polar.
>
> Any help would be apprciated.
>
> Jeff

[Jeff Runciman]

Thanks for all of the advise. The message I seem to
be getting is that I may grow out of the L33 fairly
quickly. I plan on competing fairly quickly as I have
found that this improves my skill more than just flying
around. Maybe the ASW 15/19 may be better. Anyone
got one for sale?:) I was hoping to stay newer than
1984. Maybe I can afford to spend a bit more.

Jeff