PZL compass repair

[5Z]

I have a PZL K-13 compass that's leaking. Here's a photo of the
compass:
http://www.soarbfss.org/scgi-bin/gallery2/v/Flying_0/acc.jpg.html

This summer, I had the canopy of my ASH-26E open and it focused the sun
onto the compass and melted a hole in the front. Luckily it was in the
black painted area of the plastic, so I repaired it with some epoxy and
then repainted it. I then fully filled it with compass fluid using the
fill hole on the back.

Unfortunately, it now leaks around the circular "base" of where the the
plastic "bubble" is attached to the back. Maybe there's an O-ring seal
in there?

The back has two holes that I assume are for a spanner wrench and the
ring attaching the plastic part to the base also has some notches that
I suppose are for a special wrench as well.
I've put a pair of "c clip" pliers in the holes on the back and tried
to unscrew the outer ring by hand but it's too tight and I'm afraid to
put too much pressure on it.

Any suggestions either how to take it apart or where in the USA to send
it?

Thanks

-Tom

[[email protected]]

Hi Tom - I've had a number of these compasses, and every one
leaked like this after a few years. Even without burning a hole
in the top ;-) These are great when they work but I've been
thinking of switching to the big old Airpaths...

Anybody out there got advice on this ?

Thanks !
Best Regards, Dave

5Z wrote:
> I have a PZL K-13 compass that's leaking. Here's a photo of the
> compass:
> http://www.soarbfss.org/scgi-bin/gallery2/v/Flying_0/acc.jpg.html
>
> This summer, I had the canopy of my ASH-26E open and it focused the sun
> onto the compass and melted a hole in the front. Luckily it was in the
> black painted area of the plastic, so I repaired it with some epoxy and
> then repainted it. I then fully filled it with compass fluid using the
> fill hole on the back.
>
> Unfortunately, it now leaks around the circular "base" of where the the
> plastic "bubble" is attached to the back. Maybe there's an O-ring seal
> in there?
>
> The back has two holes that I assume are for a spanner wrench and the
> ring attaching the plastic part to the base also has some notches that
> I suppose are for a special wrench as well.
> I've put a pair of "c clip" pliers in the holes on the back and tried
> to unscrew the outer ring by hand but it's too tight and I'm afraid to
> put too much pressure on it.
>
> Any suggestions either how to take it apart or where in the USA to send
> it?
>
> Thanks
>
> -Tom

[jphoenix]

Fellas,

I highly recommend a Hamilton vertical card compass, easily swung and
never a leak. I also like the planform display. I've given up on the
old style compass, always leaking and not legal to fix or refill
yourself. They're pricey, but once you buy it, you're done messing with
compasses.

Anubody ever had problems with a Hamilton?

Jim

www.jimphoenix.com

[Mitch Deutsch]

Yes, it wouldn't rotate more than about 120 degrees. Bought a new Airpath,
used solely as a backup should the GPS and moving map fail

Mitch Deutsch.


"jphoenix" > wrote in message
oups.com...

snip>
> Anubody ever had problems with a Hamilton?
>
> Jim
>
> www.jimphoenix.com
>

[JS]

5Z wrote:
> I have a PZL K-13 compass that's leaking. Here's a photo of the
> compass:
> http://www.soarbfss.org/scgi-bin/gallery2/v/Flying_0/acc.jpg.html
>

Hello Tom:
I had the leak problem, bought a new one from Tim or Rex or
someone.... Hope not to annoy people with a "plug".
Anyone who has seen your panel would know the vertical card won't
fit...
But at least it wouldn't hide the towplane!
Jim

[Tony Verhulst]

> Anubody ever had problems with a Hamilton?

A number of reports where the needle stuck and you have to tap the
instruments to free it. I have an Airpath 2300 but can't tell you the
last time I actually looked at it.

Tony V.

[[email protected]]

Hi Jim - I have had a Hamilton and replaced it with a PZL.
The Hamilton is, because of its design, very sensitive to
pitch attitude, and consequently quite inaccurate. This is
especially true at higher lattitudes with steeper dip. The
problem is that mechanically the sensing element can't
really stay level.

Pick a point on the horizon heading East or West. Note
the exact compass reading at 45 knots. Now stabilize the
airspeed at 110 knots and see what the compass reads.

It does look nice though !
Best Regards, Dave

[jphoenix]

Dave,

That's interesting, I'll give it a try. I'm at a higher latitude and I
do like to have a working compass just in case the un-thinkable happens
someday. Might have to put one of my old, leaky whiskey units back in.
:-(

Jim

[Paul Remde]

Hi,

I think PZL still produces instruments. There web site is here:
http://www.pzl.com.pl/en/produkty/osprzet_lotniczy/przyrzady_nawigacyjne.html
or
http://www.pzl.com.pl/

I sell the Airpath fluid filled compasses (extremely popular in all
aircraft) and the PAI-700 vertical card compasses. I had one customer that
said he loves the PAI-700 and would never use anything else in his gliders.
The display is very intuitive - much easier to read at a glance than the
Airpath compasses.

http://www.soarmn.com/cumulus/compasses.htm

Good Soaring,

Paul Remde
Cumulus Soaring, Inc.
http://www.cumulus-soaring.com

"5Z" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>I have a PZL K-13 compass that's leaking. Here's a photo of the
> compass:
> http://www.soarbfss.org/scgi-bin/gallery2/v/Flying_0/acc.jpg.html
>
> This summer, I had the canopy of my ASH-26E open and it focused the sun
> onto the compass and melted a hole in the front. Luckily it was in the
> black painted area of the plastic, so I repaired it with some epoxy and
> then repainted it. I then fully filled it with compass fluid using the
> fill hole on the back.
>
> Unfortunately, it now leaks around the circular "base" of where the the
> plastic "bubble" is attached to the back. Maybe there's an O-ring seal
> in there?
>
> The back has two holes that I assume are for a spanner wrench and the
> ring attaching the plastic part to the base also has some notches that
> I suppose are for a special wrench as well.
> I've put a pair of "c clip" pliers in the holes on the back and tried
> to unscrew the outer ring by hand but it's too tight and I'm afraid to
> put too much pressure on it.
>
> Any suggestions either how to take it apart or where in the USA to send
> it?
>
> Thanks
>
> -Tom
>

[Rex]

Hi,
I normally do not post about my instrument sales business, however, it
seems I am the only supplier that has continued to stock the PZL K13a
compass. The company that distributes this compass changed hands 2
years ago and the prices have been adjusted significantly. $389.00.
This makes it the most expensive whisley compass on the market but it
also has some unique features... size, mounting options, and quality.

I have found that most of the leaking issues are due to burning a hole
in it, or over tightening the mounting ring which causes a stress riser
as the compass body expands when heated. If you have a PZL compass
installed, you may want to check the tension on the band. Shoud just
be snugged to hold it from slipping.

The vertical card compasses are very sensitive to binding caused by
mounting with a stress load. Many glider instrument panels are very
thin with only 2-3 layers of light carbon cloth. When populated with a
full complement of instruments, each instrument becomes a structural
component. If the vertical card compass is one of these, there may be
a chance that it will become disformed slightly especially with changes
in temp thus it will hang up. It is easier to read when it is stuck!!

Rex
Williams Soaring Center

[Hans Disma]

Hi Tom,

I can get you one for $ 200,00

Hans Disma



"5Z" > schreef in bericht
oups.com...
>I have a PZL K-13 compass that's leaking. Here's a photo of the
> compass:
> http://www.soarbfss.org/scgi-bin/gallery2/v/Flying_0/acc.jpg.html
>
> This summer, I had the canopy of my ASH-26E open and it focused the sun
> onto the compass and melted a hole in the front. Luckily it was in the
> black painted area of the plastic, so I repaired it with some epoxy and
> then repainted it. I then fully filled it with compass fluid using the
> fill hole on the back.
>
> Unfortunately, it now leaks around the circular "base" of where the the
> plastic "bubble" is attached to the back. Maybe there's an O-ring seal
> in there?
>
> The back has two holes that I assume are for a spanner wrench and the
> ring attaching the plastic part to the base also has some notches that
> I suppose are for a special wrench as well.
> I've put a pair of "c clip" pliers in the holes on the back and tried
> to unscrew the outer ring by hand but it's too tight and I'm afraid to
> put too much pressure on it.
>
> Any suggestions either how to take it apart or where in the USA to send
> it?
>
> Thanks
>
> -Tom
>

[[email protected]]

With or without leaks ?

[5Z]

So, it appears this is a common problem, and one without a good
solution. Since the compass is useless to me as is, I plan to attempt
a repair before throwing in the towel and getting a new one....

Plan is to drain it and keep it in a "warm" place such as the dash of
my car for a few days to let all the oil evaporate. Then I'll take a
moto-tool and clean up an area around the circumferance of the leak to
accept an epoxy fillet. Before applying the epoxy, I'll put some thin
super glue in the crack to seal any small cracks (and ensure it can
never be disassembeld :).

Will report the results in a few weeks.

[bumper]

Problem with epoxy, though it bonds to many surfaces, is it tends to cure
relatively brittle and would probably have a different thermal coefficient
of expansion than the plastic you are bonding.

Consider using an adhesive such as Loctite Depend 330. 330 is an almost
instant boding two part adhesive (primer and gel) that, besides bonding to
many material types, retains more flexibility than epoxy and thus won't be
as likely to crack during thermal cycling. It's available from McMaster-Carr
on-line. Recommend the small size as it has a shelf-life of about 2 years or
so.

As and aside, 330 is excellent for such applications as bonding metal
directly to FRP. Good adhesive to have in one's tool cabinet (g).

bumper

"5Z" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> So, it appears this is a common problem, and one without a good
> solution. Since the compass is useless to me as is, I plan to attempt
> a repair before throwing in the towel and getting a new one....
>
> Plan is to drain it and keep it in a "warm" place such as the dash of
> my car for a few days to let all the oil evaporate. Then I'll take a
> moto-tool and clean up an area around the circumferance of the leak to
> accept an epoxy fillet. Before applying the epoxy, I'll put some thin
> super glue in the crack to seal any small cracks (and ensure it can
> never be disassembeld :).
>
> Will report the results in a few weeks.
>

[5Z]

bumper wrote:
> Consider using an adhesive such as Loctite Depend 330. 330 is an almost
> instant boding two part adhesive (primer and gel) that, besides bonding to
> many material types, retains more flexibility than epoxy and thus won't be
> as likely to crack during thermal cycling. It's available from McMaster-Carr
> on-line. Recommend the small size as it has a shelf-life of about 2 years or
> so.

Thanks! I'll do that.

-Tom

[[email protected]]

Another option with the PZL K13a compass is to mount it directly to the
face of the instrument panel, without using the supplied mounting ring.
I used this approach due to limited panel space in my LS6, and not
wanting to lose any forward visibility by mounting on top of the panel
(LS6 forward vis is bad enough as is!).

Turns out that there are two small screws that hold the SN plate to the
back of the compass. After removing the compass from the mounting
ring, I use these screw holes to mount the compass directly to the
front of the panel, using slightly longer screws and a small backing
plate.

Doesn't take much space, keeps compass out of the sun, hasn't leaked in
over 2 years.

I never used a compass while soaring in AZ, but now in southern
Illinois I find it useful - due to the really bad vis we have on
occasions!

Pictures available on request...

Kirk
66

[Eric Greenwell]

bumper wrote:

> Consider using an adhesive such as Loctite Depend 330.

Hmmm, sounds like a product for really incontinent adults, but I'll
order some anyway. If it doesn't work for Tom, I suggest he cruise the
local auto parts store, which usually features a dozen varieties of
compasses. The "PZL style" (compass ball floating in a clear sphere) I
have in my ASH 26 E has worked well for 10 years, looks decent, and cost
$4.95.

This might not be an option for a standard registration, but nobody has
complained about it in my Experimentally registered glider. There are no
adjustments on it, but mounted well forward on the cowling, it doesn't
need any. Some units do have the adjustments, so be prepared to spend an
extra $2.

--
Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

Eric Greenwell
Washington State
USA