plane to carry bikes?

[AINut]

What would you guys recommend to carry 4 or 5 GoldWings and their
riders? Doesn't need to be able to cross an ocean 8-). It needs to be
one that mere mortals can afford, so 747's and C5's are out.

Thanks,
David M.

[baltobernie]

"karel" > wrote in message
...
>
> "AINut" > schreef in bericht
> ...
>> What would you guys recommend to carry 4 or 5 GoldWings and their riders?
>> Doesn't need to be able to cross an ocean 8-). It needs to be one that
>> mere mortals can afford, so 747's and C5's are out.
>
> Are you claiming you're a mere mortal
> & can afford several goldwings?
>
> Apart counting $, let's count weight.
> A GoldWing weighs in at some 400lbs, I should guess?


.... more like 800 lbs. each ...

Bernie
(that boxcar in next post isn't even halfway; how about a hushed
three-holer, ex-UPS or so?)



> Generally two people on top, another 300 lbs?
> So 4-5 times 700lbs = +/- 3000 lbs payload
> plus fuel plus luggage plus whatever...?
>
> If you're not in the US of A, an An-2 might come near, though not close
> at least if you can manage to board the GoldWing things
> Next close might be a DHC6 TwinOtter
> But I cannot imagine any homebuilt in that weight range,
> so in this NG I can't see much of a useable answer.
>
> Consider a DC-3, perhaps?
> But that's closer to a HD than to a goldwing, i'm afraid.
>

[JKimmel]

AINut wrote:
> What would you guys recommend to carry 4 or 5 GoldWings and their
> riders? Doesn't need to be able to cross an ocean 8-). It needs to be
> one that mere mortals can afford, so 747's and C5's are out.
>
> Thanks,
> David M.

A trailer.

--
J Kimmel

www.metalinnovations.com

"Cuius testiculos habes, habeas cardia et cerebellum." - When you have
their full attention in your grip, their hearts and minds will follow.

[Montblack]

("karel" wrote)
> Apart counting $, let's count weight.
> A GoldWing weighs in at some 400lbs, I should guess?
> Generally two people on top, another 300 lbs?
> So 4-5 times 700lbs = +/- 3000 lbs payload
> plus fuel plus luggage plus whatever...?


My (1981) 2 cylinder Yamahopper 650 Special II weighed 450 lbs. New Gold
Wings are 1,832cc behemoths.

Gold Wing = 800+ lbs.
GW Riders = 400 lbs per couple (approx).

1,200 lbs x 5 = 6,000 lbs

DC-3

http://www.baslerturbo.com/specifications.html
Basler Turbo Conversions BT-67
Between 3 and 4 miles per minute @ 100 to 150 gallons per hour


Montblack

[Smitty Two]

In article >,
AINut > wrote:

> What would you guys recommend to carry 4 or 5 GoldWings and their
> riders? Doesn't need to be able to cross an ocean 8-). It needs to be
> one that mere mortals can afford, so 747's and C5's are out.
>
> Thanks,
> David M.

Why not put some retractable wings on those puppies, and a drive wheel
that morphs into a pusher prop? A few concept sketches, some mythical
performance figures, and a website ought to start the investor money
pouring in.

[Darrel Toepfer]

Richard Riley wrote:

> If you could find a good radial powered 123, it could be a match. The
> one they used in "Air America" was for sale a while back.

Well I guess, it was tore up someth'n aweful during the movie... ;-)

> Or there's this...
>
> http://avbooking.com/showad.php?adc=04325a3EPJK

There used to be one forsale south of Alexandria, La...

[[email protected]]

AINut wrote:
> What would you guys recommend to carry 4 or 5 GoldWings and their
> riders? Doesn't need to be able to cross an ocean 8-). It needs to be
> one that mere mortals can afford, so 747's and C5's are out.
>

You're looking for a Shorts Skyvan. It's not overkill (small twin
turboprop) and the back end is a ramp to make loading and unloading
your goldwings easier.

So what if it looks like a shoebox with wings on it.

http://www2s.biglobe.ne.jp/~ito-nori/skyvan.html

John Galban=====>N4BQ (PA28-180)

[Capt.Doug]

>"AINut" wrote in message
> What would you guys recommend to carry 4 or 5 GoldWings and their
> riders? Doesn't need to be able to cross an ocean 8-). It needs to be
> one that mere mortals can afford, so 747's and C5's are out.

The older unpressurized turboprops would work. The Casa 212 and the Shorts
SC-7 Skyvan both have ramps in the back for drive-on convenience. Both can
be had for well under
1 $MilUS.

D.

[UltraJohn]

Darrel Toepfer wrote:

> Richard Riley wrote:
>
>> If you could find a good radial powered 123, it could be a match. The
>> one they used in "Air America" was for sale a while back.
>
> Well I guess, it was tore up someth'n aweful during the movie... ;-)
>
>> Or there's this...
>>
>> http://avbooking.com/showad.php?adc=04325a3EPJK
>
> There used to be one forsale south of Alexandria, La...
Not much left south of Alexandria after this past hurricane season.
John

[Darrel Toepfer]

UltraJohn wrote:

>> There used to be one forsale south of Alexandria, La...
> Not much left south of Alexandria after this past hurricane season.

Not up on geography huh? I'm 70 miles south, didn't get anything from
Katrina, got some wind and rain from Rita, not as many tornados as Lili
of years past, higher sustained duration winds though. I lost fence and
roof to Lili, lost only trees to Rita. Leaving next week to survey the
damage recovery from Wilma in Cozumel...

[AINut]

Already have the trailer.

David M.


JKimmel wrote:

> AINut wrote:
>
>> What would you guys recommend to carry 4 or 5 GoldWings and their
>> riders? Doesn't need to be able to cross an ocean 8-). It needs to
>> be one that mere mortals can afford, so 747's and C5's are out.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> David M.
>
>
> A trailer.
>

[Morgans]

"AINut" > wrote in message
...
> Already have the trailer.

Put wings on it and call it a glider?
--
Jim in NC

[UltraJohn]

Darrel Toepfer wrote:

> UltraJohn wrote:
>
>>> There used to be one forsale south of Alexandria, La...
>> Not much left south of Alexandria after this past hurricane season.
>
> Not up on geography huh? I'm 70 miles south, didn't get anything from
> Katrina, got some wind and rain from Rita, not as many tornados as Lili
> of years past, higher sustained duration winds though. I lost fence and
> roof to Lili, lost only trees to Rita. Leaving next week to survey the
> damage recovery from Wilma in Cozumel...
You didn't say how far south originally! My brother is further south yet. He
lost everything, house and mobile home both, he lived on the coastal road
at the 8 mile mark from Texas, Johnson Bayou. Glad to hear you did ok!
John

[Darrel Toepfer]

UltraJohn wrote:

> You didn't say how far south originally! My brother is further south yet. He
> lost everything, house and mobile home both, he lived on the coastal road
> at the 8 mile mark from Texas, Johnson Bayou. Glad to hear you did ok!

Sorry to read that, thats west of us by 70 miles and ground zero for
where Rita came ashore. I fly due north (if Fort Polk approach lets me)
on trips to Pineville/Alexandria from 4R7...

What Emily left of the south coast road on Cozumel was finished off by
Wilma... Around 15km worth...

There was substantial damage not far from us (like trees through the
middle of the house) but our neighborhood faired pretty well, several
have new roofs, some are still waiting...

[AINut]

Morgans wrote:
> "AINut" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Already have the trailer.
>
>
> Put wings on it and call it a glider?

Don't have an engine big enough! And if I did, all the effective
payload would be used up with fuel <sigh>.

David M.

[AllThumbs]

Dean Wilson designed and built a twin engine amphib for two French
explorers. It used two Lycoming engines, and I think the tail end
swung open for loading. It was called the Explorer. It could hold an
Avid Flyer with the wings folded. He built a single engine version that
had room for a king size bed, I believe. Look for an article in Sport
Aviation.
It was built with tubing and fabric covered.
All Thumbs

[AllThumbs]

Here's a link I found on Ron Wanttaja's page of links
http://www.coastcomp.com/av/fltline2/avion.htm

[UltraJohn]

AllThumbs wrote:

> Here's a link I found on Ron Wanttaja's page of links
> http://www.coastcomp.com/av/fltline2/avion.htm
Full fuel leaves room for 2000lbs or two of your GoldWings and their
riders(at least if one of the riders can fly the plane) so I guess you'll
need two of these!
John

[Flyingmonk]

That's what I was about to say. Even the pocketrockets are trying to
stay close to lower 400# or higher 300#.

[Flyingmonk]

Smitty Two:
>A few concept sketches, some mythical performance figures, and a website ought to start the investor money pouring in.

LOL, I have been pondering home business for a cuople of years now,
maybe I should go this route! LOL :^))

[Richard Lamb]

DC-3,of course.
Go in style, David!

Richard

AINut wrote:

> What would you guys recommend to carry 4 or 5 GoldWings and their
> riders? Doesn't need to be able to cross an ocean 8-). It needs to be
> one that mere mortals can afford, so 747's and C5's are out.
>
> Thanks,
> David M.

[[email protected]]

We flew to San Juan, P.R. this last spring. As we were taxiing to the
terminal, I counted at least 30 DC-3's at various places on the ramps.
Most of them looked to be actively in service. Thought we had gone
through a time warp. . .

Rich S.

[Richard Lamb]

wrote:

> We flew to San Juan, P.R. this last spring. As we were taxiing to the
> terminal, I counted at least 30 DC-3's at various places on the ramps.
> Most of them looked to be actively in service. Thought we had gone
> through a time warp. . .
>
> Rich S.

How very strange, Rich
..
I went by Tradewinds (DC-3 yard in San Antonio) to see old man Ormand, and
was
surprised how much they have expanded
Literaly stacks of new shipping containers full of stuff.


Richard

[Rich S.]

"Richard Lamb" > wrote in message
...
>
> I went by Tradewinds (DC-3 yard in San Antonio) to see old man Ormand, and
> was
> surprised how much they have expanded
> Literaly stacks of new shipping containers full of stuff.

Mebbe Douglas opened a new plant?? Damn! Now if somebody will just start
cranking out '57 Chebby convertibles. . .

Rich S.

[Morgans]

"Rich S." > wrote
>
> Mebbe Douglas opened a new plant?? Damn! Now if somebody will just start
> cranking out '57 Chebby convertibles. . .

I wonder if someone was to invest in the tooling to put the DC-3 back into
production, how much demand there would be, and how much they would have to
charge per copy to break even?

Perhaps use a turboprop, but offer a radial, also.
--
Jim in NC

[Montblack]

("Morgans" wrote)
> I wonder if someone was to invest in the tooling to put the DC-3 back into
> production, how much demand there would be, and how much they would have
> to charge per copy to break even?
>
> Perhaps use a turboprop, but offer a radial, also.


That would be fun - CubCrafter DC-3.

Twin Diesels. 50 gallon per hour (total) fuel burn ...um, not sure who makes
such an engine <g>. 200 mph cruise. Clean up the plane a little - lighten it
up a little. Glass cockpit.

http://www.baslerturbo.com/
DC-3 Turbo conversions

http://www.baslerturbo.com/performance.html
Performance numbers

I'll be seeing someone tonight who was a stewardess for NWA on DC-3's. She
said there were some routes where they were up and down 10-12-15 times into
small airports per flight. The procedure for flight attendants was to go
"up" to the front of the plane before each take-off and do their safety
talk. She said many times they did it from the rear door because they didn't
want to hump it "up" to the cockpit area for the umpteenth time, plus the
poor guy flying from Madison to Omaha had already heard it umpteen times.

http://www.goldenwingsmuseum.com/Aircraft%20Pages/Bushmaster.htm
Story under the pics. Bushmaster - no market. Two built.

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=29&article_id=10442
Dodge Challenge 'Spy' photo - maybe this idea will take off.

https://www.neodata.com/hfmus/cdri/
Picture of Dodge Challenge on the cover.


Montblack

[Rich S.]

"Montblack" > wrote in message
...
>
> I'll be seeing someone tonight who was a stewardess for NWA on DC-3's. She
> said there were some routes where they were up and down 10-12-15 times
> into small airports per flight. The procedure for flight attendants was to
> go "up" to the front of the plane before each take-off and do their safety
> talk. She said many times they did it from the rear door because they
> didn't want to hump it "up" to the cockpit area for the umpteenth time,
> plus the poor guy flying from Madison to Omaha had already heard it
> umpteen times.

My dad and I (10 years old) were weathered in at Medford, Oregon. Oh, we had
tried to get out in his Cessna 120, but after an hour of scud running were
fortunate enough to find Medford again and gratefully landed.

We were sitting in the combination FBO/terminal building office watching the
rain beat down on the tarmac outside the window. There was an inch or so of
water all across the ramp and the rain would make little geysers as it hit.
Overhead, the ceiling was all of 200' and drew a soggy line on the
surrounding hills.

Then we heard the pop-pop of a couple of radial engines coasting down to the
runway. A West Coast Airlines DC-3 appeared out of the clouds, seeming to
trail lines of gray as it split the center line of the runway. Taxiing up to
the terminal, the landing light highlighted the downpour. The pilot spun the
Douglas on one wheel as he hit the throttle on his side. The left engine
then spun to a stop and the "Airstair" door opened.

The copilot appeared at the opening as a ramp worker ran across to see what
had prompted the approach to minimums that day. The copilot, trying to stay
dry, kicked a crate of chickens out the door and swung it closed. The left
engine started up with a plume of blue smoke and no time was lost in taxiing
out and taking off to the North and a stop at Salem.

Iron men and aluminum airplanes. . .

Rich S.

[Jean-Paul Roy]

And here is the single engine version of the Explorer sold in Canada. A
flying motor home.
http://www.exploreraero.com/flashed.html

Hope this helps

Jean-Paul

"AllThumbs" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Here's a link I found on Ron Wanttaja's page of links
> http://www.coastcomp.com/av/fltline2/avion.htm
>

[AINut]

This one sounds really interesting! However, how would one get the
bikes in and out?

David M.



Jean-Paul Roy wrote:
> And here is the single engine version of the Explorer sold in Canada. A
> flying motor home.
> http://www.exploreraero.com/flashed.html
>
> Hope this helps
>
> Jean-Paul
>
> "AllThumbs" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>
>>Here's a link I found on Ron Wanttaja's page of links
>>http://www.coastcomp.com/av/fltline2/avion.htm
>>
>
>
>

[Richard Lamb]

This is rec.aviation.homebuilt, dude.

A two-seat half scale Short Skyvan with Rotax 912's and electric
props?
You won't have standing headroom, but the bike should fit easy.

Roll the bike up the aft ramp into the cargo bay

Weigh the weight and balance so that the cargo bay is on the
center of lift and a bike doesn't create CG problems.



..

[Richard Lamb]

Richard Riley wrote:

>
> The Shorts was the first suggestion (way upthread), but it's not big
> enough for his mission. He wants 5 Honda Gold Wings (800 lbs each)
> and their riders. I don't think anything short of a C-119 or a C-123
> is big enough.

Yeoch!!
FIVE Goldwings?

Boy was I off.
I was thinking of a bike and a babe....

[Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired]

AINut wrote:
> This one sounds really interesting! However, how would one get the
> bikes in and out?
>
> David M.
>
>
>
> Jean-Paul Roy wrote:
>
>> And here is the single engine version of the Explorer sold in Canada. A
>> flying motor home.
>> http://www.exploreraero.com/flashed.html
>>
>> Hope this helps
>>
>> Jean-Paul
>>
>> "AllThumbs" > wrote in message
>> oups.com...
>>
>>> Here's a link I found on Ron Wanttaja's page of links
>>> http://www.coastcomp.com/av/fltline2/avion.htm
>>>
>>
>>
>>
Hey, no need to get fancy. The question was about carrying bikes. No
one said anything about getting them out of the airplane.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

[kd5sak]

"Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired" > wrote in message
news:ilSwf.78578$sg5.22072@dukeread12...
> Hey, no need to get fancy. The question was about carrying bikes. No one
> said anything about getting them out of the airplane.
>
> Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

If there is access to a door the big cabin on that plane could probably
accomodate a folding aluminum ramp or something similar.

Harold
KD5SAK

[UltraJohn]

Richard Lamb wrote:

>
>
> Richard Riley wrote:
>
>>
>> The Shorts was the first suggestion (way upthread), but it's not big
>> enough for his mission. He wants 5 Honda Gold Wings (800 lbs each)
>> and their riders. I don't think anything short of a C-119 or a C-123
>> is big enough.
>
> Yeoch!!
> FIVE Goldwings?
>
> Boy was I off.
> I was thinking of a bike and a babe....
Heck with the bike I'll take the babe and the plane!
John

[Cy Galley]

I looked up the specs. It will carry over 5000 pounds! 5(800) and 5 (200)
riders should fit.

"Richard Lamb" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Richard Riley wrote:
>
>>
>> The Shorts was the first suggestion (way upthread), but it's not big
>> enough for his mission. He wants 5 Honda Gold Wings (800 lbs each)
>> and their riders. I don't think anything short of a C-119 or a C-123
>> is big enough.
>
> Yeoch!!
> FIVE Goldwings?
>
> Boy was I off.
> I was thinking of a bike and a babe....
>
>
>

[AINut]

No, 2-4 big bikes, but thanks.



Richard Riley wrote:
> On Tue, 10 Jan 2006 11:29:25 GMT, Richard Lamb
> > wrote:
>
> :This is rec.aviation.homebuilt, dude.
> :
> :A two-seat half scale Short Skyvan with Rotax 912's and electric
> :props?
> :You won't have standing headroom, but the bike should fit easy.
> :
> :Roll the bike up the aft ramp into the cargo bay
> :
> :Weigh the weight and balance so that the cargo bay is on the
> :center of lift and a bike doesn't create CG problems.
>
> The Shorts was the first suggestion (way upthread), but it's not big
> enough for his mission. He wants 5 Honda Gold Wings (800 lbs each)
> and their riders. I don't think anything short of a C-119 or a C-123
> is big enough.