Can deaf fly under sports pilot rule?

[[email protected]]

I am not deaf, but was wondering if the deaf can fly under the new
sports pilot rule. I know the sports pilot rule says that if you have a
"medical" condition that you know can affect your ability to fly, then
you are barred from flight. Now, does being deaf count as "medical" or
is that only restricted to medication?

[Jim Macklin]

If you don't fly in airspace that requires radio
communication, why not. It is likely that a sport pilot
test would be handled by the FSDO.



--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


> wrote in message
ups.com...
|I am not deaf, but was wondering if the deaf can fly under
the new
| sports pilot rule. I know the sports pilot rule says that
if you have a
| "medical" condition that you know can affect your ability
to fly, then
| you are barred from flight. Now, does being deaf count as
"medical" or
| is that only restricted to medication?
|

[Sylvain]

you might want to ask to the folks most likely to know:

http://www.deafpilots.com/

in particular, have a look at the questions (FAQ) section;

http://www.deafpilots.com/faq.html

--Sylvain

wrote:
> I am not deaf, but was wondering if the deaf can fly under the new
> sports pilot rule. I know the sports pilot rule says that if you have a
> "medical" condition that you know can affect your ability to fly, then
> you are barred from flight. Now, does being deaf count as "medical" or
> is that only restricted to medication?

[John T]

Yes indeed, the deaf can fly under sport pilot. Same restriction "not
valid where radio use is required" applies to SP as to other classes.

Theoritically (sp), a deaf person could become a sport pilot instructor.

John

[Jim Macklin]

A recent news item from the AOPA... a deaf pilot has been
certificated to fly IFR in controlled airspace. He is
required to have a speaking pilot along to do communications
and write the ATC clearances down for him. When data-link
is available, deaf pilots should be able to fly single IFR.



DEAF PILOT PASSES INSTRUMENT CHECKRIDE
Stephen Hopson, AOPA 3553985, on February 24 became the
first instrument-
rated deaf pilot. Hopson, 45, has logged more than 700 hours
and already
holds a commercial certificate with the standard restriction
for deaf
pilots: no flight operations where two-way radio
communications are required.
As many instrument students would attest, half the challenge
of IFR flight
centers around understanding air traffic control clearances.
But Hopson,
with American Winds Flight Academy instructor Jason Edwards,
worked out a
white-board system (using shorthand) allowing Edwards to
relay ATC
instructions to Hopson while they navigate the airways.
Following
negotiation and cooperation with the FAA, Hopson took his
checkride with
a designated examiner and now has an instrument rating that
allows him to
fly with a hearing pilot using the white-board system.
Hopson hopes to pave
the way for other deaf pilots to log pilot-in-command time
in the IFR
environment, and perhaps someday, if controller-pilot
communications
datalink (CPCDL) matures, a deaf pilot could solo in the
clouds.



--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"John T" > wrote in message
...
| Yes indeed, the deaf can fly under sport pilot. Same
restriction "not
| valid where radio use is required" applies to SP as to
other classes.
|
| Theoritically (sp), a deaf person could become a sport
pilot instructor.
|
| John
|

[[email protected]]

I have trained and signed off at least three pilots for a private pilot
certificate who were deaf. They did have restrictions via the medical
and even flew into controlled fields with a notice on their flight
plans for "NO RADIO" and got light signals. They simply asked someone
to open their flight plan when they took off, and closed it the same
way....via notes at the flight counter. Have had several other
"handicapped" pilots who worked around their difficulties and coped.
Two with eye problems...one eye each, one with only one hand, one with
one leg, etc.

[[email protected]]

that's interesting. How would you rate their overall flying abilities
compared to normal pilots?

[Sylvain]

wrote:

> compared to normal pilots?

what is a 'normal pilot'?

--Sylvain

[Cub Driver]

On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 01:21:17 -0800, Sylvain > wrote:

>> compared to normal pilots?
>
>what is a 'normal pilot'?

Well, say, compared to us one-eyed pilots :)


-- all the best, Dan Ford

email: usenet AT danford DOT net

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

[Jim Macklin]

There are no normal pilots, we are all exceptional.


"Sylvain" > wrote in message
t...
| wrote:
|
| > compared to normal pilots?
|
| what is a 'normal pilot'?
|
| --Sylvain

[Allen]

"Jim Macklin" > wrote in message
news:AAcSf.117626$QW2.38119@dukeread08...
> There are no normal pilots, we are all exceptional.
>

Everybody stand and give Jim a high-five! Thank you Jim.

allen

[Jim Macklin]

Thank you.


"Allen" > wrote in message
...
|
| "Jim Macklin" > wrote
in message
| news:AAcSf.117626$QW2.38119@dukeread08...
| > There are no normal pilots, we are all exceptional.
| >
|
| Everybody stand and give Jim a high-five! Thank you Jim.
|
| allen
|
|

[John T]

See if your local library has "Flight of the Gin Fiz" by Henry Kisor.
Henry is a deaf pilot and his book recounts how he learned to fly then
retraced the route of Cal Rodgers, who was the first person to fly
across the U.S., in 1911.
Cal was also deaf.

[Sail-n-Dive]

How can a deaf pilot be aware of radio traffic? I'm a skydiver and have
experienced a plane flying thru a group of decending jumpers both while in
freefall and under canopy. This should not happen if the pilot was
listening to the radio and knew where they were! The jump plane is required
to get permission and to give a warning over the radio before jumpers exit
the aircraft. How does a deaf pilot become aware of these and other
important messages coming over the radio?

"John T" > wrote in message
...
> See if your local library has "Flight of the Gin Fiz" by Henry Kisor.
> Henry is a deaf pilot and his book recounts how he learned to fly then
> retraced the route of Cal Rodgers, who was the first person to fly across
> the U.S., in 1911.
> Cal was also deaf.
>

[Dave Stadt]

"Sail-n-Dive" > wrote in message
...
> How can a deaf pilot be aware of radio traffic? I'm a skydiver and have
> experienced a plane flying thru a group of decending jumpers both while
> in freefall and under canopy. This should not happen if the pilot was
> listening to the radio and knew where they were! The jump plane is
> required to get permission and to give a warning over the radio before
> jumpers exit the aircraft. How does a deaf pilot become aware of these
> and other important messages coming over the radio?

The same way a Cub, Champ and all the other planes without radios do. There
are tens of thousands of airplanes without radios. In a metro area there
could be many in the jump area not listening on the frequency the jump plane
is using. There is no legal requirement to listen to the jump plane
broadcasts. There is a requirement to see and avoid.


>
> "John T" > wrote in message
> ...
>> See if your local library has "Flight of the Gin Fiz" by Henry Kisor.
>> Henry is a deaf pilot and his book recounts how he learned to fly then
>> retraced the route of Cal Rodgers, who was the first person to fly across
>> the U.S., in 1911.
>> Cal was also deaf.
>>
>
>

[Gig 601XL Builder]

You do know there is no requirement to have a radio in a plane in most US
airspace.



"Sail-n-Dive" > wrote in message
...
> How can a deaf pilot be aware of radio traffic? I'm a skydiver and have
> experienced a plane flying thru a group of decending jumpers both while
> in freefall and under canopy. This should not happen if the pilot was
> listening to the radio and knew where they were! The jump plane is
> required to get permission and to give a warning over the radio before
> jumpers exit the aircraft. How does a deaf pilot become aware of these
> and other important messages coming over the radio?
>
> "John T" > wrote in message
> ...
>> See if your local library has "Flight of the Gin Fiz" by Henry Kisor.
>> Henry is a deaf pilot and his book recounts how he learned to fly then
>> retraced the route of Cal Rodgers, who was the first person to fly across
>> the U.S., in 1911.
>> Cal was also deaf.
>>
>
>

[Brien K. Meehan]

Sail-n-Dive wrote:
> How can a deaf pilot be aware of radio traffic? I'm a skydiver and have
> experienced a plane flying thru a group of decending jumpers both while in
> freefall and under canopy. This should not happen if the pilot was
> listening to the radio and knew where they were!

This should not happen if the pilot and spotter were checking for
traffic before exiting.

[[email protected]]

For the most part they were average unless you factor in the additional
work it took for them to pass their flight checks and the hassles they
did for the medicals. It took some extra effort on my part in learning
to adapt their physical problems to the physical acts of control
manipulations, etc. It was a challenge and ended up being educational
for me as well as fun, and frustrating, and satisfying, and gratifying,
etc.
Selway Kid

[Sylvain]

Well, aren't jumps supposed to be announced via NOTAMS? if you
are flying NORDO for whatever reason (deaf, antique aircraft without
a radio, or radio off as you are perfectly entitled to in uncontrolled
airspace), you just avoid the drop zone.

Actually I would say that just listening to the radio without being
aware of the NOTAMS might not do you much good as you won't really
know where the jumpers are anyway.

--Sylvain

Sail-n-Dive wrote:

> How can a deaf pilot be aware of radio traffic? I'm a skydiver and have
> experienced a plane flying thru a group of decending jumpers both while
> in
> freefall and under canopy. This should not happen if the pilot was
> listening to the radio and knew where they were! The jump plane is
> required to get permission and to give a warning over the radio before
> jumpers exit
> the aircraft. How does a deaf pilot become aware of these and other
> important messages coming over the radio?

[[email protected]]

Sylvain wrote:
> Well, aren't jumps supposed to be announced via NOTAMS? if you
> are flying NORDO for whatever reason (deaf, antique aircraft without
> a radio, or radio off as you are perfectly entitled to in uncontrolled
> airspace), you just avoid the drop zone.

Sylvain
Problem is sometimes jumps are done impromptu and no NOTAMS filed. In
any event, the drop zones are usually published in several places and
pilots just do a poor job of pre-flight planning.
I've got at least four DZ's within a 40 mile radius of my base but they
are active sporadically and mostly on weekends.

[Sylvain]

wrote:

> Problem is sometimes jumps are done impromptu and no NOTAMS filed. In
> any event, the drop zones are usually published in several places and
> pilots just do a poor job of pre-flight planning.

ok, but DZ are published, right? at least on the charts, even
if the time of activity might not be NOTAMed? I still don't think
that just listening to the radio might be a sufficient substitute to
a good pre-flight planning... (I mean, you have to know what to look
for)

--Sylvain

[Jim Macklin]

I haven't looked it up in a long time, but DZ need to be
activated before they are used. The PIC of a jump plane
should notify the controlling ATC facility before releasing
jumpers. Often radar service is available and ATC can advise
about traffic in the area.

Yep...
PART 105-PARACHUTE OPERATIONS

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Section Contents
§ 105.1 Applicability.
§ 105.3 Definitions.
§ 105.5 General.
§ 105.7 Use of alcohol and drugs.
§ 105.9 Inspections.


Subpart B-Operating Rules

§ 105.13 Radio equipment and use requirements.
§ 105.15 Information required and notice of cancellation
or postponement of a parachute operation.
§ 105.17 Flight visibility and clearance from cloud
requirements.
§ 105.19 Parachute operations between sunset and sunrise.
§ 105.21 Parachute operations over or into a congested
area or an open-air assembly of persons.
§ 105.23 Parachute operations over or onto airports.
§ 105.25 Parachute operations in designated airspace.


Subpart C-Parachute Equipment and Packing

§ 105.41 Applicability.
§ 105.43 Use of single-harness, dual-parachute systems.
§ 105.45 Use of tandem parachute systems.
§ 105.47 Use of static lines.
§ 105.49 Foreign parachutists and equipment.



> wrote in message
oups.com...
|
| Sylvain wrote:
| > Well, aren't jumps supposed to be announced via NOTAMS?
if you
| > are flying NORDO for whatever reason (deaf, antique
aircraft without
| > a radio, or radio off as you are perfectly entitled to
in uncontrolled
| > airspace), you just avoid the drop zone.
|
| Sylvain
| Problem is sometimes jumps are done impromptu and no
NOTAMS filed. In
| any event, the drop zones are usually published in several
places and
| pilots just do a poor job of pre-flight planning.
| I've got at least four DZ's within a 40 mile radius of my
base but they
| are active sporadically and mostly on weekends.
|

[[email protected]]

Sorry, I did not mean to imply that deaf pilots were not "normal"
pilots. It's just that deaf pilots are really not common. It was a bad
use of words on my part, sorry!

Myself, I have a severe case of hearing loss and that's why I was
interested in hearing more about your experiences teaching deaf pilots.
I will be looking for some instruction soon here in the Texas Hill
Country and will have to find an instructor that has experience in
dealing with deaf/hard of hearing students. I imagine many of them do
not want to deal with these kinds of student. Nonetheless, I am capable
of carrying on a conversation on the phone, etc, but the radio stops me
cold.

When I was going to high school in South Texas (near Harlingen), there
was a deaf cropduster and I figured that was the only way for for
hearing impaired people to fly! Also, I thought a Sports Pilot
certificate would enable more people like me to fly, but further
investigation has shown that they can fly with a PPL as well. All news
to me. Still learning. Thanks all for your feedback.
-Nick

[Sylvain]

wrote:

> Myself, I have a severe case of hearing loss and that's why I was
> interested in hearing more about your experiences teaching deaf pilots.
> I will be looking for some instruction soon here in the Texas Hill
> Country and will have to find an instructor that has experience in
> dealing with deaf/hard of hearing students. I imagine many of them do
> not want to deal with these kinds of student.

I have a disability myself and have had different experiences here
and there, but generally speaking pretty good; most people
(instructors, examiners, FAA inspectors) have had the attitude of
'hmm, that's interesting/different, how can we help?; :-) so don't
be afraid to ask; at the same time, I have found it quite useful
to associate with folks in the same situation; I mentioned the
Deaf Pilots Association (http://deafpilots.org), with which I am
not personally acquainted, but I reckon it might be similar in spirit
to IWA (http://wheelchairaviators.org) of which I am a member;
It provides tips, pointers to instructors, AME, etc. who are
experienced in the issue, and more importantly in a way, role models,
i.e., folks like you who went successfully through the process;
in addition of course of joining AOPA which is a source of good info
as well.

all the best,

--Sylvain

[Cub Driver]

On 17 Mar 2006 12:31:35 -0800, wrote:

>I will be looking for some instruction soon here in the Texas Hill
>Country and will have to find an instructor that has experience in
>dealing with deaf/hard of hearing students.

I remember reading a how-to-fly pamphlet from the 1940s(?) that had
small photos of the instructor (sitting in the front seat of a tandem
aircraft, of course) demonstrating hand signals. Typically the
aircraft had no intercom, so there were no audio instructions once in
the air. Maybe you can find an instructor willing to learn or refresh
his knowledge of these signals. (And a Piper Cub to go with it, since
they'd be less valuable if you were in the left seat.)



-- all the best, Dan Ford

email: usenet AT danford DOT net

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

[[email protected]]

Yep, I am hoping to get some instruction in a Cub, if at all possible.
Hey Dan I've been a big fan of your website, keep up the great work.

And you said "left seat"...you mean "back/front seat" :)

[Jim Macklin]

The new Sport Pilot rule will bring back new Cubs, both
Cubcrafters and Legend have new aircraft that meet the LSA
rules.

http://www.cubcrafters.com/home.asp
http://www.legend.aero/


> wrote in message
oups.com...
| Yep, I am hoping to get some instruction in a Cub, if at
all possible.
| Hey Dan I've been a big fan of your website, keep up the
great work.
|
| And you said "left seat"...you mean "back/front seat" :)
|