Question on the medical...

[Richard]

Hello everyone,

Long-time lurker first time poster...licensed skydiver. I'm interested
in becoming a pilot (age 47) but given that my best corrected vision in
my left eye is 20/40 and usually 20/50 (with hard contacts) as a result
of keratoconus. I'm anticipating the need for a corneal transplant
therefore to get the left eye to acceptable params. Has anyone here had
or know of anyone who has had such surgery and become/maintained flight
status?

TIA

Richard

[Jim Macklin]

The FAA can make a special issuance for many medical
conditions. As was also said, if you can qualify for a
driver's license you can be a Sport Pilot [new FAA pilot
classification].

I suggest that you contact the AOPA www.aopa.org and speak
to their medical department. They may require that you join
after a phone call.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Richard" > wrote in message
...
| Hello everyone,
|
| Long-time lurker first time poster...licensed skydiver.
I'm interested
| in becoming a pilot (age 47) but given that my best
corrected vision in
| my left eye is 20/40 and usually 20/50 (with hard
contacts) as a result
| of keratoconus. I'm anticipating the need for a corneal
transplant
| therefore to get the left eye to acceptable params. Has
anyone here had
| or know of anyone who has had such surgery and
become/maintained flight
| status?
|
| TIA
|
| Richard

[ET]

"Jim Macklin" > wrote in
news:P3ZVf.1183$t22.122@dukeread08:

> The FAA can make a special issuance for many medical
> conditions. As was also said, if you can qualify for a
> driver's license you can be a Sport Pilot [new FAA pilot
> classification].
>

BUT you cannot have "failed" your last FAA Medical... So you cant go to get
your medical, fail it, then say, "oh well, now I'll fly as a Sport Pilot".

So, dont go in for an FAA Medical unless you KNOW you can pass, if Sport
Pilot is an acceptible 2nd choice....

--
-- ET >:-)

"A common mistake people make when trying to design something
completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete
fools."---- Douglas Adams

[Jim Macklin]

That's is true too,



"ET" > wrote in message
...
| "Jim Macklin" > wrote
in
| news:P3ZVf.1183$t22.122@dukeread08:
|
| > The FAA can make a special issuance for many medical
| > conditions. As was also said, if you can qualify for a
| > driver's license you can be a Sport Pilot [new FAA pilot
| > classification].
| >
|
| BUT you cannot have "failed" your last FAA Medical... So
you cant go to get
| your medical, fail it, then say, "oh well, now I'll fly as
a Sport Pilot".
|
| So, dont go in for an FAA Medical unless you KNOW you can
pass, if Sport
| Pilot is an acceptible 2nd choice....
|
| --
| -- ET >:-)
|
| "A common mistake people make when trying to design
something
| completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of
complete
| fools."---- Douglas Adams

[Andrew Sarangan]

ET wrote:
> "Jim Macklin" > wrote in
> news:P3ZVf.1183$t22.122@dukeread08:
>
> > The FAA can make a special issuance for many medical
> > conditions. As was also said, if you can qualify for a
> > driver's license you can be a Sport Pilot [new FAA pilot
> > classification].
> >
>
> BUT you cannot have "failed" your last FAA Medical... So you cant go to get
> your medical, fail it, then say, "oh well, now I'll fly as a Sport Pilot".
>
> So, dont go in for an FAA Medical unless you KNOW you can pass, if Sport
> Pilot is an acceptible 2nd choice....
>
> --


I wonder if this is a new business idea in the making, ie physicians
who provide an FAA-like physical exam and tell you whether you will
qualify before you go to an FAA medical examiner.

[Casey Wilson]

WAIT A MINUTE!!!

One purpose of the SP class is to cut down the cost of flying by not
requiring you to pay some doctor to sign a form -- not give an unqualified
person a way to thwart safety. If you have a condidtion that would prevent
you from passing a third class medical then you should NOT be flying.

The SP stuff explicitly says if you have a disqualifying medical condition
then you are to ground yourself. The rules do not say: "Except for......
yadda, yadda."

[Grumman-581]

"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message
ups.com...
> I wonder if this is a new business idea in the making, ie physicians
> who provide an FAA-like physical exam and tell you whether you will
> qualify before you go to an FAA medical examiner.

You can do that now... Go in to the FAA medical examiner... Give them a
bogus name and refuse to give them your SSN if asked... Pay in cash...

[Cub Driver]

On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 16:16:42 -0500, T o d d P a t t i s t
> wrote:

>>I'm interested
>>in becoming a pilot (age 47) but given that my best corrected vision ....
>
>Anyone who has a driver's license can become at least a
>Sport Pilot. The AOPA has lots of info on medical
>requirements if that's not enough for you, and I'm sure
>someone here will have the information you need.

Of course the Sport Pilot must also self-certify that he is safe to
fly. Is 20/40 safe?


-- all the best, Dan Ford

email: usenet AT danford DOT net

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

[Stubby]

Richard wrote:
> Hello everyone,
>
> Long-time lurker first time poster...licensed skydiver. I'm interested
> in becoming a pilot (age 47) but given that my best corrected vision in
> my left eye is 20/40 and usually 20/50 (with hard contacts) as a result
> of keratoconus. I'm anticipating the need for a corneal transplant
> therefore to get the left eye to acceptable params. Has anyone here had
> or know of anyone who has had such surgery and become/maintained flight
> status?

Richard, you have a special situation. You certainly don't want to fly
if you are not safe. "Self certifying" does not lower the requirements.
So spend a few bucks and chat with an Aviation Medical Examiner. You
don't have to request a medical certificate so there is no risk. Good luck.

[ET]

"Casey Wilson" <N2310D @ gmail.com> wrote in
news:vF1Wf.5388$Od7.369@trnddc06:

> WAIT A MINUTE!!!
>
> One purpose of the SP class is to cut down the cost of flying by not
> requiring you to pay some doctor to sign a form -- not give an
> unqualified person a way to thwart safety. If you have a condidtion
> that would prevent you from passing a third class medical then you
> should NOT be flying.
>
> The SP stuff explicitly says if you have a disqualifying medical
> condition then you are to ground yourself. The rules do not say:
> "Except for...... yadda, yadda."
>
>
>

ah, no....;

y'wanna show me a reference for that? The sport pilot regs specifically
EXCLUDE the section of the regs that list the disqualifying
conditions...

An insulin dependent diabetic can never get a PPL (afaik). but can
certainly fly as a sport pilot.

--
-- ET >:-)

"A common mistake people make when trying to design something
completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete
fools."---- Douglas Adams

[.Blueskies.]

Medicals have been issued to one eyed pilots and folks who have lost both legs.

As advised, talk to the AOPA. They are great help...

"Richard" > wrote in message ...
> Hello everyone,
>
> Long-time lurker first time poster...licensed skydiver. I'm interested in becoming a pilot (age 47) but given that my
> best corrected vision in my left eye is 20/40 and usually 20/50 (with hard contacts) as a result of keratoconus. I'm
> anticipating the need for a corneal transplant therefore to get the left eye to acceptable params. Has anyone here
> had or know of anyone who has had such surgery and become/maintained flight status?
>
> TIA
>
> Richard

[Casey Wilson]

"ET" > wrote in message
...
> "Casey Wilson" <N2310D @ gmail.com> wrote in
> news:vF1Wf.5388$Od7.369@trnddc06:
>
>> WAIT A MINUTE!!!
>>
>> One purpose of the SP class is to cut down the cost of flying by not
>> requiring you to pay some doctor to sign a form -- not give an
>> unqualified person a way to thwart safety. If you have a condidtion
>> that would prevent you from passing a third class medical then you
>> should NOT be flying.
>>
>> The SP stuff explicitly says if you have a disqualifying medical
>> condition then you are to ground yourself. The rules do not say:
>> "Except for...... yadda, yadda."
>>
>>
>>
>
> ah, no....;
>
> y'wanna show me a reference for that? The sport pilot regs specifically
> EXCLUDE the section of the regs that list the disqualifying
> conditions...
>
> An insulin dependent diabetic can never get a PPL (afaik). but can
> certainly fly as a sport pilot.
>

Sec. 61.53

Prohibition on operations during medical deficiency.

(a) Operations that require a medical certificate. Except as provided for in
paragraph (b) of this section, a person who holds a current medical
certificate issued under part 67 of this chapter shall not act as pilot in
command, or in any other capacity as a required pilot flight crewmember,
while that person:
(1) Knows or has reason to know of any medical condition that would make the
person unable to meet the requirements for the medical certificate necessary
for the pilot operation; or
(2) Is taking medication or receiving other treatment for a medical
condition that results in the person being unable to meet the requirements
for the medical certificate necessary for the pilot operation.
(b) Operations that do not require a medical certificate. For operations
provided for in Sec. 61.23(b) of this part, a person shall not act as pilot
in command, or in any other capacity as a required pilot flight crewmember,
while that person knows or has reason to know of any medical condition that
would make the person unable to operate the aircraft in a safe manner.

[ET]

"Casey Wilson" <N2310D @ gmail.com> wrote in
news:B8cWf.5472$Od7.1271@trnddc06:

>
> "ET" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Casey Wilson" <N2310D @ gmail.com> wrote in
>> news:vF1Wf.5388$Od7.369@trnddc06:
>>
>>> WAIT A MINUTE!!!
>>>
>>> One purpose of the SP class is to cut down the cost of flying by not
>>> requiring you to pay some doctor to sign a form -- not give an
>>> unqualified person a way to thwart safety. If you have a condidtion
>>> that would prevent you from passing a third class medical then you
>>> should NOT be flying.
>>>
>>> The SP stuff explicitly says if you have a disqualifying medical
>>> condition then you are to ground yourself. The rules do not say:
>>> "Except for...... yadda, yadda."
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> ah, no....;
>>
>> y'wanna show me a reference for that? The sport pilot regs
>> specifically EXCLUDE the section of the regs that list the
>> disqualifying conditions...
>>
>> An insulin dependent diabetic can never get a PPL (afaik). but can
>> certainly fly as a sport pilot.
>>
>
> Sec. 61.53
>
> Prohibition on operations during medical deficiency.
>
> (a) Operations that require a medical certificate. Except as provided
> for in paragraph (b) of this section, a person who holds a current
> medical certificate issued under part 67 of this chapter shall not act
> as pilot in command, or in any other capacity as a required pilot
> flight crewmember, while that person:

> (1) Knows or has reason to know of any medical condition that would
> make the person unable to meet the requirements for the medical
> certificate necessary for the pilot operation; or

> (2) Is taking medication or receiving other treatment for a medical
> condition that results in the person being unable to meet the
> requirements for the medical certificate necessary for the pilot
> operation.

> (b) Operations that do not require a medical certificate.
> For operations provided for in Sec. 61.23(b) of this part, a person
> shall not act as pilot in command, or in any other capacity as a
> required pilot flight crewmember, while that person knows or has
> reason to know of any medical condition that would make the person
> unable to operate the aircraft in a safe manner.
>
>
>

There ya go, you made my point.... (a) 1&2 are for PPL & above. (b) is
for sport pilot, or gliders, or ballons. You decide before each flight
if you are able to operate you aircraft in a safe manner.




--
-- ET >:-)

"A common mistake people make when trying to design something
completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete
fools."---- Douglas Adams

[Jose]

> I wonder if this is a new business idea in the making, ie physicians
> who provide an FAA-like physical exam and tell you whether you will
> qualify before you go to an FAA medical examiner.

I think there would be some liability issues there.

Jose
--
Nothing takes longer than a shortcut.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

[Richard]

..Blueskies. wrote:
> Medicals have been issued to one eyed pilots and folks who have lost both legs.
>
> As advised, talk to the AOPA. They are great help...
>
> "Richard" > wrote in message ...
>> Hello everyone,
>>
>> Long-time lurker first time poster...licensed skydiver. I'm interested in becoming a pilot (age 47) but given that my
>> best corrected vision in my left eye is 20/40 and usually 20/50 (with hard contacts) as a result of keratoconus. I'm
>> anticipating the need for a corneal transplant therefore to get the left eye to acceptable params. Has anyone here
>> had or know of anyone who has had such surgery and become/maintained flight status?
>>
>> TIA
>>
>> Richard
>
>

Gentlemen I thank you all for your responses and advice. At this point
I'm simply researching to see what will be required to obtain my ticket-
I've always wanted to fly and have a few times from the right seat but
usually I never land in the bird. ;-) Now that I'm getting older and
increasing my income I'd like to have an opportunity to go for the
dream...and see Big Bend National Park from the air at sunset and land
LaJajitas for dinner.

[Grumman-581]

"Jose" wrote in message
m...
> I think there would be some liability issues there.

http://www.geocities.com/grumman581/lawyer-problem-solution.htm

[ET]

"Grumman-581" > wrote in
:

> "Jose" wrote in message
> m...
>> I think there would be some liability issues there.
>
> http://www.geocities.com/grumman581/lawyer-problem-solution.htm
>
>
>
>

Now that's the best idea I've heard this year! (tonge firmly in cheek....
I think)

--
-- ET >:-)

"A common mistake people make when trying to design something
completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete
fools."---- Douglas Adams

[Peter Duniho]

"ET" > wrote in message
...
> [...]
> An insulin dependent diabetic can never get a PPL (afaik). but can
> certainly fly as a sport pilot.

You're correct about the core point here, but I do want to point out that
insulin-dependent diabetics now have a certification path for obtaining a
medical. Being insulin-dependent is no longer an "auto-disqualify"
condition.

Pete

[ET]

"Peter Duniho" > wrote in
:

> "ET" > wrote in message
> ...
>> [...]
>> An insulin dependent diabetic can never get a PPL (afaik). but can
>> certainly fly as a sport pilot.
>
> You're correct about the core point here, but I do want to point out
> that insulin-dependent diabetics now have a certification path for
> obtaining a medical. Being insulin-dependent is no longer an
> "auto-disqualify" condition.
>
> Pete
>
>
>

Ah, good news that I had not heard about.. thanks for sharing


--
-- ET >:-)

"A common mistake people make when trying to design something
completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete
fools."---- Douglas Adams

[Grumman-581]

"ET" > wrote in message
...
> Now that's the best idea I've heard this year! (tonge firmly in cheek....
> I think)

No, I'm serious... If you don't believe it will work, let's just give it a
try and find out...

[Casey Wilson]

So let me see if I have this right. Under the rules for sport pilot medical
self certification, both the following scenarios are acceptable.

Charlie Cardiac has a sport pilot certificate. He gets up this morning
looks outside to a nice clear day and decides to go flying.
Charlie says to himself, "Hmm, yesterday was kind of strange. I was
standing on the corner waiting for the light to turn green when my left arm
felt numb, just like the left side of my face did. I don't remember
stumbling off the curb, but that kid that picked me up said I sort of
slumped down."
Charlie flexes his fingers and winds his arm around like a softball
pitcher getting ready to deliver a fast ball. "Feels great now. I'm okay. I
think I'll go flying."

or,

Harry Hypertense got a reading of 165/95 on his super duper BP cuff
last night.
This morning, Harry says, "My BP is always lower in the morning and I
feel great." "I'm good to go," Harry tells his sweetie and grabs the keys to
his newly acquired SP craft.

[Peter Duniho]

"Casey Wilson" <N2310D @ gmail.com> wrote in message
news:dtiWf.5973$Od7.3090@trnddc06...
>
> So let me see if I have this right. Under the rules for sport pilot
> medical self certification, both the following scenarios are acceptable.
> [possible heart attack and high blood pressure]

That depends on your definition of "any medical condition that would make
the person unable to operate the aircraft in a safe manner". And, of
course, on the FAA's.

My personaly definition would rule out the heart attack victim for sure (at
least, until the victim got a clean bill of health from a qualified doctor).
The high blood pressure guy, that's more iffy but assuming his doctor knows
about the condition and has cleared him to drive a car (for example), I
don't see why he would not be permitted to fly.

Remember, this rule is not new. It simply has been extended to apply to a
new category of aircraft. It has been in use successfully for other
categories for some time now. Any question you have regarding Sport Pilot
medical certification is an old question, "answered" by the application of
the same rule to the previously-existing aircraft categories.

Pete

[Casey Wilson]

"Peter Duniho" > wrote in message
...
> "Casey Wilson" <N2310D @ gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:dtiWf.5973$Od7.3090@trnddc06...
>>
>> So let me see if I have this right. Under the rules for sport pilot
>> medical self certification, both the following scenarios are acceptable.
>> [possible heart attack and high blood pressure]
>
> That depends on your definition of "any medical condition that would make
> the person unable to operate the aircraft in a safe manner". And, of
> course, on the FAA's.
>
> My personaly definition would rule out the heart attack victim for sure
> (at least, until the victim got a clean bill of health from a qualified
> doctor). The high blood pressure guy, that's more iffy but assuming his
> doctor knows about the condition and has cleared him to drive a car (for
> example), I don't see why he would not be permitted to fly.
>
> Remember, this rule is not new. It simply has been extended to apply to a
> new category of aircraft. It has been in use successfully for other
> categories for some time now. Any question you have regarding Sport Pilot
> medical certification is an old question, "answered" by the application of
> the same rule to the previously-existing aircraft categories.
>
Well, Pete, in both cases, although admittedly I did not include this
detail in my fictional scenarios but still..., Charlie and Harry both have
driver's licenses. Have had them for years. I'll even go so far as to say
both had "checkups" by their family physicians less than six months ago.
During Charlie's checkup his heart rhythms were clear. Harry's doc noted
Harry's BP was 142/80 and suggested he cut down on salt and eat more
oatmeal.

These are fictional characters and hypothetical conditions. That
doesn't mean that Charlie and Harry aren't out there somewhere using real
aliases.

As for other categories, I have the same bitch about
self-certification. When I started flying gliders, my CFIG made a point of
telling me I didn't need to waste money on a medical, just write a letter
and tell the FAA I was good to go.

I am not against the sport pilot class. I think it is a fine idea. I'm
sure that the vast majority of pilots who enter that system won't be as
stupid as Charlie and Harry. What does **** me off, is the way some of our
community are blithely saying not to worry about health conditions - that
all that is needed is a driver's license. My son-in-law's father has had two
serious heart attacks totalling more than a month in the hospital. He still
has his heavy hauler driver's license for 18-wheelers. I won't even take
that man for a *ride* in my airplane. But, yet, having never failed a 3rd
class medical, he is qualified for a sport pilot's license.

====Rant Mode Off========

[Peter Duniho]

"Casey Wilson" <N2310D @ gmail.com> wrote in message
news:_4nWf.5527$f21.4297@trnddc01...
> [...]
> I am not against the sport pilot class. I think it is a fine idea. I'm
> sure that the vast majority of pilots who enter that system won't be as
> stupid as Charlie and Harry. What does **** me off, is the way some of our
> community are blithely saying not to worry about health conditions - that
> all that is needed is a driver's license.

Well, for whatever reason, this hasn't been something I've seen fit to get
"****ed off" about.

For better or worse, we allow people to engage in all manner of dangerous
activities without medical certification. In many cases, the greatest
hazard is to the person actually engaging in the activity, and it seems that
society has decided that if it's safe enough for that person, it's safe
enough for the people around them.

I think in most cases, people make the correct decision. Yes, some small
portion of participants don't. But I'm not convinced that forcing
certification on them really addresses the issue. They are likely to have a
personality that leads to them either bypassing the medical requirement
somehow, or doing something else risky instead.

> My son-in-law's father has had two serious heart attacks totalling more
> than a month in the hospital. He still has his heavy hauler driver's
> license for 18-wheelers. I won't even take that man for a *ride* in my
> airplane. But, yet, having never failed a 3rd class medical, he is
> qualified for a sport pilot's license.

Well, is he qualified to drive 18-wheelers or not? If not, why is he still
permitted to do so? If he is, why wouldn't he be qualified to pilot an
airplane?

You can only go so far in keeping people from doing something stupid. IMHO,
the reason that the self-certification works is that most people ARE good
about respecting their own physical limitations, and in the remainder of the
cases, in very few instances does the medical certification process force
them to respect what they otherwise wouldn't.

Bottom line, for me: medical certification doesn't really prevent many
medically-related accidents, and it's somewhat of a burden on pilots,
especially those not flying professionally (for the professional flyers,
it's all just "part of the job"...for recreational flyers, it's just one
more hoop to jump through). Medically certified pilots have heart attacks
or other incapacitations in-flight, and a two- or three-year schedule for
certification means that even pilots with a valid medical are essentially
self-certifying for the bulk of their flights.

It seems to me that your "****ed off" attitude would be better directed at
those pilots who insist on flying in spite of being medically deficient,
rather than at those who recognize an inefficient, ineffective regulatory
program or at the new, stream-lined program that replaces it.

Pete

[Dave Stadt]

"Casey Wilson" <N2310D @ gmail.com> wrote in message
news:_4nWf.5527$f21.4297@trnddc01...
>
> "Peter Duniho" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Casey Wilson" <N2310D @ gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:dtiWf.5973$Od7.3090@trnddc06...
>>>
>>> So let me see if I have this right. Under the rules for sport pilot
>>> medical self certification, both the following scenarios are acceptable.
>>> [possible heart attack and high blood pressure]
>>
>> That depends on your definition of "any medical condition that would make
>> the person unable to operate the aircraft in a safe manner". And, of
>> course, on the FAA's.
>>
>> My personaly definition would rule out the heart attack victim for sure
>> (at least, until the victim got a clean bill of health from a qualified
>> doctor). The high blood pressure guy, that's more iffy but assuming his
>> doctor knows about the condition and has cleared him to drive a car (for
>> example), I don't see why he would not be permitted to fly.
>>
>> Remember, this rule is not new. It simply has been extended to apply to
>> a new category of aircraft. It has been in use successfully for other
>> categories for some time now. Any question you have regarding Sport
>> Pilot medical certification is an old question, "answered" by the
>> application of the same rule to the previously-existing aircraft
>> categories.
>>
> Well, Pete, in both cases, although admittedly I did not include this
> detail in my fictional scenarios but still..., Charlie and Harry both have
> driver's licenses. Have had them for years. I'll even go so far as to say
> both had "checkups" by their family physicians less than six months ago.
> During Charlie's checkup his heart rhythms were clear. Harry's doc noted
> Harry's BP was 142/80 and suggested he cut down on salt and eat more
> oatmeal.
>
> These are fictional characters and hypothetical conditions. That
> doesn't mean that Charlie and Harry aren't out there somewhere using real
> aliases.

Is there any hard evidence the Charlies and Harrys of the world are a menace
to themselves and others?

[Dave Stadt]

"T o d d P a t t i s t" > wrote in message
...
> "Dave Stadt" > wrote:
>
>>Is there any hard evidence the Charlies and Harrys of the world are a
>>menace
>>to themselves and others?
>
> No, but there is some pretty good evidence to the contrary.
> The FAA studied this 5-7 years back and concluded that the
> 3rd class medical requirement for private pilots was not
> reducing medical related accidents as compared to gliders
> where there was a simpler self-certification procedure.

That was my tongue-in-cheek point. Casey is barking up a non existant tree.
The 3rd class medical is hardly worth the effort and as you say does not
improve safety. $95 and a piece of paper does not automatically make one
safe to fly for 24 months. It is the pilots responsibility to self certify
before every flight.

> --
> Do not spin this aircraft. If the aircraft does enter a spin it will
> return to earth without further attention on the part of the aeronaut.
>
> (first handbook issued with the Curtis-Wright flyer)