Oshkosh ATC - really picking up

[Morgans[_3_]]

I'll try again, this time hitting <tab> instead of send.

Sunday 3:30 EDST, and for the last half hour or so, the frequency has been
non stop busy.

For those interested, I'm listening to http://www.liveatc.net/topfeeds.php

Click on the Oshkosh selection, in the top 20 feeds.
--
Jim in NC

[FlipSide]

On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 16:39:11 -0400, "Morgans"
> wrote:

>I'll try again, this time hitting <tab> instead of send.
>
>Sunday 3:30 EDST, and for the last half hour or so, the frequency has been
>non stop busy.
>
>For those interested, I'm listening to http://www.liveatc.net/topfeeds.php
>
>Click on the Oshkosh selection, in the top 20 feeds.

Some of it seems a little intimidating but ultimately learnable.

What are the pink and orange dots? I know they are checkpoints but
what are they?

[Morgans[_3_]]

<FlipSide> wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 16:39:11 -0400, "Morgans"
> > wrote:
>
> >I'll try again, this time hitting <tab> instead of send.
> >
> >Sunday 3:30 EDST, and for the last half hour or so, the frequency has
been
> >non stop busy.
> >
> >For those interested, I'm listening to
http://www.liveatc.net/topfeeds.php
> >
> >Click on the Oshkosh selection, in the top 20 feeds.
>
> Some of it seems a little intimidating but ultimately learnable.
>
> What are the pink and orange dots? I know they are checkpoints but
> what are they?

What section are you looking at? I see no pink or orange dots.
--
Jim in NC

[Morgans[_3_]]

> > What are the pink and orange dots? I know they are checkpoints but
> > what are they?
>
> The controllers are refering to spots on the runway that they want the
> aircraft to land on. This allows some to land long and some to land
> short simultaneously, greatly increasing the number of arrivals that
> they can handle. Should be mentioned in the NOTAM here:
>
> http://www.airventure.org/2006/flying/notam06.pdf

Ahh. I did not see the dots on the web site I referenced, so I did not
realize he was talking about the dots on the runway.

For the responder, the dots are there to make it real quick to tell the
pilots where they want the planes to touch down. Rather than saying "Fly
down the runway, until you have passed the 3rd taxiway intersection," they
can say "land on the orange dot" and it is quickly seen and understood.

This is done so planes coming in close together can land and slow further
apart, safely. It is amazing, how well it works.
--
Jim in NC

[FlipSide]

On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 14:35:00 -0400, "Morgans"
> wrote:

>
><FlipSide> wrote in message
...
>> On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 16:39:11 -0400, "Morgans"
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >I'll try again, this time hitting <tab> instead of send.
>> >
>> >Sunday 3:30 EDST, and for the last half hour or so, the frequency has
>been
>> >non stop busy.
>> >
>> >For those interested, I'm listening to
>http://www.liveatc.net/topfeeds.php
>> >
>> >Click on the Oshkosh selection, in the top 20 feeds.
>>
>> Some of it seems a little intimidating but ultimately learnable.
>>
>> What are the pink and orange dots? I know they are checkpoints but
>> what are they?
>
>What section are you looking at? I see no pink or orange dots.

I was listening to ATC this morning and heard the controller referring
to the dots. I didn't realize from the short time I listened that
these were on the runway. I assumed they were somewhere around the
airport.

[Roger[_4_]]

On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 13:10:10 -0400, FlipSide wrote:

>On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 16:39:11 -0400, "Morgans"
> wrote:
>
>>I'll try again, this time hitting <tab> instead of send.
>>
>>Sunday 3:30 EDST, and for the last half hour or so, the frequency has been
>>non stop busy.
>>
>>For those interested, I'm listening to http://www.liveatc.net/topfeeds.php
>>
>>Click on the Oshkosh selection, in the top 20 feeds.
>
>Some of it seems a little intimidating but ultimately learnable.

It is no place for a pilot who always flys a stabilized pattern. The
tell when to turn, where to turn and where to land. You may end up
flying over some one or having some one fly over you. They land up to
3 at a time.

>
>What are the pink and orange dots? I know they are checkpoints but
>what are they?

Spots on the runway The different colors are usually different shapes
as well.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com.
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

[.Blueskies.]

"Roger" > wrote in message ...
: On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 13:10:10 -0400, FlipSide wrote:
: : It is no place for a pilot who always flys a stabilized pattern. The
: tell when to turn, where to turn and where to land. You may end up
: flying over some one or having some one fly over you. They land up to
: 3 at a time.
:
: >
: >What are the pink and orange dots? I know they are checkpoints but
: >what are they?
:
: Spots on the runway The different colors are usually different shapes
: as well.
:
: Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
: (N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)

Saw a Mooney who was cleared for takeoff on 09 just sitting there. He then asked the controller if he was cleared for
takeoff...twice! There was a 337 on final. The controller finally got it through to the guy that, yes, you are cleared
for takeoff. The Mooney then started rolling, just about as the 337 was on short final. The 337 was told to go around,
and the controller told the Mooney to not rotate until told to do so. The Moony rolled on down, the 337 finally overtook
it, maybe 50' agl and just off the right side of the runway. The controller then said good job Mooney as he let them
rotate and get out. Amazing how cool and controlled the controller was - his voice did raise a bit during all this, but
he was smooth. The controllers are the glue...

....When they get back to their normal O'Hare or La Guardia jobs they probably feel bored... ;-)

[[email protected]]

..
> Saw a Mooney who was cleared for takeoff on 09 just sitting there. He then asked the controller if he was cleared for
> takeoff...twice! There was a 337 on final. The controller finally got it through to the guy that, yes, you are cleared
> for takeoff. The Mooney then started rolling, just about as the 337 was on short final. The 337 was told to go around,
> and the controller told the Mooney to not rotate until told to do so. The Moony rolled on down, the 337 finally overtook
> it, maybe 50' agl and just off the right side of the runway. The controller then said good job Mooney as he let them
> rotate and get out. Amazing how cool and controlled the controller was - his voice did raise a bit during all this, but
> he was smooth. The controllers are the glue...
>
> ...When they get back to their normal O'Hare or La Guardia jobs they probably feel bored... ;-)


Yea, I saw that one as well. I happened to look up when the controller
was telling him that he would call his rotation...(not a common
instruction!).

Gotta love OSH...

[Roger[_4_]]

On Thu, 27 Jul 2006 23:45:42 GMT, ".Blueskies."
> wrote:

>
>"Roger" > wrote in message ...

I never have gotten that link to OSH ATC to work on any of these
computers.

>: On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 13:10:10 -0400, FlipSide wrote:
>: : It is no place for a pilot who always flys a stabilized pattern. The
>: tell when to turn, where to turn and where to land. You may end up
>: flying over some one or having some one fly over you. They land up to
>: 3 at a time.
>:
>: >
>: >What are the pink and orange dots? I know they are checkpoints but
>: >what are they?
>:
>: Spots on the runway The different colors are usually different shapes
>: as well.
>:
>: Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
>: (N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
>
>Saw a Mooney who was cleared for takeoff on 09 just sitting there. He then asked the controller if he was cleared for

Yup. That's another thing. Have *everything* for departure and at
least the first 10 miles all in place before starting to taxi. When
they say go they mean go. When you pull into place you are expected to
be going in just seconds.


Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com
>takeoff...twice! There was a 337 on final. The controller finally got it through to the guy that, yes, you are cleared
>for takeoff. The Mooney then started rolling, just about as the 337 was on short final. The 337 was told to go around,
>and the controller told the Mooney to not rotate until told to do so. The Moony rolled on down, the 337 finally overtook
>it, maybe 50' agl and just off the right side of the runway. The controller then said good job Mooney as he let them
>rotate and get out. Amazing how cool and controlled the controller was - his voice did raise a bit during all this, but
>he was smooth. The controllers are the glue...
>
>...When they get back to their normal O'Hare or La Guardia jobs they probably feel bored... ;-)
>
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

[Roger[_4_]]

On 27 Jul 2006 19:25:13 -0700, wrote:

>
>.
>> Saw a Mooney who was cleared for takeoff on 09 just sitting there. He then asked the controller if he was cleared for
>> takeoff...twice! There was a 337 on final. The controller finally got it through to the guy that, yes, you are cleared
>> for takeoff. The Mooney then started rolling, just about as the 337 was on short final. The 337 was told to go around,
>> and the controller told the Mooney to not rotate until told to do so. The Moony rolled on down, the 337 finally overtook
>> it, maybe 50' agl and just off the right side of the runway. The controller then said good job Mooney as he let them
>> rotate and get out. Amazing how cool and controlled the controller was - his voice did raise a bit during all this, but
>> he was smooth. The controllers are the glue...
>>
>> ...When they get back to their normal O'Hare or La Guardia jobs they probably feel bored... ;-)
>
>
>Yea, I saw that one as well. I happened to look up when the controller
>was telling him that he would call his rotation...(not a common
>instruction!).

That would be really interesting in the Deb. When it's ready to fly
it is going to fly. If you try to hold it on you'll end up riding on
the nose gear. Retrimming is not a viable option for two reasons. The
trim is very coarse. In level flight a bit over a 1/4" movement of the
trim wheel will either lift you out of the seat or give about 2Gs. The
second reason is that coarse trim wheel is under and forward of the
bottom edge of the panel. You have to instinctually know where it is
and you have to lean over a bit to reach it. Something I'd not want
to do while trying to hold it on the runway.

The only real alternative would be to back off on the power and hold
it just under rotation speed, then go full power when given the OK.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com >
>Gotta love OSH...
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

[[email protected]]

I also watched this year as a Cherokee landed in front of a Baron, the
twin pilot did a good job of slightly varying his takeoff roll and
maneuvering around the cherokee in front of him, taking off and going
on his way.
I'm not sure whose fault that was, either cherokee not putting it down
on the appropriate dot, or the twin not rolling when he should have, or
the controllers just not getting the spacing right,
but they asked us to get the cherokee N-number so someone could "talk
to him"...

Ryan Wubben
Flight Line Operations

[Ron Natalie]

Roger wrote:

> Yup. That's another thing. Have *everything* for departure and at
> least the first 10 miles all in place before starting to taxi. When
> they say go they mean go. When you pull into place you are expected to
> be going in just seconds.
>
Which is a good idea for any busy airport. I can not understand people
who sit there and diddle their DG, transponder, whatever for two minutes
after being cleared for takeoff (at controlled fields) or after they
pull on to the runway at uncontrolled fields. About the only thing
I do while pulling on the runway is hit the strobes (if at night).

[.Blueskies.]

"Jim Macklin" > wrote in message news:w2qzg.84699$ZW3.39728@dukeread04...
: And turn the pitot heat and transponder ON.
:
:


You turn on pitot heat this time of year?

[john smith]

> : And turn the pitot heat and transponder ON.

> You turn on pitot heat this time of year?

Anytime there is visible moisture in the air.

[Matt Whiting]

john smith wrote:

>>: And turn the pitot heat and transponder ON.
>
>
>>You turn on pitot heat this time of year?
>
>
> Anytime there is visible moisture in the air.

Even when it is 80 F degrees? That is simply a waste of electrical energy.


Matt

[.Blueskies.]

"Matt Whiting" > wrote in message ...
: john smith wrote:
:
: >>: And turn the pitot heat and transponder ON.
: >
: >
: >>You turn on pitot heat this time of year?
: >
: >
: > Anytime there is visible moisture in the air.
:
: Even when it is 80 F degrees? That is simply a waste of electrical energy.
:
:
: Matt

My thoughts exactly...

[Gig 601XL Builder]

"Matt Whiting" > wrote in message
...
> john smith wrote:
>
>>>: And turn the pitot heat and transponder ON.
>>
>>
>>>You turn on pitot heat this time of year?
>>
>>
>> Anytime there is visible moisture in the air.
>
> Even when it is 80 F degrees? That is simply a waste of electrical
> energy.
>
>
> Matt

Flying on board a Beech 1900 DFW-ELD about three months ago outside temp on
the ground 85 descending from 17000 I watched ice form on the leading edge
of the wing and on the spinner. It wasn't completely gone until we descended
through 13000.