ATC subtle hints

[kontiki]

I really get a kick out of how subtle ATC can be sometimes in giving those
little "hints" to some pilots. I've heard lots of interesting ones over time
that have given me a chuckle while flying along. It got me to thinking about
what some of the more funny ones you guys have heard over the years.

Today, right after being cleared for takeoff, and while rolling onto on Rwy 36
at SAV I got a traffic advisory from tower about a 757 on a 3 mile final to Rwy 9.
(for me, that's the lowest altitude I have ever been when receiveing a
traffic advisory!). I responded with "38H is looking" and made an expeditious
take-off and got a good glance at the big airplane on the way in maybe a mile
out as I crossed the intersection.

Wish I could recall a few of the more funny ones, but telling stories is really
not my forte, sorta like you have to be there.

[FLAV8R[_1_]]

That traffic advisory more than likely was to motivate you to expedite your
takeoff.
I have had the tower ask me to cycle my transponder as another way of saying
"Turn it on you dip".

David - KGYH


"kontiki" > wrote in message
...
>I really get a kick out of how subtle ATC can be sometimes in giving those
> little "hints" to some pilots. I've heard lots of interesting ones over
> time
> that have given me a chuckle while flying along. It got me to thinking
> about
> what some of the more funny ones you guys have heard over the years.
>
> Today, right after being cleared for takeoff, and while rolling onto on
> Rwy 36
> at SAV I got a traffic advisory from tower about a 757 on a 3 mile final
> to Rwy 9.
> (for me, that's the lowest altitude I have ever been when receiveing a
> traffic advisory!). I responded with "38H is looking" and made an
> expeditious
> take-off and got a good glance at the big airplane on the way in maybe a
> mile
> out as I crossed the intersection.
>
> Wish I could recall a few of the more funny ones, but telling stories is
> really
> not my forte, sorta like you have to be there.
>

[Emily]

kontiki wrote:
<snip>
> out as I crossed the intersection.
>
> Wish I could recall a few of the more funny ones, but telling stories is
> really
> not my forte, sorta like you have to be there.

My favorite subtle hint is, "N#, say altitude." Not that it happens to
me much, you understand, but I hear it a lot while acting as safety
pilot. <g>

[Mike Adams[_1_]]

Emily > wrote:

> My favorite subtle hint is, "N#, say altitude."

Or have them tell you the altimeter setting, as if that's the reason for
the altitude discrepancy. (Yea, that must be the reason)

[Bob Noel]

In article >,
"FLAV8R" > wrote:

> That traffic advisory more than likely was to motivate you to expedite your
> takeoff.
> I have had the tower ask me to cycle my transponder as another way of saying
> "Turn it on you dip".

I heard a tower controller say:
What he said: "I'm not receiving your mode C"
What he meant: "Change that (old) discrete code to 1200"

--
Bob Noel
Looking for a sig the
lawyers will hate

[Emily]

Mike Adams wrote:
> Emily > wrote:
>
>> My favorite subtle hint is, "N#, say altitude."
>
> Or have them tell you the altimeter setting, as if that's the reason for
> the altitude discrepancy. (Yea, that must be the reason)

One night Champaign Approach just wouldn't get off my back. He started
by giving me the altimeter, which I had just received when Indy Center
had handed me off. I shook my head, looked at the altimeter, yes, it's
correct. Five minutes later, "N#, recycle your mode C." Huh? By
this time my altitude, which admittedly had been 50 feet off, was dead
on and my friend and I were both pretty confused. Approach then called
another two aircraft, gave them the altimeter setting, and asked them to
recycle. Another huh. Five minutes later he called me back and asked
altitude...I replied 6000. He replies back, "Oh, ok. Because I have
you at 900 and two other aircraft at 650, so I was just wondering what
was going on."

[Emily]

Actually, my favorite not so subtle hint is hearing tower tell an
aircraft on short final to check gear down. It's even better when you
can hear the gear horn going off in the background and when the plane
calls back five second later to say he's going around.

[Emily]

B A R R Y wrote:
> On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 22:26:12 GMT, kontiki >
> wrote:
>
>> I really get a kick out of how subtle ATC can be sometimes in giving those
>> little "hints" to some pilots.
>
> "Airline 34F, how many transponders in your aircraft?"
> "It's on now! - Airline 34F"
>
That's a good question - how many pilots admit to the controller that
they were just caught being stupid? I was caught once tracking the
wrong VOR and he called me on it. No way to bluff your way out of that one.

[Paul Tomblin]

In a previous article, Bob Noel > said:
>I heard a tower controller say:
>What he said: "I'm not receiving your mode C"
>What he meant: "Change that (old) discrete code to 1200"

I thought what he meant was "Why the hell aren't you anywhere near your
assigned altitude?"

--
Paul Tomblin > http://blog.xcski.com/
"You are installing Internet Explorer 4.0. Windows NT needs to overwrite
all your system dll's and restart your computer. Note that this
application is NOT part of the operating system. Good luck."

[Emily]

B A R R Y wrote:
> On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 19:22:44 -0500, Emily
> > wrote:
>
>> That's a good question - how many pilots admit to the controller that
>> they were just caught being stupid? I was caught once tracking the
>> wrong VOR and he called me on it. No way to bluff your way out of that one.
>
> With as many controllers that are pilots, a little humility can go a
> long way.

Oh, there was humility involved. Actually, right before he called and
asked my heading, I realized, well, look at that, I'm one VOR ahead. So
I said, "Uh, heading will be 320, I just realized I'm tracking the wrong
VOR." His response? "Umm....yeah." I felt about two inches tall.

[Emily]

B A R R Y wrote:
> On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 19:19:49 -0500, Emily
> > wrote:
>
>> He replies back, "Oh, ok. Because I have
>> you at 900 and two other aircraft at 650, so I was just wondering what
>> was going on."
>
>
> My plane had an intermittent issue where the transponder would create
> a double return.
>
> "58S, I'm getting a second return near you, same altitude. State
> number in formation..." REALLY gets your attention!

That's one of those calls that takes 10 years off your life.

[Jim Macklin]

Sometimes drug smugglers sell their airplanes [if they
didn't just steal one for the trip]. If the DEA gets a
chance they will hardwire their own transponder in the
airplane so it is always on so they can track them. The new
owner finds out that their regular panel mounted transponder
isn't working and then they find the DEA's mounted somewhere
in the belly.



"B A R R Y" > wrote in
message ...
| On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 19:19:49 -0500, Emily
| > wrote:
|
| > He replies back, "Oh, ok. Because I have
| >you at 900 and two other aircraft at 650, so I was just
wondering what
| >was going on."
|
|
| My plane had an intermittent issue where the transponder
would create
| a double return.
|
| "58S, I'm getting a second return near you, same altitude.
State
| number in formation..." REALLY gets your attention!

[Paul Tomblin]

In a previous article, said:
>On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 19:19:49 -0500, Emily
> wrote:
>
>> He replies back, "Oh, ok. Because I have
>>you at 900 and two other aircraft at 650, so I was just wondering what
>>was going on."
>
>
>My plane had an intermittent issue where the transponder would create
>a double return.

One of our club's planes did that for a while, but mostly when talking to
Rochester Approach. Approach didn't like it much, because it sets off a
collision alarm - and sometimes the ghost would be squawking 7777, which
sets off other alarms.

--
Paul Tomblin > http://blog.xcski.com/
Microsoft: bringing the world to your desktop -- and your desktop to
the world.
-- Peter Gutmann

[Emily]

Jim Macklin wrote:
> Sometimes drug smugglers sell their airplanes [if they
> didn't just steal one for the trip]. If the DEA gets a
> chance they will hardwire their own transponder in the
> airplane so it is always on so they can track them. The new
> owner finds out that their regular panel mounted transponder
> isn't working and then they find the DEA's mounted somewhere
> in the belly.
>
Is that legal? Adding a transponder kind of affects w&b and is supposed
to be written in a logbook somewhere. I know they're the government, but
somehow I don't think the FAA would overlook it.

[Paul Tomblin]

In a previous article, Emily > said:
>Jim Macklin wrote:
>> didn't just steal one for the trip]. If the DEA gets a
>> chance they will hardwire their own transponder in the
>> airplane so it is always on so they can track them. The new
>Is that legal? Adding a transponder kind of affects w&b and is supposed
>to be written in a logbook somewhere. I know they're the government, but
>somehow I don't think the FAA would overlook it.

According to some sources, at least one of these illegal DEA wiring jobs
was discovered because it caused an in-flight electrical fire!

--
Paul Tomblin > http://blog.xcski.com/
"Dad, I left my heart up there."
-- Francis Gary Powers after his first flight (age 14)

[randall g]

On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 19:32:20 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
> wrote:

>Sometimes drug smugglers sell their airplanes [if they
>didn't just steal one for the trip]. If the DEA gets a
>chance they will hardwire their own transponder in the
>airplane so it is always on so they can track them. The new
>owner finds out that their regular panel mounted transponder
>isn't working and then they find the DEA's mounted somewhere
>in the belly.


?? How would the DEA get a chance to do that? Do they get a warrant to
break into a suspect aircraft and install additional avionics?







randall g =%^)> PPASEL+Night 1974 Cardinal RG
http://www.telemark.net/randallg
Lots of aerial photographs of British Columbia at:
http://www.telemark.net/randallg/photos.htm
Vancouver's famous Kat Kam: http://www.katkam.ca

[Paul Tomblin]

In a previous article, randall g > said:
>?? How would the DEA get a chance to do that? Do they get a warrant to
>break into a suspect aircraft and install additional avionics?

Warrants? The "War On [Some] Drugs" was the training ground for the sorts
of unconstitutional excesses that are now part of the "War On [Some]
Terrorists".


--
Paul Tomblin > http://blog.xcski.com/
"Being lectured on fiscal responsibility by George Bush is like being
lectured on law and order by Tony Soprano." - John Kerry

[Sylvain]

randall g wrote:
> ?? How would the DEA get a chance to do that? Do they get a warrant to
> break into a suspect aircraft and install additional avionics?

warrants went out of fashion, a bit like the dodo and habeas corpus...

--Sylvain

[randall g]

I was departing recently on a long XC flight, and had left the baggage
door open (I know, I know, new item on the checklist...)

It took a couple of minutes after takeoff to determine what was causing
the unusual breeze in the cabin. We weren't yet out of the CZ.

Me: TUM would like to return for landing
ATC: Roger TUM follow the shoreline back to right base 30
a few seconds later...
ATC: TUM is there anything you need? Anything we can do for you?
Me: TUM didn't want to mention it but my baggage door is open and I need
to close it
ATC: Roger TUM, cleared to land on 30, cross 25 to the apron, call
ground when you are ready to leave again
Me: TUM crossing 25

Then when I made my right turn to final, the door slammed shut. Should
have thought of that. I landed and checked it out anyway. It was
probably the dumbest thing they heard that day.



randall g =%^)> PPASEL+Night 1974 Cardinal RG
http://www.telemark.net/randallg
Lots of aerial photographs of British Columbia at:
http://www.telemark.net/randallg/photos.htm
Vancouver's famous Kat Kam: http://www.katkam.ca

[Newps]

Emily wrote:
> Jim Macklin wrote:
>
>> Sometimes drug smugglers sell their airplanes [if they didn't just
>> steal one for the trip]. If the DEA gets a chance they will hardwire
>> their own transponder in the airplane so it is always on so they can
>> track them. The new owner finds out that their regular panel mounted
>> transponder isn't working and then they find the DEA's mounted
>> somewhere in the belly.
>>
> Is that legal? Adding a transponder kind of affects w&b and is supposed
> to be written in a logbook somewhere. I know they're the government, but
> somehow I don't think the FAA would overlook it.


The FAA is in on it.

[Newps]

randall g wrote:

> On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 19:32:20 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
> > wrote:
>
>
>>Sometimes drug smugglers sell their airplanes [if they
>>didn't just steal one for the trip]. If the DEA gets a
>>chance they will hardwire their own transponder in the
>>airplane so it is always on so they can track them. The new
>>owner finds out that their regular panel mounted transponder
>>isn't working and then they find the DEA's mounted somewhere
>>in the belly.
>
>
>
> ?? How would the DEA get a chance to do that? Do they get a warrant to
> break into a suspect aircraft and install additional avionics?

Yes.

[Emily]

Newps wrote:
>
>
> Emily wrote:
>> Jim Macklin wrote:
>>
>>> Sometimes drug smugglers sell their airplanes [if they didn't just
>>> steal one for the trip]. If the DEA gets a chance they will hardwire
>>> their own transponder in the airplane so it is always on so they can
>>> track them. The new owner finds out that their regular panel mounted
>>> transponder isn't working and then they find the DEA's mounted
>>> somewhere in the belly.
>>>
>> Is that legal? Adding a transponder kind of affects w&b and is
>> supposed to be written in a logbook somewhere. I know they're the
>> government, but somehow I don't think the FAA would overlook it.
>
>
> The FAA is in on it.

But do they violate unsuspecting people who buy a plane that was
previously used for drug smuggling? That's what I was getting at.

[GeorgeC]

Tower: Cessna 12345, you can turn final now.
Me: I lost the field, Cessna 12345.
Tower: Cessna 345, turn to a heading of one eight zero degrees.
Me: turning to a heading 180 degrees.
About 30 seconds later.
Tower: Cessna 345, that's south.
..
..
..
Tower: Cessna 345, do you have the field in sight?
Me: Cessna 345 has the field in sight.
Tower: Bonanza N#, you are second to land. Following a Cessna Skyhawk on six
mile final.

To add insult to injury. I was landing at my home base and the airport had a VOR
on the field.

GeorgeC

[Emily]

GeorgeC wrote:
<snip>
> To add insult to injury. I was landing at my home base and the airport had a VOR
> on the field.

Because I am masochist, I decided it would be fun to fly a partial panel
single engine NDB approach at my home airport one day. Keep in mind I'd
done the approach at least 30 times, but for some reason was really
struggling on this particular day. Still, I figured I was at least
pointed somewhat towards the runway until tower called me.

Tower: Aztec 12345, is that you breaking off the approach?
Me to safety pilot: What the $#@! is he talking about?
Me to tower: Ah, negative, Aztec 12345 will break off the approach over
the numbers.
Tower: Aztec 12345: Which numbers?
Safety pilot: Um, maybe you need to look up now.

[GeorgeC]

I hear one the other day that I don't know the translation. I was practicing
maneuvers with flight following. When approach control ask "N#, how long do you
plan on being in that area?" I told her I was heading back to the airport. She
said OK and gave me a frequency change (approach control).

GeorgeC

[Emily]

GeorgeC wrote:
> I hear one the other day that I don't know the translation. I was practicing
> maneuvers with flight following. When approach control ask "N#, how long do you
> plan on being in that area?" I told her I was heading back to the airport. She
> said OK and gave me a frequency change (approach control).
>
> GeorgeC
Were you in a inactive MOA or the like? Maybe she just wanted to know
how long she needed to alert others to your presence..

[Jim Macklin]

I've seen it a couple of times. The Feds do what they want,
a two pound ATCRBS doesn't cause any W&B issues. Besides,
it is the PIC responsibility.


--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Emily" > wrote in message
. ..
| Jim Macklin wrote:
| > Sometimes drug smugglers sell their airplanes [if they
| > didn't just steal one for the trip]. If the DEA gets a
| > chance they will hardwire their own transponder in the
| > airplane so it is always on so they can track them. The
new
| > owner finds out that their regular panel mounted
transponder
| > isn't working and then they find the DEA's mounted
somewhere
| > in the belly.
| >
| Is that legal? Adding a transponder kind of affects w&b
and is supposed
| to be written in a logbook somewhere. I know they're the
government, but
| somehow I don't think the FAA would overlook it.

[Jim Macklin]

I don't doubt that, they don't use A&P or avionics guys,
just a handy DEA agent with a pair of pliers.



"Paul Tomblin" > wrote in message
...
| In a previous article, Emily >
said:
| >Jim Macklin wrote:
| >> didn't just steal one for the trip]. If the DEA gets a
| >> chance they will hardwire their own transponder in the
| >> airplane so it is always on so they can track them.
The new
| >Is that legal? Adding a transponder kind of affects w&b
and is supposed
| >to be written in a logbook somewhere. I know they're the
government, but
| >somehow I don't think the FAA would overlook it.
|
| According to some sources, at least one of these illegal
DEA wiring jobs
| was discovered because it caused an in-flight electrical
fire!
|
| --
| Paul Tomblin > http://blog.xcski.com/
| "Dad, I left my heart up there."
| -- Francis Gary Powers after his first flight (age 14)

[Jim Macklin]

No and they don't notify them either. In one case our shop
fixed the panel mount legal transponder and when they rolled
the airplane out for a test the tower called and told them
to shutdown. The tower did know the code was DEA.



"Emily" > wrote in message
. ..
| Newps wrote:
| >
| >
| > Emily wrote:
| >> Jim Macklin wrote:
| >>
| >>> Sometimes drug smugglers sell their airplanes [if they
didn't just
| >>> steal one for the trip]. If the DEA gets a chance
they will hardwire
| >>> their own transponder in the airplane so it is always
on so they can
| >>> track them. The new owner finds out that their
regular panel mounted
| >>> transponder isn't working and then they find the DEA's
mounted
| >>> somewhere in the belly.
| >>>
| >> Is that legal? Adding a transponder kind of affects
w&b and is
| >> supposed to be written in a logbook somewhere. I know
they're the
| >> government, but somehow I don't think the FAA would
overlook it.
| >
| >
| > The FAA is in on it.
|
| But do they violate unsuspecting people who buy a plane
that was
| previously used for drug smuggling? That's what I was
getting at.

[Emily]

Jim Macklin wrote:
> I've seen it a couple of times. The Feds do what they want,
> a two pound ATCRBS doesn't cause any W&B issues. Besides,
> it is the PIC responsibility.
>
>
Of course it's not going to knock the aircraft off CG, but it's still a
requirement to calculate the change.

[Bob Noel]

In article >,
(Paul Tomblin) wrote:

> >I heard a tower controller say:
> >What he said: "I'm not receiving your mode C"
> >What he meant: "Change that (old) discrete code to 1200"
>
> I thought what he meant was "Why the hell aren't you anywhere near your
> assigned altitude?"

The aircraft was in the pattern doing night currency.

--
Bob Noel
Looking for a sig the
lawyers will hate

[Jim Macklin]

Often they do it during a Customs Inspection and other
times, I'm sure during a "ramp check" at 2 AM.


"randall g" > wrote in message
...
| On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 19:32:20 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
| > wrote:
|
| >Sometimes drug smugglers sell their airplanes [if they
| >didn't just steal one for the trip]. If the DEA gets a
| >chance they will hardwire their own transponder in the
| >airplane so it is always on so they can track them. The
new
| >owner finds out that their regular panel mounted
transponder
| >isn't working and then they find the DEA's mounted
somewhere
| >in the belly.
|
|
| ?? How would the DEA get a chance to do that? Do they get
a warrant to
| break into a suspect aircraft and install additional
avionics?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| randall g =%^)> PPASEL+Night 1974 Cardinal RG
| http://www.telemark.net/randallg
| Lots of aerial photographs of British Columbia at:
| http://www.telemark.net/randallg/photos.htm
| Vancouver's famous Kat Kam: http://www.katkam.ca

[Jim Macklin]

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Paul Tomblin" > wrote in message
...
| In a previous article, randall g >
said:
| >?? How would the DEA get a chance to do that? Do they get
a warrant to
| >break into a suspect aircraft and install additional
avionics?
|
| Warrants? The "War On [Some] Drugs" was the training
ground for the sorts
| of unconstitutional excesses that are now part of the "War
On [Some]
| Terrorists".
|
|
| --
| Paul Tomblin > http://blog.xcski.com/
| "Being lectured on fiscal responsibility by George Bush is
like being
| lectured on law and order by Tony Soprano." - John Kerry

[houstondan]

boy, have i enjoyed reading all this thread just now. (while watching
the cards kick the stuffins outta the metz) laughed my butt off
thinking about some faa guy tracking down the source of a black box to
the d.e.a. (as if??) and he's like " this is illegal! " and the dea
guys are looking at him like he just arrived straight from the planet
zernon.

i've had "say altitude" and the rest of that stuff since, till lately,
i'm a pretty local 3000 ft or below flyer. i just like looking down at
all the interesting stuff.

thanks for the entertainment.

dan (it's 5/0 - birds - bottom of 5th...oops - top of 6th )


Emily wrote:
> GeorgeC wrote:
> <snip>
> > To add insult to injury. I was landing at my home base and the airport had a VOR
> > on the field.
>
> Because I am masochist, I decided it would be fun to fly a partial panel
> single engine NDB approach at my home airport one day. Keep in mind I'd
> done the approach at least 30 times, but for some reason was really
> struggling on this particular day. Still, I figured I was at least
> pointed somewhat towards the runway until tower called me.
>
> Tower: Aztec 12345, is that you breaking off the approach?
> Me to safety pilot: What the $#@! is he talking about?
> Me to tower: Ah, negative, Aztec 12345 will break off the approach over
> the numbers.
> Tower: Aztec 12345: Which numbers?
> Safety pilot: Um, maybe you need to look up now.

[Roy Smith]

(Paul Tomblin) wrote:

> One of our club's planes did that for a while, but mostly when talking to
> Rochester Approach. Approach didn't like it much, because it sets off a
> collision alarm - and sometimes the ghost would be squawking 7777, which
> sets off other alarms.

Isn't 7777 a military intercept?

[Newps]

Emily wrote:

>>
>>
>> The FAA is in on it.
>
>
> But do they violate unsuspecting people who buy a plane that was
> previously used for drug smuggling? That's what I was getting at.


No.

[Newps]

Emily wrote:

> Jim Macklin wrote:
>
>> I've seen it a couple of times. The Feds do what they want, a two
>> pound ATCRBS doesn't cause any W&B issues. Besides, it is the PIC
>> responsibility.
>>
>>
> Of course it's not going to knock the aircraft off CG, but it's still a
> requirement to calculate the change.


Not required for a two pound change.

[John Clear]

In article >,
kontiki > wrote:
>
>Today, right after being cleared for takeoff, and while rolling onto on Rwy 36
>at SAV I got a traffic advisory from tower about a 757 on a 3 mile final
>to Rwy 9.
>(for me, that's the lowest altitude I have ever been when receiveing a
>traffic advisory!). I responded with "38H is looking" and made an expeditious
>take-off and got a good glance at the big airplane on the way in maybe a mile
>out as I crossed the intersection.

Not a subtle hint, but going by SFO one time, Norcal called with
"traffic 2 o'clock and three miles, a heavy 747 restricted below
you, report traffic in sight". It is kind of hard to miss a 747
in CAVU when it is coming right at you and passing 500ft below you.

http://www.clear-prop.org/fly-02-20-06/target2.html

John
--
John Clear - http://www.clear-prop.org/

[Emily]

Newps wrote:
>
>
> Emily wrote:
>
>> Jim Macklin wrote:
>>
>>> I've seen it a couple of times. The Feds do what they want, a two
>>> pound ATCRBS doesn't cause any W&B issues. Besides, it is the PIC
>>> responsibility.
>>>
>>>
>> Of course it's not going to knock the aircraft off CG, but it's still
>> a requirement to calculate the change.
>
>
> Not required for a two pound change.

Sorry, I guess I was referring to our company specific requirements...my
mistake.

[Jim Macklin]

Do you think the DEA will bother to tell the suspect pilot
that they need the logbooks to enter the new W&B for the
tracking device they have installed?


"Emily" > wrote in message
. ..
| Jim Macklin wrote:
| > I've seen it a couple of times. The Feds do what they
want,
| > a two pound ATCRBS doesn't cause any W&B issues.
Besides,
| > it is the PIC responsibility.
| >
| >
| Of course it's not going to knock the aircraft off CG, but
it's still a
| requirement to calculate the change.
|

[Emily]

Jim Macklin wrote:
> Do you think the DEA will bother to tell the suspect pilot
> that they need the logbooks to enter the new W&B for the
> tracking device they have installed?

Of course not.
I just get annoyed when people, especially the government, don't follow
the rules.
I know, get used to it.

[GeorgeC]

I should have been well south of the Vance 1B MOA. Just incase I wandered off I
was 2,500 ft below the floor. I was between El Reno, OK (F28) and the Kingfisher
VOR (IFI).

It was a busy Friday afternoon, maybe she was thinking about dropping.

On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 20:46:49 -0500, Emily > wrote:

>GeorgeC wrote:
>> I hear one the other day that I don't know the translation. I was practicing
>> maneuvers with flight following. When approach control ask "N#, how long do you
>> plan on being in that area?" I told her I was heading back to the airport. She
>> said OK and gave me a frequency change (approach control).
>>
>> GeorgeC
>Were you in a inactive MOA or the like? Maybe she just wanted to know
>how long she needed to alert others to your presence..

GeorgeC

[Morgans[_2_]]

"GeorgeC" > wrote in message
...
>I should have been well south of the Vance 1B MOA. Just incase I wandered off I
> was 2,500 ft below the floor. I was between El Reno, OK (F28) and the
> Kingfisher
> VOR (IFI).
>
> It was a busy Friday afternoon, maybe she was thinking about dropping.

I'll bet that was it. You will never know, though. :-(
>
> On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 20:46:49 -0500, Emily > wrote:
>
>>GeorgeC wrote:
>>> I hear one the other day that I don't know the translation. I was practicing
>>> maneuvers with flight following. When approach control ask "N#, how long do
>>> you
>>> plan on being in that area?" I told her I was heading back to the airport.
>>> She
>>> said OK and gave me a frequency change (approach control).
>>>
>>> GeorgeC
>>Were you in a inactive MOA or the like? Maybe she just wanted to know
>>how long she needed to alert others to your presence..
>
> GeorgeC

[Ben Jackson]

On 2006-10-14, kontiki > wrote:
> I really get a kick out of how subtle ATC can be sometimes in giving those
> little "hints" to some pilots.

Not quite the same, but one time I had just departed and was heading
towards Portland's class C while climbing to an altitude where they'd
be able to pick me up on radar. A flurry of radio transmission delayed
my callup and ended with me being pointed out as traffic for a Southwest
737. After that exchange I keyed up to get flight following and gave
my location as "I think I'm that traffic". Simplified giving my location,
but I always wondered if the guy on the other end was thinking, "Why
is this guy on my frequency waiting to call in until he's got a conflict??"

I guess they got me back, since on the return I was flying up the Columbia
and had negotiated a transition along the river past the airport. Right
after that I was handed off to another controller who immediately turned
me 90 degrees so I'd cross midfield.

--
Ben Jackson AD7GD
>
http://www.ben.com/

[Jim Macklin]

Chester: excitedly, "Mr. Dillon, Mr. Dillon, their going to
rob the stage when it gets out of town! What shall we do?"
Marshal Dillon: " Have the passengers surrender their guns
to avoid violence."



--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Emily" > wrote in message
. ..
| Jim Macklin wrote:
| > Do you think the DEA will bother to tell the suspect
pilot
| > that they need the logbooks to enter the new W&B for the
| > tracking device they have installed?
|
| Of course not.
| I just get annoyed when people, especially the government,
don't follow
| the rules.
| I know, get used to it.

[kontiki]

Emily wrote:
>
> Because I am masochist, I decided it would be fun to fly a partial panel
> single engine NDB approach at my home airport one day.

I remember having to do one of those on my instrument check ride. :^0

[kontiki]

randall g wrote:
>
> ?? How would the DEA get a chance to do that? Do they get a warrant to
> break into a suspect aircraft and install additional avionics?


Warrants? We don't need no stinkin' warrants.

[Jim Macklin]

sorry... they're
"Jim Macklin" > wrote
in message news:KsoYg.3031$XX2.1314@dukeread04...
| Chester: excitedly, "Mr. Dillon, Mr. Dillon, [their] going
to
| rob the stage when it gets out of town! What shall we do?"
| Marshal Dillon: " Have the passengers surrender their
guns
| to avoid violence."
|
|
|
| --
| The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
| But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
| http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
| See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and
duties.
|
|
| "Emily" > wrote in message
| . ..
|| Jim Macklin wrote:
|| > Do you think the DEA will bother to tell the suspect
| pilot
|| > that they need the logbooks to enter the new W&B for
the
|| > tracking device they have installed?
||
|| Of course not.
|| I just get annoyed when people, especially the
government,
| don't follow
|| the rules.
|| I know, get used to it.
|
|

[Martin Hotze[_1_]]

On Sun, 15 Oct 2006 00:53:49 GMT, randall g wrote:

>?? How would the DEA get a chance to do that? Do they get a warrant to
>break into a suspect aircraft and install additional avionics?
>

it is the GOVERNMENT. Homeland Security and such. Get used to it!
It is to protect you against terrorism. And if you don't have to hide
anything you will not object, will you?

#m
--
Arabic T-shirt sparks airport row
<http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/5297822.stm>

I Am Not A Terrorist <http://itsnotallbad.com/iamnotaterrorist/>

[Greg Farris]

In article >,
says...
>
>
>Mike Adams wrote:
>> Emily > wrote:
>>
>>> My favorite subtle hint is, "N#, say altitude."
>>
>> Or have them tell you the altimeter setting, as if that's the reason for
>> the altitude discrepancy. (Yea, that must be the reason)
>
>One night Champaign Approach just wouldn't get off my back. He started
>by giving me the altimeter, which I had just received when Indy Center
>had handed me off. I shook my head, looked at the altimeter, yes, it's
>correct. Five minutes later, "N#, recycle your mode C." Huh? By
>this time my altitude, which admittedly had been 50 feet off, was dead
>on and my friend and I were both pretty confused. Approach then called
>another two aircraft, gave them the altimeter setting, and asked them to
>recycle. Another huh. Five minutes later he called me back and asked
>altitude...I replied 6000. He replies back, "Oh, ok. Because I have
>you at 900 and two other aircraft at 650, so I was just wondering what
>was going on."




Years ago, as a student in an older 172, doing one of the X-C requirement
flights, I forgot to reset the DG to the mag compass before takeoff. As luck
would have it, it was off by more than 30 degrees. After takeoff, I knew
something was wrong, but I wasn't sure what. I dutifully called center for
VFR flight following, then continued to wrack my pea-sized brain to figure
out why I wasn't seeing the same landmarks I had seen on my way into that
airport. After a few minutes, as I was about to wander into a Class C outer
area, ATC called and asked me "Please say intended itinerary to x" I told
them exactly what it said on my flight log, and they replied "Got it, thank
you" They didn't say any more - they didn't need to say any more. I made a
slow turn to the left, and in turning I recognized enough terrain features to
understand approximately what direction I needed to be going. After pointing
the plane in approximately this direction, it dawned on me what the error
was, and I was able to quickly orient my present location (brushing up
against a busy Class C) and get back on track.

GF

[Jim Macklin]

A pre-purchase inspection should be as thorough as an
annual, all the holes and spaces should be examined for
corrosion, damage and left-over forgotten drugs. This
applies to airplanes and cars equally.


"B A R R Y" > wrote in
message ...
| On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 19:32:20 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
| > wrote:
|
| >Sometimes drug smugglers sell their airplanes [if they
| >didn't just steal one for the trip]. If the DEA gets a
| >chance they will hardwire their own transponder in the
| >airplane so it is always on so they can track them. The
new
| >owner finds out that their regular panel mounted
transponder
| >isn't working and then they find the DEA's mounted
somewhere
| >in the belly.
| >
|
| Fortunately, ours was simply defective.

[Paul Tomblin]

In a previous article, said:
>I hear one the other day that I don't know the translation. I was practicing
>maneuvers with flight following. When approach control ask "N#, how long do you
>plan on being in that area?" I told her I was heading back to the airport. She
>said OK and gave me a frequency change (approach control).

That happened to me a few times because I'd wandered over the line
separating the two approach frequencies at that airport. If I was
planning to stay there a while, they would switch me to the other
frequency, but if I was planning to head back the way I'd come, they'd
leave me on the frequency I was on.


--
Paul Tomblin > http://blog.xcski.com/
[Once in a lifetime opportunity] is simply a veiled reference to the staff
contract termination procedure, which involves a sunny wall, a single
cigarette and some middling to average marksmen... -- Dan Holdsworth

[Dan Luke]

Subtle landing criticisms are my favorites:

"Cessna '78Lima, if able, turn right on taxiway Hotel..."

-said to student pilot me after my third bounce. Taxiway Hotel was 7,000
ft. away.



"Citation 3CharlieCharlie, for future reference, one-four has 9,000 ft.
available,"

-to a Citation crew that stopped 10 ft. short of the end of 18.

--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

[Emily]

Martin Hotze wrote:
> On Sun, 15 Oct 2006 00:53:49 GMT, randall g wrote:
>
>> ?? How would the DEA get a chance to do that? Do they get a warrant to
>> break into a suspect aircraft and install additional avionics?
>>
>
> it is the GOVERNMENT. Homeland Security and such. Get used to it!
> It is to protect you against terrorism. And if you don't have to hide
> anything you will not object, will you?
>
> #m
I can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not....

[Emily]

Jim Macklin wrote:
> A pre-purchase inspection should be as thorough as an
> annual, all the holes and spaces should be examined for
> corrosion, damage and left-over forgotten drugs. This
> applies to airplanes and cars equally.

Does this mean I need to brave the rain and go inspect my new car for
left over drugs? Problem is, as a law abiding citizen, I wouldn't know
where to start looking. I put stuff I carry around in my car in the trunk.

[Gene Seibel]

Sometimes more than a hint. Had ground at an unfamiliar airport tell
me, "If you don't know where you are, stay there." Had some people in
the plane that never let me forget it.....
--
Gene Seibel
Tales of Flight - http://pad39a.com/gene/tales.html
Because I fly, I envy no one.



kontiki wrote:
> I really get a kick out of how subtle ATC can be sometimes in giving those
> little "hints" to some pilots. I've heard lots of interesting ones over time
> that have given me a chuckle while flying along. It got me to thinking about
> what some of the more funny ones you guys have heard over the years.
>

[Martin Hotze[_1_]]

On Sun, 15 Oct 2006 11:30:51 -0500, Emily wrote:

>> it is the GOVERNMENT. Homeland Security and such. Get used to it!
>> It is to protect you against terrorism. And if you don't have to hide
>> anything you will not object, will you?
>>
>> #m
>I can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not....

I'm never sarcastic. *BEG*


#m, land of the free (and the brave).
--
Arabic T-shirt sparks airport row
<http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/5297822.stm>

I Am Not A Terrorist <http://itsnotallbad.com/iamnotaterrorist/>

[Gerry Caron]

"Emily" > wrote in message
...
>
> Does this mean I need to brave the rain and go inspect my new car for left
> over drugs? Problem is, as a law abiding citizen, I wouldn't know where
> to start looking. I put stuff I carry around in my car in the trunk.

The AF routinely does random searches of vehicles on all AF Bases. They
would periodically remind people buying used vehicles to take them to
Security Police and have them let the drug dog search it. If the dog found
anything, it was no harm, no foul. It could save you a lot of trouble
trying to explain it away if you got caught on a random search 4 or 5 months
later.

Gerry

[Mike Granby]

I heard one at Newark the other week. An airliner had got its taxi
clearance, and appeared confused where to go. "Do you want us on
foxtrot or golf?"* asked the pilot. "Golf", replied the hurried
controller, "It's right in front of you." "But isn't that foxtrot?"
came back the pilot. The controller was having none of it: "Look, how
hard can this be? There's about twenty planes in line for the runway.
Just follow everyone else and you'll get there."

* Can't remember the exact taxiways.

[Marty Shapiro]

"Dan Luke" > wrote in
:

>
> Subtle landing criticisms are my favorites:
>
> "Cessna '78Lima, if able, turn right on taxiway Hotel..."
>
> -said to student pilot me after my third bounce. Taxiway Hotel was
> 7,000 ft. away.
>
>
>
> "Citation 3CharlieCharlie, for future reference, one-four has 9,000
> ft. available,"
>
> -to a Citation crew that stopped 10 ft. short of the end of 18.
>

Tower to an MD 11 that ballooned and landed long at SJC: Turn right
at Mike if able. Otherwise turn right on De La Cruz, 101 South, exit
Guadaloupe.

--
Marty Shapiro
Silicon Rallye Inc.

(remove SPAMNOT to email me)

[Jim Macklin]

Depending on what might be in the hidden spaces, you could
go the jail for a long time if the dope smuggler left even a
small bag of heroin or such in a fender or under the seats.

As a note, whenever the police start a new daily shift,
their car is fully inspected so that any contraband found
can be pinned on the arrestee they just had in the car.



"Emily" > wrote in message
...
| Jim Macklin wrote:
| > A pre-purchase inspection should be as thorough as an
| > annual, all the holes and spaces should be examined for
| > corrosion, damage and left-over forgotten drugs. This
| > applies to airplanes and cars equally.
|
| Does this mean I need to brave the rain and go inspect my
new car for
| left over drugs? Problem is, as a law abiding citizen, I
wouldn't know
| where to start looking. I put stuff I carry around in my
car in the trunk.

[Emily]

Jim Macklin wrote:
> Depending on what might be in the hidden spaces, you could
> go the jail for a long time if the dope smuggler left even a
> small bag of heroin or such in a fender or under the seats.

As I pointed out, I wouldn't even know where to look. I've never broken
a law in my life (administrative stuff doesn't count!)

[Al G[_1_]]

"kontiki" > wrote in message
...
>I really get a kick out of how subtle ATC can be sometimes in giving those
> little "hints" to some pilots. I've heard lots of interesting ones over
> time
> that have given me a chuckle while flying along. It got me to thinking
> about
> what some of the more funny ones you guys have heard over the years.
>
> Today, right after being cleared for takeoff, and while rolling onto on
> Rwy 36
> at SAV I got a traffic advisory from tower about a 757 on a 3 mile final
> to Rwy 9.
> (for me, that's the lowest altitude I have ever been when receiveing a
> traffic advisory!). I responded with "38H is looking" and made an
> expeditious
> take-off and got a good glance at the big airplane on the way in maybe a
> mile
> out as I crossed the intersection.
>
> Wish I could recall a few of the more funny ones, but telling stories is
> really
> not my forte, sorta like you have to be there.
>
The special VFR hint:

The weather is 1500 broken, and 2 1/2 miles when the Private Pilot
calls ground and announces "Taxi to the active with Hotel...".
The guy working ground comes back with "Weather 1500broken, 2 1/2 in
fog, the field is IFR, is there anything "SPECIAL" I can do for you?


Al G

[GeorgeC]

Our airport has parallel runways. one is 7200x150 and the other is 5000x75.
Tower: N#, clear to land 17 right.
Transient: Clear to land 17 right.
A little while later.
Tower: N#, clear to land 17 RIGHT.
Transient: Clear to land 17 right??
Tower: N#, that's the short runway.

GeorgeC

[Emily]

Al G wrote:
<snip>
>>
> The special VFR hint:
>
> The weather is 1500 broken, and 2 1/2 miles when the Private Pilot
> calls ground and announces "Taxi to the active with Hotel...".
> The guy working ground comes back with "Weather 1500broken, 2 1/2 in
> fog, the field is IFR, is there anything "SPECIAL" I can do for you?

I once sat behind a guy in a 172 who just didn't get it. Ground finally
told him to shut down and go inside and ask someone what it meant when
he asked if there was anything special he could do. It was freaking
painful to hear.

[Dan Luke]

"Emily" wrote:

>> The special VFR hint:
>>
>> The weather is 1500 broken, and 2 1/2 miles when the Private Pilot
>> calls ground and announces "Taxi to the active with Hotel...".
>> The guy working ground comes back with "Weather 1500broken, 2 1/2 in
>> fog, the field is IFR, is there anything "SPECIAL" I can do for you?
>
> I once sat behind a guy in a 172 who just didn't get it. Ground finally
> told him to shut down and go inside and ask someone what it meant when he
> asked if there was anything special he could do.


If I were a controller, there's no way in hell I would do this.

Why would I want my voice on tape helping some clueless twit figure out how
to kill himself?

--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

[Al G[_1_]]

"Dan Luke" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Emily" wrote:
>
>>> The special VFR hint:
>>>
>>> The weather is 1500 broken, and 2 1/2 miles when the Private Pilot
>>> calls ground and announces "Taxi to the active with Hotel...".
>>> The guy working ground comes back with "Weather 1500broken, 2 1/2 in
>>> fog, the field is IFR, is there anything "SPECIAL" I can do for you?
>>
>> I once sat behind a guy in a 172 who just didn't get it. Ground finally
>> told him to shut down and go inside and ask someone what it meant when he
>> asked if there was anything special he could do.
>
>
> If I were a controller, there's no way in hell I would do this.
>
> Why would I want my voice on tape helping some clueless twit figure out
> how to kill himself?
>
> --
> Dan
> C172RG at BFM
>

Yea, you are probably right. I was there, and the weather wasn't that
bad, and was VERY local. 1 mile in any direction, and you would be out of
it. It was clearing after morning fog, so the forecasts were good also. Any
of my graduates would have been long gone, but then I teach the AIM pretty
heavily.

Al G

[Emily]

Dan Luke wrote:
> "Emily" wrote:
>
>>> The special VFR hint:
>>>
>>> The weather is 1500 broken, and 2 1/2 miles when the Private Pilot
>>> calls ground and announces "Taxi to the active with Hotel...".
>>> The guy working ground comes back with "Weather 1500broken, 2 1/2 in
>>> fog, the field is IFR, is there anything "SPECIAL" I can do for you?
>> I once sat behind a guy in a 172 who just didn't get it. Ground finally
>> told him to shut down and go inside and ask someone what it meant when he
>> asked if there was anything special he could do.
>
>
> If I were a controller, there's no way in hell I would do this.
>
> Why would I want my voice on tape helping some clueless twit figure out how
> to kill himself?
>
Maybe the controllers here can clue us in, but that's why they can't
offer a special VFR clearance. After all, if they ask if there's
anything special they can do, it's hard to prove they meant to hint at a
special VFR clearance.

I was leaving IFR in my above story, btw...no way would I have gone VFR.

[Jim Macklin]

I was in the tower at RVS [Tulsa Jones] . The weather was
zero-zero, we could look down from the tower cab and just
see airplanes on the ramp directly below. Anything more
than 150 feet away was gone. Tops in the area were being
reported as about 3000 feet. It was below commercial
take-off minimums for many operators.

We heard an airplane start their engine just below the tower
at a flight school ramp. Figured it was a mechanic. Then
the tower gets a call, "Cessna xxxxx ready to taxi VFR."
Ground says, "the airport is below VFR minimums, what are
your intentions?"
"How about a special?"
"The control zone [it was a while ago] is below SVFR, what
are your intentions?"

"I guess I'll go get a cup of coffee and check the
forecast."



"Dan Luke" > wrote in message
...
|
| "Emily" wrote:
|
| >> The special VFR hint:
| >>
| >> The weather is 1500 broken, and 2 1/2 miles when
the Private Pilot
| >> calls ground and announces "Taxi to the active with
Hotel...".
| >> The guy working ground comes back with "Weather
1500broken, 2 1/2 in
| >> fog, the field is IFR, is there anything "SPECIAL" I
can do for you?
| >
| > I once sat behind a guy in a 172 who just didn't get it.
Ground finally
| > told him to shut down and go inside and ask someone what
it meant when he
| > asked if there was anything special he could do.
|
|
| If I were a controller, there's no way in hell I would do
this.
|
| Why would I want my voice on tape helping some clueless
twit figure out how
| to kill himself?
|
| --
| Dan
| C172RG at BFM
|
|

[Roy Smith]

> > If I were a controller, there's no way in hell I would do this.
> >
> > Why would I want my voice on tape helping some clueless twit figure out
> > how to kill himself?

I was leaving HPN one morning. It was one of those funny days where there
was no practical impediment to visual navigation, but a few oddly placed
low clouds in just the wrong places force the tower to declare the field
IFR from time to time.

Some guy landed and the ground controller launched into a full ground
school lesson plan. He apologized profusely to the pilot for NY Approach
not letting him in earlier that morning, explained to him how weather
observations worked, special VFR worked, why the rules made it impossible
for the controller to have suggested this to the pilot while he was still
in the air, etc, etc.

[Christopher Range]

kontiki wrote:
> I really get a kick out of how subtle ATC can be sometimes in giving those
> little "hints" to some pilots. I've heard lots of interesting ones over
> time
> that have given me a chuckle while flying along. It got me to thinking
> about
> what some of the more funny ones you guys have heard over the years.
>
> Today, right after being cleared for takeoff, and while rolling onto on
> Rwy 36
> at SAV I got a traffic advisory from tower about a 757 on a 3 mile final
> to Rwy 9.
> (for me, that's the lowest altitude I have ever been when receiveing a
> traffic advisory!). I responded with "38H is looking" and made an
> expeditious
> take-off and got a good glance at the big airplane on the way in maybe a
> mile
> out as I crossed the intersection.
>
> Wish I could recall a few of the more funny ones, but telling stories is
> really
> not my forte, sorta like you have to be there.
>
It sounds a little like the part in the movie 'Airplane' where the male
n' female PA announcers are arguing over the PA about no parking in a
red or white zone.

The ones' in the movie are not subtle but, the same general silliness.

[Bob Chilcoat]

OSU tower to me the first time I landed there, in heavy haze:
"N44511, clear to land, 27 left.
Me: "Clear to land 27 left."
I can only see one runway in the haze.
Me: "N44511 is unfamilar. Are 27 left and right close together?"
Tower, just as I see a much shorter runway way over to the right: "27 left
is the one with the L on it."

Crap


--
Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)


"GeorgeC" > wrote in message
...
> Our airport has parallel runways. one is 7200x150 and the other is
> 5000x75.
> Tower: N#, clear to land 17 right.
> Transient: Clear to land 17 right.
> A little while later.
> Tower: N#, clear to land 17 RIGHT.
> Transient: Clear to land 17 right??
> Tower: N#, that's the short runway.
>
> GeorgeC

[Bob Martin]

Emily wrote:

> That's a good question - how many pilots admit to the controller that
> they were just caught being stupid? I was caught once tracking the
> wrong VOR and he called me on it. No way to bluff your way out of that
> one.

Yeah, did something similar on my long cross-country... put the Columbus
(CSG) VOR in the GPS instead of KCSG, while coming from Tuskegee, AL
(06A). The VOR is something like 8-10 miles north of the field, so I
was probably about 30 degrees off course. There aren't many landmarks
out that way, so I basically tried to use the GPS to navigate the
30-mile stretch. Called up approach, and they politely asked me where I
thought I was going. They gave me vectors to the field. Eventually,
after I got back home, I reported the GPS as having been messed up; I
think they sent a mechanic or two to look at it. Didn't dawn on me what
I had done for a week or two.

[Rotor&Wings]

New York Approach screwed up and gave us a crossing altitude of 11,000 feet, we were at FL310 and about 20 miles from the fix. My FO replied we would give it our best. The controller comes back and says " Don't those 727's have speed brakes?" to which I replied "Roger that, but those are for MY mistakes, not yours"........................

[Mike Isaksen]

<Rotor&amp>; "Wings" ...
> New York Approach screwed up and gave us a crossing altitude of 11,000
> feet, we were at FL310 and about 20 miles from the fix. My FO replied
> we would give it our best. The controller comes back and says " Don't
> those 727's have speed brakes?" to which I replied "Roger that, but
> those are for MY mistakes, not yours"........................

Isn't that the normal "setup & dump" into LGA? ;-)

[Rotor&Wings]

Rotor&amp; "Wings" ...
New York Approach screwed up and gave us a crossing altitude of 11,000
feet, we were at FL310 and about 20 miles from the fix. My FO replied
we would give it our best. The controller comes back and says " Don't
those 727's have speed brakes?" to which I replied "Roger that, but
those are for MY mistakes, not yours"........................

Isn't that the normal "setup & dump" into LGA? ;-)

not really.

[Steven P. McNicoll[_1_]]

"Roy Smith" > wrote in message
...
>
> Isn't 7777 a military intercept?
>

Yes, the National Beacon Code Allocation Plan assigns 7777 to DoD
interceptor aircraft on active air defense missions and operating without
ATC clearance.