Preparing for a XC : Bathroom Breaks

[TF]

I've mastered fuel management now the hardest part. How to manage mine and
my wife's bathroom breaks. Our trips are typically 3 to 3.5 hours but our
blatters don't always make it thus forci6ng a stop. Thats a big 30 min
addition to the trip. On my last filight I filed two flight plans and then
called ATC to open the next flight plan when we felt we could make it all
the way without the stop. Seemed to work.

Any suggestions on preflight preparations that have worked for others ? No
coffee before the flight ? No liquids xxx hours before leaving etc. etc.
Sort of like preparing for an operations.

Thanks.
Holding it in

[Vaughn Simon]

"TF" > wrote in message
. ..
>
> Any suggestions on preflight preparations that have worked for others ? No
> coffee before the flight ? No liquids xxx hours before leaving etc. etc. Sort
> of like preparing for an operations.

Dehydration gives no warning and can seriously degrade your pilot skills
just when you need them most. Drink normally and use piddle packs to extend
your range if you really don't want to land. Some glider pilots make their own
with freezer bags and the gel that is found in some diapers. There are also
products made to accommodate the female anatomy.

On the other hand, having a desperate urge to pee and no place to do it can
also degrade your performance. Always have a plan. On my little x-country
flights, I always pack a bottle of water. It is always nice to have the water
should I happen to get thirsty, but In a pinch that bottle could be very useful!

Vaughn

[john smith]

In article >,
"TF" > wrote:
> Any suggestions on preflight preparations that have worked for others ? No
> coffee before the flight ? No liquids xxx hours before leaving etc. etc.
> Sort of like preparing for an operations.

Do not drink anything later than one-hour prior to flight.
Immediately prior to departure, go to the toilet and clear out whatever
you have.
For 3-3.5 hour legs, wait until one-hour prior to arrival before
drinking. When you do drink, drink only water and only in small sips.
You should then be able to make it to your destination before the urge
for relief hits.

[Mxsmanic]

TF writes:

> Any suggestions on preflight preparations that have worked for others ? No
> coffee before the flight ? No liquids xxx hours before leaving etc. etc.
> Sort of like preparing for an operations.

Make sure you are well hydrated in advance of the flight, but don't
drink much in the way of fluids in the last 3 hours or so. Avoid
anything with caffeine in it. Avoid alcohol (but you'll be doing that
anyway). Be sure the cabin is comfortably warm while you are flying
and avoid very cold temperatures prior the flight (cold produces
diuresis). If you are thirsty before the flight, you didn't drink
enough in advance. Make sure your thirst is quenched in the hours
before the flight, then avoid much in the way of drinks in the last
three hours or so. Avoid eating more than a snack during the same
period.

Bring something to drink along on the flight. If you get thirsty, you
can sip your drinks. If your flight is three hours, typically by the
time the stuff you drink on board starts to find its way to your
kidneys (if it does--it won't if you truly need the hydration), you'll
be back on the ground.

For emergencies, you might want to bring along urine collection
devices.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Mxsmanic]

Vaughn Simon writes:

> Dehydration gives no warning and can seriously degrade your pilot skills
> just when you need them most.

Dehydration most certainly does give a warning: thirst. If you get
thirsty, drink. If you're not thirsty, you're not dehydrated. You
won't dehydrate enough in three hours to have any effect on your
flying ability unless it is extraordinarily hot inside the aircraft.
Make sure you are hydrated before the flight and you'll be fine.

> On the other hand, having a desperate urge to pee and no place to do it can
> also degrade your performance.

Much more so than the subclinical dehydration that might occur on a
short flight of three hours.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Jay Honeck]

> Any suggestions on preflight preparations that have worked for others ? No
> coffee before the flight ? No liquids xxx hours before leaving etc. etc.

My wife and two kids have flown cross country for the last 12 years,
and have successfully flown legs as long as 5 hours without a potty
break. This is a real trick, with two little kids!

The night before a long flight, don't drink alcohol. The morning
before a flight, consume no more than a single cup of coffee, and no
pop. There is nothing worse than drinking a diuretic before launching
to make for a crossed-leg landing.

Drink no water before a long flight, either. Bring along a small
container of water, and sip it often -- but only enough to wet your
mouth. Trust me, it's better to be a bit dehydrated when you land,
than to be dying to pee.

Bring along potty bags/sick sacks. Make sure they are the BIG ones,
with the absorbent gel. Because you have them, you probably won't use
them.

(It's funny, but *knowing* that they are on board makes NOT peeing much
easier. If you forget them, and you *know* you forgot them, you will
think of nothing but peeing... ;-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkinn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Kyle Boatright]

"TF" > wrote in message
. ..
> I've mastered fuel management now the hardest part. How to manage mine
> and my wife's bathroom breaks. Our trips are typically 3 to 3.5 hours but
> our blatters don't always make it thus forci6ng a stop. Thats a big 30 min
> addition to the trip. On my last filight I filed two flight plans and
> then called ATC to open the next flight plan when we felt we could make it
> all the way without the stop. Seemed to work.
>
> Any suggestions on preflight preparations that have worked for others ?
> No coffee before the flight ? No liquids xxx hours before leaving etc.
> etc. Sort of like preparing for an operations.
>
> Thanks.
> Holding it in

I'm usually a two diet coke before going to work (or the airport) kinda guy,
but when I'm flying X/C I limit my intake to maybe 3/4 of a can, and make
sure that's an hour or more before departure so I can unload most of it at
the FBO prior to departure.

My airplane has a control stick and not a whole lot of room, so piddle packs
and/or a porta-john really are not options.

One of our routine trips is between Dallas TX and Atlanta. The airplane
will do it in 4 hours or less, but unless we're in a real hurry to get
someplace, we usually set down in Mississippi, just to stretch out and use
the bathroom. It makes for a more enjoyable flight than having to
figuratively cross your legs and pray that there isn't any turbulence for
the last 1/2 hour of the trip. Also, you can plan the stop for a field with
the services you desire.

Additionally, it is really futile to try and tough it out, then have to land
at some little armpit airport 30 minutes from home (after crossing your legs
for an hour) 'cause you realized that you didn't have a 4 hour bladder in
the first place...

Beyond that, the airplane has about 4.5 - 4.75 hours of fuel capacity, and I
feel a lot more comfortable planning to arrive at my destination with an
hour or more of fuel on board. Runways do get closed unexpectedly from time
to time, winds can drive you to alternate airfields, and there is always the
chance that you didn't get the last gallon or two into each of the tanks.

KB

[Tony]

TF, take no coffee or other diuretics for three hours before take off.
Drink water sparingly, but if thirsty aloft, drink some water.

You and your wife do not have wait until a flight to see if your
bladder endurance is what you want it to be. Go shopping and to a
movie, and call the start of the trip the ETD. From ETD minus 3 hours,
drink only water sparingly. Void before leaving to go shopping -- "I
don't have to go" is not an acceptable excuse.

Then go do your thing, have sips -- SIPS!!!!! -- of water from time to
time, and pay attention to how you both are feeling. See if you can get
to ETD plus 4 hours (it may take a time or two before you can do that.
This is an especially good practice because you'll be aware of what
you're trying to do, and it will make you more aware of your needs for
relief.

Try it a few times. Keep this in mind: you probably both go for many
hours when you're asleep. If, however, one or the other of you is
getting up every two or three hours at night, you'll just have to plan
shorter flight legs.

If these 'low and slow' flights work, do the same pre flight routine
for the real thing, void at the FBO before take off, and be confident
your personal tanks will not be full before the airplane's are getting
close to minimal reserves.

Good luck.

Oh, one other thing: don't try to be a hero. If the need is there, tell
ATC you want to land and do a personal weight and balance adjustment.
Too full a bladder IS a hazard to safe flight.


On Jan 24, 8:15 pm, "TF" > wrote:
> I've mastered fuel management now the hardest part. How to manage mine and
> my wife's bathroom breaks. Our trips are typically 3 to 3.5 hours but our
> blatters don't always make it thus forci6ng a stop. Thats a big 30 min
> addition to the trip. On my last filight I filed two flight plans and then
> called ATC to open the next flight plan when we felt we could make it all
> the way without the stop. Seemed to work.
>
> Any suggestions on preflight preparations that have worked for others ? No
> coffee before the flight ? No liquids xxx hours before leaving etc. etc.
> Sort of like preparing for an operations.
>
> Thanks.
> Holding it in

[Tony]

I had another thing worth sharing. In the hot summer time, I suggest
you get a couple of pint or half liter water bottles, fill them to
about 80%, then freeze them. Use them as your drinking water when
aloft. The thaw rate is often a nice moderator on how fast they'll
empty, they'll be cold for hours.

For golf I do that with Gater Aid or other sports drinks in liter
bottles -- walking hilly courses in hot weather is thirsty work. The
Army tells its members if they are doing hard work in the summer, that
if they are not ****ing they are not drinking enough. Thirst is NOT a
good measure of need in those circumstances.


On Jan 24, 10:03 pm, "Tony" > wrote:
> TF, take no coffee or other diuretics for three hours before take off.
> Drink water sparingly, but if thirsty aloft, drink some water.
>
> You and your wife do not have wait until a flight to see if your
> bladder endurance is what you want it to be. Go shopping and to a
> movie, and call the start of the trip the ETD. From ETD minus 3 hours,
> drink only water sparingly. Void before leaving to go shopping -- "I
> don't have to go" is not an acceptable excuse.
>
> Then go do your thing, have sips -- SIPS!!!!! -- of water from time to
> time, and pay attention to how you both are feeling. See if you can get
> to ETD plus 4 hours (it may take a time or two before you can do that.
> This is an especially good practice because you'll be aware of what
> you're trying to do, and it will make you more aware of your needs for
> relief.
>
> Try it a few times. Keep this in mind: you probably both go for many
> hours when you're asleep. If, however, one or the other of you is
> getting up every two or three hours at night, you'll just have to plan
> shorter flight legs.
>
> If these 'low and slow' flights work, do the same pre flight routine
> for the real thing, void at the FBO before take off, and be confident
> your personal tanks will not be full before the airplane's are getting
> close to minimal reserves.
>
> Good luck.
>
> Oh, one other thing: don't try to be a hero. If the need is there, tell
> ATC you want to land and do a personal weight and balance adjustment.
> Too full a bladder IS a hazard to safe flight.
>
> On Jan 24, 8:15 pm, "TF" > wrote:
>
>
>
> > I've mastered fuel management now the hardest part. How to manage mine and
> > my wife's bathroom breaks. Our trips are typically 3 to 3.5 hours but our
> > blatters don't always make it thus forci6ng a stop. Thats a big 30 min
> > addition to the trip. On my last filight I filed two flight plans and then
> > called ATC to open the next flight plan when we felt we could make it all
> > the way without the stop. Seemed to work.
>
> > Any suggestions on preflight preparations that have worked for others ? No
> > coffee before the flight ? No liquids xxx hours before leaving etc. etc.
> > Sort of like preparing for an operations.
>
> > Thanks.
> > Holding it in- Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text -

[Grumman-581[_1_]]

On Wed, 24 Jan 2007 20:15:26 -0500, in
>, TF wrote:
> Any suggestions on preflight preparations that have worked for others ? No
> coffee before the flight ? No liquids xxx hours before leaving etc. etc.
> Sort of like preparing for an operations.

You could always get a relief tube installed in your aircraft... Makes it
so much more fun when you fly over certain people's houses... <evil-grin>

For your wife, well, she can wear a pair of Depends... Hell, women are
used to having bodily fluids leaking from them anyway and having to take
measures for it, so wearing a pair of Depends shouldn't be too much to
ask, right? OK, so wearing a pair of Depends might clash with her thong
panties, but I won't tell if you won't...

If I'm flying alone, my plane has a 5-hour range... If I'm with Grace or
our daughter, a 3-hour range is probably pushing it... Damn women have
bladder capacities of a thimble... Driving across country is not any
better... For me, I stop when I need gas... For them, I have to stop at
ever damn rest stop I see along the highway in addition to when I need to
refuel...

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN[_2_]]

Jay Honeck wrote:
> Bring along potty bags/sick sacks. Make sure they are the BIG ones,
> with the absorbent gel. Because you have them, you probably won't use
> them.



I have a buddy who was flying over Gainesville, FL in a C-172 one fine evening
when he had a sudden urge to void. Since he was by himself, privacy wasn't a
consideration, but he was at 8,000 feet and didn't want to land. He looked
around and decided a sick-sack was a dandy solution. Said he did a pretty good
job of using it without spilling any, too.

But then what to do with it?

Well, it wasn't like he knew anybody down below. He opened the window....

As you know, the Road to Hell is paved with good intentions. The wind hit the
bag and it exploded before he could drop it. The back seat got a pretty good
spray along with the side of the aircraft and (I assume) my friend. He didn't
give me a lot of details but suggested I not try it myself.

Me? I pee out by the tail of the airplane right before I get in if I'm out in
the sticks... in the FBO if I'm not. But I've never had a problem holding it
all day long if necessary.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

[Jim Macklin]

Little John
Item Number: 6462A
Price: $7.95
Sporty's
Clermont County/Sporty's Airport
Batavia, OH 45103
Phone: 1.800.SPORTYS
Fax: 1.800.359.7794
Website: sportys.com


A convenient, spill-proof portable urinal that can also be
used for motion sickness. Cap screws on tightly to prevent
spills. Constructed of durable plastic and is reusable. Used
in hospitals for years. Holds 32 oz. and can be used with
the Lady J Adapter (sold separately).


"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
message
...
| Jay Honeck wrote:
| > Bring along potty bags/sick sacks. Make sure they are
the BIG ones,
| > with the absorbent gel. Because you have them, you
probably won't use
| > them.
|
|
|
| I have a buddy who was flying over Gainesville, FL in a
C-172 one fine evening
| when he had a sudden urge to void. Since he was by
himself, privacy wasn't a
| consideration, but he was at 8,000 feet and didn't want to
land. He looked
| around and decided a sick-sack was a dandy solution. Said
he did a pretty good
| job of using it without spilling any, too.
|
| But then what to do with it?
|
| Well, it wasn't like he knew anybody down below. He
opened the window....
|
| As you know, the Road to Hell is paved with good
intentions. The wind hit the
| bag and it exploded before he could drop it. The back
seat got a pretty good
| spray along with the side of the aircraft and (I assume)
my friend. He didn't
| give me a lot of details but suggested I not try it
myself.
|
| Me? I pee out by the tail of the airplane right before I
get in if I'm out in
| the sticks... in the FBO if I'm not. But I've never had a
problem holding it
| all day long if necessary.
|
|
|
| --
| Mortimer Schnerd, RN
| mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com
|
|

[RomeoMike]

Mxsmanic wrote:

>If you're not thirsty, you're not dehydrated.

Well, you may get thirsty before dehydrating while playing with your joy
stick, but people who work and play in hot climates know that that is
not true. Physiologists know that dehydration can precede thirst. The
military knows it in training troops. Pro sports teams know it. Serious
hikers know it. All plan appropriate water consumption based on planned
fluid losses, not thirst. You also imply in another post in this thread
that the kidneys won't make urine if one is dehydrated:
>"If your flight is three hours, typically by the
> time the stuff you drink on board starts to find its way to your
> kidneys (if it does--it won't if you truly need the hydration)..."

That's not so either, unless you're going into shock. Try not making
bold statements on health issues. You are obviously not qualified.

[Mxsmanic]

Tony writes:

> For golf I do that with Gater Aid or other sports drinks in liter
> bottles -- walking hilly courses in hot weather is thirsty work. The
> Army tells its members if they are doing hard work in the summer, that
> if they are not ****ing they are not drinking enough. Thirst is NOT a
> good measure of need in those circumstances.

Thirst is reliable except for heavy, short-term exertion, especially
in warm weather, when one may lose water very quickly. But the Army
is right--as long as your bladder is filling every three hours or so,
you're not dehydrated. If you go all day without having to urinate,
you need to drink a lot more water.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Thomas Borchert]

Tf,

> No
> coffee before the flight ?

That helps a lot for me.

>No liquids xxx hours before leaving etc. etc.

That has the inherent danger of dehydration. I drink even during the
flight. Absolutely necessary for my well-being.

If your wife is the only passenger, "travel toilets" like this one
http://www.aeromedix.com/?_siteid=aeromedix&_sessid=63c84962bf491e9dabbda14
25d83afbb&action=cat&catid=tj make sense.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Tony]

My 'brain bag' contains a half dozen zip lock plastic bags, gallon
size, at least one of which has prepackaged wash and drys, paper
towels, tissues and so forth in it. These make great sick bags and for
the px who are equipt with kick stands, a safe and sealable urine
collection/safekeeping device.

Be sure to test all of the advice you've been given here against your
own logic and the credibility of the advice giver. Even non-pilots can
offer reasonable and practical advice, but that's probably not where to
place your bet.




On Jan 24, 10:14 pm, "Tony" > wrote:
> I had another thing worth sharing. In the hot summer time, I suggest
> you get a couple of pint or half liter water bottles, fill them to
> about 80%, then freeze them. Use them as your drinking water when
> aloft. The thaw rate is often a nice moderator on how fast they'll
> empty, they'll be cold for hours.
>
> For golf I do that with Gater Aid or other sports drinks in liter
> bottles -- walking hilly courses in hot weather is thirsty work. The
> Army tells its members if they are doing hard work in the summer, that
> if they are not ****ing they are not drinking enough. Thirst is NOT a
> good measure of need in those circumstances.
>
> On Jan 24, 10:03 pm, "Tony" > wrote:
>
>
>
> > TF, take no coffee or other diuretics for three hours before take off.
> > Drink water sparingly, but if thirsty aloft, drink some water.
>
> > You and your wife do not have wait until a flight to see if your
> > bladder endurance is what you want it to be. Go shopping and to a
> > movie, and call the start of the trip the ETD. From ETD minus 3 hours,
> > drink only water sparingly. Void before leaving to go shopping -- "I
> > don't have to go" is not an acceptable excuse.
>
> > Then go do your thing, have sips -- SIPS!!!!! -- of water from time to
> > time, and pay attention to how you both are feeling. See if you can get
> > to ETD plus 4 hours (it may take a time or two before you can do that.
> > This is an especially good practice because you'll be aware of what
> > you're trying to do, and it will make you more aware of your needs for
> > relief.
>
> > Try it a few times. Keep this in mind: you probably both go for many
> > hours when you're asleep. If, however, one or the other of you is
> > getting up every two or three hours at night, you'll just have to plan
> > shorter flight legs.
>
> > If these 'low and slow' flights work, do the same pre flight routine
> > for the real thing, void at the FBO before take off, and be confident
> > your personal tanks will not be full before the airplane's are getting
> > close to minimal reserves.
>
> > Good luck.
>
> > Oh, one other thing: don't try to be a hero. If the need is there, tell
> > ATC you want to land and do a personal weight and balance adjustment.
> > Too full a bladder IS a hazard to safe flight.
>
> > On Jan 24, 8:15 pm, "TF" > wrote:
>
> > > I've mastered fuel management now the hardest part. How to manage mine and
> > > my wife's bathroom breaks. Our trips are typically 3 to 3.5 hours but our
> > > blatters don't always make it thus forci6ng a stop. Thats a big 30 min
> > > addition to the trip. On my last filight I filed two flight plans and then
> > > called ATC to open the next flight plan when we felt we could make it all
> > > the way without the stop. Seemed to work.
>
> > > Any suggestions on preflight preparations that have worked for others ? No
> > > coffee before the flight ? No liquids xxx hours before leaving etc. etc.
> > > Sort of like preparing for an operations.
>
> > > Thanks.
> > > Holding it in- Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text -

[kontiki]

The tips about not driniking at least one hour before departure
do work. One thing not mentioned is get a faster airplane. :^)

[Thomas Borchert]

Kontiki,

> One thing not mentioned is get a faster airplane. :^)
>

Actually, one with a toilet would make most sense.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[BDS[_2_]]

"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote

> As you know, the Road to Hell is paved with good intentions. The wind hit
the
> bag and it exploded before he could drop it. The back seat got a pretty
good
> spray along with the side of the aircraft and (I assume) my friend. He
didn't
> give me a lot of details but suggested I not try it myself.
>
> Me? I pee out by the tail of the airplane right before I get in if I'm
out in
> the sticks... in the FBO if I'm not. But I've never had a problem holding
it
> all day long if necessary.

There are some pretty funny stories from sailplane pilots about this sort of
thing since soaring flights can easily exceed 5 hours or more. Not only is
it easy to exceed one's storage capacity, but getting rid of the cargo can
be difficult in the confines of a sailplane where you are usually "wearing"
the aircraft and are also semi-reclined.

One of my favorites was from a guy who used zip-lock baggies to urinate
into, which is not uncommon. He is one of the few who routinely used to
dispose of the bag in flight by way of the window vent. Well, one time he
threw the bag out and it hit the leading edge of the wing and exploded.
That wouldn't necessarily be all that bad except that this particular
sailplane had a nice naca type air inlet on the bottom surface of the wing
for the fresh air vent, which was routed so that it blew air on the pilot
from an outlet at the top of the panel. So, as he threw the bag out the
vent and it exploded against the leading edge of the wing he immediately got
a face full of his own urine. Nasty!

BDS

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN[_2_]]

BDS wrote:
> One of my favorites was from a guy who used zip-lock baggies to urinate
> into, which is not uncommon. He is one of the few who routinely used to
> dispose of the bag in flight by way of the window vent. Well, one time he
> threw the bag out and it hit the leading edge of the wing and exploded.
> That wouldn't necessarily be all that bad except that this particular
> sailplane had a nice naca type air inlet on the bottom surface of the wing
> for the fresh air vent, which was routed so that it blew air on the pilot
> from an outlet at the top of the panel. So, as he threw the bag out the
> vent and it exploded against the leading edge of the wing he immediately got
> a face full of his own urine. Nasty!



I expect he was ****ed.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

[Matt Barrow]

"Jim Macklin" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Little John
> Item Number: 6462A
> Price: $7.95
> Sporty's
> Clermont County/Sporty's Airport
> Batavia, OH 45103
> Phone: 1.800.SPORTYS
> Fax: 1.800.359.7794
> Website: sportys.com
>
>
> A convenient, spill-proof portable urinal that can also be
> used for motion sickness. Cap screws on tightly to prevent
> spills. Constructed of durable plastic and is reusable. Used
> in hospitals for years. Holds 32 oz. and can be used with
> the Lady J Adapter (sold separately).
>

32 OUNCES?

What do ya do, hold it for a WEEK?

[Matt Barrow]

"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in message
...
> BDS wrote:
>> One of my favorites was from a guy who used zip-lock baggies to urinate
>> into, which is not uncommon. He is one of the few who routinely used to
>> dispose of the bag in flight by way of the window vent. Well, one time
>> he
>> threw the bag out and it hit the leading edge of the wing and exploded.
>> That wouldn't necessarily be all that bad except that this particular
>> sailplane had a nice naca type air inlet on the bottom surface of the
>> wing
>> for the fresh air vent, which was routed so that it blew air on the pilot
>> from an outlet at the top of the panel. So, as he threw the bag out the
>> vent and it exploded against the leading edge of the wing he immediately
>> got
>> a face full of his own urine. Nasty!
>
>
>
> I expect he was ****ed.
>

on.

[Peter R.]

On 1/25/2007 9:15:07 AM, "Matt Barrow" wrote:

> 32 OUNCES?
>
> What do ya do, hold it for a WEEK?

My favorite is the Tropicana 96 oz orange juice container. Allows for me to
drink coffee and water during the flight with little concern for overflowing
the toilet.


--
Peter

[Gene Seibel]

On Jan 24, 9:54 pm, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
> As you know, the Road to Hell is paved with good intentions. The wind hit the
> bag and it exploded before he could drop it. The back seat got a pretty good
> spray along with the side of the aircraft and (I assume) my friend. He didn't
> give me a lot of details but suggested I not try it myself.
>
Now you've done it! You've brought back memories of my first flight
with a passenger 30 years ago. She became sick and we had no sick
sacks, only a paper cup. She filled it and I had to get rid of it. You
guessed it, I opened the window and attempted to dump it. Yuk! Never
again.
--
Gene Seibel
Tales of Flight - http://pad39a.com/gene/tales.html
Because I fly, I envy no one.

[Peter R.]

On 1/25/2007 10:13:26 AM, "Gene Seibel" wrote:

> Now you've done it! You've brought back memories of my first flight
> with a passenger 30 years ago. She became sick and we had no sick
> sacks, only a paper cup. She filled it and I had to get rid of it. You
> guessed it, I opened the window and attempted to dump it. Yuk! Never
> again.

Oh, man. That's worse than the stories of the inexperienced dumping one's
cremated remains from an aircraft.

--
Peter

[Paul kgyy]

For some of us older guys with enlarged prostates, anything beyond 1.5
hours can be a problem whether hydrated or not. Also, intentional
dehydration can lead to kidney stones, and you don't want to go there.

Carry water to sip and either a gel bag or Little John container and
learn how to use it in flight - removes the stress and solves the
problem. According to Sporty's, they have documented proof that the
Little John has been known to extend the range of a Piper Malibu by 500
miles :-)

It would be nice if somebody in this NG would buy one of each type of
container, drink a lot and then go up for 5 hours with a companion of
opposite sex and give us all a Pirep on available technologies...

[Peter R.]

On 1/25/2007 10:24:40 AM, "Paul kgyy" wrote:

> It would be nice if somebody in this NG would buy one of each type of
> container, drink a lot and then go up for 5 hours with a companion of
> opposite sex and give us all a Pirep on available technologies...

LOL.

I can give you a pirep on the Tropicana 96 oz orange juice container, at
least for men, which I used on two across-the-US flights: In two words,
highly recommended. Wide opening, large reservoir for multiple uses during
one flight, white jug keeps contents private.

One tip, though: Don't bother hooking up a funnel and hose to the jug. This
will result in a most undesirable backflow.

--
Peter

[Matt Barrow]

"Peter R." > wrote in message
...
> On 1/25/2007 10:13:26 AM, "Gene Seibel" wrote:
>
>> Now you've done it! You've brought back memories of my first flight
>> with a passenger 30 years ago. She became sick and we had no sick
>> sacks, only a paper cup. She filled it and I had to get rid of it. You
>> guessed it, I opened the window and attempted to dump it. Yuk! Never
>> again.
>
> Oh, man. That's worse than the stories of the inexperienced dumping one's
> cremated remains from an aircraft.

With my luck, my remains would be swirling around the cabin lavatory.

[Matt Barrow]

"Peter R." > wrote in message
...
> On 1/25/2007 10:24:40 AM, "Paul kgyy" wrote:
>
>> It would be nice if somebody in this NG would buy one of each type of
>> container, drink a lot and then go up for 5 hours with a companion of
>> opposite sex and give us all a Pirep on available technologies...
>
> LOL.
>
> I can give you a pirep on the Tropicana 96 oz orange juice container, at
> least for men, which I used on two across-the-US flights: In two words,
> highly recommended. Wide opening,

Okay, quit bragging.

> large reservoir for multiple uses during
> one flight, white jug keeps contents private.

Be sure to label the jug as not for further consumption.

[Longworth[_1_]]

On Jan 24, 8:33 pm, "Vaughn Simon" >
wrote:
> .... Dehydration gives no warning and can seriously degrade your pilot skills just >
> when you need them most. Drink normally and use piddle packs to extend
> your range if you really don't want to land.

Vaughn,
I agree. Here is the link to this Plane & Pilot magazine article:

" Flying High & Dry- Why the FAA has added pilot dehydration to the
list of flight hazards"

http://www.planeandpilotmag.com/content/2004/august/high_dry.html
or
http://tinyurl.com/2ge2c2

I'm quoting some important facts below
" Dehydration also contributes to fuzzy thinking, poor
decision-making, dizziness and muscle fatigue"
"Dehydration symptoms go beyond thirst"

We drink nothing but water several hours before flying. A visit
to the bathroom then the water cooler is part of our preflight
activity. A water bottle is a must-have item for all flights. For
long cross-country flights, we bring along snacks and of course the
little red jug & piddle packs to extend our range when needed.

[Jim Macklin]

That is only 4 cups.



"Matt Barrow" > wrote in message
...
|
| "Jim Macklin" > wrote
in message
| ...
| >
| >
| > Little John
| > Item Number: 6462A
| > Price: $7.95
| > Sporty's
| > Clermont County/Sporty's Airport
| > Batavia, OH 45103
| > Phone: 1.800.SPORTYS
| > Fax: 1.800.359.7794
| > Website: sportys.com
| >
| >
| > A convenient, spill-proof portable urinal that can also
be
| > used for motion sickness. Cap screws on tightly to
prevent
| > spills. Constructed of durable plastic and is reusable.
Used
| > in hospitals for years. Holds 32 oz. and can be used
with
| > the Lady J Adapter (sold separately).
| >
|
| 32 OUNCES?
|
| What do ya do, hold it for a WEEK?
|
|

[Matt Barrow]

A cup is 5 oz. A "glass" is 8-12oz.


"Jim Macklin" > wrote in message
...
> That is only 4 cups.
>
>
>
> "Matt Barrow" > wrote in message
> ...
> |
> | "Jim Macklin" > wrote
> in message
> | ...
> | >
> | >
> | > Little John
> | > Item Number: 6462A
> | > Price: $7.95
> | > Sporty's
> | > Clermont County/Sporty's Airport
> | > Batavia, OH 45103
> | > Phone: 1.800.SPORTYS
> | > Fax: 1.800.359.7794
> | > Website: sportys.com
> | >
> | >
> | > A convenient, spill-proof portable urinal that can also
> be
> | > used for motion sickness. Cap screws on tightly to
> prevent
> | > spills. Constructed of durable plastic and is reusable.
> Used
> | > in hospitals for years. Holds 32 oz. and can be used
> with
> | > the Lady J Adapter (sold separately).
> | >
> |
> | 32 OUNCES?
> |
> | What do ya do, hold it for a WEEK?
> |
> |
>
>

[Bill Watson]

I've done and seen dehydration from a lot of different angles. Used leg
bags, zip locs, gel pacs, bottles, catheters, and nothing. I've dumped
a bag out of window and ate it. I've bombed Camp David with a pee bomb
('ol Ronnie wasn't there). I've landed with wet pants.

Conclusions - You can manage hydration, but at some risk. And I don't
know how you figure out the limits of that risk without risk. I've seen
the results so I don't. I just stay as hydrated as is normal and that
normally produces normal performance.

We always have the red Sporty's bottle which works great for me. I have
run out of room. Never tried the Lady J on it.
We keep 3-5 gel pacs for both of us. We use them freely. Main
deterrent here is modesty. We don't have that issue, suggest you get
over it and let it flow.

If you think you have good control and capacity now, just remember it
will fail, slowly, over time. If you don't know that, I hope you live
long enough to.

And remember not to key the mike when you ask your copilot to pass the bag.

TF wrote:
> I've mastered fuel management now the hardest part. How to manage mine and
> my wife's bathroom breaks. Our trips are typically 3 to 3.5 hours but our
> blatters don't always make it thus forci6ng a stop. Thats a big 30 min
> addition to the trip. On my last filight I filed two flight plans and then
> called ATC to open the next flight plan when we felt we could make it all
> the way without the stop. Seemed to work.
>
> Any suggestions on preflight preparations that have worked for others ? No
> coffee before the flight ? No liquids xxx hours before leaving etc. etc.
> Sort of like preparing for an operations.
>
> Thanks.
> Holding it in
>
>

[Allen[_1_]]

"Matt Barrow" > wrote in message
...
>A cup is 5 oz. A "glass" is 8-12oz.
>
A cup is 8 fluid ounces. A glass is whatever the manufacturer wants it to
be.

Allen

> "Jim Macklin" > wrote in message
> ...
>> That is only 4 cups.

[Grumman-581[_1_]]

On Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:22:02 +0100, in >,
Thomas Borchert wrote:
> Actually, one with a toilet would make most sense.

And an autopilot so that the pilot could get up to go to the toilet...
<grin>

[Grumman-581[_1_]]

On Thu, 25 Jan 2007 10:05:34 -0500, in
>, Peter R. wrote:
> My favorite is the Tropicana 96 oz orange juice container. Allows for me
> to drink coffee and water during the flight with little concern for
> overflowing the toilet.

I always figured that there was a reason that those Gatorade bottles were
wide-mouth types... On the other hand, the color of Gatorade could make
that a bit dicey... <grin>

[Jim Macklin]

Really? And my aunt would have been my uncle if she had ...

"Matt Barrow" > wrote in message
...
|A cup is 5 oz. A "glass" is 8-12oz.
|
|
| "Jim Macklin" > wrote
in message
| ...
| > That is only 4 cups.
| >
| >
| >
| > "Matt Barrow" > wrote in message
| > ...
| > |
| > | "Jim Macklin" >
wrote
| > in message
| > | ...
| > | >
| > | >
| > | > Little John
| > | > Item Number: 6462A
| > | > Price: $7.95
| > | > Sporty's
| > | > Clermont County/Sporty's Airport
| > | > Batavia, OH 45103
| > | > Phone: 1.800.SPORTYS
| > | > Fax: 1.800.359.7794
| > | > Website: sportys.com
| > | >
| > | >
| > | > A convenient, spill-proof portable urinal that can
also
| > be
| > | > used for motion sickness. Cap screws on tightly to
| > prevent
| > | > spills. Constructed of durable plastic and is
reusable.
| > Used
| > | > in hospitals for years. Holds 32 oz. and can be used
| > with
| > | > the Lady J Adapter (sold separately).
| > | >
| > |
| > | 32 OUNCES?
| > |
| > | What do ya do, hold it for a WEEK?
| > |
| > |
| >
| >
|
|

[Grumman-581[_1_]]

On Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:48:51 -0600, in >,
Jim Macklin wrote:
> That is only 4 cups.

Yeah, 32 ounces seems a bit too small for me also... It might be OK for a
single use as long as you didn't wait too long, but multiple uses would
definitely not work... And then there is the issue of trying to do it in a
cramped cockpit without an autopilot or wing leveler... I suspect the
external catheter hooked to a hose going down your pants leg into a
collection container or out the aircraft would be a better solution...

There are some guys over in the New Orleans area that are basically
selling this sort of solution for use in various situations...

http://www.sneakyleaker.com/

Of course, considering the shortage of porta-potties during Mardi Gras
around the Quarter and the way the cops like to find bust people who can't
wait in line and decide to **** in an alley or whatever, this is a good
idea... Now, before any of you start making comments about it being gross
to **** in the streets, let me inform you that with as much as is being
drank around there, the porta-potties just overflow into the street
also... No, I'm not joking... I watched it the last time I was there...
You stand in line and there is a stream of overflow that flows back into
the street... Kind of gives you a bit of incentive to not pick up any
beads that hit the street instead of being caught...

[John Clear]

In article . com>,
Paul kgyy > wrote:
>
>It would be nice if somebody in this NG would buy one of each type of
>container, drink a lot and then go up for 5 hours with a companion of
>opposite sex and give us all a Pirep on available technologies...
>

There was a hilarious article in one of the aviation magazines some
years ago with two big guys in a 152 testing the various products.
I remember the line about swooping low over a lake for inspiration....

John
--
John Clear - http://www.clear-prop.org/

[Jim Macklin]

A relief tube was a free option on the Baron and Bonanza,
have not checked lately. But they are easy to install.


"Grumman-581" > wrote
in message
...
| On Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:48:51 -0600, in
>,
| Jim Macklin wrote:
| > That is only 4 cups.
|
| Yeah, 32 ounces seems a bit too small for me also... It
might be OK for a
| single use as long as you didn't wait too long, but
multiple uses would
| definitely not work... And then there is the issue of
trying to do it in a
| cramped cockpit without an autopilot or wing leveler... I
suspect the
| external catheter hooked to a hose going down your pants
leg into a
| collection container or out the aircraft would be a better
solution...
|
| There are some guys over in the New Orleans area that are
basically
| selling this sort of solution for use in various
situations...
|
| http://www.sneakyleaker.com/
|
| Of course, considering the shortage of porta-potties
during Mardi Gras
| around the Quarter and the way the cops like to find bust
people who can't
| wait in line and decide to **** in an alley or whatever,
this is a good
| idea... Now, before any of you start making comments about
it being gross
| to **** in the streets, let me inform you that with as
much as is being
| drank around there, the porta-potties just overflow into
the street
| also... No, I'm not joking... I watched it the last time I
was there...
| You stand in line and there is a stream of overflow that
flows back into
| the street... Kind of gives you a bit of incentive to not
pick up any
| beads that hit the street instead of being caught...

[Jim Macklin]

There was also the story of the ferry pilot, taking a Pawnee
to South America. He drank a bottle of wine and then used
the bottle for relief. At the next border, the customs
inspector was demanding some bribe until he saw the wine
bottle. Confiscated it and let the pilot go. The pilot
departed post-haste.



"John Clear" > wrote in message
...
| In article
. com>,
| Paul kgyy > wrote:
| >
| >It would be nice if somebody in this NG would buy one of
each type of
| >container, drink a lot and then go up for 5 hours with a
companion of
| >opposite sex and give us all a Pirep on available
technologies...
| >
|
| There was a hilarious article in one of the aviation
magazines some
| years ago with two big guys in a 152 testing the various
products.
| I remember the line about swooping low over a lake for
inspiration....
|
| John
| --
| John Clear - http://www.clear-prop.org/
|

[Mxsmanic]

RomeoMike writes:

> Well, you may get thirsty before dehydrating while playing with your joy
> stick, but people who work and play in hot climates know that that is
> not true.

I was born and raised in a desert. You get thirsty when you get
dehydrated; it is an extremely reliable indicator of dehydration.

> Physiologists know that dehydration can precede thirst.

Only under very unusual circumstances of rapid water loss, which are
not likely to ever occur while flying a general aviation aircraft.
Essentially, you have to be vomiting, urinating, experiencing
diarrhea, or perspiring profusely to dehydrate that rapidly. None of
these is very probable in an aviation context.

> The military knows it in training troops. Pro sports teams know it. Serious
> hikers know it.

None of them are pilot GA aircraft, however, and there is no
comparison. You're no more likely to dehydrate significantly in an
aircraft than in a car.

> All plan appropriate water consumption based on planned
> fluid losses, not thirst.

Only when TBW losses are expected to be extremely rapid. That does
not apply to general aviation.

> You also imply in another post in this thread
> that the kidneys won't make urine if one is dehydrated:

They will concentrate as much as they can. If dehydration is extreme,
however, they will go into acute renal failure. Again, however, this
is never likely to occur in an aviation context.

If it burns when you urinate, that's one sign that you are seriously
dehydrated. A simple test is to make sure your bladder fills every
3-5 hours, and check to make sure that your urine is not brightly
colored. If it is lightly colored and you urinate at least with this
frequency, it's unlikely that you are significantly dehydrated.

> That's not so either, unless you're going into shock.

It's normal physiology.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Mxsmanic]

Thomas Borchert writes:

> That has the inherent danger of dehydration.

Under normal conditions, there is very little danger of dehydration
simply from abstaining from drink for a few hours.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Mxsmanic]

Grumman-581 writes:

> And an autopilot so that the pilot could get up to go to the toilet...

The Boeing Business Jet has both. However, it requires two pilots.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Paul kgyy]

> And remember not to key the mike when you ask your copilot to pass the bag.
>
LOL - also note that if you're IFR, use of the device will
automatically trigger a course change request from ATC.

[Grumman-581[_1_]]

On Thu, 25 Jan 2007 18:50:53 +0000, in
>, Allen wrote:
> A cup is 8 fluid ounces. A glass is whatever the manufacturer wants it to
> be.

Correct... A "cup" is a unit of measure... A glass is just an arbitrarily
sized container...

I remember bitching about my expresso maker when it claimed that it made 6
cups... It made 2 at best and I'm not even sure they were a full 8 ounces...

[Morgans]

"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote

> I expect he was ****ed.

I've always said that it is better to be ****ed off, than ****ed on. That
just about proves it! <g>
--
Jim in NC

[RomeoMike]

Mxsmanic wrote:
> RomeoMike writes:
>
>> Well, you may get thirsty before dehydrating while playing with your joy
>> stick, but people who work and play in hot climates know that that is
>> not true.
>
> I was born and raised in a desert. You get thirsty when you get
> dehydrated; it is an extremely reliable indicator of dehydration.
>
>> Physiologists know that dehydration can precede thirst.
>
> Only under very unusual circumstances of rapid water loss, which are
> not likely to ever occur while flying a general aviation aircraft.
> Essentially, you have to be vomiting, urinating, experiencing
> diarrhea, or perspiring profusely to dehydrate that rapidly. None of
> these is very probable in an aviation context.
>
>> The military knows it in training troops. Pro sports teams know it. Serious
>> hikers know it.
>
> None of them are pilot GA aircraft, however, and there is no
> comparison. You're no more likely to dehydrate significantly in an
> aircraft than in a car.
>
>> All plan appropriate water consumption based on planned
>> fluid losses, not thirst.
>
> Only when TBW losses are expected to be extremely rapid. That does
> not apply to general aviation.
>
>> You also imply in another post in this thread
>> that the kidneys won't make urine if one is dehydrated:
>
> They will concentrate as much as they can. If dehydration is extreme,
> however, they will go into acute renal failure. Again, however, this
> is never likely to occur in an aviation context.
>
> If it burns when you urinate, that's one sign that you are seriously
> dehydrated. A simple test is to make sure your bladder fills every
> 3-5 hours, and check to make sure that your urine is not brightly
> colored. If it is lightly colored and you urinate at least with this
> frequency, it's unlikely that you are significantly dehydrated.
>
>> That's not so either, unless you're going into shock.
>
> It's normal physiology.

Well, it's normal that normal physiology is normal, but you don't know
what that normal is.
I'm not going to address your ignorance further for the same reasons
that others have given up on you. I only responded to suggest to anyone
interested in the topic that they not take those statements of yours
that I quoted as factual. They should go read an authoritative source
about a topic that can be vitally important to some. As for you, who has
never even had a flying lesson let alone piloted a plane, you even have
the hubris to suggest to an ex-fighter pilot how to recover from a
stall. LOL

[john smith]

Jim Macklin wrote:

> Little John
> Item Number: 6462A
> Price: $7.95
> Sporty's
> Clermont County/Sporty's Airport
> Batavia, OH 45103
> Phone: 1.800.SPORTYS
> Fax: 1.800.359.7794
> Website: sportys.com
>
>
>A convenient, spill-proof portable urinal that can also be
>used for motion sickness. Cap screws on tightly to prevent
>spills. Constructed of durable plastic and is reusable. Used
>in hospitals for years. Holds 32 oz. and can be used with
>the Lady J Adapter (sold separately).
>
The least expensive, resuable relief bottle I have found is a Rubbermaid
2-liter decanter with screw on lid. It has the largest opening of any
container short of a paint can.

[[email protected]]

On Jan 25, 11:01 am, "Longworth" > wrote:
> On Jan 24, 8:33 pm, "Vaughn Simon" >
> wrote:
>
> > .... Dehydration gives no warning and can seriously degrade your pilot skills just >
> > when you need them most. Drink normally and use piddle packs to extend
> > your range if you really don't want to land. Vaughn,
> I agree. Here is the link to this Plane & Pilot magazine article:
>
> " Flying High & Dry- Why the FAA has added pilot dehydration to the
> list of flight hazards"
>
> http://www.planeandpilotmag.com/content/2004/august/high_dry.html
> orhttp://tinyurl.com/2ge2c2
>
> I'm quoting some important facts below
> " Dehydration also contributes to fuzzy thinking, poor
> decision-making, dizziness and muscle fatigue"
> "Dehydration symptoms go beyond thirst"
>
> We drink nothing but water several hours before flying. A visit
> to the bathroom then the water cooler is part of our preflight
> activity. A water bottle is a must-have item for all flights. For
> long cross-country flights, we bring along snacks and of course the
> little red jug & piddle packs to extend our range when needed.


This link has some information as seen from the soaring community.

http://w3.gwis.com/~mks/safety.htm#DEHYDRATION,%20HEAT%20STRESS%20AND%20FA TIGUE


Ben Jeffrey

[Grumman-581[_1_]]

On Thu, 25 Jan 2007 17:07:06 -0500, in
>, john smith wrote:
> The least expensive, resuable relief bottle I have found is a Rubbermaid
> 2-liter decanter with screw on lid. It has the largest opening of any
> container short of a paint can.

I prefer the 3-liter plastic Coke bottles or the 64-oz Gatorade bottles...
The Gatorade bottles at least have an acceptable size opening... The
3-liter Coke bottles require a bit more concentration... The 2-liter
bottles should only be used with a funnel or condom type catheter...

[Grumman-581[_1_]]

On Wed, 24 Jan 2007 20:15:26 -0500, in
>, TF wrote:

<snip>

http://www.aopa.org/asf/publications/inst_reports2.cfm?article=4985

[Bill Watson]

Paul kgyy wrote:
>> And remember not to key the mike when you ask your copilot to pass the bag.
>>
> LOL - also note that if you're IFR, use of the device will
> automatically trigger a course change request from ATC.
>
"We have a new route for you, ready to copy" ATC shorthand for "spill
the bottle".

Gel Pacs rule. In tight cockpits, external catheters rule the rule.

[Alan Gerber]

Peter R. > wrote:
> One tip, though: Don't bother hooking up a funnel and hose to the jug. This
> will result in a most undesirable backflow.

This is what Usenet is all about: learning from other people's mistakes.

.... Alan
--
Alan Gerber
PP-ASEL
gerber AT panix DOT com

[Alan Gerber]

Grumman-581 > wrote:
> I remember bitching about my expresso maker when it claimed that it made 6
> cups... It made 2 at best and I'm not even sure they were a full 8 ounces...

Well, espresso is served in those tiny little "cups", right? That's
probably what they meant.

I've got a four-cup coffee pot that makes two mugs of coffee. It's
theoretically four six-ounce cups, but it's actually closer to five ounces
each. I tried pouring water in from a measuring cup instead of using the
pot one time, and it went all over the counter.

.... Alan
--
Alan Gerber
PP-ASEL
gerber AT panix DOT com

[[email protected]]

I spent a few months living in a rainforest. We slept in hammocks, and
it was a significant hassle to get up in the night and relieve oneself.
At the end of each day we were typically a little dehydrated from the
day's exertions. The method I used to get hydrated but not need to go
for the 8 hours of night was as follows:

Drink A LOT of water between around 4pm and 5pm - more than I wanted
to. Then sip very small amounts for the next 4 hours. I found I needed
to relieve myself quite a few times for the first 2-3 hours, then less
and less so. Then go to bed. I reliably did not need to get up in the
night. No doubt the physiology is different for night vs day, but I'm
betting the same method would work for flying (although I haven't tried
it).

As some people have said, you need to avoid diuretics like caffeine.

Tom


On Jan 25, 7:41 pm, Alan Gerber > wrote:
> Grumman-581 > wrote:
> > I remember bitching about my expresso maker when it claimed that it made 6
> > cups... It made 2 at best and I'm not even sure they were a full 8 ounces...Well, espresso is served in those tiny little "cups", right? That's
> probably what they meant.
>
> I've got a four-cup coffee pot that makes two mugs of coffee. It's
> theoretically four six-ounce cups, but it's actually closer to five ounces
> each. I tried pouring water in from a measuring cup instead of using the
> pot one time, and it went all over the counter.
>
> ... Alan
> --
> Alan Gerber
> PP-ASEL
> gerber AT panix DOT com

[Morgans]

"Alan Gerber" > wrote

> This is what Usenet is all about: learning from other people's mistakes.

How true.

If you were to use a small vent tube in addition to the flow tube, that
would eliminate the backup problem. It is just another point of leakage, so
to speak.
--
Jim in NC

[Grumman-581[_1_]]

On Fri, 26 Jan 2007 00:41:57 +0000, in >,
Alan Gerber wrote:
> Well, espresso is served in those tiny little "cups", right? That's
> probably what they meant.

OK, this got me a bit curious, so I did a bit of measuring... My normal
coffee "cup" is basically cylinder shaped with approximately a 2-7/8"
inside diameter and a 3-7/8" height... Leaving about 3/4" from being full
so that I have room to add sugar and cream to it in addition to not
spilling it while walking, I get 10 oz of coffee in it... The little wimpy
"cup" that Grace uses turns out to give exactly 8 oz with the same basic
space left at the top... Of course, if I'm seriously caffeine deprived, I
have mugs that are considerably larger... They'll probably take the entire
expresso pot and have quite a bit of room left over...

> I've got a four-cup coffee pot that makes two mugs of coffee. It's
> theoretically four six-ounce cups, but it's actually closer to five
> ounces each. I tried pouring water in from a measuring cup instead of
> using the pot one time, and it went all over the counter.

Been there, done that... These damn companies need to learn that if they
are going to use the word "cup", it means 8 oz... These little 2-3 oz
espresso containers are not "cups"...

[Grumman-581[_1_]]

On Thu, 25 Jan 2007 22:40:23 -0500, in >,
Morgans wrote:
> If you were to use a small vent tube in addition to the flow tube, that
> would eliminate the backup problem. It is just another point of
> leakage, so to speak.

Of course, some of have aircraft with canopies, so theoretically, all we
need to do is slow to an acceptable speed, slide back the canopy, and pee
off the side... <grin>

Come to think of it, drilling a hole in the floor and running a tube
through there for a relief tube is starting to sound a lot better...

[Mxsmanic]

writes:

> Drink A LOT of water between around 4pm and 5pm - more than I wanted
> to. Then sip very small amounts for the next 4 hours. I found I needed
> to relieve myself quite a few times for the first 2-3 hours, then less
> and less so. Then go to bed. I reliably did not need to get up in the
> night. No doubt the physiology is different for night vs day, but I'm
> betting the same method would work for flying (although I haven't tried
> it).

Renal activity does indeed slow during sleep, so you produce less
urine during the night than you do during the day, all else being
equal. Urine production steps up again as you approach the morning
and your usual time for waking up.

However, the procedure you describe is entirely reasonable and will
help avoid nighttime trips to the toilet. If you drink more water
than you need, your kidneys will usually remove it in 2-3 hours at
most. After that, you will simply be fully hydrated, and you won't
produce an excess of urine unless other factors (like caffeine or
cold) intervene.

A consequence of this is that sleeping in the cockpit would allow you
to go longer without a full bladder, but unfortunately this has other
undesirable effects.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Thomas Borchert]

Bill,

> "We have a new route for you, ready to copy" ATC shorthand for "spill
> the bottle".
>

Reminds me of that great exchange between a biz jet and ATC this summer
(different context, but still funny, IMHO). The jet, after asking for and
not getting direct to destination several times, goes: "D-XXXX, request
20 degrees to the left to avoid" To which ATC answers: "D-XX, to avoid
what?". Bizjet: "To avoid cost".

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Thomas Borchert]

Grumman-581,

> Come to think of it, drilling a hole in the floor and running a tube
> through there for a relief tube is starting to sound a lot better...
>

You mean, regularly spraying a highly corrosive fluid onto the
underside of your plane, which then creeps in through every opening and
seam, sounds good? I don't get it...

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Mxsmanic]

Thomas Borchert writes:

> You mean, regularly spraying a highly corrosive fluid onto the
> underside of your plane, which then creeps in through every opening and
> seam, sounds good? I don't get it...

Urine is not highly corrosive. It's mostly sterile, dilute salt water
with a bit of urea, and a neutral pH.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Jim Macklin]

If it is installed properly, it never touches the airplane.



"Thomas Borchert" > wrote in
message ...
| Grumman-581,
|
| > Come to think of it, drilling a hole in the floor and
running a tube
| > through there for a relief tube is starting to sound a
lot better...
| >
|
| You mean, regularly spraying a highly corrosive fluid onto
the
| underside of your plane, which then creeps in through
every opening and
| seam, sounds good? I don't get it...
|
| --
| Thomas Borchert (EDDH)
|

[Jim Macklin]

Demitasse - Wikipedia, the free encyclopediaA 'demitasse'
(Fr.) or 'demitazza' (It.) is a small cup (typically about 2
or 3 ... Another type of demitasse/tazza is a glass cup set
into a metal frame. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demitasse - 14k - Cached -
Similar pages



"Grumman-581" > wrote
in message
...
| On Fri, 26 Jan 2007 00:41:57 +0000, in
>,
| Alan Gerber wrote:
| > Well, espresso is served in those tiny little "cups",
right? That's
| > probably what they meant.
|
| OK, this got me a bit curious, so I did a bit of
measuring... My normal
| coffee "cup" is basically cylinder shaped with
approximately a 2-7/8"
| inside diameter and a 3-7/8" height... Leaving about 3/4"
from being full
| so that I have room to add sugar and cream to it in
addition to not
| spilling it while walking, I get 10 oz of coffee in it...
The little wimpy
| "cup" that Grace uses turns out to give exactly 8 oz with
the same basic
| space left at the top... Of course, if I'm seriously
caffeine deprived, I
| have mugs that are considerably larger... They'll probably
take the entire
| expresso pot and have quite a bit of room left over...
|
| > I've got a four-cup coffee pot that makes two mugs of
coffee. It's
| > theoretically four six-ounce cups, but it's actually
closer to five
| > ounces each. I tried pouring water in from a measuring
cup instead of
| > using the pot one time, and it went all over the
counter.
|
| Been there, done that... These damn companies need to
learn that if they
| are going to use the word "cup", it means 8 oz... These
little 2-3 oz
| espresso containers are not "cups"...

[Jim Macklin]

Maybe drinking cups should be sized like bras, the A cup
would be like those little cups they use at the dentist or
in your bathroom, the B cup would be a small cup of tea, the
C cup would be the standard 8 oz., and then the FFF would be
for beer at the ball game.



"Grumman-581" > wrote
in message
...
| On Fri, 26 Jan 2007 00:41:57 +0000, in
>,
| Alan Gerber wrote:
| > Well, espresso is served in those tiny little "cups",
right? That's
| > probably what they meant.
|
| OK, this got me a bit curious, so I did a bit of
measuring... My normal
| coffee "cup" is basically cylinder shaped with
approximately a 2-7/8"
| inside diameter and a 3-7/8" height... Leaving about 3/4"
from being full
| so that I have room to add sugar and cream to it in
addition to not
| spilling it while walking, I get 10 oz of coffee in it...
The little wimpy
| "cup" that Grace uses turns out to give exactly 8 oz with
the same basic
| space left at the top... Of course, if I'm seriously
caffeine deprived, I
| have mugs that are considerably larger... They'll probably
take the entire
| expresso pot and have quite a bit of room left over...
|
| > I've got a four-cup coffee pot that makes two mugs of
coffee. It's
| > theoretically four six-ounce cups, but it's actually
closer to five
| > ounces each. I tried pouring water in from a measuring
cup instead of
| > using the pot one time, and it went all over the
counter.
|
| Been there, done that... These damn companies need to
learn that if they
| are going to use the word "cup", it means 8 oz... These
little 2-3 oz
| espresso containers are not "cups"...

[Roy Smith]

In article >,
"Jim Macklin" > wrote:

> Maybe drinking cups should be sized like bras, the A cup
> would be like those little cups they use at the dentist or
> in your bathroom, the B cup would be a small cup of tea, the
> C cup would be the standard 8 oz., and then the FFF would be
> for beer at the ball game.

Makes sense. When I was in college, I used to frequent McSorley's
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McSorleys_Old_Ale_House). You couldn't order
one beer, they only came in pairs. Now I know the reason.

[Tony]

Would anyone who has had a beer or two before going to bed care to
discuss renal functionality at night?

Kindneys work at, among other things, maintaining bp and internal fluid
balances. If you're not taking in fluids, for example when you're
sleeping, they do have less to do. The point being made earlier is,
restrict fluid intake, not fly while sleeping.

The QED of that is to look at what goes on with patients who are given
fluids IV. Your model of lesser night time renal function would suggest
the collection bags would not get as full at night. The nurses aides
working the floors at night will be really happy to know that.

Here's another demostration that literate writing can sometimes mask
ignorance.



The reality is renal function has everything to do with

On Jan 26, 6:25 am, Mxsmanic > wrote:
> writes:
> > Drink A LOT of water between around 4pm and 5pm - more than I wanted
> > to. Then sip very small amounts for the next 4 hours. I found I needed
> > to relieve myself quite a few times for the first 2-3 hours, then less
> > and less so. Then go to bed. I reliably did not need to get up in the
> > night. No doubt the physiology is different for night vs day, but I'm
> > betting the same method would work for flying (although I haven't tried
> > it).Renal activity does indeed slow during sleep, so you produce less
> urine during the night than you do during the day, all else being
> equal. Urine production steps up again as you approach the morning
> and your usual time for waking up.
>
> However, the procedure you describe is entirely reasonable and will
> help avoid nighttime trips to the toilet. If you drink more water
> than you need, your kidneys will usually remove it in 2-3 hours at
> most. After that, you will simply be fully hydrated, and you won't
> produce an excess of urine unless other factors (like caffeine or
> cold) intervene.
>
> A consequence of this is that sleeping in the cockpit would allow you
> to go longer without a full bladder, but unfortunately this has other
> undesirable effects.
>
> --
> Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Matt Barrow]

Have you checked?

"Jim Macklin" > wrote in message
...
> Really? And my aunt would have been my uncle if she had ...
>
> "Matt Barrow" > wrote in message
> ...
> |A cup is 5 oz. A "glass" is 8-12oz.
> |
> |
> | "Jim Macklin" > wrote
> in message
> | ...
> | > That is only 4 cups.
> | >
> | >
> | >
> | > "Matt Barrow" > wrote in message
> | > ...
> | > |
> | > | "Jim Macklin" >
> wrote
> | > in message
> | > | ...
> | > | >
> | > | >
> | > | > Little John
> | > | > Item Number: 6462A
> | > | > Price: $7.95
> | > | > Sporty's
> | > | > Clermont County/Sporty's Airport
> | > | > Batavia, OH 45103
> | > | > Phone: 1.800.SPORTYS
> | > | > Fax: 1.800.359.7794
> | > | > Website: sportys.com
> | > | >
> | > | >
> | > | > A convenient, spill-proof portable urinal that can
> also
> | > be
> | > | > used for motion sickness. Cap screws on tightly to
> | > prevent
> | > | > spills. Constructed of durable plastic and is
> reusable.
> | > Used
> | > | > in hospitals for years. Holds 32 oz. and can be used
> | > with
> | > | > the Lady J Adapter (sold separately).
> | > | >
> | > |
> | > | 32 OUNCES?
> | > |
> | > | What do ya do, hold it for a WEEK?
> | > |
> | > |
> | >
> | >
> |
> |
>
>

[Matt Barrow]

"Jim Macklin" > wrote in message
...
> There was also the story of the ferry pilot, taking a Pawnee
> to South America. He drank a bottle of wine and then used
> the bottle for relief. At the next border, the customs
> inspector was demanding some bribe until he saw the wine
> bottle. Confiscated it and let the pilot go. The pilot
> departed post-haste.
>
>
If you've ever seen the John Wayne movie "The War Wagon", recall the Indian
chief drinking the nitroglycerin.

[Matt Barrow]

"Grumman-581" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 25 Jan 2007 18:50:53 +0000, in
> >, Allen wrote:
>> A cup is 8 fluid ounces. A glass is whatever the manufacturer wants it
>> to
>> be.
>
> Correct... A "cup" is a unit of measure... A glass is just an arbitrarily
> sized container...
>
> I remember bitching about my expresso maker when it claimed that it made 6
> cups... It made 2 at best and I'm not even sure they were a full 8
> ounces...

Just about every coffee maker I can recall, has it's graduations for CUPS
being 5oz. (i.e., 12 cup variety holds 60 oz of water).

[Longworth[_1_]]

On Jan 26, 7:59 am, Thomas Borchert >
wrote:

> through there for a relief tube is starting to sound a lot
better...You mean, regularly >spraying a highly corrosive fluid onto
the underside of your plane, which then creeps >in through every
opening and seam, sounds good? I don't get it...

Thomas,
Here is an interesting link

"'Corrosive' urine is destroying famous bridge"

http://tinyurl.com/3du6az

[Thomas Borchert]

Longworth,

> Thomas,
> Here is an interesting link
>
> "'Corrosive' urine is destroying famous bridge"
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3du6az
>

Thanks, interesting. Our local know-it-all is spouting BS again, as can
be easily found out with a little googling and wikipediing (that a word
yet?).

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Gig 601XL Builder]

Vaughn Simon wrote:
> "TF" > wrote in message
> . ..
>>
>> Any suggestions on preflight preparations that have worked for
>> others ? No coffee before the flight ? No liquids xxx hours before
>> leaving etc. etc. Sort of like preparing for an operations.
>
> Dehydration gives no warning and can seriously degrade your pilot
> skills just when you need them most. Drink normally and use piddle
> packs to extend your range if you really don't want to land. Some
> glider pilots make their own with freezer bags and the gel that is
> found in some diapers. There are also products made to accommodate
> the female anatomy.
> On the other hand, having a desperate urge to pee and no place to
> do it can also degrade your performance. Always have a plan. On my
> little x-country flights, I always pack a bottle of water. It is
> always nice to have the water should I happen to get thirsty, but In
> a pinch that bottle could be very useful!
> Vaughn

http://www.flyana.com/dehydration.html

[Mxsmanic]

Tony writes:

> The QED of that is to look at what goes on with patients who are given
> fluids IV. Your model of lesser night time renal function would suggest
> the collection bags would not get as full at night.

I only know what the medical textbooks say. Renal activity, like most
other types of body activity, does decline during the night. That's
why most people can go all night without getting up to urinate, unless
they drink a substantial amount of fluid just before going to sleep.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Mxsmanic]

Thomas Borchert writes:

> Thanks, interesting. Our local know-it-all is spouting BS again, as can
> be easily found out with a little googling and wikipediing (that a word
> yet?).

It's interesting how people pick and choose their sources and adjust
their standards for reliability as a function of how much these agree
with those sources.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Thomas Borchert]

Mxsmanic,

> It's interesting how people pick and choose their sources and adjust
> their standards for reliability as a function of how much these agree
> with those sources.
>

If you were ever under the impression you had established yourself here
as a source, any kind, let alone a trusted one, you're even more
delusional than I thought. What would you have done to even try being
taken seriously?

But again, you're finding a nice rationalization to take away the blame
from yourself.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Tony]

You're not reading enough of the textbook. Understanding more about
human physiology and why reduced kidney function is driven by a lesser
metabloic challenge, rather than it being dark outside, would have
prevented you from making a misleading statement.

On Jan 26, 11:30 am, Mxsmanic > wrote:
> Tony writes:
> > The QED of that is to look at what goes on with patients who are given
> > fluids IV. Your model of lesser night time renal function would suggest
> > the collection bags would not get as full at night.I only know what the medical textbooks say. Renal activity, like most
> other types of body activity, does decline during the night. That's
> why most people can go all night without getting up to urinate, unless
> they drink a substantial amount of fluid just before going to sleep.
>
> --
> Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Mxsmanic]

Tony writes:

> You're not reading enough of the textbook. Understanding more about
> human physiology and why reduced kidney function is driven by a lesser
> metabloic challenge, rather than it being dark outside, would have
> prevented you from making a misleading statement.

Night = sleep = diminished metabolic challenge = reduced renal
activity

There's nothing misleading about that, unless your patients are
vampires.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Tony]

Sigh.

It is not its pH that makes urine corrosive, but the dissolved salts
that become reactive. That's why cars that are close to the oceans rust
more quickly than do those in rainy inland locations.

Sooner or later you may get something right. Let me rephrase that.
Sooner or later you may apply a known fact correctly to the situation
being discussed. That urine is more or less neutral, or even more
importantly has little buffering capacity, is true, but that fact is
not relevant to the topic.




On Jan 26, 8:14 am, Mxsmanic > wrote:
> Thomas Borchert writes:
> > You mean, regularly spraying a highly corrosive fluid onto the
> > underside of your plane, which then creeps in through every opening and
> > seam, sounds good? I don't get it...Urine is not highly corrosive. It's mostly sterile, dilute salt water
> with a bit of urea, and a neutral pH.
>
> --
> Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Mxsmanic]

Tony writes:

> It is not its pH that makes urine corrosive, but the dissolved salts
> that become reactive. That's why cars that are close to the oceans rust
> more quickly than do those in rainy inland locations.

Urine isn't usually terribly concentrated. Some of the byproducts of
urine that are produced after exogenous microorganisms attack it (such
as ammonia) are much more damaging.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Barney Rubble]

Don't bother to argue with him, he knows everything about anything, and is a
world expert on the whining backchat.

"RomeoMike" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Mxsmanic wrote:
>> RomeoMike writes:
>>
>>> Well, you may get thirsty before dehydrating while playing with your joy
>>> stick, but people who work and play in hot climates know that that is
>>> not true.
>>
>> I was born and raised in a desert. You get thirsty when you get
>> dehydrated; it is an extremely reliable indicator of dehydration.
>>
>>> Physiologists know that dehydration can precede thirst.
>>
>> Only under very unusual circumstances of rapid water loss, which are
>> not likely to ever occur while flying a general aviation aircraft.
>> Essentially, you have to be vomiting, urinating, experiencing
>> diarrhea, or perspiring profusely to dehydrate that rapidly. None of
>> these is very probable in an aviation context.
>>
>>> The military knows it in training troops. Pro sports teams know it.
>>> Serious hikers know it.
>>
>> None of them are pilot GA aircraft, however, and there is no
>> comparison. You're no more likely to dehydrate significantly in an
>> aircraft than in a car.
>>
>>> All plan appropriate water consumption based on planned fluid losses,
>>> not thirst.
>>
>> Only when TBW losses are expected to be extremely rapid. That does
>> not apply to general aviation.
>>
>>> You also imply in another post in this thread that the kidneys won't
>>> make urine if one is dehydrated:
>>
>> They will concentrate as much as they can. If dehydration is extreme,
>> however, they will go into acute renal failure. Again, however, this
>> is never likely to occur in an aviation context.
>>
>> If it burns when you urinate, that's one sign that you are seriously
>> dehydrated. A simple test is to make sure your bladder fills every
>> 3-5 hours, and check to make sure that your urine is not brightly
>> colored. If it is lightly colored and you urinate at least with this
>> frequency, it's unlikely that you are significantly dehydrated.
>>
>>> That's not so either, unless you're going into shock.
>>
>> It's normal physiology.
>
> Well, it's normal that normal physiology is normal, but you don't know
> what that normal is.
> I'm not going to address your ignorance further for the same reasons that
> others have given up on you. I only responded to suggest to anyone
> interested in the topic that they not take those statements of yours that
> I quoted as factual. They should go read an authoritative source about a
> topic that can be vitally important to some. As for you, who has never
> even had a flying lesson let alone piloted a plane, you even have the
> hubris to suggest to an ex-fighter pilot how to recover from a stall. LOL

[Tony]

The bridge mentioned earlier will take comfort in that.

On Jan 26, 12:51 pm, Mxsmanic > wrote:
> Tony writes:
> > It is not its pH that makes urine corrosive, but the dissolved salts
> > that become reactive. That's why cars that are close to the oceans rust
> > more quickly than do those in rainy inland locations.Urine isn't usually terribly concentrated. Some of the byproducts of
> urine that are produced after exogenous microorganisms attack it (such
> as ammonia) are much more damaging.
>
> --
> Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Longworth[_1_]]

On Jan 26, 12:49 pm, "Tony" > wrote:
> Sigh.
>
> It is not its pH that makes urine corrosive, but the dissolved salts
> that become reactive. That's why cars that are close to the oceans rust
> more quickly than do those in rainy inland locations.
>

Tony,
Here is another example of the corrosive effect of urine
http://tinyurl.com/26ghv8

"On the pitting corrosion of high strength aluminium alloys by rat
urine
Sreekumar, K; Jacob, E; Natarajan, A; Lakshmanan, T S
Praktische Metallographie (Germany). Vol. 34, no. 9, pp. 478-481. Sept.
1997

High strength AFNOR 7020 aluminium alloy sheets in T6 condition are
used for fabricating propellant tanks (nitrogen tetroxide N sub 2 O sub
4 and unsymmetrical dimethyl hydrazine UDMH) for launch vehicle
applications. These tanks are fabricated through welding route and are
filled with dry nitrogen gas at 300 mbar and sealed at both ends. The
tank is then cocooned with aluminised plastic sheets and stored under
positive dry nitrogen gas pressure. During the storage rats had cut
open the aluminised plastic sheets and had urinated all over the
surfaces of the aluminium alloy tank. The tank surface showed
discolouration and severe pitting corrosion attack wherever the rat
urine had come in contact with it. This paper highlights the
investigations made to understand the severity of the corrosion attack
on the surface of the tank with a view to clear it for further
processing and utilisation.

I'd bet someone will argue that rat urine is not the same as
human stuff. The counter argument is that some people are considered
'dirty rats' ;-)

By the way, the pH level of human urine can range from 4.5 to 8
and normal urine is slightly acidic.

[Casey Wilson]

"Mxsmanic" > wrote in message
...
> Thomas Borchert writes:
>
>> You mean, regularly spraying a highly corrosive fluid onto the
>> underside of your plane, which then creeps in through every opening and
>> seam, sounds good? I don't get it...
>
> Urine is not highly corrosive. It's mostly sterile, dilute salt water
> with a bit of urea, and a neutral pH.


Quit demonstrating your stupidity or cite your sources, such as:
Read the last line twice...

http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/003583.htm
....pH is a measure of how acidic or alkaline a fluid is, like blood or
urine. The pH in blood is maintained within the narrow range of 7.35 to
7.45. Your body maintains this narrow range by using buffers -- chemicals
that can switch back and forth between 2 forms, a weak acid or weak base.
The buffers are only temporary "stop gaps" to avoid dramatic changes in
blood pH.
Long-term correction of blood pH requires the kidneys to excrete the acid or
base in urine. For example, when your blood pH is low (acidic), your kidneys
react by excreting more acid in the urine. The urine pH becomes more acidic
until the blood pH returns to normal.

In some cases, checking your urine pH is helpful for identifying body
acid-base imbalances. In other cases, a blood pH test is needed.

Your provider may want to modify your urine pH to help prevent kidney
stones. Acidic urine is associated with xanthine, cystine, uric acid, and
calcium oxalate stones. Alkaline urine is associated with calcium carbonate,
calcium phosphate, and magnesium phosphate stones.

Some medications are more effective in acidic or alkaline environments. For
example, streptomycin, neomycin, and kanamycin are more effective in
treating urinary tract infections when the urine is alkaline.

Normal Values Return to top

The normal values range from 4.6 to 8.0.

[Mxsmanic]

Tony writes:

> The bridge mentioned earlier will take comfort in that.

People have been urinating on bridges for thousands of years, and I
don't know of any that have collapsed as a result.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Mxsmanic]

Casey Wilson writes:

> Long-term correction of blood pH requires the kidneys to excrete the acid or
> base in urine.

The acid or base. QED.

The normal pH is very close to 7 (neutral).

> Your provider may want to modify your urine pH to help prevent kidney
> stones. Acidic urine is associated with xanthine, cystine, uric acid, and
> calcium oxalate stones. Alkaline urine is associated with calcium carbonate,
> calcium phosphate, and magnesium phosphate stones.

Acid, alkaline. See?

> The normal values range from 4.6 to 8.0.

And the average is just about 7.0.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Tony]

The acidity of urine isn't very important in terms of corrosion. An
understanding of chemistry would lead you to conclude there simply
isn't enough acidic strength in urine to make it an effective caustic.
On the other hand, the salts are reactive, and become more so as the
water matrix evaporates. As mentioned before, cars parted where salt
water spray wets them are all of the demonstration of that an
intellegent disinterested observer might need.

Stong's Physical Chemistry text -- it's a pretty old book, but good --
will even allow you to put numbers to the analysis. It's, oh, more or
less junior year college stuff -- can you handle that?





On Jan 26, 3:29 pm, Mxsmanic > wrote:
> Casey Wilson writes:
> > Long-term correction of blood pH requires the kidneys to excrete the acid or
> > base in urine.The acid or base. QED.
>
> The normal pH is very close to 7 (neutral).
>
> > Your provider may want to modify your urine pH to help prevent kidney
> > stones. Acidic urine is associated with xanthine, cystine, uric acid, and
> > calcium oxalate stones. Alkaline urine is associated with calcium carbonate,
> > calcium phosphate, and magnesium phosphate stones.Acid, alkaline. See?
>
> > The normal values range from 4.6 to 8.0.And the average is just about 7.0.
>
> --
> Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[RomeoMike]

Barney Rubble wrote:
> Don't bother to argue with him, he knows everything about anything, and is a
> world expert on the whining backchat.
>

I'm avoiding his assertions regarding physiology scattered throughout
this thread. He displays in them two bad proclivities. One is to run to
the Internet to get a superficial and often erroneous impression of some
topic and then post in an authoritative fashion based on that info. The
other is to not be willing to alter his misconceptions if challenged. He
digs himself further into a hole and gets more and more ridiculous.

[Tony]

I just remembered something. I think it was with you that during a
discussion regarding the physics of a 1 G roll pointed you to a rather
nice web page where someone using classical newtonian physics showed a
family of loci that me that criterion, and you were unable to follow
the analysis and so declared it invalid.

That was simple physics, force equal mass times acceleration kinds of
stuff. Here we're talking about the reaction dynamics in inorganic
chemistry, and earlier, human physiology. Seems to me if you don't have
the tools for the simple stuff -- that roll stuff is calculus that can
be done long hand -- you don't have the tools for this either.

You are good at taking singular facts and misapplying them. Is there a
market for that skill in France? Here in the US we tend to elect such
people to public office. Or, if they work for us, we fire them.

I should badly doing this -- if MX was a cat I'd be cited for being
cruel to animals -- but I don't.


On Jan 26, 3:27 pm, Mxsmanic > wrote:
> Tony writes:
> > The bridge mentioned earlier will take comfort in that.People have been urinating on bridges for thousands of years, and I
> don't know of any that have collapsed as a result.
>
> --
> Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Matt Whiting]

Matt Barrow wrote:

> "Grumman-581" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>On Thu, 25 Jan 2007 18:50:53 +0000, in
>, Allen wrote:
>>
>>>A cup is 8 fluid ounces. A glass is whatever the manufacturer wants it
>>>to
>>>be.
>>
>>Correct... A "cup" is a unit of measure... A glass is just an arbitrarily
>>sized container...
>>
>>I remember bitching about my expresso maker when it claimed that it made 6
>>cups... It made 2 at best and I'm not even sure they were a full 8
>>ounces...
>
>
> Just about every coffee maker I can recall, has it's graduations for CUPS
> being 5oz. (i.e., 12 cup variety holds 60 oz of water).
>
>

That is marketing, not measurement.

Matt

[Roger[_4_]]

On Sun, 28 Jan 2007 17:07:47 GMT, Matt Whiting >
wrote:

>Matt Barrow wrote:
>
>> "Grumman-581" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>>On Thu, 25 Jan 2007 18:50:53 +0000, in
>, Allen wrote:
>>>
>>>>A cup is 8 fluid ounces. A glass is whatever the manufacturer wants it
>>>>to
>>>>be.
>>>
>>>Correct... A "cup" is a unit of measure... A glass is just an arbitrarily
>>>sized container...
>>>
>>>I remember bitching about my expresso maker when it claimed that it made 6
>>>cups... It made 2 at best and I'm not even sure they were a full 8
>>>ounces...
>>
>>
>> Just about every coffee maker I can recall, has it's graduations for CUPS
>> being 5oz. (i.e., 12 cup variety holds 60 oz of water).
>>
>>
>
>That is marketing, not measurement.

Best measurement, don't drink coffee and specifically never drink tea
prior to departure. Tea in particular is a strong diauretic.


>
>Matt
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

[Margy Natalie]

Paul kgyy wrote:
> For some of us older guys with enlarged prostates, anything beyond 1.5
> hours can be a problem whether hydrated or not. Also, intentional
> dehydration can lead to kidney stones, and you don't want to go there.
>
> Carry water to sip and either a gel bag or Little John container and
> learn how to use it in flight - removes the stress and solves the
> problem. According to Sporty's, they have documented proof that the
> Little John has been known to extend the range of a Piper Malibu by 500
> miles :-)
>
> It would be nice if somebody in this NG would buy one of each type of
> container, drink a lot and then go up for 5 hours with a companion of
> opposite sex and give us all a Pirep on available technologies...
>
A zip lock bag works. We had a few really long legs on our flights in
AU and that's all we had. Worked great. Here in the US we just land
somewhere, but we do have piddle packs, just in case.

Margy

[Margy Natalie]

Roy Smith wrote:
> In article >,
> "Jim Macklin" > wrote:
>
>
>>Maybe drinking cups should be sized like bras, the A cup
>>would be like those little cups they use at the dentist or
>>in your bathroom, the B cup would be a small cup of tea, the
>>C cup would be the standard 8 oz., and then the FFF would be
>>for beer at the ball game.
>
>
> Makes sense. When I was in college, I used to frequent McSorley's
> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McSorleys_Old_Ale_House). You couldn't order
> one beer, they only came in pairs. Now I know the reason.
When were you in college. I spent many an evening in McSorley's in the
70's. I've heard they've since put in a women's room getting rid of the
need of the bouncer at the door to the john who would yell "Woman coming in"

Margy

[Roy Smith]

In article >,
Margy Natalie > wrote:

> Roy Smith wrote:
> > In article >,
> > "Jim Macklin" > wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Maybe drinking cups should be sized like bras, the A cup
> >>would be like those little cups they use at the dentist or
> >>in your bathroom, the B cup would be a small cup of tea, the
> >>C cup would be the standard 8 oz., and then the FFF would be
> >>for beer at the ball game.
> >
> >
> > Makes sense. When I was in college, I used to frequent McSorley's
> > (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McSorleys_Old_Ale_House). You couldn't order
> > one beer, they only came in pairs. Now I know the reason.
> When were you in college. I spent many an evening in McSorley's in the
> 70's. I've heard they've since put in a women's room getting rid of the
> need of the bouncer at the door to the john who would yell "Woman coming in"
>
> Margy

Cooper Union, class of 81. Had an apartment on St. Marks Place. When I
was there, there was still just the one bathroom. I don't remember any
bouncer, though. It seemed to work out OK. The guys didn't mind, and the
kind of women who hung out there didn't seem to mind either. I mean, come
on, there were doors on the stalls. Some people really are prudes when it
comes to bodily functions.

[Mxsmanic]

Margy Natalie writes:

> When were you in college. I spent many an evening in McSorley's in the
> 70's. I've heard they've since put in a women's room getting rid of the
> need of the bouncer at the door to the john who would yell "Woman coming in"

Why do they need someone to announce that?

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Stan Prevost]

"Margy Natalie" > wrote in message
...
>>
> A zip lock bag works. We had a few really long legs on our flights in AU
> and that's all we had. Worked great. Here in the US we just land
> somewhere, but we do have piddle packs, just in case.
>

A diaper in the 2-gal ziploc bag helps prevent spills. Then the whole thing
goes in a plastic grocery bag and it can be discretely disposed of at the
FBO.

[Don Tuite]

>In article >,
> Margy Natalie > wrote:

>> > Makes sense. When I was in college, I used to frequent McSorley's
>> > (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McSorleys_Old_Ale_House). You couldn't order
>> > one beer, they only came in pairs. Now I know the reason.
>> When were you in college. I spent many an evening in McSorley's in the
>> 70's. I've heard they've since put in a women's room getting rid of the
>> need of the bouncer at the door to the john who would yell "Woman coming in"
>>
>> Margy
>
>Cooper Union, class of 81. Had an apartment on St. Marks Place. When I
>was there, there was still just the one bathroom. I don't remember any
>bouncer, though. It seemed to work out OK. The guys didn't mind, and the
>kind of women who hung out there didn't seem to mind either. I mean, come
>on, there were doors on the stalls. Some people really are prudes when it
>comes to bodily functions.

NCE '65. Two steins for a quarter. Where would they have put a second
bog, anyway?

Don

[Roger[_4_]]

On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 22:51:37 -0600, "Stan Prevost"
> wrote:

>
>"Margy Natalie" > wrote in message
...
>>>
>> A zip lock bag works. We had a few really long legs on our flights in AU
>> and that's all we had. Worked great. Here in the US we just land
>> somewhere, but we do have piddle packs, just in case.
>>
>
>A diaper in the 2-gal ziploc bag helps prevent spills. Then the whole thing
>goes in a plastic grocery bag and it can be discretely disposed of at the
>FBO.
>
How about cat litter? That stuff will absorbe more than it's own
weight in... ahhh...water. That and should an accident happen it won't
spill and it smells half way decent. If you don't need it you can
always use the excess for cleaning up leaks... Oil leaks!.
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com