Late BFR

[Anonymous coward #673]

I fly through an organization that requires a proficiency check ride
every six months. As a result I somehow got it into my head that I
didn't need to worry about BFR's any more. But today my instructor
reminded me that a BFR requires an hour of ground instruction, so
technically I have not completed a BFR for (as it turns out) more than
two years (though I have received considerably more recurrent in-flight
training than the regs require). My log book now contains entries for
numerous flights conducted (inadvertently) in violation of FAR61.56.

My question to the group: what is the best way to handle this situation?
Obviously I am going to get my hour of ground instruction ASAP, but what
about all those flights that I've already logged? Should I file an ASRS
form? Call up the local FSDO and confess? Scribble out all those log
entries? Deduct the hours on those illegal flights from my PIC time?
Bribe my flight instructor to back-date my BFR? Or should I just not
worry about it and hope they don't haul my ass to Gitmo for falsifying
my log book?

[Steve Foley[_2_]]

"Anonymous coward #673" > wrote in message
...
> Scribble out all those log entries?

Buy a new log book and start it with the BFR. Put the old one in a safe
place.

[Bob Gardner]

Getting the ground instruction is only part of it...you needed specific
endorsements each time a BFR came due. Right now, you can't act as PIC until
you get the full treatment, ground plus air plus endorsement.

As far as the past is concerned, it is past (duh). Forget about it.

Bob Gardner

"Anonymous coward #673" > wrote in message
...
>I fly through an organization that requires a proficiency check ride
> every six months. As a result I somehow got it into my head that I
> didn't need to worry about BFR's any more. But today my instructor
> reminded me that a BFR requires an hour of ground instruction, so
> technically I have not completed a BFR for (as it turns out) more than
> two years (though I have received considerably more recurrent in-flight
> training than the regs require). My log book now contains entries for
> numerous flights conducted (inadvertently) in violation of FAR61.56.
>
> My question to the group: what is the best way to handle this situation?
> Obviously I am going to get my hour of ground instruction ASAP, but what
> about all those flights that I've already logged? Should I file an ASRS
> form? Call up the local FSDO and confess? Scribble out all those log
> entries? Deduct the hours on those illegal flights from my PIC time?
> Bribe my flight instructor to back-date my BFR? Or should I just not
> worry about it and hope they don't haul my ass to Gitmo for falsifying
> my log book?

[Jose]

Dunno what to do about the past, but for the future, consider doing the
Wings program. It may be that the flights you already take would count,
and all you need for ground is to attend one of the safety seminars.

Jose
--
Get high on gasoline: fly an airplane.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

[Andrew Sarangan]

The logbook is your personal document. It becomes a legal document
only when you submit it for inspection by the FAA for a checkride or
ramp check. Even in that case, only the experience necessary for the
check would be relevant. The legality of your prior flight would
rarely come into question unless there was an insurance claim, and in
that case it would be an insurance matter rather than a FAA matter. If
these were personal flights, don't worry about it. Get a flight review
now, and move on.

Calling a FSDO is proably a bad idea. It's like calling the police and
confessing that you have exceeded the speed limit in the past.
However, filing an ASRS can't hurt.





On Mar 24, 5:57 pm, Anonymous coward #673 > wrote:
> I fly through an organization that requires a proficiency check ride
> every six months. As a result I somehow got it into my head that I
> didn't need to worry about BFR's any more. But today my instructor
> reminded me that a BFR requires an hour of ground instruction, so
> technically I have not completed a BFR for (as it turns out) more than
> two years (though I have received considerably more recurrent in-flight
> training than the regs require). My log book now contains entries for
> numerous flights conducted (inadvertently) in violation of FAR61.56.
>
> My question to the group: what is the best way to handle this situation?
> Obviously I am going to get my hour of ground instruction ASAP, but what
> about all those flights that I've already logged? Should I file an ASRS
> form? Call up the local FSDO and confess? Scribble out all those log
> entries? Deduct the hours on those illegal flights from my PIC time?
> Bribe my flight instructor to back-date my BFR? Or should I just not
> worry about it and hope they don't haul my ass to Gitmo for falsifying
> my log book?

[Sylvain]

Jose wrote:

> Dunno what to do about the past, but for the future, consider doing the
> Wings program. It may be that the flights you already take would count,
> and all you need for ground is to attend one of the safety seminars.

although I prefer the safety seminars (opportunities to meet interesting
folks), you can also do some of the online courses offered by AOPA
instead. I haven't done a BFR since the one I did after validating my
foreign license 10 years ago (via a combination of Wings program and
getting new ratings)...

--Sylvain

[601XL Builder]

Steve Foley wrote:
> "Anonymous coward #673" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Scribble out all those log entries?
>
> Buy a new log book and start it with the BFR. Put the old one in a safe
> place.
>
>

It couldn't hurt to complete a NASA for could it? Would the protections
apply in a case like this?

[kontiki]

Get a BFR ASAP and make sure it is logged. Beyond that,
just be thankful that no mishap ocurred thus far that
would have resulted in your logbook being scrutinized.

[John Theune]

Anonymous coward #673 wrote:
> I fly through an organization that requires a proficiency check ride
> every six months. As a result I somehow got it into my head that I
> didn't need to worry about BFR's any more. But today my instructor
> reminded me that a BFR requires an hour of ground instruction, so
> technically I have not completed a BFR for (as it turns out) more than
> two years (though I have received considerably more recurrent in-flight
> training than the regs require). My log book now contains entries for
> numerous flights conducted (inadvertently) in violation of FAR61.56.
>
> My question to the group: what is the best way to handle this situation?
> Obviously I am going to get my hour of ground instruction ASAP, but what
> about all those flights that I've already logged? Should I file an ASRS
> form? Call up the local FSDO and confess? Scribble out all those log
> entries? Deduct the hours on those illegal flights from my PIC time?
> Bribe my flight instructor to back-date my BFR? Or should I just not
> worry about it and hope they don't haul my ass to Gitmo for falsifying
> my log book?
You might also want to check to see if the safety meetings count as part
of the hour of ground instructions. You may only be missing the sign
offs not the work itself.

[C J Campbell[_1_]]

On 2007-03-24 14:57:01 -0700, Anonymous coward #673 > said:
> My log book now contains entries for
> numerous flights conducted (inadvertently) in violation of FAR61.56.
>
> My question to the group: what is the best way to handle this situation?
>

There is no requirement to keep a logbook except to show currency. Get
a new logbook, move the total hours into it, and forget about it.

Get your BFR signed off in the new logbook and log enough takeoffs and
landings to show currency. No one will have any reason to look in your
old logbook. Once you get the BFR, I doubt if even the FAA would care.
--
Waddling Eagle
World Famous Flight Instructor

[Peter Dohm]

> I fly through an organization that requires a proficiency check ride
> every six months. As a result I somehow got it into my head that I
> didn't need to worry about BFR's any more. But today my instructor
> reminded me that a BFR requires an hour of ground instruction, so
> technically I have not completed a BFR for (as it turns out) more than
> two years (though I have received considerably more recurrent in-flight
> training than the regs require). My log book now contains entries for
> numerous flights conducted (inadvertently) in violation of FAR61.56.
>
> My question to the group: what is the best way to handle this situation?
> Obviously I am going to get my hour of ground instruction ASAP, but what
> about all those flights that I've already logged? Should I file an ASRS
> form? Call up the local FSDO and confess? Scribble out all those log
> entries? Deduct the hours on those illegal flights from my PIC time?
> Bribe my flight instructor to back-date my BFR? Or should I just not
> worry about it and hope they don't haul my ass to Gitmo for falsifying
> my log book?

A call to AOPA couldn't hurt.

[Jim Macklin]

A technical violation of the flight review is a minor think,
particularly since you did do "check flights" with the club.
It is an "honest error" and best kept to yourself.

BUT whatever you do, do not try to go back and amend your
logbook to "cover your tracks and make it right. That is
logbook fraud and they will revoke all your certificates and
require you to wait at least 1 year to apply again, and
taking all the required training and testing again.

Don't report yourself and don't bother with the NASA report,
it doesn't cover that type of error.

Just don't do it again. And the new logbook isn't a bad
idea, just transfer the totals and start clean. Maybe burn
the old one.


"kontiki" > wrote in message
...
| Get a BFR ASAP and make sure it is logged. Beyond that,
| just be thankful that no mishap ocurred thus far that
| would have resulted in your logbook being scrutinized.
|

[C J Campbell[_1_]]

On 2007-03-24 20:55:52 -0700, "Jim Macklin"
> said:

> A technical violation of the flight review is a minor think,
> particularly since you did do "check flights" with the club.
> It is an "honest error" and best kept to yourself.
>
> BUT whatever you do, do not try to go back and amend your
> logbook to "cover your tracks and make it right. That is
> logbook fraud and they will revoke all your certificates and
> require you to wait at least 1 year to apply again, and
> taking all the required training and testing again.
>
> Don't report yourself and don't bother with the NASA report,
> it doesn't cover that type of error.
>
> Just don't do it again. And the new logbook isn't a bad
> idea, just transfer the totals and start clean. Maybe burn
> the old one.

I would not recommend burning the old one. Aside from old endorsements
and stuff that might be valuable from an insurance standpoint, there is
usually a lot of emotional attachment to a logbook. I just wouldn't
volunteer its contents to anyone who might look to see if all the BFRs
are in there.
--
Waddling Eagle
World Famous Flight Instructor

[Dan Luke]

"Andrew Sarangan" wrote:

> The logbook is your personal document. It becomes a legal document
> only when you submit it for inspection by the FAA for a checkride or
> ramp check.

You do not have to show your logbook to the FAA at a ramp check.

--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

[Stubby]

601XL Builder wrote:
> Steve Foley wrote:
>> "Anonymous coward #673" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Scribble out all those log entries?
>>
>> Buy a new log book and start it with the BFR. Put the old one in a
>> safe place.
>>
>>
>
> It couldn't hurt to complete a NASA for could it?
It might, because filing an ASRS bars you from filing another one for
something like a year.



Would the protections
> apply in a case like this?

[Andrew Sarangan]

On Mar 25, 12:48 pm, Stubby >
wrote:
> 601XL Builder wrote:
> > Steve Foley wrote:
> >> "Anonymous coward #673" > wrote in message
> ...
> >>> Scribble out all those log entries?
>
> >> Buy a new log book and start it with the BFR. Put the old one in a
> >> safe place.
>
> > It couldn't hurt to complete a NASA for could it?
>
> It might, because filing an ASRS bars you from filing another one for
> something like a year.
>

You can file as many as you want, but you only qualify for one
immunity every five years. Simply filing an ASRS does not mean you are
using up that one chance. The FAA must come after you for the
violation, using information other than the ASRS itself. Also,
remember that not all ASRS involve a violation. Some are simply
informational or whistle blowers.

[Jim Macklin]

You can file a NASA report every day for every flight leg.
But you can only use one to end an FAA enforcement action
once each five years. You don't bring up the NASA report
and your proof of timely filing until the FAA completes an
investigation and says, you have a 9 month suspension or a
$25,000 fine, then you present your NASA slip.


"Stubby" > wrote in
message . ..
|
|
| 601XL Builder wrote:
| > Steve Foley wrote:
| >> "Anonymous coward #673" > wrote in
message
| >>
...
| >>> Scribble out all those log entries?
| >>
| >> Buy a new log book and start it with the BFR. Put the
old one in a
| >> safe place.
| >>
| >>
| >
| > It couldn't hurt to complete a NASA for could it?
| It might, because filing an ASRS bars you from filing
another one for
| something like a year.
|
|
|
| Would the protections
| > apply in a case like this?

[Ron Natalie]

Andrew Sarangan wrote:
> On Mar 25, 12:48 pm, Stubby >
> wrote:
>> 601XL Builder wrote:
>>> Steve Foley wrote:
>>>> "Anonymous coward #673" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>> Scribble out all those log entries?
>>>> Buy a new log book and start it with the BFR. Put the old one in a
>>>> safe place.
>>> It couldn't hurt to complete a NASA for could it?
>> It might, because filing an ASRS bars you from filing another one for
>> something like a year.
>>
>
> You can file as many as you want, but you only qualify for one
> immunity every five years. Simply filing an ASRS does not mean you are
> using up that one chance. The FAA must come after you for the
> violation, using information other than the ASRS itself. Also,
> remember that not all ASRS involve a violation. Some are simply
> informational or whistle blowers.
>
>
>
It doesn't even work that way. First off you get immunity (the
info on the form can't be used against you) for each submission.

The every five year thing is the part where the FAA will forgive
enforcement action if you file an ASRS and you haven't another
previous violation in the past five years. The 5-year thing
runs regardless of whether you've used the ASRS get out of free
thing for a previous violation. That is, it's not possible
to "save it up" for a bigger violation.

[Peter R.]

On 3/25/2007 2:21:50 PM, "Andrew Sarangan" wrote:

> Also,
> remember that not all ASRS involve a violation. Some are simply
> informational or whistle blowers.

Some point out potential safety issues as well (not sure if you included that
in your "informational" definition or not).

Two years ago I filed one to point out that two different, but nearby active
airports shared the same AWOS frequency. When flying to the further airport
from the east, the closer airport's AWOS stepped all over the further
airport's AWOS and it was impossible to receive current weather until about
15 to 20 nm, or about 6 to 8 minutes east of the further airport. Not a big
deal if conditions were benign VFR, but this was an issue when conditions
were low and windy IFR, since the pilot had to scramble to decide and then
set up the desired approach.

Never heard a word back from this report and both airports still share the
same AWOS frequency two years later, so a lot of good that did. :(

--
Peter

[Shirl]

Dan Luke wrote:
> > You do not have to show your logbook to the FAA at a ramp check.

Jim Stewart > wrote:
> Don't you have to show it if you're a soloed
> student without a regular license?

This question came up when I worked at the flight school. The answer
given to our customers by our CFIs was that you must have your student
license and medical with you in the airplane, and if asked in a ramp
check, you must be able to produce a logbook showing the appropriate
solo endorsement, but you don't have to have the logbook with you *in
the airplane* during the flight.

[Jim Logajan]

"Dan Luke" > wrote:
> "Andrew Sarangan" wrote:
>
>> The logbook is your personal document. It becomes a legal document
>> only when you submit it for inspection by the FAA for a checkride or
>> ramp check.
>
> You do not have to show your logbook to the FAA at a ramp check.

Some of the legal advice I've found says that if you have it with you then
you have to show it if asked. Here's a couple links that say that:

http://www.aerolegalservices.com/Articles/RampCheck.shtml
http://www.avweb.com/news/avlaw/181897-1.html

[Jim Stewart]

Dan Luke wrote:
> "Andrew Sarangan" wrote:
>
>
>>The logbook is your personal document. It becomes a legal document
>>only when you submit it for inspection by the FAA for a checkride or
>>ramp check.
>
>
> You do not have to show your logbook to the FAA at a ramp check.

Don't you have to show it if you're a soloed
student without a regular license?

[Dan Luke]

"Jim Logajan" wrote :
>> "Andrew Sarangan" wrote:
>>
>>> The logbook is your personal document. It becomes a legal document
>>> only when you submit it for inspection by the FAA for a checkride or
>>> ramp check.
>>
>> You do not have to show your logbook to the FAA at a ramp check.
>
> Some of the legal advice I've found says that if you have it with you then
> you have to show it if asked. Here's a couple links that say that:
>
> http://www.aerolegalservices.com/Articles/RampCheck.shtml

The article says that the FAA may ask to see it, not that you have to show it.
It also advises, wisely, that you not carry your logbook in the airplane.

> http://www.avweb.com/news/avlaw/181897-1.html

Can't read this one; I lost my AvWeb pw a long time ago.

Anyway, the logbook is not one of the items a private pilot is required to
submit to a ramp check.

--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

[Jim Logajan]

"Dan Luke" > wrote:
>
> "Jim Logajan" wrote :
>>> "Andrew Sarangan" wrote:
>>>
>>>> The logbook is your personal document. It becomes a legal document
>>>> only when you submit it for inspection by the FAA for a checkride
>>>> or ramp check.
>>>
>>> You do not have to show your logbook to the FAA at a ramp check.
>>
>> Some of the legal advice I've found says that if you have it with you
>> then you have to show it if asked. Here's a couple links that say
>> that:
>>
>> http://www.aerolegalservices.com/Articles/RampCheck.shtml
>
> The article says that the FAA may ask to see it, not that you have to
> show it. It also advises, wisely, that you not carry your logbook in
> the airplane.
>
>> http://www.avweb.com/news/avlaw/181897-1.html
>
> Can't read this one; I lost my AvWeb pw a long time ago.

Here's the relevant quote from that article:

"What Can an FAA Inspector Demand to See?

Upon request, a properly credentialed FAA official may demand to see a
pilot's license and medical certificate and a copy of the pilot's logbook
(if he has it with him). An inspector cannot normally gain entry to
search an aircraft operated under FAR Part 91 without authorization from
the owner or operator, but he may examine the aircraft from the outside
and look through unshaded windows. Exceptions may exist where there is
probable cause that a crime has been committed or in "border crossing"
situations."

> Anyway, the logbook is not one of the items a private pilot is
> required to submit to a ramp check.

As a practical matter, even if the pilot does have the log book with him
but claims he doesn't have it with him, there doesn't seem to be anything
an FAA official can do to prove that the logbook was with the pilot but
he was not shown it. Sure, something that looks like a log book may be
visible but it may not be that pilot's log book or even the current
logbook of the pilot.

[C J Campbell[_1_]]

On 2007-03-25 05:54:49 -0700, "Dan Luke" > said:

>
> "Andrew Sarangan" wrote:
>
>> The logbook is your personal document. It becomes a legal document
>> only when you submit it for inspection by the FAA for a checkride or
>> ramp check.
>
> You do not have to show your logbook to the FAA at a ramp check.

Even so, I cannot imagine an FAA inspector going through your logbook
to see if every flight you ever made was legal or not. At most, he will
look to see when your last BFR was. If it is overdue, the most likely
action is that he will tell you that you need a BFR and encourage you
to get one.

Most FAA inspectors in my experience are not jerks, but people
genuinely interested in aviation safety. Yes, there are a few jerks out
there, but those guys will find an excuse to hang you no matter what
you do. And I am not saying that just because the FAA does a lot of
training flights out of our flight school. :-)
--
Waddling Eagle
World Famous Flight Instructor

[Jim Stewart]

C J Campbell wrote:
> On 2007-03-25 05:54:49 -0700, "Dan Luke" > said:
>
>>
>> "Andrew Sarangan" wrote:
>>
>>> The logbook is your personal document. It becomes a legal document
>>> only when you submit it for inspection by the FAA for a checkride or
>>> ramp check.
>>
>>
>> You do not have to show your logbook to the FAA at a ramp check.
>
>
> Even so, I cannot imagine an FAA inspector going through your logbook to
> see if every flight you ever made was legal or not. At most, he will
> look to see when your last BFR was. If it is overdue, the most likely
> action is that he will tell you that you need a BFR and encourage you to
> get one.
>
> Most FAA inspectors in my experience are not jerks, but people genuinely
> interested in aviation safety. Yes, there are a few jerks out there, but
> those guys will find an excuse to hang you no matter what you do. And I
> am not saying that just because the FAA does a lot of training flights
> out of our flight school. :-)

I'm glad you said that. I can't help but wonder
why most everyone else has such a contentious
attitude towards the FAA.

How many people have been mistreated by the FAA
to lead them to have such an attitude?

[[email protected]]

Jim Stewart > wrote:
> C J Campbell wrote:
> > On 2007-03-25 05:54:49 -0700, "Dan Luke" > said:
> >
> >>
> >> "Andrew Sarangan" wrote:
> >>
> >>> The logbook is your personal document. It becomes a legal document
> >>> only when you submit it for inspection by the FAA for a checkride or
> >>> ramp check.
> >>
> >>
> >> You do not have to show your logbook to the FAA at a ramp check.
> >
> >
> > Even so, I cannot imagine an FAA inspector going through your logbook to
> > see if every flight you ever made was legal or not. At most, he will
> > look to see when your last BFR was. If it is overdue, the most likely
> > action is that he will tell you that you need a BFR and encourage you to
> > get one.
> >
> > Most FAA inspectors in my experience are not jerks, but people genuinely
> > interested in aviation safety. Yes, there are a few jerks out there, but
> > those guys will find an excuse to hang you no matter what you do. And I
> > am not saying that just because the FAA does a lot of training flights
> > out of our flight school. :-)

> I'm glad you said that. I can't help but wonder
> why most everyone else has such a contentious
> attitude towards the FAA.

> How many people have been mistreated by the FAA
> to lead them to have such an attitude?

It only takes a few incidents such as the Bob Hover debacle to get
everyone goosey.

Plus it is bad news that is interesting.

People don't sit around swapping stories about what a non-event their
encounter with the FAA was, they talk about the one time they, or
someone they know, got drug over the coals.

--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

[Shirl]

C J Campbell wrote:
> > Most FAA inspectors in my experience are not jerks, but people genuinely
> > interested in aviation safety. Yes, there are a few jerks out there, but
> > those guys will find an excuse to hang you no matter what you do. And I
> > am not saying that just because the FAA does a lot of training flights
> > out of our flight school. :-)

Jim Stewart > wrote:
> I'm glad you said that. I can't help but wonder
> why most everyone else has such a contentious
> attitude towards the FAA.
>
> How many people have been mistreated by the FAA
> to lead them to have such an attitude?

I wonder the same thing.
I had a mechanical failure and emergency off-field landing that totaled
my airplane last year, and the FAA was VERY professional, helpful and
supportive. I was prepared for the worst, because of all the comments
about how "the FAA out to get you" ... and was very pleasantly surprised
they were nothing like that.

[Shirl]

> People don't sit around swapping stories about what a non-event their
> encounter with the FAA was, they talk about the one time they, or
> someone they know, got drug over the coals.

....and of course it was never their own fault!
;-)

[Matt Whiting]

Jim Stewart wrote:
> C J Campbell wrote:
>> On 2007-03-25 05:54:49 -0700, "Dan Luke" > said:
>>
>>>
>>> "Andrew Sarangan" wrote:
>>>
>>>> The logbook is your personal document. It becomes a legal document
>>>> only when you submit it for inspection by the FAA for a checkride or
>>>> ramp check.
>>>
>>>
>>> You do not have to show your logbook to the FAA at a ramp check.
>>
>>
>> Even so, I cannot imagine an FAA inspector going through your logbook
>> to see if every flight you ever made was legal or not. At most, he
>> will look to see when your last BFR was. If it is overdue, the most
>> likely action is that he will tell you that you need a BFR and
>> encourage you to get one.
>>
>> Most FAA inspectors in my experience are not jerks, but people
>> genuinely interested in aviation safety. Yes, there are a few jerks
>> out there, but those guys will find an excuse to hang you no matter
>> what you do. And I am not saying that just because the FAA does a lot
>> of training flights out of our flight school. :-)
>
> I'm glad you said that. I can't help but wonder
> why most everyone else has such a contentious
> attitude towards the FAA.
>
> How many people have been mistreated by the FAA
> to lead them to have such an attitude?
>

I haven't and I don't know anyone who has, but the few that have
happened have been pretty high profile such as the Hoover case. This
certainly cements in people's minds that all of the FAA are idiots like
the two cretins that busted Bob.

Matt

[Phil]

C J Campbell wrote:
> On 2007-03-24 14:57:01 -0700, Anonymous coward #673
> > said:
>> My log book now contains entries for
>> numerous flights conducted (inadvertently) in violation of FAR61.56.
>>
>> My question to the group: what is the best way to handle this situation?
>>
>
> There is no requirement to keep a logbook except to show currency. Get a
> new logbook, move the total hours into it, and forget about it.
>
> Get your BFR signed off in the new logbook and log enough takeoffs and
> landings to show currency. No one will have any reason to look in your
> old logbook. Once you get the BFR, I doubt if even the FAA would care.

The above is true. What is a logbook? I use a spiral notebook in the
plane that I replace every six months or so.
What happens if I lose my "logbook" and can't prove I had a BFR? Well,
the guy who gave me the BFR put it in HIS logbook and the FAR says only
that it must be logged in a logbook, not WHOSE logbook.
Please don't read stuff into the FAR's.

--
"Religion began when the first scoundrel met the first fool."
—- Voltaire

[Margy Natalie]

Anonymous coward #673 wrote:
> I fly through an organization that requires a proficiency check ride
> every six months. As a result I somehow got it into my head that I
> didn't need to worry about BFR's any more. But today my instructor
> reminded me that a BFR requires an hour of ground instruction, so
> technically I have not completed a BFR for (as it turns out) more than
> two years (though I have received considerably more recurrent in-flight
> training than the regs require). My log book now contains entries for
> numerous flights conducted (inadvertently) in violation of FAR61.56.
>
> My question to the group: what is the best way to handle this situation?
> Obviously I am going to get my hour of ground instruction ASAP, but what
> about all those flights that I've already logged? Should I file an ASRS
> form? Call up the local FSDO and confess? Scribble out all those log
> entries? Deduct the hours on those illegal flights from my PIC time?
> Bribe my flight instructor to back-date my BFR? Or should I just not
> worry about it and hope they don't haul my ass to Gitmo for falsifying
> my log book?
You didn't falisify your log book, you just flew when you weren't legal.

Margy

[Anonymous coward #673]

In article >,
Margy Natalie > wrote:

> Anonymous coward #673 wrote:
> > I fly through an organization that requires a proficiency check ride
> > every six months. As a result I somehow got it into my head that I
> > didn't need to worry about BFR's any more. But today my instructor
> > reminded me that a BFR requires an hour of ground instruction, so
> > technically I have not completed a BFR for (as it turns out) more than
> > two years (though I have received considerably more recurrent in-flight
> > training than the regs require). My log book now contains entries for
> > numerous flights conducted (inadvertently) in violation of FAR61.56.
> >
> > My question to the group: what is the best way to handle this situation?
> > Obviously I am going to get my hour of ground instruction ASAP, but what
> > about all those flights that I've already logged? Should I file an ASRS
> > form? Call up the local FSDO and confess? Scribble out all those log
> > entries? Deduct the hours on those illegal flights from my PIC time?
> > Bribe my flight instructor to back-date my BFR? Or should I just not
> > worry about it and hope they don't haul my ass to Gitmo for falsifying
> > my log book?
> You didn't falisify your log book, you just flew when you weren't legal.

Well, I logged PIC time when I was not legally qualified to act as PIC
(though I was *acting* as PIC by virtue of being sole manipulator of the
controls).

God, this is such a weird situation.

FWIW, I am now newly BFRd, so hopefully this is now a moot point :-)

Thanks for all the feedback.

[LJ Blodgett]

cut the page out. I did'nt say that. LJ

Margy Natalie wrote:
> Anonymous coward #673 wrote:
>
>> I fly through an organization that requires a proficiency check ride
>> every six months. As a result I somehow got it into my head that I
>> didn't need to worry about BFR's any more. But today my instructor
>> reminded me that a BFR requires an hour of ground instruction, so
>> technically I have not completed a BFR for (as it turns out) more than
>> two years (though I have received considerably more recurrent
>> in-flight training than the regs require). My log book now contains
>> entries for numerous flights conducted (inadvertently) in violation of
>> FAR61.56.
>>
>> My question to the group: what is the best way to handle this
>> situation? Obviously I am going to get my hour of ground instruction
>> ASAP, but what about all those flights that I've already logged?
>> Should I file an ASRS form? Call up the local FSDO and confess?
>> Scribble out all those log entries? Deduct the hours on those illegal
>> flights from my PIC time? Bribe my flight instructor to back-date my
>> BFR? Or should I just not worry about it and hope they don't haul my
>> ass to Gitmo for falsifying my log book?
>
> You didn't falisify your log book, you just flew when you weren't legal.
>
> Margy

[Roger[_4_]]

On Thu, 29 Mar 2007 11:33:40 -0600, LJ Blodgett >
wrote:

You any relation to Terry from HTL?

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

[Roger[_4_]]

On Sat, 24 Mar 2007 14:57:01 -0700, Anonymous coward #673
> wrote:

>I fly through an organization that requires a proficiency check ride
>every six months. As a result I somehow got it into my head that I
>didn't need to worry about BFR's any more. But today my instructor
>reminded me that a BFR requires an hour of ground instruction, so

According to the FARs the way I read them a Proficency check can
substitute for the BFR.
My book is out in the shop and I'm too lazy to go get it, but the
remark about the Proficency check is in the section on BFRs.

>technically I have not completed a BFR for (as it turns out) more than
>two years (though I have received considerably more recurrent in-flight
>training than the regs require). My log book now contains entries for
>numerous flights conducted (inadvertently) in violation of FAR61.56.
>
>My question to the group: what is the best way to handle this situation?
>Obviously I am going to get my hour of ground instruction ASAP, but what
>about all those flights that I've already logged? Should I file an ASRS
>form? Call up the local FSDO and confess? Scribble out all those log
>entries? Deduct the hours on those illegal flights from my PIC time?
>Bribe my flight instructor to back-date my BFR? Or should I just not
>worry about it and hope they don't haul my ass to Gitmo for falsifying
>my log book?
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com