I just have to get it off my chest.

[Clem]

This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.


Regarding YENC:

The only interpretation provided to newbies, is to use a simple reader
like OE. Unless you know the history of yenc software, newbies can't
figure out why an answer like that is provided and the tempers erupt.

You can plonk people to death, but what's the point? If we were at an air
show and I mentioned that I use yenc, would you stop talking to me or I
you? Probably not, that would be rude, so why persist with that type
behavior on this newsgroup?

This group has an aversion to yenc for only one noticeable reason, the
rules here. Yenc has come a long way since its inception. If you take
time to learn it, you might change your mind about it.

It's assumed plonking posters who use yenc will be shamed into leaving or
at least stop any future yenc posts.

I was asked not to post here a long time ago because of the "rules".

That's ok, I won't post anything on this group and subsequently the group
has been denied what I have to share. I don't see the logic in it, but
that's the way this group runs itself. This group only denies themselves
because of an outdated rule.

Every group I use that allows binary posting doesn't seem to have a
problem with yenc. Actually they could care less and personally I have
not had any trouble viewing others yenc postings. What this group needs
is a rule to update its rules which brings me to this point:

I don't understand why an unmoderated group insists on enforcing rules
over a public platform like the Internet. Unless someone is breaking laws
like posting child porn, the ability to enforce a rule like this is non-
existent. It actually invites trouble.

When a new user comes along, where do they go for the list of rules? The
list of do's and do not's appear nowhere when I visit here.

I say it's time to vote again. I say an open vote on a public system like
yahoo should resolve this issue once and for all.

For some reason I have a problem looking at GIF and BMP files only in a
newsgroup. Should that reason alone be reason enough that I ask everyone
not to use those formats?

Eventually I'll find out what the problem is with my readers.

The point here is that what problem "I" have should not be yours which is
what oldtimers here don't understand. If all you see is gibberish, it
isn't decoding. If the software isn't decoding it either has a problem or
doesn't recognize the format.

There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.

[russell[_2_]]

Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted programmes)
when all you need to do is resize your pictures before you post them. The
best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO) and we don't have to install
any upgraded software to view his images, so what is so special about yours?
If you can't take his lead, maybe you are the loser and we have missed
nothing....



"Clem" > wrote in message
. 97.136...
> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>
>
> Regarding YENC:
>
>
> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>

[Dallas[_2_]]

Agreed... :D

"russell" > wrote in message
...
> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures before you
> post them. The best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO) and we don't
> have to install any upgraded software to view his images, so what is so
> special about yours? If you can't take his lead, maybe you are the loser
> and we have missed nothing....
>
>
>
> "Clem" > wrote in message
> . 97.136...
>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>>
>>
>> Regarding YENC:
>>
>>
>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>>
>
>

[Frank[_2_]]

"russell" > wrote in
:

> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures before you
> post them. The best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO) and we
> don't have to install any upgraded software to view his images, so
> what is so special about yours? If you can't take his lead, maybe you
> are the loser and we have missed nothing....
>
>
>
> "Clem" > wrote in message
> . 97.136...
>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>>
>>
>> Regarding YENC:
>>
>>
>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>>
>
>

Clem:

I agree with you wholeheartedly. "Upgrade to what?" Just use your web
browser to search for "yenc newsreader" and you will be rewarded with a
long list of free offerings. Why downsize your images when YENC is so easy.

Frank

[Woody]

My solution to YENC posters is just to stick them in the killfile. Stop
trying to dictate what everyone else should use. My solution is if you
insist on YENC I don't want to see your pictures.


"Frank" > wrote in message
...
> "russell" > wrote in
> :
>
>> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
>> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures before you
>> post them. The best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO) and we
>> don't have to install any upgraded software to view his images, so
>> what is so special about yours? If you can't take his lead, maybe you
>> are the loser and we have missed nothing....
>>
>>
>>
>> "Clem" > wrote in message
>> . 97.136...
>>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>>>
>>>
>>> Regarding YENC:
>>>
>>>
>>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>>>
>>
>>
>
> Clem:
>
> I agree with you wholeheartedly. "Upgrade to what?" Just use your web
> browser to search for "yenc newsreader" and you will be rewarded with a
> long list of free offerings. Why downsize your images when YENC is so
> easy.
>
> Frank

[Ray O'Hara[_2_]]

"russell" > wrote in message
...
> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
programmes)
> when all you need to do is resize your pictures before you post them. The
> best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO) and we don't have to
install
> any upgraded software to view his images, so what is so special about
yours?
> If you can't take his lead, maybe you are the loser and we have missed
> nothing....

dead on

[Ray O'Hara[_2_]]

"Clem" > wrote in message
. 97.136...
> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>
>
> Regarding YENC:

why should i add another program? i don't killfile yenc-ers to be rude but
just to remove clutter.

why should i waste space on my machine for a program i don't want, and which
forces me to download several posts to a special folder and combine them
just to see one picture?

the truth is , if you want people to see your stuff put it in a format they
will use.

its an unmoderated group. so there are no rules, just custom. so feel free
to post in yenc, but also expect to be killfiled by many of us who don't use
it.
it's nothing personal,

[Willem Van der Voort]

"russell" > schreef in bericht
...
> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures before you
> post them. The best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO) and we don't
> have to install any upgraded software to view his images, so what is so
> special about yours? If you can't take his lead, maybe you are the loser
> and we have missed nothing....

100% tru

Willem

[The Good Poster[_2_]]

"Clem" > wrote in message
. 97.136...
>
> Every group I use that allows binary posting doesn't seem to have a
> problem with yenc. Actually they could care less and personally I have
> not had any trouble viewing others yenc postings.


Please name one non-porn photo group where yEnc is the norm.

Joe
TGP

[Bernd Rosemeier]

"russell" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures before you
> post them. The best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO) and we don't
> have to install any upgraded software to view his images, so what is so
> special about yours? If you can't take his lead, maybe you are the loser
> and we have missed nothing....
>
Full ACK

Bernd

[Clairbear]

"Ray O'Hara" > wrote in
:

>
> "Clem" > wrote in message
> . 97.136...
>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>>
>>
>> Regarding YENC:
>
> why should i add another program? i don't killfile yenc-ers to be
> rude but
> just to remove clutter.
>
> why should i waste space on my machine for a program i don't want, and
> which forces me to download several posts to a special folder and
> combine them just to see one picture?
>
> the truth is , if you want people to see your stuff put it in a format
> they will use.
>
> its an unmoderated group. so there are no rules, just custom. so feel
> free to post in yenc, but also expect to be killfiled by many of us
> who don't use it.
> it's nothing personal,
>
>
>

Gee 1227K for xnews I might have to remove it
and it reads yenc, speeds up access,rejoins multi part posts, and allows me
to access all header on ng
You might be right I guess I'll just have to go back to the inconvenience
of using OE to access the usenet.

[Dave[_16_]]

Clairbear wrote:
> "Ray O'Hara" > wrote in
> :
>
>> "Clem" > wrote in message
>> . 97.136...
>>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>>>
>>>
>>> Regarding YENC:
>> why should i add another program? i don't killfile yenc-ers to be
>> rude but
>> just to remove clutter.
>>
>> why should i waste space on my machine for a program i don't want, and
>> which forces me to download several posts to a special folder and
>> combine them just to see one picture?
>>
>> the truth is , if you want people to see your stuff put it in a format
>> they will use.
>>
>> its an unmoderated group. so there are no rules, just custom. so feel
>> free to post in yenc, but also expect to be killfiled by many of us
>> who don't use it.
>> it's nothing personal,
>>
>>
>>
>
> Gee 1227K for xnews I might have to remove it
> and it reads yenc, speeds up access,rejoins multi part posts, and allows me
> to access all header on ng
> You might be right I guess I'll just have to go back to the inconvenience
> of using OE to access the usenet.

I think that things should be as simple as possible.
There are quite a few people who don't know how to setup new programs,
like my 85 year old father, but he likes this newsgroup.
He worked for Curtis back in the 30's and 40's in their experimental
aircraft group in Buffalo.

I vote for keeping it as simple and direct as possible so everybody can
enjoy these great photos of beautiful and unique aircraft.
Just my two cents.

Cheers

Dave

[Shiver]

> Frank > wrote:


> Just use your web
> browser to search for "yenc newsreader" and you will be rewarded with a
> long list of free offerings.

I'll tell you what Frank.

Upgrading my older Mac OS and software is NOT AN OPTION.

So if YOU can find a way for me to view YENC images that won't cost me
any money which I do not have I will be eternally grateful.

However it MUST WORK WITH OS 8.6 and my newsreader YA Newswatcher 5.0.1

And I mean it must work with that system...... PERIOD.

I can tell you that after trying for years and listening to advice from
people just like you that noboday and I mean nobody has been able to
come up with a solution for me.

So I go back to my simple attitude..... If your not willing to post
images to this group or any others in a manner that all can see then
obviously you do not wish me to see your pictures and in that case
it is very simple... I CAN'T MISS WHAT I CAN'T SEE.

[Netko]

On Sun, 8 Jul 2007 19:23:30 +0100, shiver wrote
(in message >):

> So if YOU can find a way for me to view YENC images that won't cost me
> any money which I do not have I will be eternally grateful.
>
> However it MUST WORK WITH OS 8.6 and my newsreader YA Newswatcher 5.0.1

yEnc TZ might help. You'll find it at:

http://www.turbozen.com/mac/yenc/

Note that there are three different versions, depending on the mix
of hardware and software, so make sure you grab the right one.

--

[Terry M[_3_]]

Absolutely. I have to decode yenc in the book newsgroups but before I waste
my time decoding - I already know what I am going to get. Why should I
spend a lot of time downloading a single huge picture then have to decode it
just to find something I don't want in the first place? Post in a downsized
picture format and save me time in viewing. I killfile anyone in the
picture groups which post in yenc because of their inconsideration in
thinking their stuff is so important that they have to post in huge size and
waste my time. Another thing is that many servers (not mine thank goodness)
have very limited server space and posting in yenc can rapidly fill it up
pushing other material off. I agree that yenc has many good points for
certain things like the book groups but in here - NO!!


"russell" > wrote in message
...
> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures before you
> post them. The best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO) and we don't
> have to install any upgraded software to view his images, so what is so
> special about yours? If you can't take his lead, maybe you are the loser
> and we have missed nothing....
>
>
>
> "Clem" > wrote in message
> . 97.136...
>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>>
>>
>> Regarding YENC:
>>
>>
>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>>
>
>

[Dustoff]

"The Good Poster" > wrote in message
...
> "Clem" > wrote in message
> . 97.136...
>>
>> Every group I use that allows binary posting doesn't seem to have a
>> problem with yenc. Actually they could care less and personally I have
>> not had any trouble viewing others yenc postings.
>
>
> Please name one non-porn photo group where yEnc is the norm.
>
> Joe
> TGP
>
I just kill file them otherwise they drag out a war on the yEnc and then
nothing gets posted because they fill the the space with argueing about
it....I won't debate it nor will I try to force them to change. Its their
stuff to post so let them. Its too easy to killfile them and ever newsgroup
I go to if I see yEnc BURRPPPP killfiled. End of story.....
Even thou I usully just lurk here I do want to Thank All the posters For
some really GREAT aircraft Photos THANKS...

[Don Pyeatt]

"russell" > wrote in message
...
> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures before you
> post them. The best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO) and we don't
> have to install any upgraded software to view his images, so what is so
> special about yours? If you can't take his lead, maybe you are the loser
> and we have missed nothing....
>
>
>
> "Clem" > wrote in message
> . 97.136...
>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>>
>>
>> Regarding YENC:
>>
>>
>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>>
>
>

This group has decided to be YENC-free and has reaffirmed the decision many
times. If it goes YENC, I'm leaving.

gdp

[Clairbear]

Dave > wrote in
. net:

> Clairbear wrote:
>> "Ray O'Hara" > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>> "Clem" > wrote in message
>>> . 97.136...
>>>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Regarding YENC:
>>> why should i add another program? i don't killfile yenc-ers to be
>>> rude but
>>> just to remove clutter.
>>>
>>> why should i waste space on my machine for a program i don't want,
>>> and which forces me to download several posts to a special folder
>>> and combine them just to see one picture?
>>>
>>> the truth is , if you want people to see your stuff put it in a
>>> format they will use.
>>>
>>> its an unmoderated group. so there are no rules, just custom. so
>>> feel free to post in yenc, but also expect to be killfiled by many
>>> of us who don't use it.
>>> it's nothing personal,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Gee 1227K for xnews I might have to remove it
>> and it reads yenc, speeds up access,rejoins multi part posts, and
>> allows me to access all header on ng
>> You might be right I guess I'll just have to go back to the
>> inconvenience of using OE to access the usenet.
>
> I think that things should be as simple as possible.
> There are quite a few people who don't know how to setup new programs,
> like my 85 year old father, but he likes this newsgroup.
> He worked for Curtis back in the 30's and 40's in their experimental
> aircraft group in Buffalo.
>
> I vote for keeping it as simple and direct as possible so everybody
> can enjoy these great photos of beautiful and unique aircraft.
> Just my two cents.
>
> Cheers
>
> Dave
>
>

I am not talking about voting on anything. It is just that downloading
and using a program like xnews simply make using NGs easier and more
simplified than using something as cumbersome as OE.
It is easier to set up and use than OE so give it a try you might be
pleasantly supprised

I am not shilling for xnews it is free and there may be others that fit
the bill.

[Clairbear]

shiver > wrote in news:080720071223131051%
:

>> Frank > wrote:
>
>
>> Just use your web
>> browser to search for "yenc newsreader" and you will be rewarded with a
>> long list of free offerings.
>
> I'll tell you what Frank.
>
> Upgrading my older Mac OS and software is NOT AN OPTION.
>
> So if YOU can find a way for me to view YENC images that won't cost me
> any money which I do not have I will be eternally grateful.
>
> However it MUST WORK WITH OS 8.6 and my newsreader YA Newswatcher 5.0.1
>
> And I mean it must work with that system...... PERIOD.
>
> I can tell you that after trying for years and listening to advice from
> people just like you that noboday and I mean nobody has been able to
> come up with a solution for me.
>
> So I go back to my simple attitude..... If your not willing to post
> images to this group or any others in a manner that all can see then
> obviously you do not wish me to see your pictures and in that case
> it is very simple... I CAN'T MISS WHAT I CAN'T SEE.
>

XNEWS is free and there are probaly others just go to some site like
download.com

[Clairbear]

"Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
:

>
> "russell" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
>> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures before
>> you post them. The best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO) and
>> we don't have to install any upgraded software to view his images, so
>> what is so special about yours? If you can't take his lead, maybe you
>> are the loser and we have missed nothing....
>>
>>
>>
>> "Clem" > wrote in message
>> . 97.136...
>>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>>>
>>>
>>> Regarding YENC:
>>>
>>>
>>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>>>
>>
>>
>
> This group has decided to be YENC-free and has reaffirmed the decision
> many times. If it goes YENC, I'm leaving.
>
> gdp
>
>
>
>
>

don't get you panties in a twist there Don
It really should not matter yenc or not if you have a good newsreader
OE is not a good newreader BTW

[Morgans[_2_]]

"Clairbear" > wrote

> don't get you panties in a twist there Don
> It really should not matter yenc or not if you have a good newsreader
> OE is not a good newreader BTW

WHO are YOU to say what is a good newsreader, or not?

If he likes it, I like it, and thousands of others like it, it must be plenty
good, for our needs.

Who is to say Yenc is an improvement, for that matter? Not me, or many others.
--
Jim in NC

[Don Pyeatt]

"Clairbear" > wrote in message
...
> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
> :
>
>>
>> "russell" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
>>> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures before
>>> you post them. The best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO) and
>>> we don't have to install any upgraded software to view his images, so
>>> what is so special about yours? If you can't take his lead, maybe you
>>> are the loser and we have missed nothing....
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "Clem" > wrote in message
>>> . 97.136...
>>>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Regarding YENC:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> This group has decided to be YENC-free and has reaffirmed the decision
>> many times. If it goes YENC, I'm leaving.
>>
>> gdp
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> don't get you panties in a twist there Don
> It really should not matter yenc or not if you have a good newsreader
> OE is not a good newreader BTW

"Good" is a matter of opinion. OE sends and receives email, it has a broad
group of filters, it doesn't force me to open anything I don't want to read,
it reads from and posts to newsgroups, it combines and decodes.....just what
would make it "good"? YENC??? From my experience, anyone who says OE is
trash simply doesn't know how to use it.

gdp

[Clairbear]

"Morgans" > wrote in
:

>
> "Clairbear" > wrote
>
>> don't get you panties in a twist there Don
>> It really should not matter yenc or not if you have a good newsreader
>> OE is not a good newreader BTW
>
> WHO are YOU to say what is a good newsreader, or not?
>
> If he likes it, I like it, and thousands of others like it, it must
> be plenty
> good, for our needs.
>
> Who is to say Yenc is an improvement, for that matter? Not me, or
> many others.

Tell would you want to power your car with a 1 cylinder 2 stroke engine or
would you rather have a good auto engine of 4 cylinders or more.
But then since I have never seen post of any pics here I guess your
rudeness would be less pardonable than from someone who has share photos
here

As to this whole yenc or not argument her I don't use it to post but my
newsreader can decode itand it can rejoin multipart post OE can't do that
ergo OE is an inferior news reader. fit for newbies and those who are
stuck in the last century.

[Clairbear]

"Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
:

>
> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>>
>>> "russell" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
>>>> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures before
>>>> you post them. The best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO)
>>>> and we don't have to install any upgraded software to view his
>>>> images, so what is so special about yours? If you can't take his
>>>> lead, maybe you are the loser and we have missed nothing....
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Clem" > wrote in message
>>>> . 97.136...
>>>>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Regarding YENC:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> This group has decided to be YENC-free and has reaffirmed the
>>> decision many times. If it goes YENC, I'm leaving.
>>>
>>> gdp
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> don't get you panties in a twist there Don
>> It really should not matter yenc or not if you have a good newsreader
>> OE is not a good newreader BTW
>
> "Good" is a matter of opinion. OE sends and receives email, it has a
> broad group of filters, it doesn't force me to open anything I don't
> want to read, it reads from and posts to newsgroups, it combines and
> decodes.....just what would make it "good"? YENC??? From my
> experience, anyone who says OE is trash simply doesn't know how to use
> it.
>
> gdp
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

OE is fine for email but as a newsreader it is stuck in the darkages
There several fine newreader that would make posting and reading far
simpler If you want to stay in the dark ages that is fine but don't
attack those who post in an easily readable format. If you use a more up
to date reader you can see what is posted by those who choose to use
yenc. As for me when I post I don'y use yenc but I have no problem with
those who do.
"It is better to light one single candle than to curse the darkness"

[Morgans[_2_]]

"Clairbear" > wrote

> my
> newsreader can decode itand it can rejoin multipart post OE can't do that
> ergo OE is an inferior news reader. fit for newbies and those who are
> stuck in the last century.

My car can't fart like a horse, but that does not mean that my car is inferior
to a horse.

All that is new does not glitter like gold.
--
Jim in NC

[Don Pyeatt]

"Clairbear" > wrote in message
...
> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
> :
>
>>
>> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>>> :
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "russell" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
>>>>> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures before
>>>>> you post them. The best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO)
>>>>> and we don't have to install any upgraded software to view his
>>>>> images, so what is so special about yours? If you can't take his
>>>>> lead, maybe you are the loser and we have missed nothing....
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Clem" > wrote in message
>>>>> . 97.136...
>>>>>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Regarding YENC:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> This group has decided to be YENC-free and has reaffirmed the
>>>> decision many times. If it goes YENC, I'm leaving.
>>>>
>>>> gdp
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> don't get you panties in a twist there Don
>>> It really should not matter yenc or not if you have a good newsreader
>>> OE is not a good newreader BTW
>>
>> "Good" is a matter of opinion. OE sends and receives email, it has a
>> broad group of filters, it doesn't force me to open anything I don't
>> want to read, it reads from and posts to newsgroups, it combines and
>> decodes.....just what would make it "good"? YENC??? From my
>> experience, anyone who says OE is trash simply doesn't know how to use
>> it.
>>
>> gdp
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> OE is fine for email but as a newsreader it is stuck in the darkages
> There several fine newreader that would make posting and reading far
> simpler If you want to stay in the dark ages that is fine but don't
> attack those who post in an easily readable format. If you use a more up
> to date reader you can see what is posted by those who choose to use
> yenc. As for me when I post I don'y use yenc but I have no problem with
> those who do.
> "It is better to light one single candle than to curse the darkness"


I had no intent of attacking anyone, if I did, I apologize. Please tell me
the virtues of other newsreaders that make them easier to use than OE.

[Clairbear]

"Morgans" > wrote in
:

>
> "Clairbear" > wrote
>
>> my
>> newsreader can decode itand it can rejoin multipart post OE can't do
>> that ergo OE is an inferior news reader. fit for newbies and those
>> who are stuck in the last century.
>
> My car can't fart like a horse, but that does not mean that my car is
> inferior to a horse.
>
> All that is new does not glitter like gold.

your point is moot!

[Clairbear]

"Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
:

>
> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>>
>>> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>>>> :
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "russell" > wrote in message
>>>>> ...
>>>>>> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
>>>>>> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures
>>>>>> before you post them. The best pictures on this NG come from
>>>>>> Glenn (IMO) and we don't have to install any upgraded software to
>>>>>> view his images, so what is so special about yours? If you can't
>>>>>> take his lead, maybe you are the loser and we have missed
>>>>>> nothing....
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Clem" > wrote in message
>>>>>> . 97.136...
>>>>>>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in
>>>>>>> particular.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Regarding YENC:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> This group has decided to be YENC-free and has reaffirmed the
>>>>> decision many times. If it goes YENC, I'm leaving.
>>>>>
>>>>> gdp
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> don't get you panties in a twist there Don
>>>> It really should not matter yenc or not if you have a good
>>>> newsreader OE is not a good newreader BTW
>>>
>>> "Good" is a matter of opinion. OE sends and receives email, it has
>>> a broad group of filters, it doesn't force me to open anything I
>>> don't want to read, it reads from and posts to newsgroups, it
>>> combines and decodes.....just what would make it "good"? YENC???
>>> From my experience, anyone who says OE is trash simply doesn't know
>>> how to use it.
>>>
>>> gdp
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> OE is fine for email but as a newsreader it is stuck in the darkages
>> There several fine newreader that would make posting and reading far
>> simpler If you want to stay in the dark ages that is fine but don't
>> attack those who post in an easily readable format. If you use a more
>> up to date reader you can see what is posted by those who choose to
>> use yenc. As for me when I post I don'y use yenc but I have no
>> problem with those who do.
>> "It is better to light one single candle than to curse the darkness"
>
>
> I had no intent of attacking anyone, if I did, I apologize. Please
> tell me the virtues of other newsreaders that make them easier to use
> than OE.
>
>
>

Xnews can read all headers at once OE can't
It can decode and rejoin multiaprt posts without other steps
It can download an entire stream of posts where as You have to manually
read each and every one with OE
I could go on and on but Xnews and other similar to are just more
efficient and easier that OE
What would it harm for you to try one or more to see if they work
better

Of course if you are not willing to try you'll never know.

[Don Pyeatt]

"Clairbear" > wrote in message
...
> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
> :
>
>>
>> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>>> :
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>>>>> :
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "russell" > wrote in message
>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
>>>>>>> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures
>>>>>>> before you post them. The best pictures on this NG come from
>>>>>>> Glenn (IMO) and we don't have to install any upgraded software to
>>>>>>> view his images, so what is so special about yours? If you can't
>>>>>>> take his lead, maybe you are the loser and we have missed
>>>>>>> nothing....
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "Clem" > wrote in message
>>>>>>> . 97.136...
>>>>>>>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in
>>>>>>>> particular.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Regarding YENC:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This group has decided to be YENC-free and has reaffirmed the
>>>>>> decision many times. If it goes YENC, I'm leaving.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> gdp
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> don't get you panties in a twist there Don
>>>>> It really should not matter yenc or not if you have a good
>>>>> newsreader OE is not a good newreader BTW
>>>>
>>>> "Good" is a matter of opinion. OE sends and receives email, it has
>>>> a broad group of filters, it doesn't force me to open anything I
>>>> don't want to read, it reads from and posts to newsgroups, it
>>>> combines and decodes.....just what would make it "good"? YENC???
>>>> From my experience, anyone who says OE is trash simply doesn't know
>>>> how to use it.
>>>>
>>>> gdp
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> OE is fine for email but as a newsreader it is stuck in the darkages
>>> There several fine newreader that would make posting and reading far
>>> simpler If you want to stay in the dark ages that is fine but don't
>>> attack those who post in an easily readable format. If you use a more
>>> up to date reader you can see what is posted by those who choose to
>>> use yenc. As for me when I post I don'y use yenc but I have no
>>> problem with those who do.
>>> "It is better to light one single candle than to curse the darkness"
>>
>>
>> I had no intent of attacking anyone, if I did, I apologize. Please
>> tell me the virtues of other newsreaders that make them easier to use
>> than OE.
>>
>>
>>
>
> Xnews can read all headers at once OE can't
> It can decode and rejoin multiaprt posts without other steps
> It can download an entire stream of posts where as You have to manually
> read each and every one with OE
> I could go on and on but Xnews and other similar to are just more
> efficient and easier that OE
> What would it harm for you to try one or more to see if they work
> better
>
> Of course if you are not willing to try you'll never know.

Um...thanks for the prompt reply but you haven't told me anything that OE
can't do. It can do all the things you say it can't. Perhaps you are one of
those who don't know how to use it.

And, I'll bet you a years wages that you don't know what other newsreaders I
have tried.

gdp

[Clairbear]

"Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
:

>
> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>>
>>> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>>>> :
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
>>>>> ...
>>>>>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>>>>>> :
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "russell" > wrote in message
>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>>> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install
>>>>>>>> unwanted programmes) when all you need to do is resize your
>>>>>>>> pictures before you post them. The best pictures on this NG
>>>>>>>> come from Glenn (IMO) and we don't have to install any upgraded
>>>>>>>> software to view his images, so what is so special about yours?
>>>>>>>> If you can't take his lead, maybe you are the loser and we have
>>>>>>>> missed nothing....
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Clem" > wrote in message
>>>>>>>> . 97.136...
>>>>>>>>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in
>>>>>>>>> particular.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Regarding YENC:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST
>>>>>>>>> upgrade.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This group has decided to be YENC-free and has reaffirmed the
>>>>>>> decision many times. If it goes YENC, I'm leaving.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> gdp
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> don't get you panties in a twist there Don
>>>>>> It really should not matter yenc or not if you have a good
>>>>>> newsreader OE is not a good newreader BTW
>>>>>
>>>>> "Good" is a matter of opinion. OE sends and receives email, it
>>>>> has a broad group of filters, it doesn't force me to open anything
>>>>> I don't want to read, it reads from and posts to newsgroups, it
>>>>> combines and decodes.....just what would make it "good"? YENC???
>>>>> From my experience, anyone who says OE is trash simply doesn't
>>>>> know how to use it.
>>>>>
>>>>> gdp
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> OE is fine for email but as a newsreader it is stuck in the
>>>> darkages There several fine newreader that would make posting and
>>>> reading far simpler If you want to stay in the dark ages that is
>>>> fine but don't attack those who post in an easily readable format.
>>>> If you use a more up to date reader you can see what is posted by
>>>> those who choose to use yenc. As for me when I post I don'y use
>>>> yenc but I have no problem with those who do.
>>>> "It is better to light one single candle than to curse the
>>>> darkness"
>>>
>>>
>>> I had no intent of attacking anyone, if I did, I apologize. Please
>>> tell me the virtues of other newsreaders that make them easier to
>>> use than OE.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Xnews can read all headers at once OE can't
>> It can decode and rejoin multiaprt posts without other steps
>> It can download an entire stream of posts where as You have to
>> manually read each and every one with OE
>> I could go on and on but Xnews and other similar to are just more
>> efficient and easier that OE
>> What would it harm for you to try one or more to see if they work
>> better
>>
>> Of course if you are not willing to try you'll never know.
>
> Um...thanks for the prompt reply but you haven't told me anything that
> OE can't do. It can do all the things you say it can't. Perhaps you
> are one of those who don't know how to use it.
>
> And, I'll bet you a years wages that you don't know what other
> newsreaders I have tried.
>
> gdp
>
>
>
>
>

I have used several newsreaders in the past in crulding OE and like so
many of Bill gates' product I found OE to be lacking all of the features
I just mentioned If you want to believe in Bill and microsloth that's
all fine and goo but I used OE when I was a newbie and found it wanting
and found xnews is soooo much better.
As for newsreader you may have tried I would bet the were some
primitive attempts building the better mousetrap

[Don Pyeatt]

"Clairbear" > wrote in message
...
> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
> :
>
>>
>> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>>> :
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>>>>> :
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "russell" > wrote in message
>>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>>>> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install
>>>>>>>>> unwanted programmes) when all you need to do is resize your
>>>>>>>>> pictures before you post them. The best pictures on this NG
>>>>>>>>> come from Glenn (IMO) and we don't have to install any upgraded
>>>>>>>>> software to view his images, so what is so special about yours?
>>>>>>>>> If you can't take his lead, maybe you are the loser and we have
>>>>>>>>> missed nothing....
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "Clem" > wrote in message
>>>>>>>>> . 97.136...
>>>>>>>>>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in
>>>>>>>>>> particular.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Regarding YENC:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST
>>>>>>>>>> upgrade.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This group has decided to be YENC-free and has reaffirmed the
>>>>>>>> decision many times. If it goes YENC, I'm leaving.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> gdp
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> don't get you panties in a twist there Don
>>>>>>> It really should not matter yenc or not if you have a good
>>>>>>> newsreader OE is not a good newreader BTW
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Good" is a matter of opinion. OE sends and receives email, it
>>>>>> has a broad group of filters, it doesn't force me to open anything
>>>>>> I don't want to read, it reads from and posts to newsgroups, it
>>>>>> combines and decodes.....just what would make it "good"? YENC???
>>>>>> From my experience, anyone who says OE is trash simply doesn't
>>>>>> know how to use it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> gdp
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> OE is fine for email but as a newsreader it is stuck in the
>>>>> darkages There several fine newreader that would make posting and
>>>>> reading far simpler If you want to stay in the dark ages that is
>>>>> fine but don't attack those who post in an easily readable format.
>>>>> If you use a more up to date reader you can see what is posted by
>>>>> those who choose to use yenc. As for me when I post I don'y use
>>>>> yenc but I have no problem with those who do.
>>>>> "It is better to light one single candle than to curse the
>>>>> darkness"
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I had no intent of attacking anyone, if I did, I apologize. Please
>>>> tell me the virtues of other newsreaders that make them easier to
>>>> use than OE.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Xnews can read all headers at once OE can't
>>> It can decode and rejoin multiaprt posts without other steps
>>> It can download an entire stream of posts where as You have to
>>> manually read each and every one with OE
>>> I could go on and on but Xnews and other similar to are just more
>>> efficient and easier that OE
>>> What would it harm for you to try one or more to see if they work
>>> better
>>>
>>> Of course if you are not willing to try you'll never know.
>>
>> Um...thanks for the prompt reply but you haven't told me anything that
>> OE can't do. It can do all the things you say it can't. Perhaps you
>> are one of those who don't know how to use it.
>>
>> And, I'll bet you a years wages that you don't know what other
>> newsreaders I have tried.
>>
>> gdp
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> I have used several newsreaders in the past in crulding OE and like so
> many of Bill gates' product I found OE to be lacking all of the features
> I just mentioned If you want to believe in Bill and microsloth that's
> all fine and goo but I used OE when I was a newbie and found it wanting
> and found xnews is soooo much better.
> As for newsreader you may have tried I would bet the were some
> primitive attempts building the better mousetrap


It's interesting that my copy of OE will do the things that your copy won't.

[Jim Breckenridge]

Clem wrote:
> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>
>
> Regarding YENC:
>
>
The reason I have no interest in Yenc is that is seems that
if I were to use it I would be overcome with an unstoppable
and highly irritating desire to berate anyone who did not
adopt my belief. I would have to tell everyone who had no
interest, just how good Yenc is and why they should get new
software. I would also have to thrust all this onto the
members of groups that have democratically agreed no to use
this marvelous Yenc.

I'll just continue going about my own business and going
with the majority and ignoring all those Yenc missionaries.

[redc1c4]

Clem wrote:
>
> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>
> Regarding YENC:

if yEnc users follow the convention and place "yEnc" in the header line,
there is no problem.

redc1c4,
pointing out the obvious, to the oblivious. %-)
--
"Enlisted men are stupid, but extremely cunning and sly, and bear
considerable watching."

Army Officer's Guide

[russell[_2_]]

>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> I have used several newsreaders in the past in crulding OE and like so
> many of Bill gates' product I found OE to be lacking all of the features
> I just mentioned If you want to believe in Bill and microsloth that's
> all fine and goo but I used OE when I was a newbie and found it wanting
> and found xnews is soooo much better.
> As for newsreader you may have tried I would bet the were some
> primitive attempts building the better mousetrap


So the truth will come out. It's not OE that's the problem, it's Bill
Gates...

[Frank[_2_]]

Clairbear > wrote in news:Xns9967D801DDA8Fclairbear@
130.81.64.196:

> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
> :
>
>>
>> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
>> ...

SNIP

>>
>>
>> I had no intent of attacking anyone, if I did, I apologize. Please
>> tell me the virtues of other newsreaders that make them easier to use
>> than OE.
>>
>>
>>
>
> Xnews can read all headers at once OE can't
> It can decode and rejoin multiaprt posts without other steps
> It can download an entire stream of posts where as You have to manually
> read each and every one with OE
> I could go on and on but Xnews and other similar to are just more
> efficient and easier that OE
> What would it harm for you to try one or more to see if they work
> better
>
> Of course if you are not willing to try you'll never know.

Like you, I use Xnews. The feature which sold me on it is that the fact
that a file is yENC is just not an issue any more. I don't have to
"convert" a received yENC file. I just download the file and Xnews shows me
the picture.

What I don't understand is why there seems to be an impression going around
that yENC files are humungous in comparison to other encoding used for
newsgroups. A file sent using the "normal" newsgroup encoding is generally
33 to 40% larger than the same file sent using yENC. For large, what about
the fellow a few days ago that posted some large BMP image files. If I
remember correctly, each image was a nine-part attachment. If he had used
yENC, they would only have been about six-part attachments. I personaly
think that a 30% saving in download time, bandwidth usage or whatever is
worthy of real consideration. I know that someone will then say they can't
get a yENC newsreader for their five-year-old computer. Five years in
computer history is like 50 years in the automotive industry. While it is
probably fairly easy to get upgrades for a 50-year-old Ford, it may not be
the same for Studebaker or some other model produced in relatively lower
volumes.

[Frank[_2_]]

shiver > wrote in news:080720071223131051%
:

>> Frank > wrote:
>
>
>> Just use your web
>> browser to search for "yenc newsreader" and you will be rewarded with a
>> long list of free offerings.
>
> I'll tell you what Frank.
>
> Upgrading my older Mac OS and software is NOT AN OPTION.
>
> So if YOU can find a way for me to view YENC images that won't cost me
> any money which I do not have I will be eternally grateful.
>
> However it MUST WORK WITH OS 8.6 and my newsreader YA Newswatcher 5.0.1
>
> And I mean it must work with that system...... PERIOD.
>
> I can tell you that after trying for years and listening to advice from
> people just like you that noboday and I mean nobody has been able to
> come up with a solution for me.
>
> So I go back to my simple attitude..... If your not willing to post
> images to this group or any others in a manner that all can see then
> obviously you do not wish me to see your pictures and in that case
> it is very simple... I CAN'T MISS WHAT I CAN'T SEE.


Fair enough, but what you are saying sounds very much like: "My telephone
uses magneto crank handles for signalling, so you can't reach me by
dialling, even if you know my number." I'm not sure who is missing the
more.

[Clairbear]

Frank > wrote in
:

> Clairbear > wrote in news:Xns9967D801DDA8Fclairbear@
> 130.81.64.196:
>
>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>>
>>> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>
> SNIP
>
>>>
>>>
>>> I had no intent of attacking anyone, if I did, I apologize. Please
>>> tell me the virtues of other newsreaders that make them easier to
>>> use than OE.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Xnews can read all headers at once OE can't
>> It can decode and rejoin multiaprt posts without other steps
>> It can download an entire stream of posts where as You have to
>> manually read each and every one with OE
>> I could go on and on but Xnews and other similar to are just more
>> efficient and easier that OE
>> What would it harm for you to try one or more to see if they work
>> better
>>
>> Of course if you are not willing to try you'll never know.
>
> Like you, I use Xnews. The feature which sold me on it is that the
> fact that a file is yENC is just not an issue any more. I don't have
> to "convert" a received yENC file. I just download the file and Xnews
> shows me the picture.
>
> What I don't understand is why there seems to be an impression going
> around that yENC files are humungous in comparison to other encoding
> used for newsgroups. A file sent using the "normal" newsgroup
> encoding is generally 33 to 40% larger than the same file sent using
> yENC. For large, what about the fellow a few days ago that posted some
> large BMP image files. If I remember correctly, each image was a
> nine-part attachment. If he had used yENC, they would only have been
> about six-part attachments. I personaly think that a 30% saving in
> download time, bandwidth usage or whatever is worthy of real
> consideration. I know that someone will then say they can't get a yENC
> newsreader for their five-year-old computer. Five years in computer
> history is like 50 years in the automotive industry. While it is
> probably fairly easy to get upgrades for a 50-year-old Ford, it may
> not be the same for Studebaker or some other model produced in
> relatively lower volumes.
>
>

Well said Much better than I was able to put it

[Tom Inglima]

Goodby - Good Ridance!


"Clem" > wrote in message
. 97.136...
> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>
>
> Regarding YENC:
>
> The only interpretation provided to newbies, is to use a simple reader
> like OE. Unless you know the history of yenc software, newbies can't
> figure out why an answer like that is provided and the tempers erupt.
>
> You can plonk people to death, but what's the point? If we were at an air
> show and I mentioned that I use yenc, would you stop talking to me or I
> you? Probably not, that would be rude, so why persist with that type
> behavior on this newsgroup?
>
> This group has an aversion to yenc for only one noticeable reason, the
> rules here. Yenc has come a long way since its inception. If you take
> time to learn it, you might change your mind about it.
>
> It's assumed plonking posters who use yenc will be shamed into leaving or
> at least stop any future yenc posts.
>
> I was asked not to post here a long time ago because of the "rules".
>
> That's ok, I won't post anything on this group and subsequently the group
> has been denied what I have to share. I don't see the logic in it, but
> that's the way this group runs itself. This group only denies themselves
> because of an outdated rule.
>
> Every group I use that allows binary posting doesn't seem to have a
> problem with yenc. Actually they could care less and personally I have
> not had any trouble viewing others yenc postings. What this group needs
> is a rule to update its rules which brings me to this point:
>
> I don't understand why an unmoderated group insists on enforcing rules
> over a public platform like the Internet. Unless someone is breaking laws
> like posting child porn, the ability to enforce a rule like this is non-
> existent. It actually invites trouble.
>
> When a new user comes along, where do they go for the list of rules? The
> list of do's and do not's appear nowhere when I visit here.
>
> I say it's time to vote again. I say an open vote on a public system like
> yahoo should resolve this issue once and for all.
>
> For some reason I have a problem looking at GIF and BMP files only in a
> newsgroup. Should that reason alone be reason enough that I ask everyone
> not to use those formats?
>
> Eventually I'll find out what the problem is with my readers.
>
> The point here is that what problem "I" have should not be yours which is
> what oldtimers here don't understand. If all you see is gibberish, it
> isn't decoding. If the software isn't decoding it either has a problem or
> doesn't recognize the format.
>
> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>

[Jules]

Clem wrote:


> The only interpretation provided to newbies, is to use a simple reader
> like OE.

I wonder if the push to yenc is an attempt to take down microsoft a bit?
Just wondering.





> You can plonk people to death, but what's the point? If we were at an air
> show and I mentioned that I use yenc, would you stop talking to me or I
> you?

Yes. The subject has been talked to death. Yet yenc pumpers don't seem
to get it.



Probably not, that would be rude, so why persist with that type
> behavior on this newsgroup?

Huh? Yenc pumpers are persisting.
I just haven't changed my mind.

[hielan' laddie]

On Sun, 8 Jul 2007 10:42:10 -0400, Woody wrote
(in article >):

> My solution to YENC posters is just to stick them in the killfile.

And this affects me... how?

> Stop
> trying to dictate what everyone else should use.

Not doing that. On the other hand, some people are trying to say how others
must post.

> My solution is if you
> insist on YENC I don't want to see your pictures.

Sounds like a plan.

>
>
> "Frank" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "russell" > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>> Clem, upgrade to what? Why should I upgrade (or install unwanted
>>> programmes) when all you need to do is resize your pictures before you
>>> post them. The best pictures on this NG come from Glenn (IMO) and we
>>> don't have to install any upgraded software to view his images, so
>>> what is so special about yours? If you can't take his lead, maybe you
>>> are the loser and we have missed nothing....
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "Clem" > wrote in message
>>> . 97.136...
>>>> This is just an open thought not directed at anyone in particular.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Regarding YENC:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> There does come a point when to stay current, you MUST upgrade.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Clem:
>>
>> I agree with you wholeheartedly. "Upgrade to what?" Just use your web
>> browser to search for "yenc newsreader" and you will be rewarded with a
>> long list of free offerings. Why downsize your images when YENC is so
>> easy.
>>
>> Frank
>
>

[Glenn[_2_]]

"hielan' laddie" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 8 Jul 2007 10:42:10 -0400, Woody wrote
> (in article >):
>
>> My solution to YENC posters is just to stick them in the killfile.
>
> And this affects me... how?
>
>> Stop
>> trying to dictate what everyone else should use.
>
> Not doing that. On the other hand, some people are trying to say how
> others
> must post.

no, what they are saying is if you want them to view them, don't post in
Yenc.
Are you sure that your not ****y with them because you are not reaching your
target audience ?

[Glenn[_2_]]

"Jules" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Clem wrote:
>
>
>> The only interpretation provided to newbies, is to use a simple reader
>> like OE.
>
> I wonder if the push to yenc is an attempt to take down microsoft a bit?
> Just wondering.
>
>
>
>
>
>> You can plonk people to death, but what's the point? If we were at an air
>> show and I mentioned that I use yenc, would you stop talking to me or I
>> you?
>
> Yes. The subject has been talked to death. Yet yenc pumpers don't seem to
> get it.
>
>
>
> Probably not, that would be rude, so why persist with that type
>> behavior on this newsgroup?
>
> Huh? Yenc pumpers are persisting.
> I just haven't changed my mind.
>
I'm not allowed to change my mind till my wife tells me.

[hielan' laddie]

On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 07:08:19 -0400, Glenn wrote
(in article >):

>
> "hielan' laddie" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Sun, 8 Jul 2007 10:42:10 -0400, Woody wrote
>> (in article >):
>>
>>> My solution to YENC posters is just to stick them in the killfile.
>>
>> And this affects me... how?
>>
>>> Stop
>>> trying to dictate what everyone else should use.
>>
>> Not doing that. On the other hand, some people are trying to say how
>> others
>> must post.
>
> no, what they are saying is if you want them to view them, don't post in
> Yenc.
> Are you sure that your not ****y with them because you are not reaching your
> target audience ?
>

I'm trying to say that I don't give a damn either way. Sometimes I post using
YENC, sometimes I don't, depending on what it is I'm posting, which machine
I'm posting from, what account I'm using, and what software I'm using. In
some cases it's easier for me to use YENC. In some cases it's easier for me
to use other encoding systems. I use what's convenient. I have _never_ seen
what the problem some people have with YENC. This means that I use YENC
encoding sometimes, but not all the time... because the use/non-use of YENC
is not a religious matter with me. And my software, where possible, is set to
announce what kind of encoding was used for any binaries which might be being
posted, so that those who can't/won't use one type of encoding can know
beforehand what's what. You can download the file or not. You can killfile
the account or not. I don't give a damn.

There are those who say that I _must not use YENC under any circumstances_ or
they will 'punish' me by killfiling me. My response is simple: I'll keep on
doing what's convenient to me. You do what you gotta do. Everybody's happy.

There are free or low-cost (and by low-cost I mean under US$25) methods of
reading YENC for:

Win98
W2K
WinXP
Mac OS 8.x
Mac OS 9.x
Mac OS X, 10.1.x and later

I don't use Linux to read USENET, so I've got no idea about Linux solutions.
I'd find it extremely strange if there were no similar solutions for at least
the most commonly used Linux distros, though.

If someone objects to YENC so much that, rather than get one of the free or
low-cost methods of viewing YENC-encoded files, they'd rather killfile those
who post in YENC, then more power to them. It appears to be a religious
matter rather than anything rational. At least one poster who uses a Mac
objects to YENC on grounds of cost; yENC TZ is free, and Decoder is US$20,
and both work from at least OS 8.x on up. He uses YA-Newswatcher, Brian
Clarke's old abandonware version of John Norstad's Newswatcher.
MT-Newswatcher, Simon Fraser's still-supported (and still free!) version of
Newswatcher, is (IMHO) superior to YA-NW, and knows about YENC. Now, if that
gentleman prefers to not use MT-NW, or if he doesn't want to download and use
yENC TZ or Decoder or some other helper app, fine. It's absolutely no skin
off _my_ nose either way. As I said in my original post, if you have a policy
of automatically killfiling those who use YENC, by all means keep on using
it. I would not stop you even if I could, which I can't. Conversely, your
killfiling me will not stop me posting using YENC encoding if I so desire.

And, oh, this is neither the machine nor the account that I usually use to
post binaries. Killfiling _this_ account would be particularly pointless. I
expect that some of the more foaming-at-the-mouth fanatics have already done
so. I don't give a damn.

[gpaleo]

"hielan' laddie" > wrote
...
>
...........................................
>
> I'm trying to say that I don't give a damn either way.
...............................................




Seeng that you are such a "don't give a damn" guy (as you say 4-5-6 times in
your post), I wonder why you bother to post pix anyway, or reply to negative
posts about your methods..........
Oh well, yaaaaawwwwwwnnnnnn................................

[hielan' laddie]

On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 11:58:05 -0400, gpaleo wrote
(in article <1184255885.318252@athprx03>):

>
> "hielan' laddie" > wrote
> ...
>>
> ..........................................
>>
>> I'm trying to say that I don't give a damn either way.
> ..............................................
>
>
>
>
> Seeng that you are such a "don't give a damn" guy (as you say 4-5-6 times in
> your post), I wonder why you bother to post pix anyway, or reply to negative
> posts about your methods..........
> Oh well, yaaaaawwwwwwnnnnnn................................
>

'Cause I'm bored, there's nothing happening right now, and I have time to
waste.

[Glenn[_2_]]

"hielan' laddie" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 11:58:05 -0400, gpaleo wrote
> (in article <1184255885.318252@athprx03>):
>
>>
>> "hielan' laddie" > wrote
>> ...
>>>
>> ..........................................
>>>
>>> I'm trying to say that I don't give a damn either way.
>> ..............................................
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Seeng that you are such a "don't give a damn" guy (as you say 4-5-6 times
>> in
>> your post), I wonder why you bother to post pix anyway, or reply to
>> negative
>> posts about your methods..........
>> Oh well, yaaaaawwwwwwnnnnnn................................
>>
>
> 'Cause I'm bored, there's nothing happening right now, and I have time to
> waste.

That you do. Thus indicating you are just being problematic and have no
real concern for other peoples wishes.

[hielan' laddie]

On Fri, 13 Jul 2007 06:44:43 -0400, Glenn wrote
(in article >):

>
> "hielan' laddie" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 11:58:05 -0400, gpaleo wrote
>> (in article <1184255885.318252@athprx03>):
>>
>>>
>>> "hielan' laddie" > wrote
>>> ...
>>>>
>>> ..........................................
>>>>
>>>> I'm trying to say that I don't give a damn either way.
>>> ..............................................
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Seeng that you are such a "don't give a damn" guy (as you say 4-5-6 times
>>> in
>>> your post), I wonder why you bother to post pix anyway, or reply to
>>> negative
>>> posts about your methods..........
>>> Oh well, yaaaaawwwwwwnnnnnn................................
>>>
>>
>> 'Cause I'm bored, there's nothing happening right now, and I have time to
>> waste.
>
> That you do. Thus indicating you are just being problematic and have no
> real concern for other peoples wishes.
>
>

Nah. If you don't like YENC, don't bloody download any YENC-encoded files.
Simple as that. I wouldn't force you to do so, even if I could.

And, quite simply, _you_ cannot force _me_ to upload files using any encoding
that I don't find convenient. Sometimes it's convenient for me to use YENC.
Sometimes it's not. You can download any or all files I post, whatever the
encoding, or not download any or all files I post. It does not affect me
either way. I will continue to do what I find convenient. If you don't like
it, you can, of course, apply your killfile. Go ahead. Or don't. It makes no
difference to me whatsoever.

[Glenn[_2_]]

"hielan' laddie" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 13 Jul 2007 06:44:43 -0400, Glenn wrote
> (in article >):
>
>>
>> "hielan' laddie" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 11:58:05 -0400, gpaleo wrote
>>> (in article <1184255885.318252@athprx03>):
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "hielan' laddie" > wrote
>>>> ...
>>>>>
>>>> ..........................................
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm trying to say that I don't give a damn either way.
>>>> ..............................................
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Seeng that you are such a "don't give a damn" guy (as you say 4-5-6
>>>> times
>>>> in
>>>> your post), I wonder why you bother to post pix anyway, or reply to
>>>> negative
>>>> posts about your methods..........
>>>> Oh well, yaaaaawwwwwwnnnnnn................................
>>>>
>>>
>>> 'Cause I'm bored, there's nothing happening right now, and I have time
>>> to
>>> waste.
>>
>> That you do. Thus indicating you are just being problematic and have no
>> real concern for other peoples wishes.
>>
>>
>
> Nah. If you don't like YENC, don't bloody download any YENC-encoded files.
> Simple as that. I wouldn't force you to do so, even if I could.
>
> And, quite simply, _you_ cannot force _me_ to upload files using any
> encoding
> that I don't find convenient. Sometimes it's convenient for me to use
> YENC.
> Sometimes it's not. You can download any or all files I post, whatever the
> encoding, or not download any or all files I post. It does not affect me
> either way. I will continue to do what I find convenient. If you don't
> like
> it, you can, of course, apply your killfile. Go ahead. Or don't. It makes
> no
> difference to me whatsoever.


Ahh but it does. Cause you persist with this futile argument.
You want people to view your images. That's simple.
You want to make people to jump through hoops to view them. Not so simple.
Your loss really.
Just trying to help you. but if you just want to continue to be
problematic, I'm sure you will.

[hielan' laddie]

On Sun, 15 Jul 2007 01:02:38 -0400, Glenn wrote
(in article >):

>
> "hielan' laddie" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Fri, 13 Jul 2007 06:44:43 -0400, Glenn wrote
>> (in article >):
>>
>>>
>>> "hielan' laddie" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 11:58:05 -0400, gpaleo wrote
>>>> (in article <1184255885.318252@athprx03>):
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "hielan' laddie" > wrote
>>>>> ...
>>>>>>
>>>>> ..........................................
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm trying to say that I don't give a damn either way.
>>>>> ..............................................
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Seeng that you are such a "don't give a damn" guy (as you say 4-5-6
>>>>> times
>>>>> in
>>>>> your post), I wonder why you bother to post pix anyway, or reply to
>>>>> negative
>>>>> posts about your methods..........
>>>>> Oh well, yaaaaawwwwwwnnnnnn................................
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 'Cause I'm bored, there's nothing happening right now, and I have time
>>>> to
>>>> waste.
>>>
>>> That you do. Thus indicating you are just being problematic and have no
>>> real concern for other peoples wishes.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Nah. If you don't like YENC, don't bloody download any YENC-encoded files.
>> Simple as that. I wouldn't force you to do so, even if I could.
>>
>> And, quite simply, _you_ cannot force _me_ to upload files using any
>> encoding
>> that I don't find convenient. Sometimes it's convenient for me to use
>> YENC.
>> Sometimes it's not. You can download any or all files I post, whatever the
>> encoding, or not download any or all files I post. It does not affect me
>> either way. I will continue to do what I find convenient. If you don't
>> like
>> it, you can, of course, apply your killfile. Go ahead. Or don't. It makes
>> no
>> difference to me whatsoever.
>
>
> Ahh but it does.

Nope.

> Cause you persist with this futile argument.

Who's arguing?

> You want people to view your images.

Some will, some won't.

> That's simple.
> You want to make people to jump through hoops to view them.

No. I just won't jump through hoops so that those who have a religious
problem with an _encoding system_ can see them.

> Not so simple.
> Your loss really.

How is it my loss?

> Just trying to help you. but if you just want to continue to be
> problematic, I'm sure you will.
>
I'll keep on doing as I have been doing. It works for me. It's worked for me
for _years_. I see no reason to change.

[Casey Tompkins]

On Sun, 08 Jul 2007 17:21:13 GMT, Dave > wrote:

>Clairbear wrote:

>> Gee 1227K for xnews I might have to remove it
>> and it reads yenc, speeds up access,rejoins multi part posts, and allows me
>> to access all header on ng
>> You might be right I guess I'll just have to go back to the inconvenience
>> of using OE to access the usenet.


>I think that things should be as simple as possible.
>There are quite a few people who don't know how to setup new programs,
>like my 85 year old father, but he likes this newsgroup.
>He worked for Curtis back in the 30's and 40's in their experimental
>aircraft group in Buffalo.
>
>I vote for keeping it as simple and direct as possible so everybody can
>enjoy these great photos of beautiful and unique aircraft.
>Just my two cents.

Um, Dave, just how hard is it for *anyone* to double-click on an
install program? Doesn't get much simpler than that.

Virtually every person I've ever seen complain about yEnc is an
Outlook Express user. That is, they use one of the worst pieces of
junk ever released by MicroSoft that contains an absurd number of
security holes. It is, I might add, just an email program with
newsgroup reading tacked on.

You might as well use a truck to pull a plow. It would work, but it
wouldn't be very effective.

This argument falls into the same category of people who complain that
they don't want to deal with those bloody VHS players, since there's
nothing wrong with their Betamax.

If you really want simple and direct, we could go back to text-only
usenet, accessed via command-line programs, transmitting cute
ASCII-art pics of airplanes. Better yet, go real old-school, and use
the US Post Office. Just photocopy those shots and physically mail
them to folks. It can't get much simpler than that, and -hey-
absolutely no software is involved!

Let's be honest: this argument has virtually always been driven by
Outlook Express users who refuse to part from their bedraggled
teddy-bear of a program. Why not 'fess up about it?

On the other hand, it depends on how the poster uploads their images.
If they do so by hand (which is possible via newsreader) the uploader
can configure the program not to use yEnc. I use Agent 1.91 (hate the
3.x, they trashed the interface) and I've disabled yEnc manually for
my uploads. If anyone wants direction on how to do that for Agent,
email me or ask here.

But if I have a large number of images, I need something like Power
Post v11b, and I can't disable the yEnc encoding. It's hard-wired into
the code. I personally would have no trouble in turning off yEnc, if
that option existed. Maybe if we all wrote the author - assert at
powerpost dot cjb dot net- he would release a new version? :)

[Don Pyeatt]

"Casey Tompkins" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 08 Jul 2007 17:21:13 GMT, Dave > wrote:
>
>>Clairbear wrote:
>
>>> Gee 1227K for xnews I might have to remove it
>>> and it reads yenc, speeds up access,rejoins multi part posts, and allows
>>> me
>>> to access all header on ng
>>> You might be right I guess I'll just have to go back to the
>>> inconvenience
>>> of using OE to access the usenet.
>
>
>>I think that things should be as simple as possible.
>>There are quite a few people who don't know how to setup new programs,
>>like my 85 year old father, but he likes this newsgroup.
>>He worked for Curtis back in the 30's and 40's in their experimental
>>aircraft group in Buffalo.
>>
>>I vote for keeping it as simple and direct as possible so everybody can
>>enjoy these great photos of beautiful and unique aircraft.
>>Just my two cents.
>
> Um, Dave, just how hard is it for *anyone* to double-click on an
> install program? Doesn't get much simpler than that.
>
> Virtually every person I've ever seen complain about yEnc is an
> Outlook Express user. That is, they use one of the worst pieces of
> junk ever released by MicroSoft that contains an absurd number of
> security holes. It is, I might add, just an email program with
> newsgroup reading tacked on.
>
> You might as well use a truck to pull a plow. It would work, but it
> wouldn't be very effective.
>
> This argument falls into the same category of people who complain that
> they don't want to deal with those bloody VHS players, since there's
> nothing wrong with their Betamax.
>
> If you really want simple and direct, we could go back to text-only
> usenet, accessed via command-line programs, transmitting cute
> ASCII-art pics of airplanes. Better yet, go real old-school, and use
> the US Post Office. Just photocopy those shots and physically mail
> them to folks. It can't get much simpler than that, and -hey-
> absolutely no software is involved!
>
> Let's be honest: this argument has virtually always been driven by
> Outlook Express users who refuse to part from their bedraggled
> teddy-bear of a program. Why not 'fess up about it?
>
> On the other hand, it depends on how the poster uploads their images.
> If they do so by hand (which is possible via newsreader) the uploader
> can configure the program not to use yEnc. I use Agent 1.91 (hate the
> 3.x, they trashed the interface) and I've disabled yEnc manually for
> my uploads. If anyone wants direction on how to do that for Agent,
> email me or ask here.
>
> But if I have a large number of images, I need something like Power
> Post v11b, and I can't disable the yEnc encoding. It's hard-wired into
> the code. I personally would have no trouble in turning off yEnc, if
> that option existed. Maybe if we all wrote the author - assert at
> powerpost dot cjb dot net- he would release a new version? :)
>
>

Hi, Casey !

I have been avoiding this yEnc/OE thread but after reading your post I
thought you may perhaps be the one to answer my as-yet unanswered question:
What will your agent do that OE will not, except of course decode yEnc
without an add-on patch?

I have formed the opinion after reading these hate-OE threads over the years
that those who hate OE simply don't know how to use it.

What say you?

gdp

[Maple1]

Agreed though I do not use OE I use Thunderbird and still YENC is a
source of trouble

Dont like being placed into a group just because I hate YENC
>
>
> Hi, Casey !
>
> I have been avoiding this yEnc/OE thread but after reading your post I
> thought you may perhaps be the one to answer my as-yet unanswered question:
> What will your agent do that OE will not, except of course decode yEnc
> without an add-on patch?
>
> I have formed the opinion after reading these hate-OE threads over the years
> that those who hate OE simply don't know how to use it.
>
> What say you?
>
> gdp
>
>
>
>
>

[JRW]

Casey Tompkins wrote:
> On Sun, 08 Jul 2007 17:21:13 GMT, Dave > wrote:
>
>> Clairbear wrote:
>
>>> Gee 1227K for xnews I might have to remove it
>>> and it reads yenc, speeds up access,rejoins multi part posts, and allows me
>>> to access all header on ng
>>> You might be right I guess I'll just have to go back to the inconvenience
>>> of using OE to access the usenet.
>
>
>> I think that things should be as simple as possible.
>> There are quite a few people who don't know how to setup new programs,
>> like my 85 year old father, but he likes this newsgroup.
>> He worked for Curtis back in the 30's and 40's in their experimental
>> aircraft group in Buffalo.
>>
>> I vote for keeping it as simple and direct as possible so everybody can
>> enjoy these great photos of beautiful and unique aircraft.
>> Just my two cents.
>
> Um, Dave, just how hard is it for *anyone* to double-click on an
> install program? Doesn't get much simpler than that.
>
> Virtually every person I've ever seen complain about yEnc is an
> Outlook Express user. That is, they use one of the worst pieces of
> junk ever released by MicroSoft that contains an absurd number of
> security holes. It is, I might add, just an email program with
> newsgroup reading tacked on.
>
> You might as well use a truck to pull a plow. It would work, but it
> wouldn't be very effective.
>
> This argument falls into the same category of people who complain that
> they don't want to deal with those bloody VHS players, since there's
> nothing wrong with their Betamax.
>
> If you really want simple and direct, we could go back to text-only
> usenet, accessed via command-line programs, transmitting cute
> ASCII-art pics of airplanes. Better yet, go real old-school, and use
> the US Post Office. Just photocopy those shots and physically mail
> them to folks. It can't get much simpler than that, and -hey-
> absolutely no software is involved!
>
> Let's be honest: this argument has virtually always been driven by
> Outlook Express users who refuse to part from their bedraggled
> teddy-bear of a program. Why not 'fess up about it?
>
> On the other hand, it depends on how the poster uploads their images.
> If they do so by hand (which is possible via newsreader) the uploader
> can configure the program not to use yEnc. I use Agent 1.91 (hate the
> 3.x, they trashed the interface) and I've disabled yEnc manually for
> my uploads. If anyone wants direction on how to do that for Agent,
> email me or ask here.
>
> But if I have a large number of images, I need something like Power
> Post v11b, and I can't disable the yEnc encoding. It's hard-wired into
> the code. I personally would have no trouble in turning off yEnc, if
> that option existed. Maybe if we all wrote the author - assert at
> powerpost dot cjb dot net- he would release a new version? :)
>
>
I agree and a FREE newsreader is easy to install. I use XNews and it
does it all.
This back and forth over YEnc is stupid. If you can't decode it, pass on
it. Simple.
JRW

[JRW]

Maple1 wrote:
> Agreed though I do not use OE I use Thunderbird and still YENC is a
> source of trouble
>
> Dont like being placed into a group just because I hate YENC
>>
>>
>> Hi, Casey !
>>
>> I have been avoiding this yEnc/OE thread but after reading your post I
>> thought you may perhaps be the one to answer my as-yet unanswered
>> question: What will your agent do that OE will not, except of course
>> decode yEnc without an add-on patch?
>>
>> I have formed the opinion after reading these hate-OE threads over the
>> years that those who hate OE simply don't know how to use it.
>>
>> What say you?
>>
>> gdp
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
I use T-Bird also. Great program. I think in the future it will have a
add-on to decode YEnc, if not now. I just haven't looked at the add-ons
lately.
I was once anti YEnc until someone told me about XNews. Free and easy to
use. Seconds to open.
Let's face it, we don't open everything unless it perks our interest.
Let's stop this silly thread and press on.

JMHO,
JRW

[Don Pyeatt]

"JRW" > wrote in message
...
> Casey Tompkins wrote:
>> On Sun, 08 Jul 2007 17:21:13 GMT, Dave > wrote:
>>
>>> Clairbear wrote:
>>
>>>> Gee 1227K for xnews I might have to remove it
>>>> and it reads yenc, speeds up access,rejoins multi part posts, and
>>>> allows me
>>>> to access all header on ng
>>>> You might be right I guess I'll just have to go back to the
>>>> inconvenience
>>>> of using OE to access the usenet.
>>
>>
>>> I think that things should be as simple as possible.
>>> There are quite a few people who don't know how to setup new programs,
>>> like my 85 year old father, but he likes this newsgroup.
>>> He worked for Curtis back in the 30's and 40's in their experimental
>>> aircraft group in Buffalo.
>>>
>>> I vote for keeping it as simple and direct as possible so everybody can
>>> enjoy these great photos of beautiful and unique aircraft.
>>> Just my two cents.
>>
>> Um, Dave, just how hard is it for *anyone* to double-click on an
>> install program? Doesn't get much simpler than that.
>>
>> Virtually every person I've ever seen complain about yEnc is an
>> Outlook Express user. That is, they use one of the worst pieces of
>> junk ever released by MicroSoft that contains an absurd number of
>> security holes. It is, I might add, just an email program with
>> newsgroup reading tacked on.
>>
>> You might as well use a truck to pull a plow. It would work, but it
>> wouldn't be very effective.
>>
>> This argument falls into the same category of people who complain that
>> they don't want to deal with those bloody VHS players, since there's
>> nothing wrong with their Betamax.
>>
>> If you really want simple and direct, we could go back to text-only
>> usenet, accessed via command-line programs, transmitting cute
>> ASCII-art pics of airplanes. Better yet, go real old-school, and use
>> the US Post Office. Just photocopy those shots and physically mail
>> them to folks. It can't get much simpler than that, and -hey-
>> absolutely no software is involved!
>>
>> Let's be honest: this argument has virtually always been driven by
>> Outlook Express users who refuse to part from their bedraggled
>> teddy-bear of a program. Why not 'fess up about it?
>>
>> On the other hand, it depends on how the poster uploads their images.
>> If they do so by hand (which is possible via newsreader) the uploader
>> can configure the program not to use yEnc. I use Agent 1.91 (hate the
>> 3.x, they trashed the interface) and I've disabled yEnc manually for
>> my uploads. If anyone wants direction on how to do that for Agent,
>> email me or ask here.
>>
>> But if I have a large number of images, I need something like Power
>> Post v11b, and I can't disable the yEnc encoding. It's hard-wired into
>> the code. I personally would have no trouble in turning off yEnc, if
>> that option existed. Maybe if we all wrote the author - assert at
>> powerpost dot cjb dot net- he would release a new version? :)
>>
>>
> I agree and a FREE newsreader is easy to install. I use XNews and it
> does it all.
> This back and forth over YEnc is stupid. If you can't decode it, pass on
> it. Simple.
> JRW

Not so fast....this is not a yEnc thread. I just want someone to answer my
question about news and email clients.

Why is OE inferior to other clients?

It is beginning to appear that no one can answer it.

gdp

[Dave Kearton]

Don Pyeatt wrote:
>> Not so fast....this is not a yEnc thread. I just want someone to
>> answer my question about news and email clients.
>>
>> Why is OE inferior to other clients?
>>
>> It is beginning to appear that no one can answer it.
>>
>> gdp



Poking my head above the trench for the first time on this, I _prefer_ OE.


I've been using it for years, (since '91 or '92) I've also tried other
clients such as Free Agent, Thunderbird and XNews.


Quite frankly, none of them made my day sufficiently easier, to make it
worth the trouble of learning a new program.


Thunderbird was pretty - but the message folder was over twice the size of
OE's, I have about a Gb of stored messages with OE and about 2.4Gb with
Thunderbird.


Some of these other newsreaders have all the features of OE, but do their
'thing' slightly differently. One of them (I can't remember which)
was difficult or impossible to tag and download messages selectively (I'd
have to download every message on the group, first).



Quite frankly, I still download and install the very occasional new version
of the above list, but nothing I've seen convinces ME that it's worth the
switch.



If the others were as good as some people seem to attest, then the whole
planet would have taken on these wonderful, free packages - but that hasn't
happened.


Why is that ? Some of us are boring old farts, that are resistant
to change - a lot of us have seen this all before, this isn't our first
time around the block.



yEnc ? Use it if you want, I personally don't give a crap.
My OE filters out most of it, so it doesn't worry me.


Some of the yEnc files that do slip past the filter (because they're not
labelled in the header) seem to be overly large pictures anyway, HUGE damn
files that should have been resized properly, no matter what encoding method
was used. The only justification offered was that "they would be
even larger in Mime or UUencode"


There are still people on dial-up - their opinion matters. As
technology moves on, more of these people are going over to broadband,
making the one advantage that the yEnc enclave hold very dear, increasingly
redundant. Bandwidth gets faster and cheaper every year - it's been
doing that since my first 1200bps modem and I don't see that trend changing.


My personal opinion, for those who are still reading this far ..... is
that yEnc is a solution in search of a problem and not enough of one for me
to migrate all of my mail and news activity over to a new platform - it's
not always as easy or as important as some people think.



But of course YMMV.


--

Cheers

Dave Kearton

[jett23]

My old machine expiried, and I was eager to to try Vista.
Vista comes with an email/newsreader program - Windows
Mail. I am not a fan of Windows Mail as a newsreader.
Within 20 minutes, I was at the Microsoft Download center
trying to get OE, but OE is apparently not compatable with Vista.
I find the Windows Mail newsreader cumbersome, awkward,
and needlessly time consuming compared to OE.
I am not usually a Microsoft basher, but IMO, they missed
the mark with this program.
Vista has some very nice features, but I would return to
XP and OE in a millisecond.

Just my opinion and POV as a usenet user.

[Casey Tompkins]

On Tue, 24 Jul 2007 16:07:35 -0500, "Don Pyeatt" >
wrote:

>Hi, Casey !
>
>I have been avoiding this yEnc/OE thread but after reading your post I
>thought you may perhaps be the one to answer my as-yet unanswered question:
>What will your agent do that OE will not, except of course decode yEnc
>without an add-on patch?
>
>I have formed the opinion after reading these hate-OE threads over the years
>that those who hate OE simply don't know how to use it.
>
>What say you?

Without going into exhaustive detail, Don, that's like asking what MS
Word can do, that Wordpad can't? You have the cart and the horse
backwards. Both Wordpad and OE are targeted to very specific and
narrow uses. OE is an email program with limited newsreading ability.
Similarly, Wordpad may act as an elemental word processor.

I can speak with some authority on this, as my first PC used CP/M, not
MS-DOS, and I remember the dreaded EDLIN, the only text editor
available to early versions of MS-DOS. It was a line-editor. That is,
one could edit text one line at a time. You had to type commands along
the lines of "edit line 3" and then you could perform primitive
editing similar to command-line editing until WinXP.

Then along (finally) comes WordPad, which is a freebie included with
the latest Windows. Considered as a basic word processor (compared to
the 80s stuff) it is excellent. WYSIWYG, different fonts on-screen,
in-place editing on-screen, italics, boldface, etc, etc. After Valdocs
that's exciting! :)

But... Compared to a real modern word processor -or even a powerful
text editor such as TextPad or EMACS, Wordpad is primitive.

To put it another way, OE to a modern newsreader as MS Paint is to
Adobe Photoshop.

I don't hate OE per se, as an email utility. I loathe it as an example
of how MicroSoft allowed it to become one of the world's worst
vulnerability magnet.

There are free programs which are head and shoulders above what MS
produces for email, newsgroups, and the web. I've mentioned Agent
already. The Mozilla Firefox brower and Mozilla Sunbird email client
are the best of the best. If you want to see what's going to be added
to the next edition of Internet Explorer, just check out what's
current (or old {g}) in Firefox and Sunbird. The Mozilla products are
more secure than equivalent MS products, more stable, more advanced,
and one helluva lot cheaper.

To get back to your original point, I know how to use OE; I just don't
see the point; any more than I see the point of using WordPad as a
word processor. (which reminds me: OpenOffice, anyone?) There are far
more powerful freeware applications out there. OE is comparatively
primitive, and a security nightmare. If I could rip it out by the
roots from WinXP, I would do so in a heartbeat.

I think my earlier analogy still holds: you can use a truck as a
tractor, but that doesn't make it a good idea. OE is not a newsgroup
reader.

I'll also repeat my earlier statment: much of the argument can be
avoided by posting via newgroup reader and not using yEnc. I have no
problem doing that, just to keep the peace. Alas, the best freeware
auto-poster is Power Post v11b, AKA Power Post v11b-yEnc. Are there
any yEnc-hating hackers out there who would be willing to (ahhh...)
"yEnc" that code out of the program to allow standard bulk posting?

Please excuse the pun. :)

[Casey Tompkins]

On Tue, 24 Jul 2007 23:54:44 GMT, Maple1 > wrote:

>Agreed though I do not use OE I use Thunderbird and still YENC is a
>source of trouble
>
>Dont like being placed into a group just because I hate YENC


Please excuse the repetition, but I want to be clear on this; the
Thunderbird reader doesn't understand yEnc while browsing newsgroups??

Color me shocked... I would have expected them to include that
functionality in a modern program.

[Clairbear]

"Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
:

>
> Hi, Casey !
>
> I have been avoiding this yEnc/OE thread but after reading your post I
> thought you may perhaps be the one to answer my as-yet unanswered
> question: What will your agent do that OE will not, except of course
> decode yEnc without an add-on patch?
>
> I have formed the opinion after reading these hate-OE threads over the
> years that those who hate OE simply don't know how to use it.
>
> What say you?
>
> gdp
>
>
>

Do I don't hate OE I just prefer to use a better program for reading NGs

[Clairbear]

"Don Pyeatt" > wrote in :

> Not so fast....this is not a yEnc thread. I just want someone to
> answer my question about news and email clients.
>
> Why is OE inferior to other clients?
>
> It is beginning to appear that no one can answer it.
>
> gdp
>
>

Don It has been answered but you, my friend, just prefer not to accept the
answers.

[Casey Tompkins]

On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 11:03:00 +0930, "Dave Kearton"
> wrote:

>Don Pyeatt wrote:
>If the others were as good as some people seem to attest, then the whole
>planet would have taken on these wonderful, free packages - but that hasn't
>happened.

Let us reformulate: If the health bonuses were as good as some people
seem to attest, then the whole planet would have stopped smoking by
now - but that hasn't happened.

Catch my drift?

I'm trying to get into a "which is better" argument per se, but OE is
not, never has been, and never will be a full-blown newsreader, any
more than WordPad is a true word processor. My orientation is more
towards appropriate/legitimate arguments, and how to solve the
problem.

If, however, your needs are served by that application, knock yourself
out. Just please don't try to tell me it's a newreader.

Also, the approach of "argument by simplicity" falls apart upon
examination, especially if one side gets to define simplicity as "what
I'm used to." Heck, I was used to DesqView interrupt-driven
multi-tasking under MS-DOS long before Win95 came along. Yet I was
finally dragged -kicking and screaming- into Windows-world.

You want simplicity? Fine, let's go back to TTY terminals and
analog-coupled 300bps modems. THAT'S simple! Or text-only usenet
readers/browsers like LYNX. THAT'S simple.

I think I've outlined the two major challenges for binaries groups:
individual posting, and bulk posting. I may be wrong (not having
exhaustively tested every newsreader on the market) but they should
have an option to disable yEnc encoding for uploads. I've already done
that with Agent. That's step one. The other challenge is finding a
bulk uploader as powerful and as inexpensive as Power Post v11b
(yEnc). If there were a non-yEnc version available, I would switch to
that in a heartbeat, just to keep the peace.

Another analogy, possibly on topic, just occured to me. Supposedly
Ernst Udet checked out the new Bf-109 Willy Messerchmidt was
developing, then told the designer that once he added a second wing
and lost the canopy he would have a great fighter.

I would venture to suggest that, perhaps, the non-yEncers just don't
get the whole "glass over the head" thing... :)

Please note that I never have, and never will make claims as to yEnc's
"superiority." It's there, and we have to deal with it. I did with a
simple point upgrade to Agent. As Don originally said, YMMV.

[Dallas[_2_]]

And the yEnc thumpers dont get the We dont want it, dont need it thing
either..... The yEnc'ers force their pages and pages of unreadable code
down our throats even tho time and time again its been said that its not
welcome here. Since you seem to be unable to answer Dons Question with a
straight answer and just keep throwing
analogy after analogy around....I come to your house and you dont smoke and
Im a smoker, out of common courtesy, Im not gonna smoke in your house......
but that comes from those having conciences and able to be considerate of
others...... Nuff said, if you want to post yEnc fine, your just wasting
bandwidth to me and shall join the other yEncers in the kill file.

"Casey Tompkins" > wrote in message
...
> On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 11:03:00 +0930, "Dave Kearton"
> > wrote:
>
>>Don Pyeatt wrote:
>>If the others were as good as some people seem to attest, then the whole
>>planet would have taken on these wonderful, free packages - but that
>>hasn't
>>happened.
>
> Let us reformulate: If the health bonuses were as good as some people
> seem to attest, then the whole planet would have stopped smoking by
> now - but that hasn't happened.
>
> Catch my drift?
>
> I'm trying to get into a "which is better" argument per se, but OE is
> not, never has been, and never will be a full-blown newsreader, any
> more than WordPad is a true word processor. My orientation is more
> towards appropriate/legitimate arguments, and how to solve the
> problem.
>
> If, however, your needs are served by that application, knock yourself
> out. Just please don't try to tell me it's a newreader.
>
> Also, the approach of "argument by simplicity" falls apart upon
> examination, especially if one side gets to define simplicity as "what
> I'm used to." Heck, I was used to DesqView interrupt-driven
> multi-tasking under MS-DOS long before Win95 came along. Yet I was
> finally dragged -kicking and screaming- into Windows-world.
>
> You want simplicity? Fine, let's go back to TTY terminals and
> analog-coupled 300bps modems. THAT'S simple! Or text-only usenet
> readers/browsers like LYNX. THAT'S simple.
>
> I think I've outlined the two major challenges for binaries groups:
> individual posting, and bulk posting. I may be wrong (not having
> exhaustively tested every newsreader on the market) but they should
> have an option to disable yEnc encoding for uploads. I've already done
> that with Agent. That's step one. The other challenge is finding a
> bulk uploader as powerful and as inexpensive as Power Post v11b
> (yEnc). If there were a non-yEnc version available, I would switch to
> that in a heartbeat, just to keep the peace.
>
> Another analogy, possibly on topic, just occured to me. Supposedly
> Ernst Udet checked out the new Bf-109 Willy Messerchmidt was
> developing, then told the designer that once he added a second wing
> and lost the canopy he would have a great fighter.
>
> I would venture to suggest that, perhaps, the non-yEncers just don't
> get the whole "glass over the head" thing... :)
>
> Please note that I never have, and never will make claims as to yEnc's
> "superiority." It's there, and we have to deal with it. I did with a
> simple point upgrade to Agent. As Don originally said, YMMV.
>

[Don Pyeatt]

"Casey Tompkins" > wrote in message
...
> On Tue, 24 Jul 2007 16:07:35 -0500, "Don Pyeatt" >
> wrote:
>
>>Hi, Casey !
>>
>>I have been avoiding this yEnc/OE thread but after reading your post I
>>thought you may perhaps be the one to answer my as-yet unanswered
>>question:
>>What will your agent do that OE will not, except of course decode yEnc
>>without an add-on patch?
>>
>>I have formed the opinion after reading these hate-OE threads over the
>>years
>>that those who hate OE simply don't know how to use it.
>>
>>What say you?
>
> Without going into exhaustive detail, Don, that's like asking what MS
> Word can do, that Wordpad can't? You have the cart and the horse
> backwards. Both Wordpad and OE are targeted to very specific and
> narrow uses. OE is an email program with limited newsreading ability.
> Similarly, Wordpad may act as an elemental word processor.
>
> I can speak with some authority on this, as my first PC used CP/M, not
> MS-DOS, and I remember the dreaded EDLIN, the only text editor
> available to early versions of MS-DOS. It was a line-editor. That is,
> one could edit text one line at a time. You had to type commands along
> the lines of "edit line 3" and then you could perform primitive
> editing similar to command-line editing until WinXP.
>
> Then along (finally) comes WordPad, which is a freebie included with
> the latest Windows. Considered as a basic word processor (compared to
> the 80s stuff) it is excellent. WYSIWYG, different fonts on-screen,
> in-place editing on-screen, italics, boldface, etc, etc. After Valdocs
> that's exciting! :)
>
> But... Compared to a real modern word processor -or even a powerful
> text editor such as TextPad or EMACS, Wordpad is primitive.
>
> To put it another way, OE to a modern newsreader as MS Paint is to
> Adobe Photoshop.
>
> I don't hate OE per se, as an email utility. I loathe it as an example
> of how MicroSoft allowed it to become one of the world's worst
> vulnerability magnet.
>
> There are free programs which are head and shoulders above what MS
> produces for email, newsgroups, and the web. I've mentioned Agent
> already. The Mozilla Firefox brower and Mozilla Sunbird email client
> are the best of the best. If you want to see what's going to be added
> to the next edition of Internet Explorer, just check out what's
> current (or old {g}) in Firefox and Sunbird. The Mozilla products are
> more secure than equivalent MS products, more stable, more advanced,
> and one helluva lot cheaper.
>
> To get back to your original point, I know how to use OE; I just don't
> see the point; any more than I see the point of using WordPad as a
> word processor. (which reminds me: OpenOffice, anyone?) There are far
> more powerful freeware applications out there. OE is comparatively
> primitive, and a security nightmare. If I could rip it out by the
> roots from WinXP, I would do so in a heartbeat.
>
> I think my earlier analogy still holds: you can use a truck as a
> tractor, but that doesn't make it a good idea. OE is not a newsgroup
> reader.
>
> I'll also repeat my earlier statment: much of the argument can be
> avoided by posting via newgroup reader and not using yEnc. I have no
> problem doing that, just to keep the peace. Alas, the best freeware
> auto-poster is Power Post v11b, AKA Power Post v11b-yEnc. Are there
> any yEnc-hating hackers out there who would be willing to (ahhh...)
> "yEnc" that code out of the program to allow standard bulk posting?
>
> Please excuse the pun. :)
>

Thanks, Casey.

Unfortunately, after all the subjective comparisons you used, you have not
answered my basic question. To repeat:

Other than yEnc, "What will your agent do that OE will not?"

This former CP/M and DOS user just wants a straight answer.

Please be objective.

Don

[Don Pyeatt]

"Clairbear" > wrote in message
...
> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in :
>
>> Not so fast....this is not a yEnc thread. I just want someone to
>> answer my question about news and email clients.
>>
>> Why is OE inferior to other clients?
>>
>> It is beginning to appear that no one can answer it.
>>
>> gdp
>>
>>
>
> Don It has been answered but you, my friend, just prefer not to accept the
> answers.

No, it has not. Just like you, others who try to answer the basic question
just run and hide or, at best, throw up a smoke screen.

Want to try again? Here it is:

Other than yEnc, "What will your agent do that OE will not?"

Waiting patiently,

gdp

[Don Pyeatt]

"Casey Tompkins" > wrote in message
...
> On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 11:03:00 +0930, "Dave Kearton"
> > wrote:
>
>>Don Pyeatt wrote:
>>If the others were as good as some people seem to attest, then the whole
>>planet would have taken on these wonderful, free packages - but that
>>hasn't
>>happened.
>
> Let us reformulate: If the health bonuses were as good as some people
> seem to attest, then the whole planet would have stopped smoking by
> now - but that hasn't happened.
>
> Catch my drift?
>
> I'm trying to get into a "which is better" argument per se, but OE is
> not, never has been, and never will be a full-blown newsreader, any
> more than WordPad is a true word processor. My orientation is more
> towards appropriate/legitimate arguments, and how to solve the
> problem.
>
> If, however, your needs are served by that application, knock yourself
> out. Just please don't try to tell me it's a newreader.
>
> Also, the approach of "argument by simplicity" falls apart upon
> examination, especially if one side gets to define simplicity as "what
> I'm used to." Heck, I was used to DesqView interrupt-driven
> multi-tasking under MS-DOS long before Win95 came along. Yet I was
> finally dragged -kicking and screaming- into Windows-world.
>
> You want simplicity? Fine, let's go back to TTY terminals and
> analog-coupled 300bps modems. THAT'S simple! Or text-only usenet
> readers/browsers like LYNX. THAT'S simple.
>
> I think I've outlined the two major challenges for binaries groups:
> individual posting, and bulk posting. I may be wrong (not having
> exhaustively tested every newsreader on the market) but they should
> have an option to disable yEnc encoding for uploads. I've already done
> that with Agent. That's step one. The other challenge is finding a
> bulk uploader as powerful and as inexpensive as Power Post v11b
> (yEnc). If there were a non-yEnc version available, I would switch to
> that in a heartbeat, just to keep the peace.
>
> Another analogy, possibly on topic, just occured to me. Supposedly
> Ernst Udet checked out the new Bf-109 Willy Messerchmidt was
> developing, then told the designer that once he added a second wing
> and lost the canopy he would have a great fighter.
>
> I would venture to suggest that, perhaps, the non-yEncers just don't
> get the whole "glass over the head" thing... :)
>
> Please note that I never have, and never will make claims as to yEnc's
> "superiority." It's there, and we have to deal with it. I did with a
> simple point upgrade to Agent. As Don originally said, YMMV.
>

No, I did not.

What I said was, "Other than yEnc, what will your agent do that OE will
not?"

gdp

[Dave Kearton]

Don Pyeatt wrote:
>> "Casey Tompkins" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 11:03:00 +0930, "Dave Kearton"
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> Don Pyeatt wrote:
>>>> If the others were as good as some people seem to attest, then
>>>> the whole planet would have taken on these wonderful, free
>>>> packages - but that hasn't
>>>> happened.
>>>
>>> Let us reformulate: If the health bonuses were as good as some
>>> people seem to attest, then the whole planet would have stopped
>>> smoking by now - but that hasn't happened.
>>>
>>> Catch my drift?
>>>
>>> I'm trying to get into a "which is better" argument per se, but OE
>>> is not, never has been, and never will be a full-blown newsreader,
>>> any more than WordPad is a true word processor. My orientation is
>>> more towards appropriate/legitimate arguments, and how to solve the
>>> problem.
>>>
>>> If, however, your needs are served by that application, knock
>>> yourself out. Just please don't try to tell me it's a newreader.
>>>
>>> Also, the approach of "argument by simplicity" falls apart upon
>>> examination, especially if one side gets to define simplicity as
>>> "what I'm used to." Heck, I was used to DesqView interrupt-driven
>>> multi-tasking under MS-DOS long before Win95 came along. Yet I was
>>> finally dragged -kicking and screaming- into Windows-world.
>>>
>>> You want simplicity? Fine, let's go back to TTY terminals and
>>> analog-coupled 300bps modems. THAT'S simple! Or text-only usenet
>>> readers/browsers like LYNX. THAT'S simple.
>>>
>>> I think I've outlined the two major challenges for binaries groups:
>>> individual posting, and bulk posting. I may be wrong (not having
>>> exhaustively tested every newsreader on the market) but they should
>>> have an option to disable yEnc encoding for uploads. I've already
>>> done that with Agent. That's step one. The other challenge is
>>> finding a bulk uploader as powerful and as inexpensive as Power
>>> Post v11b (yEnc). If there were a non-yEnc version available, I
>>> would switch to that in a heartbeat, just to keep the peace.
>>>
>>> Another analogy, possibly on topic, just occured to me. Supposedly
>>> Ernst Udet checked out the new Bf-109 Willy Messerchmidt was
>>> developing, then told the designer that once he added a second wing
>>> and lost the canopy he would have a great fighter.
>>>
>>> I would venture to suggest that, perhaps, the non-yEncers just don't
>>> get the whole "glass over the head" thing... :)
>>>
>>> Please note that I never have, and never will make claims as to
>>> yEnc's "superiority." It's there, and we have to deal with it. I
>>> did with a simple point upgrade to Agent. As Don originally said,
>>> YMMV.
>>>
>>
>> No, I did not.
>>
>> What I said was, "Other than yEnc, what will your agent do that OE
>> will not?"
>>
>> gdp



His newsreader is causing problems with attributions.



--

Cheers

Dave Kearton

[Tauty]

>
> Other than yEnc, "What will your agent do that OE will not?"
>
> Waiting patiently,
>
> gdp
>

I think the answer has been given - Using a newsreader other than OE makes
them feel superior, I guess.

As for OE not being a newsreader - well, I am reading news on it.

[Mike Henley]

"Don Pyeatt" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Casey Tompkins" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Tue, 24 Jul 2007 16:07:35 -0500, "Don Pyeatt" >
>> wrote:
>>


Why don't you people start a NEW newsgroup "alt.binaries.pictures.yEnc is
better.No it isn't.Yes it is", then everyone can move over there and
continue to club this thread into the ground.

[Clairbear]

"Don Pyeatt" > wrote in :

>
> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>> Not so fast....this is not a yEnc thread. I just want someone to
>>> answer my question about news and email clients.
>>>
>>> Why is OE inferior to other clients?
>>>
>>> It is beginning to appear that no one can answer it.
>>>
>>> gdp
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Don It has been answered but you, my friend, just prefer not to
>> accept the answers.
>
> No, it has not. Just like you, others who try to answer the basic
> question just run and hide or, at best, throw up a smoke screen.
>
> Want to try again? Here it is:
>
> Other than yEnc, "What will your agent do that OE will not?"
>
> Waiting patiently,
>
> gdp
>
>
>
>
>
Xnews is easier, faster, more capable and more usable

[Clairbear]

"Tauty" <tautalogicus<not this stuff>@gmail<this either>.com> wrote in
:

>>
>> Other than yEnc, "What will your agent do that OE will not?"
>>
>> Waiting patiently,
>>
>> gdp
>>
>
> I think the answer has been given - Using a newsreader other than OE
> makes them feel superior, I guess.
I use Xnews but it does not make me superior to anyone Just better served
than using OE to read news
> As for OE not being a newsreader - well, I am reading news on it.
>
I you are satisfied with the ModelT then I guess a 2007 Mustangwon't thrill
you at all

[Don Pyeatt]

"gnububba" > wrote in message
...
> On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 05:32:43 -0500, "Don Pyeatt" >
> >
>
> ...snippage here, sorry...
>>Unfortunately, after all the subjective comparisons you used, you have not
>>answered my basic question. To repeat:
>>
>>Other than yEnc, "What will your agent do that OE will not?"
>>
>>This former CP/M and DOS user just wants a straight answer.
>>
>>Please be objective.
>>
>>Don
>>
> Hi Don,
>
> This is for information only but here is a brief list of things I find
> important every day which I believe OE won't do for me.
>
> 1. Automatically combine multiple part posts into a single line.
>
> 2. Allow more than one group to be open at a time.
> (I can look through other groups while one is downloading.)
>
> 3. Allow a single post to be d/led 'right now' without having to stop
> a d/l going on in another group. (Priority retrieval)
>
> 4. Allow Personalization of the toolbar with a choice of nearly any
> function available in the reader.
>
> 5. Automatically add the filename to the Subject line of a post.
>
> 6. Permit changing how many headers to get on a one-time basis
> without having to reset the default properties.
>
> 7. Allow different usage settings for_each individual group_rather
> than a single set of options for all.
>
> 8. Correctly format quoted text without breaking it into spastic
> little pieces and stringing it down an entire page. (I had to get
> one dig in OK?)
>
> Also some readers:
> 8. Exceed the options capability of OE by more than 10::1.
>
> 9. Exceed the filtering capability of OE by Light Years.
>
> 10. The nickel & dime conveniences are far too many to list.
>
> Let me qualify. I used OE for over a year getting news and during that
> time the list above seemed every bit as unimportant to me as it now
> seems indispensable.
>
> These threads are beyond weariness and will end only when OE is
> repaired. Unfortunately all hope of that is now gone forever.
> Microsoft ended development and it was officially killed last year.
> Does the fact Microsoft itself has quit using it say anything?
>
> I didn't want to take time learning another news reader and enjoyed
> the groups using Outlook Express. I still thoroughly enjoy the groups
> but using a program that is smart about what goes on in news groups
> has saved me a lot of grief. I can spend what time there is available
> looking through the groups rather than wondering what went wrong.
>
> The most important part of this group are the people who have been
> bringing pictures here day after day for years. Without them this news
> reader is just as worthless as any other. They know who they are and
> how they want to go about doing it.
>
> Thank you,
>

And thank you for your objectivity ! I believe the question has been
answered succinctly, and with no references to VHS and Beta.

Thank you,

gdp

[RK]

Kainolophobia rules!

[Bob Harrington]

(RK) wrote in news:fM4qi.53285$5j1.50259
@newssvr21.news.prodigy.net:

>
> Kainolophobia rules!


Fine. ~Make~ me go look it up...

Ah.

[Don Pyeatt]

"Bob Harrington" > wrote in message
...
> (RK) wrote in news:fM4qi.53285$5j1.50259
> @newssvr21.news.prodigy.net:
>
>>
>> Kainolophobia rules!
>
>
> Fine. ~Make~ me go look it up...
>
> Ah.

Maybe it has something to do with number 8 in gnububba's list.

The first number 8 that is.

Howyadoin Bob?

gdp

[Luc]

On Thu, 26 Jul 2007 05:09:08 GMT, Clairbear > wrote:

The YENC debate seems very similar to the California Assembly and
Senate as they attempt to reach a budget....late again as usual! They
haven't changed many minds either!!



>"Don Pyeatt" > wrote in :
>
>>
>> "Clairbear" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> "Don Pyeatt" > wrote in
>>> :
>>>
>>>> Not so fast....this is not a yEnc thread. I just want someone to
>>>> answer my question about news and email clients.
>>>>
>>>> Why is OE inferior to other clients?
>>>>
>>>> It is beginning to appear that no one can answer it.
>>>>
>>>> gdp
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Don It has been answered but you, my friend, just prefer not to
>>> accept the answers.
>>
>> No, it has not. Just like you, others who try to answer the basic
>> question just run and hide or, at best, throw up a smoke screen.
>>
>> Want to try again? Here it is:
>>
>> Other than yEnc, "What will your agent do that OE will not?"
>>
>> Waiting patiently,
>>
>> gdp
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>Xnews is easier, faster, more capable and more usable

[Casey Tompkins]

On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 05:26:40 GMT, "Dallas"
> wrote:

>And the yEnc thumpers dont get the We dont want it, dont need it thing
>either..... The yEnc'ers force their pages and pages of unreadable code
>down our throats even tho time and time again its been said that its not
>welcome here. Since you seem to be unable to answer Dons Question with a
>straight answer and just keep throwing
>analogy after analogy around....I come to your house and you dont smoke and
>Im a smoker, out of common courtesy, Im not gonna smoke in your house......
>but that comes from those having conciences and able to be considerate of
>others...... Nuff said, if you want to post yEnc fine, your just wasting
>bandwidth to me and shall join the other yEncers in the kill file.

Dallas, if you have a problem with argument by analogy, I can't help
you. It's a legitmate method of discussion, and sometimes may
illustrate a point more effectively than pure prose.

I have, in fact, answered Don's question, which was about OE, not
yEnc, if you were paying attention...

Also, IF you were paying attention, I have already (upon more than one
occasion) made suggestions on how posters may accomodate
non-yEnc-compliant readers, but you are apparently more interested in
shoving me into some pre-concieved category in your mind, than reading
what I have to say.

Sorry.

[Casey Tompkins]

On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 21:17:18 +0930, "Dave Kearton"
> wrote:

>Don Pyeatt wrote:
>>> "Casey Tompkins" > wrote in message
>>>> did with a simple point upgrade to Agent. As Don originally said,
>>>> YMMV.

>>> No, I did not.
>>>
>>> What I said was, "Other than yEnc, what will your agent do that OE
>>> will not?"

>His newsreader is causing problems with attributions.

It's a bug, not a feature.. :)

[Casey Tompkins]

On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 15:19:03 -0700, "Mike Henley" >
wrote:

>Why don't you people start a NEW newsgroup "alt.binaries.pictures.yEnc is
>better.No it isn't.Yes it is", then everyone can move over there and
>continue to club this thread into the ground.

Ok. I'm busted. I've seen this thread way too many times myself. but
the folks around here are (generally) just too darn civilized.
Besides, I have a prelidicton for pedanrty, and the argument that
adding yEnc functionality or upgrading to a true newsreader is not
supportable...

On the other hand, I am in no way a "yEnc fan" (despite belief to the
contrary).

On the gripping hand, I think there are valid ways to address this
challenge besides the bit bucket. I have already mentioned some of
these methods in earliers remarks.

[Bob Harrington]

"Don Pyeatt" > wrote in :

> Howyadoin Bob?

Still listed amongst the survivors. Trust the world is being kind at you?

Taking ~lots~ o' pictures. Not posting many. Seems to be a blockage in the
workflow... anybody got a copy of Adobe X-Lax I could borrow...?

Bob ^,,^

[Casey Tompkins]

On Thu, 26 Jul 2007 04:47:39 -0500, "Don Pyeatt" >
wrote:

>And thank you for your objectivity ! I believe the question has been
>answered succinctly, and with no references to VHS and Beta.
>
>Thank you,
>

Well, sorry about that, sir! I was trying to provide a general
argument, but apparently that rubs feathers the wrong way around here.
You asked an honest question, and I tried to anwser it honestly and
objectively.

....Even if very few people use Betamax machines any more. Heh...

(ducking for cover)

[Dallas[_2_]]

I dont have any problem with argument by analogy, but what was asked for was
specifics not generalities....... You provided none.... And you still miss
my point, the group has had a long..............long time standing policy on
yEnc.......Much like non smokers prolly have in their homes about
smoking........and that is that yEnc isnt welcome here.... It never has
been, and prolly never will be........ Point being is that those posting
in yEnc are being much like the smoker entering the nonsmokers house and
lighting up................
Last thing Ill say bout it as this horse is officially deader then
hell.............

"Casey Tompkins" > wrote in message
...
> On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 05:26:40 GMT, "Dallas"
> > wrote:
>
>>And the yEnc thumpers dont get the We dont want it, dont need it thing
>>either..... The yEnc'ers force their pages and pages of unreadable code
>>down our throats even tho time and time again its been said that its not
>>welcome here. Since you seem to be unable to answer Dons Question with a
>>straight answer and just keep throwing
>>analogy after analogy around....I come to your house and you dont smoke
>>and
>>Im a smoker, out of common courtesy, Im not gonna smoke in your
>>house......
>>but that comes from those having conciences and able to be considerate of
>>others...... Nuff said, if you want to post yEnc fine, your just wasting
>>bandwidth to me and shall join the other yEncers in the kill file.
>
> Dallas, if you have a problem with argument by analogy, I can't help
> you. It's a legitmate method of discussion, and sometimes may
> illustrate a point more effectively than pure prose.
>
> I have, in fact, answered Don's question, which was about OE, not
> yEnc, if you were paying attention...
>
> Also, IF you were paying attention, I have already (upon more than one
> occasion) made suggestions on how posters may accomodate
> non-yEnc-compliant readers, but you are apparently more interested in
> shoving me into some pre-concieved category in your mind, than reading
> what I have to say.
>
> Sorry.
>
>