Question for the Flight Physician

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN[_2_]]

Is the FAA aware of a new anti-smoking drug called Chantix? More to the point,
do hey have an official position on it? For most of my career, we always used
Nicoderm patches on those inpatients who smoked... with very uneven results. I
have, within the last few months, become aware of Chantix and its ability to
totally kill the desire to smoke. Before I suggest it to a friend of mine who
flies for a commuter, I want to be able to say one way or the other if it will
affect his ability to fly while he's taking it. If not, I'm just going to keep
my mouth shut; he'd never look into it in that case.

Gentlemen?



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

[Matt Barrow[_4_]]

"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in message
...
> Is the FAA aware of a new anti-smoking drug called Chantix? More to the
> point, do hey have an official position on it? For most of my career, we
> always used Nicoderm patches on those inpatients who smoked... with very
> uneven results. I have, within the last few months, become aware of
> Chantix and its ability to totally kill the desire to smoke. Before I
> suggest it to a friend of mine who flies for a commuter, I want to be able
> to say one way or the other if it will affect his ability to fly while
> he's taking it. If not, I'm just going to keep my mouth shut; he'd never
> look into it in that case.
>
> Gentlemen?
>

I prefer Hoyo de Monterrey's to help me quit smoking.

In maduro.
--
Matt Barrow
Performance Homes, LLC.
Cheyenne, WY
--
“Nonscientists generally do not want to bother with understanding
the science. Claims of consensus relieve policy types, environmental
advocates and politicians of any need to do so. Such claims also serve
to intimidate the public and even scientists...there is a clear attempt to
establish truth not by scientific methods but by perpetual repetition.”
- Dr. Richard Lindzen, MIT, (6-26-06)

[Viperdoc[_4_]]

Here's a link for practitioners:
https://www.pfizerpro.com/product_info/chantix_pi_clinical_pharmacology.jsp

I have not checked on the FAA website to see if it is on their list of
approved meds, but if it is new, it probably has not been evaluated. Sounds
like it would be reasonable and logical, but the FAA is very conservative
when it comes to aeromedical issues.

If you're talking about the military, you can completely forget it- they are
so conservative that I'm surprised they've approved Tylenol.



"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in message
...
> Is the FAA aware of a new anti-smoking drug called Chantix? More to the
> point, do hey have an official position on it? For most of my career, we
> always used Nicoderm patches on those inpatients who smoked... with very
> uneven results. I have, within the last few months, become aware of
> Chantix and its ability to totally kill the desire to smoke. Before I
> suggest it to a friend of mine who flies for a commuter, I want to be able
> to say one way or the other if it will affect his ability to fly while
> he's taking it. If not, I'm just going to keep my mouth shut; he'd never
> look into it in that case.
>
> Gentlemen?
>
>
>
> --
> Mortimer Schnerd, RN
> mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com
>

[Mxsmanic]

Viperdoc writes:

> If you're talking about the military, you can completely forget it- they are
> so conservative that I'm surprised they've approved Tylenol.

They don't seem to have a problem with amphetamines.

[NoneYa]

but the FAA is very conservative when it comes to
aeromedical issues.



Why?

They are very liberal when it comes to hiring and promoting
minorities and women who are clueless and unqualified.

[Dave S]

Viperdoc wrote:

> If you're talking about the military, you can completely forget it- they are
> so conservative that I'm surprised they've approved Tylenol.
>
>
The same military that gives amphetamines to its crews to prolong
alertness, and forces their troops to get unproven vaccines against
obscure illnesses? I never took them for that conservative with regards
to medicine..

(dont paint me as part of the anti-vaccine crowd, im not.)

rant off.

[Montblack]

("Dave S" wrote)
> The same military that gives amphetamines to its crews to prolong
> alertness...


http://www.modafinil.com/article/soldiers.html
Military use

http://www.modafinil.com/
....modafinil ('Provigil', 'Alertec', 'Vigicer', 'Modalert', etc) is a
memory-improving and mood-brightening psychostimulant. It enhances
wakefulness and vigilance, but its pharmacological profile is notably
different from the amphetamines, methylphenidate (Ritalin) or cocaine.
Modafinil is less likely to cause jitteriness, anxiety, or excess locomotor
activity - or lead to a hypersomnolent 'rebound effect' - than traditional
stimulants. Subjectively, it feels smoother and cleaner than the
amphetamines too. It may even be anxiolytic.


Paul-Mont

[Denny]

I am prescribing Chantix frequently - while Chantix is not the safest
drug ever made, it is head and shoulders better than the risk from
continuing to smoke...


It strongly binds to nicotinic receptors (which is probably a neutral
to the FAA)..
But it moderately binds to 5-HT receptors (which the FAA gets nervous
about)..

Selected (by me) findings are "frequent" chest pain, cardiac
arrythmias, elevated liver enzymes, and edema...
But more importantly, "frequent" anxiety, depression, and
irritability...

My judgement is that the FAA medical staff will not approve it's use
in flight...

http://www.pfizer.com/pfizer/download/uspi_chantix.pdf

denny

[Viperdoc[_4_]]

I was waiting to see how long it would take for you to chime in with some
stupid moronic comment.

..

[Ron Natalie]

Mortimer Schnerd, RN wrote:
> Is the FAA aware of a new anti-smoking drug called Chantix?

I believe the FAA aeromedical guys won't make a decision until a
drug has been on the market for a year. The general conclusion
is that Chantix will be approved subject to the patient reports
no adverse side effects...

>
>

[Ron Natalie]

Matt Barrow wrote:

>
> I prefer Hoyo de Monterrey's to help me quit smoking.
>
> In maduro.

Blech...I was about to agree with you until you mentioned maduro
and then I realized you were taking about the Honduran version
rather than the cubans.

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN[_2_]]

Denny wrote:
> I am prescribing Chantix frequently - while Chantix is not the safest
> drug ever made, it is head and shoulders better than the risk from
> continuing to smoke...
>
> My judgement is that the FAA medical staff will not approve it's use
> in flight...


It'd be a shame. This drug looks like the one we've been looking for. My
patients who've been on it report ZERO urge to smoke.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

[Mxsmanic]

Montblack writes:

> http://www.modafinil.com/
> ...modafinil ('Provigil', 'Alertec', 'Vigicer', 'Modalert', etc) is a
> memory-improving and mood-brightening psychostimulant. It enhances
> wakefulness and vigilance, but its pharmacological profile is notably
> different from the amphetamines, methylphenidate (Ritalin) or cocaine.
> Modafinil is less likely to cause jitteriness, anxiety, or excess locomotor
> activity - or lead to a hypersomnolent 'rebound effect' - than traditional
> stimulants. Subjectively, it feels smoother and cleaner than the
> amphetamines too. It may even be anxiolytic.

Amphetamines were long the stimulant of choice for the military.

[Mxsmanic]

Denny writes:

> I am prescribing Chantix frequently - while Chantix is not the safest
> drug ever made, it is head and shoulders better than the risk from
> continuing to smoke...
>
>
> It strongly binds to nicotinic receptors (which is probably a neutral
> to the FAA)..
> But it moderately binds to 5-HT receptors (which the FAA gets nervous
> about)..
>
> Selected (by me) findings are "frequent" chest pain, cardiac
> arrythmias, elevated liver enzymes, and edema...
> But more importantly, "frequent" anxiety, depression, and
> irritability...
>
> My judgement is that the FAA medical staff will not approve it's use
> in flight...

Since Chantix is not something that a person takes for prolonged periods, it
shouldn't be a problem. It might be necessary to abstain from flying for the
course of a 12- or 24-week treatment program, but that's all.

[Mxsmanic]

Mortimer Schnerd, RN writes:

> It'd be a shame. This drug looks like the one we've been looking for. My
> patients who've been on it report ZERO urge to smoke.

They don't have to remain on it for a lifetime, and once they are off it, it's
no longer a concern for aviation.

[El Maximo]

"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in message
...
> Is the FAA aware of a new anti-smoking drug called Chantix? More to the
> point, do hey have an official position on it? For most of my career, we
> always used Nicoderm patches on those inpatients who smoked... with very
> uneven results. I have, within the last few months, become aware of
> Chantix and its ability to totally kill the desire to smoke. Before I
> suggest it to a friend of mine who flies for a commuter, I want to be able
> to say one way or the other if it will affect his ability to fly while
> he's taking it. If not, I'm just going to keep my mouth shut; he'd never
> look into it in that case.
>
> Gentlemen?

Although it doesn't agree with Dr. Atkielski's advice, I found this when I
googled AOPA CHANTIX:

http://www.vansairforce.net/old_news.htm
- TRYING TO STOP SMOKING?...from aopa site
The FAA allows pilots taking a new smoking-cessation drug, Chantix, to
continue flying as long as they have a status report from their treating
physician that confirms they have not experienced any adverse side effects.
Chewing gums that help you stop smoking are also permitted. But a
prescription medication, Bupropion, marketed as Zyban and Wellbutrin, which
is commonly prescribed for smoking cessation, is an antidepressant and
cannot be taken while flying. Current FAA policy does not allow pilots to
fly while using antidepressants. If you are using Bupropion to stop smoking,
you must be off it for 30 days before flying.

[Doug Semler]

On Aug 22, 7:24 am, Denny > wrote:
> I am prescribing Chantix frequently - while Chantix is not the safest
> drug ever made, it is head and shoulders better than the risk from
> continuing to smoke...
>
> It strongly binds to nicotinic receptors (which is probably a neutral
> to the FAA)..
> But it moderately binds to 5-HT receptors (which the FAA gets nervous
> about)..
>

It looks like that the drug only moderately binds to the 5-HT3
receptor, and not the other seratonin receptors (at least from a quick
read). Since 5-HT3 isn't G protien coupled, it may be more "approval
friendly?" Or, from what I remember, SSRIs actually don't have a
specific affinity to the 5-HT receptors, but that the antagonism of
the receptors is hypothesized to be a side effect of other protien
bindings. <shrug>

As a side note, thanks for the info, I'll ask my doc about it...

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Mortimer Schnerd, RN writes:
>
>> It'd be a shame. This drug looks like the one we've been looking
>> for. My patients who've been on it report ZERO urge to smoke.
>
> They don't have to remain on it for a lifetime, and once they are off
> it, it's no longer a concern for aviation.
>

So now you're a flight physician as well?


Fjukkwit


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Denny writes:
>
>> I am prescribing Chantix frequently - while Chantix is not the safest
>> drug ever made, it is head and shoulders better than the risk from
>> continuing to smoke...
>>
>>
>> It strongly binds to nicotinic receptors (which is probably a neutral
>> to the FAA)..
>> But it moderately binds to 5-HT receptors (which the FAA gets nervous
>> about)..
>>
>> Selected (by me) findings are "frequent" chest pain, cardiac
>> arrythmias, elevated liver enzymes, and edema...
>> But more importantly, "frequent" anxiety, depression, and
>> irritability...
>>
>> My judgement is that the FAA medical staff will not approve it's use
>> in flight...
>
> Since Chantix is not something that a person takes for prolonged
> periods, it shouldn't be a problem. It might be necessary to abstain
> from flying for the course of a 12- or 24-week treatment program, but
> that's all.
>

Your loing history of medication doesn't make you qualified to make these
kind of statements, luser boi

Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Montblack writes:
>
>> http://www.modafinil.com/
>> ...modafinil ('Provigil', 'Alertec', 'Vigicer', 'Modalert', etc) is a
>> memory-improving and mood-brightening psychostimulant. It enhances
>> wakefulness and vigilance, but its pharmacological profile is notably
>> different from the amphetamines, methylphenidate (Ritalin) or
>> cocaine. Modafinil is less likely to cause jitteriness, anxiety, or
>> excess locomotor activity - or lead to a hypersomnolent 'rebound
>> effect' - than traditional stimulants. Subjectively, it feels
>> smoother and cleaner than the amphetamines too. It may even be
>> anxiolytic.
>
> Amphetamines were long the stimulant of choice for the military.
>



Good grief

Bertie

[Robert M. Gary]

On Aug 21, 7:47 pm, Dave S > wrote:
> Viperdoc wrote:
> > If you're talking about the military, you can completely forget it- they are
> > so conservative that I'm surprised they've approved Tylenol.
>
> The same military that gives amphetamines to its crews to prolong
> alertness, and forces their troops to get unproven vaccines against
> obscure illnesses? I never took them for that conservative with regards
> to medicine..

The FAA does not have authority over what medications a military
flight sugeon might authorize for a pilot while flying military
aircraft.

-Robert

[Robert M. Gary]

On Aug 22, 10:37 am, Mxsmanic > wrote:
> Montblack writes:
> >http://www.modafinil.com/
> > ...modafinil ('Provigil', 'Alertec', 'Vigicer', 'Modalert', etc) is a
> > memory-improving and mood-brightening psychostimulant. It enhances
> > wakefulness and vigilance, but its pharmacological profile is notably
> > different from the amphetamines, methylphenidate (Ritalin) or cocaine.
> > Modafinil is less likely to cause jitteriness, anxiety, or excess locomotor
> > activity - or lead to a hypersomnolent 'rebound effect' - than traditional
> > stimulants. Subjectively, it feels smoother and cleaner than the
> > amphetamines too. It may even be anxiolytic.
>
> Amphetamines were long the stimulant of choice for the military.

What does that have to do with the FAA?

-Robert (downs at least a liter of soda before a long night flight)

[David Horne, _the_ chancellor]

Viperdoc > wrote:

> I was waiting to see how long it would take for you to chime in with some
> stupid moronic comment.

Experience tells me that 24 hours is the usual max! :)

--
(*) ... of the royal duchy of city south and deansgate
http://www.davidhorne.net - real address on website
"Abominable, loyal, blind, apparently subservient."
Pres. Carter on Ex-Pres. Blair- May, 2007

[David Horne, _the_ chancellor]

Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:

> Mxsmanic > wrote in
> :
>
> > Mortimer Schnerd, RN writes:
> >
> >> It'd be a shame. This drug looks like the one we've been looking
> >> for. My patients who've been on it report ZERO urge to smoke.
> >
> > They don't have to remain on it for a lifetime, and once they are off
> > it, it's no longer a concern for aviation.
> >
>
> So now you're a flight physician as well?

He removed his testicles with a pair of tweezers once while playing
flight sim. Does that count?

--
(*) ... of the royal duchy of city south and deansgate
http://www.davidhorne.net - real address on website
"Abominable, loyal, blind, apparently subservient."
Pres. Carter on Ex-Pres. Blair- May, 2007

[NW_Pilot]

"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in message
...
> Is the FAA aware of a new anti-smoking drug called Chantix? More to the
> point, do hey have an official position on it? For most of my career, we
> always used Nicoderm patches on those inpatients who smoked... with very
> uneven results. I have, within the last few months, become aware of
> Chantix and its ability to totally kill the desire to smoke. Before I
> suggest it to a friend of mine who flies for a commuter, I want to be able
> to say one way or the other if it will affect his ability to fly while
> he's taking it. If not, I'm just going to keep my mouth shut; he'd never
> look into it in that case.
>
> Gentlemen?
>
>
>
> --
> Mortimer Schnerd, RN
> mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com
>

Called will power just quit!!! I was 3 packs a day quit cold turkey almost 4
years if you want to bad enough you will quit unless you have a weak mind!!!
The drug companys want you to think you need drugs or patches to quit you
just need to be strong and stop!

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN[_2_]]

NW_Pilot wrote:
> Called will power just quit!!! I was 3 packs a day quit cold turkey almost 4
> years if you want to bad enough you will quit unless you have a weak mind!!!
> The drug companys want you to think you need drugs or patches to quit you
> just need to be strong and stop!


Some can, some can't. My father quit a 3 ppd habit cold turkey back when I was
15 and hasn't smoked since, even though my mother continued to smoke for another
20 years or so. The friend who inspired this whole thread has quit 1000 times.
I guess he's weak then. But that label doesn't help him quit for good. This
Chantix might.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

[Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe]

"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in message
...
> NW_Pilot wrote:
>> Called will power just quit!!! I was 3 packs a day quit cold turkey
>> almost 4
>> years if you want to bad enough you will quit unless you have a weak
>> mind!!!
>> The drug companys want you to think you need drugs or patches to quit you
>> just need to be strong and stop!
>
>
> Some can, some can't. My father quit a 3 ppd habit cold turkey back when
> I was 15 and hasn't smoked since, even though my mother continued to smoke
> for another 20 years or so. The friend who inspired this whole thread has
> quit 1000 times. I guess he's weak then. But that label doesn't help him
> quit for good. This Chantix might.
>

My grandfathers brother had emphysema, weighed about 90 pounds, and was in
real bad shape - one day he wakes up and he is in a hospital bed - the whole
family is there, the priest is there, and he asks "What's going on?"

"The priest just gave you your last rites."

He replies "Maybe I should quit smoking."

--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.

[Doug Semler]

"NW_Pilot" > wrote in message
. ..

>
> Called will power just quit!!! I was 3 packs a day quit cold turkey almost
> 4 years if you want to bad enough you will quit unless you have a weak
> mind!!! The drug companys want you to think you need drugs or patches to
> quit you just need to be strong and stop!


It depends on the physiology *and* psychology of the person. I've tried
quitting I don't know how many times. Longest was 9 weeks. All it takes is
a "trigger" to revert back (once I get over being sick like heroin
withdrawals). If there is a drug out there that will help with the
psychological (as well as the physiological - it seems Chantax does that as
well, in re nausea), I'll take it. So far I haven't found it. Maybe this
is it....

--
Doug Semler, MCPD
a.a. #705, BAAWA. EAC Guardian of the Horn of the IPU (pbuhh).
The answer is 42; DNRC o-
Gur Hfrarg unf orpbzr fb shyy bs penc gurfr qnlf, abbar rira
erpbtavmrf fvzcyr guvatf yvxr ebg13 nalzber. Fnq, vfa'g vg?

[NW_Pilot]

"Doug Semler" > wrote in message
...
> "NW_Pilot" > wrote in message
> . ..
>
>>
>> Called will power just quit!!! I was 3 packs a day quit cold turkey
>> almost 4 years if you want to bad enough you will quit unless you have a
>> weak mind!!! The drug companys want you to think you need drugs or
>> patches to quit you just need to be strong and stop!
>
>
> It depends on the physiology *and* psychology of the person. I've tried
> quitting I don't know how many times. Longest was 9 weeks. All it takes
> is a "trigger" to revert back (once I get over being sick like heroin
> withdrawals). If there is a drug out there that will help with the
> psychological (as well as the physiological - it seems Chantax does that
> as well, in re nausea), I'll take it. So far I haven't found it. Maybe
> this is it....
>
> --
> Doug Semler, MCPD
> a.a. #705, BAAWA. EAC Guardian of the Horn of the IPU (pbuhh).
> The answer is 42; DNRC o-
> Gur Hfrarg unf orpbzr fb shyy bs penc gurfr qnlf, abbar rira
> erpbtavmrf fvzcyr guvatf yvxr ebg13 nalzber. Fnq, vfa'g vg?

Once you stop taking the other drug you may have withdrawals from that. As I
said it's will power I know it is not easy you just have to have the will to
do it be strong it can be done with out drugs. Your body will suffer a
little from the damage you have done to it already but it can be overcome
with time. Our society is becoming to dependent upon pharmaceuticals (Drugs)
some of witch have far more worse side effects then natural substances that
nature created.

In clinical trials, Chentix was generally well tolerated. However, there
were side effects that were more general in occurrence and some that were
more serious, but rare.

Gastrointestinal Side Effects: The most common side effect of taking Chantix
is nausea. Other gastrointestinal symtoms include abdominal pain, gas,
dyspepsia, vomiting, constipation, acid reflux, and dry mouth.

Psychiatric Side Effects: Psychiatric disorders involved problems with sleep
disorders such as insomnia, abnormal dreams and nightmares.

Nervous Systems Side Effects: Nervous system problems involved headache,
somnolence, and lethargy.
General disorders included fatigue, malaise, and asthenia.

Metabolism Side Effects: Metabolism and nutritional side effects included
either increased or decreased appetite and anorexia.

Other side effects involved skin rash and respiratory disorders.

More serious, but less common were life threatening side affects which may
or may not require medical attention depending on severity of symptoms and
life threatening nature. Those include, nut are not limited to, blood and
lymphatic system disorders (anemia), cardiac disorders (chest pain, heart
arrhythmia, heart palpitations and rapid heartbeat, stroke, atrial
fibrillation, and coronary heart disease), ear disorders (tinnitus,
vertigo), thyroid gland disorders, gastrointestinal disorders (diarrhea,
gingivitis, gastritis, esophagitis, gastric ulcer), immune systems
disorders, metabolism disorder (diabetes), musculoskeletal (back pain,
muscle cramps, musculoskeletal pain, arthritis, osteoporosis), nervous
system disorders (disturbance in attention, dizziness, amnesia, migraine,
restless leg syndrome, tremor), psychiatric disorders (anxety depression,
irritability, restlessness, mood swings, agitation, decreased libido). There
is a low occurrence of renal and urinary disorders, reproductive disorders
(menstrual disorder, erectile dysfunction), vascular disorders (hot flush,
hypertension, hypotension), respiratory disorders, and skin disorders (acne,
dermatitis, dry skin, eczema, psoriasis).

Chantix has no clinically significant pharmacological drug interactions and
was shown not to have carcinogenic effects in studies on rats.

[Doug Semler]

"NW_Pilot" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Doug Semler" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "NW_Pilot" > wrote in message
>> . ..
>>
>>>
>>> Called will power just quit!!! I was 3 packs a day quit cold turkey
>>> almost 4 years if you want to bad enough you will quit unless you have a
>>> weak mind!!! The drug companys want you to think you need drugs or
>>> patches to quit you just need to be strong and stop!
>>
>>
>> It depends on the physiology *and* psychology of the person. I've tried
>> quitting I don't know how many times. Longest was 9 weeks. All it takes
>> is a "trigger" to revert back (once I get over being sick like heroin
>> withdrawals). If there is a drug out there that will help with the
>> psychological (as well as the physiological - it seems Chantax does that
>> as well, in re nausea), I'll take it. So far I haven't found it. Maybe
>> this is it....
>>
>> --
>> Doug Semler, MCPD
>> a.a. #705, BAAWA. EAC Guardian of the Horn of the IPU (pbuhh).
>> The answer is 42; DNRC o-
>> Gur Hfrarg unf orpbzr fb shyy bs penc gurfr qnlf, abbar rira
>> erpbtavmrf fvzcyr guvatf yvxr ebg13 nalzber. Fnq, vfa'g vg?
>
> Once you stop taking the other drug you may have withdrawals from that. As
> I said it's will power I know it is not easy you just have to have the
> will to do it be strong it can be done with out drugs. Your body will
> suffer a little from the damage you have done to it already but it can be
> overcome with time. Our society is becoming to dependent upon
> pharmaceuticals (Drugs) some of witch have far more worse side effects
> then natural substances that nature created.
>

<snip>

You just quoted the same side effects for just about every single drug on
the market. <shrug> Anyway. My point is, not everyone has the
PSYCHOLOGICAL makeup to just up and quit a physical addiction. They are
called "addictive personalities". I am one of those. I can't go into a
casino; I'll drain my bank account. Luckily I don't like being drunk (nor
the day after) so I don't drink but a couple glasses of wine/beer with
dinner or in a social situation (i like the taste with food).

That being said, the temporary side effects suffered while taking the drug
may or may not outweigh the benefits the drug may or may not provide. That
is between me and my doctor. And no one else. Regardless of your opinions
on "will power" and the drug companies, you have absolutely no say in this
decision.

--
Doug Semler, MCPD
a.a. #705, BAAWA. EAC Guardian of the Horn of the IPU (pbuhh).
The answer is 42; DNRC o-
Gur Hfrarg unf orpbzr fb shyy bs penc gurfr qnlf, abbar rira
erpbtavmrf fvzcyr guvatf yvxr ebg13 nalzber. Fnq, vfa'g vg?

[Mxsmanic]

Robert M. Gary writes:

> What does that have to do with the FAA?

Nothing. I was simply refuting the assertion that the military is
conservative in its use of medication. Some of the primary users of
amphetamines in the military have traditionally been pilots.

[Montblack]

("john smith" wrote)
> Describe what "abnormal dreams" means.


Remember the melatonin craze in the mid 90's? :-)

ZZZZzzzzZZZzzz <:-o ....zzzZZZZzzzz

(from Wiki)
Many melatonin users have reported an increase in the vividness or frequency
of dreams. High doses of melatonin (50mg) dramatically increased REM sleep
time and dream activity in both narcoleptics and normal people. Many
psychoactive drugs, such as LSD and cocaine, increase melatonin synthesis.
It has been suggested that nonpolar (lipid-soluble) indolic hallucinogenic
drugs emulate melatonin activity in the awakened state and that both act on
the same areas of the brain.


Paul-Mont

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

(David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*)) wrote in
:

> Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>
>> Mxsmanic > wrote in
>> :
>>
>> > Mortimer Schnerd, RN writes:
>> >
>> >> It'd be a shame. This drug looks like the one we've been looking
>> >> for. My patients who've been on it report ZERO urge to smoke.
>> >
>> > They don't have to remain on it for a lifetime, and once they are off
>> > it, it's no longer a concern for aviation.
>> >
>>
>> So now you're a flight physician as well?
>
> He removed his testicles with a pair of tweezers once while playing
> flight sim. Does that count?
>

Hey, better'n I could do.

Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Robert M. Gary writes:
>
>> What does that have to do with the FAA?
>
> Nothing. I was simply refuting the assertion that the military is
> conservative in its use of medication.

No you weren't

Bertie

[NW_Pilot]

"Doug Semler" > wrote in message
...
> "NW_Pilot" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "Doug Semler" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> "NW_Pilot" > wrote in message
>>> . ..
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Called will power just quit!!! I was 3 packs a day quit cold turkey
>>>> almost 4 years if you want to bad enough you will quit unless you have
>>>> a weak mind!!! The drug companys want you to think you need drugs or
>>>> patches to quit you just need to be strong and stop!
>>>
>>>
>>> It depends on the physiology *and* psychology of the person. I've tried
>>> quitting I don't know how many times. Longest was 9 weeks. All it
>>> takes is a "trigger" to revert back (once I get over being sick like
>>> heroin withdrawals). If there is a drug out there that will help with
>>> the psychological (as well as the physiological - it seems Chantax does
>>> that as well, in re nausea), I'll take it. So far I haven't found it.
>>> Maybe this is it....
>>>
>>> --
>>> Doug Semler, MCPD
>>> a.a. #705, BAAWA. EAC Guardian of the Horn of the IPU (pbuhh).
>>> The answer is 42; DNRC o-
>>> Gur Hfrarg unf orpbzr fb shyy bs penc gurfr qnlf, abbar rira
>>> erpbtavmrf fvzcyr guvatf yvxr ebg13 nalzber. Fnq, vfa'g vg?
>>
>> Once you stop taking the other drug you may have withdrawals from that.
>> As I said it's will power I know it is not easy you just have to have the
>> will to do it be strong it can be done with out drugs. Your body will
>> suffer a little from the damage you have done to it already but it can be
>> overcome with time. Our society is becoming to dependent upon
>> pharmaceuticals (Drugs) some of witch have far more worse side effects
>> then natural substances that nature created.
>>
>
> <snip>
>
> You just quoted the same side effects for just about every single drug on
> the market. <shrug> Anyway. My point is, not everyone has the
> PSYCHOLOGICAL makeup to just up and quit a physical addiction. They are
> called "addictive personalities". I am one of those. I can't go into a
> casino; I'll drain my bank account. Luckily I don't like being drunk (nor
> the day after) so I don't drink but a couple glasses of wine/beer with
> dinner or in a social situation (i like the taste with food).
>
> That being said, the temporary side effects suffered while taking the drug
> may or may not outweigh the benefits the drug may or may not provide.
> That is between me and my doctor. And no one else. Regardless of your
> opinions on "will power" and the drug companies, you have absolutely no
> say in this decision.
>
> --
> Doug Semler, MCPD
> a.a. #705, BAAWA. EAC Guardian of the Horn of the IPU (pbuhh).
> The answer is 42; DNRC o-
> Gur Hfrarg unf orpbzr fb shyy bs penc gurfr qnlf, abbar rira
> erpbtavmrf fvzcyr guvatf yvxr ebg13 nalzber. Fnq, vfa'g vg?

Yea, between you and your drug pusher/perscriber! You said it yourself you
don't go in to casinos that is will power. Same with smoking just don't suck
on the end of a cigarette. As for temporary side effects from a drug they
don't know what long terms side effects will be.

What's the difference Between A Drug Pusher and Drug Dealer, The Pusher has
an M.D. look at their portfolio and compare with prescriptions written.

[El Maximo]

"Viperdoc" > wrote in message
...
>I was waiting to see how long it would take for you to chime in with some
>stupid moronic comment.
>

Kinda like waiting for the sun to rise, isn't it?

It's a good thing the OP knows MX's history, otherwise he might be tempted
to follow his incorrect advice.

[Denny]

Chantix is a great drug.. It is not perfect.. I have had two patients
within the past week who reported back to me that they could not
handle the side effects... I am having them bust the low dose tab in
half, take it on a full stomach once a day, and see if they can build
a tolerance to the side effects so we can get their serum levels high
enough to allow them to stop smoking...

If you go through Pfizer's prescribing sheet, you can see that this
drug has a high rate of drop out due to GI side effects mainly, but
lots of other stuff too, so it is not a "yawn" situation... A serious
drug for a serious problem..

And yeah, I do not want to get into a big hoo haa over the 5HT sub
group bonding and a bunch of physiology crap... Look, I'm just a
brain dead country GP... I dunno what a 5-HT really is (I think it is
a part number for a 1954 Henry J - all you snot nosed kiddies can look
that up - I actually owned one), but it sure sounds cool when you say
it...

denny

[Robert M. Gary]

On Aug 23, 5:05 am, "Viperdoc" > wrote:
be ground tested to look for potential side effects.
>
> As an Air Force flight surgeon, I felt compelled to respond to yet another
> of your idiotic pronouncements. Why don't you go back to another forum where
> you perceive yourself an expert, like on breast feeding.

Another thing others may not have considered is that the affect of the
military giving a 25 year old a perk-up pill may not be the same as
the FAA approving it for 65 year old pilots. My father was a military
pilot and each and every drug he took was given to him by a flight
surgeon. The ability for the military to approve a given drug on a
person-by-person baises is not the same as the FAA approving it for
across-the-board use.

-Robert

[Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe]

"Robert M. Gary" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> On Aug 23, 5:05 am, "Viperdoc" > wrote:
> be ground tested to look for potential side effects.
>>
>> As an Air Force flight surgeon, I felt compelled to respond to yet
>> another
>> of your idiotic pronouncements. Why don't you go back to another forum
>> where
>> you perceive yourself an expert, like on breast feeding.
>
> Another thing others may not have considered is that the affect of the
> military giving a 25 year old a perk-up pill may not be the same as
> the FAA approving it for 65 year old pilots.
<...>

True. Us geezers in need of a "perk-up pill" would be more likely to turn
towards something like Viagra.

--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.

[Mxsmanic]

Robert M. Gary writes:

> Another thing others may not have considered is that the affect of the
> military giving a 25 year old a perk-up pill may not be the same as
> the FAA approving it for 65 year old pilots.

Why?

> My father was a military pilot and each and every drug he took
> was given to him by a flight surgeon.

The most widely abused drugs in the United States are those obtained by
prescription (excluding alcohol and nicotine).

[george]

On Aug 23, 10:02 am, (David Horne, _the_ chancellor
(*))
> He removed his testicles with a pair of tweezers once while playing
> flight sim. Does that count?

Wouldn't tweezers be overkill ?

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Robert M. Gary writes:
>
>> Another thing others may not have considered is that the affect of the
>> military giving a 25 year old a perk-up pill may not be the same as
>> the FAA approving it for 65 year old pilots.
>
> Why?
>
>> My father was a military pilot and each and every drug he took
>> was given to him by a flight surgeon.
>
> The most widely abused drugs in the United States are those obtained by
> prescription (excluding alcohol and nicotine).
>



As opposed to what bankruptcy boi?

Bertie

[Mxsmanic]

Bertie the Bunyip writes:

> As opposed to what bankruptcy boi?

As opposed to illicit drugs.

[El Maximo]

"bankruptcy boi" wrote in message
...
> Bertie the Bunyip writes:
>
>> As opposed to what bankruptcy boi?
>
> As opposed to illicit drugs.

At least he responds to his name.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Bertie the Bunyip writes:
>
>> As opposed to what bankruptcy boi?
>
> As opposed to illicit drugs.
>

Like you take, you mean?


Bertie

[george]

On Aug 26, 12:51 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> Mxsmanic > wrote :
>
> > Bertie the Bunyip writes:
>
> >> As opposed to what bankruptcy boi?
>
> > As opposed to illicit drugs.
>
> Like you take, you mean?

He has 16 pound of dope on his shoulders 24/7

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

george > wrote in
oups.com:

> On Aug 26, 12:51 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>> Mxsmanic > wrote
>> :
>>
>> > Bertie the Bunyip writes:
>>
>> >> As opposed to what bankruptcy boi?
>>
>> > As opposed to illicit drugs.
>>
>> Like you take, you mean?
>
> He has 16 pound of dope on his shoulders 24/7
>
>


True.

Bertie