Flying Tigers: Claire Chennault and all that

[Cubdriver]

HarperCollins has just published a revised, updated, and shortened (!)
edition of "Flying Tigers: Claire Chennault and His American
Volunteers, 1941-1942". Thanks in large part to people I met on this
newsgroup, it's a much improved version of what Smithsonian
Institution Press published in 1991 with a slightly different title. I
think particularly of Corey Jordan, who put me straight on the P-40s
flown by the AVG, and the late Erik Shilling, who tried (not always
with success) to put me straight about just about everything. They and
others are saluted in the preface, which you can read online at
www.FlyingTigersBook.com/preface.htm

"In this second edition of his 'revisionist' history masterpiece,
Daniel Ford tightens up the tale, corrects a few errors, and adds
dramatic new details." -- says JDR in an online review:
http://seacoastnh.com/The_Arts/Book_of_the_Week/Flying_Tigers

As always, Amazon.com has the best price on the book at $10.85. Check
it out at www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0061246557/annals or at the
Amazon sites for Canada, France, Germany, and Japan.

For a bit more money, you can get a signed copy. Point your browser at
www.FlyingTigersBook.com or send an email to usenet[AT]danford[DOT]net
(with the obvious changes).


Blue skies! -- Dan Ford

Claire Chennault and His American Volunteers, 1941-1942
new from HarperCollins www.FlyingTigersBook.com

[Jay Honeck]

> For a bit more money, you can get a signed copy. Point your browser atwww.FlyingTigersBook.comor send an email to usenet[AT]danford[DOT]net
> (with the obvious changes).

Dan, you've got amazing timing. Mary and I just returned home from
working all day on our upcoming "Flying Tigers Suite", which (although
it's gonna be one of our cheaper suites -- sans hot tub) is going to
be very nice.

We started with an absolute wreck of a suite -- it's our last one to
be remodeled, and had been occupied for the last two years by a
professor emeritus with a dog and a serious hygiene problem -- and
have built, entirely from scratch (I'm talking back to the studs), a
really nice, comfortable suite that will commemorate the AVG and their
Chinese allies...

Everything -- drywall, carpet, furniture, closet doors -- is brand
new. We're trying to make it look "oriental" while still being sturdy
enough to survive the real world of hotel guests -- no mean feat. (We
learned long ago that delicate, cool-looking chairs will NOT survive
daily use by the average-sized American, for example.) We've
acquired a nice collection of Flying Tigers artwork, and plan to spend
tomorrow hanging it all....

Sign me up for a copy of your book! We'll keep it in our 200+ volume
aviation library, for Flying Tigers aficianados to enjoy... (I'll
check out the website shortly...)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Dudley Henriques[_2_]]

Cubdriver wrote:
> HarperCollins has just published a revised, updated, and shortened (!)
> edition of "Flying Tigers: Claire Chennault and His American
> Volunteers, 1941-1942". Thanks in large part to people I met on this
> newsgroup, it's a much improved version of what Smithsonian
> Institution Press published in 1991 with a slightly different title. I
> think particularly of Corey Jordan, who put me straight on the P-40s
> flown by the AVG, and the late Erik Shilling, who tried (not always
> with success) to put me straight about just about everything. They and
> others are saluted in the preface, which you can read online at
> www.FlyingTigersBook.com/preface.htm
>

Hi Dan;

It was very good of you to say these things, especially about Erik. I'm
beginning to form a whole new picture of you. You just might in fact, if
it means anything to you, have discovered a new friend.
I would like to personally wish you the best of luck with your new book.
Dudley Henriques



--
Dudley Henriques

[Vanwall]

On Aug 22, 8:48 am, Cubdriver <usenet AT danford DOT net> wrote:
> HarperCollins has just published a revised, updated, and shortened (!)
> edition of "Flying Tigers: Claire Chennault and His American
> Volunteers, 1941-1942". Thanks in large part to people I met on this
> newsgroup, it's a much improved version of what Smithsonian
> Institution Press published in 1991 with a slightly different title. I
> think particularly of Corey Jordan, who put me straight on the P-40s
> flown by the AVG, and the late Erik Shilling, who tried (not always
> with success) to put me straight about just about everything. They and
> others are saluted in the preface, which you can read online atwww.FlyingTigersBook.com/preface.htm
>
> "In this second edition of his 'revisionist' history masterpiece,
> Daniel Ford tightens up the tale, corrects a few errors, and adds
> dramatic new details." -- says JDR in an online review:http://seacoastnh.com/The_Arts/Book_of_the_Week/Flying_Tigers
>
> As always, Amazon.com has the best price on the book at $10.85. Check
> it out atwww.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0061246557/annalsor at the
> Amazon sites for Canada, France, Germany, and Japan.
>
> For a bit more money, you can get a signed copy. Point your browser atwww.FlyingTigersBook.comor send an email to usenet[AT]danford[DOT]net
> (with the obvious changes).
>
> Blue skies! -- Dan Ford
>
> Claire Chennault and His American Volunteers, 1941-1942
> new from HarperCollinswww.FlyingTigersBook.com

Well done, Dan! A new book to add for me, goody. I well remember
meeting Mr. Shilling at an air show at Gillespie Field, and we talked
about this newsgroup, and the AVG, and yes, Dan Ford - Erik was a
character-and-a-half.

BCNU,
Rob

[Larry Dighera]

On Wed, 22 Aug 2007 11:48:31 -0400, Cubdriver <usenet AT danford DOT
net> wrote in >:

>HarperCollins has just published a revised, updated, and shortened (!)
>edition of "Flying Tigers: Claire Chennault and His American
>Volunteers, 1941-1942".

Congratulations. I wish you all the best.

It seems that there are several aviation authors among the readership
of rec.aviation.*.

Are you able to point me toward a resource, like a roster or other
documentation, that will shed any light on an individual Flying Tiger?
I used to work with a Zinsco salesman named Arnold Moselle who once
mentioned that he was a member of the Flying Tigers that flew the
hump. As I recall, the hump was the Himalaya Mountains. I guess not
all Flying Tigers flew P40s.

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN[_2_]]

Larry Dighera wrote:
> Are you able to point me toward a resource, like a roster or other
> documentation, that will shed any light on an individual Flying Tiger?
> I used to work with a Zinsco salesman named Arnold Moselle who once
> mentioned that he was a member of the Flying Tigers that flew the
> hump. As I recall, the hump was the Himalaya Mountains. I guess not
> all Flying Tigers flew P40s.


It's safe to say Moselle wasn't a member of the AVG. He could easily have been
a member of the 14th Air Force, which assumed the moniker of "Flying Tigers"
after the breakup of the AVG in 1942. And they did fly the Hump....

While I can easily find complete rosters for the AVG, the 14th Air Force is a
little more daunting. Too much for me, anyway.

Moselle should be somewhere between 80 and 90 years old today, assuming he's
still alive. Coincidentally, there was a B-17 pilot by that name but he flew in
the European theater of war.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

[Dudley Henriques[_2_]]

Larry Dighera wrote:
> On Wed, 22 Aug 2007 11:48:31 -0400, Cubdriver <usenet AT danford DOT
> net> wrote in >:
>
>> HarperCollins has just published a revised, updated, and shortened (!)
>> edition of "Flying Tigers: Claire Chennault and His American
>> Volunteers, 1941-1942".
>
> Congratulations. I wish you all the best.
>
> It seems that there are several aviation authors among the readership
> of rec.aviation.*.
>
> Are you able to point me toward a resource, like a roster or other
> documentation, that will shed any light on an individual Flying Tiger?
> I used to work with a Zinsco salesman named Arnold Moselle who once
> mentioned that he was a member of the Flying Tigers that flew the
> hump. As I recall, the hump was the Himalaya Mountains. I guess not
> all Flying Tigers flew P40s.

Arnold Moselle wasn't a member of the AVG, officer or enlisted.
Dudley Henriques

--
Dudley Henriques

[Larry Dighera]

On Thu, 23 Aug 2007 11:45:53 -0400, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
<mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
>:

>Larry Dighera wrote:
>> Are you able to point me toward a resource, like a roster or other
>> documentation, that will shed any light on an individual Flying Tiger?
>> I used to work with a Zinsco salesman named Arnold Moselle who once
>> mentioned that he was a member of the Flying Tigers that flew the
>> hump. As I recall, the hump was the Himalaya Mountains. I guess not
>> all Flying Tigers flew P40s.
>
>
>It's safe to say Moselle wasn't a member of the AVG.

Perhaps. But checking the AVG roster would enable conformation or
not. I don't find his name here:

http://www.warbirdforum.com/roster.htm
http://www.flyingtigersavg.com/camco.htm
http://www.flyingtigersvideo.com/roster.html
Flying Tigers were officially disbanded on July 4th, 1942...

>He could easily have been
>a member of the 14th Air Force, which assumed the moniker of "Flying Tigers"
>after the breakup of the AVG in 1942. And they did fly the Hump....

Thank you for that information. I wasn't aware of that. It might
explain his statement.

At the time, I had just earned my airmans certificate, and I wasn't at
all familiar with the Flying Tigers, so I didn't question his
statement. Now I'm still not sure whether Flying Tigers flew the hump
or not.

If this information is correct, it seems that the Air Transport
Command flew the hump:

http://www.u-s-history.com/pages/h1733.html
The Flying Tigers
The U.S. began to help the Chinese defend itself even before the
Pearl Harbor Attack. Lend-Lease aid began in April 1941, and in
June the Flying Tigers were sent to fly missions against the
Japanese.

In April 1942, pilots started flying the "Hump," and continued
missions until 1945, when the Burma Road was reopened. The
dangerous 530-mile long passage over the Himalayan Mountains took
its toll. Nearly 1,000 men and 600 Air Transport Command (ATC)
planes were lost over the hump by the end of China-Burma-India
Theater (CBI) operations. In addition, China National Aviation
Corporation (CNAC) lost 38 planes and 88 airmen.

>While I can easily find complete rosters for the AVG, the 14th Air Force is a
>little more daunting. Too much for me, anyway.

I did find a little history on 14th Air Force web site:

http://www.vandenberg.af.mil/library/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=4685
The Creation of the 14th Air Force

The China Air Task Force continued as the "Flying Tigers" under
the command of Brigadier General Chennault. After the China Air
Task Force was discontinued, the 14th Air Force (14 AF) was
established by the special order of President Roosevelt on 10
March 1943. Chennault was appointed the commander and promoted to
Major General. The "Flying Tigers" of 14 AF (who adopted the
"Flying Tigers" designation from the AVG) conducted highly
effective fighter and bomber operations along a wide front that
stretched from the bend of the Yellow River and Tsinan in the
north to Indochina in the south, from Chengtu and the Salween
River in the west to the China Sea and the island of Formosa in
the east. They were also instrumental in supplying Chinese forces
through the airlift of cargo across "The Hump" in the
China-Burma-India theater. By the end of World War II, 14 AF had
achieved air superiority over the skies of China and established a
ratio of 7.7 enemy planes destroyed for every American plane lost
in combat. Overall, military officials estimated that over 4,000
Japanese planes were destroyed or damaged in the China-Burma-India
theater during World War II. In addition, they estimated that air
units in China destroyed 1,100,000 tons of shipping, 1,079
locomotives, 4,836 trucks and 580 bridges. The United States Army
Air Corps credits 14 AF with the destruction of 2,315 Japanese
aircraft, 356 bridges, 1,225 locomotives and 712 railroad cars.

>Moselle should be somewhere between 80 and 90 years old today, assuming he's
>still alive.

Right. I have completely lost touch with him.

>Coincidentally, there was a B-17 pilot by that name but he flew in
>the European theater of war.

Yes. I saw that too, but I don't think that was him. He was
considerably under 6' tall. He was a prince of a fellow, and
knowledgeable too.

[Cubdriver]

On Wed, 22 Aug 2007 21:38:40 -0400, Dudley Henriques
> wrote:

>It was very good of you to say these things, especially about Erik

Though wary to the end, we actually got along fairly well once we took
the discussion off the internet. Erik did two huge favors for me.
First, he annotated a copy of the RAF pilot's manual for the P-40
Tomahawk, which I posted at www.warbirdforum.com/manual.htm (comments
beginning ES: are by him, and help document the likelihood that
Curtiss-Wright retrofitted the Tomahawks sent to China with fuel tanks
and other parts intended for an earlier model).

Second, he goaded me into taking flying lessons. ("Of course Ford is
not a pilot ....") Thanks to Erik, I was duly certificated at age 68,
and I'm now working on a scheme to get a little stick time in a P-40
:)

Blue skies! -- Dan Ford

Claire Chennault and His American Volunteers, 1941-1942
new from HarperCollins www.FlyingTigersBook.com

[Dudley Henriques[_2_]]

Cubdriver wrote:
> On Wed, 22 Aug 2007 21:38:40 -0400, Dudley Henriques
> > wrote:
>
>> It was very good of you to say these things, especially about Erik
>
> Though wary to the end, we actually got along fairly well once we took
> the discussion off the internet. Erik did two huge favors for me.
> First, he annotated a copy of the RAF pilot's manual for the P-40
> Tomahawk, which I posted at www.warbirdforum.com/manual.htm (comments
> beginning ES: are by him, and help document the likelihood that
> Curtiss-Wright retrofitted the Tomahawks sent to China with fuel tanks
> and other parts intended for an earlier model).
>
> Second, he goaded me into taking flying lessons. ("Of course Ford is
> not a pilot ....") Thanks to Erik, I was duly certificated at age 68,
> and I'm now working on a scheme to get a little stick time in a P-40
> :)
>
> Blue skies! -- Dan Ford
>
> Claire Chennault and His American Volunteers, 1941-1942
> new from HarperCollins www.FlyingTigersBook.com

Erik was indeed an unusual guy. Bea and I stopped out to see him on the
way to Garden Grove and visited with him for the day. At the time, he
was deeply involved in trying to get to the bottom of a situation out
there in California involving a character going around giving speeches
wearing all kinds of decorations saying he was a member of the AVG.
Erik was as mad as a hatter about it and was trying to enlist just about
everybody to help in exposing the "intruder". I think he got the Rossi's
involved and me as well. I made a few phone calls to contacts I had out
there and the last I heard, the guy was "exposed".
Erik was still flying. He and his son were flying a Steen Skybolt if I
remember right.
I brought Erik out an hour long tape Bob Scott had sent to me after his
wife died. Bob was feeling low one night and just set up a tape
recorder and talked into it for an hour reminiscing about everything
from Chennault and tactics to Wong Cook and the Panay sinking. I gave a
copy of the tape to Erik and I have the original. To my knowledge,
these are the only two copies in existence. I did make a CD that will go
to the Museum at Warner Robbins upon my death.
Good luck with your P40 exploits. Let me know how it goes. You did well
learning to fly at 68, and the Cub was a great choice.
Best,

--
Dudley Henriques

[Paul Tomblin]

In a previous article, Cubdriver <usenet AT danford DOT net> said:
>First, he annotated a copy of the RAF pilot's manual for the P-40
>Tomahawk, which I posted at www.warbirdforum.com/manual.htm (comments

http://www.warbirdforum.com/manual3.htm
"(iv) Radiator control adjusted to keep coolant temperature between 85°C
minimum and 12585°C maximum."

That's one jeezly hot radiator.


--
Paul Tomblin > http://blog.xcski.com/
There's this special biologist word we use for "stable". It's "dead".
-- Jack Cohen

[Cubdriver]

On Fri, 24 Aug 2007 15:09:59 +0000 (UTC),
(Paul Tomblin) wrote:

>http://www.warbirdforum.com/manual3.htm
>"(iv) Radiator control adjusted to keep coolant temperature between 85°C
>minimum and 12585°C maximum."
>
>That's one jeezly hot radiator.

Now fixed.

Thanks for heads-up!

Blue skies! -- Dan Ford

Claire Chennault and His American Volunteers, 1941-1942
new from HarperCollins www.FlyingTigersBook.com

[Jay Honeck]

> Thanks for heads-up!

Hey Dan, do me a favor and check my page here:

http://www.alexisparkinn.com/the_flying_tiger_suite.htm

I just threw that page of Flying Tigers history together, for the new
suite (first booking tonight!), and just want to make sure I got my
AVG facts straight.

Thanks!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"