Hiring a retrieve crew - thoughts? US

[Gary Emerson]

I'm pondering the notion of hiring someone to be a dedicated retrieve
crew for days when I'm planning on going XC. I was thinking maybe a HS
senior or perhaps college student.

Hourly rate would be paid and any expenses covered related to the task.
If I'm not headed too far out, they could hang at the gliderport, do
homework, whatever unless I landed out. If so, they'd use my vehicle to
come get me.

If I decided on a straight out flight, then they'd head out with the
trailer as soon as I left the local area on task.

The upside for them is that on a good day it's easy money with no real
work involved. On a long day it might be a late night getting home and
no guarantee on making the party that night.

I'm betting some on this group might also come up with some risks that I
haven't thought about in this situation. Some obvious things include
finding someone dependable and able to safely drive w/ the trailer.
There may be issues with car insurance that I'm not thinking about.
Maybe some additional issues with liability present too.

Let's not waste time discussing why I would prefer not to just depend on
other glider pilots at the club, but I'd really like thoughts on this
basic concept, particularly if you've got some legal basis or real world
experience that you can draw upon.

Thanks in advance,

Gary

[[email protected]]

Paid crew is excellent idea that used to be in vogue back in the
70's. Some pilots like Moffatt and Scott and the same paid crew for
years. Others were total jerks and went through multiple crews in a
season.

The economics strongly favor this over a motorglider for typical (non-
safari ops).

You can pay the crew a lot of $, eat like a king, stay in exellent
hotels and fly all over with the crew at your disposal for a few
decades in oder to equal the cost differential of a motorglider.

I would look for a retired individual who is bored and looking for
something to do. Most modern teen-agers and 20-somethings, especially
those who are urban-dwellers have little or no relevant skills,
mindset, or maturity. Farm- and rural kids would be a better. A
retired truck driver would be perfect.

The Crystal Squadron pilots would be an excellent resource for
procedures, training, and systems.

No clue on legal/liability issues but I speculate that a lawyer would
find the entire concept untenable from a liability/exposure
perspective.

[Mike Schumann]

From a legal perspective, it shouldn't be a problem as long as you deduct
and pay taxes (FICA, FUTA, SUTA, Income, etc...) from their paychecks and
have workmen's comp insurance for your employee. There are simplified
procedures for domestic employees, but you would need to check to see if
this would apply for this type of employment.

Mike Schumann

> wrote in message
ups.com...
> Paid crew is excellent idea that used to be in vogue back in the
> 70's. Some pilots like Moffatt and Scott and the same paid crew for
> years. Others were total jerks and went through multiple crews in a
> season.
>
> The economics strongly favor this over a motorglider for typical (non-
> safari ops).
>
> You can pay the crew a lot of $, eat like a king, stay in exellent
> hotels and fly all over with the crew at your disposal for a few
> decades in oder to equal the cost differential of a motorglider.
>
> I would look for a retired individual who is bored and looking for
> something to do. Most modern teen-agers and 20-somethings, especially
> those who are urban-dwellers have little or no relevant skills,
> mindset, or maturity. Farm- and rural kids would be a better. A
> retired truck driver would be perfect.
>
> The Crystal Squadron pilots would be an excellent resource for
> procedures, training, and systems.
>
> No clue on legal/liability issues but I speculate that a lawyer would
> find the entire concept untenable from a liability/exposure
> perspective.
>
>
>
>



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

[Papa3]

On Sep 4, 12:56 am, "Mike Schumann" <mike-nos...@traditions-
nospam.com> wrote:
> From a legal perspective, it shouldn't be a problem as long as you deduct
> and pay taxes (FICA, FUTA, SUTA, Income, etc...) from their paychecks and
> have workmen's comp insurance for your employee. There are simplified
> procedures for domestic employees, but you would need to check to see if
> this would apply for this type of employment.
>
> Mike Schumann
>
> > wrote in message
>
> ups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> > Paid crew is excellent idea that used to be in vogue back in the
> > 70's. Some pilots like Moffatt and Scott and the same paid crew for
> > years. Others were total jerks and went through multiple crews in a
> > season.
>
> > The economics strongly favor this over a motorglider for typical (non-
> > safari ops).
>
> > You can pay the crew a lot of $, eat like a king, stay in exellent
> > hotels and fly all over with the crew at your disposal for a few
> > decades in oder to equal the cost differential of a motorglider.
>
> > I would look for a retired individual who is bored and looking for
> > something to do. Most modern teen-agers and 20-somethings, especially
> > those who are urban-dwellers have little or no relevant skills,
> > mindset, or maturity. Farm- and rural kids would be a better. A
> > retired truck driver would be perfect.
>
> > The Crystal Squadron pilots would be an excellent resource for
> > procedures, training, and systems.
>
> > No clue on legal/liability issues but I speculate that a lawyer would
> > find the entire concept untenable from a liability/exposure
> > perspective.
>
> --
> Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Mike,

I would imagine that this would fall under the domain of Casual
Employees (if Gary requires more than 1,000 hours of crewing each
year, he's got other problems :-). Though Worker's Comp laws vary
from state to state, I'm not aware of any that would require a formal
Worker's Comp structure in this situation. In terms of liability,
it's along the same lines as hiring the neighborhood kid to mow your
lawn, no? I'm sure you could get any one of a number of legal
opinions on this depending on what you want the answer to be. Best
to make sure you've talked over the scenario with your insurance agent
first (think in terms of excess/umbrella policy).

Erik

[Mike Schumann]

I'm not sure either what the rules are. He should definitely check with his
insurance agent. Someone getting into a serious accident while driving your
car on a retrieve while he/she is being paid could definitely get messy if
things aren't setup correctly beforehand.

Mike Schumann

"Papa3" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> On Sep 4, 12:56 am, "Mike Schumann" <mike-nos...@traditions-
> nospam.com> wrote:
>> From a legal perspective, it shouldn't be a problem as long as you deduct
>> and pay taxes (FICA, FUTA, SUTA, Income, etc...) from their paychecks and
>> have workmen's comp insurance for your employee. There are simplified
>> procedures for domestic employees, but you would need to check to see if
>> this would apply for this type of employment.
>>
>> Mike Schumann
>>
>> > wrote in message
>>
>> ups.com...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > Paid crew is excellent idea that used to be in vogue back in the
>> > 70's. Some pilots like Moffatt and Scott and the same paid crew for
>> > years. Others were total jerks and went through multiple crews in a
>> > season.
>>
>> > The economics strongly favor this over a motorglider for typical (non-
>> > safari ops).
>>
>> > You can pay the crew a lot of $, eat like a king, stay in exellent
>> > hotels and fly all over with the crew at your disposal for a few
>> > decades in oder to equal the cost differential of a motorglider.
>>
>> > I would look for a retired individual who is bored and looking for
>> > something to do. Most modern teen-agers and 20-somethings, especially
>> > those who are urban-dwellers have little or no relevant skills,
>> > mindset, or maturity. Farm- and rural kids would be a better. A
>> > retired truck driver would be perfect.
>>
>> > The Crystal Squadron pilots would be an excellent resource for
>> > procedures, training, and systems.
>>
>> > No clue on legal/liability issues but I speculate that a lawyer would
>> > find the entire concept untenable from a liability/exposure
>> > perspective.
>>
>> --
>> Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com- Hide quoted
>> text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Mike,
>
> I would imagine that this would fall under the domain of Casual
> Employees (if Gary requires more than 1,000 hours of crewing each
> year, he's got other problems :-). Though Worker's Comp laws vary
> from state to state, I'm not aware of any that would require a formal
> Worker's Comp structure in this situation. In terms of liability,
> it's along the same lines as hiring the neighborhood kid to mow your
> lawn, no? I'm sure you could get any one of a number of legal
> opinions on this depending on what you want the answer to be. Best
> to make sure you've talked over the scenario with your insurance agent
> first (think in terms of excess/umbrella policy).
>
> Erik
>



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

[Papa3]

On Sep 4, 2:35 pm, Papa3 > wrote:
> On Sep 4, 12:56 am, "Mike Schumann" <mike-nos...@traditions-
>
>
>
>
>
> nospam.com> wrote:
> > From a legal perspective, it shouldn't be a problem as long as you deduct
> > and pay taxes (FICA, FUTA, SUTA, Income, etc...) from their paychecks and
> > have workmen's comp insurance for your employee. There are simplified
> > procedures for domestic employees, but you would need to check to see if
> > this would apply for this type of employment.
>
> > Mike Schumann
>
> > > wrote in message
>
> ups.com...
>
> > > Paid crew is excellent idea that used to be in vogue back in the
> > > 70's. Some pilots like Moffatt and Scott and the same paid crew for
> > > years. Others were total jerks and went through multiple crews in a
> > > season.
>
> > > The economics strongly favor this over a motorglider for typical (non-
> > > safari ops).
>
> > > You can pay the crew a lot of $, eat like a king, stay in exellent
> > > hotels and fly all over with the crew at your disposal for a few
> > > decades in oder to equal the cost differential of a motorglider.
>
> > > I would look for a retired individual who is bored and looking for
> > > something to do. Most modern teen-agers and 20-somethings, especially
> > > those who are urban-dwellers have little or no relevant skills,
> > > mindset, or maturity. Farm- and rural kids would be a better. A
> > > retired truck driver would be perfect.
>
> > > The Crystal Squadron pilots would be an excellent resource for
> > > procedures, training, and systems.
>
> > > No clue on legal/liability issues but I speculate that a lawyer would
> > > find the entire concept untenable from a liability/exposure
> > > perspective.
>
> > --
> > Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com-Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Mike,
>
> I would imagine that this would fall under the domain of Casual
> Employees (if Gary requires more than 1,000 hours of crewing each
> year, he's got other problems :-). Though Worker's Comp laws vary
> from state to state, I'm not aware of any that would require a formal
> Worker's Comp structure in this situation. In terms of liability,
> it's along the same lines as hiring the neighborhood kid to mow your
> lawn, no? I'm sure you could get any one of a number of legal
> opinions on this depending on what you want the answer to be. Best
> to make sure you've talked over the scenario with your insurance agent
> first (think in terms of excess/umbrella policy).
>
> Erik- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I was being a little too circumspect in the above and maybe it got
confusing. Worker's comp in most US states doesn't apply to Casual
Employees and, for that matter, to companies with fewer than X
employees (several I know of use 5 as the minumum). So, I was
suggesting that the real issue relates to any liability concerns.
There are two angles to this:

- Third-party liability related to injury or damage your crew may
cause to others while operating your vehicle. It gets a bit tricky
when you have a paid "employee" using your vehicle. The standard
Auto Policy that all major insurers use expressly prohibits certain
kinds of business use. This is a variation that I honestly
wouldn't want to offer an opinion on. Best is to describe the
scenario precisely to a good Agent (note: don't talk to the
"assistant" in the agency if you use one; talk right to the senior guy
or gal).
- Liability related to injuries (physical or emotional) your crew may
suffer on the job. "He landed out in bumblef*** Nevada and I was
scared for my life. Now, I can't go near a glider without breaking
out in hives :-)

In the past, I've always tried to keep anything like this as "casual"
as possible and rely on my judgement of the other person (i.e. will
this guy/gal sue my ass off). That's sort of a personal choice.

P3