water meters

[Roy Bourgeois]

Does anybody have experience with this product or similar?:

http://www.watersavers.com/docs/yardandgarden_wat.shtml

I am looking for an inexpensive and lightweight water meter to measure
ballast. Any suggestions?

Roy

[toad]

On Sep 5, 9:52 am, Roy Bourgeois >
wrote:
> Does anybody have experience with this product or similar?:
>
> http://www.watersavers.com/docs/yardandgarden_wat.shtml
>
> I am looking for an inexpensive and lightweight water meter to measure
> ballast. Any suggestions?
>
> Roy

Roy,

I have one of those meters, it works well but is not supper
accurate.

Todd Smith
3S

[01-- Zero One]

Yes, Roy, I have one of these. It is NOT accurate enough for
determining ballast. I use mine on the inlet of my rooftop waterbed
water carrier for making sure that I have loaded enough into the
waterbed before toting it all back to the glider to fill. It is
accurate enough for that but would not trust it beyond that.



Cumulus Soaring and Wings and Wheels both sell good ones.



HTH,



Larry

"zero one"





"Roy Bourgeois" > wrote in message
:

> Does anybody have experience with this product or similar?:
>
> http://www.watersavers.com/docs/yardandgarden_wat.shtml
>
> I am looking for an inexpensive and lightweight water meter to measure
> ballast. Any suggestions?
>
> Roy

[Paul Remde]

Hi Roy,

I have no idea whether the unit you mention is accurate.

However, I have received very positive feedback on the one I sell. I've sold
quite a lot of them. You can see details here:
http://www.cumulus-soaring.com/misc.htm#Water_Meter

Good Soaring,

Paul Remde
Cumulus Soaring, Inc.
http://www.cumulus-soaring.com

"Roy Bourgeois" > wrote in message
...
> Does anybody have experience with this product or similar?:
>
> http://www.watersavers.com/docs/yardandgarden_wat.shtml
>
> I am looking for an inexpensive and lightweight water meter to measure
> ballast. Any suggestions?
>
> Roy
>
>
>
>
>

[toad]

On Sep 5, 10:27 am, "01-- Zero One" > wrote:
> Yes, Roy, I have one of these. It is NOT accurate enough for
> determining ballast. I use mine on the inlet of my rooftop waterbed
> water carrier for making sure that I have loaded enough into the
> waterbed before toting it all back to the glider to fill. It is
> accurate enough for that but would not trust it beyond that.
>
> Cumulus Soaring and Wings and Wheels both sell good ones.
>
> HTH,
>
> Larry
>
> "zero one"

Larry,

How accurate does ballast need to be filled ? I have a Grob 102 and
my approach is fill completely, since it only holds about 220 lbs of
water. It also cross feeds when level so I don't worry about
perfectly symmetrical filling.

For other gliders, how much error is tolerable ?

Todd Smith
3S

[Roy Bourgeois]

Todd:
Use is for my Nimbus 3 that has 4 separate tanks and some roll performance
and structure considerations when using the inner vs. outer tanks. For
eastern conditions I normally load 14 gallons (100 liters) in each inner
tank and 7 gallons in the outer tanks. More weight out west - more weight
outboard when ridge flying. I am looking for a meter that is reasonably
accurate (+/- 5%) but doesn't weigh a ton ( I also fly a different N3 in
South Africa and would like to bring it with me).

Roy

[01-- Zero One]

Todd,



If you are filling completely then you don't need a water meter at all
do you? Just a standpipe to be sure that the water pressure is not
sufficient to burst the wings or tanks while filling.



I am more concerned that I maximize allowable for competition soaring.
Don't want the penalties. I can fill mine considerably beyond the
allowable if desired.



Larry

"zero one"






"toad" > wrote in message
ps.com:

> On Sep 5, 10:27 am, "01-- Zero One" > wrote:
> > Yes, Roy, I have one of these. It is NOT accurate enough for
> > determining ballast. I use mine on the inlet of my rooftop waterbed
> > water carrier for making sure that I have loaded enough into the
> > waterbed before toting it all back to the glider to fill. It is
> > accurate enough for that but would not trust it beyond that.
> >
> > Cumulus Soaring and Wings and Wheels both sell good ones.
> >
> > HTH,
> >
> > Larry
> >
> > "zero one"
>
> Larry,
>
> How accurate does ballast need to be filled ? I have a Grob 102 and
> my approach is fill completely, since it only holds about 220 lbs of
> water. It also cross feeds when level so I don't worry about
> perfectly symmetrical filling.
>
> For other gliders, how much error is tolerable ?
>
> Todd Smith
> 3S

[Papa3]

On Sep 5, 9:52 am, Roy Bourgeois >
wrote:
> Does anybody have experience with this product or similar?:
>
> http://www.watersavers.com/docs/yardandgarden_wat.shtml
>
> I am looking for an inexpensive and lightweight water meter to measure
> ballast. Any suggestions?
>
> Roy

Roy,

I use a model very similar to the one Paul is showing. Pluses:

- Accurate.
- Designed to work even with relatively low flow rates.
- Rugged.
- Simple

Minus
- A bit bulky and heavy (maybe 2-3 lbs).

I've seen several guys using a digital meter at contests. Though the
digital meters are pretty slick, I've adopted the KISS principle
lately on all of my supporting gear. I worry that the electronic
meters can have battery issues and that they may not be quite as
robust (mine tends to sit either in the cargo bin of the trailer with
tail dollies and towout gear or in the ballast box on top of the
roof).

Erik Mann
LS8-18 P3

[Udo]

On Sep 5, 9:52 am, Roy Bourgeois >
wrote:
> Does anybody have experience with this product or similar?:
>
> http://www.watersavers.com/docs/yardandgarden_wat.shtml
>
> I am looking for an inexpensive and lightweight water meter to measure
> ballast. Any suggestions?
>
> Roy

I bought water metres in 1999 in Bayreuth as I was crewing for the
Canadian team.
They are similar to Paul Remde's. They are very accurate.
I still use the one I bought for myself.
Udo

[Bob Kuykendall]

Earlier, Roy Bourgeois wrote:

> I am looking for an inexpensive and lightweight water
> meter to measure ballast. Any suggestions?

The last time I crewed a Nationals, we tried one of those cheapie
plastic hose meters like you get at a nursery or garden shop. It was
inaccurate to the point of uselessness. Then we bought a water utility
meter like the one between your house and the water main - basically
what Paul Remde sells. It was no cheaper than Paul's price and it took
us a couple days to find and obtain it. Were I to do it again I'd just
order whatever Paul or Tim sells and be done with it.

Bob K.

[mattm]

On Sep 5, 12:36 pm, Papa3 > wrote:
> On Sep 5, 9:52 am, Roy Bourgeois >
> wrote:
>
> > Does anybody have experience with this product or similar?:
>
> >http://www.watersavers.com/docs/yardandgarden_wat.shtml
>
> > I am looking for an inexpensive and lightweight water meter to measure
> > ballast. Any suggestions?
>
> > Roy
>
> Roy,
>
> I use a model very similar to the one Paul is showing. Pluses:
>
> - Accurate.
> - Designed to work even with relatively low flow rates.
> - Rugged.
> - Simple
>
> Minus
> - A bit bulky and heavy (maybe 2-3 lbs).
>
> I've seen several guys using a digital meter at contests. Though the
> digital meters are pretty slick, I've adopted the KISS principle
> lately on all of my supporting gear. I worry that the electronic
> meters can have battery issues and that they may not be quite as
> robust (mine tends to sit either in the cargo bin of the trailer with
> tail dollies and towout gear or in the ballast box on top of the
> roof).
>
> Erik Mann
> LS8-18 P3

Hey, nice article in this month's Soaring magazine, Erik! Good
timing!
-- Matt

[[email protected]]

On 5 sep, 19:25, Bob Kuykendall > wrote:
> Earlier, Roy Bourgeois wrote:
> > I am looking for an inexpensive and lightweight water
> > meter to measure ballast. Any suggestions?
>
> The last time I crewed a Nationals, we tried one of those cheapie
> plastic hose meters like you get at a nursery or garden shop. It was
> inaccurate to the point of uselessness. Then we bought a water utility
> meter like the one between your house and the water main - basically
> what Paul Remde sells. It was no cheaper than Paul's price and it took
> us a couple days to find and obtain it. Were I to do it again I'd just
> order whatever Paul or Tim sells and be done with it.
>
> Bob K.


Simplest thing is to fill out of 25 ltr cans and put stripes or marks
at each 10 liter level
Easyest way to measure how much you put in each wing

jhvdl

[Richard[_1_]]

On Sep 5, 7:17 am, toad > wrote:
> On Sep 5, 9:52 am, Roy Bourgeois >
> wrote:
>
> > Does anybody have experience with this product or similar?:
>
> >http://www.watersavers.com/docs/yardandgarden_wat.shtml
>
> > I am looking for an inexpensive and lightweight water meter to measure
> > ballast. Any suggestions?
>
> > Roy
>
> Roy,
>
> I have one of those meters, it works well but is not supper
> accurate.
>
> Todd Smith
> 3S

Todd,

I have been selling the inline water meter for 4 years. I use it to
fill my ventus b with 20 gallons. It is very accurate and balances
the wings perfectly.

http://www.craggyaero.com/watermeter.htm

Please check Craggy Aero prices before you buy.

Thanks,


Richard
www.craggyaero.com

[Chip Bearden]

My water meter is identical to those installed on a house (I bought it
from a couple of city water contractors in Littlefield, TX) and seems
to be very accurate based on the scales at U.S. nationals. I also
plumbed it in line with one of the plastic meters this summer at Hobbs
with good agreement.

I formerly used 5 gal. water cans but got tired of hauling them
around, lifting them in and out of the van, pouring from them, etc.
Years later, I went to a homemade tire innertube carrier similar to
P3's. If I kept it in a cartop luggage carrier like he does, I might
still use it but mine rolled off the roof turning into my assembly
area one morning. It was comical getting enough people to sit on it to
create sufficient pressure to get water through the hose. Finally,
after we'd partially emptied it, the ungainly thing was light enough
for a bunch of us to lift it into the bed of someone's pickup truck so
I could finish filling. This one developed cracks over the years,
probably from the UV exposure, as did the one I replace it with.

More recently I just hook up to spigot with a long garden hose, a
standpipe (to limit pressure), the aforementioned water meter, and a
hose plugged into the main dump port of the glider (which connects to
both tanks). It's very simple to fill any amount up to maximum
allowable so long as I can get the glider to the spigot.

Chip Bearden
ASW 24 "JB"
USA

[01-- Zero One]

" > wrote in message
ups.com:

> On 5 sep, 19:25, Bob Kuykendall > wrote:
> > Earlier, Roy Bourgeois wrote:
> > > I am looking for an inexpensive and lightweight water
> > > meter to measure ballast. Any suggestions?
> >
> > The last time I crewed a Nationals, we tried one of those cheapie
> > plastic hose meters like you get at a nursery or garden shop. It was
> > inaccurate to the point of uselessness. Then we bought a water utility
> > meter like the one between your house and the water main - basically
> > what Paul Remde sells. It was no cheaper than Paul's price and it took
> > us a couple days to find and obtain it. Were I to do it again I'd just
> > order whatever Paul or Tim sells and be done with it.
> >
> > Bob K.
>
>
> Simplest thing is to fill out of 25 ltr cans and put stripes or marks
> at each 10 liter level
> Easyest way to measure how much you put in each wing
>
> jhvdl







I am not so sure about that being the simplest... To me the only thing
"simple" about it is that you don't have to buy a water meter. With
your system, you have to tote several of the cans, or make multiple
trips, come up with a plan for carrying them in your vehicle, tend to
the filling constantly by holding the cans and pouring into a funnel,
etc., or rigging some other Rube Goldberg apparatus. A simple rooftop
bladder, valve, and meter (with optional standpipe, if needed) is all
that you need for accurate and EASY filling. The bladder and everything
collapses into a small box in the front of the trailer.



My $0.02



Larry

"zero one"

[toad]

Richard,

That's a good meter, and if I needed an accurate meter, I would get
one. I guess that I was curious how accurate the water measurement
needs to be. Within 1 pound, 10 pounds, 1/10 ?

For weight I think within 10 pounds total might be good enough, but I
wouldn't want one wing 10 pounds heavier than the other, so I guess
that within 1 pound error per wing would be OK ?


For me in my G102, I just fill the wing tanks full.
Todd

[JS]

The digital meters that are available from your soaring supplier are
great.
Suggested mod: Put additional foam over the battery so it doesn't
slip away from the terminals if
- sorry -
WHEN you drop the meter.
Jim

[Tim Mara]

I offer several electronic and mechanical meters, all seem to be widely
accepted. I've also tried the cheap garden hose variety and find these to be
pretty inaccurate.... see http://www.wingsandwheels.com/page45.htm for
available types
The best and cheapest and most accurate method is however to simply fill
the tanks and then dump into a 5 Gal bucket (as much as you don't
want)....works great for 304CZ owners, would be fine with most other gliders
and is especially easy with those with separate wing tanks and dumps below
each wing
tim
Please visit the Wings & Wheels website at www.wingsandwheels.com