To Pawnee or not to Pawnee...that is the question...

[Travis Beach]

Our club has a Piper Pawnee 235hp in excellent condition.
We just spent $35000 five years ago to completely overhaul
her...new fabric, new engine, anything that needed
to be replaced was...

Heres the rub...we are in the middle of a new two place
acquisition with the club making a decision about getting
a new two place intermediate performance. We were about
to drop the hammer when a very vocal minority raised
the issue of PAWNEE needing to be replaced citing extreme
maintenance cost (???) and inability to get parts.
He/She cited the local aero repair facility as his/her
source of information...Many of us just dont see this
as a problem. The replacement that was cited was a
Husky 180HP...I just dont see the reasoning of such
a switch...I surely would rather two a heavier two
place with a proven performer with 235 hp vs a 180...

What say you? Discuss...should we scrap the Pawnee
in favor of a Husky?

Beach

[Tim Taylor]

On Oct 15, 4:16 pm, Travis Beach >
wrote:
> Our club has a Piper Pawnee 235hp in excellent condition.
> We just spent $35000 five years ago to completely overhaul
> her...new fabric, new engine, anything that needed
> to be replaced was...
>
> Heres the rub...we are in the middle of a new two place
> acquisition with the club making a decision about getting
> a new two place intermediate performance. We were about
> to drop the hammer when a very vocal minority raised
> the issue of PAWNEE needing to be replaced citing extreme
> maintenance cost (???) and inability to get parts.
> He/She cited the local aero repair facility as his/her
> source of information...Many of us just dont see this
> as a problem. The replacement that was cited was a
> Husky 180HP...I just dont see the reasoning of such
> a switch...I surely would rather two a heavier two
> place with a proven performer with 235 hp vs a 180...
>
> What say you? Discuss...should we scrap the Pawnee
> in favor of a Husky?
>
> Beach

hmmm, lets see; cost of interest or lost income from the cash on a
120K Husky plus maintenance vs keeping a paid for 35K Pawnee flying.
Not hard for me to calculate:

1. Keep the Pawnee
2. Buy the two place
3. Add a winch to the operation and move toward a real sustainable
future.

[Bill Daniels]

I'll save a suggestion 'til last.

First, I've recently towed behind both a 180HP Husky and a 235 Pawnee at
Salida, CO where the density altitude was over 10,000 feet. Both tugs did
fine. In fact, I didn't see much difference.

For the Pawnee: It's a known quantity. There's plenty of experience around
both maintaining it and flying it. Against the Pawnee: It's old, thirsty
and it's a single seat which means using another airplane for tuggie
training.

For the Husky, it's available new, uses less fuel and it's a two seater -
and now it's available with 200HP. Against: It's expensive since it's new.

The fuel cost issue is becoming a real one. According to AirNav, the
average price for 100LL is now $4.61/gal with a maximum of $7.61. By next
summer it is likely to be more than $5/gal average.

My advice is keep the old Pawnee but minimize its use to save operating cost
and extend its life - and get a winch for training and joyrides.

Bill Daniels


"Travis Beach" > wrote in message
...
> Our club has a Piper Pawnee 235hp in excellent condition.
> We just spent $35000 five years ago to completely overhaul
> her...new fabric, new engine, anything that needed
> to be replaced was...
>
> Heres the rub...we are in the middle of a new two place
> acquisition with the club making a decision about getting
> a new two place intermediate performance. We were about
> to drop the hammer when a very vocal minority raised
> the issue of PAWNEE needing to be replaced citing extreme
> maintenance cost (???) and inability to get parts.
> He/She cited the local aero repair facility as his/her
> source of information...Many of us just dont see this
> as a problem. The replacement that was cited was a
> Husky 180HP...I just dont see the reasoning of such
> a switch...I surely would rather two a heavier two
> place with a proven performer with 235 hp vs a 180...
>
> What say you? Discuss...should we scrap the Pawnee
> in favor of a Husky?
>
> Beach
>
>
>

[bagmaker]

The Pawnee is a tough bird, frame-wise, making it ideal for towing and off-feild retreives.

There are alternatives to lycoming powered Pawnee, in Australia they are trialling LS-1 Chev V8 engine power, prop drives through a belt reduction.

Downside- its experimental
Upside - no cooling issues, cheaper fuel, cheaper spares, cheaper engine rebuilds, faster climb rate, shorter take-off distance, quieter operation, etc, see also

http://www.gfa.org.au/airworth/engines.php

If more clubs took the punt on such an engine, it would be a simpler thing to get certified!

bagger

[Martin Gregorie[_1_]]

bagmaker wrote:
> The Pawnee is a tough bird, frame-wise, making it ideal for towing and
> off-feild retreives.
>
> There are alternatives to lycoming powered Pawnee, in Australia they
> are trialling LS-1 Chev V8 engine power, prop drives through a belt
> reduction.
>
> Downside- its experimental
> Upside - no cooling issues, cheaper fuel, cheaper spares, cheaper
> engine rebuilds, faster climb rate, shorter take-off distance, quieter
> operation, etc, see also
>
> http://www.gfa.org.au/airworth/engines.php
>
> If more clubs took the punt on such an engine, it would be a simpler
> thing to get certified!
>
The Swedes did a similar thing with a 225 hp Volvo V8 and claimed that
they got the liquid cooling advantage (no shock cooling, so faster
turnround) as well as hugely reduced fuel and engine maintenance costs.

I remember seeing a report in S&G and a search for "Pawnee Volvo engine"
will turn up online references.


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |