Alarus for training?

[Gig 601XL Builder]

Scott wrote:
> What do we think of an Alarus CH2000 as a primary trainer and as a
> weekend flyer? I've run into a possible opportunity to buy a used
> CH2000 for possibly well under market value (at auction, so it really
> depends on where the bidding goes). I also have a couple of guys who
> might be interested in partnering on it (one a returning student, the
> other a retired bizjet pilot).
>
> I'm a zero-hour student, currently working through ground school.
> I've been thinking about maybe buying a PA-28-140 next year to train
> in and for general flying later, but if the Alarus is a decent plane
> and I can get a deal on it...? Can anyone give me more reasons to
> think yea or nay?
>
> -Scott

Great plane. I have a couple of hours in one.

Just make sure that it isn't this one.

N652AM, S/N 20-1022

It was recently reported stolen.

[Scott[_5_]]

What do we think of an Alarus CH2000 as a primary trainer and as a weekend
flyer? I've run into a possible opportunity to buy a used CH2000 for
possibly well under market value (at auction, so it really depends on where
the bidding goes). I also have a couple of guys who might be interested in
partnering on it (one a returning student, the other a retired bizjet
pilot).

I'm a zero-hour student, currently working through ground school. I've been
thinking about maybe buying a PA-28-140 next year to train in and for
general flying later, but if the Alarus is a decent plane and I can get a
deal on it...? Can anyone give me more reasons to think yea or nay?

-Scott

[Paul Tomblin]

In a previous article, (Scott) said:
>What do we think of an Alarus CH2000 as a primary trainer and as a weekend
>flyer? I've run into a possible opportunity to buy a used CH2000 for

It looks like a Zenith Zodiac. Are they related?


--
Paul Tomblin > http://blog.xcski.com/
Here at WeSellCellPhones, I was pleased to hear that they believe in
"work-life balance." What it turned out this actually means is that your work
is your life, and is by definition balanced... -- JDF

[Gig 601XL Builder]

Paul Tomblin wrote:
> In a previous article, (Scott) said:
>> What do we think of an Alarus CH2000 as a primary trainer and as a
>> weekend flyer? I've run into a possible opportunity to buy a used
>> CH2000 for
>
> It looks like a Zenith Zodiac. Are they related?

Yep, the Zenith 640 is close to a CH2000. The CH is Chris Heintz

[buttman]

On Oct 30, 8:41 am, "Gig 601XL Builder" <wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net>
wrote:
> Scott wrote:
> > What do we think of an Alarus CH2000 as a primary trainer and as a
> > weekend flyer? I've run into a possible opportunity to buy a used
> > CH2000 for possibly well under market value (at auction, so it really
> > depends on where the bidding goes). I also have a couple of guys who
> > might be interested in partnering on it (one a returning student, the
> > other a retired bizjet pilot).
>
> > I'm a zero-hour student, currently working through ground school.
> > I've been thinking about maybe buying a PA-28-140 next year to train
> > in and for general flying later, but if the Alarus is a decent plane
> > and I can get a deal on it...? Can anyone give me more reasons to
> > think yea or nay?
>
> > -Scott
>
> Great plane. I have a couple of hours in one.
>
> Just make sure that it isn't this one.
>
> N652AM, S/N 20-1022
>
> It was recently reported stolen.

Who on earth would steal an Alarus?

I've got about 200 hours in a CH2000. The flight school I work at has
about10 of them we use for instrument and primary instruction. People
always talk poorly of them, but honestly, we put probably 6000 hours
on all our planes annually, and in the 3 years we have operated them,
not a single serious incident has ever occurred. We've had alternator
belts snap, and things like that, but nothing major.

There are a bunch of little things about the plane that make it very
uncomfortable. Some of them (actually all of them to an extent)
vibrate very badly in flight. I think it's because of how the engine
is mounted onto the frame. If you bring power back, the vibration
stops, but in cruise flight, it can be very annoying. When I do long
flights in it, I sometimes have to rest my feet onto the rudder pedals
instead of the floor because the pedals give a little vibration
dampening, but not much.

It has a hard time starting. While you crank it, it makes all kinds of
weird burping sounds. Some people have more trouble with it than
others. I've actually only had one not start on me once. We cranked
and primed, and pumped the throttle until the battery died. I think
it's much more of a problem in the winter than when it's warmer.

They suck for winter flying too. There is a Canadian AD (or at least
that what I've heard) that orders the heater to be disconnected
because of a carbon monoxide problem. That is sort of a bad thing in
the summer because the heater tends to leak big time into the cabin.
Now that it's getting colder, it would be nice to have some heat, but
they are all still disconnected.

The seats are very hard. After an hour or so, your butt will hurt.
Theres an examiner who does checkrides around here who always brings
with her a seat cushion. In the morning when the plane is cold, I
swear you can knock on the cushioning on the seat and it'll be like
knocking on wood.

The doors are really crappy. They are made of a plastic it seems. All
thats holding them onto the plane is a little hinge, which has a
tendency to snap off if stressed. (Search the NTSB records for
N285AM). As a result, you can't have the door open while the engine is
running, or it will put stress on that hinge and you'll risk having
the door blow off in flight. In the summertime, you REALLY REALLY
don't want to have to taxi one of these with the door closed either.
All you have for air circulation is a little tine air scoop vent in
the window, and two little vents between the seats. In 90F+ heat,
thats not enough. You'll sweat like crazy.

Also, one more thing about the doors. Because of the tiny hinge at the
top, the doors don't fit very well onto the plane. When you close the
door, there is always a big gap along the side of the door which
allows a draft to come in. Nice in the summer, but terrible in the
winter.

Now for the good: The instruments are very nice. The vacuum system
could be a little beefier, but the rest are pretty nice. All our
planes have GNS430's, which are pretty nice. Short field performance
is nice too. When you put full flaps in, that plane drops like a rock.
You'll never have to do a go-around due to being too high on final
ever again. If you put in full flaps and idle the power, you'll drop
at about 2500 fpm at around 60 knots, I kid you not. you can be
3000AGL on a 2 mile final, and still land on a 1000 foot runway. The
brakes are really good too. You can stand on them, and they won't lock
up and skid like a Cessna.

Don't expect to go any higher than 9000 feet, because it won't climb
any higher. on a IFR flight a while ago, ATC cleared me up to 9000
feet and it took me about 30 minutes to get up that high. Once we got
there, it was difficult to keep the altitude as well. My student would
let it go down to 8700, then we full throttled it at Vy, and it was
showing 100 fpm.

Would I buy one? Eh, I'd consider it. If the price was right, I would.
But I'd get a 152 instead, even if it cost a bit more. But I already
have all my ratings. If you're wanting it just to do training, go for
it, it'll be a deal. After you get all your training done, you're
probably going to want to get rid of it though, since it's not very
enjoyable to ride in.

[Robert M. Gary]

On Oct 30, 9:13 am, (Scott) wrote:
> What do we think of an Alarus CH2000 as a primary trainer and as a weekend
> flyer? I've run into a possible opportunity to buy a used CH2000 for
> possibly well under market value (at auction, so it really depends on where
> the bidding goes). I also have a couple of guys who might be interested in
> partnering on it (one a returning student, the other a retired bizjet
> pilot).
>
> I'm a zero-hour student, currently working through ground school. I've been
> thinking about maybe buying a PA-28-140 next year to train in and for
> general flying later, but if the Alarus is a decent plane and I can get a
> deal on it...? Can anyone give me more reasons to think yea or nay?
>
> -Scott

I seriously doubt you will get the aircraft for below market price at
an open auction. You may get it cheep, which may be exactly what it is
worth. There really are no "great deals" on aircraft. Planes sell for
what they are worth and no one is going to sell you a plane for less
than the guy next to you is willing to pay for it.

-Robert

[RH[_1_]]

I just bought a 2002 Alarus two weeks ago to lease back to my local
flight school, it has an amazing avionics package (garmin 430, garmin
audio panel, garmin digital transponder, and would you believe a
SANDEL EHSI??), it only has 800 TTSN and I think I got a great deal.
I had never flown one before, I took it around the patch with the
dealer a few times, and then flew it home to KRDG from KFXE. That
trip was about 11 hours, groundspeeds varied from 72 knots to 118
knots during the trip. From a training standpoint it is a fantastic
machine, utilitarian in design but well mannered in flight.
>From a mechanical standpoint you cant get much simpler. The engine is
the tried and proven Lycoming O235, good for 2400 hours TBO. It
delivers an honest 5.5 - 6.0 gallons per hour fuel burn.
So far it is being well received at the flight school, it is now the
newest, best equipped, and least expensive airplane on the flight line
at $89.00 per hour. The cockpit is wider than the C172's that the
students have been training in. If you can get past its frumpy look
you will find a comfortable and honest airplane. I think it is a
perfect trainer and sport tourer.

Richard

[Scott[_5_]]

On Tue, 30 Oct 2007 18:39:18 -0000, in rec.aviation.owning, buttman
> wrote:

>Don't expect to go any higher than 9000 feet, because it won't climb
>any higher. on a IFR flight a while ago, ATC cleared me up to 9000
>feet and it took me about 30 minutes to get up that high. Once we got
>there, it was difficult to keep the altitude as well. My student would
>let it go down to 8700, then we full throttled it at Vy, and it was
>showing 100 fpm.

Mmm...that could be interesting. My home fields are around 4,300 with DAs
up to 7,500 in the summer, and mountains up to 12,000 in almost every
direction. Very interesting. Maybe that's why the flight school is
liquidating them.

>Would I buy one? Eh, I'd consider it. If the price was right, I would.
>But I'd get a 152 instead, even if it cost a bit more. But I already
>have all my ratings. If you're wanting it just to do training, go for
>it, it'll be a deal. After you get all your training done, you're
>probably going to want to get rid of it though, since it's not very
>enjoyable to ride in.

That sounds like a fair assessment. The Alarus was not my first choice, but
if I am offered a deal that I cannot refuse....

-Scott

[Scott[_5_]]

On Tue, 30 Oct 2007 23:32:37 -0000, in rec.aviation.owning, "Robert M. Gary"
> wrote:

>I seriously doubt you will get the aircraft for below market price at
>an open auction. You may get it cheep, which may be exactly what it is
>worth. There really are no "great deals" on aircraft. Planes sell for
>what they are worth and no one is going to sell you a plane for less
>than the guy next to you is willing to pay for it.

I know. There's an element of wishful thinking: it's possible, however
unlikely, that everyone else at the auction could be cheaper and/or dumber
than I am. Yes, very unlikely.

Frankly I'm not exactly sure what a fair market value would be. I see
CH2000s listed for around 60-70k, but I often hear that actual sale prices
tend towards 70-80% of the asking price. It's also possible that these
airplanes will sell below market, but still beyond my budget. I don't know.
This is the first time I've really thought about actually buying an airplane
(as opposed to thinking about buying one in theory), and it's my first
airplane auction. There's sure to be a *lot* of education waiting for me
there.

-Scott

[Scott[_5_]]

On Tue, 30 Oct 2007 17:10:18 -0700, in rec.aviation.owning, RH
> wrote:

>I just bought a 2002 Alarus two weeks ago to lease back to my local
>flight school, it has an amazing avionics package (garmin 430, garmin
>audio panel, garmin digital transponder, and would you believe a
>SANDEL EHSI??), it only has 800 TTSN and I think I got a great deal.

If I may ask, how much did you pay?

-Scott

[Tom C]

"Scott" > wrote in message
news:4727522c.154908276@localhost...
> What do we think of an Alarus CH2000 as a primary trainer and as a weekend
> flyer? I've run into a possible opportunity to buy a used CH2000 for
> possibly well under market value (at auction, so it really depends on
> where
> the bidding goes). I also have a couple of guys who might be interested
> in
> partnering on it (one a returning student, the other a retired bizjet
> pilot).
>
> I'm a zero-hour student, currently working through ground school. I've
> been
> thinking about maybe buying a PA-28-140 next year to train in and for
> general flying later, but if the Alarus is a decent plane and I can get a
> deal on it...? Can anyone give me more reasons to think yea or nay?
>
> -Scott

I flew one once out of HND. It did not do well in high density altitude. I
just signed papers on an older Cherokee 140/150.
It's a decent two person plane (even if it does have back seats). You should
be able to find one with a good panel
and more horse power than the Alarus with parts that fit together like they
should for far less money. 80 ponies in high elevation isn't the
best bet.

Tom C

[Lou]

I'm happy that the OP started this post. I was considering looking
for one of these. However, for the same cost of buying one, I could
build the 640 4 seater. Which is probebly the way to go.
Lou