FW: Article "DHS Wants GA Aircraft Screened Before Flights To U.S."

[Jon]

Just got this today in e-mail, forwarded from an Aviation Daily piece.
I imagine this should **** of a few people.


==========================

DHS Wants GA Aircraft Screened Before Flights To U.S.

The Dept. of Homeland Security plans to extend the security
requirements now applicable to Part 135 charter operators to a wider
range of general aviation operators and also wants GA aircraft and
passengers flying into the U.S. to undergo security screening before
takeoff, DHS Secretary Michael Chertoff said Monday.

Appearing at an Aviation Business Roundtable sponsored by the National
Air Transportation Association, Chertoff told the gathering of about
60 executives from charter, FBO and fuel companies that charter and
private aircraft flights are becoming cheaper and available to more
people. To ensure that these airplanes do not become weapons for
terrorists, Chertoff said DHS believes it is necessary to add multiple
layers of security to GA operations similar to those imposed on
scheduled airlines.

The additional security requirements being considered are designed to
help prevent the possible use of GA aircraft to carry terrorists or
other criminals into the U.S.; to transport dangerous goods or weapons
into this country; or as weapons themselves in the way that the Sept.
11 hijackers used airliners to strike targets in New York and
Washington.

Chertoff said there needs to be an "appropriate level of vetting" of
crewmembers, passengers and the material on board general aviation
aircraft flying into the U.S. from abroad. U.S. Customs and Border
Protection (CBP) previously issued a notice of proposed rulemaking to
require electronic transmission by GA operators of flight and manifest
information at least one hour prior to taking off for a flight into or
out of the U.S. under the Advance Passenger Information System
(eAPIS). The eAPIS system is currently used by scheduled airlines and
charter operators.

The Transportation Security Administration also wants to establish a
"Large Aircraft Security Program" for GA operators, including
corporate and private operations, "to make them consistent with
existing security programs for commercial aircraft of similar size,"
according to a statement issued Monday. Chertoff said DHS also wants
aircraft and their occupants to be physically inspected overseas
before embarking on flights to the U.S. Chertoff added that DHS has
already embarked on a partnership with fixed-base operator Signature
Flight Support on a pilot program from several locations that will
"serve as a last point of departure into the United States." DHS
wants to have that program operating from Signature FBOs in Shannon,
Ireland and Anchorage, Alaska by the end of the year, the department
said.

[Robert M. Gary]

On Nov 6, 9:14 am, Jon > wrote:
> Just got this today in e-mail, forwarded from an Aviation Daily piece.
> I imagine this should **** of a few people.
>
> ==========================
>
> DHS Wants GA Aircraft Screened Before Flights To U.S.

Perhaps they can make an exception if the pilot personally has known
the passenger for more than 10 years.

-Robert

[Mxsmanic]

This illustrates that people who are incompetent in security will spend most
of their time addressing the minority of risks that they think they
understand, while ignoring all the risks that they do not understand (or
perceive). Unfortunately, the bad guys are rarely using the same playbook,
and indeed, they tend to observe security measures and then attack in areas
that have not been subjected to them.

Put another way, the DHS is trying to protect against things that will never
happen, because it only understands things that have already happened, and
incorrectly assumes that the future will resemble the past, even though the
bad guys usually know better than to try the same trick twice.

[NW_Pilot]

"Jon" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> Just got this today in e-mail, forwarded from an Aviation Daily piece.
> I imagine this should **** of a few people.
>
>
> ==========================
>
> DHS Wants GA Aircraft Screened Before Flights To U.S.
>
> The Dept. of Homeland Security plans to extend the security
> requirements now applicable to Part 135 charter operators to a wider
> range of general aviation operators and also wants GA aircraft and
> passengers flying into the U.S. to undergo security screening before
> takeoff, DHS Secretary Michael Chertoff said Monday.
>
> Appearing at an Aviation Business Roundtable sponsored by the National
> Air Transportation Association, Chertoff told the gathering of about
> 60 executives from charter, FBO and fuel companies that charter and
> private aircraft flights are becoming cheaper and available to more
> people. To ensure that these airplanes do not become weapons for
> terrorists, Chertoff said DHS believes it is necessary to add multiple
> layers of security to GA operations similar to those imposed on
> scheduled airlines.
>
> The additional security requirements being considered are designed to
> help prevent the possible use of GA aircraft to carry terrorists or
> other criminals into the U.S.; to transport dangerous goods or weapons
> into this country; or as weapons themselves in the way that the Sept.
> 11 hijackers used airliners to strike targets in New York and
> Washington.
>
> Chertoff said there needs to be an "appropriate level of vetting" of
> crewmembers, passengers and the material on board general aviation
> aircraft flying into the U.S. from abroad. U.S. Customs and Border
> Protection (CBP) previously issued a notice of proposed rulemaking to
> require electronic transmission by GA operators of flight and manifest
> information at least one hour prior to taking off for a flight into or
> out of the U.S. under the Advance Passenger Information System
> (eAPIS). The eAPIS system is currently used by scheduled airlines and
> charter operators.
>
> The Transportation Security Administration also wants to establish a
> "Large Aircraft Security Program" for GA operators, including
> corporate and private operations, "to make them consistent with
> existing security programs for commercial aircraft of similar size,"
> according to a statement issued Monday. Chertoff said DHS also wants
> aircraft and their occupants to be physically inspected overseas
> before embarking on flights to the U.S. Chertoff added that DHS has
> already embarked on a partnership with fixed-base operator Signature
> Flight Support on a pilot program from several locations that will
> "serve as a last point of departure into the United States." DHS
> wants to have that program operating from Signature FBOs in Shannon,
> Ireland and Anchorage, Alaska by the end of the year, the department
> said.

Yea, Control our so called freedom of movement just a little more.

[Gig 601XL Builder]

NW_Pilot wrote:
>
> Yea, Control our so called freedom of movement just a little more.

While I appreciate your paranoia please keep in mind that there hasn't
legal, unimpaired freedom of movement over the border into the US in well
over 100 years. And there is nothing in the constitution that should make
you think there is such a right.

But it is well within your rights trim your posts when you are going to
follow up a long post with one sentence.

[C J Campbell[_1_]]

On 2007-11-06 09:14:28 -0800, Jon > said:

> Just got this today in e-mail, forwarded from an Aviation Daily piece.
> I imagine this should **** of a few people.
>
>
> ==========================
>
> DHS Wants GA Aircraft Screened Before Flights To U.S.
>
> The Dept. of Homeland Security plans to extend the security
> requirements now applicable to Part 135 charter operators to a wider
> range of general aviation operators and also wants GA aircraft and
> passengers flying into the U.S. to undergo security screening before
> takeoff, DHS Secretary Michael Chertoff said Monday.

That would be a good trick. How would you do it? Say you are in Mexico
at some airport which does not even have a phone, let alone Internet
access. Currently you can take off and call Customs as long as you give
Customs notice 60 minutes before crossing the border. Now, they want a
security screen of your passengers before you even take off? How do you
do that?

This is going to kill a lot of humanitarian programs in Mexico that
depend on volunteer pilots. The earlier Customs proposal was completely
unworkable, now this.

What kind of fantasy world to these people live in?

Last I looked, Alaska was part of the United States of America. How
come these guys want to screen flights from Alaska?

--
Waddling Eagle
World Famous Flight Instructor

[NW_Pilot]

"Gig 601XL Builder" <wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net> wrote in message
...
> NW_Pilot wrote:
>>
>> Yea, Control our so called freedom of movement just a little more.
>
> While I appreciate your paranoia please keep in mind that there hasn't
> legal, unimpaired freedom of movement over the border into the US in well
> over 100 years. And there is nothing in the constitution that should make
> you think there is such a right.
>
> But it is well within your rights trim your posts when you are going to
> follow up a long post with one sentence.
>

For the way my government treats me every time I reenter the U.S. it feels
like I am being persecuted. Also see http://www.bajabushpilots.com and read
a bit about what happening along our borders..... Soon we will have to have
permission "A Clearance" to leave the country..

Next time I enter and they detain me I will click on my audio recorder and
post the audio! If they are nice after the Interview I get 3 to12 hours in
tee shirt and blue jeans not even a belt socks shoe's or a blanket to keep
warm in a cold room, on a cold metal bench, with a rusty dirty toilet, no
liquids, no food, and no explination....

I call it an American Gulag run by the American Gestapo (DHS)!

[[email protected][_1_]]

On Tue, 6 Nov 2007 14:25:41 -0800, C J Campbell
> wrote:


>That would be a good trick. How would you do it? Say you are in Mexico
>at some airport which does not even have a phone, let alone Internet
>access. Currently you can take off and call Customs as long as you give
>Customs notice 60 minutes before crossing the border. Now, they want a
>security screen of your passengers before you even take off? How do you
>do that?
>
>This is going to kill a lot of humanitarian programs in Mexico that
>depend on volunteer pilots. The earlier Customs proposal was completely
>unworkable, now this.
>
>What kind of fantasy world to these people live in?
>
>Last I looked, Alaska was part of the United States of America. How
>come these guys want to screen flights from Alaska?

Did you miss the part where it mentioned Pt 135??

Pt 91/GA is going to have to use the same procedure/system that Pt 135
has been using for quite some time.

https://eapis.cbp.dhs.gov/

TC

[[email protected]]

On Nov 6, 10:24 am, "Robert M. Gary" > wrote:
> On Nov 6, 9:14 am, Jon > wrote:
>
> > Just got this today in e-mail, forwarded from an Aviation Daily piece.
> > I imagine this should **** of a few people.
>
> > ==========================
>
> > DHS Wants GA Aircraft Screened Before Flights To U.S.
>
> Perhaps they can make an exception if the pilot personally has known
> the passenger for more than 10 years.
>
> -Robert

DHS use logical and rational thought? Not gonna happen, you get to go
through the security checkpoint just like everyone else...

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> This illustrates that people who are incompetent in security will
> spend most of their time addressing the minority of risks that they
> think they understand, while ignoring all the risks that they do not
> understand (or perceive). Unfortunately, the bad guys are rarely
> using the same playbook, and indeed, they tend to observe security
> measures and then attack in areas that have not been subjected to
> them.
>


Sounds like a threat to me.


Bertie

[C J Campbell[_1_]]

On 2007-11-06 14:42:36 -0800, said:

> On Tue, 6 Nov 2007 14:25:41 -0800, C J Campbell
> > wrote:
>
>
>> That would be a good trick. How would you do it? Say you are in Mexico
>> at some airport which does not even have a phone, let alone Internet
>> access. Currently you can take off and call Customs as long as you give
>> Customs notice 60 minutes before crossing the border. Now, they want a
>> security screen of your passengers before you even take off? How do you
>> do that?
>>
>> This is going to kill a lot of humanitarian programs in Mexico that
>> depend on volunteer pilots. The earlier Customs proposal was completely
>> unworkable, now this.
>>
>> What kind of fantasy world to these people live in?
>>
>> Last I looked, Alaska was part of the United States of America. How
>> come these guys want to screen flights from Alaska?
>
> Did you miss the part where it mentioned Pt 135??
>
> Pt 91/GA is going to have to use the same procedure/system that Pt 135
> has been using for quite some time.
>
> https://eapis.cbp.dhs.gov/
>
> TC

Great, if you have Internet access. But in Mexico a lot of airports do
not even have phones, let alone Internet access. What, does DHS think
that if it commands people to register over the Internet, that all the
necessary equipment will just suddenly appear in a flash of pink smoke?
--
Waddling Eagle
World Famous Flight Instructor

[C J Campbell[_1_]]

On 2007-11-06 15:25:33 -0800, said:

> On Nov 6, 10:24 am, "Robert M. Gary" > wrote:
>> On Nov 6, 9:14 am, Jon > wrote:
>>
>>> Just got this today in e-mail, forwarded from an Aviation Daily piece.
>>> I imagine this should **** of a few people.
>>
>>> ==========================
>>
>>> DHS Wants GA Aircraft Screened Before Flights To U.S.
>>
>> Perhaps they can make an exception if the pilot personally has known
>> the passenger for more than 10 years.
>>
>> -Robert
>
> DHS use logical and rational thought? Not gonna happen, you get to go
> through the security checkpoint just like everyone else...

Even if there isn't one? Sure, you might have security checkpoints at
major airports, but outside of the US a lot of airports do not have
fences or anything else.

What about Alaskan hunters carrying their weapons onto small planes? I
know! DHS will make them hunt bears with their bare hands! That's why
they are called bare hands, you know -- so you can hunt bears with them.
--
Waddling Eagle
World Famous Flight Instructor

[Bob Noel]

In article <2007110621085416807-christophercampbell@hotmailcom>,
C J Campbell > wrote:

> What, does DHS think

DHS doesn't think. Don't expect the impossible from such a group. (>-{

--
Bob Noel
(goodness, please trim replies!!!)

[[email protected][_1_]]

On Tue, 6 Nov 2007 21:08:54 -0800, C J Campbell
> wrote:


>Great, if you have Internet access. But in Mexico a lot of airports do
>not even have phones, let alone Internet access. What, does DHS think
>that if it commands people to register over the Internet, that all the
>necessary equipment will just suddenly appear in a flash of pink smoke?

I understand what you are saying, and am not disagreeing, but you are
urinating into the wind.

FWIW, the Pt 135 people were mandated to use the EAPIS system before
it was operational-so evidently they were counting on "a flash of pink
smoke".

Call around to a couple of smaller Pt 135 operations and ask them what
it takes to haul a box of freight into the US...I think you will find
that most of them tried to "comply" and gave up. Strange thing is a
bunch of auto parts seem to be made in either Mexico or Canada these
days.

TC

[Mxsmanic]

C J Campbell writes:

> Great, if you have Internet access. But in Mexico a lot of airports do
> not even have phones, let alone Internet access. What, does DHS think
> that if it commands people to register over the Internet, that all the
> necessary equipment will just suddenly appear in a flash of pink smoke?

Perhaps there are people in DHS who would simply like to put an end to all
private aviation.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> C J Campbell writes:
>
>> Great, if you have Internet access. But in Mexico a lot of airports
>> do not even have phones, let alone Internet access. What, does DHS
>> think that if it commands people to register over the Internet, that
>> all the necessary equipment will just suddenly appear in a flash of
>> pink smoke?
>
> Perhaps there are people in DHS who would simply like to put an end to
> all private aviation.


A bit like you.



Bertie