Yet Another Cirrus SR22 Crash.

[Larry Dighera]

FOUR KILLED IN MINNESOTA SR22 CRASH
(http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1006-full.html#196677)
A Cirrus SR22 was on its second try to land at the Faribault
airport in southern Minnesota on Sunday afternoon when it flipped
over and burst into flames by the side of the runway. All four on
board were killed. The pilot, Dr. Chester W. P. Mayo, 51, was a
descendant of one of the founders of the famed Mayo Clinic. The
others on board were his 17-year-old son and two of his friends,
who were on their way back to school after the holiday. Winds were
gusting at up to 20 knots, but officials weren't speculating as to
whether that was a factor in the crash, and also didn't say why
the pilot had aborted his first landing attempt. The airplane had
departed from Aberdeen, .D. "There's very little left [of the
airplane]," Faribault Police Chief Dan Collins told the Associated
Press

(http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gjocCPmhqj7ENiUdwTNUWWYvym6AD8T5EMF00)
on Sunday.




http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gjocCPmhqj7ENiUdwTNUWWYvym6AD8T5EMF00
The four-seat plane burst into flames and scattered debris across
the airfield when it crashed just off the runway. ...

"There's very little left," Faribault Police Chief Dan Collins
said Sunday. Wind was gusting above 20 mph, but it hadn't been
determined if that contributed to the crash, he said. ...

Since 2002, the SR22 has been involved in 17 accidents resulting
in 35 deaths, according to the NTSB...



http://minnesota.publicradio.org/display/web/2007/11/26/planecrash/
Surgeon and three teenagers killed in Faribault plane crash
November 26, 2007
Faribault, Minn. — (AP) - Authorities have identified all four
victims killed in this weekend's Faribault plane crash.

Dr. Chester W.P. Mayo, an orthopedic surgeon, was a descendent of
the brothers who founded the Mayo Clinic. Mayo, who was piloting
the Cirrus SR22, was bringing his eldest son back to boarding
school in Faribault following the Thanksgiving holiday break.

His son, Chester Mayo Jr., 17, also died in the crash, along with
Corey Lyn Creger, 18, and Jay Wang, 17. Creger, a Faribault
native, was a freshman at the University of Wisconsin-Stout, and
Wang was Chester Mayo Jr.'s roomate at Shattuck-St. Mary's school.
...

Joseph Mayo, who is an orthopedic surgeon in Placentia, Calif.,
said he and Chester both learned to fly airplanes before they were
old enough to drive cars.

"He's an incredibly careful, well-trained pilot. He had his
instrument rating," Joseph Mayo said. "It wasn't all that exciting
flying with him, because he was always worried and concerned and
double checking and all that." ...

King says there about 2,700 SR22s in the market. Since 2002, the
SR22 has been involved in 17 accidents resulting in 35 deaths,
according to the National Transportation Safety Board.

[Darkwing]

"Larry Dighera" > wrote in message
...
> FOUR KILLED IN MINNESOTA SR22 CRASH
> (http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1006-full.html#196677)
> A Cirrus SR22 was on its second try to land at the Faribault
> airport in southern Minnesota on Sunday afternoon when it flipped
> over and burst into flames by the side of the runway. All four on
> board were killed. The pilot, Dr. Chester W. P. Mayo, 51, was a
> descendant of one of the founders of the famed Mayo Clinic. The
> others on board were his 17-year-old son and two of his friends,
> who were on their way back to school after the holiday. Winds were
> gusting at up to 20 knots, but officials weren't speculating as to
> whether that was a factor in the crash, and also didn't say why
> the pilot had aborted his first landing attempt. The airplane had
> departed from Aberdeen, .D. "There's very little left [of the
> airplane]," Faribault Police Chief Dan Collins told the Associated
> Press
>
> (http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gjocCPmhqj7ENiUdwTNUWWYvym6AD8T5EMF00)
> on Sunday.
>
>
>
>
> http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gjocCPmhqj7ENiUdwTNUWWYvym6AD8T5EMF00
> The four-seat plane burst into flames and scattered debris across
> the airfield when it crashed just off the runway. ...
>
> "There's very little left," Faribault Police Chief Dan Collins
> said Sunday. Wind was gusting above 20 mph, but it hadn't been
> determined if that contributed to the crash, he said. ...
>
> Since 2002, the SR22 has been involved in 17 accidents resulting
> in 35 deaths, according to the NTSB...
>
>
>
> http://minnesota.publicradio.org/display/web/2007/11/26/planecrash/
> Surgeon and three teenagers killed in Faribault plane crash
> November 26, 2007
> Faribault, Minn. - (AP) - Authorities have identified all four
> victims killed in this weekend's Faribault plane crash.
>
> Dr. Chester W.P. Mayo, an orthopedic surgeon, was a descendent of
> the brothers who founded the Mayo Clinic. Mayo, who was piloting
> the Cirrus SR22, was bringing his eldest son back to boarding
> school in Faribault following the Thanksgiving holiday break.
>
> His son, Chester Mayo Jr., 17, also died in the crash, along with
> Corey Lyn Creger, 18, and Jay Wang, 17. Creger, a Faribault
> native, was a freshman at the University of Wisconsin-Stout, and
> Wang was Chester Mayo Jr.'s roomate at Shattuck-St. Mary's school.
> ...
>
> Joseph Mayo, who is an orthopedic surgeon in Placentia, Calif.,
> said he and Chester both learned to fly airplanes before they were
> old enough to drive cars.
>
> "He's an incredibly careful, well-trained pilot. He had his
> instrument rating," Joseph Mayo said. "It wasn't all that exciting
> flying with him, because he was always worried and concerned and
> double checking and all that." ...
>
> King says there about 2,700 SR22s in the market. Since 2002, the
> SR22 has been involved in 17 accidents resulting in 35 deaths,
> according to the National Transportation Safety Board.


I seen that the other day, man that sucks with all the kids on the plane,
not that a car crash would be any less tragic. What were the weather
conditions at the time of the crash? I haven't seen that reported anywhere
yet.

[Neil Gould]

Recently, Larry Dighera > posted:

> FOUR KILLED IN MINNESOTA SR22 CRASH
> (http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1006-full.html#196677)
> A Cirrus SR22 was on its second try to land at the Faribault
> airport in southern Minnesota on Sunday afternoon when it flipped
> over and burst into flames by the side of the runway. All four on
> board were killed. The pilot, Dr. Chester W. P. Mayo, 51, was a
> descendant of one of the founders of the famed Mayo Clinic. The
> others on board were his 17-year-old son and two of his friends,
> who were on their way back to school after the holiday. Winds were
> gusting at up to 20 knots, but officials weren't speculating as to
> whether that was a factor in the crash, and also didn't say why
> the pilot had aborted his first landing attempt. The airplane had
> departed from Aberdeen, .D. "There's very little left [of the
> airplane]," Faribault Police Chief Dan Collins told the Associated
> Press
>
Gusting at up to 20 kts? That shouldn't have been much of a problem.

Another unfortunate loss, and it saddens me that the kids were victims in
this accident.

Neil

[Gig 601XL Builder]

Neil Gould wrote:
> Recently, Larry Dighera > posted:
>
>> FOUR KILLED IN MINNESOTA SR22 CRASH
>> (http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1006-
>> full.html#196677) A Cirrus SR22 was on its second try to land at
>> the Faribault airport in southern Minnesota on Sunday afternoon
>> when it flipped over and burst into flames by the side of the
>> runway. All four on board were killed. The pilot, Dr. Chester W.
>> P. Mayo, 51, was a descendant of one of the founders of the
>> famed Mayo Clinic. The others on board were his 17-year-old son
>> and two of his friends, who were on their way back to school
>> after the holiday. Winds were gusting at up to 20 knots, but
>> officials weren't speculating as to whether that was a factor in
>> the crash, and also didn't say why the pilot had aborted his
>> first landing attempt. The airplane had departed from Aberdeen,
>> .D. "There's very little left [of the airplane]," Faribault
>> Police Chief Dan Collins told the Associated Press
>>
> Gusting at up to 20 kts? That shouldn't have been much of a problem.
>
> Another unfortunate loss, and it saddens me that the kids were
> victims in this accident.
>
> Neil

I too hate the kids were killed but I think we all new the Ciruss was going
to take over from the Beech 35 as the forked-tailed doctor killer.

[Mxsmanic]

Larry Dighera writes:

> FOUR KILLED IN MINNESOTA SR22 CRASH
> (http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1006-full.html#196677)
> A Cirrus SR22 was on its second try to land at the Faribault
> airport in southern Minnesota on Sunday afternoon when it flipped
> over and burst into flames by the side of the runway. All four on
> board were killed. The pilot, Dr. Chester W. P. Mayo, 51, was a
> descendant of one of the founders of the famed Mayo Clinic. The
> others on board were his 17-year-old son and two of his friends,
> who were on their way back to school after the holiday. Winds were
> gusting at up to 20 knots, but officials weren't speculating as to
> whether that was a factor in the crash, and also didn't say why
> the pilot had aborted his first landing attempt. The airplane had
> departed from Aberdeen, .D. "There's very little left [of the
> airplane]," Faribault Police Chief Dan Collins told the Associated
> Press

Some things never change. Apparently doctors still kill themselves in
aircraft. But there are probably pilots ruining their own health, too.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Larry Dighera writes:
>
>> FOUR KILLED IN MINNESOTA SR22 CRASH
>> (http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1006-full.html#196677)
>> A Cirrus SR22 was on its second try to land at the Faribault
>> airport in southern Minnesota on Sunday afternoon when it flipped
>> over and burst into flames by the side of the runway. All four on
>> board were killed. The pilot, Dr. Chester W. P. Mayo, 51, was a
>> descendant of one of the founders of the famed Mayo Clinic. The
>> others on board were his 17-year-old son and two of his friends,
>> who were on their way back to school after the holiday. Winds were
>> gusting at up to 20 knots, but officials weren't speculating as to
>> whether that was a factor in the crash, and also didn't say why
>> the pilot had aborted his first landing attempt. The airplane had
>> departed from Aberdeen, .D. "There's very little left [of the
>> airplane]," Faribault Police Chief Dan Collins told the Associated
>> Press
>
> Some things never change. Apparently doctors still kill themselves in
> aircraft. But there are probably pilots ruining their own health, too.
>

You're an idiot.


Bertie

[ManhattanMan]

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
> Mxsmanic > wrote in
> :
>

> You're an idiot.
>
>
> Bertie

And you're waaayyy too conservative!!

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

"ManhattanMan" > wrote in news:Uc04j.42$bE7.13
@newsfe16.lga:

> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>> Mxsmanic > wrote in
>> :
>>
>
>> You're an idiot.
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>
> And you're waaayyy too conservative!!
>
>
>

It's a shortcoming of mine.

Bertie

[Larry Dighera]

On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 21:08:16 GMT, "Neil Gould"
> wrote in
>:

>Recently, Larry Dighera > posted:
>
>> FOUR KILLED IN MINNESOTA SR22 CRASH
>> (http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1006-full.html#196677)
>> A Cirrus SR22 was on its second try to land at the Faribault
>> airport in southern Minnesota on Sunday afternoon when it flipped
>> over and burst into flames by the side of the runway. All four on
>> board were killed. The pilot, Dr. Chester W. P. Mayo, 51, was a
>> descendant of one of the founders of the famed Mayo Clinic. The
>> others on board were his 17-year-old son and two of his friends,
>> who were on their way back to school after the holiday. Winds were
>> gusting at up to 20 knots, but officials weren't speculating as to
>> whether that was a factor in the crash, and also didn't say why
>> the pilot had aborted his first landing attempt. The airplane had
>> departed from Aberdeen, .D. "There's very little left [of the
>> airplane]," Faribault Police Chief Dan Collins told the Associated
>> Press
>>
>Gusting at up to 20 kts? That shouldn't have been much of a problem.

I haven't flown a Cirrus, so I have no idea how it handles in a
crosswind.

>Another unfortunate loss, and it saddens me that the kids were victims in
>this accident.

I guess one of the drawbacks of low-wing aircraft is the inability to
open the cabin doors if it is flipped inverted. And the ballistic
parachute system may be a liability in that situation also.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

"Viperdoc" > wrote in
:

> I've been holding back on responding to the village idiot, Anthony
> Atkielski, but it's simply amazing how insensitive he can be,
> particularly considering that he doesn't fly, and couldn't even pass
> the simple requirements for a flying physical. Yet, he's critical of
> others that do fly- it's his form of penis envy.
>
> He really needs to get a life.
>
>
>

Spnak him to your heart;s content. Better than having one of those elastic
stress dolls.

Bertie

[Neil Gould]

Recently, Larry Dighera > posted:

> On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 21:08:16 GMT, "Neil Gould" wrote
>>>
>> Gusting at up to 20 kts? That shouldn't have been much of a problem.
>
> I haven't flown a Cirrus, so I have no idea how it handles in a
> crosswind.
>
I know what you mean, but it seems an unlikely factor unless it was about
a 90º crosswind (in which case it might have been a questionable decision
to land).

>> Another unfortunate loss, and it saddens me that the kids were
>> victims in this accident.
>
> I guess one of the drawbacks of low-wing aircraft is the inability to
> open the cabin doors if it is flipped inverted. And the ballistic
> parachute system may be a liability in that situation also.
>
Excellent point. The more situations like these I hear about, the less
sense a ballistic parachute system makes to me.

Neil

[Darkwing]

"Larry Dighera" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 21:08:16 GMT, "Neil Gould"
> > wrote in
> >:
>
>>Recently, Larry Dighera > posted:
>>
>>> FOUR KILLED IN MINNESOTA SR22 CRASH
>>> (http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1006-full.html#196677)
>>> A Cirrus SR22 was on its second try to land at the Faribault
>>> airport in southern Minnesota on Sunday afternoon when it flipped
>>> over and burst into flames by the side of the runway. All four on
>>> board were killed. The pilot, Dr. Chester W. P. Mayo, 51, was a
>>> descendant of one of the founders of the famed Mayo Clinic. The
>>> others on board were his 17-year-old son and two of his friends,
>>> who were on their way back to school after the holiday. Winds were
>>> gusting at up to 20 knots, but officials weren't speculating as to
>>> whether that was a factor in the crash, and also didn't say why
>>> the pilot had aborted his first landing attempt. The airplane had
>>> departed from Aberdeen, .D. "There's very little left [of the
>>> airplane]," Faribault Police Chief Dan Collins told the Associated
>>> Press
>>>
>>Gusting at up to 20 kts? That shouldn't have been much of a problem.
>
> I haven't flown a Cirrus, so I have no idea how it handles in a
> crosswind.
>
>>Another unfortunate loss, and it saddens me that the kids were victims in
>>this accident.
>
> I guess one of the drawbacks of low-wing aircraft is the inability to
> open the cabin doors if it is flipped inverted. And the ballistic
> parachute system may be a liability in that situation also.
>


From what I have read the ballistic chute has never gone off due to a crash,
they were always pulled by an occupant.

[Darkwing]

"Viperdoc" > wrote in message
...
> I've been holding back on responding to the village idiot, Anthony
> Atkielski, but it's simply amazing how insensitive he can be, particularly
> considering that he doesn't fly, and couldn't even pass the simple
> requirements for a flying physical. Yet, he's critical of others that do
> fly- it's his form of penis envy.
>
> He really needs to get a life.
>

I think he has some kind of borderline personality issue considering the
lack of empathy for others and a grandiose self image. Your mileage may
vary.

[alank]

> Since 2002, the SR22 has been involved in 17 accidents resulting
> in 35 deaths, according to the NTSB...

Larry, you seem to be bashing the Cirrus with "Yet Another Cirrus SR22
Crash", but have you checked NTSB for 2007 fatal crashes with a Cirrus?
Only two this year, and first one was a ditching in the ocean (not sure why
he did not use the chute there).

And no, I'm not a Cirrus pilot (30 minutes total in one), but they have done
great in 2007. As Mr. Collins pointed out in one of his articles, take a
look at flightaware and see how they are the most popular GA aircraft in the
IFR system today. Speaks well for Cirrus in 2007.

btw, most of my time is in a A36, looking at the track record for them this
year has average, but when you throw in a loss of a family friend that lost
his life in a A36 crash this year..... the Cirrus is looking better then
the past few years.

Alan.

[Larry Dighera]

On Sat, 1 Dec 2007 09:29:57 -0500, "Darkwing"
<theducksmail"AT"yahoo.com> wrote in
>:

>From what I have read the ballistic chute has never gone off due to a crash,
>they were always pulled by an occupant.
>

Perhaps. But I would be interested in knowing how BRS has managed to
fireproof the explosive charge that deploys their 'chute against
ignition from a fire that almost totally consumes the plastic
aircraft.

[Newps]

alank wrote:

>> Since 2002, the SR22 has been involved in 17 accidents resulting
>> in 35 deaths, according to the NTSB...
>
>
> Larry, you seem to be bashing the Cirrus with "Yet Another Cirrus SR22
> Crash", but have you checked NTSB for 2007 fatal crashes with a Cirrus?
> Only two this year, and first one was a ditching in the ocean (not sure why
> he did not use the chute there).
>
> And no, I'm not a Cirrus pilot (30 minutes total in one), but they have done
> great in 2007. As Mr. Collins pointed out in one of his articles, take a
> look at flightaware and see how they are the most popular GA aircraft in the
> IFR system today. Speaks well for Cirrus in 2007.
>
> btw, most of my time is in a A36, looking at the track record for them this
> year has average, but when you throw in a loss of a family friend that lost
> his life in a A36 crash this year..... the Cirrus is looking better then
> the past few years.
>
> Alan.
>


As soon as somebody writes an article about how safe the Cirrus is he
will be more than happy to copy and paste it here.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Newps > wrote in
:

>
>
> alank wrote:
>
>>> Since 2002, the SR22 has been involved in 17 accidents resulting
>>> in 35 deaths, according to the NTSB...
>>
>>
>> Larry, you seem to be bashing the Cirrus with "Yet Another Cirrus
>> SR22 Crash", but have you checked NTSB for 2007 fatal crashes with a
>> Cirrus? Only two this year, and first one was a ditching in the ocean
>> (not sure why he did not use the chute there).
>>
>> And no, I'm not a Cirrus pilot (30 minutes total in one), but they
>> have done great in 2007. As Mr. Collins pointed out in one of his
>> articles, take a look at flightaware and see how they are the most
>> popular GA aircraft in the IFR system today. Speaks well for Cirrus
>> in 2007.
>>
>> btw, most of my time is in a A36, looking at the track record for
>> them this year has average, but when you throw in a loss of a family
>> friend that lost his life in a A36 crash this year..... the Cirrus
>> is looking better then the past few years.
>>
>> Alan.
>>
>
>
> As soon as somebody writes an article about how safe the Cirrus is he
> will be more than happy to copy and paste it here.
>
>

"The Cirrus is safe"


There you go.


Bertie
>

[Darkwing]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
.. .
> Newps > wrote in
> :
>
>>
>>
>> alank wrote:
>>
>>>> Since 2002, the SR22 has been involved in 17 accidents resulting
>>>> in 35 deaths, according to the NTSB...
>>>
>>>
>>> Larry, you seem to be bashing the Cirrus with "Yet Another Cirrus
>>> SR22 Crash", but have you checked NTSB for 2007 fatal crashes with a
>>> Cirrus? Only two this year, and first one was a ditching in the ocean
>>> (not sure why he did not use the chute there).
>>>
>>> And no, I'm not a Cirrus pilot (30 minutes total in one), but they
>>> have done great in 2007. As Mr. Collins pointed out in one of his
>>> articles, take a look at flightaware and see how they are the most
>>> popular GA aircraft in the IFR system today. Speaks well for Cirrus
>>> in 2007.
>>>
>>> btw, most of my time is in a A36, looking at the track record for
>>> them this year has average, but when you throw in a loss of a family
>>> friend that lost his life in a A36 crash this year..... the Cirrus
>>> is looking better then the past few years.
>>>
>>> Alan.
>>>
>>
>>
>> As soon as somebody writes an article about how safe the Cirrus is he
>> will be more than happy to copy and paste it here.
>>
>>
>
> "The Cirrus is safe"
>
>
> There you go.
>
>
> Bertie
>>


As long as you don't have your doctorate.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

"Darkwing" <theducksmail"AT"yahoo.com> wrote in
:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> .. .
>> Newps > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> alank wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Since 2002, the SR22 has been involved in 17 accidents resulting
>>>>> in 35 deaths, according to the NTSB...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Larry, you seem to be bashing the Cirrus with "Yet Another Cirrus
>>>> SR22 Crash", but have you checked NTSB for 2007 fatal crashes with
a
>>>> Cirrus? Only two this year, and first one was a ditching in the
ocean
>>>> (not sure why he did not use the chute there).
>>>>
>>>> And no, I'm not a Cirrus pilot (30 minutes total in one), but they
>>>> have done great in 2007. As Mr. Collins pointed out in one of his
>>>> articles, take a look at flightaware and see how they are the most
>>>> popular GA aircraft in the IFR system today. Speaks well for
Cirrus
>>>> in 2007.
>>>>
>>>> btw, most of my time is in a A36, looking at the track record for
>>>> them this year has average, but when you throw in a loss of a
family
>>>> friend that lost his life in a A36 crash this year..... the Cirrus
>>>> is looking better then the past few years.
>>>>
>>>> Alan.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> As soon as somebody writes an article about how safe the Cirrus is
he
>>> will be more than happy to copy and paste it here.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> "The Cirrus is safe"
>>
>>
>> There you go.
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>>>
>
>
> As long as you don't have your doctorate.
>
>

He heh!

Bertie
>

[Thomas Borchert]

Newps,

> As soon as somebody writes an article about how safe the Cirrus is he
> will be more than happy to copy and paste it here.
>

And violate another copyright along the way... <g>

We had another fatal SR20 crash this week in Germany. 82-year old pilot
apparently got in over his head scud running while it turned dark. Hit a
powerline... There's obviously a lot to say, but I won't until the
accident report is out.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Larry Dighera]

On Sat, 01 Dec 2007 09:09:29 -0700, Newps > wrote
in >:

>As soon as somebody writes an article about how safe the Cirrus is he
>will be more than happy to copy and paste it here.

Dear Mr. Newpower,

I include a lot of the research material I find in my articles for
several reasons:

1. Web-page content tends to become unavailable as it ages.

2. It makes it easier for the reader to view background material.

3. It is independently created, and thus not viewed as my
opinion.

4. It lends credibility to the validity of the subject.

5. It remains in the deja.com Usenet archive for decades
facilitating further research.

For those reasons, I wish others would adopt the practice of quoting
credible source material in their articles, including URLs.

[Thomas Borchert]

Larry,

> I wish others would adopt the practice of quoting
> credible source material in their articles,
>

There is the small matter of copyright infringement, of course. I keep
bringing it up since I live off it.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Mxsmanic]

Thomas Borchert writes:

> There is the small matter of copyright infringement, of course. I keep
> bringing it up since I live off it.

That's a rather incriminating statement to make.

[[email protected]]

Mxsmanic > wrote:
> Thomas Borchert writes:

> > There is the small matter of copyright infringement, of course. I keep
> > bringing it up since I live off it.

> That's a rather incriminating statement to make.

That's a rather stupid conclusion to make.

--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Thomas Borchert writes:
>
>> There is the small matter of copyright infringement, of course. I keep
>> bringing it up since I live off it.
>
> That's a rather incriminating statement to make.
>

You are an idiot.


Bertie

[Jeff Dougherty]

On Dec 2, 12:45 pm, Mxsmanic > wrote:
> Thomas Borchert writes:
> > There is the small matter of copyright infringement, of course. I keep
> > bringing it up since I live off it.
>
> That's a rather incriminating statement to make.

Did they outlaw copyright lawyers while I wasn't looking?

-JTD

[Newps]

> Larry,
>
>
>>I wish others would adopt the practice of quoting
>>credible source material in their articles,
>>

You're not quoting anything. You're simply copying and
pasting(stealing, really) an entire article with no comments. If that
is of any interest to me I'll go read it from the people who actually
wrote it.

[Larry Dighera]

On Sun, 02 Dec 2007 18:18:11 +0100, Thomas Borchert
> wrote in
>:

>Larry,
>
>> I wish others would adopt the practice of quoting
>> credible source material in their articles,
>>
>
>There is the small matter of copyright infringement, of course. I keep
>bringing it up since I live off it.

Those familiar with US copyright law are aware of Fair Use provisions,
and know what ellipsis mean.

[Mxsmanic]

Larry Dighera writes:

> Those familiar with US copyright law are aware of Fair Use provisions,
> and know what ellipsis mean.

Very few people understand the Fair Use provisions, and they are typically
cited as a blanket excuse for blatant and wholesale copying of copyrighted
material, which they do not allow.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Larry Dighera writes:
>
>> Those familiar with US copyright law are aware of Fair Use
>> provisions, and know what ellipsis mean.
>
> Very few people understand the Fair Use provisions,

@specially you.

Bertie

[Thomas Borchert]

Mxsmanic,

> That's a rather incriminating statement to make.
>

It may be a matter of my being a non-native speaker, but I can't follow
(not that I normally can).

I'm a journalist. If there was no copyright, I would have no income. If
everybody was infringing on my copyright, I would have no income. Thus,
I have something against copyright infringements in the casual manner
recommended here.


--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Dan Luke[_2_]]

"Darkwing" wrote:
>
> From what I have read the ballistic chute has never gone off due to a
> crash, they were always pulled by an occupant.

Don't know where you read that, but it happenened in this crash and has
happened before.

--
Dan
T-182T at BFM

[B A R R Y[_2_]]

Dan Luke wrote:
>
> Don't know where you read that, but it happenened in this crash and has
> happened before.
>

The NTSB believes it can happen:

<http://www.ntsb.gov/Recs/letters/2004/A04_36_41.pdf>

[Stefan]

Dan Luke schrieb:

>> From what I have read the ballistic chute has never gone off due to a
>> crash, they were always pulled by an occupant.

> Don't know where you read that, but it happenened in this crash and has
> happened before.

And where did you read *that*?

[Newps]

Thomas Borchert wrote:

>
> It may be a matter of my being a non-native speaker, but I can't follow
> (not that I normally can).

Your sentence can be taken two ways. The village idiot took it the
wrong way.

[Cary]

On Nov 30, 3:08 pm, "Neil Gould" > wrote:

> Gusting at up to 20 kts? That shouldn't have been much of a problem.
>
> Another unfortunate loss, and it saddens me that the kids were victims in
> this accident.
>
> Neil

Neil, the loss was indeed unfortunate and very sad. The wind that day
was gusting from many directions and other very experienced pilots
were having difficulty landing. I have stated before that the SR22 (at
least the one that I flew) was one of the most difficult planes I have
had to land; speed control is critical in that plane. I have bounced
landings in the SR22 more than once. I was to also fly that day and
cancelled because the gusts made landing very difficult. I could
easily see how one of the gusts lifted a wing tip while trying to land
and causing the plane to flip. I am not saying that is what happened,
but I certainly can see that possibility on that day. I tried to
locate the actual Metars for that airport and other airports in the
Twin Cities for that date, but was unsuccessful.

Cary Mariash

[Yes - I have a name[_2_]]

"Newps" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Thomas Borchert wrote:
>
> >
> > It may be a matter of my being a non-native speaker, but I can't follow
> > (not that I normally can).
>
> Your sentence can be taken two ways. The village idiot took it the
> wrong way.

And replied in the most ambiguous way possible

[Mxsmanic]

Thomas Borchert writes:

> I'm a journalist. If there was no copyright, I would have no income. If
> everybody was infringing on my copyright, I would have no income. Thus,
> I have something against copyright infringements in the casual manner
> recommended here.

Actually, the ephemeral and time-sensitive nature of journalism makes it
possible to earn money with it even in the absence of copyright. In many
cases, by the time someone infringes, it's old news.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Thomas Borchert writes:
>
>> I'm a journalist. If there was no copyright, I would have no income. If
>> everybody was infringing on my copyright, I would have no income. Thus,
>> I have something against copyright infringements in the casual manner
>> recommended here.
>
> Actually, the ephemeral and time-sensitive nature of journalism makes it
> possible to earn money with it even in the absence of copyright. In many
> cases, by the time someone infringes, it's old news.



Like you.


Bertie

[Thomas Borchert]

Dan,

> but it happenened in this crash
>

Accident analysis by acclamation?

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Thomas Borchert]

Mxsmanic,

> Actually, the ephemeral and time-sensitive nature of journalism makes it
> possible to earn money with it even in the absence of copyright.
>

Ah, you're an expert in journalism now, too? Admirable.

There's obviously only one area of expertise you are seriously lacking in:
Recognizing and knowing your limitations. The thing is: This lack
influences all other areas you might know something about.

So STFU AND DON'T TELL ME ABOUT MY JOB, YOU STUPID LOSER!


--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Tina]

Gee, Mx is wrong again. Without copyright, a writer -- reporting news
or otherwise -- could have his material taken and used without
compensation in real time. This would have a particular impact on
writers without affiliations, who might be first on scene, dash off a
story, and have it used without getting a penny for their efforts.

Interesting how real world issues somehow escape someone who lives in
a simulated one. We don't get to walk away from real world aftermaths
-- it would be nice to have an alt control delete key sequence on some
of our days.




.. On Dec 3, 11:43 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> Mxsmanic > wrote :
>
> > Thomas Borchert writes:
>
> >> I'm a journalist. If there was no copyright, I would have no income. If
> >> everybody was infringing on my copyright, I would have no income. Thus,
> >> I have something against copyright infringements in the casual manner
> >> recommended here.
>
> > Actually, the ephemeral and time-sensitive nature of journalism makes it
> > possible to earn money with it even in the absence of copyright. In many
> > cases, by the time someone infringes, it's old news.
>
> Like you.
>
> Bertie

[Darkwing]

"Tina" > wrote in message
...
> Gee, Mx is wrong again. Without copyright, a writer -- reporting news
> or otherwise -- could have his material taken and used without
> compensation in real time. This would have a particular impact on
> writers without affiliations, who might be first on scene, dash off a
> story, and have it used without getting a penny for their efforts.
>
> Interesting how real world issues somehow escape someone who lives in
> a simulated one. We don't get to walk away from real world aftermaths
> -- it would be nice to have an alt control delete key sequence on some
> of our days.
>


He probably spends most of his downtime on Second Life...as a pilot.

[Mxsmanic]

Thomas Borchert writes:

> So STFU AND DON'T TELL ME ABOUT MY JOB, YOU STUPID LOSER!

Or else what?

[Mxsmanic]

Tina writes:

> Gee, Mx is wrong again. Without copyright, a writer -- reporting news
> or otherwise -- could have his material taken and used without
> compensation in real time. This would have a particular impact on
> writers without affiliations, who might be first on scene, dash off a
> story, and have it used without getting a penny for their efforts.

In modern journalism, the speed with which you get the news to the audience is
often much more important than anything having to do with copyright. No
matter how fast the copycats are, the original writer is always the first to
have the news he has written, and that is a tremendous and usually overriding
advantage in high-speed journalism.

[Darkwing]

"Mxsmanic" > wrote in message
...
> Thomas Borchert writes:
>
>> So STFU AND DON'T TELL ME ABOUT MY JOB, YOU STUPID LOSER!
>
> Or else what?

He will continue with his life...which you don't have.

[Mxsmanic]

"Darkwing" <theducksmail"AT"yahoo.com> writes:

> He will continue with his life...which you don't have.

So he will not continue with his life if I don't?

[Maxwell]

"Mxsmanic" > wrote in message
...
> "Darkwing" <theducksmail"AT"yahoo.com> writes:
>
>> He will continue with his life...which you don't have.
>
> So he will not continue with his life if I don't?

You won't continue with your life because you can't, you don't have one.

[Tina]

Mx's statement has nothing to do with defending his position or
countering what I said.

One would think by the some cosmic force he would take a supportable
and defendable posiiton sometimes -- the conclusion I've reached is he
carefully takes wrong ones.

Keep your children from playing flight simulation games on computer --
we have some evidence it makes them stupid.


.. On Dec 4, 1:31 pm, Mxsmanic > wrote:
> Tina writes:
> > Gee, Mx is wrong again. Without copyright, a writer -- reporting news
> > or otherwise -- could have his material taken and used without
> > compensation in real time. This would have a particular impact on
> > writers without affiliations, who might be first on scene, dash off a
> > story, and have it used without getting a penny for their efforts.
>
> In modern journalism, the speed with which you get the news to the audience is
> often much more important than anything having to do with copyright. No
> matter how fast the copycats are, the original writer is always the first to
> have the news he has written, and that is a tremendous and usually overriding
> advantage in high-speed journalism.

[Darkwing]

"Mxsmanic" > wrote in message
...
> "Darkwing" <theducksmail"AT"yahoo.com> writes:
>
>> He will continue with his life...which you don't have.
>
> So he will not continue with his life if I don't?


Damn, you are numb from neck up.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Tina writes:
>
>> Gee, Mx is wrong again. Without copyright, a writer -- reporting news
>> or otherwise -- could have his material taken and used without
>> compensation in real time. This would have a particular impact on
>> writers without affiliations, who might be first on scene, dash off a
>> story, and have it used without getting a penny for their efforts.
>
> In modern journalism, the speed with which you get the news to the
> audience is often much more important than anything having to do with
> copyright. No matter how fast the copycats are, the original writer
> is always the first to have the news he has written, and that is a
> tremendous and usually overriding advantage in high-speed journalism.
>

So, the strategy now is, when you're wrong you just change the subject
altogether..


Just so I know.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Thomas Borchert writes:
>
>> So STFU AND DON'T TELL ME ABOUT MY JOB, YOU STUPID LOSER!
>
> Or else what?
>

Your dick wil fall off.

Oh wait, you won't care.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_19_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> "Darkwing" <theducksmail"AT"yahoo.com> writes:
>
>> He will continue with his life...which you don't have.
>
> So he will not continue with his life if I don't?


I know I'd die if you you stopped...


Bertie

[Thomas Borchert]

Mxsmanic,

> Or else what?
>

Or else you'll make a total idiot of yourself.

Ah, too late...

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)