Chinese new regional jet

[Morgans[_2_]]

Well, it has officially started.

China has rolled out a new jet that is a knockoff from an American passenger
jet.

From AvWeb:

Shenyang used much of the tooling left over from McDonnell-Douglas's aborted
attempt to build MD-90s in China and the "new" airplane has the same cabin
cross section and nose as the DC-9 family.

Does anyone have any doubt that China will copy any airplane that a
manufacturer decides to build there?

Cessna (and others) have screwed up, big time, IMHO.
--
Jim in NC

[NW_Pilot]

Look that they do to electronics, cars, and motorcycles.



"Morgans" > wrote in message
...
> Well, it has officially started.
>
> China has rolled out a new jet that is a knockoff from an American
> passenger jet.
>
> From AvWeb:
>
> Shenyang used much of the tooling left over from McDonnell-Douglas's
> aborted attempt to build MD-90s in China and the "new" airplane has the
> same cabin cross section and nose as the DC-9 family.
>
> Does anyone have any doubt that China will copy any airplane that a
> manufacturer decides to build there?
>
> Cessna (and others) have screwed up, big time, IMHO.
> --
> Jim in NC
>

[Kyle Boatright]

"Morgans" > wrote in message
...
> Well, it has officially started.
>
> China has rolled out a new jet that is a knockoff from an American
> passenger jet.
>
> From AvWeb:
>
> Shenyang used much of the tooling left over from McDonnell-Douglas's
> aborted attempt to build MD-90s in China and the "new" airplane has the
> same cabin cross section and nose as the DC-9 family.
>
> Does anyone have any doubt that China will copy any airplane that a
> manufacturer decides to build there?
>
> Cessna (and others) have screwed up, big time, IMHO.
> --
> Jim in NC

Without a doubt, that culture doesn't respect the same business norms as
most western businesses.

That said, I think it'll be a long time before someone buys a knock-off
airliner pushed by knock-off engines and guided by knock-off avionics. I
just don't foresee a market for third rate aircraft.

[Paul Tomblin]

In a previous article, "Kyle Boatright" > said:
>That said, I think it'll be a long time before someone buys a knock-off
>airliner pushed by knock-off engines and guided by knock-off avionics. I
>just don't foresee a market for third rate aircraft.

The company I'm currently working for nearly got knocked out of the
business because we were dumb enough to buy cheap Dell workstations that
had power supplies that had a cheap Chinese knock-off of a Japanese
designed capacitor that failed after a few months. Our customers really
did not like having their critical machines going dead after a few months,
and it was expensive as hell sending out hundreds of replacements.
Finally, our parent company used their clout on Dell to make them pay for
the cost of not only replacing the computers, but sending people out to
the customer sites to replace them all.

Dell's saving a few cents per computer cost them hundreds of dollars in
replacement costs, and cost us untold millions in customer goodwill.


--
Paul Tomblin > http://blog.xcski.com/
"I kept the faith and I kept voting/Not for the iron fist but for the helping
hand/For theirs is a land with a wall around it/And mine is a faith in my
fellow man" --Billy Bragg

[B A R R Y]

On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:54:18 -0500, "Kyle Boatright"
> wrote:

>
>That said, I think it'll be a long time before someone buys a knock-off
>airliner pushed by knock-off engines and guided by knock-off avionics. I
>just don't foresee a market for third rate aircraft.

I've heard it's equipped with such brand name gear as Garvin Avionics
and a choice of Gentleman Electric or Rolls Boyce engines...

[muff528]

"NW_Pilot" > wrote in message
...
> Look that they do to electronics, cars, and motorcycles.
>

..............& nukes

[Jim Logajan]

"Morgans" > wrote:
> Well, it has officially started.
>
> China has rolled out a new jet that is a knockoff from an American
> passenger jet.
>
> From AvWeb:
>
> Shenyang used much of the tooling left over from McDonnell-Douglas's
> aborted attempt to build MD-90s in China and the "new" airplane has
> the same cabin cross section and nose as the DC-9 family.
>
> Does anyone have any doubt that China will copy any airplane that a
> manufacturer decides to build there?

The story in question also states "According to United Press International,
the aircraft is the first-ever clean sheet airliner design by the Chinese."

Having the same cross section and nose as an entire family of aircraft is
mighty thin evidence to start claiming "knockoff".

Also, I'm pretty sure that U.S. corporations and governments have in
decades past ripped off design ideas when it suited them.

(Shucks, the U.S. sometimes doesn't just rip off designs but complete sets
of designers! Got a bunch of German rocket designers a few decades back.
And prior to that some airships and airship designs. Different wars, same
result: transfer of IP.)

[Gig601XLBuilder]

Kyle Boatright wrote:
>
> "Morgans" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Well, it has officially started.
>>
>> China has rolled out a new jet that is a knockoff from an American
>> passenger jet.
>>
>> From AvWeb:
>>
>> Shenyang used much of the tooling left over from McDonnell-Douglas's
>> aborted attempt to build MD-90s in China and the "new" airplane has
>> the same cabin cross section and nose as the DC-9 family.
>>
>> Does anyone have any doubt that China will copy any airplane that a
>> manufacturer decides to build there?
>>
>> Cessna (and others) have screwed up, big time, IMHO.
>> --
>> Jim in NC
>
> Without a doubt, that culture doesn't respect the same business norms as
> most western businesses.
>
> That said, I think it'll be a long time before someone buys a knock-off
> airliner pushed by knock-off engines and guided by knock-off avionics.
> I just don't foresee a market for third rate aircraft.

Just the loss of the business in China, who I assume will but the
planes, will hurt the companies that are ripped off.

[Clay[_2_]]

On Dec 26, 5:54*pm, "Kyle Boatright" > wrote:
> "Morgans" > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
>
>
>
>
> > Well, it has officially started.
>
> > China has rolled out a new jet that is a knockoff from an American
> > passenger jet.
>
> > From AvWeb:
>
> > Shenyang used much of the tooling left over from McDonnell-Douglas's
> > aborted attempt to build MD-90s in China and the "new" airplane has the
> > same cabin cross section and nose as the DC-9 family.
>
> > Does anyone have any doubt that China will copy any airplane that a
> > manufacturer decides to build there?
>
> > Cessna (and others) have screwed up, big time, IMHO.
> > --
> > Jim in NC
>
> Without a doubt, that culture doesn't respect the same business norms as
> most western businesses.
>
> That said, I think it'll be a long time before someone buys a knock-off
> airliner pushed by knock-off engines and guided by knock-off avionics. *I
> just don't foresee a market for third rate aircraft.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

The Chineese are over populated as it is. Perhaps their new airliner
is the Chineese government's attempt at controlling their over
population problem.

[Aluckyguess]

>
> That said, I think it'll be a long time before someone buys a knock-off
> airliner pushed by knock-off engines and guided by knock-off avionics. I
> just don't foresee a market for third rate aircraft.

If its certified and it costs half the price it will sell.
If I remember correctly almost are whole trade with Japan is boeing.
Airplanes are the only thing we still build.
>

[[email protected]]

B A R R Y wrote:
> On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:54:18 -0500, "Kyle Boatright"
> > wrote:
>
> >
> >That said, I think it'll be a long time before someone buys a knock-off
> >airliner pushed by knock-off engines and guided by knock-off avionics. I
> >just don't foresee a market for third rate aircraft.
>
> I've heard it's equipped with such brand name gear as Garvin Avionics
> and a choice of Gentleman Electric or Rolls Boyce engines...


knockoff ? Sure, mind you, it has a cabin that was designed by
australian firm FACC, engine is from GE, wing design is from antonov.
btw, i heard that the only thing that american can really manufacture
now is boeing, american cars are only the verge of bankruptcy thanks
to Japan, ask chrysler if you don't believe me. almost the entire
american market now is dominated by Japanese brands, what a pity for a
country that hated Japanese brands so much only 2 decades ago.

sometimes it makes me laugh to think what would happen to boeing if
japan was to make passenger planes. lol


God bless america ! :D

[[email protected]]

Paul Tomblin wrote:
> In a previous article, "Kyle Boatright" > said:
> >That said, I think it'll be a long time before someone buys a knock-off
> >airliner pushed by knock-off engines and guided by knock-off avionics. I
> >just don't foresee a market for third rate aircraft.
>
> The company I'm currently working for nearly got knocked out of the
> business because we were dumb enough to buy cheap Dell workstations that
> had power supplies that had a cheap Chinese knock-off of a Japanese
> designed capacitor that failed after a few months. Our customers really
> did not like having their critical machines going dead after a few months,
> and it was expensive as hell sending out hundreds of replacements.
> Finally, our parent company used their clout on Dell to make them pay for
> the cost of not only replacing the computers, but sending people out to
> the customer sites to replace them all.
>
> Dell's saving a few cents per computer cost them hundreds of dollars in
> replacement costs, and cost us untold millions in customer goodwill.
>
>
> --
> Paul Tomblin > http://blog.xcski.com/
> "I kept the faith and I kept voting/Not for the iron fist but for the helping
> hand/For theirs is a land with a wall around it/And mine is a faith in my
> fellow man" --Billy Bragg


oh poor you, hey i got a suggestion here, why don't you turn to the
back of your mobile phone and open the battery case and read the
country of origin , do the same for your computers, keyboard and your
tv too . and wow Dell, an american brand uses knockoff components.

[[email protected]]

Morgans wrote:
> Well, it has officially started.
>
> China has rolled out a new jet that is a knockoff from an American passenger
> jet.
>
> From AvWeb:
>
> Shenyang used much of the tooling left over from McDonnell-Douglas's aborted
> attempt to build MD-90s in China and the "new" airplane has the same cabin
> cross section and nose as the DC-9 family.
>
> Does anyone have any doubt that China will copy any airplane that a
> manufacturer decides to build there?
>
> Cessna (and others) have screwed up, big time, IMHO.
> --
> Jim in NC



"In 1992, McDonnell Douglas Corporation announced a $1,000m contract
with the Shanghai Aviation Industrial Corporation (SAIC) at Dachang to
build the 3 MD-82, 17 MD82T and 20 MD-90-30T under license. The
MD-90-30T, known as the TrunkLiner, was designed with dual landing
gear with four main wheels for Chinese domestic use, but due to lack
of orders, only two were completed when production stopped in 1000 and
the last one was delivered to China Northern Airlines."

Quote from the reference book "Airliners Worldwide" by Tom Singfield