Anyone take an ICOM on a commercial flight?

[es330td]

What are the odds I can get away with taking my ICOM radio and
listening to the cockpit?

[Vaughn Simon]

"es330td" > wrote in message
...
> What are the odds I can get away with taking my ICOM radio and
> listening to the cockpit?

Well, you didn't say what kind of ICOM. It is probably not on the approved
electronics list (but you know that). These days, there are so many consumer
electronics goodies in the cabin that there is no way the crew can keep track.
A fellow I work with actually got away with operating his ham 2-meter portable
radio on at least one flight. Needless to say: Transmitting on the air bands
from inside the passenger cabin would be a very dumb idea.

Finding and following the correct radio channel would be a problem.

Vaughn
>

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

es330td > wrote in
:

> On Jan 30, 9:49*pm, "Vaughn Simon" >
> wrote:
>> "es330td" > wrote in message
>>
>> news:03787d5e-672b-4070-99c5-eb3ed21e8aa3
@j20g2000hsi.googlegroups.com
>> ...
>>
>> > What are the odds I can get away with taking my ICOM radio and
>> > listening to the cockpit?
>>
>> * *Well, you didn't say what kind of ICOM. *It is probably not on th
> e approved
>> electronics list (but you know that). *These days, there are so many
>> con
> sumer
>> electronics goodies in the cabin that there is no way the crew can
>> keep tr
> ack.
>> A fellow I work with actually got away with operating his ham 2-meter
>> port
> able
>> radio on at least one flight. *Needless to say: Transmitting on the
>> air
> bands
>> from inside the passenger cabin would be a very dumb idea.
>>
>> * *Finding and following the correct radio channel would be a
>> problem.
>
>>
>> Vaughn
>>
>>
>>
>> - Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> It's an IC-A6, btw.
>
> I wouldn't DARE transmit. I don't even transmit when I'm in my car
> when nobody could catch me. In this case I'll be sitting in 1st class
> about 10 feet from the pilots. I would be clear enough that the pilot
> would have to know it was someone on board.
>
> It shouldn't be too tough to do. I know the departure frequencies of
> my airport and my flight number. As long as I can listen while we are
> holding short I should be able to find the right one. Once I have
> that I just have to listen for frequency changes. I do that myself
> when flying so doing it with them shouldn't be any different.
>
> I just realized I'm going to have to get it through security. I doubt
> they are going to let me take it on board.
>

I can't see why not. You could stand a chance of losing it, but I doubt
they would know what it was.
You wouldn't believe the crap I've brought through security....


Bertie

[kontiki]

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
erent.
>>
>> I just realized I'm going to have to get it through security. I doubt
>> they are going to let me take it on board.
>>
>
> I can't see why not. You could stand a chance of losing it, but I doubt
> they would know what it was.
> You wouldn't believe the crap I've brought through security....
>
>

When flying commercial several times carrying my flight
bag, including radio, headset etc. I've had no problem
with security.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

kontiki > wrote in news:Y_hoj.3018$Sa1.2642
@news02.roc.ny:

> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
> erent.
>>>
>>> I just realized I'm going to have to get it through security. I
doubt
>>> they are going to let me take it on board.
>>>
>>
>> I can't see why not. You could stand a chance of losing it, but I
doubt
>> they would know what it was.
>> You wouldn't believe the crap I've brought through security....
>>
>>
>
> When flying commercial several times carrying my flight
> bag, including radio, headset etc. I've had no problem
> with security.
>
>

Yeah, when I have to deadhead somewhere as pax I usually carry my
headset in my carry on (in case my bag doesn't make it I can still fly)
Pre 9-11, a long time ago, I carried a Very pistol and a giant hunting
knife through. I just forgot I had 'em.
My favorite story regards a friend of mine who was a military chopper
pilot. They stopped at a relatively large commercial field and left the
chopper on the ramp while they went inside for lunch. When they were on
their way back out, security objected to them carrying their .45s out
with them.
"Don't be stupid" my friend said "We're military for God's sake!"
But the moron wouldn't budge. After a bunch of to-ing and fro-ing, my
buddy just said, "Well, I'm going out anyway" The security gaurd sez "I
can't allow that" and my friend replied "Who's gonna stop me? You? I got
a gun, remember? "

And so he did. Never heard a word about it either.

Bertie

[B A R R Y[_2_]]

es330td wrote:
> What are the odds I can get away with taking my ICOM radio and
> listening to the cockpit?
>


I fly with mine all the time, but I leave it off while onboard. The
radio fits into my bag better without the antenna. I have used it in
the terminal to listen to ground and clearance delivery.

The only time you'll hear the cockpit is if you're on an aircraft with a
comm feed in the entertainment system. The signal inside the aluminum
tube is nearly nil. Holding the radio up to a window, or using an
external antenna will probably get you in trouble as transceivers are
banned in the cabin on any airline I fly.

If you are a licensed pilot, just think of how stupid you'd look if you
got caught violating an FAA reg. If you're instrument rated, the reg is
something that appears on the written, so you'd look even dumber.

[F. Baum]

On Jan 30, 7:33*pm, es330td > wrote:
> What are the odds I can get away with taking my ICOM radio and
> listening to the cockpit?

The question is why would you want to do this. On most flights ATC is
available on the inflight entertainment system. What would happen if
you had a stuck mike ? I will guarantee that if the flight attendants
find that you have anything that looks like it could transmit you will
get some unwanted attention. Why not just sit back, have a couple of
drinks and read car magazines .
FB

[Ron Natalie]

F. Baum wrote:
> On Jan 30, 7:33 pm, es330td > wrote:
>> What are the odds I can get away with taking my ICOM radio and
>> listening to the cockpit?
>
> The question is why would you want to do this. On most flights ATC is
> available on the inflight entertainment system. \

"Most flights" Hardly.
United is the only one who does this to my knowledge and ATC-on-9
(officially "from the cockpit") is entirely at the captain's
discretion.

Notwithstanding that, the radio and the GPS stay in the flight bag
for the duration of the flight.

[es330td]

On Jan 31, 7:29*am, B A R R Y > wrote:

> If you are a licensed pilot, just think of how stupid you'd look if you
> got caught violating an FAA reg. *

This is probably the strongest reason to not do it. I don't have my
license yet (working on cross country) so I'm still in the "fascinated
by it all" phase. Although I think it would be interesting just to
track the frequency changes and listen in on the conversations of the
pros, I am not putting my flying career in jeopardy doing something
like this.

[F. Baum]

On Jan 31, 6:14*am, Ron Natalie > wrote:
>
> > The question is why would you want to do this. On most flights ATC is
> > available on the inflight entertainment system. \
>
> "Most flights" Hardly.
> United is the only one who does this to my knowledge and ATC-on-9
> (officially "from the cockpit") is entirely at the captain's
> discretion.

"Most Flights" Actually. ;). DAL and NWA do this also. On the bigger
equipment they even have a moving map in the cabin so the Sheep can
follow the progress. The cockpit crew has no control of the inflight
entertainment system (Other than telling the cabin crew to shut it
off).
>
> Notwithstanding that, the radio and the GPS stay in the flight bag
> for the duration of the flight.

As they should. Ive had two incidents where pax were suspected of
operating a two way device. Both turned out OK but they provided a
distraction that we just dont need.
Frank

[B A R R Y[_2_]]

F. Baum wrote:
>
> "Most Flights" Actually. ;). DAL and NWA do this also.

I've never had it on a Delta or Northwest flight, only United.

[John[_1_]]

On Jan 31, 7:57*am, "F. Baum" > wrote:

> The question is why would you want to do this. On most flights ATC is
> available on the inflight entertainment system.

Really? What airline does this nowadays? I remember American and
United used to back in the 80's and I loved to follow along in an
atlas with high airways over printed on the maps (hey, it beat what
was showing for a movie 99.4% of the time). But it seems to me
everyone stopped doing that in the late 80's and early 90's.

Nowadays I fly mostly Delta whose audio pickings are slim beyond
reason or Airtran which provides XM radio which isnt bad. I would
love to find a flight that had ATC as an audio choice.

Take care . . .

John

[John[_1_]]

On Jan 31, 8:55*am, "F. Baum" > wrote:
> On Jan 31, 6:14*am, Ron Natalie > wrote:
>
>
>
> > > The question is why would you want to do this. On most flights ATC is
> > > available on the inflight entertainment system. \
>
> > "Most flights" Hardly.
> > United is the only one who does this to my knowledge and ATC-on-9
> > (officially "from the cockpit") is entirely at the captain's
> > discretion.
>
> "Most Flights" Actually. ;). DAL and NWA do this also. On the bigger
> equipment they even have a moving map in the cabin so the Sheep can
> follow the progress. The cockpit crew has no control of the inflight
> entertainment system (Other than telling the cabin crew to shut it
> off).
>
>
>
> > Notwithstanding that, the radio and the GPS stay in the flight bag
> > for the duration of the flight.
>
> As they should. Ive had two incidents where pax were suspected of
> operating a two way device. Both turned out OK but they provided a
> distraction that we just dont need.
> Frank

Frank,

Was that on Delta or NW overseas flights? I have never seen it on any
domestic flight or on flights to SK in Canada.

Take care . . .

John

[xyzzy]

On Jan 31, 8:29 am, B A R R Y > wrote:
> es330td wrote:
> > What are the odds I can get away with taking my ICOM radio and
> > listening to the cockpit?
>
> I fly with mine all the time, but I leave it off while onboard. The
> radio fits into my bag better without the antenna. I have used it in
> the terminal to listen to ground and clearance delivery.
>
> The only time you'll hear the cockpit is if you're on an aircraft with a
> comm feed in the entertainment system. The signal inside the aluminum
> tube is nearly nil. Holding the radio up to a window, or using an
> external antenna will probably get you in trouble as transceivers are
> banned in the cabin on any airline I fly.
>
> If you are a licensed pilot, just think of how stupid you'd look if you
> got caught violating an FAA reg. If you're instrument rated, the reg is
> something that appears on the written, so you'd look even dumber.

And you will get caught. Think of all the frequency changes you'd
have to input. And in first class the FA has fewer passengers to
watch over. If nothing else, a nervous seatmate would rat you out.

I tried using a portable GPS a few times, the FA's always noticed and
my success rate of being allowed to use it was about 50%.

[Matt Whiting]

Edward A. Falk wrote:
> In this post-9/11 world, you'd be lucky not to be arrested just for
> having it.
>
> Legally, you can only operate electronics like this with permission from
> the airline (the pilot isn't allowed to make the decision). I'm guessing
> that in most cases, either the airline hasn't approved the radio, or
> the pilot doesn't know either way and tells you no just to be safe.

Which law requires this permission to listen to a radio?

[JGalban via AviationKB.com]

Matt Whiting wrote:
>
>Which law requires this permission to listen to a radio?

There is a reg that says the operator can decide what types of electronic
devices to be operated in flight.

There used to be a reg (dating back to the '50s) banning all receivers and
transmitters in the cabin, because of possible interference emitted by the
local oscillator. Last time I went to look for it I couldn't find it.

If you check the airline's policy on electronic devices (most have them
posted somewhere), you're likely to find that there are some devices like
laptops, GPS and CD players permitted in cruise. You'll probably also find
that devices like TVs, AM/FM radios, tranceivers and scanners are never
permitted.

John Galban=====>N4BQ (PA28-180)

--
Message posted via AviationKB.com
http://www.aviationkb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/aviation/200801/1

[Gig 601XL Builder[_2_]]

Matt Whiting wrote:
> Edward A. Falk wrote:
>> In this post-9/11 world, you'd be lucky not to be arrested just for
>> having it.
>>
>> Legally, you can only operate electronics like this with permission from
>> the airline (the pilot isn't allowed to make the decision). I'm guessing
>> that in most cases, either the airline hasn't approved the radio, or
>> the pilot doesn't know either way and tells you no just to be safe.
>
> Which law requires this permission to listen to a radio?

91.21c

(c) In the case of an aircraft operated by a holder of an air carrier
operating certificate or an operating certificate, the determination
required by paragraph (b)(5) of this section shall be made by that
operator of the aircraft on which the particular device is to be used.
In the case of other aircraft, the determination may be made by the
pilot in command or other operator of the aircraft.

[Peter Clark]

On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 16:31:11 -0600, Gig 601XL Builder
> wrote:

>Matt Whiting wrote:
>> Edward A. Falk wrote:
>>> In this post-9/11 world, you'd be lucky not to be arrested just for
>>> having it.
>>>
>>> Legally, you can only operate electronics like this with permission from
>>> the airline (the pilot isn't allowed to make the decision). I'm guessing
>>> that in most cases, either the airline hasn't approved the radio, or
>>> the pilot doesn't know either way and tells you no just to be safe.
>>
>> Which law requires this permission to listen to a radio?
>
>91.21c
>
>(c) In the case of an aircraft operated by a holder of an air carrier
>operating certificate or an operating certificate, the determination
>required by paragraph (b)(5) of this section shall be made by that
>operator of the aircraft on which the particular device is to be used.
>In the case of other aircraft, the determination may be made by the
>pilot in command or other operator of the aircraft.

Commercial airline operations with passengers onboard are part 121 not
91. You want 121.306:

Sec. 121.306 - Portable electronic devices.

(a) Except as provided in paragraph (b) of this section, no person may
operate, nor may any operator or pilot in command of an aircraft allow
the operation of, any portable electronic device on any
U.S.-registered civil aircraft operating under this part.

(b) Paragraph (a) of this section does not apply to --

(1) Portable voice recorders;

(2) Hearing aids;

(3) Heart pacemakers;

(4) Electric shavers; or

(5) Any other portable electronic device that the part 119 certificate
holder has determined will not cause interference with the navigation
or communication system of the aircraft on which it is to be used.

(c) The determination required by paragraph (b)(5) of this section
shall be made by that part 119 certificate holder operating the
particular device to be used.

[Gig 601XL Builder[_2_]]

Peter Clark wrote:
> On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 16:31:11 -0600, Gig 601XL Builder
> > wrote:
>
>> Matt Whiting wrote:
>>> Edward A. Falk wrote:
>>>> In this post-9/11 world, you'd be lucky not to be arrested just for
>>>> having it.
>>>>
>>>> Legally, you can only operate electronics like this with permission from
>>>> the airline (the pilot isn't allowed to make the decision). I'm guessing
>>>> that in most cases, either the airline hasn't approved the radio, or
>>>> the pilot doesn't know either way and tells you no just to be safe.
>>> Which law requires this permission to listen to a radio?
>> 91.21c
>>
>> (c) In the case of an aircraft operated by a holder of an air carrier
>> operating certificate or an operating certificate, the determination
>> required by paragraph (b)(5) of this section shall be made by that
>> operator of the aircraft on which the particular device is to be used.
>> In the case of other aircraft, the determination may be made by the
>> pilot in command or other operator of the aircraft.
>
> Commercial airline operations with passengers onboard are part 121 not
> 91. You want 121.306:
>

Then why does 91.21c have this line in it? "In the case of an aircraft
operated by a holder of an air carrier operating certificate or an
operating certificate,..."

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Gig 601XL Builder > wrote in
:

> Peter Clark wrote:
>> On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 16:31:11 -0600, Gig 601XL Builder
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> Matt Whiting wrote:
>>>> Edward A. Falk wrote:
>>>>> In this post-9/11 world, you'd be lucky not to be arrested just
>>>>> for having it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Legally, you can only operate electronics like this with
>>>>> permission from the airline (the pilot isn't allowed to make the
>>>>> decision). I'm guessing that in most cases, either the airline
>>>>> hasn't approved the radio, or the pilot doesn't know either way
>>>>> and tells you no just to be safe.
>>>> Which law requires this permission to listen to a radio?
>>> 91.21c
>>>
>>> (c) In the case of an aircraft operated by a holder of an air
>>> carrier operating certificate or an operating certificate, the
>>> determination required by paragraph (b)(5) of this section shall be
>>> made by that operator of the aircraft on which the particular device
>>> is to be used. In the case of other aircraft, the determination may
>>> be made by the pilot in command or other operator of the aircraft.
>>
>> Commercial airline operations with passengers onboard are part 121
>> not 91. You want 121.306:
>>
>
> Then why does 91.21c have this line in it? "In the case of an aircraft
> operated by a holder of an air carrier operating certificate or an
> operating certificate,..."
>

Some air carrier stuff can be done 91. I can't remember how or why, but
I did fly with a guy who did it in a Convair 880 out of Miami. I'm not
sure if it was a loophole or what, but they did it.


Bertie

[Peter Clark]

On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 22:54:31 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip >
wrote:


>
>Some air carrier stuff can be done 91. I can't remember how or why, but
>I did fly with a guy who did it in a Convair 880 out of Miami. I'm not
>sure if it was a loophole or what, but they did it.

Empty repositioning and maintenance flights are 91 as well are they
not?

[Jay Maynard]

On 2008-01-31, F. Baum > wrote:
> "Most Flights" Actually. ;). DAL and NWA do this also.

Oh, yeah? NW flights on 757 and smaller aircraft don't even have audio any
more. I haven't been on a DL flight that's had the comm feed on the audio
system, either. (Before you object that I don't know what I'm talking about,
I generally make Platinum Elite on NW in 6 months or so after the beginning
of the year.)

> On the bigger equipment they even have a moving map in the cabin so the
> Sheep can follow the progress. The cockpit crew has no control of the
> inflight entertainment system (Other than telling the cabin crew to shut
> it off).

The UA comm feed to channel 9 is controlled by the captain. I make a point,
on those rare occasions I fly UA, to thank the crew if the captain leaves
channel 9 up.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
http://www.hercules-390.org (Yes, that's me!)
Buy Hercules stuff at http://www.cafepress.com/hercules-390

[Matt Whiting]

Gig 601XL Builder wrote:
> Matt Whiting wrote:
>> Edward A. Falk wrote:
>>> In this post-9/11 world, you'd be lucky not to be arrested just for
>>> having it.
>>>
>>> Legally, you can only operate electronics like this with permission from
>>> the airline (the pilot isn't allowed to make the decision). I'm
>>> guessing
>>> that in most cases, either the airline hasn't approved the radio, or
>>> the pilot doesn't know either way and tells you no just to be safe.
>>
>> Which law requires this permission to listen to a radio?
>
> 91.21c
>
> (c) In the case of an aircraft operated by a holder of an air carrier
> operating certificate or an operating certificate, the determination
> required by paragraph (b)(5) of this section shall be made by that
> operator of the aircraft on which the particular device is to be used.
> In the case of other aircraft, the determination may be made by the
> pilot in command or other operator of the aircraft.

It doesn't say you have to ask permission. If the captain comes and
tells you to turn it off, then you turn it off. It doesn't say you have
to go ask for permission.

Matt

[Edward A. Falk]

http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2006/10/30
--
-Ed Falk,
http://thespamdiaries.blogspot.com/

[Aluckyguess]

You can take it on board. If they just tell them your a pilot going to pick
up a plane. They dont care.
"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
.. .
> es330td > wrote in
> :
>
>> On Jan 30, 9:49 pm, "Vaughn Simon" >
>> wrote:
>>> "es330td" > wrote in message
>>>
>>> news:03787d5e-672b-4070-99c5-eb3ed21e8aa3
> @j20g2000hsi.googlegroups.com
>>> ...
>>>
>>> > What are the odds I can get away with taking my ICOM radio and
>>> > listening to the cockpit?
>>>
>>> Well, you didn't say what kind of ICOM. It is probably not on th
>> e approved
>>> electronics list (but you know that). These days, there are so many
>>> con
>> sumer
>>> electronics goodies in the cabin that there is no way the crew can
>>> keep tr
>> ack.
>>> A fellow I work with actually got away with operating his ham 2-meter
>>> port
>> able
>>> radio on at least one flight. Needless to say: Transmitting on the
>>> air
>> bands
>>> from inside the passenger cabin would be a very dumb idea.
>>>
>>> Finding and following the correct radio channel would be a
>>> problem.
>>
>>>
>>> Vaughn
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> - Hide quoted text -
>>>
>>> - Show quoted text -
>>
>> It's an IC-A6, btw.
>>
>> I wouldn't DARE transmit. I don't even transmit when I'm in my car
>> when nobody could catch me. In this case I'll be sitting in 1st class
>> about 10 feet from the pilots. I would be clear enough that the pilot
>> would have to know it was someone on board.
>>
>> It shouldn't be too tough to do. I know the departure frequencies of
>> my airport and my flight number. As long as I can listen while we are
>> holding short I should be able to find the right one. Once I have
>> that I just have to listen for frequency changes. I do that myself
>> when flying so doing it with them shouldn't be any different.
>>
>> I just realized I'm going to have to get it through security. I doubt
>> they are going to let me take it on board.
>>
>
> I can't see why not. You could stand a chance of losing it, but I doubt
> they would know what it was.
> You wouldn't believe the crap I've brought through security....
>
>
> Bertie

[Edward A. Falk]

In article >,
es330td > wrote:
>On Jan 31, 7:29*am, B A R R Y > wrote:
>
>This is probably the strongest reason to not do it. I don't have my
>license yet (working on cross country) so I'm still in the "fascinated
>by it all" phase.

Yah, me too. I would love to just sit back and listen to the chatter
during the flight, but the few times I've actually brought a radio with
me, the pilot said I couldn't use it.

In the pre 9/11 days, I used to bring it with me anytime I went to the
airport and listen while I was waiting for the flight I was meeting. It's
a good way to practice your clearance shorthand too.

--
-Ed Falk,
http://thespamdiaries.blogspot.com/

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Peter Clark > wrote in
:

> On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 22:54:31 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip >
> wrote:
>
>
>>
>>Some air carrier stuff can be done 91. I can't remember how or why, but
>>I did fly with a guy who did it in a Convair 880 out of Miami. I'm not
>>sure if it was a loophole or what, but they did it.
>
> Empty repositioning and maintenance flights are 91 as well are they
> not?
>

Well, whe I flew 135 we called them 91 OK, but I always wondered if the FAA
would really buy that if the **** hit the fan. Flying heavies I've never
done that, though. The guy explained it to me at the time, but i can't
rmember how it worked. i suspect that they regarded it as a company
airplane and that they were transporting company material from one place to
another.
Fedex and UPS do something similar to this to get around operating US reg
airplanes in Europe. They're 121, but it's technically not legal to operate
between two european countries for revenue, so they say that they aren't
and that they're only moving material that's been collectd for truck
transport in a more expeditious way. IOW they haven't promised the customer
air travel. I probably don't have that exactly right but its something like
that anyway.. There was a lot of shouting and screaming over it a few years
ago...


Bertie

[Peter Clark]

On Fri, 01 Feb 2008 02:52:14 GMT, Matt Whiting >
wrote:


>It doesn't say you have to ask permission. If the captain comes and
>tells you to turn it off, then you turn it off. It doesn't say you have
>to go ask for permission.

The appropriate reg for the big airlines is 121.306(a) which says you
can't use it at all unless the airline has deemed it OK.

[B A R R Y[_2_]]

JGalban via AviationKB.com wrote:
> You'll probably also find
> that devices like TVs, AM/FM radios, tranceivers and scanners are never
> permitted.

That's been true for every in-flight magazine I've ever checked.

Transceivers are usually specifically mentioned.

[B A R R Y[_2_]]

aluckyguess wrote:
> You can take it on board. If they just tell them your a pilot going to pick
> up a plane. They dont care.

I've never been asked. My carry on usually includes my handheld,
headset and GPS. Other times, my carry on is my entire flight bag,
charts and all. I don't even have one of those silly "CREW" tags from
Sporty's. <G>

I doubt TSA knows the difference between an aviation handheld, the
multitudes of ham radios, scanners, and Disney World-bound FRS radios,
that fly every day, and the one on their belt.

It's not like you need a license to possess a radio. Yet...

[F. Baum]

On Jan 31, 10:41*am, John > wrote:
>
> Really? *What airline does this nowadays? *I remember American and
> United used to back in the 80's and I loved to follow along in an
> atlas with high airways over printed on the maps (hey, it beat what
> was showing for a movie 99.4% of the time). *But it seems to me
> everyone stopped doing that in the late 80's and early 90's.
>
I guess I will stand corrected on this one. I ride in the back all the
time but I never pay attention to whats on the radio (Or the silly
inflight movies). The last time I did run through the channels was on
a 767-400 and it was there. I also noticed it on a 767-300 ER a few
years back, but that was into FRA . Could be different for
International ?

[JGalban via AviationKB.com]

Matt Whiting wrote:
>
>It doesn't say you have to ask permission. If the captain comes and
>tells you to turn it off, then you turn it off. It doesn't say you have
>to go ask for permission.
>

121.306 (a) Except as provided in paragraph (b) of this section, no person
may
operate,nor may any operator or pilot in command of an aircraft allow the
operation of, any portable electronic device on any U.S. registered civil
aircraft operating under this part.

(b)5 says :

Any other portable electronic device that the part 119
certificate holder has determined will not cause interference with the
navigation or communication system of the aircraft on which it is to be
used.

That would seem to rule out the notion that you can operate any device you
want until you're told to turn it off.

John Galban====>N4BQ (PA28-280)

--
Message posted via AviationKB.com
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[JOM]

A part 121 or 135 air carrier can make a non-revenue flight under part 91. Example: a maintenance flight, moving unscheduled aircraft from one location to another, or return from a trip with no cargo or passengers, etc.


.... Commercial airline operations with passengers onboard are part 121 not
91. You want 121.306:
[/i][/color]

Then why does 91.21c have this line in it? "In the case of an aircraft
operated by a holder of an air carrier operating certificate or an
operating certificate,..."[/QUOTE]

[Kobra]

>Anyone take an ICOM on a commercial flight.

I did this once. I also brought some earbuds to see if I could follow our
flight's clearences and handoffs.

It was fun, but I noticed that I had difficulty right from the start because
at large airports there are several tower frequencies depending on the
runways in use. I struggled to find the right frequencies and lost it
shortly after the handoff from Tower to Departure. I couldn't figure out
why.

About a minute later I looked down at the ICOM and my faced turn red! The
transmit light was ON!!! I don't remember the details on this but, somehow
when I plugged the headset in it also KEYED the mic!!! The transmit light
was on almost continously!!

I don't know for sure, but I may have stepped on my flights transmittions
and caused grief for anyone else on the frequency. I never did that again
and later found out that the type of jack I was using on the stereo headset
was the problem. Quite embarressing and now I know why they don't allow
such activity.

Kobra