2 cylinder engines

[[email protected]]

To pick up on the 2 cylinder engine discussion, for those that might
be interested, I have been test flying a direct drive, v-twin Generac
industrial engine (generators, weed cutters, etc), with 38 peak hp, on
my Thunder Gull. There are others flying with re-drive versions, as
well as some Briggs, Kohler and Honda efforts too. All this is
discussed on http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Small4-strokeEngines/.

I did a series of reports on my development and testing there. Search
thru the old messages on "Generac" for my reports. Sorry, I don't want
to repeat any of that here, so I am back to lurk mode.

Regards,
Jerry Booker

[stol]

On Feb 1, 6:25*pm, wrote:
> To pick up on the 2 cylinder engine discussion, for those that might
> be interested, I have been test flying a direct drive, v-twin Generac
> industrial engine (generators, weed cutters, etc), with 38 peak hp, on
> my Thunder Gull. There are others flying with re-drive versions, as
> well as some Briggs, Kohler and Honda efforts too. All this is
> discussed onhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/Small4-strokeEngines/.
>
> I did a series of reports on my development and testing there. Search
> thru the old messages on "Generac" for my reports. Sorry, I don't want
> to repeat any of that here, so I am back to lurk mode.
>
> Regards,
> Jerry Booker

I am in the middle of a Generac fiasco now. A homeowner I built a
house for installed a Generac generator and it has an intake fire
every time it tries to start... Not a good thing for sure. I have a
video and am going to post it on YouTube soon. If I am not wrong the
Generac unit uses a Vanguard engine, basically a top of the line
Briggs & Stratton motor... They seem kinda heavy for aircraft use
though... JMHO...

[Dave[_5_]]

A few years ago a man of my acquaintance picked up a BMW opposed twin
motorcycle engine, and was building an airplane around it. This was
his third homebuilt, so he had a proven track record - and his work
was top notch. The design was a pusher configuration - a descendant of
his original, which was a Titan Tornado. The engine was new, or nearly
so. I expect that the project was a success - but I moved before it
was finished, so don't know how it turned out.

David Johnson

[Vaughn Simon]

"Dave" > wrote in message
...
>A few years ago a man of my acquaintance picked up a BMW opposed twin
> motorcycle engine, and was building an airplane around it.

The wonderful irony is that the original BMW twin was built as an airplane
engine, and then someone thought of trying one in a motorcycle.

Vaughn ('65 BMW R60)

[Andy[_6_]]

"Vaughn Simon" > wrote in message
news:cFZoj.190842>
> The wonderful irony is that the original BMW twin was built as an
> airplane engine, and then someone thought of trying one in a motorcycle.
>
> Vaughn ('65 BMW R60)

It would be fun if that were true but I have an extensive library of BMW
motorcycle books and I think that's another story that has been repeated so
many times it's become accepted but isn't based in fact. Sort of like the
notion that the blue and white roundel is supposed to represent a spinning
propeller. It's just not based in fact. the first BMW twin was designed by
an aircraft engineer Max Friz but was inspired by an earlier British design,
the Douglas twin. The roundel design came from 1917 and was based on the
Rapp Motorwerken logo using the colors and basic design from the Bavarian
free state flag in the center. The notion of the spinning propeller came
from a much later advertisement when BMW started builting radial engines
under license from Pratt &Whitney.

I like your bike, I let my older R50/2 go when I upgraded to an R60/6. No
regrets but the /2 always seemed more solid somehow.

[oilsardine[_2_]]

and then back again
http://www.takeoff-ul.de/motoren.html



"Vaughn Simon" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
>
> "Dave" > wrote in message
> ...
>>A few years ago a man of my acquaintance picked up a BMW opposed twin
>> motorcycle engine, and was building an airplane around it.
>
> The wonderful irony is that the original BMW twin was built as an
> airplane engine, and then someone thought of trying one in a motorcycle.
>
> Vaughn ('65 BMW R60)
>

[Stealth Pilot[_2_]]

On Fri, 1 Feb 2008 18:08:24 -0800 (PST), stol >
wrote:

>On Feb 1, 6:25*pm, wrote:
>> To pick up on the 2 cylinder engine discussion, for those that might
>> be interested, I have been test flying a direct drive, v-twin Generac
>> industrial engine (generators, weed cutters, etc), with 38 peak hp, on
>> my Thunder Gull. There are others flying with re-drive versions, as
>> well as some Briggs, Kohler and Honda efforts too. All this is
>> discussed onhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/Small4-strokeEngines/.
>>
>> I did a series of reports on my development and testing there. Search
>> thru the old messages on "Generac" for my reports. Sorry, I don't want
>> to repeat any of that here, so I am back to lurk mode.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Jerry Booker
>
>I am in the middle of a Generac fiasco now. A homeowner I built a
>house for installed a Generac generator and it has an intake fire
>every time it tries to start... Not a good thing for sure. I have a
>video and am going to post it on YouTube soon. If I am not wrong the
>Generac unit uses a Vanguard engine, basically a top of the line
>Briggs & Stratton motor... They seem kinda heavy for aircraft use
>though... JMHO...

most of the V engines are around 90 lbs.
the Briggs 'n Stratton Vanguard is evidently around 70lb.

[[email protected]]

> most of the V engines are around 90 lbs.
> the Briggs 'n Stratton Vanguard is evidently around 70lb.

It's 125 lb. Not light at all. See
http://www.commercialpower.com/display/router.asp?docid=80498

Dan

[Philippe Vessaire]

wrote:

>
> To pick up on the 2 cylinder engine discussion, for those that might
> be interested, I have been test flying a direct drive, v-twin Generac
> industrial engine (generators, weed cutters, etc), with 38 peak hp, on
> my Thunder Gull. There are others flying with re-drive versions, as
> well as some Briggs, Kohler and Honda efforts too. All this is
> discussed on http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Small4-strokeEngines/.

B&S powered: http://luciolemc30.blogspot.com/


By
--
Volem rien foutre al païs!
Philippe Vessaire Ò¿Ó¬

[Steve Hix]

In article >,
"Vaughn Simon" > wrote:

> "Dave" > wrote in message
> ...
> >A few years ago a man of my acquaintance picked up a BMW opposed twin
> > motorcycle engine, and was building an airplane around it.
>
> The wonderful irony is that the original BMW twin was built as an airplane
> engine, and then someone thought of trying one in a motorcycle.

No, it wasn't.

BMW made aircraft engines through WW1, including some that were used to
set absolute altitude records (look at the BMW logo; it's a four-blade
propellor quartering alternate blue sky and white clouds).

After WW1, BMW was prohibited from making anything to do with aviation,
so they switched to making cheap office furniture from their stocks of
plywood, and aluminum cookware, since they already had the foundry
capability.

Their first motorcycle was a 148cc moped-ish bike called the "Flink",
never sold under the BMW name, and it failed in the market.

Their first boxer engine was based on the British Douglas engine, and
sold to other companies to put in their motorcycles. They didn't offer a
motorcycle under their own name until the R32 in 1923.

Max Friz, who headed BMW engineering, didn't think much of the
motorcycle business; it was just something to keep them out of
bankruptcy until they could start making airplanes and airplane engines
again.

L.J.K. Setwright wrote a pretty entertaining history of BMW, that used
to be available at BMW shops.

[Stealth Pilot[_2_]]

On Sat, 2 Feb 2008 09:48:49 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

>> most of the V engines are around 90 lbs.
>> the Briggs 'n Stratton Vanguard is evidently around 70lb.
>
> It's 125 lb. Not light at all. See
>http://www.commercialpower.com/display/router.asp?docid=80498
>
> Dan
>
>
have a look on the luciole site that phillip vesaire posted and note
the slight difference between the stock engine and all its
accessories, and the engine as mounted in flying condition. I wouldnt
have believed 50 lb difference but it seems to be.

[Peter Dohm]

> wrote in message
...
>> most of the V engines are around 90 lbs.
>> the Briggs 'n Stratton Vanguard is evidently around 70lb.
>
> It's 125 lb. Not light at all. See
> http://www.commercialpower.com/display/router.asp?docid=80498
>
> Dan
>
Yeah, something changed while I wasn't paying attention.

Up through 28 or 29 horsepower was in that lower range of weights, IIRC.
However, everything above 23 hp appears to now be part of their "big block"
series, which is around 125 pounds for the air cooled version. There is
also a liqued cooled version, which is even heavier.

While the "rest of the story" is probably interesting, your point is well
taken.

BTW, the 23 hp Briggs engine (like the 20 hp Kohler engine) is still in the
weight range that we remembered--although there does not appear to be any
advantage in horsepower per pound.

Peter

[[email protected]]

My 38 peak hp Generac, stripped for flying and direct drive, weighs
about 79 pounds dry. It stays plenty cool installed as a free-air
cooled pusher on my Thunder Gull. Valley Engineering is working on a
version that they think will be about 70 pounds.

[[email protected]]

On Feb 3, 5:20 pm, wrote:
> My 38 peak hp Generac, stripped for flying and direct drive, weighs
> about 79 pounds dry. It stays plenty cool installed as a free-air
> cooled pusher on my Thunder Gull. Valley Engineering is working on a
> version that they think will be about 70 pounds.

That's more like it. How much do they think they'll sell these
things for once they're ready?

Dan

[Peter Dohm]

> wrote in message
...
> My 38 peak hp Generac, stripped for flying and direct drive, weighs
> about 79 pounds dry. It stays plenty cool installed as a free-air
> cooled pusher on my Thunder Gull. Valley Engineering is working on a
> version that they think will be about 70 pounds.

OK, so far so good.

I did a quick web search and found a model GHT990, which is a 992cc V-Twin
that seems to fit the description; with a max power of 38 hp and a
recommended power of 32 hp. It is stated to weigh 119 pounds as delivered,
which is about six pounds lighter than the 33 hp Briggs--for which I did not
happen to notice graphs for peak and normal power--although they almost
certainly exist.

The question is: What did you have to remove to reduce the weight by 40
pounds?

Peter

[Darrel Toepfer]

"oilsardine" > wrote:

> and then back again
> http://www.takeoff-ul.de/motoren.html

Try this instead:
http://www.takeoff-ul.de/motoren.htm

[Morgans[_2_]]

"Darrel Toepfer" > wrote in message
. 18...
> "oilsardine" > wrote:
>
>> and then back again
>> http://www.takeoff-ul.de/motoren.html
>
> Try this instead:
> http://www.takeoff-ul.de/motoren.htm

I like it, I think, but is there an English version available?
--
Jim in NC

[clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada]

On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 18:28:23 -0400, "Morgans"
> wrote:

>
>"Darrel Toepfer" > wrote in message
. 18...
>> "oilsardine" > wrote:
>>
>>> and then back again
>>> http://www.takeoff-ul.de/motoren.html
>>
>> Try this instead:
>> http://www.takeoff-ul.de/motoren.htm
>
>I like it, I think, but is there an English version available?

How about the HKS?
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

[Morgans[_2_]]

>>> Try this instead:
>>> http://www.takeoff-ul.de/motoren.htm
>>
> How about the HKS?
> ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

Was the link at the top above, a BMW conversion?

HKS would not be at the top of my list.
--
Jim in NC