Ferry Pilot Down

[Jay Honeck[_2_]]

Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at Hooters) for
a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North Atlantic, 50 miles
short of Keflavik, Iceland.

Here's the story, from Airliners.net:
************************************************** *************************************************
At 15:50 local time, contact was made with RKV ICG centre from a Cessna 310,
arriving from Narsarsuaq, which had lost power in one of its engines, 60
miles off Keflavik. In an effort to pump fuel between tanks its feared both
engines failed and the pilot had to rely on gliding the aircraft. At the
time he was descending through 7000 ft heading towards Reykjavik.

RKV ATC Centre initiated emergency status in KEF and the ICG Centre sent its
Super Pumas, TF-GNA and TF-LIF out to the incident site.

At 16:10 the Cessna 310 disappeared from radar, around 50 miles from
Keflavik.

A Challenger 604 from the Danish Air Force was sent straight to the scene of
the incident and a full search was carried out from that point.

TF-LIF arrived at the scene around 17:00. No sighting of the Cessna 310 had
been made and no signal from the emergency transmitter was noticed.

Three trawlers which were near the scene of the incident where called
immediately into action and a full scale search was underway. A Cessna 172
aircraft was also involved in the search operation as well as various rescue
boats from Slysavarnarfelagid Landsbjorg.

ICGs own F27 TF-SYN was sent out as a surveillance aircraft to replace the
efforts of the DAF CL604. A patrol vessel from the ICG was also sent out to
help the search efforts.
************************************************** *************************************************
Pretty much a worst-case scenario. High seas, ice cold water, gliding a
dead stick C-310 into 40-foot swells. NWPilot says he didn't start drinking
until 3 hours after the crash -- survival time in the water is estimated at
2 hours, maximum, in a survival suit. The pilot's name was Jeff Hall, and he
helped NW get into the biz.

Raise a toast to a brave man, gents....
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[[email protected]]

On Feb 11, 6:34*pm, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at Hooters) for
> a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North Atlantic, 50 miles
> short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>
> Here's the story, from Airliners.net:
> ************************************************** **************************************************
> At 15:50 local time, contact was made with RKV ICG centre from a Cessna 310,
> arriving from Narsarsuaq, which had lost power in one of its engines, 60
> miles off Keflavik. In an effort to pump fuel between tanks its feared both
> engines failed and the pilot had to rely on gliding the aircraft. At the
> time he was descending through 7000 ft heading towards Reykjavik.
>
> RKV ATC Centre initiated emergency status in KEF and the ICG Centre sent its
> Super Pumas, TF-GNA and TF-LIF out to the incident site.
>
> At 16:10 the Cessna 310 disappeared from radar, around 50 miles from
> Keflavik.
>
> A Challenger 604 from the Danish Air Force was sent straight to the scene of
> the incident and a full search was carried out from that point.
>
> TF-LIF arrived at the scene around 17:00. No sighting of the Cessna 310 had
> been made and no signal from the emergency transmitter was noticed.
>
> Three trawlers which were near the scene of the incident where called
> immediately into action and a full scale search was underway. A Cessna 172
> aircraft was also involved in the search operation as well as various rescue
> boats from Slysavarnarfelagid Landsbjorg.
>
> ICGs own F27 TF-SYN was sent out as a surveillance aircraft to replace the
> efforts of the DAF CL604. A patrol vessel from the ICG was also sent out to
> help the search efforts.
> ************************************************** **************************************************
> Pretty much a worst-case scenario. *High seas, ice cold water, gliding a
> dead stick C-310 into 40-foot swells. *NWPilot says he didn't start drinking
> until 3 hours after the crash -- survival time in the water is estimated at
> 2 hours, maximum, in a survival suit. The pilot's name was Jeff Hall, and he
> helped NW get into the biz.
>
> Raise a toast to a brave man, gents....
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"

So Sad............

Ben
www.haaspowerair.com

[gatt[_2_]]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:mI6sj.29479$9j6.4199@attbi_s22...


> Pretty much a worst-case scenario. High seas, ice cold water, gliding a
> dead stick C-310 into 40-foot swells. NWPilot says he didn't start
> drinking until 3 hours after the crash -- survival time in the water is
> estimated at 2 hours, maximum, in a survival suit. The pilot's name was
> Jeff Hall, and he helped NW get into the biz.
>
> Raise a toast to a brave man, gents....


*salute*

Thanks for passing this on.

-c

[Dudley Henriques[_2_]]

Jay Honeck wrote:
> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at Hooters)
> for a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North Atlantic, 50
> miles short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>
> Here's the story, from Airliners.net:
> ************************************************** *************************************************
>
> At 15:50 local time, contact was made with RKV ICG centre from a Cessna
> 310, arriving from Narsarsuaq, which had lost power in one of its
> engines, 60 miles off Keflavik. In an effort to pump fuel between tanks
> its feared both engines failed and the pilot had to rely on gliding the
> aircraft. At the time he was descending through 7000 ft heading towards
> Reykjavik.
>
> RKV ATC Centre initiated emergency status in KEF and the ICG Centre sent
> its Super Pumas, TF-GNA and TF-LIF out to the incident site.
>
> At 16:10 the Cessna 310 disappeared from radar, around 50 miles from
> Keflavik.
>
> A Challenger 604 from the Danish Air Force was sent straight to the
> scene of the incident and a full search was carried out from that point.
>
> TF-LIF arrived at the scene around 17:00. No sighting of the Cessna 310
> had been made and no signal from the emergency transmitter was noticed.
>
> Three trawlers which were near the scene of the incident where called
> immediately into action and a full scale search was underway. A Cessna
> 172 aircraft was also involved in the search operation as well as
> various rescue boats from Slysavarnarfelagid Landsbjorg.
>
> ICGs own F27 TF-SYN was sent out as a surveillance aircraft to replace
> the efforts of the DAF CL604. A patrol vessel from the ICG was also sent
> out to help the search efforts.
> ************************************************** *************************************************
>
> Pretty much a worst-case scenario. High seas, ice cold water, gliding a
> dead stick C-310 into 40-foot swells. NWPilot says he didn't start
> drinking until 3 hours after the crash -- survival time in the water is
> estimated at 2 hours, maximum, in a survival suit. The pilot's name was
> Jeff Hall, and he helped NW get into the biz.
>
> Raise a toast to a brave man, gents....

These long over water ferry flights are much more dangerous than the
average person might expect. The pilots engaged in this line of work
deserve a lot of respect.
I sincerely hope there was something friendly under him if he went down
but I doubt that will be the case.
Others have correctly stated the dangers.
It's a shame about this pilot. NW Pilot has my sincere condolences with
this. I know what it feels like to go through these things.

--
Dudley Henriques

[[email protected]]

On Feb 11, 5:34 pm, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at Hooters) for
> a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North Atlantic, 50 miles
> short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>
> Here's the story, from Airliners.net:
> ************************************************** *************************************************
> At 15:50 local time, contact was made with RKV ICG centre from a Cessna 310,
> arriving from Narsarsuaq, which had lost power in one of its engines, 60
> miles off Keflavik. In an effort to pump fuel between tanks its feared both
> engines failed and the pilot had to rely on gliding the aircraft. At the
> time he was descending through 7000 ft heading towards Reykjavik.
>
> RKV ATC Centre initiated emergency status in KEF and the ICG Centre sent its
> Super Pumas, TF-GNA and TF-LIF out to the incident site.
>
> At 16:10 the Cessna 310 disappeared from radar, around 50 miles from
> Keflavik.
>
> A Challenger 604 from the Danish Air Force was sent straight to the scene of
> the incident and a full search was carried out from that point.
>
> TF-LIF arrived at the scene around 17:00. No sighting of the Cessna 310 had
> been made and no signal from the emergency transmitter was noticed.
>
> Three trawlers which were near the scene of the incident where called
> immediately into action and a full scale search was underway. A Cessna 172
> aircraft was also involved in the search operation as well as various rescue
> boats from Slysavarnarfelagid Landsbjorg.
>
> ICGs own F27 TF-SYN was sent out as a surveillance aircraft to replace the
> efforts of the DAF CL604. A patrol vessel from the ICG was also sent out to
> help the search efforts.
> ************************************************** *************************************************
> Pretty much a worst-case scenario. High seas, ice cold water, gliding a
> dead stick C-310 into 40-foot swells. NWPilot says he didn't start drinking
> until 3 hours after the crash -- survival time in the water is estimated at
> 2 hours, maximum, in a survival suit. The pilot's name was Jeff Hall, and he
> helped NW get into the biz.
>
> Raise a toast to a brave man, gents....
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"

Thanks Jay,

If your in this business it's a small group of pilots that do it
regularly and we get to know each other. He will be missed by a bunch
of other pilots. He worked his rear off crossing almost weekly.

I am Currently On my way across this week shutdown for ice here in
Ohio the aircraft T182 should be able to be tanked Thursday and have a
Friday crossing to Santa Maria.

Ditching is a ferry pilots worst nightmare but we understand it dose
happen even to experienced pilots with hundreds of crossings.

Last 12 Months,
Fritz Schroder 02/2007 (SR20, Blown Engine Outside Narsarsuaq)
Lori Love 08/2007 (Vanished Between Accra Ghana And Namibia)

[Dan[_1_]]

On Feb 12, 6:23*am, wrote:
> On Feb 11, 5:34 pm, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at Hooters) for
> > a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North Atlantic, 50 miles
> > short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>
> > Here's the story, from Airliners.net:
> > ************************************************** **************************************************
> > At 15:50 local time, contact was made with RKV ICG centre from a Cessna 310,
> > arriving from Narsarsuaq, which had lost power in one of its engines, 60
> > miles off Keflavik. In an effort to pump fuel between tanks its feared both
> > engines failed and the pilot had to rely on gliding the aircraft. At the
> > time he was descending through 7000 ft heading towards Reykjavik.
>
> > RKV ATC Centre initiated emergency status in KEF and the ICG Centre sent its
> > Super Pumas, TF-GNA and TF-LIF out to the incident site.
>
> > At 16:10 the Cessna 310 disappeared from radar, around 50 miles from
> > Keflavik.
>
> > A Challenger 604 from the Danish Air Force was sent straight to the scene of
> > the incident and a full search was carried out from that point.
>
> > TF-LIF arrived at the scene around 17:00. No sighting of the Cessna 310 had
> > been made and no signal from the emergency transmitter was noticed.
>
> > Three trawlers which were near the scene of the incident where called
> > immediately into action and a full scale search was underway. A Cessna 172
> > aircraft was also involved in the search operation as well as various rescue
> > boats from Slysavarnarfelagid Landsbjorg.
>
> > ICGs own F27 TF-SYN was sent out as a surveillance aircraft to replace the
> > efforts of the DAF CL604. A patrol vessel from the ICG was also sent out to
> > help the search efforts.
> > ************************************************** **************************************************
> > Pretty much a worst-case scenario. *High seas, ice cold water, gliding a
> > dead stick C-310 into 40-foot swells. *NWPilot says he didn't start drinking
> > until 3 hours after the crash -- survival time in the water is estimated at
> > 2 hours, maximum, in a survival suit. The pilot's name was Jeff Hall, and he
> > helped NW get into the biz.
>
> > Raise a toast to a brave man, gents....
> > --
> > Jay Honeck
> > Iowa City, IA
> > Pathfinder N56993www.AlexisParkInn.com
> > "Your Aviation Destination"
>
> Thanks Jay,
>
> If your in this business it's a small group of pilots that do it
> regularly and we get to know each other. He will be missed by a bunch
> of other pilots. He worked his rear off crossing almost weekly.
>
> I am Currently On my way across this week shutdown for ice here in
> Ohio the aircraft T182 should be able to be tanked Thursday and have a
> Friday crossing to Santa Maria.
>
> Ditching is a ferry pilots worst nightmare but we understand it dose
> happen even to experienced pilots with hundreds of crossings.
>
> Last 12 Months,
> Fritz Schroder 02/2007 (SR20, Blown Engine Outside Narsarsuaq)
> Lori Love 08/2007 (Vanished Between Accra Ghana And Namibia)- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Do ferry pilots universally carry 406 Mhz GPS PLBs? I know I would
want one for sure.

If the pilot who vanished in Africa had one, and a signal was not
received, it could be (somewhat) reasonably assumed that she died on
impact.

--Dan

[Darkwing]

"Dan" > wrote in message
...
On Feb 12, 6:23 am, wrote:
> On Feb 11, 5:34 pm, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at Hooters)
> > for
> > a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North Atlantic, 50 miles
> > short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>
> > Here's the story, from Airliners.net:
> > ************************************************** **************************************************
> > At 15:50 local time, contact was made with RKV ICG centre from a Cessna
> > 310,
> > arriving from Narsarsuaq, which had lost power in one of its engines, 60
> > miles off Keflavik. In an effort to pump fuel between tanks its feared
> > both
> > engines failed and the pilot had to rely on gliding the aircraft. At the
> > time he was descending through 7000 ft heading towards Reykjavik.
>
> > RKV ATC Centre initiated emergency status in KEF and the ICG Centre sent
> > its
> > Super Pumas, TF-GNA and TF-LIF out to the incident site.
>
> > At 16:10 the Cessna 310 disappeared from radar, around 50 miles from
> > Keflavik.
>
> > A Challenger 604 from the Danish Air Force was sent straight to the
> > scene of
> > the incident and a full search was carried out from that point.
>
> > TF-LIF arrived at the scene around 17:00. No sighting of the Cessna 310
> > had
> > been made and no signal from the emergency transmitter was noticed.
>
> > Three trawlers which were near the scene of the incident where called
> > immediately into action and a full scale search was underway. A Cessna
> > 172
> > aircraft was also involved in the search operation as well as various
> > rescue
> > boats from Slysavarnarfelagid Landsbjorg.
>
> > ICGs own F27 TF-SYN was sent out as a surveillance aircraft to replace
> > the
> > efforts of the DAF CL604. A patrol vessel from the ICG was also sent out
> > to
> > help the search efforts.
> > ************************************************** **************************************************
> > Pretty much a worst-case scenario. High seas, ice cold water, gliding a
> > dead stick C-310 into 40-foot swells. NWPilot says he didn't start
> > drinking
> > until 3 hours after the crash -- survival time in the water is estimated
> > at
> > 2 hours, maximum, in a survival suit. The pilot's name was Jeff Hall,
> > and he
> > helped NW get into the biz.
>
> > Raise a toast to a brave man, gents....
> > --
> > Jay Honeck
> > Iowa City, IA
> > Pathfinder N56993www.AlexisParkInn.com
> > "Your Aviation Destination"
>
> Thanks Jay,
>
> If your in this business it's a small group of pilots that do it
> regularly and we get to know each other. He will be missed by a bunch
> of other pilots. He worked his rear off crossing almost weekly.
>
> I am Currently On my way across this week shutdown for ice here in
> Ohio the aircraft T182 should be able to be tanked Thursday and have a
> Friday crossing to Santa Maria.
>
> Ditching is a ferry pilots worst nightmare but we understand it dose
> happen even to experienced pilots with hundreds of crossings.
>
> Last 12 Months,
> Fritz Schroder 02/2007 (SR20, Blown Engine Outside Narsarsuaq)
> Lori Love 08/2007 (Vanished Between Accra Ghana And Namibia)- Hide quoted
> text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
>
>Do ferry pilots universally carry 406 Mhz GPS PLBs? I know I would
>want one for sure.
>
>If the pilot who vanished in Africa had one, and a signal was not
>received, it could be (somewhat) reasonably assumed that she died on
>impact.
>
>--Dan
>


I'm still amazed they can't find Steve Fossett here in the USA. Amazing how
big the world truly is at ground level.

[[email protected]]

On Feb 12, 1:30 pm, John Smith > wrote:
> In article
> >,
>
> wrote:
> > I am Currently On my way across this week shutdown for ice here in
> > Ohio the aircraft T182 should be able to be tanked Thursday and have a
> > Friday crossing to Santa Maria.
>
> Where are you in Ohio?
> I am in Columbus area.

I am in Cincy, I carry a 406 with GPS and I where it and it is
recommended to turn it on before ditching.. I knew Jeff flew the same
routs at the same time he had a lite military style immersion suit I
and very small raft if any at all I had never seen him with an Epirb
he packed lightly and we have both helped load our accessories and
test our HF Radios. he alway told me to be more productive take less/
smaller stuff.

More info from Iceland Review,

An extensive search for an American pilot was launched yesterday
afternoon after reports were received that his small Cessna 310
airplane crashed into the ocean 50 nautical miles west of Reykjanes
peninsula, Iceland's southwestern coast.

The pilot, who was the only one onboard, was traveling from
Narsassuaq, Greenland, to Reykjavík when his engines went dead, the
first at 3 pm. He managed to send an emergency message about having
trouble transferring fuel between tanks, Morgunbladid reports.

Shortly afterwards the pilot reported that he had also lost power in
the other engine and that his airplane was hovering at an altitude of
7,000 feet. The Icelandic Coast Guard sent one of its helicopters TF-
LIF towards the airplane. A Danish military aircraft had already begun
searching for the Cessna.

Three fishing vessels located near the scene of the accident and Coast
Guard cruisers were also called to the scene of the accident as well
as the Coast Guard airplane TF-SIF, and other airplanes.

Head Icelandic Coast Guard pilot Sigurdur Heidar Wiium, who flew the
TF-LIF helicopter, said the conditions had been very difficult
yesterday. "The waves were high and it was stormy, making it difficult
to search in the ocean."

In the evening it began snowing and the visibility in the search area
was poor. Captain Thorsteinn Eyjólfsson of trawler Baldvin Njálsson
GK-400, which was fishing only 10 nautical miles away from the scene
of the accident, said conditions for searching were extremely
difficult.

The air search was called off late last night.

[[email protected]]

Will miss Jeffrey, was good friend... Gonna be a hard crossing this
weekend with this in back of my mind.... hope he did not suffer!

[[email protected]]

He was the only one i knew that would take anything over 600SMHO over
the pond.... he was good people. I will miss the stuck days in Bangor,
St john, Narsarsuaq, santa maria. with him would make a long flight
long flight a Short flight on 121.7 chit chatting.... this one really
hits home!!!!! I know i ahve only been doing this about 2 years but
you make friends and it's hard when they go way like this....


In winter there is usually n o survival on any ditching survival time
is about 2min to 3 hours depending if your wearing a suit and it's
quality. Mustang is now befor my next crossing a must the sterns i
have will give 1.5 to 2 hours in them conditions my raft EAM-T-4 with
cover will give 24 to 36 hours that is if i can get in to it...

If any on can do the survival training from CAMI in OKC or cretin
AFB's go do it they will slam you in the water and let you egress not
funnn....

if he did get in his little raft if he even if he had it with him i
know! he some times went across with out one crazy fella... Was good
people very hard worker....

bye bye

[Dan[_1_]]

On Feb 13, 12:25*am, wrote:
> He was the only one i knew that would take anything over 600SMHO over
> the pond.... he was good people. I will miss the stuck days in Bangor,
> St john, Narsarsuaq, santa maria. with him would make a long flight
> long flight a Short flight on 121.7 chit chatting.... this one really
> hits home!!!!! I know i ahve only been doing this about 2 years but
> you make friends and it's hard when they go way like this....
>
> In winter there is usually n o survival on any ditching survival time
> is about 2min to 3 hours depending if your wearing a suit and it's
> quality. Mustang is now befor my next crossing a must the sterns i
> have will give 1.5 to 2 hours in them conditions my raft EAM-T-4 with
> cover will give 24 to 36 hours that is if i can get in to it...
>
> If any on can do the survival training from CAMI *in OKC or cretin
> AFB's go do it they will slam you in the water and let you egress not
> funnn....
>
> if he did get in his little raft if he even if he had it with him i
> know! he some times went across with out one crazy fella... Was good
> people very hard worker....
>
> bye bye


Is it common for ferry pilots to specify a max SMOH time? I can
definately understand why, but I'm not sure that it statistically
makes a difference, as long as the engine has been well maintained.
Interesting.

--Dan

[RST Engineering]

I'll tellya right now I'd rather be flying one with five hundred hours on it
than five hours on it.

Properly maintained, of course.


Jim

--
"If you think you can, or think you can't, you're right."
--Henry Ford



Is it common for ferry pilots to specify a max SMOH time? I can
definately understand why, but I'm not sure that it statistically
makes a difference, as long as the engine has been well maintained.
Interesting.

--Dan

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in
news:mI6sj.29479$9j6.4199@attbi_s22:

> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at
> Hooters) for a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North
> Atlantic, 50 miles short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>



New low for you there Jay.


Bertie

[C J Campbell[_1_]]

On 2008-02-11 17:34:10 -0800, "Jay Honeck" > said:

> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at
> Hooters) for a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North
> Atlantic, 50 miles short of Keflavik, Iceland.
> ...
> Raise a toast to a brave man, gents....

A toast (n.a. for me, of course)!
--
Waddling Eagle
World Famous Flight Instructor

[RL Anderson]

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
> "Jay Honeck" > wrote in
> news:mI6sj.29479$9j6.4199@attbi_s22:
>
>> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at
>> Hooters) for a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North
>> Atlantic, 50 miles short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>>
>
>
>
> New low for you there Jay.
>
>
> Bertie
>


Hi Bertie,

I have watched your posts for quite a few years. WTF gives you the
balls to bitch out Jay for posting that NWPilot mentioned to him, on a
phone call, that one of his "compadres" went down on a ferry flight over
the North Atlantic? NWPilot, and a very small group of pilots, perform
a very vital service to the aviation community. I am not a pilot
myself. I am a retired US Air Force enlisted communications puke who
had job responsibilities that took me into the worlds of the "bus
driver" and the "fighter jock". However, I do know a whole ****load of
civilian pilots, of various qualification levels as well. In fact, I
have a close family member who is a "four striper" on a major US
airline. Because of this, I have a pretty good outlook on the military
and civilian pilot communities. However, in the case of NWPilot and his
"compadres", it takes a very special group of pilots to ferry "small"
aircraft over the two big "ponds" off the east and west coasts of the
North American continent. The North Atlantic, like the North Pacific,
can be fatal to anyone who "screws the pooch". It appears, that in this
case, a mechanical failure may have occurred and the airplane went down,
taking the pilot with it. However, none of us in this NG knows the
exact details of this accident and probably will never know.

You may be a sim pilot, or a "pattern pilot" or a non-pilot who may have
an interest in aviation. Before you start bitching out guys like Jay,
pull your head out of your ass and understand how airplanes, and
aviation, work. For the record, I have not been anywhere in the State
of Iowa since May 1988. I have never been to Iowa City and have not
stayed at Jay's establishment. He, and Mary, bust their asses off to
run a great little business. It is great that they are both airplane
owners and pilots. As I watch your posts, your stupidity is hilarious
at the minimum, and criminal at the maximum. If you are a pilot, you
exhibit a stupidity only exhibited by various US politicians. In this
particular case, Jay was passing on what he was told on a phone call to
the people who frequent this NG. Before you decide to bitch Jay (or
anyone else for that matter) out do your ****ing homework!!! I have
been lurking, and posting, in NGs since the mid 90s. You, and MX, are
just as bad, if not worse, than the "MI-5 Guy". Do yourself a favor and
get your **** together. You, and MX, will become more credible as a result.

Later

Rick

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

RL Anderson > wrote in
:

> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>> "Jay Honeck" > wrote in
>> news:mI6sj.29479$9j6.4199@attbi_s22:
>>
>>> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at
>>> Hooters) for a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North
>>> Atlantic, 50 miles short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> New low for you there Jay.
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>>
>
>
> Hi Bertie,
>
> I have watched your posts for quite a few years. WTF gives you the
> balls to bitch out Jay for posting that NWPilot mentioned to him, on a
> phone call, that one of his "compadres" went down on a ferry flight
> over the North Atlantic? NWPilot, and a very small group of pilots,
> perform a very vital service to the aviation community. I am not a
> pilot myself. I am a retired US Air Force enlisted communications
> puke who had job responsibilities that took me into the worlds of the
> "bus driver" and the "fighter jock". However, I do know a whole
> ****load of civilian pilots, of various qualification levels as well.
> In fact, I have a close family member who is a "four striper" on a
> major US airline. Because of this, I have a pretty good outlook on
> the military and civilian pilot communities. However, in the case of
> NWPilot and his "compadres", it takes a very special group of pilots
> to ferry "small" aircraft over the two big "ponds" off the east and
> west coasts of the North American continent. The North Atlantic, like
> the North Pacific, can be fatal to anyone who "screws the pooch". It
> appears, that in this case, a mechanical failure may have occurred and
> the airplane went down, taking the pilot with it. However, none of us
> in this NG knows the exact details of this accident and probably will
> never know.
>
> You may be a sim pilot, or a "pattern pilot" or a non-pilot who may
> have an interest in aviation. Before you start bitching out guys like
> Jay, pull your head out of your ass and understand how airplanes, and
> aviation, work. For the record, I have not been anywhere in the State
> of Iowa since May 1988. I have never been to Iowa City and have not
> stayed at Jay's establishment. He, and Mary, bust their asses off to
> run a great little business. It is great that they are both airplane
> owners and pilots. As I watch your posts, your stupidity is hilarious
> at the minimum, and criminal at the maximum.


Happy to have entertained you then.


If you are a pilot, you
> exhibit a stupidity only exhibited by various US politicians. In
> this particular case, Jay was passing on what he was told on a phone
> call to the people who frequent this NG. Before you decide to bitch
> Jay (or anyone else for that matter) out do your ****ing homework!!!
> I have been lurking, and posting, in NGs since the mid 90s. You, and
> MX, are just as bad, if not worse, than the "MI-5 Guy". Do yourself a
> favor and get your **** together. You, and MX, will become more
> credible as a result.


Fantastic. You go right on ahead and fly like he tells you!




Bertie

[Al G[_1_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
.. .
> "Jay Honeck" > wrote in
> news:mI6sj.29479$9j6.4199@attbi_s22:
>
>> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at
>> Hooters) for a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North
>> Atlantic, 50 miles short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>>
>
>
>
> New low for you there Jay.
>
>
> Bertie
>

WTF Bertie ?

Al G

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

"Al G" > wrote in news:2UZsj.14$IN2.9
@newsfe06.lga:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> .. .
>> "Jay Honeck" > wrote in
>> news:mI6sj.29479$9j6.4199@attbi_s22:
>>
>>> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at
>>> Hooters) for a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North
>>> Atlantic, 50 miles short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> New low for you there Jay.
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>>
>
> WTF Bertie ?



Jay making currency out of someone's death..


Bertie

[C J Campbell[_1_]]

On 2008-02-14 08:30:32 -0800, Bertie the Bunyip > said:

> "Al G" > wrote in news:2UZsj.14$IN2.9
> @newsfe06.lga:
>
>>
>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>> .. .
>>> "Jay Honeck" > wrote in
>>> news:mI6sj.29479$9j6.4199@attbi_s22:
>>>
>>>> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at
>>>> Hooters) for a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North
>>>> Atlantic, 50 miles short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> New low for you there Jay.
>>>
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>>
>>
>> WTF Bertie ?
>
>
>
> Jay making currency out of someone's death..
>
>
> Bertie

I don't think anyone else sees it that way, Bertie. In fact, your
comment seems rude and uncalled for.
--
Waddling Eagle
World Famous Flight Instructor

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

C J Campbell > wrote in
news:2008021408403675249-christophercampbell@hotmailcom:

> On 2008-02-14 08:30:32 -0800, Bertie the Bunyip > said:
>
>> "Al G" > wrote in news:2UZsj.14$IN2.9
>> @newsfe06.lga:
>>
>>>
>>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>> .. .
>>>> "Jay Honeck" > wrote in
>>>> news:mI6sj.29479$9j6.4199@attbi_s22:
>>>>
>>>>> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at
>>>>> Hooters) for a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North
>>>>> Atlantic, 50 miles short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> New low for you there Jay.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Bertie
>>>>
>>>
>>> WTF Bertie ?
>>
>>
>>
>> Jay making currency out of someone's death..
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>
> I don't think anyone else sees it that way, Bertie. In fact, your
> comment seems rude and uncalled for.



Well, let's just say I got my reasons and I'm not going to post them
here, but that's exactly what he's doing. And by currency, I don't mean
coin of the realm.

Jay knows it's true, too. Not that you'll hear him admit it.

Bertie

[xyzzy]

On Feb 14, 12:49 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> C J Campbell > wrote innews:2008021408403675249-christophercampbell@hotmailcom:
>
>
>
> > On 2008-02-14 08:30:32 -0800, Bertie the Bunyip > said:
>
> >> "Al G" > wrote in news:2UZsj.14$IN2.9
> >> @newsfe06.lga:
>
> >>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> .. .
> >>>> "Jay Honeck" > wrote in
> >>>>news:mI6sj.29479$9j6.4199@attbi_s22:
>
> >>>>> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at
> >>>>> Hooters) for a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North
> >>>>> Atlantic, 50 miles short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>
> >>>> New low for you there Jay.
>
> >>>> Bertie
>
> >>> WTF Bertie ?
>
> >> Jay making currency out of someone's death..
>
> >> Bertie
>
> > I don't think anyone else sees it that way, Bertie. In fact, your
> > comment seems rude and uncalled for.
>
> Well, let's just say I got my reasons and I'm not going to post them
> here, but that's exactly what he's doing. And by currency, I don't mean
> coin of the realm.
>
> Jay knows it's true, too. Not that you'll hear him admit it.

When you were stalking MxManiac leg on the n.g.'s it was cute because
he was obviously a clueless wannabe.

wtf do you now feel the need to hump Jay's leg? I've been watching
you do it for several months. Jay is a real pilot with an aviation
related business and he is one of the rec.aviation.* newsgroup's most
interesting and useful posters, and he's well respected. He lives the
life a lot of GA pilots would like to have. I often disagree with
him, have never met him, and have argued with him on political
threads, so I'm not being his friend when I say that you have gone
really over the top with this Jay hatred. You were way over the top
on this thread. And making vague references to some supposed
something that justifies your actions that we are supposed to take on
faith is BS. If you have an issue with Jay, you should state it or
STFU.

Do you just feel that you need to find a new target now that Mx has
been pretty much put down?

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

xyzzy > wrote in
:

> On Feb 14, 12:49 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>> C J Campbell > wrote
>> innews:2008021408403675249-christophercampbell@hotmailcom:
>>
>>
>>
>> > On 2008-02-14 08:30:32 -0800, Bertie the Bunyip > said:
>>
>> >> "Al G" > wrote in
>> >> news:2UZsj.14$IN2.9 @newsfe06.lga:
>>
>> >>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>> .. .
>> >>>> "Jay Honeck" > wrote in
>> >>>>news:mI6sj.29479$9j6.4199@attbi_s22:
>>
>> >>>>> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at
>> >>>>> Hooters) for a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the
>> >>>>> North Atlantic, 50 miles short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>>
>> >>>> New low for you there Jay.
>>
>> >>>> Bertie
>>
>> >>> WTF Bertie ?
>>
>> >> Jay making currency out of someone's death..
>>
>> >> Bertie
>>
>> > I don't think anyone else sees it that way, Bertie. In fact, your
>> > comment seems rude and uncalled for.
>>
>> Well, let's just say I got my reasons and I'm not going to post them
>> here, but that's exactly what he's doing. And by currency, I don't
>> mean coin of the realm.
>>
>> Jay knows it's true, too. Not that you'll hear him admit it.
>
> When you were stalking MxManiac leg on the n.g.'s it was cute because
> he was obviously a clueless wannabe.
>
> wtf do you now feel the need to hump Jay's leg?


I've been watching
> you do it for several months.


So don't watch. he says he doesn't.



Jay is a real pilot with an aviation
> related business and he is one of the rec.aviation.* newsgroup's most
> interesting and useful posters, and he's well respected. He lives the
> life a lot of GA pilots would like to have. I often disagree with
> him, have never met him, and have argued with him on political
> threads, so I'm not being his friend when I say that you have gone
> really over the top with this Jay hatred. You were way over the top
> on this thread. And making vague references to some supposed
> something that justifies your actions that we are supposed to take on
> faith is BS. If you have an issue with Jay, you should state it or
> STFU.
>
> Do you just feel that you need to find a new target now that Mx has
> been pretty much put down?
>

Nope,. Jay is worthy..


Besides, he seems to feel it's OK to make me a target.


Turnabout is fair play.


But that's not why...


Bertie

[gatt[_2_]]

> wrote in message
news:6235c66f-ecfd-4059-a20a-

> Will miss Jeffrey, was good friend... Gonna be a hard crossing this
> weekend with this in back of my mind.... hope he did not suffer!

Good luck, man, and have a safe crossing. Very sorry to hear about the
loss.

-chris
Portland

[[email protected]]

>
> Good luck, man, and have a safe crossing. Very sorry to hear about the
> loss.
>
> -chris
> Portland

Yea, I had to break the news to a few other pilots in Bangor today.

Looking like I will not be tanked until monday I was 15 min late in to
Bangor I had to wait for the ice to melt off the plane and got out of
KLUX about 1/2 hour late.

Will try and keep up with posts... The GPS was showing 10.5 hours from
bangor to Santa Maria (LPAZ) and 174 Gallons required Today, Some nice
winds predicted this weekend hope they can tank me quick tomarrow.

[[email protected]]

> NWPilot, and a very small group of pilots, perform
> a very vital service to the aviation community.

Very Vital Service

> it takes a very special group of pilots to ferry "small"
> aircraft over the two big "ponds" off the east and west coasts of the
> North American continent.

Yea, we have balls larger then an elephant and very strong mental
ability's to keep it cool under the pressure flying aircraft with
extensively modified
fuel systems in over weight conditions over unfavorable terrain in
marginal weather conditions. Then doing an ILS or some other approach
after being cooped up for 15 hours or more.

>The North Atlantic, like the North Pacific,
> can be fatal to anyone who "screws the pooch". It appears, that in this
> case, a mechanical failure may have occurred and the airplane went down,
> taking the pilot with it. However, none of us in this NG knows the
> exact details of this accident and probably will never know.

Correct, Unless they fish the plane out and some times they do.

> I have never been to Iowa City and have not
> stayed at Jay's establishment. He, and Mary, bust their asses off to
> run a great little business.

Yes, they do and I patronize it when ever possible.

I thank Jay for posting usually ditching's such as this are not even a
headline on a newspaper.

Thanks again jay ignore the childish flamers.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

wrote in news:447d6879-b1c4-404d-a5d5-
:

>> NWPilot, and a very small group of pilots, perform
>> a very vital service to the aviation community.
>
> Very Vital Service
>
>> it takes a very special group of pilots to ferry "small"
>> aircraft over the two big "ponds" off the east and west coasts of the
>> North American continent.
>
> Yea, we have balls larger then an elephant and very strong mental
> ability's to keep it cool under the pressure flying aircraft with
> extensively modified
> fuel systems in over weight conditions over unfavorable terrain in
> marginal weather conditions. Then doing an ILS or some other approach
> after being cooped up for 15 hours or more.
>
>>The North Atlantic, like the North Pacific,
>> can be fatal to anyone who "screws the pooch". It appears, that in
this
>> case, a mechanical failure may have occurred and the airplane went
down,
>> taking the pilot with it. However, none of us in this NG knows the
>> exact details of this accident and probably will never know.
>
> Correct, Unless they fish the plane out and some times they do.
>
>> I have never been to Iowa City and have not
>> stayed at Jay's establishment. He, and Mary, bust their asses off to
>> run a great little business.
>
> Yes, they do and I patronize it when ever possible.
>
> I thank Jay for posting usually ditching's such as this are not even a
> headline on a newspaper.
>
> Thanks again jay ignore the childish flamers.

Yeah, one of whom was doing it long before GPS or loran...



Bertie
>
>

[[email protected]]

On Feb 15, 12:19 pm, wrote:
> > Good luck, man, and have a safe crossing. Very sorry to hear about the
> > loss.
>
> > -chris
> > Portland
>
> Yea, I had to break the news to a few other pilots in Bangor today.
>
> Looking like I will not be tanked until monday I was 15 min late in to
> Bangor I had to wait for the ice to melt off the plane and got out of
> KLUX about 1/2 hour late.
>
> Will try and keep up with posts... The GPS was showing 10.5 hours from
> bangor to Santa Maria (LPAZ) and 174 Gallons required Today, Some nice
> winds predicted this weekend hope they can tank me quick tomarrow.


Jeff Hall is the 4th ferry pilot that I knew of to go down on the
sectors between
Goose and Reykjavik in the past 4-5 years. ...Prior to GPS in the
1980's it
used to be around three a year. ...It's a very dangerous game!
Pete Hirst

[Jay Honeck[_2_]]

> As I watch your posts, your stupidity is hilarious at the minimum, and
> criminal at the maximum. If you are a pilot, you exhibit a stupidity only
> exhibited by various US politicians.

Please do not feed the trolls... As much as I appreciate your defense, I
think it's safe to say that any real pilots here have long since discovered
that "Bertie" is nothing but a troll -- and responding to him in any way
only feeds his mental illness.

Worse, the kill file I've set up only zaps HIS message -- not your
response(s). This means I must read his drivel in order to view your
post -- something that truly is not worth anyone's time.

I know it's hard to resist the temptation, but the only way to make posters
like Bertie go away is to give them no response. Sooner or later they find
another playground to terrorize.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[[email protected]]

Jay Honeck > wrote:
> > As I watch your posts, your stupidity is hilarious at the minimum, and
> > criminal at the maximum. If you are a pilot, you exhibit a stupidity only
> > exhibited by various US politicians.

> Please do not feed the trolls... As much as I appreciate your defense, I
> think it's safe to say that any real pilots here have long since discovered
> that "Bertie" is nothing but a troll -- and responding to him in any way
> only feeds his mental illness.

Nah, Bertie is an opinionated, crusty, sometimes informative, sometimes
entertaining, sometimes annoying, old fart that doesn't suffer fools
easily, but definately is not a troll.

Like others that have achieved this status, he could give a crap less
what anyone thinks of him and just says what he feels without having
the need to justify it.

WYSIWYG.

--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in
news:ZK8tj.34218$9j6.6554@attbi_s22:

>> As I watch your posts, your stupidity is hilarious at the minimum,
>> and criminal at the maximum. If you are a pilot, you exhibit a
>> stupidity only exhibited by various US politicians.
>
> Please do not feed the trolls... As much as I appreciate your
> defense, I think it's safe to say that any real pilots here have long
> since discovered that "Bertie" is nothing but a troll -- and
> responding to him in any way only feeds his mental illness.
>
> Worse, the kill file I've set up only zaps HIS message -- not your
> response(s). This means I must read his drivel in order to view your
> post -- something that truly is not worth anyone's time.
>


Yeah, right luser boi..


> I know it's hard to resist the temptation, but the only way to make
> posters like Bertie go away is to give them no response. Sooner or
> later they find another playground to terrorize.


Actually, that has never worked on me..

Feel free to check.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

wrote in :

> Jay Honeck > wrote:
>> > As I watch your posts, your stupidity is hilarious at the minimum,
>> > and criminal at the maximum. If you are a pilot, you exhibit a
>> > stupidity only exhibited by various US politicians.
>
>> Please do not feed the trolls... As much as I appreciate your
>> defense, I think it's safe to say that any real pilots here have long
>> since discovered that "Bertie" is nothing but a troll -- and
>> responding to him in any way only feeds his mental illness.
>
> Nah, Bertie is an opinionated, crusty, sometimes informative,
> sometimes entertaining, sometimes annoying, old fart that doesn't
> suffer fools easily, but definately is not a troll.
>
> Like others that have achieved this status, he could give a crap less
> what anyone thinks of him and just says what he feels without having
> the need to justify it.

Thenkew. though i object to the crusty part. I do use a loofah as often as
I can.


Bertie

[Jay Honeck[_2_]]

> Nah, Bertie is an opinionated, crusty, sometimes informative, sometimes
> entertaining, sometimes annoying, old fart that doesn't suffer fools
> easily, but definately is not a troll.

You're definition of troll is certainly unusual.

Anyone who responds with a knee-jerk "fujkwit!" to every, single post that
is made by another poster is, by definition, a troll.

Anyone who responds with personal attacks and lies for the sole purpose of
stirring controversy and provoking a response is, by definition, a troll.

Any aviation contributions Bertie may make here are completely incidental to
this sad fact. His mental illness (and that's what it is -- let's call a
spade a spade) has negated any positive impact he may have once been able to
contribute.

It's truly a shame, but that's why the kill file was invented.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Bertie the Bunyip[_25_]]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in
news:hXgtj.34658$yE1.25967@attbi_s21:

>> Nah, Bertie is an opinionated, crusty, sometimes informative,
>> sometimes entertaining, sometimes annoying, old fart that doesn't
>> suffer fools easily, but definately is not a troll.
>
> You're definition of troll is certainly unusual.

Your's is asinine.
>
> Anyone who responds with a knee-jerk "fujkwit!" to every, single post
> that is made by another poster is, by definition, a troll.

Nope.
The definition of a troll is a poster who posts strictly to elicit a
particular response. In my case I troll to reveal people for who they
really are without regard to how it may make me appear. I've found it to
be an interesting,educational and productive exercise for all concerned.
Once I hace a trollee shrieking, I can generally expose ever more of his
idiocy or hypocrisy simply by pushing all the right buttons. I'm real
good at it too, which of course, exposes even more buttons.
People that don't have those buttons or who are smart enough to realise
that they do have them, but keep them properly under control, are almost
untrollable. Well, I could probably still troll them, but I'm not that
energetic. Anyhow, there are lots of people here like that and they know
it. It takes about three posts, maybe a bit more to spot the difference
and it usually takes even fewer to spot someone who has more buttons
than an Airbus.

Guess which category you fit into?
>
> Anyone who responds with personal attacks and lies for the sole
> purpose of stirring controversy and provoking a response is, by
> definition, a troll.

Actually, I only respond with personal attacks to assholes, as anyone
can see.
With Bertie, you get exactly what you deserve. No more or less.
And, I'm not a democracy.


>
> Any aviation contributions Bertie may make here are completely
> incidental to this sad fact. His mental illness (and that's what it
> is -- let's call a spade a spade) has negated any positive impact he
> may have once been able to contribute.


Well, in fact, the FAA would disagree with you, fjukkwit. now there's a
surprise, eh?

As to your little campaign to get me out of here so you can go on
posting your crap unmolested, well, good luck with that! I'll watch with
interest!

Oh wait! You can't read this! Looks like I just wasted two minutes
typing this up....

Bwawhahwhahwhahwhhahwhahwhhhwawhahwhhahwh!


Bertie

[Jim Logajan]

wrote:
> [...] he could give a crap less
> what anyone thinks of him and just says what he feels without having
> the need to justify it.

Looks like a fallacy, specifically: special pleading:

Why is that justification considered valid when applied to an anonymous
poster like Bertie but not valid when applied to a poster who uses his real
name like Jay?

As far as I can tell Jay has just as much right to "give a crap less what
anyone thinks of him" and just say what he feels about "Bertie" without
having to justify it.

[Jim Logajan]

Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> Once I hace a trollee shrieking, I can generally expose ever more of his
> idiocy or hypocrisy simply by pushing all the right buttons.

Mxsmanic was your target, right? Thanks to your magnanimous (or self-
centered) gesture everyone but the target is shrieking. All buttons, right
and wrong, appear to have been pushed.

Good work - I think your work here is done! :-)

[Jim Logajan]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote:
> I know it's hard to resist the temptation, but the only way to make
> posters like Bertie go away is to give them no response. Sooner or
> later they find another playground to terrorize.

I don't think that would drive him away. But for other reasons I think it
is generally a good idea to not respond to every provocation.

It appears Bertie doesn't like you - based on his past posts (haven't read
them all) I'd guess it is because you have political views that differ from
his, he thinks you're a bigot because of views you have expressed with
regard to illegal immigration, and you use employment practices that appear
to be needlessly callous. (Again - all just guesses.)

He might also think you're a self-centered blow-hard, but if so, I'd say he
was spitting into the wind on that count. ;-) (Practically by definition I
think one has to be a self-centered blow-hard to post responses to Usenet.
:-) )

[[email protected]]

Jim Logajan > wrote:
> wrote:
> > [...] he could give a crap less
> > what anyone thinks of him and just says what he feels without having
> > the need to justify it.

> Looks like a fallacy, specifically: special pleading:

> Why is that justification considered valid when applied to an anonymous
> poster like Bertie but not valid when applied to a poster who uses his real
> name like Jay?

I never said it was or anything about anonymous posters.

> As far as I can tell Jay has just as much right to "give a crap less what
> anyone thinks of him" and just say what he feels about "Bertie" without
> having to justify it.

I never said he didn't.

Bottom line:

Jay said Bertie is a troll.

I said Bertie is something else.


--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Jim Logajan > wrote in
:

> wrote:
>> [...] he could give a crap less
>> what anyone thinks of him and just says what he feels without having
>> the need to justify it.
>
> Looks like a fallacy, specifically: special pleading:
>
> Why is that justification considered valid when applied to an
> anonymous poster like Bertie but not valid when applied to a poster
> who uses his real name like Jay?
>
> As far as I can tell Jay has just as much right to "give a crap less
> what anyone thinks of him" and just say what he feels about "Bertie"
> without having to justify it.
>


He has the right, of course. He doesn't use it because he can't.

Bertie

[Jim Logajan]

wrote:
> Jim Logajan > wrote:
>> wrote:
>> > [...] he could give a crap less
>> > what anyone thinks of him and just says what he feels without
>> > having the need to justify it.
>
>> Looks like a fallacy, specifically: special pleading:
>
>> Why is that justification considered valid when applied to an
>> anonymous poster like Bertie but not valid when applied to a poster
>> who uses his real name like Jay?
>
> I never said it was or anything about anonymous posters.

Ah, okay. It was a rhetorical question anyway. Doesn't seem to have made
the point I intended.

>> As far as I can tell Jay has just as much right to "give a crap less
>> what anyone thinks of him" and just say what he feels about "Bertie"
>> without having to justify it.
>
> I never said he didn't.

True enough. I thought your post was intended as a defense of Bertie, but
in retrospect it is just an observation. Mea culpa.

> Bottom line:
>
> Jay said Bertie is a troll.
>
> I said Bertie is something else.

I hear New Zealand thinks differently. ;-)

Me, I think I should stifle my temptation to jump into these personality
debates.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Jim Logajan > wrote in
:

> "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
>> I know it's hard to resist the temptation, but the only way to make
>> posters like Bertie go away is to give them no response. Sooner or
>> later they find another playground to terrorize.
>
> I don't think that would drive him away. But for other reasons I think
> it is generally a good idea to not respond to every provocation.

Responses vary.
>
> It appears Bertie doesn't like you - based on his past posts (haven't
> read them all) I'd guess it is because you have political views that
> differ from his, he thinks you're a bigot because of views you have
> expressed with regard to illegal immigration, and you use employment
> practices that appear to be needlessly callous. (Again - all just
> guesses.)
>

Not correct. I was playing battleship with him on that ane and sunk his
submarine with a hit.

> He might also think you're a self-centered blow-hard,

Amongst other things.

But I can forgive everything bar hypocrisy and a lack of a sense of humor,
whihc pretty much leaves Jay ****ed.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

wrote in :

> Jim Logajan > wrote:
>> wrote:
>> > [...] he could give a crap less
>> > what anyone thinks of him and just says what he feels without
>> > having the need to justify it.
>
>> Looks like a fallacy, specifically: special pleading:
>
>> Why is that justification considered valid when applied to an
>> anonymous poster like Bertie but not valid when applied to a poster
>> who uses his real name like Jay?
>
> I never said it was or anything about anonymous posters.
>
>> As far as I can tell Jay has just as much right to "give a crap less
>> what anyone thinks of him" and just say what he feels about "Bertie"
>> without having to justify it.
>
> I never said he didn't.
>
> Bottom line:
>
> Jay said Bertie is a troll.
>
> I said Bertie is something else.
>
>



I'm kinda both. I used to reserve the Bertie handle strictly for
trolling but got lazy once in here harassing Anthony and started using
it to make sensible posts as well.
Thing is, the concept of a troll is widely misunderstood. I believe I
explained it well earlier in this thread. Without a trollee though ,
there are no trolls. You have to have someone as idiotic as Jay as a
target or there is no point. This does not mean that ignoring me works.
That tactic is just one more step along the way.
I can tell you from experience that a good troll is never deterred by
that. Jay hasn't actually killfiled me and I know it, for one thing, and
even if he left usenet forever I could pull his chain just by living
longer than him at this stage. He's mine forever now, so he might as wel
stay and get his ass kicked in the open than in his limited imagination.

Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_25_]]

Jim Logajan > wrote in
:

> Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>> Once I hace a trollee shrieking, I can generally expose ever more of
>> his idiocy or hypocrisy simply by pushing all the right buttons.
>
> Mxsmanic was your target, right?


Originally.


Thanks to your magnanimous (or self-
> centered) gesture everyone but the target is shrieking.


Nope, only a handful are shrieking.


All buttons,
> right and wrong, appear to have been pushed.

I never hit a wrong button. I use a checklist.

>
> Good work - I think your work here is done! :-)
>

Nope, everyone is a potential target,



Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Jim Logajan > wrote in
:

> wrote:
>> Jim Logajan > wrote:
>>> wrote:
>>> > [...] he could give a crap less
>>> > what anyone thinks of him and just says what he feels without
>>> > having the need to justify it.
>>
>>> Looks like a fallacy, specifically: special pleading:
>>
>>> Why is that justification considered valid when applied to an
>>> anonymous poster like Bertie but not valid when applied to a poster
>>> who uses his real name like Jay?
>>
>> I never said it was or anything about anonymous posters.
>
> Ah, okay. It was a rhetorical question anyway. Doesn't seem to have
> made the point I intended.
>
>>> As far as I can tell Jay has just as much right to "give a crap less
>>> what anyone thinks of him" and just say what he feels about "Bertie"
>>> without having to justify it.
>>
>> I never said he didn't.
>
> True enough. I thought your post was intended as a defense of Bertie,
> but in retrospect it is just an observation. Mea culpa.


I need no defense. My actions don't require it.
>
>> Bottom line:
>>
>> Jay said Bertie is a troll.
>>
>> I said Bertie is something else.
>
> I hear New Zealand thinks differently. ;-)
>
> Me, I think I should stifle my temptation to jump into these
> personality debates.



Why? I think they're great.


Bertie


Bertie

[Larry Dighera]

Candidate For Quote Of The Week:

On Fri, 15 Feb 2008 18:32:04 -0000, Jim Logajan >
wrote in >:

>Me, I think I should stifle my temptation to jump into these personality
>debates.


(This is applicable to all except those who want to fan the flames;
don't take it personally, Jim.)

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Larry Dighera > wrote in
:

>
> Candidate For Quote Of The Week:
>
> On Fri, 15 Feb 2008 18:32:04 -0000, Jim Logajan >
> wrote in >:
>
>>Me, I think I should stifle my temptation to jump into these personality
>>debates.
>
>
> (This is applicable to all except those who want to fan the flames;
> don't take it personally, Jim.)
>

I could wallpaper the taj mahal with posts like both of these.

Conflict like this is a fact of life. Imagining you can stop it is a waste
of that life..





Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Larry Dighera > wrote in
:

>
> Candidate For Quote Of The Week:
>
> On Fri, 15 Feb 2008 18:32:04 -0000, Jim Logajan >
> wrote in >:
>
>>Me, I think I should stifle my temptation to jump into these personality
>>debates.
>
>
> (This is applicable to all except those who want to fan the flames;
> don't take it personally, Jim.)
>

Oh sorry Lar. I dodn't notice you were the poster. You have no life so you
can't waste it.

Carry on.

Bertie

[WingFlaps]

On Feb 16, 7:38*am, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:

> I can tell you from experience that a good troll is never deterred by
> that. Jay hasn't actually killfiled me and I know it, for one thing, and
> even if he left usenet forever I could pull his chain just by living
> longer than him at this stage. He's mine forever now, so he might as wel
> stay and get his ass kicked in the open than in his limited imagination.
>

Say it is not so Bertie, is there no hope of redemption from the hell
you espouse?
Is there no crutch among thine armaments for the crippled?

Cheers

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

WingFlaps > wrote in news:ef599547-c228-4e5c-933d-
:

> On Feb 16, 7:38*am, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>
>> I can tell you from experience that a good troll is never deterred by
>> that. Jay hasn't actually killfiled me and I know it, for one thing, and
>> even if he left usenet forever I could pull his chain just by living
>> longer than him at this stage. He's mine forever now, so he might as wel
>> stay and get his ass kicked in the open than in his limited imagination.
>>
>
> Say it is not so Bertie, is there no hope of redemption from the hell
> you espouse?


Sure there is! Unfortunately ( for them) most assholes are hard wired for
life.
]
> Is there no crutch among thine armaments for the crippled?


I have lots of medical aids, but it depends on the infirmity.
I got a crowbar for getting heads out of asses, for instance.


Bertie

[Al G[_1_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
.. .
> wrote in :
>
>> Jim Logajan > wrote:
>>> wrote:
>>> > [...] he could give a crap less
>>> > what anyone thinks of him and just says what he feels without
>>> > having the need to justify it.
>>
>>> Looks like a fallacy, specifically: special pleading:
>>
>>> Why is that justification considered valid when applied to an
>>> anonymous poster like Bertie but not valid when applied to a poster
>>> who uses his real name like Jay?
>>
>> I never said it was or anything about anonymous posters.
>>
>>> As far as I can tell Jay has just as much right to "give a crap less
>>> what anyone thinks of him" and just say what he feels about "Bertie"
>>> without having to justify it.
>>
>> I never said he didn't.
>>
>> Bottom line:
>>
>> Jay said Bertie is a troll.
>>
>> I said Bertie is something else.
>>
>>
>
>
>
> I'm kinda both. I used to reserve the Bertie handle strictly for
> trolling but got lazy once in here harassing Anthony and started using
> it to make sensible posts as well.
> Thing is, the concept of a troll is widely misunderstood. I believe I
> explained it well earlier in this thread. Without a trollee though ,
> there are no trolls. You have to have someone as idiotic as Jay as a
> target or there is no point. This does not mean that ignoring me works.
> That tactic is just one more step along the way.
> I can tell you from experience that a good troll is never deterred by
> that. Jay hasn't actually killfiled me and I know it, for one thing, and
> even if he left usenet forever I could pull his chain just by living
> longer than him at this stage. He's mine forever now, so he might as wel
> stay and get his ass kicked in the open than in his limited imagination.
>
> Bertie

So, first it's MX and the Rabbit. Then Jay & Thomas. Who's next?

Where does it end? Will you re-make the world in your image?

Do you just keep building windmills?

Frankly, I don't give a damn, but you leave a lot of muck to wade
through and I miss folks like MontBlack.

You are getting to be kinda like a boil, not very important, but a pain
in the ass.

Al G

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

"Al G" > wrote in
:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> .. .
>> wrote in
>> :
>>
>>> Jim Logajan > wrote:
>>>> wrote:
>>>> > [...] he could give a crap less
>>>> > what anyone thinks of him and just says what he feels without
>>>> > having the need to justify it.
>>>
>>>> Looks like a fallacy, specifically: special pleading:
>>>
>>>> Why is that justification considered valid when applied to an
>>>> anonymous poster like Bertie but not valid when applied to a poster
>>>> who uses his real name like Jay?
>>>
>>> I never said it was or anything about anonymous posters.
>>>
>>>> As far as I can tell Jay has just as much right to "give a crap
>>>> less what anyone thinks of him" and just say what he feels about
>>>> "Bertie" without having to justify it.
>>>
>>> I never said he didn't.
>>>
>>> Bottom line:
>>>
>>> Jay said Bertie is a troll.
>>>
>>> I said Bertie is something else.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm kinda both. I used to reserve the Bertie handle strictly for
>> trolling but got lazy once in here harassing Anthony and started
>> using it to make sensible posts as well.
>> Thing is, the concept of a troll is widely misunderstood. I believe I
>> explained it well earlier in this thread. Without a trollee though ,
>> there are no trolls. You have to have someone as idiotic as Jay as a
>> target or there is no point. This does not mean that ignoring me
>> works. That tactic is just one more step along the way.
>> I can tell you from experience that a good troll is never deterred by
>> that. Jay hasn't actually killfiled me and I know it, for one thing,
>> and even if he left usenet forever I could pull his chain just by
>> living longer than him at this stage. He's mine forever now, so he
>> might as wel stay and get his ass kicked in the open than in his
>> limited imagination.
>>
>> Bertie
>
> So, first it's MX and the Rabbit. Then Jay & Thomas. Who's next?

Why, you volunteering? Step right up. First lesson, it's a bit like
hypnosis. There are no unwilling victims.

>
> Where does it end? Will you re-make the world in your image?

With any luck.

>
> Do you just keep building windmills?

Windmills? nope. Wrong model.
>
> Frankly, I don't give a damn,


Obviously.

but you leave a lot of muck to wade
> through and I miss folks like MontBlack.

Hey, I do seem o remember recommending a killfile.

>
> You are getting to be kinda like a boil, not very important, but a
> pain
> in the ass.

Now that's disappointing, I was aiming for lypoma


Bertie

[Al G[_1_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
.. .
> "Al G" > wrote in
> :
>
>>
>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>> .. .
>>> wrote in
>>> :
>>>
>>>> Jim Logajan > wrote:
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> > [...] he could give a crap less
>>>>> > what anyone thinks of him and just says what he feels without
>>>>> > having the need to justify it.
>>>>
>>>>> Looks like a fallacy, specifically: special pleading:
>>>>
>>>>> Why is that justification considered valid when applied to an
>>>>> anonymous poster like Bertie but not valid when applied to a poster
>>>>> who uses his real name like Jay?
>>>>
>>>> I never said it was or anything about anonymous posters.
>>>>
>>>>> As far as I can tell Jay has just as much right to "give a crap
>>>>> less what anyone thinks of him" and just say what he feels about
>>>>> "Bertie" without having to justify it.
>>>>
>>>> I never said he didn't.
>>>>
>>>> Bottom line:
>>>>
>>>> Jay said Bertie is a troll.
>>>>
>>>> I said Bertie is something else.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I'm kinda both. I used to reserve the Bertie handle strictly for
>>> trolling but got lazy once in here harassing Anthony and started
>>> using it to make sensible posts as well.
>>> Thing is, the concept of a troll is widely misunderstood. I believe I
>>> explained it well earlier in this thread. Without a trollee though ,
>>> there are no trolls. You have to have someone as idiotic as Jay as a
>>> target or there is no point. This does not mean that ignoring me
>>> works. That tactic is just one more step along the way.
>>> I can tell you from experience that a good troll is never deterred by
>>> that. Jay hasn't actually killfiled me and I know it, for one thing,
>>> and even if he left usenet forever I could pull his chain just by
>>> living longer than him at this stage. He's mine forever now, so he
>>> might as wel stay and get his ass kicked in the open than in his
>>> limited imagination.
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>
>> So, first it's MX and the Rabbit. Then Jay & Thomas. Who's next?
>
> Why, you volunteering? Step right up. First lesson, it's a bit like
> hypnosis. There are no unwilling victims.
>
>>
>> Where does it end? Will you re-make the world in your image?
>
> With any luck.
>
>>
>> Do you just keep building windmills?
>
> Windmills? nope. Wrong model.
>>
>> Frankly, I don't give a damn,
>
>
> Obviously.
>
> but you leave a lot of muck to wade
>> through and I miss folks like MontBlack.
>
> Hey, I do seem o remember recommending a killfile.
>
>>
>> You are getting to be kinda like a boil, not very important, but a
>> pain
>> in the ass.
>
> Now that's disappointing, I was aiming for lypoma
>
>
> Bertie

I guess I can take some satisfaction out of disappointing you. ;)

Al G

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

"Al G" > wrote in news:3Entj.8601$iB4.509
@newsfe07.lga:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> .. .
>> "Al G" > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>>
>>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>> .. .
>>>> wrote in
>>>> :
>>>>
>>>>> Jim Logajan > wrote:
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> > [...] he could give a crap less
>>>>>> > what anyone thinks of him and just says what he feels without
>>>>>> > having the need to justify it.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Looks like a fallacy, specifically: special pleading:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Why is that justification considered valid when applied to an
>>>>>> anonymous poster like Bertie but not valid when applied to a
poster
>>>>>> who uses his real name like Jay?
>>>>>
>>>>> I never said it was or anything about anonymous posters.
>>>>>
>>>>>> As far as I can tell Jay has just as much right to "give a crap
>>>>>> less what anyone thinks of him" and just say what he feels about
>>>>>> "Bertie" without having to justify it.
>>>>>
>>>>> I never said he didn't.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bottom line:
>>>>>
>>>>> Jay said Bertie is a troll.
>>>>>
>>>>> I said Bertie is something else.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I'm kinda both. I used to reserve the Bertie handle strictly for
>>>> trolling but got lazy once in here harassing Anthony and started
>>>> using it to make sensible posts as well.
>>>> Thing is, the concept of a troll is widely misunderstood. I believe
I
>>>> explained it well earlier in this thread. Without a trollee though
,
>>>> there are no trolls. You have to have someone as idiotic as Jay as
a
>>>> target or there is no point. This does not mean that ignoring me
>>>> works. That tactic is just one more step along the way.
>>>> I can tell you from experience that a good troll is never deterred
by
>>>> that. Jay hasn't actually killfiled me and I know it, for one
thing,
>>>> and even if he left usenet forever I could pull his chain just by
>>>> living longer than him at this stage. He's mine forever now, so he
>>>> might as wel stay and get his ass kicked in the open than in his
>>>> limited imagination.
>>>>
>>>> Bertie
>>>
>>> So, first it's MX and the Rabbit. Then Jay & Thomas. Who's next?
>>
>> Why, you volunteering? Step right up. First lesson, it's a bit like
>> hypnosis. There are no unwilling victims.
>>
>>>
>>> Where does it end? Will you re-make the world in your image?
>>
>> With any luck.
>>
>>>
>>> Do you just keep building windmills?
>>
>> Windmills? nope. Wrong model.
>>>
>>> Frankly, I don't give a damn,
>>
>>
>> Obviously.
>>
>> but you leave a lot of muck to wade
>>> through and I miss folks like MontBlack.
>>
>> Hey, I do seem o remember recommending a killfile.
>>
>>>
>>> You are getting to be kinda like a boil, not very important, but
a
>>> pain
>>> in the ass.
>>
>> Now that's disappointing, I was aiming for lypoma
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>
> I guess I can take some satisfaction out of disappointing you. ;)
>

Happy to oblige. Any bit of sunshine I can sprinkle will stand to me in
Bunyip heaven


Bertie

[Jay Honeck[_2_]]

> It appears Bertie doesn't like you - based on his past posts (haven't read
> them all) I'd guess it is because you have political views that differ
> from
> his, he thinks you're a bigot because of views you have expressed with
> regard to illegal immigration, and you use employment practices that
> appear
> to be needlessly callous. (Again - all just guesses.)

Wrong assumptions across the board. Bertie and I got along just fine until
I called him out on his knee-jerk, automated, inane, one-word nonsensical
responses to MX's every post.

When I pointed out that he had become a bigger liability to this group than
his target, he became my rump-ranger.

But, again, that's why the kill file was invented. I haven't seen any of
his posts in many weeks, and it's truly restored the utility of this group.
I heartily recommend it.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Bertie the Bunyip[_25_]]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in
news:pTstj.35545$yE1.3709@attbi_s21:

>> It appears Bertie doesn't like you - based on his past posts (haven't
>> read them all) I'd guess it is because you have political views that
>> differ from
>> his, he thinks you're a bigot because of views you have expressed
>> with regard to illegal immigration, and you use employment practices
>> that appear
>> to be needlessly callous. (Again - all just guesses.)
>
> Wrong assumptions across the board. Bertie and I got along just fine
> until I called him out on his knee-jerk, automated, inane, one-word
> nonsensical responses to MX's every post.
>

Nope.

Lots of people do that, fjukkwit.


> When I pointed out that he had become a bigger liability to this group
> than his target, he became my rump-ranger.
>

Wrong again fjukkwit.


> But, again, that's why the kill file was invented. I haven't seen any
> of his posts in many weeks, and it's truly restored the utility of
> this group. I heartily recommend it.



Yeah, right. Straight out of the k00k manual.


Do keep whining though. You just won't ever get it will you fjukwit?

Bertie

[Matt Whiting]

Jay Honeck wrote:
>> It appears Bertie doesn't like you - based on his past posts (haven't
>> read
>> them all) I'd guess it is because you have political views that differ
>> from
>> his, he thinks you're a bigot because of views you have expressed with
>> regard to illegal immigration, and you use employment practices that
>> appear
>> to be needlessly callous. (Again - all just guesses.)
>
> Wrong assumptions across the board. Bertie and I got along just fine
> until I called him out on his knee-jerk, automated, inane, one-word
> nonsensical responses to MX's every post.
>
> When I pointed out that he had become a bigger liability to this group
> than his target, he became my rump-ranger.
>
> But, again, that's why the kill file was invented. I haven't seen any
> of his posts in many weeks, and it's truly restored the utility of this
> group. I heartily recommend it.

Yes, I killfiled MX and then Bertie shortly after and the quality of
this ng increased 10X instantly! :-)

Matt

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Matt Whiting > wrote in news:fjCtj.1$555.121
@news1.epix.net:

> Jay Honeck wrote:
>>> It appears Bertie doesn't like you - based on his past posts (haven't
>>> read
>>> them all) I'd guess it is because you have political views that differ
>>> from
>>> his, he thinks you're a bigot because of views you have expressed with
>>> regard to illegal immigration, and you use employment practices that
>>> appear
>>> to be needlessly callous. (Again - all just guesses.)
>>
>> Wrong assumptions across the board. Bertie and I got along just fine
>> until I called him out on his knee-jerk, automated, inane, one-word
>> nonsensical responses to MX's every post.
>>
>> When I pointed out that he had become a bigger liability to this group
>> than his target, he became my rump-ranger.
>>
>> But, again, that's why the kill file was invented. I haven't seen any
>> of his posts in many weeks, and it's truly restored the utility of this
>> group. I heartily recommend it.
>
> Yes, I killfiled MX and then Bertie shortly after and the quality of
> this ng increased 10X instantly! :-)
>

Too bad you couldn't just shoot me, eh?

Bertie

[Rich Ahrens[_2_]]

Al G wrote:
> Frankly, I don't give a damn, but you leave a lot of muck to wade
> through and I miss folks like MontBlack.

All you have to do is visit Jay in that case. And check in late.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

"Owner" > wrote in
:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> .. .
>> Matt Whiting > wrote in news:fjCtj.1$555.121
>> @news1.epix.net:
>>
>>> Jay Honeck wrote:
>>>>> It appears Bertie doesn't like you - based on his past posts
>>>>> (haven't read
>>>>> them all) I'd guess it is because you have political views that
>>>>> differ from
>>>>> his, he thinks you're a bigot because of views you have expressed
>>>>> with regard to illegal immigration, and you use employment
>>>>> practices that appear
>>>>> to be needlessly callous. (Again - all just guesses.)
>>>>
>>>> Wrong assumptions across the board. Bertie and I got along just
>>>> fine until I called him out on his knee-jerk, automated, inane,
>>>> one-word nonsensical responses to MX's every post.
>>>>
>>>> When I pointed out that he had become a bigger liability to this
>>>> group than his target, he became my rump-ranger.
>>>>
>>>> But, again, that's why the kill file was invented. I haven't seen
>>>> any of his posts in many weeks, and it's truly restored the utility
>>>> of this group. I heartily recommend it.
>>>
>>> Yes, I killfiled MX and then Bertie shortly after and the quality of
>>> this ng increased 10X instantly! :-)
>>>
>>
>> Too bad you couldn't just shoot me, eh?
>>
>> Bertie
>
> BANG!
>
>
>

Missed


Bertie

[Rich Ahrens[_2_]]

RL Anderson wrote:
> Hi Bertie,
<snip>
> You may be a sim pilot, or a "pattern pilot" or a non-pilot who may have
> an interest in aviation. Before you start bitching out guys like Jay,
> pull your head out of your ass and understand how airplanes, and
> aviation, work.

Bwaaaaahahahahaaaaaa!!!! (my spelling, not Bertie's)

Are you really idiotic enough to not recognize the amount of aviation
experience and knowledge he has demonstrated here?

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Rich Ahrens > wrote in
ouse.com:

> RL Anderson wrote:
>> Hi Bertie,
> <snip>
>> You may be a sim pilot, or a "pattern pilot" or a non-pilot who may
>> have an interest in aviation. Before you start bitching out guys
>> like Jay, pull your head out of your ass and understand how
>> airplanes, and aviation, work.
>
> Bwaaaaahahahahaaaaaa!!!! (my spelling, not Bertie's)
>
> Are you really idiotic enough to not recognize the amount of aviation
> experience and knowledge he has demonstrated here?
>

Apparently.


Bertie

[B A R R Y]

On Sat, 16 Feb 2008 16:42:50 -0600, Rich Ahrens >
wrote:

>Are you really idiotic enough to not recognize the amount of aviation
>experience and knowledge he has demonstrated here?

That is rather strange...

Bertie knows how an airplane files, and not because he read a book.

It takes all types to make a world, but we have to look through the
personalities to make it all work. There are lots of strong
personalities here. Some work ATC, others are current or retired
airline pilots, still others are corporate or ferry pilots, even a few
airshow pilots. They ALL have strong opinions and/or their own world
views. Some are quite tactful, others... not so much.

Spam canners like me can learn from all of them.

[Jim Logajan]

Rich Ahrens > wrote:
> RL Anderson wrote:
>> Hi Bertie,
> <snip>
>> You may be a sim pilot, or a "pattern pilot" or a non-pilot who may
>> have an interest in aviation. Before you start bitching out guys
>> like Jay, pull your head out of your ass and understand how
>> airplanes, and aviation, work.
>
> Bwaaaaahahahahaaaaaa!!!! (my spelling, not Bertie's)
>
> Are you really idiotic enough to not recognize the amount of aviation
> experience and knowledge he has demonstrated here?

If Bertie had never posted anything at all to Usenet then I would not have
been any the poorer in aviation knowledge. I've not found any knowledge or
advice that was of use to me in any of his posts.

By comparison, Dudley Henriques has posted helpful information and views
that I haven't encountered anywhere else.

And Jay Honeck's postings have been pretty average, from my perspective.
The usual mix of topical and non-topical, self-serving and non-self-
serving. Pretty average Jay, er, Joe.

Lastly you, Rich, seem to be taking pains to attack anyone who dare attack
or posts their displeasure Bertie. Well, here's another target for you.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Jim Logajan > wrote in
:

> Rich Ahrens > wrote:
>> RL Anderson wrote:
>>> Hi Bertie,
>> <snip>
>>> You may be a sim pilot, or a "pattern pilot" or a non-pilot who may
>>> have an interest in aviation. Before you start bitching out guys
>>> like Jay, pull your head out of your ass and understand how
>>> airplanes, and aviation, work.
>>
>> Bwaaaaahahahahaaaaaa!!!! (my spelling, not Bertie's)
>>
>> Are you really idiotic enough to not recognize the amount of aviation
>> experience and knowledge he has demonstrated here?
>
> If Bertie had never posted anything at all to Usenet then I would not
> have been any the poorer in aviation knowledge. I've not found any
> knowledge or advice that was of use to me in any of his posts.
>
> By comparison, Dudley Henriques has posted helpful information and
> views that I haven't encountered anywhere else.
>


Hmm.


> And Jay Honeck's postings have been pretty average, from my
> perspective. The usual mix of topical and non-topical, self-serving
> and non-self- serving. Pretty average Jay, er, Joe.


Hmm hmm.

>
> Lastly you, Rich, seem to be taking pains to attack anyone who dare
> attack or posts their displeasure Bertie. Well, here's another target
> for you.
>


You like attacking people? That seems a bit, nasty, for want of a beter
word.



Bertie

[Jim Logajan]

Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> You like attacking people?

Always leave an unpleasant feeling in my stomach when I try it, so I don't
think so. How about you - do you like attacking people?

> That seems a bit, nasty, for want of a beter word.

Nasty seems a reasonable term for it. But I suspect it is sometimes a
necessary task, like blowing one's nose or taking a ****.

By the way, you sure seemed to be quick to post a reply. I bet if you got
away from the computer more often you'd be closer to getting your Hatz
done. I seem to recall stumbling across some posts of yours in the late
90's where I think you mentioned working on it back then (or mentioned
something about it).

I suspect you might be annoyed with yourself if, just before your death,
you realized you blew a lot of your spare time posting insulting followups
to mxsmanic that could have been spent finishing that Hatz and flying it.
(That's the best I can do, attack nasty-wise I'm afraid. I get too damn
cerebral.)

[Jay Maynard]

On 2008-02-16, Rich Ahrens > wrote:
> Are you really idiotic enough to not recognize the amount of aviation
> experience and knowledge he has demonstrated here?

I recognize that he's someone who I would ordinarily listen to with great
respect. Unfortunately, he's lost that respect with his incessant trolling
and incivility. I didn't like dropping him in my killfile...but the group
has been a lot more useful to me since I did so.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
http://www.hercules-390.org (Yes, that's me!)
Buy Hercules stuff at http://www.cafepress.com/hercules-390

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Jim Logajan > wrote in
:

> Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>> You like attacking people?
>
> Always leave an unpleasant feeling in my stomach when I try it, so I
> don't think so. How about you - do you like attacking people?
>

Nope. Some of 'em just need it, though.


>> That seems a bit, nasty, for want of a beter word.
>
> Nasty seems a reasonable term for it. But I suspect it is sometimes a
> necessary task, like blowing one's nose or taking a ****.

Xactly.


>
> By the way, you sure seemed to be quick to post a reply. I bet if you
> got away from the computer more often you'd be closer to getting your
> Hatz done. I seem to recall stumbling across some posts of yours in
> the late 90's where I think you mentioned working on it back then (or
> mentioned something about it).

Yep, been going a long time, but I'm not usually close to it when i'm
posting anyway. and they prolly would object to me filing and bandsawing
in ops.

>
> I suspect you might be annoyed with yourself if, just before your
> death, you realized you blew a lot of your spare time posting
> insulting followups to mxsmanic that could have been spent finishing
> that Hatz and flying it. (That's the best I can do, attack nasty-wise
> I'm afraid. I get too damn cerebral.)


Oh that'd be a good one.

Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Jay Maynard > wrote in
:

> On 2008-02-16, Rich Ahrens > wrote:
>> Are you really idiotic enough to not recognize the amount of aviation
>> experience and knowledge he has demonstrated here?
>
> I recognize that he's someone who I would ordinarily listen to with
> great respect. Unfortunately, he's lost that respect with his
> incessant trolling and incivility. I didn't like dropping him in my
> killfile...but the group has been a lot more useful to me since I did
> so.

Oh well, easy come...

Bertie

[Big John[_2_]]

On Sun, 17 Feb 2008 00:41:06 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip >
wrote:

>Jay Maynard > wrote in
:
>
>> On 2008-02-16, Rich Ahrens > wrote:
>>> Are you really idiotic enough to not recognize the amount of aviation
>>> experience and knowledge he has demonstrated here?
>>
>> I recognize that he's someone who I would ordinarily listen to with
>> great respect. Unfortunately, he's lost that respect with his
>> incessant trolling and incivility. I didn't like dropping him in my
>> killfile...but the group has been a lot more useful to me since I did
>> so.
>
>Oh well, easy come...
>
>Bertie
************************************************** ****************************

Bertie

Good riddence of bad rubbish. Put him in your Mx file.

Check him out on Google to get a feel for his background.

He is known as the "Tron" guy in the TX VHF-FM Society.

There is a large Amateur Radio group here in TX that wouldn't p**ss on
him if he was on fire.

Big John

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Big John > wrote in
:

> On Sun, 17 Feb 2008 00:41:06 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip >
> wrote:
>
>>Jay Maynard > wrote in
:
>>
>>> On 2008-02-16, Rich Ahrens > wrote:
>>>> Are you really idiotic enough to not recognize the amount of
>>>> aviation experience and knowledge he has demonstrated here?
>>>
>>> I recognize that he's someone who I would ordinarily listen to with
>>> great respect. Unfortunately, he's lost that respect with his
>>> incessant trolling and incivility. I didn't like dropping him in my
>>> killfile...but the group has been a lot more useful to me since I
>>> did so.
>>
>>Oh well, easy come...
>>
>>Bertie
> ************************************************** ********************
*
> *******
>
> Bertie
>
> Good riddence of bad rubbish. Put him in your Mx file.
>
> Check him out on Google to get a feel for his background.
>
> He is known as the "Tron" guy in the TX VHF-FM Society.
>
> There is a large Amateur Radio group here in TX that wouldn't p**ss on
> him if he was on fire.

Ah, OK. I don't really pay too much attention to people who flame me.
Except to laugh at some of them, of course.
I also never killfile anyone.
I yam what I yam what I yam, sez popeye the sailor man.


Bertie

[Jay Maynard]

On 2008-02-17, Big John > wrote:
> He is known as the "Tron" guy in the TX VHF-FM Society.

Not just in the FM Society, but all around the net. See
http://www.tronguy.net for more.

> There is a large Amateur Radio group here in TX that wouldn't p**ss on
> him if he was on fire.

And to see why, check out http://www.gangofthree.info. Basically, they tried
to ram through a bylaws change in the FM Society in violation of the
existing bylaws in a blatant attempt to seize control, and I helped expose
the scheme and put a stop to it. They've paid me back by slinging mud ever
since. They can't answer my arguments with any substance, so they just hurl
insults.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
http://www.hercules-390.org (Yes, that's me!)
Buy Hercules stuff at http://www.cafepress.com/hercules-390

[Rich Ahrens[_2_]]

Jim Logajan wrote:
> Lastly you, Rich, seem to be taking pains to attack anyone who dare attack
> or posts their displeasure Bertie. Well, here's another target for you.

Hardly. He's a big boy and can handle it. I'm simply amused by the
ignorance of some folks who confuse his antics in dealing with loons and
idiots with an imagined lack of aeronautic knowledge, and occasionally
feel the urge to mock them for it. Not to mention I find some of the
same people obnoxious that he does (Jay, for example). I've even
introduced him to a few of them because I simply don't have the time and
patience to whack them the way he does.

[Larry Dighera]

On Sun, 17 Feb 2008 03:07:49 GMT, Jay Maynard
> wrote in
>:

>On 2008-02-17, Big John > wrote:
>> He is known as the "Tron" guy in the TX VHF-FM Society.
>
>Not just in the FM Society, but all around the net. See
>http://www.tronguy.net for more.

Internet Explorer crashed when I loaded this image:
http://www.tronguy.net/images/headshot.jpg

Very futuristic there, wackoid (and I mean that with all due respect).
Not too original (marginally plagiarized from Disney:
http://disney.go.com/disneyvideos/liveaction/tron/tron01.html#), but
it shows initiative and determination if not creativity.

Have you ever considered incorporating a micorcontroller and LEDs into
an actively moving display scene on your suits? It's not that
difficult....

[Jay Maynard]

On 2008-02-17, Larry Dighera > wrote:
> Internet Explorer crashed when I loaded this image:
> http://www.tronguy.net/images/headshot.jpg

Really? Interesting. Did it crash when loading headshot-web.jpg? That's the
same image, just at a smaller size.

> Very futuristic there, wackoid (and I mean that with all due respect).
> Not too original (marginally plagiarized from Disney:
> http://disney.go.com/disneyvideos/liveaction/tron/tron01.html#), but
> it shows initiative and determination if not creativity.

Not just "marginally plagiarized" from Disney, but explicitly designed to
be in the same style as the costumes in the movie. This is common in
costuming at SF cons, which is where that one was originally aimed.

> Have you ever considered incorporating a micorcontroller and LEDs into
> an actively moving display scene on your suits? It's not that
> difficult....

Not really; I'm not sure the extra complexity would be worth the effect. It
would also highlight the difference between the armor and the unitard -
since I can't put amything on that, because it wouldn't survive being
washed. There's also the minor matter of where to put it: there's not a lot
of space left under the armor for more batteries and the like.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
http://www.hercules-390.org (Yes, that's me!)
Buy Hercules stuff at http://www.cafepress.com/hercules-390

[Larry Dighera]

On Sat, 16 Feb 2008 23:52:10 -0600, Rich Ahrens >
blurted in . com>:

>I'm simply amused by the
>ignorance of some folks who confuse his antics in dealing with loons and
>idiots with an imagined lack of aeronautic knowledge, and occasionally
>feel the urge to mock them for it.

Perhaps it is his mindless arrogance, unnecessary profanity, and
neurotic compulsiveness to which "some ignorant folks" object. But I
wouldn't expect a mid-western apartment dweller to possess the
discretion to be aware of those obnoxious personality defects in which
he so exuberantly revels.

What makes a low-time private pilot think his assessment of this
troll's aviation experience is sufficient to compensate for its
stinking vituperation? You're just attempting to spin a cover over
the blatant hipcrimeinization that you and the other self-proclaimed
net-kooks openly support.

Your true agenda is evident in your chosen domain name:

Main Entry:l*se*majest*
Variant:or lese majesty \*l*z-*ma-j*-st*, *lez-, *l*z-\
Function:noun
Etymology:Middle French lese majest*, from Latin laesa majestas,
literally, injured majesty
Date:1536

1 a : a crime (as treason) committed against a sovereign power
b : an offense violating the dignity of a ruler as the
representative of a sovereign power
2 : a detraction from or affront to dignity or importance


(It's also curious, that one who uses
as the Registrant Name contact of
his domain puts his e-mail address on his home page:
)

Open your eyes, man; is that what you want to be associated with?
Consider how what you foster here might affect Internet Broadcasting's
image in the eyes of its TV station clients; how do you think Dave
Abbott (or Reid Johnson) might find the repugnant attitude you
support? Is Internet Broadcasting a spamnaus or what?

Further, is this the public image of airmen that you feel is
appropriate to project worldwide? If you think this trolling
abomination is what your airmans certificate entitles you to inflect
on your fellows, perhaps you should go back to "messing about in
boats." Think about it, Rich. Please. This behavior reflects on the
entire worldwide airman community. As it is we're constantly being
characterized by the public as snobbish, noisy, hobby flyers who don't
deserve to share the skies with airline passengers. Imagine the field
day the news media could have publishing the scandalous public display
of asininity you both foster in this worldwide public forum.
Personally, I'd prefer to welcome a sober-headed, responsible member
to our ranks than an arrogant, destructive anarchist. Think about it.
Please.


Oblig. r.a.p content: Are you making any progress in accumulating
cross country hours toward your instrument rating?
http://lesemajeste.org/#flying

[[email protected]]

On Feb 15, 8:36*pm, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
> > It appears Bertie doesn't like you - based on his past posts (haven't read
> > them all) I'd guess it is because you have political views that differ
> > from
> > his, he thinks you're a bigot because of views you have expressed with
> > regard to illegal immigration, and you use employment practices that
> > appear
> > to be needlessly callous. (Again - all just guesses.)
>
> Wrong assumptions across the board. *Bertie and I got along just fine until
> I called him out on his knee-jerk, automated, inane, one-word nonsensical
> responses to MX's every post.
>
> When I pointed out that he had become a bigger liability to this group than
> his target, he became my rump-ranger.
>
> But, again, that's why the kill file was invented. *I haven't seen any of
> his posts in many weeks, and it's truly restored the utility of this group..
> I heartily recommend it.
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"

I am standing next to Jay on this one. We both speak our minds and if
it comes across as self serving. well so be it... This is America and
by god we can do that here. Several other posters I respect highly,
Like Jim in NC and others. I might not agree with some of their ideas
but enjoy reading their takes on various topics. I am guilt of making
a few crass comments and after sleeping on it I realized my mistake
and apoligized promply.
The big thing that toggles my BS meter is a person who posts with a
obvious fake and arrogent screen name. I put these people in the same
group as someone who would go into a theatre with a halloween mask on
and scream "fire". They are spineless creatures and spend their lives
lurking in the shadows of life... They suffer from the "small
testicle" syndrome.. I wish tailwinds to all the TRUE pilots in this
newsgroup and painfull hemeroids to the "whining, sniveling,keyboard
pilots sitting in their computer chairs spewing bitterness..

Ben Haas
N801BH
Jackson Hole WY

[RST Engineering]

How do you get a filing cabinet that big?

Jim



> Bertie knows how an airplane files,

[NVArt]

Jay Honeck's reasoned posts are always welcomed by this newsgrouper. I
hope someday to make it to Iowa and enjoy a visit with him, his
family, and hotel.

N5217D
HTH

[B A R R Y]

On Sun, 17 Feb 2008 08:44:13 -0800, "RST Engineering"
> wrote:

>How do you get a filing cabinet that big?

You never saw the drawers in the old blimp hangers at Moffet? <G>

[RST Engineering]

No, everybody I saw there was fully clothed.

{;-)

Jim

--
"If you think you can, or think you can't, you're right."
--Henry Ford

"B A R R Y" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 17 Feb 2008 08:44:13 -0800, "RST Engineering"
> > wrote:
>
>>How do you get a filing cabinet that big?
>
> You never saw the drawers in the old blimp hangers at Moffet? <G>

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Larry Dighera > wrote in
:

> On Sat, 16 Feb 2008 23:52:10 -0600, Rich Ahrens >
> blurted in . com>:
>
>>I'm simply amused by the
>>ignorance of some folks who confuse his antics in dealing with loons and
>>idiots with an imagined lack of aeronautic knowledge, and occasionally
>>feel the urge to mock them for it.
>
> Perhaps it is his mindless arrogance, unnecessary profanity, and
> neurotic compulsiveness to which "some ignorant folks" object.


Mebbe, I'm patient, though, and I'm here to deal with their ignorance.

Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Larry Dighera > wrote in
:

> On Sun, 17 Feb 2008 03:07:49 GMT, Jay Maynard
> > wrote in
> >:
>
>>On 2008-02-17, Big John > wrote:
>>> He is known as the "Tron" guy in the TX VHF-FM Society.
>>
>>Not just in the FM Society, but all around the net. See
>>http://www.tronguy.net for more.
>
> Internet Explorer crashed when I loaded this image:
> http://www.tronguy.net/images/headshot.jpg
>
> Very futuristic there, wackoid (and I mean that with all due respect).
> Not too original (marginally plagiarized from Disney:
> http://disney.go.com/disneyvideos/liveaction/tron/tron01.html#), but
> it shows initiative and determination if not creativity.
>
> Have you ever considered incorporating a micorcontroller and LEDs into
> an actively moving display scene on your suits? It's not that
> difficult....


Wow Lar, adjust your dosage. Or read some statutes. That should calm you
down.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

" > wrote in
:

> On Feb 15, 8:36*pm, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
>> > It appears Bertie doesn't like you - based on his past posts
>> > (haven't re
> ad
>> > them all) I'd guess it is because you have political views that
>> > differ from
>> > his, he thinks you're a bigot because of views you have expressed
>> > with regard to illegal immigration, and you use employment
>> > practices that appear
>> > to be needlessly callous. (Again - all just guesses.)
>>
>> Wrong assumptions across the board. *Bertie and I got along just fine
>> un
> til
>> I called him out on his knee-jerk, automated, inane, one-word
>> nonsensical responses to MX's every post.
>>
>> When I pointed out that he had become a bigger liability to this
>> group tha
> n
>> his target, he became my rump-ranger.
>>
>> But, again, that's why the kill file was invented. *I haven't seen
>> any o
> f
>> his posts in many weeks, and it's truly restored the utility of this
>> group
> .
>> I heartily recommend it.
>> --
>> Jay Honeck
>> Iowa City, IA
>> Pathfinder N56993www.AlexisParkInn.com
>> "Your Aviation Destination"
>
> I am standing next to Jay on this one. We both speak our minds and if
> it comes across as self serving. well so be it...


Woudldnt Jay have to have a mind?

This is America and
> by god we can do that here. Several other posters I respect highly,
> Like Jim in NC and others. I might not agree with some of their ideas
> but enjoy reading their takes on various topics. I am guilt of making
> a few crass comments and after sleeping on it I realized my mistake
> and apoligized promply.
> The big thing that toggles my BS meter is a person who posts with a
> obvious fake and arrogent screen name. I put these people in the same
> group as someone who would go into a theatre with a halloween mask on
> and scream "fire".


I'm sure you would.

What's next, the inevitable nazi accusation?



They are spineless creatures and spend their lives
> lurking in the shadows of life... They suffer from the "small
> testicle" syndrome.. I wish tailwinds to all the TRUE pilots in this
> newsgroup and painfull hemeroids to the "whining, sniveling,keyboard
> pilots sitting in their computer chairs spewing bitterness.


Bwawhawhahwhahwhawhahwhahwhahhwhahwhahwhahwha!

Bertie>

[Jay Honeck[_2_]]

> Jay Honeck's reasoned posts are always welcomed by this newsgrouper. I
> hope someday to make it to Iowa and enjoy a visit with him, his
> family, and hotel.

Thank you, sir. Our door is always open, our hangar fridge is always
stocked, and there will always be room at the inn for everyone on this
group. The H.O.P.S. party will go on at Oshkosh, the pool party will happen
here in Iowa City, and we will continue to introduce everyone and anyone to
the joys of flying.

Remember -- no matter what we all say here, no matter what the trolls do
here, we are all united in our love of aviation. We wouldn't be here if we
didn't believe that flying was the greatest thing to do, and I, for one, am
not going to let the acidic self-hatred of a few foul-mouthed faux pilots
ruin this group.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jay Honeck[_2_]]

> Open your eyes, man; is that what you want to be associated with?
> Consider how what you foster here might affect Internet Broadcasting's
> image in the eyes of its TV station clients; how do you think Dave
> Abbott (or Reid Johnson) might find the repugnant attitude you
> support? Is Internet Broadcasting a spamnaus or what?

Interesting. I had always pictured Mr. Ahrens as more of the "angry young
man/unemployed/MX"-type.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[B A R R Y]

On Sun, 17 Feb 2008 21:55:12 GMT, "Jay Honeck"
> wrote:

>Remember -- no matter what we all say here, no matter what the trolls do
>here, we are all united in our love of aviation.

Right on.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in
news:432uj.38213$9j6.19114@attbi_s22:

>> Jay Honeck's reasoned posts are always welcomed by this newsgrouper.
>> I hope someday to make it to Iowa and enjoy a visit with him, his
>> family, and hotel.
>
> Thank you, sir. Our door is always open, our hangar fridge is always
> stocked, and there will always be room at the inn for everyone on this
> group. The H.O.P.S. party will go on at Oshkosh, the pool party will
> happen here in Iowa City, and we will continue to introduce everyone
> and anyone to the joys of flying.
>
> Remember -- no matter what we all say here, no matter what the trolls
> do here, we are all united in our love of aviation. We wouldn't be
> here if we didn't believe that flying was the greatest thing to do,
> and I, for one, am not going to let the acidic self-hatred of a few
> foul-mouthed faux pilots ruin this group.


I don't hate myself.

And you sue aion't gonna make me, wannabe boi.



Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in
news:Vx2uj.38245$yE1.8357@attbi_s21:

>> Open your eyes, man; is that what you want to be associated with?
>> Consider how what you foster here might affect Internet
>> Broadcasting's image in the eyes of its TV station clients; how do
>> you think Dave Abbott (or Reid Johnson) might find the repugnant
>> attitude you support? Is Internet Broadcasting a spamnaus or what?
>
> Interesting. I had always pictured Mr. Ahrens as more of the "angry
> young man/unemployed/MX"-type.

You'd be wrong there....



But why break the habits of a lifetime, eh?


Bertie

[[email protected]]

On Feb 17, 1:40*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> " > wrote :
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 15, 8:36*pm, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
> >> > It appears Bertie doesn't like you - based on his past posts
> >> > (haven't re
> > ad
> >> > them all) I'd guess it is because you have political views that
> >> > differ from
> >> > his, he thinks you're a bigot because of views you have expressed
> >> > with regard to illegal immigration, and you use employment
> >> > practices that appear
> >> > to be needlessly callous. (Again - all just guesses.)
>
> >> Wrong assumptions across the board. *Bertie and I got along just fine
> >> un
> > til
> >> I called him out on his knee-jerk, automated, inane, one-word
> >> nonsensical responses to MX's every post.
>
> >> When I pointed out that he had become a bigger liability to this
> >> group tha
> > n
> >> his target, he became my rump-ranger.
>
> >> But, again, that's why the kill file was invented. *I haven't seen
> >> any o
> > f
> >> his posts in many weeks, and it's truly restored the utility of this
> >> group
> > .
> >> I heartily recommend it.
> >> --
> >> Jay Honeck
> >> Iowa City, IA
> >> Pathfinder N56993www.AlexisParkInn.com
> >> "Your Aviation Destination"
>
> > I am standing next to Jay on this one. We both speak our minds and if
> > it comes across as self serving. well so be it...
>
> Woudldnt Jay have to have a mind?
>
> *This is America and
>
> > by god we can do that here. Several other posters I respect highly,
> > Like Jim in NC and others. I might not agree with *some of their ideas
> > but enjoy reading their takes on various topics. I am guilt of making
> > a few crass comments and after sleeping on it I realized my mistake
> > and apoligized promply.
> > *The big thing that toggles my BS meter is a person who posts with a
> > obvious fake and arrogent screen name. I put these people in the same
> > group as someone who would go into a theatre with a halloween mask on
> > and scream "fire".
>
> I'm sure you would.
>
> What's next, the inevitable nazi accusation?
>
> They are spineless creatures and spend their lives
>
> > lurking in the shadows of life... They suffer from the "small
> > testicle" syndrome.. I wish tailwinds to all the TRUE pilots in this
> > newsgroup and painfull hemeroids to the "whining, sniveling,keyboard
> > pilots sitting in their computer chairs spewing bitterness.
>
> Bwawhawhahwhahwhawhahwhahwhahhwhahwhahwhahwha!
>
> Bertie>- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I didn't mention your name in my post......... Ya feeing kinda guilty
or something ??????

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

" > wrote in
:

> On Feb 17, 1:40*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>> " > wrote
>> innews:e185d601-e130-4116-9d6d
> :
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > On Feb 15, 8:36*pm, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
>> >> > It appears Bertie doesn't like you - based on his past posts
>> >> > (haven't re
>> > ad
>> >> > them all) I'd guess it is because you have political views that
>> >> > differ from
>> >> > his, he thinks you're a bigot because of views you have
>> >> > expressed with regard to illegal immigration, and you use
>> >> > employment practices that appear
>> >> > to be needlessly callous. (Again - all just guesses.)
>>
>> >> Wrong assumptions across the board. *Bertie and I got along just
>> >> fine
>
>> >> un
>> > til
>> >> I called him out on his knee-jerk, automated, inane, one-word
>> >> nonsensical responses to MX's every post.
>>
>> >> When I pointed out that he had become a bigger liability to this
>> >> group tha
>> > n
>> >> his target, he became my rump-ranger.
>>
>> >> But, again, that's why the kill file was invented. *I haven't seen
>> >> any o
>> > f
>> >> his posts in many weeks, and it's truly restored the utility of
>> >> this group
>> > .
>> >> I heartily recommend it.
>> >> --
>> >> Jay Honeck
>> >> Iowa City, IA
>> >> Pathfinder N56993www.AlexisParkInn.com
>> >> "Your Aviation Destination"
>>
>> > I am standing next to Jay on this one. We both speak our minds and
>> > if it comes across as self serving. well so be it...
>>
>> Woudldnt Jay have to have a mind?
>>
>> *This is America and
>>
>> > by god we can do that here. Several other posters I respect highly,
>> > Like Jim in NC and others. I might not agree with *some of their
>> > ideas
>
>> > but enjoy reading their takes on various topics. I am guilt of
>> > making a few crass comments and after sleeping on it I realized my
>> > mistake and apoligized promply.
>> > *The big thing that toggles my BS meter is a person who posts with
>> > a obvious fake and arrogent screen name. I put these people in the
>> > same group as someone who would go into a theatre with a halloween
>> > mask on and scream "fire".
>>
>> I'm sure you would.
>>
>> What's next, the inevitable nazi accusation?
>>
>> They are spineless creatures and spend their lives
>>
>> > lurking in the shadows of life... They suffer from the "small
>> > testicle" syndrome.. I wish tailwinds to all the TRUE pilots in
>> > this newsgroup and painfull hemeroids to the "whining,
>> > sniveling,keyboard pilots sitting in their computer chairs spewing
>> > bitterness.
>>
>> Bwawhawhahwhahwhawhahwhahwhahhwhahwhahwhahwha!
>>
>> Bertie>- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> I didn't mention your name in my post......... Ya feeing kinda guilty
> or something ??????
>
Nope.

Bertie

[[email protected]]

On Feb 17, 4:55*pm, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
>
> We wouldn't be here if we didn't believe that flying was
> the greatest thing to do,

Not really. Many of us believe that flying is a nice hobby, but we do
other things that are more important, more challenging, and more
enjoyable.

[[email protected]]

On Feb 19, 6:24*am, wrote:
> On Feb 17, 4:55*pm, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
>
>
>
> > We wouldn't be here if we didn't believe that flying was
> > the greatest thing to do,
>
> Not really. Many of us believe that flying is a nice hobby, but we do
> other things that are more important, more challenging, and more
> enjoyable.

Wanna bet??? {: - )

[Mike Noel]

Sometimes I would ride my bicycle to the airport for a weekly flying fix.
Even though flying is an important part of my life, the bike ride was at
least as enjoyable as time in the airplane.

Diversity makes life much more interesting.

--
Best Regards,
Mike

http://photoshow.comcast.net/mikenoel


> wrote in message
...
On Feb 17, 4:55 pm, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
>
> We wouldn't be here if we didn't believe that flying was
> the greatest thing to do,

Not really. Many of us believe that flying is a nice hobby, but we do
other things that are more important, more challenging, and more
enjoyable.

[Jay Honeck[_2_]]

> Sometimes I would ride my bicycle to the airport for a weekly flying fix.
> Even though flying is an important part of my life, the bike ride was at
> least as enjoyable as time in the airplane.

I hope I never become so jaded with flying that it becomes as mundane as
riding my bike. That would truly be....awful.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[B A R R Y[_2_]]

Jay Honeck wrote:
>>
>
> I hope I never become so jaded with flying that it becomes as mundane as
> riding my bike. That would truly be....awful.


Bike riding doesn't have to be mundane. <G>

Hills help.

[[email protected]]

On Feb 20, 1:47*am, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
> > Sometimes I would ride my bicycle to the airport for a weekly flying fix..
> > Even though flying is an important part of my life, the bike ride was at
> > least as enjoyable as time in the airplane.
>
> I hope I never become so jaded with flying that it becomes as mundane as
> riding my bike. *That would truly be....awful.

The thing is, people who have activities they esteem more highly than
recreational aviation don't necessarily appreciate flying any less
than you do. They may just appreciate some other things more than you
do.

[William Hung[_2_]]

On Feb 11, 8:34*pm, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at Hooters) for
> a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North Atlantic, 50 miles
> short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>
> Here's the story, from Airliners.net:
> ************************************************** **************************************************
> At 15:50 local time, contact was made with RKV ICG centre from a Cessna 310,
> arriving from Narsarsuaq, which had lost power in one of its engines, 60
> miles off Keflavik. In an effort to pump fuel between tanks its feared both
> engines failed and the pilot had to rely on gliding the aircraft. At the
> time he was descending through 7000 ft heading towards Reykjavik.
>
> RKV ATC Centre initiated emergency status in KEF and the ICG Centre sent its
> Super Pumas, TF-GNA and TF-LIF out to the incident site.
>
> At 16:10 the Cessna 310 disappeared from radar, around 50 miles from
> Keflavik.
>
> A Challenger 604 from the Danish Air Force was sent straight to the scene of
> the incident and a full search was carried out from that point.
>
> TF-LIF arrived at the scene around 17:00. No sighting of the Cessna 310 had
> been made and no signal from the emergency transmitter was noticed.
>
> Three trawlers which were near the scene of the incident where called
> immediately into action and a full scale search was underway. A Cessna 172
> aircraft was also involved in the search operation as well as various rescue
> boats from Slysavarnarfelagid Landsbjorg.
>
> ICGs own F27 TF-SYN was sent out as a surveillance aircraft to replace the
> efforts of the DAF CL604. A patrol vessel from the ICG was also sent out to
> help the search efforts.
> ************************************************** **************************************************
> Pretty much a worst-case scenario. *High seas, ice cold water, gliding a
> dead stick C-310 into 40-foot swells. *NWPilot says he didn't start drinking
> until 3 hours after the crash -- survival time in the water is estimated at
> 2 hours, maximum, in a survival suit. The pilot's name was Jeff Hall, and he
> helped NW get into the biz.
>
> Raise a toast to a brave man, gents....
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"

O'sheenana,

Not intending to disrespect the dead, but can a Ferry pilot get life
insurance? How about the insurance for the plane in ferry mode with
tons of fuel on board? If so, that's gotta be very very expensive.

Wil

[Jay Honeck[_2_]]

> Bike riding doesn't have to be mundane. <G>
>
> Hills help.

Nothing against bike riding. It's especially fun when combined with flying.
(Last summer Joe and I flew to Washington Island, in Lake Michigan, and rode
our mountain bikes all over. The year before we flew to Madeline Island,
out in Lake Superior, and did the same.)

However, to equate bike riding with flying is just troll fodder, to me.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Kloudy via AviationKB.com]

John Smith wrote:
>> > Bike riding doesn't have to be mundane. <G>
>> >
>[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>>
>> However, to equate bike riding with flying is just troll fodder, to me.
>
>I don't know about that.

Oh brother, when I began climbing the coastal hills between San Francisco and
Pt Reyes, Marshall, Petaluma on my Eddy Merckx after three years on a
Specialized Allez...

That was flyin'

--
Message posted via AviationKB.com
http://www.aviationkb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/aviation/200802/1

[Mike Noel]

There is a big difference in riding a bike occasionally and riding often
enough to get good at it. Once you're conditioned to a long, fast ride, it
is one of the best 'highs' around.

And it doesn't help keep the bad guys in power.
--
Best Regards,
Mike

http://photoshow.comcast.net/mikenoel


"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:uWWuj.41980$9j6.1508@attbi_s22...
>> Bike riding doesn't have to be mundane. <G>
>>
>> Hills help.
>
> Nothing against bike riding. It's especially fun when combined with
> flying. (Last summer Joe and I flew to Washington Island, in Lake
> Michigan, and rode our mountain bikes all over. The year before we flew
> to Madeline Island, out in Lake Superior, and did the same.)
>
> However, to equate bike riding with flying is just troll fodder, to me.
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993
> www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"

[Rich Ahrens[_2_]]

Oh my. I leave town for a few days of R&R and Larry the NetKopp goes
positively ape**** with his script kiddie tools. How amusing... Let's
see what he's frothing about now...

Larry Dighera wrote:
> Perhaps it is his mindless arrogance, unnecessary profanity, and
> neurotic compulsiveness to which "some ignorant folks" object. But I
> wouldn't expect a mid-western apartment dweller to possess the
> discretion to be aware of those obnoxious personality defects in which
> he so exuberantly revels.

When I can observe them in you?

Apartment dweller? Bwaaaaahahahahaaaa!!! By your measure, Rupert Murdoch
is an apartment dweller as well.

> What makes a low-time private pilot think his assessment of this
> troll's aviation experience is sufficient to compensate for its
> stinking vituperation? You're just attempting to spin a cover over
> the blatant hipcrimeinization that you and the other self-proclaimed
> net-kooks openly support.

Wow. Did you eat some bad bologna to cause you barf that nonsense out?
Hipcrimeinization? Clap, clap, clap!!! Larry made his own word! Can I
try one? How about Digheratype - an obsolete photographic process used
for self-portraiture in which the self-image is made by smearing one's
own feces on a surface of tin foil, then developing it with one's own
flatulence..

And I've seen his certificates and type ratings, by the way. And flown
with him. And seen the aircraft he is building. So private pilot or not,
I'm in much better position than just about anyone here to know how
experienced he is. But far more senior pilots in the group than either
you or I have also concluded he's the real thing. Jealous, are you?

> Your true agenda is evident in your chosen domain name:
>
> Main Entry:l*se*majest*
> Variant:or lese majesty \*l*z-*ma-j*-st*, *lez-, *l*z-\
> Function:noun
> Etymology:Middle French lese majest*, from Latin laesa majestas,
> literally, injured majesty
> Date:1536
>
> 1 a : a crime (as treason) committed against a sovereign power
> b : an offense violating the dignity of a ruler as the
> representative of a sovereign power
> 2 : a detraction from or affront to dignity or importance

Awwwww...is Lawwy's dignity or importance feeling diminished???

And if you don't think our "rulers" need their dignity violated further
(what little they've left themselves in this administration) you're even
a bigger idiot than I thought. Which is almost unimaginable. Perhaps
your stupidity has reached such levels of density that it is collapsing
upon itself? No intelligent remark, in the highly unlikely possibility
of your coming up with one, can cross your event horizon?

> (It's also curious, that one who uses
> as the Registrant Name contact of
> his domain puts his e-mail address on his home page:
> )

Of course you don't understand it. You're too much a craven coward to
stand up for yourself.

> Open your eyes, man; is that what you want to be associated with?
> Consider how what you foster here might affect Internet Broadcasting's
> image in the eyes of its TV station clients; how do you think Dave
> Abbott (or Reid Johnson) might find the repugnant attitude you
> support? Is Internet Broadcasting a spamnaus or what?

What do you think, Mr. NetKopp? You swinging for a kook award by
threatening to go real life or something? You have the balls to make a
try at it? Prepare to be laughed at in the very least.

> Further, is this the public image of airmen that you feel is
> appropriate to project worldwide? If you think this trolling
> abomination is what your airmans certificate entitles you to inflect
> on your fellows, perhaps you should go back to "messing about in
> boats." Think about it, Rich. Please. This behavior reflects on the
> entire worldwide airman community.

Not half as badly as your pathetic little NetKopp games reflect on the
human race in general, Larry-boy.

> As it is we're constantly being characterized by the public as
> snobbish, noisy, hobby flyers who don't deserve to share the skies
> with airline passengers.

I'm sure you are. But not the rest of us. Don't project the rejection
you meet everywhere you go on the rest of us.

Oh, and you really pathetically stupid enough to believe that any
meaningful fraction of the world has the slightest clue what goes on in
RAP??? I doubt the number of regular participants reaches three digits,
and when you factor in lurking readers, I suspect we're talking the low
four digits. So don't inflate your importance or this newsgroup's, kook.

> Imagine the field day the news media could have publishing the
> scandalous public display of asininity you both foster in this
> worldwide public forum.

Legitimate news media recognize Usenet for what it is and would hardly
treat this little self-selected bunch of geeks as representative of
anything. The kind of crap rags you probably read simply don't matter.

> Personally, I'd prefer to welcome a sober-headed, responsible member
> to our ranks than an arrogant, destructive anarchist. Think about it.
> Please.

Shove it up your ass. Please.

> Oblig. r.a.p content: Are you making any progress in accumulating
> cross country hours toward your instrument rating?
> http://lesemajeste.org/

Wouldn't you like to know? But I urge *everyone* to take a look at the
site. Openly urge them, unlike your chicken**** implication...

[Rich Ahrens[_2_]]

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
> "Jay Honeck" > wrote in
>> Interesting. I had always pictured Mr. Ahrens as more of the "angry
>> young man/unemployed/MX"-type.
>
> You'd be wrong there....

This comes as a surprise? When has Jay ever been right about anything,
after all.

> But why break the habits of a lifetime, eh?

Indeed. And I can hardly wait to hear Anthony's reaction to being lumped
in with angry young men, his favorite whipping boys.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Rich Ahrens > wrote in news:47be51a6$0$1112
:

> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>> "Jay Honeck" > wrote in
>>> Interesting. I had always pictured Mr. Ahrens as more of the "angry
>>> young man/unemployed/MX"-type.
>>
>> You'd be wrong there....
>
> This comes as a surprise? When has Jay ever been right about anything,
> after all.
>
>> But why break the habits of a lifetime, eh?
>
> Indeed. And I can hardly wait to hear Anthony's reaction to being lumped
> in with angry young men, his favorite whipping boys.
>

Oh please. There's an image I don't want dwelling in my skull.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

William Hung > wrote in
:

> On Feb 11, 8:34*pm, "Jay Honeck" > wrote:
>> Just got off the phone with NWPilot, calling me from a wake (at
>> Hooters) f
> or
>> a fellow ferry pilot who went down today in the North Atlantic, 50
>> miles short of Keflavik, Iceland.
>>
>> Here's the story, from Airliners.net:
>>
************************************************** ********************
>> ****
> **************************
>> At 15:50 local time, contact was made with RKV ICG centre from a
>> Cessna 31
> 0,
>> arriving from Narsarsuaq, which had lost power in one of its engines,
>> 60 miles off Keflavik. In an effort to pump fuel between tanks its
>> feared bot
> h
>> engines failed and the pilot had to rely on gliding the aircraft. At
>> the time he was descending through 7000 ft heading towards Reykjavik.
>>
>> RKV ATC Centre initiated emergency status in KEF and the ICG Centre
>> sent i
> ts
>> Super Pumas, TF-GNA and TF-LIF out to the incident site.
>>
>> At 16:10 the Cessna 310 disappeared from radar, around 50 miles from
>> Keflavik.
>>
>> A Challenger 604 from the Danish Air Force was sent straight to the
>> scene
> of
>> the incident and a full search was carried out from that point.
>>
>> TF-LIF arrived at the scene around 17:00. No sighting of the Cessna
>> 310 ha
> d
>> been made and no signal from the emergency transmitter was noticed.
>>
>> Three trawlers which were near the scene of the incident where called
>> immediately into action and a full scale search was underway. A
>> Cessna 172
>
>> aircraft was also involved in the search operation as well as various
>> resc
> ue
>> boats from Slysavarnarfelagid Landsbjorg.
>>
>> ICGs own F27 TF-SYN was sent out as a surveillance aircraft to
>> replace the
>
>> efforts of the DAF CL604. A patrol vessel from the ICG was also sent
>> out t
> o
>> help the search efforts.
>>
************************************************** ********************
>> ****
> **************************
>> Pretty much a worst-case scenario. *High seas, ice cold water,
>> gliding a
>
>> dead stick C-310 into 40-foot swells. *NWPilot says he didn't start
>> drin
> king
>> until 3 hours after the crash -- survival time in the water is
>> estimated a
> t
>> 2 hours, maximum, in a survival suit. The pilot's name was Jeff Hall,
>> and
> he
>> helped NW get into the biz.
>>
>> Raise a toast to a brave man, gents....
>> --
>> Jay Honeck
>> Iowa City, IA
>> Pathfinder N56993www.AlexisParkInn.com
>> "Your Aviation Destination"
>
> O'sheenana,
>
> Not intending to disrespect the dead, but can a Ferry pilot get life
> insurance? How about the insurance for the plane in ferry mode with
> tons of fuel on board? If so, that's gotta be very very expensive.


Dunno. Most make it. I know ferry pilots who have done hundreds of them.
I know one who went in and got rescued, but most aren;t the life
insurance "type".


Bertie