Landing on one wheel

[Ol Shy & Bashful]

This is fun stiring the pot! OK ...how many of you practice doing a
one wheel touch and go from time to time. And I don't mean by
accident.
I did it all the time with tailwheel students, and still do it with
students in 172's. We frequently get winds that are 15 G25 90 to the
runway and topography that makes the winds squirrly as hell on the
west end. Learning good crosswind techniques are vital.
I recognize different techniques are needed for different aircraft
with wing clearance, etc but I still did them with lots of different
low wing aircraft like Piper Pawnee, Cessna Ag Husky, Ag Cat,
Stearman, Thrush and so on.
Ol S&B

[Denny]

Used to do that with my T-Craft... Land on one wheel, hop gently over
to the other wheel without having both touch, and back and forth,
finally add power and go around when out of runway... Simpler times...
I used to fly for $2.90 an hour, gas and oil....

denny

[Dudley Henriques[_2_]]

Ol Shy & Bashful wrote:
> This is fun stiring the pot! OK ...how many of you practice doing a
> one wheel touch and go from time to time. And I don't mean by
> accident.
> I did it all the time with tailwheel students, and still do it with
> students in 172's. We frequently get winds that are 15 G25 90 to the
> runway and topography that makes the winds squirrly as hell on the
> west end. Learning good crosswind techniques are vital.
> I recognize different techniques are needed for different aircraft
> with wing clearance, etc but I still did them with lots of different
> low wing aircraft like Piper Pawnee, Cessna Ag Husky, Ag Cat,
> Stearman, Thrush and so on.
> Ol S&B
We had occasion one time to loan Miss America to Bob Hoover to use for
his demonstration. His P51 had been damaged in a forced landing the day
before. The only stipulation we placed on his use of the airplane was
that he not do any one wheel landings. It was strongly felt by all of us
that these "landings" if not directly, at least have a strong potential
to place undue stress on the main gear leg and attach points where the
wheel meets the axle.
True, this was our personal choice, but I would still feel this way today.
I've never actually asked Bob to clarify the issue by disclosing if he
ever had maintanence done on the main gear oleos on his 51, so to be
fair, it was then and is as I write this an open issue and simply a
matter of opinion.

--
Dudley Henriques

[[email protected]]

Ol Shy & Bashful > wrote:
> This is fun stiring the pot! OK ...how many of you practice doing a
> one wheel touch and go from time to time. And I don't mean by
> accident.
> I did it all the time with tailwheel students, and still do it with
> students in 172's. We frequently get winds that are 15 G25 90 to the
> runway and topography that makes the winds squirrly as hell on the
> west end. Learning good crosswind techniques are vital.
> I recognize different techniques are needed for different aircraft
> with wing clearance, etc but I still did them with lots of different
> low wing aircraft like Piper Pawnee, Cessna Ag Husky, Ag Cat,
> Stearman, Thrush and so on.
> Ol S&B

Well, I always use the slip approach method so if whatever it takes
to stay on the center line results in a one wheel landing, that's
what happens.

I never considered it to be anything special.

--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

[[email protected]]

On Mar 18, 8:04 am, Dudley Henriques > wrote:
> Ol Shy & Bashful wrote:> This is fun stiring the pot! OK ...how many of you practice doing a
> > one wheel touch and go from time to time. And I don't mean by
> > accident.
> > I did it all the time with tailwheel students, and still do it with
> > students in 172's. We frequently get winds that are 15 G25 90 to the
> > runway and topography that makes the winds squirrly as hell on the
> > west end. Learning good crosswind techniques are vital.
> > I recognize different techniques are needed for different aircraft
> > with wing clearance, etc but I still did them with lots of different
> > low wing aircraft like Piper Pawnee, Cessna Ag Husky, Ag Cat,
> > Stearman, Thrush and so on.
> > Ol S&B
>
> We had occasion one time to loan Miss America to Bob Hoover to use for
> his demonstration. His P51 had been damaged in a forced landing the day
> before. The only stipulation we placed on his use of the airplane was
> that he not do any one wheel landings. It was strongly felt by all of us
> that these "landings" if not directly, at least have a strong potential
> to place undue stress on the main gear leg and attach points where the
> wheel meets the axle.
> True, this was our personal choice, but I would still feel this way today.
> I've never actually asked Bob to clarify the issue by disclosing if he
> ever had maintanence done on the main gear oleos on his 51, so to be
> fair, it was then and is as I write this an open issue and simply a
> matter of opinion.
>
> --
> Dudley Henriques

Pretty hard to damage the gear on a Citabria doing that.
They're stout, to withstand the abuses of the novice. I've done the
one-wheel thing with students in the past, students who are having
trouble transitioning to the taildragger. The one-wheel touch-and-go
teaches them to fly the airplane ALL the time, not just until
touchdown like they tend to do in a trike. It also develops strong
crosswind skills. After that, they're careful in trikes, too, since
now they know that the airplane really isn't finished flying until
it's tied down. Every so often you hear of another 172 or something
that came to grief after the pilot made a successful touchdown, only
to lose it in the rollout.

Dan

[Dudley Henriques[_2_]]

wrote:
> On Mar 18, 8:04 am, Dudley Henriques > wrote:
>> Ol Shy & Bashful wrote:> This is fun stiring the pot! OK ...how many of you practice doing a
>>> one wheel touch and go from time to time. And I don't mean by
>>> accident.
>>> I did it all the time with tailwheel students, and still do it with
>>> students in 172's. We frequently get winds that are 15 G25 90 to the
>>> runway and topography that makes the winds squirrly as hell on the
>>> west end. Learning good crosswind techniques are vital.
>>> I recognize different techniques are needed for different aircraft
>>> with wing clearance, etc but I still did them with lots of different
>>> low wing aircraft like Piper Pawnee, Cessna Ag Husky, Ag Cat,
>>> Stearman, Thrush and so on.
>>> Ol S&B
>> We had occasion one time to loan Miss America to Bob Hoover to use for
>> his demonstration. His P51 had been damaged in a forced landing the day
>> before. The only stipulation we placed on his use of the airplane was
>> that he not do any one wheel landings. It was strongly felt by all of us
>> that these "landings" if not directly, at least have a strong potential
>> to place undue stress on the main gear leg and attach points where the
>> wheel meets the axle.
>> True, this was our personal choice, but I would still feel this way today.
>> I've never actually asked Bob to clarify the issue by disclosing if he
>> ever had maintanence done on the main gear oleos on his 51, so to be
>> fair, it was then and is as I write this an open issue and simply a
>> matter of opinion.
>>
>> --
>> Dudley Henriques
>
> Pretty hard to damage the gear on a Citabria doing that.
> They're stout, to withstand the abuses of the novice. I've done the
> one-wheel thing with students in the past, students who are having
> trouble transitioning to the taildragger. The one-wheel touch-and-go
> teaches them to fly the airplane ALL the time, not just until
> touchdown like they tend to do in a trike. It also develops strong
> crosswind skills. After that, they're careful in trikes, too, since
> now they know that the airplane really isn't finished flying until
> it's tied down. Every so often you hear of another 172 or something
> that came to grief after the pilot made a successful touchdown, only
> to lose it in the rollout.
>
> Dan
The argument for practicing one wheel landings as a teaching tool can
indeed be made and the technique is not a new concept for instructors
dealing with tail wheel instruction.

The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much better
suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed then an oleo leg.
In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive tire wear due to
scrubbing.

It's a toss up really. If monitored closely by the instructor, it most
certainly can be done without serious incident.
I would say that I personally have not used this technique in teaching
tail wheel students having found it unnecessary to do so.

I should say that I have stood facing down a runway while doing safety
work at air shows and watched this being done by pilots who were
experiencing what I would easily classify as excessive and damaging side
loads placed on their main gear as touchdowns were made cross controlled
but WAY off the required correction for the existing wind conditions.

I've used the technique myself doing comedy acts in Citabrias and
Decathlons both. I was a fair stick (on ccasion anyway :-) and I've
stressed a tire or two and felt that "spring released force" myself on
occasion as a sudden wind shift screwed up my carefully planned out one
wheel landing :-))

--
Dudley Henriques

[Phil J]

On Mar 18, 5:26*am, "Ol Shy & Bashful" > wrote:
> This is fun stiring the pot! OK ...how many of you practice doing a
> one wheel touch and go from time to time. And I don't mean by
> accident.
> I did it all the time with tailwheel students, and still do it with
> students in 172's. We frequently get winds that are 15 G25 90 to the
> runway and topography that makes the winds squirrly as hell on the
> west end. Learning good crosswind techniques are vital.
> I recognize different techniques are needed for different aircraft
> with wing clearance, etc but I still did them with lots of different
> low wing aircraft like Piper Pawnee, Cessna Ag Husky, Ag Cat,
> Stearman, Thrush and so on.
> Ol S&B

I have yet to do it on purpose, but I would like to!

Phil

[JGalban via AviationKB.com]

Ol Shy & Bashful wrote:
>This is fun stiring the pot! OK ...how many of you practice doing a
>one wheel touch and go from time to time. And I don't mean by
>accident.

A friend of mine got a nasty surprise when he tried this on a dirt strip a
few years back. I had already landed and was shooting some video of him
doing one-wheel T&Gs in his 182. After 4 of these (2 on each wheel) he
landed. When I looked at the outboard leading edge of the elevator, there
was a hole showing. Seems the dirt and pebbles coming off the main gear shot
straight back to the elevator and sandblasted a hole in the thin material
(can't remember if it was thin metal or plastic).

Fortunately, he had some 200 Kt. metalized duct tape on hand to get him
home.

John Galban=====>N4BQ (PA28-180)

--
Message posted via http://www.aviationkb.com

[Dudley Henriques[_2_]]

john smith wrote:
> Dudley Henriques wrote:
>> The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much better
>> suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed then an oleo leg.
>> In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive tire wear due to
>> scrubbing.
>
> Ah! But what about the wheelpants? :-))


My guess would be that if a pilot is catching a pant while attempting a
one wheel landing, that pilot is in wind WAY over their head :-))))

--
Dudley Henriques

[[email protected]]

On Mar 18, 2:53 pm, Dudley Henriques > wrote:
> john smith wrote:
> > Dudley Henriques wrote:
> >> The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much better
> >> suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed then an oleo leg.
> >> In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive tire wear due to
> >> scrubbing.
>
> > Ah! But what about the wheelpants? :-))
>
> My guess would be that if a pilot is catching a pant while attempting a
> one wheel landing, that pilot is in wind WAY over their head :-))))
>
> --
> Dudley Henriques

Might explain the Lufthansa incident....

;-)

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Dudley Henriques > wrote in
:

> john smith wrote:
>> Dudley Henriques wrote:
>>> The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much better
>>> suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed then an oleo
leg.
>>> In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive tire wear due
to
>>> scrubbing.
>>
>> Ah! But what about the wheelpants? :-))
>
>
> My guess would be that if a pilot is catching a pant while attempting
a
> one wheel landing, that pilot is in wind WAY over their head :-))))
>

Zachery. I had a nasty experience somewhat realted to this about ten
years ago in my Luscombe. I had bought a pair of wheel pants form
Wagaero. Fiberglass ones. The field I fly from is a bit muddy so I
fiberglassed a pair of "dams" in the back just behind the wheel to
prevent mud building up inside of the pants.
Anyhow. i dropped a friend at a paved strip to collect is airplane and
while taxiing in I noticed it was pulling to one side a bit. It had
mechanical brakes so I got out the tools and let the cable on that side
slack a bit and went to go home. It was very windy. About 25 knots with
a fair bit of crosswind from the right ( the left wheel was pulling a
bit still, but not what I considered significant) I rolled and just as I
rotated the airplane lurched left with a god awful screech. Airborne and
catching my wind, I climbed away and wondered WTF that was all about. A
bit later I looked out at my left wheel and saw my wheel pant pointing
straight down! ****.
I flew back to my home base. The wind there couldn't have been more
favorable. It was about 25 knots, about 25 degrees off the runway
heading from the right. I was able to touch down and keep my left wing
up almost to walking pace, when the left wheel came down and I did a
gentle groundloop to the left. Very little damage to the pant, BTW. The
bracket broke and a bit of fiberglass was ground away is all.
Couple of interesting points about it were; the field I went to was
unpaved and also uninhabited, so no emergency services if I had hurt
myself. (No radio on this ship) However, my friend had seen the incident
from the ground and called his wife to be at the field when I arrived. I
did have the presence of mind to try and ensure that the impact , if I
did flip it, wouldn't ruin my looks. I took off my glasses and took the
pen out of my pocket. I thought about using the vacant seat cushion on
the panel just in case, but couldn't figure a way to fasten it there. (
no shoulder harness) Anyhow, I got away with it and no real harm done.
The cause, of course, was one of those dams I had put inside the pant
coming adrift and lodging itself between the wheel and the pant.

Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

wrote in
:

> On Mar 18, 2:53 pm, Dudley Henriques > wrote:
>> john smith wrote:
>> > Dudley Henriques wrote:
>> >> The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much
>> >> better suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed then
>> >> an oleo leg. In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive
>> >> tire wear due to scrubbing.
>>
>> > Ah! But what about the wheelpants? :-))
>>
>> My guess would be that if a pilot is catching a pant while attempting
>> a one wheel landing, that pilot is in wind WAY over their head :-))))
>>
>> --
>> Dudley Henriques
>
> Might explain the Lufthansa incident...

An impromptu flying farmer act in an A320? cool!


Bertie

[Dudley Henriques[_2_]]

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
> Dudley Henriques > wrote in
> :
>
>> john smith wrote:
>>> Dudley Henriques wrote:
>>>> The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much better
>>>> suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed then an oleo
> leg.
>>>> In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive tire wear due
> to
>>>> scrubbing.
>>> Ah! But what about the wheelpants? :-))
>>
>> My guess would be that if a pilot is catching a pant while attempting
> a
>> one wheel landing, that pilot is in wind WAY over their head :-))))
>>
>
> Zachery. I had a nasty experience somewhat realted to this about ten
> years ago in my Luscombe. I had bought a pair of wheel pants form
> Wagaero. Fiberglass ones. The field I fly from is a bit muddy so I
> fiberglassed a pair of "dams" in the back just behind the wheel to
> prevent mud building up inside of the pants.
> Anyhow. i dropped a friend at a paved strip to collect is airplane and
> while taxiing in I noticed it was pulling to one side a bit. It had
> mechanical brakes so I got out the tools and let the cable on that side
> slack a bit and went to go home. It was very windy. About 25 knots with
> a fair bit of crosswind from the right ( the left wheel was pulling a
> bit still, but not what I considered significant) I rolled and just as I
> rotated the airplane lurched left with a god awful screech. Airborne and
> catching my wind, I climbed away and wondered WTF that was all about. A
> bit later I looked out at my left wheel and saw my wheel pant pointing
> straight down! ****.
> I flew back to my home base. The wind there couldn't have been more
> favorable. It was about 25 knots, about 25 degrees off the runway
> heading from the right. I was able to touch down and keep my left wing
> up almost to walking pace, when the left wheel came down and I did a
> gentle groundloop to the left. Very little damage to the pant, BTW. The
> bracket broke and a bit of fiberglass was ground away is all.
> Couple of interesting points about it were; the field I went to was
> unpaved and also uninhabited, so no emergency services if I had hurt
> myself. (No radio on this ship) However, my friend had seen the incident
> from the ground and called his wife to be at the field when I arrived. I
> did have the presence of mind to try and ensure that the impact , if I
> did flip it, wouldn't ruin my looks. I took off my glasses and took the
> pen out of my pocket. I thought about using the vacant seat cushion on
> the panel just in case, but couldn't figure a way to fasten it there. (
> no shoulder harness) Anyhow, I got away with it and no real harm done.
> The cause, of course, was one of those dams I had put inside the pant
> coming adrift and lodging itself between the wheel and the pant.
>
> Bertie
Good job on not dinging it. We used to take the pants off our training
planes for the winter each year to keep ice from causing similar issues.


--
Dudley Henriques

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Dudley Henriques > wrote in
:

> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>> Dudley Henriques > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>> john smith wrote:
>>>> Dudley Henriques wrote:
>>>>> The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much
>>>>> better suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed then
>>>>> an oleo
>> leg.
>>>>> In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive tire wear
>>>>> due
>> to
>>>>> scrubbing.
>>>> Ah! But what about the wheelpants? :-))
>>>
>>> My guess would be that if a pilot is catching a pant while
>>> attempting
>> a
>>> one wheel landing, that pilot is in wind WAY over their head :-))))
>>>
>>
>> Zachery. I had a nasty experience somewhat realted to this about ten
>> years ago in my Luscombe. I had bought a pair of wheel pants form
>> Wagaero. Fiberglass ones. The field I fly from is a bit muddy so I
>> fiberglassed a pair of "dams" in the back just behind the wheel to
>> prevent mud building up inside of the pants.
>> Anyhow. i dropped a friend at a paved strip to collect is airplane
>> and while taxiing in I noticed it was pulling to one side a bit. It
>> had mechanical brakes so I got out the tools and let the cable on
>> that side slack a bit and went to go home. It was very windy. About
>> 25 knots with a fair bit of crosswind from the right ( the left wheel
>> was pulling a bit still, but not what I considered significant) I
>> rolled and just as I rotated the airplane lurched left with a god
>> awful screech. Airborne and catching my wind, I climbed away and
>> wondered WTF that was all about. A bit later I looked out at my left
>> wheel and saw my wheel pant pointing straight down! ****.
>> I flew back to my home base. The wind there couldn't have been more
>> favorable. It was about 25 knots, about 25 degrees off the runway
>> heading from the right. I was able to touch down and keep my left
>> wing up almost to walking pace, when the left wheel came down and I
>> did a gentle groundloop to the left. Very little damage to the pant,
>> BTW. The bracket broke and a bit of fiberglass was ground away is
>> all. Couple of interesting points about it were; the field I went to
>> was unpaved and also uninhabited, so no emergency services if I had
>> hurt myself. (No radio on this ship) However, my friend had seen the
>> incident from the ground and called his wife to be at the field when
>> I arrived. I did have the presence of mind to try and ensure that the
>> impact , if I did flip it, wouldn't ruin my looks. I took off my
>> glasses and took the pen out of my pocket. I thought about using the
>> vacant seat cushion on the panel just in case, but couldn't figure a
>> way to fasten it there. ( no shoulder harness) Anyhow, I got away
>> with it and no real harm done. The cause, of course, was one of those
>> dams I had put inside the pant coming adrift and lodging itself
>> between the wheel and the pant.
>>
>> Bertie
> Good job on not dinging it. We used to take the pants off our training
> planes for the winter each year to keep ice from causing similar
> issues.
>
>

Yeanh, I should have done the same year round in this place, but it was
so much prettier with them on!


Bertie

[Dudley Henriques[_2_]]

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
> Dudley Henriques > wrote in
> :
>
>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>> Dudley Henriques > wrote in
>>> :
>>>
>>>> john smith wrote:
>>>>> Dudley Henriques wrote:
>>>>>> The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much
>>>>>> better suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed then
>>>>>> an oleo
>>> leg.
>>>>>> In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive tire wear
>>>>>> due
>>> to
>>>>>> scrubbing.
>>>>> Ah! But what about the wheelpants? :-))
>>>> My guess would be that if a pilot is catching a pant while
>>>> attempting
>>> a
>>>> one wheel landing, that pilot is in wind WAY over their head :-))))
>>>>
>>> Zachery. I had a nasty experience somewhat realted to this about ten
>>> years ago in my Luscombe. I had bought a pair of wheel pants form
>>> Wagaero. Fiberglass ones. The field I fly from is a bit muddy so I
>>> fiberglassed a pair of "dams" in the back just behind the wheel to
>>> prevent mud building up inside of the pants.
>>> Anyhow. i dropped a friend at a paved strip to collect is airplane
>>> and while taxiing in I noticed it was pulling to one side a bit. It
>>> had mechanical brakes so I got out the tools and let the cable on
>>> that side slack a bit and went to go home. It was very windy. About
>>> 25 knots with a fair bit of crosswind from the right ( the left wheel
>>> was pulling a bit still, but not what I considered significant) I
>>> rolled and just as I rotated the airplane lurched left with a god
>>> awful screech. Airborne and catching my wind, I climbed away and
>>> wondered WTF that was all about. A bit later I looked out at my left
>>> wheel and saw my wheel pant pointing straight down! ****.
>>> I flew back to my home base. The wind there couldn't have been more
>>> favorable. It was about 25 knots, about 25 degrees off the runway
>>> heading from the right. I was able to touch down and keep my left
>>> wing up almost to walking pace, when the left wheel came down and I
>>> did a gentle groundloop to the left. Very little damage to the pant,
>>> BTW. The bracket broke and a bit of fiberglass was ground away is
>>> all. Couple of interesting points about it were; the field I went to
>>> was unpaved and also uninhabited, so no emergency services if I had
>>> hurt myself. (No radio on this ship) However, my friend had seen the
>>> incident from the ground and called his wife to be at the field when
>>> I arrived. I did have the presence of mind to try and ensure that the
>>> impact , if I did flip it, wouldn't ruin my looks. I took off my
>>> glasses and took the pen out of my pocket. I thought about using the
>>> vacant seat cushion on the panel just in case, but couldn't figure a
>>> way to fasten it there. ( no shoulder harness) Anyhow, I got away
>>> with it and no real harm done. The cause, of course, was one of those
>>> dams I had put inside the pant coming adrift and lodging itself
>>> between the wheel and the pant.
>>>
>>> Bertie
>> Good job on not dinging it. We used to take the pants off our training
>> planes for the winter each year to keep ice from causing similar
>> issues.
>>
>>
>
> Yeanh, I should have done the same year round in this place, but it was
> so much prettier with them on!
>
>
> Bertie
Adds a few knots on a 150. Anything on the Luscombe?

--
Dudley Henriques

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Dudley Henriques > wrote in
:

> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>> Dudley Henriques > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>> Dudley Henriques > wrote in
>>>> :
>>>>
>>>>> john smith wrote:
>>>>>> Dudley Henriques wrote:
>>>>>>> The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much
>>>>>>> better suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed
then
>>>>>>> an oleo
>>>> leg.
>>>>>>> In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive tire wear
>>>>>>> due
>>>> to
>>>>>>> scrubbing.
>>>>>> Ah! But what about the wheelpants? :-))
>>>>> My guess would be that if a pilot is catching a pant while
>>>>> attempting
>>>> a
>>>>> one wheel landing, that pilot is in wind WAY over their head
:-))))
>>>>>
>>>> Zachery. I had a nasty experience somewhat realted to this about
ten
>>>> years ago in my Luscombe. I had bought a pair of wheel pants form
>>>> Wagaero. Fiberglass ones. The field I fly from is a bit muddy so I
>>>> fiberglassed a pair of "dams" in the back just behind the wheel to
>>>> prevent mud building up inside of the pants.
>>>> Anyhow. i dropped a friend at a paved strip to collect is airplane
>>>> and while taxiing in I noticed it was pulling to one side a bit. It
>>>> had mechanical brakes so I got out the tools and let the cable on
>>>> that side slack a bit and went to go home. It was very windy. About
>>>> 25 knots with a fair bit of crosswind from the right ( the left
wheel
>>>> was pulling a bit still, but not what I considered significant) I
>>>> rolled and just as I rotated the airplane lurched left with a god
>>>> awful screech. Airborne and catching my wind, I climbed away and
>>>> wondered WTF that was all about. A bit later I looked out at my
left
>>>> wheel and saw my wheel pant pointing straight down! ****.
>>>> I flew back to my home base. The wind there couldn't have been more
>>>> favorable. It was about 25 knots, about 25 degrees off the runway
>>>> heading from the right. I was able to touch down and keep my left
>>>> wing up almost to walking pace, when the left wheel came down and I
>>>> did a gentle groundloop to the left. Very little damage to the
pant,
>>>> BTW. The bracket broke and a bit of fiberglass was ground away is
>>>> all. Couple of interesting points about it were; the field I went
to
>>>> was unpaved and also uninhabited, so no emergency services if I had
>>>> hurt myself. (No radio on this ship) However, my friend had seen
the
>>>> incident from the ground and called his wife to be at the field
when
>>>> I arrived. I did have the presence of mind to try and ensure that
the
>>>> impact , if I did flip it, wouldn't ruin my looks. I took off my
>>>> glasses and took the pen out of my pocket. I thought about using
the
>>>> vacant seat cushion on the panel just in case, but couldn't figure
a
>>>> way to fasten it there. ( no shoulder harness) Anyhow, I got away
>>>> with it and no real harm done. The cause, of course, was one of
those
>>>> dams I had put inside the pant coming adrift and lodging itself
>>>> between the wheel and the pant.
>>>>
>>>> Bertie
>>> Good job on not dinging it. We used to take the pants off our
training
>>> planes for the winter each year to keep ice from causing similar
>>> issues.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Yeanh, I should have done the same year round in this place, but it
was
>> so much prettier with them on!
>>
>>
>> Bertie
> Adds a few knots on a 150. Anything on the Luscombe?
>
Not that you would notice. These were fiberglass replicas of the
original ali ones and were pretty fat.


Bertie

[Dudley Henriques[_2_]]

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
> Dudley Henriques > wrote in
> :
>
>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>> Dudley Henriques > wrote in
>>> :
>>>
>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>> Dudley Henriques > wrote in
>>>>> :
>>>>>
>>>>>> john smith wrote:
>>>>>>> Dudley Henriques wrote:
>>>>>>>> The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much
>>>>>>>> better suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed
> then
>>>>>>>> an oleo
>>>>> leg.
>>>>>>>> In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive tire wear
>>>>>>>> due
>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> scrubbing.
>>>>>>> Ah! But what about the wheelpants? :-))
>>>>>> My guess would be that if a pilot is catching a pant while
>>>>>> attempting
>>>>> a
>>>>>> one wheel landing, that pilot is in wind WAY over their head
> :-))))
>>>>> Zachery. I had a nasty experience somewhat realted to this about
> ten
>>>>> years ago in my Luscombe. I had bought a pair of wheel pants form
>>>>> Wagaero. Fiberglass ones. The field I fly from is a bit muddy so I
>>>>> fiberglassed a pair of "dams" in the back just behind the wheel to
>>>>> prevent mud building up inside of the pants.
>>>>> Anyhow. i dropped a friend at a paved strip to collect is airplane
>>>>> and while taxiing in I noticed it was pulling to one side a bit. It
>>>>> had mechanical brakes so I got out the tools and let the cable on
>>>>> that side slack a bit and went to go home. It was very windy. About
>>>>> 25 knots with a fair bit of crosswind from the right ( the left
> wheel
>>>>> was pulling a bit still, but not what I considered significant) I
>>>>> rolled and just as I rotated the airplane lurched left with a god
>>>>> awful screech. Airborne and catching my wind, I climbed away and
>>>>> wondered WTF that was all about. A bit later I looked out at my
> left
>>>>> wheel and saw my wheel pant pointing straight down! ****.
>>>>> I flew back to my home base. The wind there couldn't have been more
>>>>> favorable. It was about 25 knots, about 25 degrees off the runway
>>>>> heading from the right. I was able to touch down and keep my left
>>>>> wing up almost to walking pace, when the left wheel came down and I
>>>>> did a gentle groundloop to the left. Very little damage to the
> pant,
>>>>> BTW. The bracket broke and a bit of fiberglass was ground away is
>>>>> all. Couple of interesting points about it were; the field I went
> to
>>>>> was unpaved and also uninhabited, so no emergency services if I had
>>>>> hurt myself. (No radio on this ship) However, my friend had seen
> the
>>>>> incident from the ground and called his wife to be at the field
> when
>>>>> I arrived. I did have the presence of mind to try and ensure that
> the
>>>>> impact , if I did flip it, wouldn't ruin my looks. I took off my
>>>>> glasses and took the pen out of my pocket. I thought about using
> the
>>>>> vacant seat cushion on the panel just in case, but couldn't figure
> a
>>>>> way to fasten it there. ( no shoulder harness) Anyhow, I got away
>>>>> with it and no real harm done. The cause, of course, was one of
> those
>>>>> dams I had put inside the pant coming adrift and lodging itself
>>>>> between the wheel and the pant.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bertie
>>>> Good job on not dinging it. We used to take the pants off our
> training
>>>> planes for the winter each year to keep ice from causing similar
>>>> issues.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Yeanh, I should have done the same year round in this place, but it
> was
>>> so much prettier with them on!
>>>
>>>
>>> Bertie
>> Adds a few knots on a 150. Anything on the Luscombe?
>>
> Not that you would notice. These were fiberglass replicas of the
> original ali ones and were pretty fat.
>
>
> Bertie
Yeah. Come to think of it, they were those little fat guys weren't they.
They looked a lot like the ones on the Cessna 140 if I recall.

--
Dudley Henriques

[[email protected]]

On Mar 18, 10:11 am, Dudley Henriques > wrote:
> wrote:
> > On Mar 18, 8:04 am, Dudley Henriques > wrote:
> >> Ol Shy & Bashful wrote:> This is fun stiring the pot! OK ...how many of you practice doing a
> >>> one wheel touch and go from time to time. And I don't mean by
> >>> accident.
> >>> I did it all the time with tailwheel students, and still do it with
> >>> students in 172's. We frequently get winds that are 15 G25 90 to the
> >>> runway and topography that makes the winds squirrly as hell on the
> >>> west end. Learning good crosswind techniques are vital.
> >>> I recognize different techniques are needed for different aircraft
> >>> with wing clearance, etc but I still did them with lots of different
> >>> low wing aircraft like Piper Pawnee, Cessna Ag Husky, Ag Cat,
> >>> Stearman, Thrush and so on.
> >>> Ol S&B
> >> We had occasion one time to loan Miss America to Bob Hoover to use for
> >> his demonstration. His P51 had been damaged in a forced landing the day
> >> before. The only stipulation we placed on his use of the airplane was
> >> that he not do any one wheel landings. It was strongly felt by all of us
> >> that these "landings" if not directly, at least have a strong potential
> >> to place undue stress on the main gear leg and attach points where the
> >> wheel meets the axle.
> >> True, this was our personal choice, but I would still feel this way today.
> >> I've never actually asked Bob to clarify the issue by disclosing if he
> >> ever had maintanence done on the main gear oleos on his 51, so to be
> >> fair, it was then and is as I write this an open issue and simply a
> >> matter of opinion.
>
> >> --
> >> Dudley Henriques
>
> > Pretty hard to damage the gear on a Citabria doing that.
> > They're stout, to withstand the abuses of the novice. I've done the
> > one-wheel thing with students in the past, students who are having
> > trouble transitioning to the taildragger. The one-wheel touch-and-go
> > teaches them to fly the airplane ALL the time, not just until
> > touchdown like they tend to do in a trike. It also develops strong
> > crosswind skills. After that, they're careful in trikes, too, since
> > now they know that the airplane really isn't finished flying until
> > it's tied down. Every so often you hear of another 172 or something
> > that came to grief after the pilot made a successful touchdown, only
> > to lose it in the rollout.
>
> > Dan
>
> The argument for practicing one wheel landings as a teaching tool can
> indeed be made and the technique is not a new concept for instructors
> dealing with tail wheel instruction.
>
> The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much better
> suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed then an oleo leg.
> In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive tire wear due to
> scrubbing.
>
> It's a toss up really. If monitored closely by the instructor, it most
> certainly can be done without serious incident.
> I would say that I personally have not used this technique in teaching
> tail wheel students having found it unnecessary to do so.
>
> I should say that I have stood facing down a runway while doing safety
> work at air shows and watched this being done by pilots who were
> experiencing what I would easily classify as excessive and damaging side
> loads placed on their main gear as touchdowns were made cross controlled
> but WAY off the required correction for the existing wind conditions.
>
> I've used the technique myself doing comedy acts in Citabrias and
> Decathlons both. I was a fair stick (on ccasion anyway :-) and I've
> stressed a tire or two and felt that "spring released force" myself on
> occasion as a sudden wind shift screwed up my carefully planned out one
> wheel landing :-))
>
> --
> Dudley Henriques

Best way to do it: get into the flare for a wheel landing,
wings level, then just as the mains are ready to touch, lower one
wheel to the surface. Don't need a lot of bank, but as speed decays
more aileron and down-elevator will be required. Add power to keep
speed up. With one wheel off a little, the lift vector isn't much and
the tendency to scrub the rolling tire isn't all that great. Bank into
any crosswind, not away from it. Lifting an upwind wing is surely
asking for a busted airplane. Don't do any of this if you're not
already proficient at wheel landings.
I can't quite maintain it in the Jodel unless I'm near
liftoff speed. The gear is too far apart (F-11 type spring leaf) and
the wings, being so short, make the ailerons a little feeble doing
this.
Taildraggers are fun. They make a real pilot out of you. You
find out just how inept you really are. If you're gonna spend money on
flying, make sure you spend some on a taildragger checkout. Makes the
trike drivers envious in the worst way. And, don't forget, taildragger
pilots drink their coffee black.

Dan

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Dudley Henriques > wrote in
:


> Yeah. Come to think of it, they were those little fat guys weren't they.
> They looked a lot like the ones on the Cessna 140 if I recall.
>

Yes,. Very Art Deco.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

wrote in
:

> On Mar 18, 10:11 am, Dudley Henriques > wrote:
>> wrote:
>> > On Mar 18, 8:04 am, Dudley Henriques > wrote:
>> >> Ol Shy & Bashful wrote:> This is fun stiring the pot! OK ...how
>> >> many of you practice doing a
>> >>> one wheel touch and go from time to time. And I don't mean by
>> >>> accident.
>> >>> I did it all the time with tailwheel students, and still do it
>> >>> with students in 172's. We frequently get winds that are 15 G25
>> >>> 90 to the runway and topography that makes the winds squirrly as
>> >>> hell on the west end. Learning good crosswind techniques are
>> >>> vital. I recognize different techniques are needed for different
>> >>> aircraft with wing clearance, etc but I still did them with lots
>> >>> of different low wing aircraft like Piper Pawnee, Cessna Ag
>> >>> Husky, Ag Cat, Stearman, Thrush and so on.
>> >>> Ol S&B
>> >> We had occasion one time to loan Miss America to Bob Hoover to use
>> >> for his demonstration. His P51 had been damaged in a forced
>> >> landing the day before. The only stipulation we placed on his use
>> >> of the airplane was that he not do any one wheel landings. It was
>> >> strongly felt by all of us that these "landings" if not directly,
>> >> at least have a strong potential to place undue stress on the main
>> >> gear leg and attach points where the wheel meets the axle.
>> >> True, this was our personal choice, but I would still feel this
>> >> way today. I've never actually asked Bob to clarify the issue by
>> >> disclosing if he ever had maintanence done on the main gear oleos
>> >> on his 51, so to be fair, it was then and is as I write this an
>> >> open issue and simply a matter of opinion.
>>
>> >> --
>> >> Dudley Henriques
>>
>> > Pretty hard to damage the gear on a Citabria doing that.
>> > They're stout, to withstand the abuses of the novice. I've done the
>> > one-wheel thing with students in the past, students who are having
>> > trouble transitioning to the taildragger. The one-wheel
>> > touch-and-go teaches them to fly the airplane ALL the time, not
>> > just until touchdown like they tend to do in a trike. It also
>> > develops strong crosswind skills. After that, they're careful in
>> > trikes, too, since now they know that the airplane really isn't
>> > finished flying until it's tied down. Every so often you hear of
>> > another 172 or something that came to grief after the pilot made a
>> > successful touchdown, only to lose it in the rollout.
>>
>> > Dan
>>
>> The argument for practicing one wheel landings as a teaching tool can
>> indeed be made and the technique is not a new concept for instructors
>> dealing with tail wheel instruction.
>>
>> The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much better
>> suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed then an oleo
>> leg. In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive tire wear
>> due to scrubbing.
>>
>> It's a toss up really. If monitored closely by the instructor, it
>> most certainly can be done without serious incident.
>> I would say that I personally have not used this technique in
>> teaching tail wheel students having found it unnecessary to do so.
>>
>> I should say that I have stood facing down a runway while doing
>> safety work at air shows and watched this being done by pilots who
>> were experiencing what I would easily classify as excessive and
>> damaging side loads placed on their main gear as touchdowns were made
>> cross controlled but WAY off the required correction for the existing
>> wind conditions.
>>
>> I've used the technique myself doing comedy acts in Citabrias and
>> Decathlons both. I was a fair stick (on ccasion anyway :-) and I've
>> stressed a tire or two and felt that "spring released force" myself
>> on occasion as a sudden wind shift screwed up my carefully planned
>> out one wheel landing :-))
>>
>> --
>> Dudley Henriques
>
> Best way to do it: get into the flare for a wheel landing,
> wings level, then just as the mains are ready to touch, lower one
> wheel to the surface. Don't need a lot of bank, but as speed decays
> more aileron and down-elevator will be required. Add power to keep
> speed up. With one wheel off a little, the lift vector isn't much and
> the tendency to scrub the rolling tire isn't all that great. Bank into
> any crosswind, not away from it. Lifting an upwind wing is surely
> asking for a busted airplane. Don't do any of this if you're not
> already proficient at wheel landings.
> I can't quite maintain it in the Jodel unless I'm near
> liftoff speed. The gear is too far apart (F-11 type spring leaf) and
> the wings, being so short, make the ailerons a little feeble doing
> this.
> Taildraggers are fun. They make a real pilot out of you. You
> find out just how inept you really are. If you're gonna spend money on
> flying, make sure you spend some on a taildragger checkout. Makes the
> trike drivers envious in the worst way. And, don't forget, taildragger
> pilots drink their coffee black.

I drink tea.


Bertie

[Dudley Henriques[_2_]]

wrote:
> On Mar 18, 10:11 am, Dudley Henriques > wrote:
>> wrote:
>>> On Mar 18, 8:04 am, Dudley Henriques > wrote:
>>>> Ol Shy & Bashful wrote:> This is fun stiring the pot! OK ...how many of you practice doing a
>>>>> one wheel touch and go from time to time. And I don't mean by
>>>>> accident.
>>>>> I did it all the time with tailwheel students, and still do it with
>>>>> students in 172's. We frequently get winds that are 15 G25 90 to the
>>>>> runway and topography that makes the winds squirrly as hell on the
>>>>> west end. Learning good crosswind techniques are vital.
>>>>> I recognize different techniques are needed for different aircraft
>>>>> with wing clearance, etc but I still did them with lots of different
>>>>> low wing aircraft like Piper Pawnee, Cessna Ag Husky, Ag Cat,
>>>>> Stearman, Thrush and so on.
>>>>> Ol S&B
>>>> We had occasion one time to loan Miss America to Bob Hoover to use for
>>>> his demonstration. His P51 had been damaged in a forced landing the day
>>>> before. The only stipulation we placed on his use of the airplane was
>>>> that he not do any one wheel landings. It was strongly felt by all of us
>>>> that these "landings" if not directly, at least have a strong potential
>>>> to place undue stress on the main gear leg and attach points where the
>>>> wheel meets the axle.
>>>> True, this was our personal choice, but I would still feel this way today.
>>>> I've never actually asked Bob to clarify the issue by disclosing if he
>>>> ever had maintanence done on the main gear oleos on his 51, so to be
>>>> fair, it was then and is as I write this an open issue and simply a
>>>> matter of opinion.
>>>> --
>>>> Dudley Henriques
>>> Pretty hard to damage the gear on a Citabria doing that.
>>> They're stout, to withstand the abuses of the novice. I've done the
>>> one-wheel thing with students in the past, students who are having
>>> trouble transitioning to the taildragger. The one-wheel touch-and-go
>>> teaches them to fly the airplane ALL the time, not just until
>>> touchdown like they tend to do in a trike. It also develops strong
>>> crosswind skills. After that, they're careful in trikes, too, since
>>> now they know that the airplane really isn't finished flying until
>>> it's tied down. Every so often you hear of another 172 or something
>>> that came to grief after the pilot made a successful touchdown, only
>>> to lose it in the rollout.
>>> Dan
>> The argument for practicing one wheel landings as a teaching tool can
>> indeed be made and the technique is not a new concept for instructors
>> dealing with tail wheel instruction.
>>
>> The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much better
>> suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed then an oleo leg.
>> In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive tire wear due to
>> scrubbing.
>>
>> It's a toss up really. If monitored closely by the instructor, it most
>> certainly can be done without serious incident.
>> I would say that I personally have not used this technique in teaching
>> tail wheel students having found it unnecessary to do so.
>>
>> I should say that I have stood facing down a runway while doing safety
>> work at air shows and watched this being done by pilots who were
>> experiencing what I would easily classify as excessive and damaging side
>> loads placed on their main gear as touchdowns were made cross controlled
>> but WAY off the required correction for the existing wind conditions.
>>
>> I've used the technique myself doing comedy acts in Citabrias and
>> Decathlons both. I was a fair stick (on ccasion anyway :-) and I've
>> stressed a tire or two and felt that "spring released force" myself on
>> occasion as a sudden wind shift screwed up my carefully planned out one
>> wheel landing :-))
>>
>> --
>> Dudley Henriques
>
> Best way to do it: get into the flare for a wheel landing,
> wings level, then just as the mains are ready to touch, lower one
> wheel to the surface. Don't need a lot of bank, but as speed decays
> more aileron and down-elevator will be required. Add power to keep
> speed up. With one wheel off a little, the lift vector isn't much and
> the tendency to scrub the rolling tire isn't all that great. Bank into
> any crosswind, not away from it. Lifting an upwind wing is surely
> asking for a busted airplane. Don't do any of this if you're not
> already proficient at wheel landings.
> I can't quite maintain it in the Jodel unless I'm near
> liftoff speed. The gear is too far apart (F-11 type spring leaf) and
> the wings, being so short, make the ailerons a little feeble doing
> this.
> Taildraggers are fun. They make a real pilot out of you. You
> find out just how inept you really are. If you're gonna spend money on
> flying, make sure you spend some on a taildragger checkout. Makes the
> trike drivers envious in the worst way. And, don't forget, taildragger
> pilots drink their coffee black.
>
> Dan

I'll be sure to keep all this in mind. :-)))

--
Dudley Henriques

[BT]

most of my aircraft only have one main wheel.. so I always land on it..
B

> wrote in message
...
> Ol Shy & Bashful > wrote:
>> This is fun stiring the pot! OK ...how many of you practice doing a
>> one wheel touch and go from time to time. And I don't mean by
>> accident.
>> I did it all the time with tailwheel students, and still do it with
>> students in 172's. We frequently get winds that are 15 G25 90 to the
>> runway and topography that makes the winds squirrly as hell on the
>> west end. Learning good crosswind techniques are vital.
>> I recognize different techniques are needed for different aircraft
>> with wing clearance, etc but I still did them with lots of different
>> low wing aircraft like Piper Pawnee, Cessna Ag Husky, Ag Cat,
>> Stearman, Thrush and so on.
>> Ol S&B
>
> Well, I always use the slip approach method so if whatever it takes
> to stay on the center line results in a one wheel landing, that's
> what happens.
>
> I never considered it to be anything special.
>
> --
> Jim Pennino
>
> Remove .spam.sux to reply.

[Roger[_4_]]

On Tue, 18 Mar 2008 03:26:14 -0700 (PDT), "Ol Shy & Bashful"
> wrote:

>This is fun stiring the pot! OK ...how many of you practice doing a
>one wheel touch and go from time to time. And I don't mean by
>accident.

Hmmm I make every cross wind landing a one wheel landing... OK, most
of them are one wheel landings... Oh, OK, I TRY to make them all one
wheel landings. Sheesh. Being honest is sometimes more than a little
trying<:-))

As to doing T&Gs the Deb becomes a real handful and needs to be
reconfigured *before* brging in the power which can use a lot of
runway. Otherwise you can quickly find you are still doing a one wheel
landing, but you are now riding on the nose gear/wheel. So, I
practice enough of them to be safe, but otherwise avoid them. On top
of that our airport has a policy against T&Gs not that bevery one
abides by it though.

>I did it all the time with tailwheel students, and still do it with
>students in 172's. We frequently get winds that are 15 G25 90 to the
>runway and topography that makes the winds squirrly as hell on the
>west end. Learning good crosswind techniques are vital.
>I recognize different techniques are needed for different aircraft
>with wing clearance, etc but I still did them with lots of different
>low wing aircraft like Piper Pawnee, Cessna Ag Husky, Ag Cat,
>Stearman, Thrush and so on.
>Ol S&B
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

[Roger[_4_]]

On Tue, 18 Mar 2008 15:53:07 -0400, Dudley Henriques
> wrote:

>john smith wrote:
>> Dudley Henriques wrote:
>>> The spring type one piece main gear legs are as you say much better
>>> suited to taking any side loads that might be imposed then an oleo leg.
>>> In this scenario, the principal negative is excessive tire wear due to
>>> scrubbing.
>>
>> Ah! But what about the wheelpants? :-))
>
>
>My guess would be that if a pilot is catching a pant while attempting a
>one wheel landing, that pilot is in wind WAY over their head :-))))

I'm having a hard time envisioning a tire rolled far enough sideways
to catch the wheel pant unless it's already flat.. On a Cherokee
you'd need to shorten the wing about 3 feet or more to catch a pant.
<:-)) And at that point scrubbing a wheel pant would be the least of
the worries.
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com