Jet turbine starting equipment ?

[Externet]

Hi. Could not find a proper group to ask, sorry :
The old Boeing 707 and perhaps others had a tiny 3000+ psi air
compressor on board driven by a hydraulic motor to start engines with
NO ground equipment assist.
Which current aircraft have a similar compressed air starting system
on board ?
Thanks.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Externet > wrote in news:a78f196e-92e0-46d3-9c4d-
:

> Hi. Could not find a proper group to ask, sorry :
> The old Boeing 707 and perhaps others had a tiny 3000+ psi air
> compressor on board driven by a hydraulic motor to start engines with
> NO ground equipment assist.
> Which current aircraft have a similar compressed air starting system
> on board ?
> Thanks.

No civil AC I know of, except some russian light planes.

Bertie

[Mxsmanic]

Externet writes:

> The old Boeing 707 and perhaps others had a tiny 3000+ psi air
> compressor on board driven by a hydraulic motor to start engines with
> NO ground equipment assist.

What drove the hydraulic motor?

[F. Baum]

On May 9, 4:44*pm, Mxsmanic > wrote:
> > NO ground equipment assist.
>
> What drove the hydraulic motor?

The Transfunctioner <G>. Transport jets use both engine driven and
electric hydraulic pumps. I have never started a jet with compressed
air. Have you BTB ?
Frank

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

"F. Baum" > wrote in news:c41f80e7-c680-47f1-8611-
:

> On May 9, 4:44*pm, Mxsmanic > wrote:
>> > NO ground equipment assist.
>>
>> What drove the hydraulic motor?
>
> The Transfunctioner <G>. Transport jets use both engine driven and
> electric hydraulic pumps. I have never started a jet with compressed
> air. Have you BTB ?
> Frank
>

No. I knew a guy who ferried a lot of them and he's done it. IIRC he says
it's all pretty quick! My company uses an umbilical every now and again.


Bertie

[Morgans[_2_]]

"Robert Moore" > wrote

> I have done numerous "high pressure" starts in the old B-707. The air
> compressor filled a "high pressure tank" and the tank then was sufficient
> to start just one engine. After that, that engine's bleed air was used to
> start the remaining engines.

Did the 707 not have an onboard APU?
--
Jim in NC

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

"Morgans" > wrote in
:

>
> "Robert Moore" > wrote
>
>> I have done numerous "high pressure" starts in the old B-707. The air
>> compressor filled a "high pressure tank" and the tank then was
>> sufficient to start just one engine. After that, that engine's bleed
>> air was used to start the remaining engines.
>
> Did the 707 not have an onboard APU?

Some did. Most not.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Robert Moore > wrote in
46.128:

> "Morgans" wrote
>> Did the 707 not have an onboard APU?
>
> None in regular airline service. I have seen a couple of
> 707s converted to corporate service where the forward cargo
> hold was converted to hold a retractable APU that was pulled
> outside the cargo door for engine starts and then shut-down
> and stowed away.
>

I've een told, but haven't seen, that some have the 727 type installation.


Bertie

[F. Baum]

On May 9, 7:59*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> > None in regular airline service. I have seen a couple of
> > 707s converted to corporate service where the forward cargo
> > hold was converted to hold a retractable APU that was pulled
> > outside the cargo door for engine starts and then shut-down
> > and stowed away.
>
> I've een told, but haven't seen, that some have the 727 type installation.
>
> Bertie

I understand the 727 was originaly designed without an APU and they
squeezed one into the wheel well. This was the main reason it couldnt
be used inflight. This was from a systems instructor who had alot of
folklore on the 727 (Including the picture of 30 or so people hanging
on the airstair inflight during the fall of Siagon).
FB

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

"F. Baum" > wrote in
:

> On May 9, 7:59*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>> > None in regular airline service. I have seen a couple of
>> > 707s converted to corporate service where the forward cargo
>> > hold was converted to hold a retractable APU that was pulled
>> > outside the cargo door for engine starts and then shut-down
>> > and stowed away.
>>
>> I've een told, but haven't seen, that some have the 727 type
>> installation.
>
>>
>> Bertie
>
> I understand the 727 was originaly designed without an APU and they
> squeezed one into the wheel well. This was the main reason it couldnt
> be used inflight. This was from a systems instructor who had alot of
> folklore on the 727 (Including the picture of 30 or so people hanging
> on the airstair inflight during the fall of Siagon).


Could be. I only flew th e200 and they all had them. Of course, you
didn't really need one in flight anyway. There were plenty of electrics
available from the three engines anyway.

Bertie
>
>

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
.. .
> Externet > wrote in news:a78f196e-92e0-46d3-9c4d-
> :
>
>> Hi. Could not find a proper group to ask, sorry :
>> The old Boeing 707 and perhaps others had a tiny 3000+ psi air
>> compressor on board driven by a hydraulic motor to start engines with
>> NO ground equipment assist.
>> Which current aircraft have a similar compressed air starting system
>> on board ?
>> Thanks.
>
> No civil AC I know of, except some russian light planes.
>
> Bertie

Yeah, Mx probably doesn't know either.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
.. .
> "Morgans" > wrote in
> :
>
>>
>> "Robert Moore" > wrote
>>
>>> I have done numerous "high pressure" starts in the old B-707. The air
>>> compressor filled a "high pressure tank" and the tank then was
>>> sufficient to start just one engine. After that, that engine's bleed
>>> air was used to start the remaining engines.
>>
>> Did the 707 not have an onboard APU?
>
> Some did. Most not.
>
>
> Bertie

Got a link?

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"F. Baum" > wrote in message
...
On May 9, 7:59 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> > None in regular airline service. I have seen a couple of
> > 707s converted to corporate service where the forward cargo
> > hold was converted to hold a retractable APU that was pulled
> > outside the cargo door for engine starts and then shut-down
> > and stowed away.
>
> I've een told, but haven't seen, that some have the 727 type installation.
>
> Bertie

I understand the 727 was originaly designed without an APU and they
squeezed one into the wheel well. This was the main reason it couldnt
be used inflight. This was from a systems instructor who had alot of
folklore on the 727 (Including the picture of 30 or so people hanging
on the airstair inflight during the fall of Siagon).
FB

You are feeding a very destructive (wanna be) troll.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
.. .
> "F. Baum" > wrote in
> :
>
>> On May 9, 7:59 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>>> > None in regular airline service. I have seen a couple of
>>> > 707s converted to corporate service where the forward cargo
>>> > hold was converted to hold a retractable APU that was pulled
>>> > outside the cargo door for engine starts and then shut-down
>>> > and stowed away.
>>>
>>> I've een told, but haven't seen, that some have the 727 type
>>> installation.
>>
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>
>> I understand the 727 was originaly designed without an APU and they
>> squeezed one into the wheel well. This was the main reason it couldnt
>> be used inflight. This was from a systems instructor who had alot of
>> folklore on the 727 (Including the picture of 30 or so people hanging
>> on the airstair inflight during the fall of Siagon).
>
>
> Could be. I only flew th e200 and they all had them. Of course, you
> didn't really need one in flight anyway. There were plenty of electrics
> available from the three engines anyway.
>
> Bertie
>>
>>
>

Mory bull****.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_25_]]

"Maxwell" <luv2^fly99@cox.^net> wrote in news:POhVj.81$CE1.20
@newsfe23.lga:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> .. .
>> Externet > wrote in news:a78f196e-92e0-46d3-
9c4d-
>> :
>>
>>> Hi. Could not find a proper group to ask, sorry :
>>> The old Boeing 707 and perhaps others had a tiny 3000+ psi air
>>> compressor on board driven by a hydraulic motor to start engines
with
>>> NO ground equipment assist.
>>> Which current aircraft have a similar compressed air starting system
>>> on board ?
>>> Thanks.
>>
>> No civil AC I know of, except some russian light planes.
>>
>> Bertie
>
> Yeah, Mx probably doesn't know either.
>

Awwww, you having a bad day?

I'm not! that's something anyway, isn't it?


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_25_]]

"Maxwell" <luv2^fly99@cox.^net> wrote in news:hQhVj.82$CE1.20
@newsfe23.lga:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> .. .
>> "Morgans" > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>>
>>> "Robert Moore" > wrote
>>>
>>>> I have done numerous "high pressure" starts in the old B-707. The
air
>>>> compressor filled a "high pressure tank" and the tank then was
>>>> sufficient to start just one engine. After that, that engine's
bleed
>>>> air was used to start the remaining engines.
>>>
>>> Did the 707 not have an onboard APU?
>>
>> Some did. Most not.
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>
> Got a link?
>
>
>

nOPE.
Do you?


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_25_]]

"Maxwell" <luv2^fly99@cox.^net> wrote in
:

>
> "F. Baum" > wrote in message
> news:824b5025-7172-452a-939f-fa86f16d33f7@
27g2000hsf.googlegroups.com..
> . On May 9, 7:59 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>> > None in regular airline service. I have seen a couple of
>> > 707s converted to corporate service where the forward cargo
>> > hold was converted to hold a retractable APU that was pulled
>> > outside the cargo door for engine starts and then shut-down
>> > and stowed away.
>>
>> I've een told, but haven't seen, that some have the 727 type
>> installation.
>>
>> Bertie
>
> I understand the 727 was originaly designed without an APU and they
> squeezed one into the wheel well. This was the main reason it couldnt
> be used inflight. This was from a systems instructor who had alot of
> folklore on the 727 (Including the picture of 30 or so people hanging
> on the airstair inflight during the fall of Siagon).
> FB
>
> You are feeding a very destructive (wanna be) troll.
>

He isn't, actually.


But you are.


Not that that will stop you. You're a k00k and k00ks never listen.

Bertie
>
>

[Bertie the Bunyip[_25_]]

"Maxwell" <luv2^fly99@cox.^net> wrote in news:CRhVj.84$CE1.32
@newsfe23.lga:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> .. .
>> "F. Baum" > wrote in
>> news:824b5025-7172-452a-939f-fa86f16d33f7@
27g2000hsf.googlegroups.com:
>>
>>> On May 9, 7:59 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>>>> > None in regular airline service. I have seen a couple of
>>>> > 707s converted to corporate service where the forward cargo
>>>> > hold was converted to hold a retractable APU that was pulled
>>>> > outside the cargo door for engine starts and then shut-down
>>>> > and stowed away.
>>>>
>>>> I've een told, but haven't seen, that some have the 727 type
>>>> installation.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Bertie
>>>
>>> I understand the 727 was originaly designed without an APU and they
>>> squeezed one into the wheel well. This was the main reason it
couldnt
>>> be used inflight. This was from a systems instructor who had alot of
>>> folklore on the 727 (Including the picture of 30 or so people
hanging
>>> on the airstair inflight during the fall of Siagon).
>>
>>
>> Could be. I only flew th e200 and they all had them. Of course, you
>> didn't really need one in flight anyway. There were plenty of
electrics
>> available from the three engines anyway.
>>
>> Bertie
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> Mory bull****.
>
>
>

Nope.


Bertie

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> "Maxwell" <luv2^fly99@cox.^net> wrote in news:POhVj.81$CE1.20
> @newsfe23.lga:
>
>>
>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>> .. .
>>> Externet > wrote in news:a78f196e-92e0-46d3-
> 9c4d-
>>> :
>>>
>>>> Hi. Could not find a proper group to ask, sorry :
>>>> The old Boeing 707 and perhaps others had a tiny 3000+ psi air
>>>> compressor on board driven by a hydraulic motor to start engines
> with
>>>> NO ground equipment assist.
>>>> Which current aircraft have a similar compressed air starting system
>>>> on board ?
>>>> Thanks.
>>>
>>> No civil AC I know of, except some russian light planes.
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>
>> Yeah, Mx probably doesn't know either.
>>
>
> Awwww, you having a bad day?
>
> I'm not! that's something anyway, isn't it?
>
>
> Bertie

Take your meds. You are making even less sense than usual.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> "Maxwell" <luv2^fly99@cox.^net> wrote in
> :
>
>>
>> "F. Baum" > wrote in message
>> news:824b5025-7172-452a-939f-fa86f16d33f7@
> 27g2000hsf.googlegroups.com..
>> . On May 9, 7:59 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>>> > None in regular airline service. I have seen a couple of
>>> > 707s converted to corporate service where the forward cargo
>>> > hold was converted to hold a retractable APU that was pulled
>>> > outside the cargo door for engine starts and then shut-down
>>> > and stowed away.
>>>
>>> I've een told, but haven't seen, that some have the 727 type
>>> installation.
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>
>> I understand the 727 was originaly designed without an APU and they
>> squeezed one into the wheel well. This was the main reason it couldnt
>> be used inflight. This was from a systems instructor who had alot of
>> folklore on the 727 (Including the picture of 30 or so people hanging
>> on the airstair inflight during the fall of Siagon).
>> FB
>>
>> You are feeding a very destructive (wanna be) troll.
>>
>
> He isn't, actually.
>
>
> But you are.
>
>
> Not that that will stop you. You're a k00k and k00ks never listen.
>
> Bertie
>>
>>
>

You're a liar.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_25_]]

"Maxwell" <luv2^fly99@cox.^net> wrote in news:AzjVj.72948$y05.72600
@newsfe22.lga:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Maxwell" <luv2^fly99@cox.^net> wrote in news:POhVj.81$CE1.20
>> @newsfe23.lga:
>>
>>>
>>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>> .. .
>>>> Externet > wrote in news:a78f196e-92e0-46d3-
>> 9c4d-
>>>> :
>>>>
>>>>> Hi. Could not find a proper group to ask, sorry :
>>>>> The old Boeing 707 and perhaps others had a tiny 3000+ psi air
>>>>> compressor on board driven by a hydraulic motor to start engines
>> with
>>>>> NO ground equipment assist.
>>>>> Which current aircraft have a similar compressed air starting
system
>>>>> on board ?
>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>
>>>> No civil AC I know of, except some russian light planes.
>>>>
>>>> Bertie
>>>
>>> Yeah, Mx probably doesn't know either.
>>>
>>
>> Awwww, you having a bad day?
>>
>> I'm not! that's something anyway, isn't it?
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>
> Take your meds. You are making even less sense than usual.
>

Aww, a meds slur.

That makes perfect sense.
Anyone else understand it?

See?
You're just stupid.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_25_]]

"Maxwell" <luv2^fly99@cox.^net> wrote in news:AAjVj.72949$y05.919
@newsfe22.lga:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Maxwell" <luv2^fly99@cox.^net> wrote in
>> :
>>
>>>
>>> "F. Baum" > wrote in message
>>> news:824b5025-7172-452a-939f-fa86f16d33f7@
>> 27g2000hsf.googlegroups.com..
>>> . On May 9, 7:59 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>>>> > None in regular airline service. I have seen a couple of
>>>> > 707s converted to corporate service where the forward cargo
>>>> > hold was converted to hold a retractable APU that was pulled
>>>> > outside the cargo door for engine starts and then shut-down
>>>> > and stowed away.
>>>>
>>>> I've een told, but haven't seen, that some have the 727 type
>>>> installation.
>>>>
>>>> Bertie
>>>
>>> I understand the 727 was originaly designed without an APU and they
>>> squeezed one into the wheel well. This was the main reason it
couldnt
>>> be used inflight. This was from a systems instructor who had alot of
>>> folklore on the 727 (Including the picture of 30 or so people
hanging
>>> on the airstair inflight during the fall of Siagon).
>>> FB
>>>
>>> You are feeding a very destructive (wanna be) troll.
>>>
>>
>> He isn't, actually.
>>
>>
>> But you are.
>>
>>
>> Not that that will stop you. You're a k00k and k00ks never listen.
>>
>> Bertie
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> You're a liar.
>
>
>

Well, even if I were that's immaterial. Th eproof is in the pudding,
k00kie boi.

You didn't listen.


Bertie

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...

Did you remember to tell them you could suck start one?


You couldn't stop if your life depended on it, could you Squirty ****drip?


Squirt, squirt.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_25_]]

"Maxwell" <luv2^fly99@cox.^net> wrote in
:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>
> Did you remember to tell them you could suck start one?
>


ahh, gay lames!

Excellent.



Bertie

[Externet]

Thanks, gentlemen.
What would be the exact technical name for that on-board air
compressor unit ?
-To say it right when I call a boneyard looking for one, perhaps they
know what other current aircraft are equipped with a similar system-

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Externet > wrote in news:28871dca-f985-4b97-9c70-
:

> Thanks, gentlemen.
> What would be the exact technical name for that on-board air
> compressor unit ?

Air compressor, probably.

> -To say it right when I call a boneyard looking for one, perhaps they
> know what other current aircraft are equipped with a similar system-
>

Nothing new uses anything like that. Even the barbie jets have APUs


Bertie