antenna dilemma

[Brad[_2_]]

My buddies tell me my handheld is too painfull to listen to anymore. I
would put in a panel mount, but since I have a mostly carbon aircraft,
where should I put the antenna? Too late to install it in the rudder,
or is there a solution that would allow me to install one in the
rudder??

I think the main issue with the handheld, is line-of-sight from the
antenna to who I am talking to, it works fine when the aircraft is
pointing towards them, or they are on the side of the glider the radio
is on, but as I turn (while thermalling) I am told the transmissions
cut out.

Any thoughts on this?

Thanks,
Brad

[bikensoar]

On May 25, 5:57*pm, Brad > wrote:
> My buddies tell me my handheld is too painfull to listen to anymore. I
> would put in a panel mount, but since I have a mostly carbon aircraft,
> where should I put the antenna? Too late to install it in the rudder,
> or is there a solution that would allow me to install one in the
> rudder??
>
> I think the main issue with the handheld, is line-of-sight from the
> antenna to who I am talking to, it works fine when the aircraft is
> pointing towards them, or they are on the side of the glider the radio
> is on, but as I turn (while thermalling) I am told the transmissions
> cut out.
>
> Any thoughts on this?
>
> Thanks,
> Brad

Brad,

The all carbon Sparrowhawks have a little external antenna on the
bottom of the fuselage, just behind the main gear.
It can be twisted off and removed similar to a handheld antenna. It
works very well.

George

[Eric Greenwell]

Brad wrote:
> My buddies tell me my handheld is too painfull to listen to anymore. I
> would put in a panel mount, but since I have a mostly carbon aircraft,
> where should I put the antenna? Too late to install it in the rudder,
> or is there a solution that would allow me to install one in the
> rudder??

If your fin and rudder are not carbon, you might be able to put an
antenna on the back of the fin, just ahead of the rudder. A "coaxial
dipole" style could be used if there is enough room, as the cable comes
in the bottom. A standard diople using wire or tape elements would work
if room is limited, and these are available commercially.

Where does the manufacturer put the antenna in the ones they produce?

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
* Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

* Updated! "Transponders in Sailplanes" http://tinyurl.com/y739x4
* New Jan '08 - sections on Mode S, TPAS, ADS-B, Flarm, more

* "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" at www.motorglider.org

[Brad[_2_]]

On May 26, 7:35*am, Eric Greenwell > wrote:
> Brad wrote:
> > My buddies tell me my handheld is too painfull to listen to anymore. I
> > would put in a panel mount, but since I have a mostly carbon aircraft,
> > where should I put the antenna? Too late to install it in the rudder,
> > or is there a solution that would allow me to install one in the
> > rudder??
>
> If your fin and rudder are not carbon, you might be able to put an
> antenna on the back of the fin, just ahead of the rudder. A "coaxial
> dipole" style could be used if there is enough room, as the cable comes
> in the bottom. A standard diople using wire or tape elements would work
> if room is limited, and these are available commercially.
>
> Where does the manufacturer put the antenna in the ones they produce?
>
> --
> Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
> * Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly
>
> * Updated! "Transponders in Sailplanes"http://tinyurl.com/y739x4
> * * * New Jan '08 - sections on Mode S, TPAS, ADS-B, Flarm, more
>
> * "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" atwww.motorglider.org

[Brad[_2_]]

Hi Eric,

My vertical fin is carbon too, and any wire placed aft of the fin spar
would still be surrounded by carbon.

I'll probably do as a few have suggested to mount the rubber ducky
antenna a-la the sparrowhawk.

Many thanks to everyones help!

Cheers,
Brad

PS........I see there is a new feature we have to deal with when
posting now, at least via google-groups

On May 26, 7:35*am, Eric Greenwell > wrote:
> Brad wrote:
> > My buddies tell me my handheld is too painfull to listen to anymore. I
> > would put in a panel mount, but since I have a mostly carbon aircraft,
> > where should I put the antenna? Too late to install it in the rudder,
> > or is there a solution that would allow me to install one in the
> > rudder??
>
> If your fin and rudder are not carbon, you might be able to put an
> antenna on the back of the fin, just ahead of the rudder. A "coaxial
> dipole" style could be used if there is enough room, as the cable comes
> in the bottom. A standard diople using wire or tape elements would work
> if room is limited, and these are available commercially.
>
> Where does the manufacturer put the antenna in the ones they produce?
>
> --
> Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
> * Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly
>
> * Updated! "Transponders in Sailplanes"http://tinyurl.com/y739x4
> * * * New Jan '08 - sections on Mode S, TPAS, ADS-B, Flarm, more
>
> * "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" atwww.motorglider.org

[Ralph Jones[_2_]]

On Sun, 25 May 2008 17:57:22 -0700 (PDT), Brad >
wrote:

>My buddies tell me my handheld is too painfull to listen to anymore. I
>would put in a panel mount, but since I have a mostly carbon aircraft,
>where should I put the antenna? Too late to install it in the rudder,
>or is there a solution that would allow me to install one in the
>rudder??
>
>I think the main issue with the handheld, is line-of-sight from the
>antenna to who I am talking to, it works fine when the aircraft is
>pointing towards them, or they are on the side of the glider the radio
>is on, but as I turn (while thermalling) I am told the transmissions
>cut out.
>
I've seen a few ships that had a small whip antenna mounted on the
gear door. With the gear down, of course, the antenna was horizontal,
and if mounted close to the hinge line, it was high enough not to get
ground damage on most fields.

But that won't work if you trailer your ship with the gear up...

rj

[Bill Daniels]

"Ralph Jones" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 25 May 2008 17:57:22 -0700 (PDT), Brad >
> wrote:
>
>>My buddies tell me my handheld is too painfull to listen to anymore. I
>>would put in a panel mount, but since I have a mostly carbon aircraft,
>>where should I put the antenna? Too late to install it in the rudder,
>>or is there a solution that would allow me to install one in the
>>rudder??
>>
>>I think the main issue with the handheld, is line-of-sight from the
>>antenna to who I am talking to, it works fine when the aircraft is
>>pointing towards them, or they are on the side of the glider the radio
>>is on, but as I turn (while thermalling) I am told the transmissions
>>cut out.
>>
> I've seen a few ships that had a small whip antenna mounted on the
> gear door. With the gear down, of course, the antenna was horizontal,
> and if mounted close to the hinge line, it was high enough not to get
> ground damage on most fields.
>
> But that won't work if you trailer your ship with the gear up...
>
> rj

Hmm, well, if you mounted a BNC thru-bulkhead connector on the gear door,
and the antenna had a mating BNC connector, it could br removed for
trailering. That said, antenna wires have a LOT of drag so maybe a rubber
duckie....

Bill D

[Ralph Jones[_2_]]

On Mon, 26 May 2008 13:23:04 -0600, "Bill Daniels"
<bildan@comcast-dot-net> wrote:

>
>"Ralph Jones" > wrote in message
...
>> On Sun, 25 May 2008 17:57:22 -0700 (PDT), Brad >
>> wrote:
>>
>>>My buddies tell me my handheld is too painfull to listen to anymore. I
>>>would put in a panel mount, but since I have a mostly carbon aircraft,
>>>where should I put the antenna? Too late to install it in the rudder,
>>>or is there a solution that would allow me to install one in the
>>>rudder??
>>>
>>>I think the main issue with the handheld, is line-of-sight from the
>>>antenna to who I am talking to, it works fine when the aircraft is
>>>pointing towards them, or they are on the side of the glider the radio
>>>is on, but as I turn (while thermalling) I am told the transmissions
>>>cut out.
>>>
>> I've seen a few ships that had a small whip antenna mounted on the
>> gear door. With the gear down, of course, the antenna was horizontal,
>> and if mounted close to the hinge line, it was high enough not to get
>> ground damage on most fields.
>>
>> But that won't work if you trailer your ship with the gear up...
>>
>> rj
>
>Hmm, well, if you mounted a BNC thru-bulkhead connector on the gear door,
>and the antenna had a mating BNC connector, it could br removed for
>trailering. That said, antenna wires have a LOT of drag so maybe a rubber
>duckie....
>
Actually, the one I remember best was on the 1-36 that Big John
Brittingham owned briefly, and he used it as a gear warning once...he
was well into his landing flare when he heard the antenna scraping on
the pavement, pulled up, slammed the gear, and touched down.

Don't think I would have asked for a broken wrist to save some sheet
metal work...;-)

rj

[Ged McKnight[_2_]]

SHOUT LOUDER

;-))


At 19:23 26 May 2008, Bill Daniels wrote:
>
>"Ralph Jones" wrote in message
...
>> On Sun, 25 May 2008 17:57:22 -0700 (PDT), Brad
>> wrote:
>>
>>>My buddies tell me my handheld is too painfull to listen to anymore. I
>>>would put in a panel mount, but since I have a mostly carbon aircraft,
>>>where should I put the antenna? Too late to install it in the rudder,
>>>or is there a solution that would allow me to install one in the
>>>rudder??
>>>
>>>I think the main issue with the handheld, is line-of-sight from the
>>>antenna to who I am talking to, it works fine when the aircraft is
>>>pointing towards them, or they are on the side of the glider the radio
>>>is on, but as I turn (while thermalling) I am told the transmissions
>>>cut out.
>>>
>> I've seen a few ships that had a small whip antenna mounted on the
>> gear door. With the gear down, of course, the antenna was horizontal,
>> and if mounted close to the hinge line, it was high enough not to get
>> ground damage on most fields.
>>
>> But that won't work if you trailer your ship with the gear up...
>>
>> rj
>
>Hmm, well, if you mounted a BNC thru-bulkhead connector on the gear door,

>and the antenna had a mating BNC connector, it could br removed for
>trailering. That said, antenna wires have a LOT of drag so maybe a
rubber
>
>duckie....
>
>Bill D
>
>
>

[01-- Zero One]

I think Eric is on to something. How about a wire dipole glued to the
trailing edge of the rudder? You could drill a tiny hole(s) somewhere
in the middle of the trailing edge into the body of the rudder in order
to run the wires. Externally you would have nothing except very small
wires that could be glued and faired into the trailing edge.

Just a thought.

Larry



"Brad" > wrote in message
:

> Hi Eric,
>
> My vertical fin is carbon too, and any wire placed aft of the fin spar
> would still be surrounded by carbon.
>
> I'll probably do as a few have suggested to mount the rubber ducky
> antenna a-la the sparrowhawk.
>
> Many thanks to everyones help!
>
> Cheers,
> Brad
>
> PS........I see there is a new feature we have to deal with when
> posting now, at least via google-groups
>
> On May 26, 7:35 am, Eric Greenwell > wrote:
> > Brad wrote:
> > > My buddies tell me my handheld is too painfull to listen to anymore. I
> > > would put in a panel mount, but since I have a mostly carbon aircraft,
> > > where should I put the antenna? Too late to install it in the rudder,
> > > or is there a solution that would allow me to install one in the
> > > rudder??
> >
> > If your fin and rudder are not carbon, you might be able to put an
> > antenna on the back of the fin, just ahead of the rudder. A "coaxial
> > dipole" style could be used if there is enough room, as the cable comes
> > in the bottom. A standard diople using wire or tape elements would work
> > if room is limited, and these are available commercially.
> >
> > Where does the manufacturer put the antenna in the ones they produce?
> >
> > --
> > Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
> > * Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly
> >
> > * Updated! "Transponders in Sailplanes"http://tinyurl.com/y739x4
> > * New Jan '08 - sections on Mode S, TPAS, ADS-B, Flarm, more
> >
> > * "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" atwww.motorglider.org

[Alan[_6_]]

In article > bikensoar > writes:
>On May 25, 5:57=A0pm, Brad > wrote:
>> My buddies tell me my handheld is too painfull to listen to anymore. I
>> would put in a panel mount, but since I have a mostly carbon aircraft,
>> where should I put the antenna? Too late to install it in the rudder,
>> or is there a solution that would allow me to install one in the
>> rudder??
>>
>> I think the main issue with the handheld, is line-of-sight from the
>> antenna to who I am talking to, it works fine when the aircraft is
>> pointing towards them, or they are on the side of the glider the radio
>> is on, but as I turn (while thermalling) I am told the transmissions
>> cut out.
>>
>> Any thoughts on this?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Brad
>
>Brad,
>
>The all carbon Sparrowhawks have a little external antenna on the
>bottom of the fuselage, just behind the main gear.
>It can be twisted off and removed similar to a handheld antenna. It
>works very well.
>
>George


(yes old, but antennas came up again recently)

I would think that an antenna sticking *down* is a poorer choice than
one sticking up from the top of the aircraft. Down does pretty poorly
when on the ground, and is at extra risk of damage.

Has anyone measured the drag from a simple 1/4 wave wire monopole
sticking up from the aircraft?

Alan