Wanted: cheap audio vario

[Ian]

Folks,

I'm after a cheap audio vario for the Pirat, to replace a CAVII.
Requirements are (a) cheap (b) 80mm (c) cheap (d) working (e) cheap.

Anyone?

Ian

[Martin Gregorie[_4_]]

On Fri, 29 Aug 2008 10:13:19 -0700, Ian wrote:

> Folks,
>
> I'm after a cheap audio vario for the Pirat, to replace a CAVII.
> Requirements are (a) cheap (b) 80mm (c) cheap (d) working (e) cheap.
>
I'd suggest:

(1) used Borgelt B.40. I'm very pleased with mine.
(2) Tasman V 1000, used if you can find one.

Why the instance on 80mm? you can always use an 80->57 adapter plate.

The B.40 is available in both 57 mm and 80 mm though I think the latter
may be rare. Used because its been superseded by the B.400, which I
haven't seen yet. I got a used B.40 with dodgy main switch and dead
audio, and promptly sent it back to Mike Borgelt, who did an excellent,
fast overhaul for a very reasonable price. The total cost was under 2/3
the cost of a new Tasman: at that time both were available new at the
same price. Its one drawback is that you need to press a button to read
the average climb rate. I like the fact that it has a backup get-you-home
PP3 strapped to the back of it and a power switch that lets you select
12v from the glider or the PP3.

I've also flown with a Tasman and liked it too. The display is easy to
read, average is continuously shown and its noises are pleasant. It too
should run off a PP3 but you'd have to make your own battery box and
external change-over switch.

I was going try a Gizmo vario but the B.40 appeared at a price I couldn't
refuse. I don't know anybody who has a Gizmo, but its spec is OK despite
the unusual vertical ribbon display. Like the V.1000 it will run off a
PP3 but again you'd need to make your own change-over etc. Judging by the
on-site demo its easy to read and sounds good. It's also the cheapest new
vario I'm aware of. http://www.gizmo-instruments.co.uk/

HTH
Martin


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

[Ian]

On 29 Aug, 20:13, Martin Gregorie >
wrote:

> I'd suggest:
>
> (1) used Borgelt B.40. I'm very pleased with mine.
> (2) Tasman V 1000, used if you can find one.

Thanks!

> Why the instance on 80mm? you can always use an 80->57 adapter plate.

I know, but it looks a bit bodgy, and the Pirat has a very trim little
panel for four 80mm dials. Sure it's purely aesthetics!

Ian

[noel.wade]

> > I'd suggest:
>
> > (1) used Borgelt B.40. I'm very pleased with mine.
> > (2) Tasman V 1000, used if you can find one.

Gotta go with Martin on this one... I've used both and enjoyed them
both. I usually have a slight preference for analog needles over
digital "blocks", but the more I fly the better I get at using my ears
and the seat of my pants; so I find that the Tasman (with its timing
and tone options) is growing to be my favorite.

I have a couple of buddies who love their ILEC SC-7's; but when I
tried to buy one I was told they'd been discontinued due to
calibration problems.

One more note: Good compensation is critical - a poorly compensated
vario (even a high quality one) will seem misleading or cruddy,
especially frustrating when trying to center an important thermal!

Take care,

--Noel

[Steve Leonard[_2_]]

At 17:13 29 August 2008, Ian wrote:
>Folks,
>
>I'm after a cheap audio vario for the Pirat, to replace a CAVII.
>Requirements are (a) cheap (b) 80mm (c) cheap (d) working (e) cheap.
>
>Anyone?
>
>Ian
>

If you really liked your CAV II, maybe you can just get a replacement?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Cambridge-Variometer-VSI-Model-CAV-II-Exc-Used-Cond_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ90977QQihZ005QQite mZ150288966643QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

Steve Leonard

[DRN]

On Aug 30, 5:34*pm, "noel.wade" > wrote:
> > > I'd suggest:
>
> > > (1) used Borgelt B.40. I'm very pleased with mine.
> > > (2) Tasman V 1000, used if you can find one.
>
> Gotta go with Martin on this one... *I've used both and enjoyed them
> both. *I usually have a slight preference for analog needles over
> digital "blocks", but the more I fly the better I get at using my ears
> and the seat of my pants; so I find that the Tasman (with its timing
> and tone options) is growing to be my favorite.
>
> I have a couple of buddies who love their ILEC SC-7's; but when I
> tried to buy one I was told they'd been discontinued due to
> calibration problems.
>
> One more note: *Good compensation is critical - a poorly compensated
> vario (even a high quality one) will seem misleading or cruddy,
> especially frustrating when trying to center an important thermal!
>
> Take care,
>
> --Noel

ILEC continues production of SC-7 as always.
If you are having difficulty obtaining one, contact
ILEC on

Please do not post uninformed rumor on RAS;
you do a disservice to all (and you look foolish).

Thanks,
Best Regards, Dave

PS: For those interested in learning about TE compensation
from an authority instead of RAS rumor, have a look at:
http://www.nadler.com/sn10/Brozel_TE_Compensation_20020510.pdf

[Ian]

On 31 Aug, 14:24, Steve Leonard > wrote:
> At 17:13 29 August 2008, Ian wrote:
>
> >Folks,
>
> >I'm after a cheap audio vario for the Pirat, to replace a CAVII.
> >Requirements are (a) cheap (b) 80mm (c) cheap (d) working (e) cheap.
>
> >Anyone?
>
> >Ian
>
> If you really liked your CAV II, maybe you can just get a replacement?
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Cambridge-Variometer-VSI-Model-CAV-II-...

Thanks. I've just checked, and I was wrong - I have a CAV50. Which is
so old that it's the electronic equivalent of a Cosim. I did think of
trying to find another, but was told that it's simply age which is
doing for mine ... would the CAVII be any better?

Ian

[Martin Gregorie[_4_]]

On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 02:04:19 -0700, Ian wrote:

> On 31 Aug, 14:24, Steve Leonard > wrote:
>> At 17:13 29 August 2008, Ian wrote:
>>
>> >Folks,
>>
>> >I'm after a cheap audio vario for the Pirat, to replace a CAVII.
>> >Requirements are (a) cheap (b) 80mm (c) cheap (d) working (e) cheap.
>>
>> >Anyone?
>>
>> >Ian
>>
>> If you really liked your CAV II, maybe you can just get a replacement?
>>
>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Cambridge-Variometer-VSI-Model-CAV-
II-...
>
> Thanks. I've just checked, and I was wrong - I have a CAV50. Which is so
> old that it's the electronic equivalent of a Cosim. I did think of
> trying to find another, but was told that it's simply age which is doing
> for mine ... would the CAVII be any better?
>
We (CGC) had a Cambridge M-nav Mk 4 in our Pegase at one time. I flew
that a lot and found it an acceptable vario. It has switchable range (+/-
5, 10, 20 kts) and three switchable response rates. No averager - for
that you need to add the CMP 150 Mk 4 flight director.

My Libelle came with a CVS50 vario. Is this the same as the CAV50? - mine
was fixed +/- 10 kts with an external switch as its only control. It also
had a CMP150 Mk4 flight director installed, which added an averager and
electronic speed-to-fly. The backup was a PZL mechanical vario. I
replaced them all with an SDI C4 and a B.40 before I flew it. I already
had the C4 and like it a lot. The PZL had to go in favour of the B.40 to
avoid mixing capacity and pressure sensing instruments on the same TE
probe.

I think the M-nav is a bit more recent than your CAV50. As its an 80mm
instrument, it may be worth grabbing one if you see it.


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

[Ian]

On 2 Sep, 11:57, Martin Gregorie >
wrote:
> On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 02:04:19 -0700, Ian wrote:

> I think the M-nav is a bit more recent than your CAV50. As its an 80mm
> instrument, it may be worth grabbing one if you see it.

Thanks. However, I think anything with "nav" in its name would be too
expensive. We're talking Pirat, here...

Ian

[Martin Gregorie[_4_]]

On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 05:25:09 -0700, Ian wrote:

> On 2 Sep, 11:57, Martin Gregorie >
> wrote:
>> On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 02:04:19 -0700, Ian wrote:
>
>> I think the M-nav is a bit more recent than your CAV50. As its an 80mm
>> instrument, it may be worth grabbing one if you see it.
>
> Thanks. However, I think anything with "nav" in its name would be too
> expensive. We're talking Pirat, here...
>
Understood.

I managed to record the wrong name in my notes because I found the
Cambridge website confusing when it came to identifying and naming their
older instruments. Cambridge call the vario we had in the Peg a Mk 4
Vario. I described it correctly, though I had the name wrong. It is just
a simple audio vario with selectable sensitivities and response rates:

http://www.bas.uk.net/docs/Mk4_Vario.zip

Despite the URL this is the link from their site.

I have used an M-nav - our older Discus had one fitted. It worked OK as a
vario, but I never really liked the way it handled other functions. You
had to manually put the final glide distance and wind in on toggle
switches because it had no GPS link, though in fairness it probably
predates GPS. Once the final glide details were entered entered, it
counted distance etc down on dead reckoning. That has also been replaced
with a C3.

I don't know what happened to either instrument though I can try to find
out if you're interested.


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

[Andy[_1_]]

On Sep 2, 11:31*am, Martin Gregorie
> wrote:
.. You
> had to manually put the final glide distance and wind in on toggle
> switches because it had no GPS link, though in fairness it probably
> predates GPS. Once the final glide details were entered entered, it
> counted distance etc down on dead reckoning.

Yes, the MNAV was hot stuff long before GPS and when the alternative
was a prayer wheel. I used one in my 19 for years. The MNAV was not
dead reckoning though, it decremented glide distance based on
integrated airspeed, offset by a pilot entered wind estimate. Repeated
fixes allowed the wind estimate to be refined as the glide
progressed. When GPS came available the final glide distance could be
manually set from the GPS rather than taking fixes off the chart which
made things much easier and gave a quicker final glide wind
solution.

Integrated glide computers with GPS and moving maps make flying a
whole different game from those days.

Andy