Yenc decoder <was "Ren Yenc" >

[Clive[_3_]]

Best bet is to use a dedicated newsreader, I use Xnews, it's free!
xnews.newsguy.com

I've never used OE for newsgroups, but this little prog is supposed to make
it Y-happy.

[The Raven[_2_]]

"Clive" > wrote in message
...
> Best bet is to use a dedicated newsreader, I use Xnews, it's free!
> xnews.newsguy.com

So is OE and it's supplied with the majority of computers.

> I've never used OE for newsgroups, but this little prog is supposed to
> make
> it Y-happy.

OE is designed for newsgroups, it comes free with the computer, it's the
defacto standard, it's been in use for over a decade, very few 'new'
newsreaders offer significant improvement, Yenc has been around for years
but the adoption rate is very low.

[mrorwell]

"The Raven" > wrote in
u:

> OE is designed for newsgroups,

No. It was designed as a barebones email program with the ability to read
TEXT newsgroups, which were predominant at the time.

>it's the defacto standard,

You're joking, right?

>it's been in use for over a decade, very few 'new' newsreaders offer
significant improvement,

If you're not joking, you're in denial.



.................................................. ...............
Posted via TITANnews - Uncensored Newsgroups Access
>>>> at http://www.TitanNews.com <<<<
-=Every Newsgroup - Anonymous, UNCENSORED, BROADBAND Downloads=-

[Auld Phart]

On Tue, 2 Sep 2008 08:23:07 +1000, "The Raven" > wrote:

>"Clive" > wrote in message
...
>> Best bet is to use a dedicated newsreader, I use Xnews, it's free!
>> xnews.newsguy.com
>
>So is OE and it's supplied with the majority of computers.

Dedicated newsreader - definitely NOT!
Free - questionable - supplied at no extra cost whether you want it or not when
you pay lots of money to M$.

About the one piece of pricing M$ got right - OE is priced at its real value.
>
>> I've never used OE for newsgroups, but this little prog is supposed to
>> make
>> it Y-happy.
>
>OE is designed for newsgroups,

WRONG

> it comes free with the computer,

WRONG - where exactly can I get OE for free ?

> it's the defacto standard,

WRONG

>it's been in use for over a decade,

POSSIBLY - can't be bothered to check

> very few 'new' newsreaders offer significant improvement,

WRONG

> Yenc has been around for years but the adoption rate is very low.

VERY WRONG

Five (possibly six) wrong out of six.

Next!

[Lee[_2_]]

"The Raven" > wrote in
u:

> "Clive" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Best bet is to use a dedicated newsreader, I use Xnews, it's free!
>> xnews.newsguy.com
>
> So is OE and it's supplied with the majority of computers.
>
>> I've never used OE for newsgroups, but this little prog is supposed
>> to make
>> it Y-happy.
>
> OE is designed for newsgroups, it comes free with the computer, it's
> the defacto standard, it's been in use for over a decade, very few
> 'new' newsreaders offer significant improvement, Yenc has been around
> for years but the adoption rate is very low.
>
>

No, OE is ***NOT*** designed for newsgroups! In many ways is
antithetical regarding newsgroups.

It IS supplied in the majority of computers ONLY due to
MicroSoft's mercenary marketing tentacles.

IF YOU THINK THAT **ANYTHING** THAT "COMES WITH" YOUR IBM-CLONE
COMPUTER IS FREE, YOU NEED TO RETHINK MARKETING IN GENERAL.

And Yes, I know I'm shouting. There are NO FREE LUNCHES.

I've yet to have a single problem viewing any pictures WHATSOEVER
by simply thinking outside the MicroSoft box... and yes, I use
an IBM-clone... and Xnews ...and NewsGuy ...and broadband. But I
am NOT subservient to MicroSoft. It's my computer. Not Gate's.

------------------
Here's *my* funny sig from an ABPA thread on 08/16/08:
Alan Erskine > says... "I've got an IQ of 151"
"I'm in the 99th percentile for my age group - that's the top 1 percent"
(nice math there, Einstein!) "I doubt very strongly that you know
anyone in my range of IQ" (Thankfully, NO!)
Lee > discussing newsserver retention:
"...I can go back about 6 months..."
Alan Erskine > interrupts with:
"Why should we wait for six months to download an image
that was posted yesterday?"


Oh, and say hello to the 45th President of the United States:

[The Raven[_2_]]

"Auld Phart" > wrote in message
...
> On Tue, 2 Sep 2008 08:23:07 +1000, "The Raven" >
> wrote:
>
>>"Clive" > wrote in message
...
>>> Best bet is to use a dedicated newsreader, I use Xnews, it's free!
>>> xnews.newsguy.com
>>
>>So is OE and it's supplied with the majority of computers.
>
> Dedicated newsreader - definitely NOT!

So we're going to argue what constitues a 'dedicated newsreader' now....
<sigh> It was and is a newsreader.

> Free - questionable - supplied at no extra cost whether you want it or not
> when
> you pay lots of money to M$.

Free, as in you could (for many years) download it free of charge. Heck, you
could even get the browser for free.

>
> About the one piece of pricing M$ got right - OE is priced at its real
> value.
>>
>>> I've never used OE for newsgroups, but this little prog is supposed to
>>> make
>>> it Y-happy.
>>
>>OE is designed for newsgroups,
>
> WRONG

It is or else it wouldn't have been used for such for the last decade.

>
>> it comes free with the computer,
>
> WRONG - where exactly can I get OE for free ?

Try downloading Internet Explorer, it's part of the install.

http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrsswxp1100000063mrt/direct/01/

>
>> it's the defacto standard,
>
> WRONG

Approx 60 million users think otherwise.

>>it's been in use for over a decade,
>
> POSSIBLY - can't be bothered to check

Very close to a decade if not longer.

>
>> very few 'new' newsreaders offer significant improvement,
>
> WRONG

Significant improvement can only be measured by the installed user base (as
in actual users not just installation).

We could probably gather stats via Google on the number of unique posters
and their newsreader preferences. I'd be very confident OE would have a
market share exceeding that of default Yenc enabled newsreaders.

>
>> Yenc has been around for years but the adoption rate is very low.
>
> VERY WRONG

Do some research to prove that. The majority of newgroups I've seen either
have a small number of Yenc posters or recommend it not be used.

>
> Five (possibly six) wrong out of six.

You're definitely wrong on one (evidence provided) and somewhat biased on
the others.

>
> Next!

You won't provide any evidence.

For the sake of this newsgroup, Yenc is not preferred. This is particularly
the case when the majority of Yenc posts are floods.

[The Raven[_2_]]

"Lee" > wrote in message
. 91...
> "The Raven" > wrote in
> u:
>
>> "Clive" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Best bet is to use a dedicated newsreader, I use Xnews, it's free!
>>> xnews.newsguy.com
>>
>> So is OE and it's supplied with the majority of computers.
>>
>>> I've never used OE for newsgroups, but this little prog is supposed
>>> to make
>>> it Y-happy.
>>
>> OE is designed for newsgroups, it comes free with the computer, it's
>> the defacto standard, it's been in use for over a decade, very few
>> 'new' newsreaders offer significant improvement, Yenc has been around
>> for years but the adoption rate is very low.
>>
>>
>
> No, OE is ***NOT*** designed for newsgroups! In many ways is
> antithetical regarding newsgroups.

It is a newsreader, otherwise you wouldn't see it here.
It's been around doing newgroup service longer than most other newsreader
apps.

> It IS supplied in the majority of computers ONLY due to
> MicroSoft's mercenary marketing tentacles.

It's downloadable, see the link I posted earlier. I'm not concerned with
anti-MS conspiracy theories.

> IF YOU THINK THAT **ANYTHING** THAT "COMES WITH" YOUR IBM-CLONE
> COMPUTER IS FREE, YOU NEED TO RETHINK MARKETING IN GENERAL.

Typing like a AOLuser whilst going on an anti-MS rant tends to pigeon hole
people very close to those who wear tin foil hats. The credibility to your
argument drops significantly.

> And Yes, I know I'm shouting. There are NO FREE LUNCHES.

In which case, pick the product you want.

OE has a proven record and user base other apps can only hope to emulate.
Sure, it may not be the absolute best package but it does most of the things
that most of the people want.

> I've yet to have a single problem viewing any pictures WHATSOEVER
> by simply thinking outside the MicroSoft box... and yes, I use
> an IBM-clone... and Xnews ...and NewsGuy ...and broadband. But I
> am NOT subservient to MicroSoft. It's my computer. Not Gate's.

We're talking about a newsreader functionality here, not some rabid
anti-Microsoft zealots conspiracy theory.

Get past the anti-MS crap and you'll discover a product that actually does
what most people want.

Hands up all those who can remember the compression format wars? ARC, ARJ,
ZIP, LZH, ZOO etc etc.

Of all those competing formats, with their supposed competition crushing
benefits, how many are still used today? Yenc is just repeating the same old
format war, one which it's highly unlikely to win.

[HEMI-Powered[_2_]]

The Raven added these comments in the current discussion du jour
....

When I looked in here this morning, I found no pictures, just a
long and winding thread of people complaining about other people
wrt yEnc and Outhouse Depressed. So, yep, I guess this NG has
changed. Good luck, folks, in keeping this place alive if you
enact a rule that only original pictures are allowed.

> "Lee" > wrote in message
> . 91...
>> "The Raven" > wrote in
>> u:
>>
>>> "Clive" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> Best bet is to use a dedicated newsreader, I use Xnews,
>>>> it's free! xnews.newsguy.com
>>>
>>> So is OE and it's supplied with the majority of computers.
>>>
>>>> I've never used OE for newsgroups, but this little prog is
>>>> supposed to make
>>>> it Y-happy.
>>>
>>> OE is designed for newsgroups, it comes free with the
>>> computer, it's the defacto standard, it's been in use for
>>> over a decade, very few 'new' newsreaders offer significant
>>> improvement, Yenc has been around for years but the adoption
>>> rate is very low.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> No, OE is ***NOT*** designed for newsgroups! In many ways is
>> antithetical regarding newsgroups.
>
> It is a newsreader, otherwise you wouldn't see it here.
> It's been around doing newgroup service longer than most other
> newsreader apps.
>
>> It IS supplied in the majority of computers ONLY due to
>> MicroSoft's mercenary marketing tentacles.
>
> It's downloadable, see the link I posted earlier. I'm not
> concerned with anti-MS conspiracy theories.
>
>> IF YOU THINK THAT **ANYTHING** THAT "COMES WITH" YOUR
>> IBM-CLONE COMPUTER IS FREE, YOU NEED TO RETHINK MARKETING IN
>> GENERAL.
>
> Typing like a AOLuser whilst going on an anti-MS rant tends to
> pigeon hole people very close to those who wear tin foil hats.
> The credibility to your argument drops significantly.
>
>> And Yes, I know I'm shouting. There are NO FREE LUNCHES.
>
> In which case, pick the product you want.
>
> OE has a proven record and user base other apps can only hope
> to emulate. Sure, it may not be the absolute best package but
> it does most of the things that most of the people want.
>
>> I've yet to have a single problem viewing any pictures
>> WHATSOEVER by simply thinking outside the MicroSoft box...
>> and yes, I use an IBM-clone... and Xnews ...and NewsGuy
>> ...and broadband. But I am NOT subservient to MicroSoft.
>> It's my computer. Not Gate's.
>
> We're talking about a newsreader functionality here, not some
> rabid anti-Microsoft zealots conspiracy theory.
>
> Get past the anti-MS crap and you'll discover a product that
> actually does what most people want.
>
> Hands up all those who can remember the compression format
> wars? ARC, ARJ, ZIP, LZH, ZOO etc etc.
>
> Of all those competing formats, with their supposed
> competition crushing benefits, how many are still used today?
> Yenc is just repeating the same old format war, one which it's
> highly unlikely to win.
>
>
>
>



--
HP, aka Jerry

Don't be a fop or a blooter, make only pithy comments on Usenet

[Lee[_2_]]

"The Raven" > wrote in
:

>
> It is a newsreader, otherwise you wouldn't see it here.
> It's been around doing newgroup service longer than most other
> newsreader apps.
>

Of course it is! That's why a flame war starts up
here every 10 minutes. It is a newsreader, but only
in the most marginal sense. Keith Olberman is a news
reader too, just as intolerable as MSOE and something
else I don't have any use for as my newsreader.

>
> It's downloadable, see the link I posted earlier. I'm not concerned
> with anti-MS conspiracy theories.
>

Tell that to everyone else in here. See how quickly
they D/L something that is multi-part and has an
extension of ".zip"

>
> In which case, pick the product you want.
>

Circular logic.

> OE has a proven record and user base other apps can only hope to
> emulate. Sure, it may not be the absolute best package but it does
> most of the things that most of the people want.
>

You miss the point entirely. Until the commercial news
services started making a bigger footprint, NOBODY made
money off of NNTP. Hence the cripple-ware status of MSOE
in relation to NNTP. Further proof is with the ISPs
dropping NGs like a warm turd, using the excuse of 0.08%
of the postings were "kiddie porn." There's tons more
porn of that type on the Web, but they don't address that,
do they? NO! because they make money off the web.
If MS or ATT or any other place could manipulate the prices
relating to NNTP, everyone would have easier access and
would be using MSOE.

The software that most everyone in here refuses to try is
actually forestalling the death of NNTP. MS and many of
our dear providers have been trying for ten years to kill
off UseNet, cause they can't make a buck off it.

>
> We're talking about a newsreader functionality here, not some rabid
> anti-Microsoft zealots conspiracy theory.

Odd, the non-functionality of MSOE is the root of every
argument in this swamp. The people who actually move to
a program that is capable and easy to use are the pariahs.
I don't even need to detail that nearly 98% of the viruses,
trojans, spyware etc. are written to specifically attack
MSWIN/MSOE/MS-anything.


>
> Get past the anti-MS crap and you'll discover a product that actually
> does what most people want.
>

Odd again. I'm using Vista as we speak, and I have copies
of every Windows version since Windows 2! I happen to
know quite well what does more than just what "most people
want." I want my computer to do what I want it to do.
MSOE doesn't handle newsgroups like I want... so I move
onward and upward.

> Hands up all those who can remember the compression format wars? ARC,
> ARJ, ZIP, LZH, ZOO etc etc.
>
> Of all those competing formats, with their supposed competition
> crushing benefits, how many are still used today? Yenc is just
> repeating the same old format war, one which it's highly unlikely to
> win.
>

One of the main reasons for those wars was simply entrepreneurs
filling a giant hole that MS wasn't concerned with addressing
at the time. Y-encoding is a non-issue... well, excepting
those who still using MSOE cripple-ware.

In conclusion... I've built thousands of desk-top computers
since the 8088s. There are still scars on my hands from pulling
eproms. But I can't build a laptop like the majors can.
My point? I have to use laptops. Try to go into any retailer
and ask for a laptop with NOTHING on it. You can't. If you could,
it would easily be $300.00 cheaper. As I said, there are no free
lunches. The guys who use only the software provided by the
sharks will forever remain bait. For the money they pay, they
shouldn't have to bitch about not being able to handle splits,
RARs, PARs, and poor old much-maligned Yenc.

[HEMI-Powered[_4_]]

Lee added these comments in the current discussion du jour ...

> You miss the point entirely. Until the commercial news
> services started making a bigger footprint, NOBODY made
> money off of NNTP. Hence the cripple-ware status of MSOE
> in relation to NNTP. Further proof is with the ISPs
> dropping NGs like a warm turd, using the excuse of 0.08%
> of the postings were "kiddie porn." There's tons more
> porn of that type on the Web, but they don't address that,
> do they? NO! because they make money off the web.
> If MS or ATT or any other place could manipulate the prices
> relating to NNTP, everyone would have easier access and
> would be using MSOE.

The real problem with Microcrap is that they don't innovate now
and never have. They write very popular code for many purposes
and sell enough of it to monopolize the market but that hardly
makes them the best. Bill the Gates only innovates or adds
functionality long proven correct by independent developers when
he senses an economic advantage. So, in the case of OE, it not
only allows HTML which is very, very bad on Usenet but OE is a
very inefficient news reader and has difficulty downloading
multipart binaries. Of course, it cannot do yEnc at all without a
plug in. But, because the hundreds of millions of users all have
Microcrap software, they get OE for free and believe that it is
all they need.

I'm not necessarily in favor of people flooding this NG or others
I monitor with yEnc unless the collective group decides they want
to. My main autoposter is Rocketfuel which doesn't support yEnc
but I do have a version of PP2K that does. For the size pictures
posted here, the approx. 39% reduction in as-posted file size is
probably not that important, but for the people still stuck on
dial-up it is a God send.

I've seen flame wars break out in many NGs over the yEnc issue.
When you cut through all the crap and personal insults, what
sifts out is that the OE crowd simply won't change thus majority
rule disallows a more efficient encoding scheme. I guess that is
their right.

> The software that most everyone in here refuses to try is
> actually forestalling the death of NNTP. MS and many of
> our dear providers have been trying for ten years to kill
> off UseNet, cause they can't make a buck off it.

I don't know about that. But, I do thing that the major ISPs -
not NSPs - really don't understand Usenet at all and clearly
don't understand the difference between HTTP/SMTP and NNTP. But,
as I say above, the problem with OE, and thus the angst of its
users, is that Bill the Gates so far has refused to add a yEnc
decoder into the product. Then, too, Microcrap could have put the
major 3rd party utility developers out of business years ago if
they put in good technical functionality into the O/S and/or sold
it as a separate product. Until then, the yEnc wars will go on
and on and on.
>>
>> We're talking about a newsreader functionality here, not some
>> rabid anti-Microsoft zealots conspiracy theory.
>
> Odd, the non-functionality of MSOE is the root of every
> argument in this swamp. The people who actually move to
> a program that is capable and easy to use are the pariahs.
> I don't even need to detail that nearly 98% of the viruses,
> trojans, spyware etc. are written to specifically attack
> MSWIN/MSOE/MS-anything.
>
I guess you could call it "odd". I think it is more an inertia
problem in that people simply don't like to change what they're
comfortable with even when it is obvious that the software
doesn't work.
>>
>> Get past the anti-MS crap and you'll discover a product that
>> actually does what most people want.
>>
>
> Odd again. I'm using Vista as we speak, and I have copies
> of every Windows version since Windows 2! I happen to
> know quite well what does more than just what "most people
> want." I want my computer to do what I want it to do.
> MSOE doesn't handle newsgroups like I want... so I move
> onward and upward.
>
>> Hands up all those who can remember the compression format
>> wars? ARC, ARJ, ZIP, LZH, ZOO etc etc.
>>
>> Of all those competing formats, with their supposed
>> competition crushing benefits, how many are still used today?
>> Yenc is just repeating the same old format war, one which
>> it's highly unlikely to win.

The older compression schemes died out mainly because nobody
wrote a GUI app like WinZip for Windows and the vast majority of
users no longer wants to go to a DOS window and play around with
arcane command line switches and the like. As I recall, Arc and
Arj compressed less than Zip but Lzh was a little better. Yet,
Zip survived because WinZip is such a good utility. What is
especially interesting is why Microcrap never incorporated the
full functionality of the many utilities they've bought over the
years.
>
> One of the main reasons for those wars was simply
> entrepreneurs filling a giant hole that MS wasn't concerned
> with addressing at the time. Y-encoding is a non-issue...
> well, excepting those who still using MSOE cripple-ware.
>
> In conclusion... I've built thousands of desk-top computers
> since the 8088s. There are still scars on my hands from
> pulling eproms. But I can't build a laptop like the majors
> can. My point? I have to use laptops. Try to go into any
> retailer and ask for a laptop with NOTHING on it. You can't.
> If you could, it would easily be $300.00 cheaper. As I said,
> there are no free lunches. The guys who use only the software
> provided by the sharks will forever remain bait. For the
> money they pay, they shouldn't have to bitch about not being
> able to handle splits, RARs, PARs, and poor old much-maligned
> Yenc.

--
HP, aka Jerry

Don't be a fop or a blooter, make only pithy comments on Usenet

[hielan' laddie]

On Tue, 2 Sep 2008 11:10:56 -0400, HEMI-Powered wrote
(in article >):

> I've seen flame wars break out in many NGs over the yEnc issue.
> When you cut through all the crap and personal insults, what
> sifts out is that the OE crowd simply won't change thus majority
> rule disallows a more efficient encoding scheme. I guess that is
> their right.

They can complain all they like. I will not coddle them. They no like? Me no
care.

[Clive[_3_]]

hielan' laddie wrote :

> On Tue, 2 Sep 2008 11:10:56 -0400, HEMI-Powered wrote
> (in article >):
>
>> I've seen flame wars break out in many NGs over the yEnc issue.
>> When you cut through all the crap and personal insults, what
>> sifts out is that the OE crowd simply won't change thus majority
>> rule disallows a more efficient encoding scheme. I guess that is
>> their right.
>
> They can complain all they like. I will not coddle them. They no like?
> Me no care.
>
>

I wish I'd kept my gob shut!
I didn't expect some kind of <Spanish Inquisition>

[Peter Hucker[_2_]]

On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 15:17:10 +0000 (UTC), Clive >
wrote:

>hielan' laddie wrote :
>
>> On Tue, 2 Sep 2008 11:10:56 -0400, HEMI-Powered wrote
>> (in article >):
>>
>>> I've seen flame wars break out in many NGs over the yEnc issue.
>>> When you cut through all the crap and personal insults, what
>>> sifts out is that the OE crowd simply won't change thus majority
>>> rule disallows a more efficient encoding scheme. I guess that is
>>> their right.
>>
>> They can complain all they like. I will not coddle them. They no like?
>> Me no care.
>>
>>
>
>I wish I'd kept my gob shut!
>I didn't expect some kind of <Spanish Inquisition>

Nobody expects the.... oh bugger!
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

A little girl asked her mother, "Can I go outside and play with the boys?"
Her mother replied, "No, you can't play with the boys, they're too rough."
The little girl thought about it for a few moments and asked, "If I can find a smooth one, can I play with him?"