DIY Gascolator

[[email protected]]

To All:

The Gascolator dates from the days of the Model T Ford. Back in those
days the fuel tank was located in the cowl, just forward of the
windscreen -- which was plate glass. The filler was located on the
cowl. The float-type quantity gauge was located in the instrument
cluster. The system did not have a pump; it relied on gravity to feed
fuel to the carburetor. There was a strainer inside of the tank which
prevented LARGE particles of debris from reaching the carb, whilst the
Gascolator served to trap any WATER that happened to get into the
tank. The Gascolator's bowl was made of glass, allowing you to SEE
any water that may have been trapped. Your job was to loosen the
clamp securing the glass bowl and empty it, thus ridding the system of
water.

When I was a kid every junk yard worthy of the name had a windrow of
early Fords -- T's as well as A's -- which managed to survive the lust
for scrap iron generated by World War II. These junked Fords provided
a host of parts for anyone crazy enough to build their own airplane.
One of those parts was the Gascolator.

Alas, Gascolators have become rather rare birds in today's world.
Fortunately, they are relatively easy to make.

The first thing you'll need is the receiver; the glass or metal
'sediment bowl' through which all of the engine's fuel must pass.
Back then, it was always glass. Nowadays it's usually metal but
either one will work. (If you want to stick with Ford parts for some
reason, give a call to Mike's "A" Ford-able Parts in Maysville,
Georgia. Good people. See their on-line catalog at www.mikes-afordable.com

The receiver needs a mouth 1-3/4" to 2" in diameter. This could be a
baby food jar or similar. It could also be a section of chromed drain
pipe from under the bathroom sink. Or kitchen sink. (But don't get
caught!) The tricky bit here is to close the open end of the pipe,
which you can do by spinning or by hammering or whatever. If you
chose to hammer the end closed you'll have to anneal the brass pipe
several times during the process so keep in mind that quenching non-
ferrous metals SOFTENS the metal, whereas quenching ferrous metals
hardens them. To anneal your brass pipe simply raise it to a red heat
then swirl it around in a bucket of water. That makes it good to go
for another round of hammering.

Once you've hammered or spun the brass pipe to a single point, you may
seal it with a dot of hard solder.

Whatever you settle upon as your receiver, the next step is to find an
O-ring that matches its diameter. This is pretty easy since most real
auto-parts stores (as opposed to un-real, chain-store type FLAPS) will
have TRAYS of O-rings in every size imaginable. Simply find one that
fits.

The body of your Gascolator needs to be about 3/4" thick (ie, 19mm).
You need that much depth because the body will receive several
fittings that use NPT -- pipe threads. (I'm assuming you have
suitable pipe-thread reamers and taps.)

Although NPT is pretty strong you do NOT want to depend upon a pipe-
threaded fitting to SUPPORT the Gascolator, which will be mounted on
your firewall -- and which must be the LOWEST point in your fuel
system. (Why lowest? So that the water will go there.)

A circular groove is cut into the Gascolator body to accept the O-
ring. The receiver then presses against the O-ring with sufficient
pressure to form a gasoline-tight seal. The pressure comes from a
simple screw affair and a pair of straps that connect to the body of
the Gascolator then pass under the receiver. At the point where the
straps pass under the receiver you must fabricate a plate or other
fixture that is threaded 1/4-20, the bolt provided with some means of
safety-wiring. The head of the bolt is usually fitted with a cross-
bar or wheel to make it easy to unscrew by hand.

On the body of the Gascolator you must provide for one inlet (ie, from
the fuel tank) and two outlets. One of the outlets is to the carb and
is fitted with a sintered bronze muffler from a pneumatic-tool. The
other outlet goes to the primer. All of the drillings in the body of
the Gascolator are 3/16" or larger in diameter and are tapped 1/8"
NPT.

You must also provide some means of attaching and supporting the
Gascolator to the firewall.

The body of the Gascolator may be made from a billet of aluminum or
frm a casting..

I will post an illustrated version of this message to my blog as soon
as I am able to do so.

[jan olieslagers[_2_]]

schreef:
> To All:
>
> The Gascolator dates from the days of the Model T Ford. Back in those
> days the fuel tank was located in the cowl, just forward of the
> windscreen -- which was plate glass. The filler was located on the
> cowl. The float-type quantity gauge was located in the instrument
> cluster. The system did not have a pump; it relied on gravity to feed
> fuel to the carburetor. There was a strainer inside of the tank which
> prevented LARGE particles of debris from reaching the carb, whilst the
> Gascolator served to trap any WATER that happened to get into the
> tank. The Gascolator's bowl was made of glass, allowing you to SEE
> any water that may have been trapped. Your job was to loosen the
> clamp securing the glass bowl and empty it, thus ridding the system of
> water.
>
> When I was a kid every junk yard worthy of the name had a windrow of
> early Fords -- T's as well as A's -- which managed to survive the lust
> for scrap iron generated by World War II. These junked Fords provided
> a host of parts for anyone crazy enough to build their own airplane.
> One of those parts was the Gascolator.
>
> Alas, Gascolators have become rather rare birds in today's world.
> Fortunately, they are relatively easy to make.
>
> The first thing you'll need is the receiver; the glass or metal
> 'sediment bowl' through which all of the engine's fuel must pass.
> Back then, it was always glass. Nowadays it's usually metal but
> either one will work. (If you want to stick with Ford parts for some
> reason, give a call to Mike's "A" Ford-able Parts in Maysville,
> Georgia. Good people. See their on-line catalog at www.mikes-afordable.com
>
> The receiver needs a mouth 1-3/4" to 2" in diameter. This could be a
> baby food jar or similar. It could also be a section of chromed drain
> pipe from under the bathroom sink. Or kitchen sink. (But don't get
> caught!) The tricky bit here is to close the open end of the pipe,
> which you can do by spinning or by hammering or whatever. If you
> chose to hammer the end closed you'll have to anneal the brass pipe
> several times during the process so keep in mind that quenching non-
> ferrous metals SOFTENS the metal, whereas quenching ferrous metals
> hardens them. To anneal your brass pipe simply raise it to a red heat
> then swirl it around in a bucket of water. That makes it good to go
> for another round of hammering.
>
> Once you've hammered or spun the brass pipe to a single point, you may
> seal it with a dot of hard solder.
>
> Whatever you settle upon as your receiver, the next step is to find an
> O-ring that matches its diameter. This is pretty easy since most real
> auto-parts stores (as opposed to un-real, chain-store type FLAPS) will
> have TRAYS of O-rings in every size imaginable. Simply find one that
> fits.
>
> The body of your Gascolator needs to be about 3/4" thick (ie, 19mm).
> You need that much depth because the body will receive several
> fittings that use NPT -- pipe threads. (I'm assuming you have
> suitable pipe-thread reamers and taps.)
>
> Although NPT is pretty strong you do NOT want to depend upon a pipe-
> threaded fitting to SUPPORT the Gascolator, which will be mounted on
> your firewall -- and which must be the LOWEST point in your fuel
> system. (Why lowest? So that the water will go there.)
>
> A circular groove is cut into the Gascolator body to accept the O-
> ring. The receiver then presses against the O-ring with sufficient
> pressure to form a gasoline-tight seal. The pressure comes from a
> simple screw affair and a pair of straps that connect to the body of
> the Gascolator then pass under the receiver. At the point where the
> straps pass under the receiver you must fabricate a plate or other
> fixture that is threaded 1/4-20, the bolt provided with some means of
> safety-wiring. The head of the bolt is usually fitted with a cross-
> bar or wheel to make it easy to unscrew by hand.
>
> On the body of the Gascolator you must provide for one inlet (ie, from
> the fuel tank) and two outlets. One of the outlets is to the carb and
> is fitted with a sintered bronze muffler from a pneumatic-tool. The
> other outlet goes to the primer. All of the drillings in the body of
> the Gascolator are 3/16" or larger in diameter and are tapped 1/8"
> NPT.
>
> You must also provide some means of attaching and supporting the
> Gascolator to the firewall.
>
> The body of the Gascolator may be made from a billet of aluminum or
> frm a casting..
>
> I will post an illustrated version of this message to my blog as soon
> as I am able to do so.

Bob, thanks for explaining!
So a gascolator is simply a water separator, OK?
I thought it a lot more complicated -
an easy way to get lost in explanations.

Questions:
-) why does one want a water separator apart from the fuel filter?
In my house's heating, there's a filter cartridge in a glass bowl,
and when I ran the tank dry it sure filled up with water (and smudge).
Isn't it sufficient to mount the fuel filter at the lowest point,
and have a water drain valve on its bottom?
-) is there a finer fuel filter in the Ford A & T, or only the
strainer in the tank? Do you recommend a finer filter, either
between tank and gascolator or between gascolator and carb?
-) why the "sintered bronze muffler" on the exit?
actually, what is a "sintered bronze muffler"?
Does it serve as a filter, perhaps?
-) for the receiver body, I should like clear plastic:
less delicate than glass, but unlike metal, it shows what's happening.
There must surely be clear plastics that resist gasoline?

Sincere apologies if these questions are stupid, or were answered
before. And my gratitude for sharing your knowledge!

[Ed]

On Sun, 16 Nov 2008 12:09:06 -0800 (PST), "
> wrote:

>To All:
>
>The Gascolator dates from the days of the Model T Ford. Back in those
>days the fuel tank was located in the cowl, just forward of the
>windscreen -- which was plate glass. The filler was located on the
>cowl. The float-type quantity gauge was located in the instrument
>cluster. The system did not have a pump; it relied on gravity to feed
>fuel to the carburetor. There was a strainer inside of the tank which
>prevented LARGE particles of debris from reaching the carb, whilst the
>Gascolator served to trap any WATER that happened to get into the
>tank. The Gascolator's bowl was made of glass, allowing you to SEE
>any water that may have been trapped. Your job was to loosen the
>clamp securing the glass bowl and empty it, thus ridding the system of
>water.
>
>When I was a kid every junk yard worthy of the name had a windrow of
>early Fords -- T's as well as A's -- which managed to survive the lust
>for scrap iron generated by World War II. These junked Fords provided
>a host of parts for anyone crazy enough to build their own airplane.
>One of those parts was the Gascolator.
>
>Alas, Gascolators have become rather rare birds in today's world.
>Fortunately, they are relatively easy to make.
>
>The first thing you'll need is the receiver; the glass or metal
>'sediment bowl' through which all of the engine's fuel must pass.
>Back then, it was always glass. Nowadays it's usually metal but
>either one will work. (If you want to stick with Ford parts for some
>reason, give a call to Mike's "A" Ford-able Parts in Maysville,
>Georgia. Good people. See their on-line catalog at www.mikes-afordable.com
>
>The receiver needs a mouth 1-3/4" to 2" in diameter. This could be a
>baby food jar or similar. It could also be a section of chromed drain
>pipe from under the bathroom sink. Or kitchen sink. (But don't get
>caught!) The tricky bit here is to close the open end of the pipe,
>which you can do by spinning or by hammering or whatever. If you
>chose to hammer the end closed you'll have to anneal the brass pipe
>several times during the process so keep in mind that quenching non-
>ferrous metals SOFTENS the metal, whereas quenching ferrous metals
>hardens them. To anneal your brass pipe simply raise it to a red heat
>then swirl it around in a bucket of water. That makes it good to go
>for another round of hammering.
>
>Once you've hammered or spun the brass pipe to a single point, you may
>seal it with a dot of hard solder.
>
>Whatever you settle upon as your receiver, the next step is to find an
>O-ring that matches its diameter. This is pretty easy since most real
>auto-parts stores (as opposed to un-real, chain-store type FLAPS) will
>have TRAYS of O-rings in every size imaginable. Simply find one that
>fits.
>
>The body of your Gascolator needs to be about 3/4" thick (ie, 19mm).
>You need that much depth because the body will receive several
>fittings that use NPT -- pipe threads. (I'm assuming you have
>suitable pipe-thread reamers and taps.)
>
>Although NPT is pretty strong you do NOT want to depend upon a pipe-
>threaded fitting to SUPPORT the Gascolator, which will be mounted on
>your firewall -- and which must be the LOWEST point in your fuel
>system. (Why lowest? So that the water will go there.)
>
>A circular groove is cut into the Gascolator body to accept the O-
>ring. The receiver then presses against the O-ring with sufficient
>pressure to form a gasoline-tight seal. The pressure comes from a
>simple screw affair and a pair of straps that connect to the body of
>the Gascolator then pass under the receiver. At the point where the
>straps pass under the receiver you must fabricate a plate or other
>fixture that is threaded 1/4-20, the bolt provided with some means of
>safety-wiring. The head of the bolt is usually fitted with a cross-
>bar or wheel to make it easy to unscrew by hand.
>
>On the body of the Gascolator you must provide for one inlet (ie, from
>the fuel tank) and two outlets. One of the outlets is to the carb and
>is fitted with a sintered bronze muffler from a pneumatic-tool. The
>other outlet goes to the primer. All of the drillings in the body of
>the Gascolator are 3/16" or larger in diameter and are tapped 1/8"
>NPT.
>
>You must also provide some means of attaching and supporting the
>Gascolator to the firewall.
>
>The body of the Gascolator may be made from a billet of aluminum or
>frm a casting..
>
>I will post an illustrated version of this message to my blog as soon
>as I am able to do so.

Actually, the tank was located behind the dash on the model A, The
model T tank was under the front seat. That is why you had to back up
a hill since the drop wasn't sufficient to gravity feed the carb. on a
hill.

[Anthony W]

Old rototillers and garden tractors used to have these too. I'm not
sure where you'd find one of them these days...

Tony

[[email protected]]

..
>
> So a gascolator is simply a water separator, OK?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

More or less, yes.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> I thought it a lot more complicated -
> an easy way to get lost in explanations.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It IS a lot more complicated. The body of the Gascolator provides a
place to attach various fuel lines. On a simple airplane -- one
lacking even a fuel pump -- the Gascolator offers more convenience
than other methods..

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -) why does one want a water separator apart from the fuel filter?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I give up. Why?
In fact, most Gascolators DO provide for fuel filtering as well as
water separation.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

> In my house's heating, there's a filter cartridge in a glass bowl,
> and when I ran the tank dry it sure filled up with water (and smudge).
> Isn't it sufficient to mount the fuel filter at the lowest point,
> and have a water drain valve on its bottom?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes, a water drain at the lowest point should prevent water from
reaching the burner. But I am not familiar with the oil burners used
by many Americans. Based on your description I suspect there is an
auxiliary circuit open to the atmosphere that is only allowed to drain
when the main tank is completely empty, but that is only a guess.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

> -) is there a finer fuel filter in the Ford A & T, or only the
> strainer in the tank?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

No; not as a stock item. As I recall, the strainer fits down inside
the filler neck and there were a number of after-market filters that
offered a finer mesh than the stock filter.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Do you recommend a finer filter, either
> between tank and gascolator or between gascolator and carb?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That's two questions :-)

The Gascolator has a finer filter than the one in the filler neck.
You should not need any additional filtering.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -) why the "sintered bronze muffler" on the exit?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Because the 'exit' of the Gascolator is the inlet to the carburetor.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> actually, what is a "sintered bronze muffler"?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A muffler -- the types vary -- is standard equipment for pneumatically-
powered tools, which have an extremely high noise signature. Sintered
bronze mufflers do not corrode nor 'pack-up' like some other types of
mufflers.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Does it serve as a filter, perhaps?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

See the above.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -) for the receiver body, I should like clear plastic:
> less delicate than glass, but unlike metal, it shows what's happening.
> There must surely be clear plastics that resist gasoline?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm sure there is but the goal here is to describe a Gascolator that
can be fabricated by the typical homebuilder. As for showing what's
happening, it would ALWAYS show full; there would be nothing to see.
As for plastic vs glass or metal, my personal preference -- and that
of many other homebuilders -- is to keep keep the amount of flammable
materials forward of the firewall to an absolute minimum.

-R.S.Hoover

[Tim Ward[_1_]]

> wrote in message
...
> To All:
>
> The Gascolator dates from the days of the Model T Ford. Back in those
> days the fuel tank was located in the cowl, just forward of the
> windscreen -- which was plate glass. The filler was located on the
> cowl. The float-type quantity gauge was located in the instrument
> cluster. The system did not have a pump; it relied on gravity to feed
> fuel to the carburetor. There was a strainer inside of the tank which
> prevented LARGE particles of debris from reaching the carb, whilst the
> Gascolator served to trap any WATER that happened to get into the
> tank. The Gascolator's bowl was made of glass, allowing you to SEE
> any water that may have been trapped. Your job was to loosen the
> clamp securing the glass bowl and empty it, thus ridding the system of
> water.
>
> When I was a kid every junk yard worthy of the name had a windrow of
> early Fords -- T's as well as A's -- which managed to survive the lust
> for scrap iron generated by World War II. These junked Fords provided
> a host of parts for anyone crazy enough to build their own airplane.
> One of those parts was the Gascolator.
>
> Alas, Gascolators have become rather rare birds in today's world.
> Fortunately, they are relatively easy to make.
>
> The first thing you'll need is the receiver; the glass or metal
> 'sediment bowl' through which all of the engine's fuel must pass.
> Back then, it was always glass. Nowadays it's usually metal but
> either one will work. (If you want to stick with Ford parts for some
> reason, give a call to Mike's "A" Ford-able Parts in Maysville,
> Georgia. Good people. See their on-line catalog at
www.mikes-afordable.com
>
> The receiver needs a mouth 1-3/4" to 2" in diameter. This could be a
> baby food jar or similar. It could also be a section of chromed drain
> pipe from under the bathroom sink. Or kitchen sink. (But don't get
> caught!) The tricky bit here is to close the open end of the pipe,
> which you can do by spinning or by hammering or whatever. If you
> chose to hammer the end closed you'll have to anneal the brass pipe
> several times during the process so keep in mind that quenching non-
> ferrous metals SOFTENS the metal, whereas quenching ferrous metals
> hardens them. To anneal your brass pipe simply raise it to a red heat
> then swirl it around in a bucket of water. That makes it good to go
> for another round of hammering.
>
> Once you've hammered or spun the brass pipe to a single point, you may
> seal it with a dot of hard solder.
>
> Whatever you settle upon as your receiver, the next step is to find an
> O-ring that matches its diameter. This is pretty easy since most real
> auto-parts stores (as opposed to un-real, chain-store type FLAPS) will
> have TRAYS of O-rings in every size imaginable. Simply find one that
> fits.
>
> The body of your Gascolator needs to be about 3/4" thick (ie, 19mm).
> You need that much depth because the body will receive several
> fittings that use NPT -- pipe threads. (I'm assuming you have
> suitable pipe-thread reamers and taps.)
>
> Although NPT is pretty strong you do NOT want to depend upon a pipe-
> threaded fitting to SUPPORT the Gascolator, which will be mounted on
> your firewall -- and which must be the LOWEST point in your fuel
> system. (Why lowest? So that the water will go there.)
>
> A circular groove is cut into the Gascolator body to accept the O-
> ring. The receiver then presses against the O-ring with sufficient
> pressure to form a gasoline-tight seal. The pressure comes from a
> simple screw affair and a pair of straps that connect to the body of
> the Gascolator then pass under the receiver. At the point where the
> straps pass under the receiver you must fabricate a plate or other
> fixture that is threaded 1/4-20, the bolt provided with some means of
> safety-wiring. The head of the bolt is usually fitted with a cross-
> bar or wheel to make it easy to unscrew by hand.
>
> On the body of the Gascolator you must provide for one inlet (ie, from
> the fuel tank) and two outlets. One of the outlets is to the carb and
> is fitted with a sintered bronze muffler from a pneumatic-tool. The
> other outlet goes to the primer. All of the drillings in the body of
> the Gascolator are 3/16" or larger in diameter and are tapped 1/8"
> NPT.
>
> You must also provide some means of attaching and supporting the
> Gascolator to the firewall.
>
> The body of the Gascolator may be made from a billet of aluminum or
> frm a casting..
>
> I will post an illustrated version of this message to my blog as soon
> as I am able to do so.

There is a thingummy available from Briggs and Stratton called a "glass bowl
cutoff".
It sits directly under the fuel tank, and has a glass sediment bowl of
approximately the size you describe. It has one input, one output, and a
shutoff valve on... I think it's the input.

The glass bowl cutoff, the replacement glass bowls, and a picture of both of
them can be seen at:
http://www.briggs.learnsmallenginerepair.com/BScarbkits.htm
The assembly is $10.75, the glass bowl replacement is $5.75.

On the one on my rototiller, the glass bowl is about 1 1/2" in diameter, and
the gasket, instead of an O-ring, is flat, and molded onto fine brass
screen.
The lip on the glass bowl is flat enough that using an O-ring instead
shouldn't be a problem, though.

Tim Ward

[[email protected]]

On Nov 16, 5:07*pm, "Tim Ward" > wrote:
> > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
> > To All:
Dear Tim,
This sounds like the sediment/strainer I got from Northern Hydraulic
and tested for maximum flow rate. It was a little bit shy.
-Bob Hoover
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

> There is a thingummy available from Briggs and Stratton called a "glass bowl
> cu toff".
> It sits directly under the fuel tank, and has a glass sediment bowl of
> approximately the size you describe. *It has one input, one output, and a
> shutoff valve on... I think it's the input.
>
> The glass bowl cutoff, the replacement glass bowls, and a picture of both of
> them can be seen at:http://www.briggs.learnsmallenginerepair.com/BScarbkits.htm
> The assembly is $10.75, the glass bowl replacement is $5.75.
>
> On the one on my rototiller, the glass bowl is about 1 1/2" in diameter, and
> the gasket, instead of an O-ring, is flat, and molded onto fine brass
> screen.
> The lip on the glass bowl is flat enough that using an O-ring instead
> shouldn't be a problem, though.
>
> Tim Ward

[Morgans[_2_]]

> wrote

Dear Tim,
This sounds like the sediment/strainer I got from Northern Hydraulic
and tested for maximum flow rate. It was a little bit shy.

I would think so. <g>

I have a 1942 Gibson tractor that has a (book rated) 9 HP Wisconsin engine,
and it has one like that. Not enough for a VW engine, I would not think.

The reason I said it was book rated at 9 HP, was because it has a 3 inch
piston, with a 3 1/4" stroke.

What a striker. I love that engine. A modern one with that displacement in
the typical over square configuration is rated at around 20 HP, I think. I
would be very surprised if a modern would come close to working as hard, for
pushing dirt and pulling stuff, as that tractor.

I gotta get that thing back in good running condition. I have a sneaking
feeling that we might get some snow, this year.
--
Jim in NC

[Anthony W]

Tim Ward wrote:

> There is a thingummy available from Briggs and Stratton called a "glass bowl
> cutoff".
> It sits directly under the fuel tank, and has a glass sediment bowl of
> approximately the size you describe. It has one input, one output, and a
> shutoff valve on... I think it's the input.
>
> The glass bowl cutoff, the replacement glass bowls, and a picture of both of
> them can be seen at:
> http://www.briggs.learnsmallenginerepair.com/BScarbkits.htm
> The assembly is $10.75, the glass bowl replacement is $5.75.

Wouldn't it be easier to drill out one of these for better flow rather
than making one from scratch?

Tony

[Ernest Christley]

Anthony W wrote:
> Tim Ward wrote:
>> http://www.briggs.learnsmallenginerepair.com/BScarbkits.htm
>> The assembly is $10.75, the glass bowl replacement is $5.75.
>
> Wouldn't it be easier to drill out one of these for better flow rather
> than making one from scratch?
>
> Tony

It'll cost ya' $11 to find out.

[Morgans[_2_]]

"Morgans" < wrote

> What a striker. I love that engine.

*****************************
Damn. Sometimes I hate spell checker. I thought I told it to leave that
word alone.

"Striker" was supposed to read "stroker." What a stroker. It can really
chug away in the lower RPM's.

Oh, it also has an impulse Fairbanks-Morse magneto. It will crank on the
first or second pull, every time.
--
Jim in NC

[[email protected]]

> Tim Ward wrote:
> > There is a thingummy available from Briggs and Stratton called a "glass bowl
> > cutoff".
> > It sits directly under the fuel tank, and has a glass sediment bowl of
> > approximately the size you describe. *It has one input, one output, and a
> > shutoff valve on... I think it's the input.
>
> > The glass bowl cutoff, the replacement glass bowls, and a picture of both of
> > them can be seen at:
> >http://www.briggs.learnsmallenginerepair.com/BScarbkits.htm
> > The assembly is $10.75, the glass bowl replacement is $5.75.
>
> Wouldn't it be easier to drill out one of these for better flow rather
> than making one from scratch?
>----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

YES! The one in the photo is larger than the one I tested. On the
one I had the bowl came to more of a point and the doohicky holding it
on was made up of four wires and a screw rather than the straps as
shown in the picture.
-Bob

[[email protected]]

On Nov 16, 6:36*pm, Anthony W > wrote:

> Wouldn't it be easier to drill out one of these for better flow rather
> than making one from scratch?
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear Tony,

Probably so, but I believe we still need to include such things in the
archive of drawings. Some people don't have access to the retailers
as we have here in the States and there's always the possibility that
WE may not be able to buy such things in the future.

-Bob

[[email protected]]

On Nov 16, 1:27*pm, Ed > wrote:

> Actually, the tank was located behind the dash on the model A, The
> model T tank was under the front seat. That is why you had to back up
> a hill since the drop wasn't sufficient to gravity feed the carb. on a
> hill.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear Ed,

Yes, you are correct. My recollection data-base is seventy years
old. If someone had asked me relative to where we lived (West Avenue
= farm = Model T, vs C Street = house = Model A) I would have aced the
test :-)
-Bob

[Ed]

On Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:45:28 -0800 (PST), "
> wrote:

>On Nov 16, 1:27*pm, Ed > wrote:
>
>> Actually, the tank was located behind the dash on the model A, The
>> model T tank was under the front seat. That is why you had to back up
>> a hill since the drop wasn't sufficient to gravity feed the carb. on a
>> hill.
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Dear Ed,
>
>Yes, you are correct. My recollection data-base is seventy years
>old. If someone had asked me relative to where we lived (West Avenue
>= farm = Model T, vs C Street = house = Model A) I would have aced the
>test :-)
>-Bob
Actually I checked it out since my brain is old. I had a 1921 model,
but I found that they moved the tank under the dash in 1926 and 27.

[Anthony W]

wrote:
> On Nov 16, 6:36 pm, Anthony W > wrote:
>
>> Wouldn't it be easier to drill out one of these for better flow rather
>> than making one from scratch?
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Dear Tony,
>
> Probably so, but I believe we still need to include such things in the
> archive of drawings. Some people don't have access to the retailers
> as we have here in the States and there's always the possibility that
> WE may not be able to buy such things in the future.
>
> -Bob

True, I didn't know these things still existed at all.

Tony

[Copperhead]

On Nov 16, 11:32*pm, " > wrote:
> On Nov 16, 6:36*pm, Anthony W > wrote:
>
> > Wouldn't it be easier to drill out one of these for better flow rather
> > than making one from scratch?
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------*-----------------
>
> Dear Tony,
>
> Probably so, but I believe we still need to include such things in the
> archive of drawings. *Some people don't have access to the retailers
> as we have here in the States and there's always the possibility that
> WE may not be able to buy such things in the future.
>
> -Bob

All right! Finally a topic I have extensive first hand experience with
instead of my usual neophyte airplane builder syndrome, i.e. just
plain ignorant! One of the best sources of a gascolator is found on
the sides of used farm tractors from the 1980’s marketed by Ford but
built in Japan. Mine is a 1310 20 HP diesel engine model but other
models are extensively available in a variety of sizes and HP. Yes,
most other tractor’s have them to. What you have is a small gravity
fed fuel collector bowl in front of the fuel injectors with an equally
small internal filter in place. The fuel bowl is generally plastic but
a simple home made adapter will allow you to put a variety of small
mouthed bottles on it. Even better is these assemblies are available
in either used or new configurations, or as Bob H. would say how good
of a scrounger you are.

[[email protected]]

On Nov 16, 10:32 pm, " > wrote:
> On Nov 16, 6:36 pm, Anthony W > wrote:
>
> > Wouldn't it be easier to drill out one of these for better flow rather
> > than making one from scratch?
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Dear Tony,
>
> Probably so, but I believe we still need to include such things in the
> archive of drawings. Some people don't have access to the retailers
> as we have here in the States and there's always the possibility that
> WE may not be able to buy such things in the future.
>
> -Bob

Oh, Man. That problem--the disappearance of many components--is
an increasing pain already. I went to the local Radio Shack last week
to buy a couple of 9-volt battery terminal clips and they didn't have
any and the catalog showed them as discontinued. Can you feature that?
And the big electronics shop in the city doesn't have roller-lever
microswitches or a decent selection of potentiometers or even a DPDT
spring-center-off toggle switch. Nor dop they have the employees who
know anything about some of this stuff. It seems that 99.9% of people
are buying everything instead of building it, and either contracting
out the repair of it or tossing it and buying a new one. Sad. And
that's why so many of our young folks have no idea what's under the
hood of a car or the cowl of an airplane, or even inside a simple
switch or lawnmower engine.

Dan

[[email protected]]

On Mon, 17 Nov 2008 08:36:50 -0800 (PST), Copperhead
> wrote:

>On Nov 16, 11:32Â*pm, " > wrote:
>> On Nov 16, 6:36Â*pm, Anthony W > wrote:
>>
>> > Wouldn't it be easier to drill out one of these for better flow rather
>> > than making one from scratch?
>> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------Â*-----------------
>>
>> Dear Tony,
>>
>> Probably so, but I believe we still need to include such things in the
>> archive of drawings. Â*Some people don't have access to the retailers
>> as we have here in the States and there's always the possibility that
>> WE may not be able to buy such things in the future.
>>
>> -Bob
>
>All right! Finally a topic I have extensive first hand experience with
>instead of my usual neophyte airplane builder syndrome, i.e. just
>plain ignorant! One of the best sources of a gascolator is found on
>the sides of used farm tractors from the 1980’s marketed by Ford but
>built in Japan. Mine is a 1310 20 HP diesel engine model but other
>models are extensively available in a variety of sizes and HP. Yes,
>most other tractor’s have them to. What you have is a small gravity
>fed fuel collector bowl in front of the fuel injectors with an equally
>small internal filter in place. The fuel bowl is generally plastic but
>a simple home made adapter will allow you to put a variety of small
>mouthed bottles on it. Even better is these assemblies are available
>in either used or new configurations, or as Bob H. would say how good
>of a scrounger you are.


Tractor "sediment bowls" are available at TSC for about $55 Canadian.

They have glass bouls thugh, and in Canada you will not get the OK on
a homebuilt / experimental with a glass bowl.

[[email protected]]

On Nov 17, 3:27 pm, wrote:
> Tractor "sediment bowls" are available at TSC for about $55 Canadian.
>
> They have glass bouls thugh, and in Canada you will not get the OK on
> a homebuilt / experimental with a glass bowl.

Didn't know that. Got a glass one on my Jodel, but it was
licensed in the '70s. It's a thickwalled (1/4" or 5/16" thick) glass
tube, actually, with cast aluminum or zinc top and bottom pieces. Not
likely to break unless I drop it on the concrete at annual time.
I think, since we have a lathe and mill here, I'll just buy a
chunk of 2" 6061T6 aluminum round bar and machine my own for the
Hummelbird. 2011T3 would be better if I could find it.

Dan

[[email protected]]

On Mon, 17 Nov 2008 15:54:52 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

>On Nov 17, 3:27 pm, wrote:
>> Tractor "sediment bowls" are available at TSC for about $55 Canadian.
>>
>> They have glass bouls thugh, and in Canada you will not get the OK on
>> a homebuilt / experimental with a glass bowl.
>
> Didn't know that. Got a glass one on my Jodel, but it was
>licensed in the '70s. It's a thickwalled (1/4" or 5/16" thick) glass
>tube, actually, with cast aluminum or zinc top and bottom pieces. Not
>likely to break unless I drop it on the concrete at annual time.
> I think, since we have a lathe and mill here, I'll just buy a
>chunk of 2" 6061T6 aluminum round bar and machine my own for the
>Hummelbird. 2011T3 would be better if I could find it.
>
> Dan
>
Thinkong of doing the same for mine.

[Highflyer]

> wrote in message
...
> On Nov 17, 3:27 pm, wrote:
>> Tractor "sediment bowls" are available at TSC for about $55 Canadian.
>>
>> They have glass bouls thugh, and in Canada you will not get the OK on
>> a homebuilt / experimental with a glass bowl.
>
> Didn't know that. Got a glass one on my Jodel, but it was
> licensed in the '70s. It's a thickwalled (1/4" or 5/16" thick) glass
> tube, actually, with cast aluminum or zinc top and bottom pieces. Not
> likely to break unless I drop it on the concrete at annual time.
> I think, since we have a lathe and mill here, I'll just buy a
> chunk of 2" 6061T6 aluminum round bar and machine my own for the
> Hummelbird. 2011T3 would be better if I could find it.
>
> Dan
>
>

I am working on a 1962 Cessna 150 for a customer. It has a glass
bowl gascolator. Gravity feed system. O-200, similiar fuel flow to
a vee dub! The "bowl" is a length of heavy wall glass tubing cut and
flame polished on both ends. Cast housing at the top, and a cast plate on
the bottom. Both seal with flat gaskets. Cylindrical screen
down the center. Input connection, Primer connection, and output
connection to the carb.

Highflyer
Highflight Aviation Services
Pinckneyville Airport ( PJY )

[Highflyer]

> wrote in message

<snip>
> Oh, Man. That problem--the disappearance of many components--is
> an increasing pain already. I went to the local Radio Shack last week
> to buy a couple of 9-volt battery terminal clips and they didn't have
> any and the catalog showed them as discontinued. Can you feature that?
> And the big electronics shop in the city doesn't have roller-lever
> microswitches or a decent selection of potentiometers or even a DPDT
> spring-center-off toggle switch. Nor dop they have the employees who
> know anything about some of this stuff. It seems that 99.9% of people
> are buying everything instead of building it, and either contracting
> out the repair of it or tossing it and buying a new one. Sad. And
> that's why so many of our young folks have no idea what's under the
> hood of a car or the cowl of an airplane, or even inside a simple
> switch or lawnmower engine.
>
> Dan

Try mouser electronics. On line at http://www.mouser.com .

Highflyer
Highflight Aviation Services
Pinckneyville Airport ( PJY )

[news.motzarella.org]

Hmmm, I guess a gascolator is a fancy name for a sediment bowl. My 1955 John
Deere had a sediment bowl. If I had called it a gascolator I would have been
laughed out of the county.
> wrote in message
...
> .
>>
>> So a gascolator is simply a water separator, OK?
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> More or less, yes.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> I thought it a lot more complicated -
>> an easy way to get lost in explanations.
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> It IS a lot more complicated. The body of the Gascolator provides a
> place to attach various fuel lines. On a simple airplane -- one
> lacking even a fuel pump -- the Gascolator offers more convenience
> than other methods..
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> -) why does one want a water separator apart from the fuel filter?
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I give up. Why?
> In fact, most Gascolators DO provide for fuel filtering as well as
> water separation.
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>> In my house's heating, there's a filter cartridge in a glass bowl,
>> and when I ran the tank dry it sure filled up with water (and smudge).
>> Isn't it sufficient to mount the fuel filter at the lowest point,
>> and have a water drain valve on its bottom?
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Yes, a water drain at the lowest point should prevent water from
> reaching the burner. But I am not familiar with the oil burners used
> by many Americans. Based on your description I suspect there is an
> auxiliary circuit open to the atmosphere that is only allowed to drain
> when the main tank is completely empty, but that is only a guess.
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>> -) is there a finer fuel filter in the Ford A & T, or only the
>> strainer in the tank?
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> No; not as a stock item. As I recall, the strainer fits down inside
> the filler neck and there were a number of after-market filters that
> offered a finer mesh than the stock filter.
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>> Do you recommend a finer filter, either
>> between tank and gascolator or between gascolator and carb?
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> That's two questions :-)
>
> The Gascolator has a finer filter than the one in the filler neck.
> You should not need any additional filtering.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> -) why the "sintered bronze muffler" on the exit?
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Because the 'exit' of the Gascolator is the inlet to the carburetor.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> actually, what is a "sintered bronze muffler"?
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> A muffler -- the types vary -- is standard equipment for pneumatically-
> powered tools, which have an extremely high noise signature. Sintered
> bronze mufflers do not corrode nor 'pack-up' like some other types of
> mufflers.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Does it serve as a filter, perhaps?
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> See the above.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> -) for the receiver body, I should like clear plastic:
>> less delicate than glass, but unlike metal, it shows what's happening.
>> There must surely be clear plastics that resist gasoline?
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I'm sure there is but the goal here is to describe a Gascolator that
> can be fabricated by the typical homebuilder. As for showing what's
> happening, it would ALWAYS show full; there would be nothing to see.
> As for plastic vs glass or metal, my personal preference -- and that
> of many other homebuilders -- is to keep keep the amount of flammable
> materials forward of the firewall to an absolute minimum.
>
> -R.S.Hoover