Re: Didn't know that....

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

wrote in :

> On Sat, 17 Jan 2009 15:54:23 -0500, "Scott M. Kozel"
> > wrote:
>
wrote:
>>>
>>> "Scott M. Kozel" > wrote:
>>>
>>>> what the ditching button does ... it may just send
>>>> signals to the cabin crew to prepare for ditching. Or it may be to
>>>> shut off all electrical power immediately before entering the
>>>> water.
>>>
>>> What does the DITCHING pb do? PHB 10.5.4
>>> The DITCHING pb on the pressurization panel, when selected ON,
>>> allows the pilot to close all exterior openings below the flotation
>>> line. This will enhance flotation of the aircraft in case of
>>> ditching. System sends a close signal to:
>>> • Outflow valve (if not in manual control)
>>> • Emergency ram air inlet
>>> • Avionics ventilation inlet and extraction valves
>>> • Pack flow control valves
>>> • Forward cargo isolation outlet valve (if installed)
>>
>>Is this also "According to CNN"?
>
> Nope. Found it somewhere else on the internet.
>
>>Sounds like the news media is clueless as usual about aviation
>>matters...
>
> So, the above is completely nonsens? The button doesn't exist?
> Those inlets can't be closed for ditching?

Actually they can in most arplanes. The 'bus has one that will do the
whole lot in one go, though. Some old Brit airplanes had the same thing.
you know,in case "Gerry snuck up on us over la Manch after a jolly good
thrashing of Dresden"



Bertie

Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

wrote in :

> On Sun, 18 Jan 2009 21:49:45 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip
> > wrote:
>
>
>>Actually they can in most arplanes. The 'bus has one that will do the
>>whole lot in one go, though. Some old Brit airplanes had the same
>>thing. you know,in case "Gerry snuck up on us over la Manch after a
>>jolly good thrashing of Dresden"
>
> Thank you for your answer.
> There is only one thing: The ditch switch on flight 1549 was not
> activated as reported by the NTSB interview.


You don' tknow that.


The crew didn't have time


You don' tknow that either.

> to flick the switch. So, Captain C.B. Sullenberger III is after all
> just a human being. The plane floated anyway. For a while at least.




Good grief


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

wrote in :

> On Sun, 18 Jan 2009 23:07:42 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip
> > wrote:
>
>
>>You don' tknow that.
>>
>>
>> The crew didn't have time
>>
>>
>>You don' tknow that either.
>
> No, I wasn't there indeed.
> I'm quoting National Transportation Safety Board member Kitty Higgins.



> Higgins gave a detailed summary of Sullenberger's testimony to the
> investigation team on Saturday and Sunday. She also recounted the
> NTSB's interview with the plane's first officer, Jeff Skiles, and
> three flight attendants.
>
> Their account illustrated how quickly things deteriorated during the
> flight, and laid out the split-second command decisions that
> ultimately ensured that everyone aboard the plane survived.
>
> "It happened so fast, the pilots never had time to throw the
> aircraft's "ditch switch," which seals off vents and holes in the
> fuselage to make it more seaworthy. "


She wasn't there either...

in any case she's talking ****. It was a low priority in any case.


Bertie

[ah]

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
> wrote in :
>
>> On Sun, 18 Jan 2009 21:49:45 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip
>> > wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Actually they can in most arplanes. The 'bus has one that will do the
>>>whole lot in one go, though. Some old Brit airplanes had the same
>>>thing. you know,in case "Gerry snuck up on us over la Manch after a
>>>jolly good thrashing of Dresden"
>>
>> Thank you for your answer.
>> There is only one thing: The ditch switch on flight 1549 was not
>> activated as reported by the NTSB interview.
>
>
> You don' tknow that.
>
>
> The crew didn't have time
>
>
> You don' tknow that either.
>
>> to flick the switch. So, Captain C.B. Sullenberger III is after all
>> just a human being. The plane floated anyway. For a while at least.

What about the in-flight tea reserves?
--
ah

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> wrote in :
>
>
> She wasn't there either...
>
> in any case she's talking ****. It was a low priority in any case.
>
>
> Bertie
>

Like you had a clue.

[George]

On Jan 18, 5:49*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:

> > "It happened so fast, the pilots never had time to throw the
> > aircraft's "ditch switch," which seals off vents and holes in the
> > fuselage to make it more seaworthy. "
>
> She wasn't there either...
>
> in any case she's talking sh**. It was a low priority in any case.
>
> Bertie

If she was quoting what the Capt. testified to "we didn't throw the
ditch switch" (or similar) how would this be "talking sh**?

Why is the ditch switch a low priority? Is it operable after the plane
has hit water & is (temporarily) floating?

[[email protected]]

On Jan 20, 2:12*am, George > wrote:
> On Jan 18, 5:49*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>
> > > "It happened so fast, the pilots never had time to throw the
> > > aircraft's "ditch switch," which seals off vents and holes in the
> > > fuselage to make it more seaworthy. "
>
> > She wasn't there either...
>
> > in any case she's talking sh**. It was a low priority in any case.
>
> > Bertie
>
> If she was quoting what the Capt. testified to "we didn't throw the
> ditch switch" (or similar) how would this be "talking sh**?
>
> Why is the ditch switch a low priority? Is it operable after the plane
> has hit water & is (temporarily) floating?

Low priority compared to flying the plane, deadstick, in a congested
urban environment.

Or would you rather he spend time looking for a button on the panel?

Geez people, if you don't fly the plane or if you allow yourself to
become distracted over minutae you will die. Don't you get it?
"Examination of the wreckage of ill fated flight 1549 along with
playback from the CVR showed the air crew to have been unduly
concerned with the 'ditch switch'". Would that make everyone
happier? Perhaps with the stall warning sounding in the background
along with the final 'oh ****' from pilot?

How about this, while attempting to steer around a sudden obstruction/
incident on the highway why don't you call 911?

This kind of faulty thinking is why people shouldn't be allowed to
have distractions, aka radios, cellphones or talking pax in their
automobiles.

[Flydive]

wrote:

>
> Low priority compared to flying the plane, deadstick, in a congested
> urban environment.
>
> Or would you rather he spend time looking for a button on the panel?
>

Well it takes 3 seconds to flip the switch, you should know where is
located.

one pilot is flying the aircraft, the other one is assisting and going
through the checklist.

[[email protected]]

On Jan 20, 10:11*am, Flydive > wrote:
> wrote:
>
> > Low priority compared to flying the plane, deadstick, in a congested
> > urban environment.
>
> > Or would you rather he spend time looking for a button on the panel?
>
> Well it takes 3 seconds to flip the switch, you should know where is
> located.
>
> one pilot is flying the aircraft, the other one is assisting and going
> through the checklist.

Yep.

Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?

One may assume that since it was not flipped it was not at the top of
the list and thus was of a lower priority. Flying the airplane and
only those steps necessary to (1) avoid obstacles while (2) setting up
for landing are of high(est) priority.

While correcting for a skid on an icy road you should not be
attempting to change radio stations or answering a cellphone. I would
imagine that checking to be certain the fasten seatbelt sign was lit
was likewise at the bottom of the list.

Really folks have any of you ever been in an emergency situation?
It's amazing how much focus you get on priorities. Flying followed by
landing is priority one and from <3000' in the middle of NYC with no
engines you'd best be flying. First things first.

With engines out, no APU and probably given the timeframe no RAM the
ditch switch may not have done anything.

Reading many of the posts here I'm concerned about my safety on the
highway; far too many people have their priorities out of whack with
flying, can it be any better in a car?

[Flydive]

wrote:
> On Jan 20, 10:11 am, Flydive > wrote:
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Low priority compared to flying the plane, deadstick, in a congested
>>> urban environment.
>>> Or would you rather he spend time looking for a button on the panel?
>> Well it takes 3 seconds to flip the switch, you should know where is
>> located.
>>
>> one pilot is flying the aircraft, the other one is assisting and going
>> through the checklist.
>
> Yep.
>
> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>
> One may assume that since it was not flipped it was not at the top of
> the list and thus was of a lower priority. Flying the airplane and
> only those steps necessary to (1) avoid obstacles while (2) setting up
> for landing are of high(est) priority.

The ditch switch is at the top of the ditching checklist and usually is
a memory item, if you are going to ditch I would say is a priority item.

Airliners have 2 pilots and usually only one of them is handling the
controls, the other one takes care of the emergency and assists the
flying pilot. You say setting up for landing, well if you are "landing"
in water the water, prepare the aircraft for ditching is part of it, a
priority.


>
> While correcting for a skid on an icy road you should not be
> attempting to change radio stations or answering a cellphone. I would
> imagine that checking to be certain the fasten seatbelt sign was lit
> was likewise at the bottom of the list.

Changing radio stations or answering the phone is not part of the
driving, the ditching checklist, flipping the switch is part of the
procedure of landing in the water. The fasten seat belt was probably
already on in this situation.

>
> Really folks have any of you ever been in an emergency situation?
> It's amazing how much focus you get on priorities. Flying followed by
> landing is priority one and from <3000' in the middle of NYC with no
> engines you'd best be flying. First things first.

Never had a bad emergency yet and hope never will, but I train a lot for
it, and the main part of it is follow the procedures for the emergency
and in particular the memory items.

>
> With engines out, no APU and probably given the timeframe no RAM the
> ditch switch may not have done anything.

Do not know if the APU was on or not.
The ditch switch would have had the time and the power to do his job.

> Reading many of the posts here I'm concerned about my safety on the
> highway; far too many people have their priorities out of whack with
> flying, can it be any better in a car?

Well, if anytime you have something out of the ordinary while driving
you get tunnel vision hang on the steering wheel and forget all about
all the surroundings and the way to operate safely your car you are
quite dangerous too

[[email protected]]

On Jan 20, 3:51*pm, wrote:
> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST), wrote:
> >Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>
> The manual states:
>
> At 2000 ft
>
> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE MINUTE"
> Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.
>
> Poster

However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which takes
precedence? Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight emergency.
Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise altitude
or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of events. As a
PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on landing the
aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.

That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone seems
to miss.

I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show them to
have maintained situational awareness with the concomitant priority
management.

[Flydive]

wrote:
> On Jan 20, 3:51 pm, wrote:
>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST), wrote:
>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>> The manual states:
>>
>> At 2000 ft
>>
>> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
>> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
>> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
>> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE MINUTE"
>> Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.
>>
>> Poster
>
> However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which takes
> precedence? Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight emergency.
> Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise altitude
> or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of events. As a
> PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on landing the
> aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.
>
> That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
> fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone seems
> to miss.
>
> I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show them to
> have maintained situational awareness with the concomitant priority
> management.
>

Again, there are 2 pilots in the cockpit, only one is steering the aircraft.
If the captain was flying the aircraft, what was the copilot doing in
those 7-8 minutes if he was not going through the emergency checklist?
What the use of a perfect water landing if then the aircraft quickly
fill with water because the ditching checklist has not been done?

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in news:ex7dl.165906$2w3.143091
@newsfe19.iad:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> wrote in :
>>
>>
>> She wasn't there either...
>>
>> in any case she's talking ****. It was a low priority in any case.
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>>
>
> Like you had a clue.
>

Snort!


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

George > wrote in news:a6ee548c-99b4-4bf2-bda0-
:

> On Jan 18, 5:49*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>
>> > "It happened so fast, the pilots never had time to throw the
>> > aircraft's "ditch switch," which seals off vents and holes in the
>> > fuselage to make it more seaworthy. "
>>
>> She wasn't there either...
>>
>> in any case she's talking sh**. It was a low priority in any case.
>>
>> Bertie
>
> If she was quoting what the Capt. testified to "we didn't throw the
> ditch switch" (or similar) how would this be "talking sh**?

Because it just wasn't all that important. he might have said it , but to
attach any importance to it is crap. Presuming she was quoting him
accurately, the fact she thougth it important enough to repeat deomnstrates
that she has no idea.



>
> Why is the ditch switch a low priority? Is it operable after the plane
> has hit water & is (temporarily) floating?
>

If it has electrics, yes, but It's only going to slow things a tiny bit in
any case. There's a lot of holes in an airplane and it only closes a few of
the holes in the belly.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

Flydive > wrote in :

> wrote:
>
>>
>> Low priority compared to flying the plane, deadstick, in a congested
>> urban environment.
>>
>> Or would you rather he spend time looking for a button on the panel?
>>
>
> Well it takes 3 seconds to flip the switch, you should know where is
> located.
>
> one pilot is flying the aircraft, the other one is assisting and going
> through the checklist.
>



Yep, and the checklists can lead you into a workd of trouble. There wasn't
time. In this case, a relight checklist was really all they should have
been interested in.



Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

Flydive > wrote in :

> wrote:
>> On Jan 20, 10:11 am, Flydive > wrote:
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Low priority compared to flying the plane, deadstick, in a
congested
>>>> urban environment.
>>>> Or would you rather he spend time looking for a button on the
panel?
>>> Well it takes 3 seconds to flip the switch, you should know where is
>>> located.
>>>
>>> one pilot is flying the aircraft, the other one is assisting and
going
>>> through the checklist.
>>
>> Yep.
>>
>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>>
>> One may assume that since it was not flipped it was not at the top of
>> the list and thus was of a lower priority. Flying the airplane and
>> only those steps necessary to (1) avoid obstacles while (2) setting
up
>> for landing are of high(est) priority.
>
> The ditch switch is at the top of the ditching checklist and usually
is
> a memory item, if you are going to ditch I would say is a priority
item.


Only if you have time. Ditchig checklists don't have any memory items at
all, and in fact Bus checklists, with most airlines, have very few
memory drills. Lkikely the only memory checks are the engine fire drill
and a pressurisations blowout, and those would have only the initial
itiems on them.

>
> Airliners have 2 pilots and usually only one of them is handling the
> controls, the other one takes care of the emergency and assists the
> flying pilot. You say setting up for landing, well if you are
"landing"

No, you tell him to do what you need him to do in the circumstance. In
this case, the non handler was probably try to relight and telling the
cabin and ATC waht was happening.

> in water the water, prepare the aircraft for ditching is part of it, a
> priority.
>
Nope, not in this case. if they didn;t fly the airplane, the holes in
the bottom of the airplane would have been the least of their problems,
since they would have made significantly larger holes.









Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

wrote in :

> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST), wrote:
>
>
>>Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>
> The manual states:
>
> At 2000 ft
>
> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE MINUTE"
> Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.


Yep, and you have spent ag god couple of minutes diggin out the checklist
and reading it out.
Their rod would have been in the region of 1200 FPM, on average. The
priority woudl be a relight and loing for a place to land. Not reaidng the
checklist.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

wrote in
:

> On Jan 20, 3:51*pm, wrote:
>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST), wrote:
>> >Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>>
>> The manual states:
>>
>> At 2000 ft
>>
>> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
>> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
>> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
>> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE
>> MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.
>>
>> Poster
>
> However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which takes
> precedence? Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight emergency.
> Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise altitude
> or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of events. As a
> PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on landing the
> aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.
>
> That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
> fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone seems
> to miss.

Exactly.
>
> I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show them to
> have maintained situational awareness with the concomitant priority
> management.
>
>
I'd agree, it;'s hard to argue wiht success. Like many accidents of this
sort, these gusy will have rewritten the book.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

Flydive > wrote in :

> wrote:
>> On Jan 20, 3:51 pm, wrote:
>>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
>>> wrote:
>>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>>> The manual states:
>>>
>>> At 2000 ft
>>>
>>> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
>>> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
>>> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
>>> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE
>>> MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.
>>>
>>> Poster
>>
>> However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which takes
>> precedence? Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight emergency.
>> Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise altitude
>> or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of events. As a
>> PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on landing
>> the aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.
>>
>> That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
>> fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone
>> seems to miss.
>>
>> I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show them to
>> have maintained situational awareness with the concomitant priority
>> management.
>>
>
> Again, there are 2 pilots in the cockpit, only one is steering the
> aircraft. If the captain was flying the aircraft, what was the copilot
> doing in those 7-8 minutes if he was not going through the emergency
> checklist? What the use of a perfect water landing if then the
> aircraft quickly fill with water because the ditching checklist has
> not been done?
>

There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining waht the
problem was.
Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure. Immediate
relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to assist in the relight.
as they would have been too slow for a windmill start.
Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav selections for the
captain to look for a runway they could plunk it on.Then back to the
relight drill. We're taught to keep trying that to the bitter end, BTW.
They take a minute or so so he wouldn't have had time for more than one
or two, and that would have been after the APU had fired up, say at
abotu 1200'. A couple of calls to the cabin would have been tossed in
their somewhere as well.
The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist would
have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not have.
And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would have been no
trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions they may or may
not have accomplished in the time they had. But all of them would come
ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching checklist.



Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

ah > wrote in news:4973fef3$0$57681
:

> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>> wrote in news:6thqo1FartetU2
@mid.individual.net:
>>
>>> On Sun, 18 Jan 2009 21:49:45 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Actually they can in most arplanes. The 'bus has one that will do
the
>>>>whole lot in one go, though. Some old Brit airplanes had the same
>>>>thing. you know,in case "Gerry snuck up on us over la Manch after a
>>>>jolly good thrashing of Dresden"
>>>
>>> Thank you for your answer.
>>> There is only one thing: The ditch switch on flight 1549 was not
>>> activated as reported by the NTSB interview.
>>
>>
>> You don' tknow that.
>>
>>
>> The crew didn't have time
>>
>>
>> You don' tknow that either.
>>
>>> to flick the switch. So, Captain C.B. Sullenberger III is after all
>>> just a human being. The plane floated anyway. For a while at least.
>
> What about the in-flight tea reserves?

Well, if you want to get into a nightmare situation..


Bertie

[cavedweller]

On Jan 21, 1:15*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:

>
> Nope, not in this case. if they didn;t fly the airplane, the holes in
> the bottom of the airplane would have been the least of their problems,
> since they would have made significantly larger holes.
>
> Bertie

....at last, the magic words. "Fly the airplane". Good on ya, Bertie.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

ah > wrote in news:4973fef3$0$57681
:

> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>> wrote in :
>>
>>> On Sun, 18 Jan 2009 21:49:45 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Actually they can in most arplanes. The 'bus has one that will do the
>>>>whole lot in one go, though. Some old Brit airplanes had the same
>>>>thing. you know,in case "Gerry snuck up on us over la Manch after a
>>>>jolly good thrashing of Dresden"
>>>
>>> Thank you for your answer.
>>> There is only one thing: The ditch switch on flight 1549 was not
>>> activated as reported by the NTSB interview.
>>
>>
>> You don' tknow that.
>>
>>
>> The crew didn't have time
>>
>>
>> You don' tknow that either.
>>
>>> to flick the switch. So, Captain C.B. Sullenberger III is after all
>>> just a human being. The plane floated anyway. For a while at least.
>
> What about the in-flight tea reserves?

Let's not get into the nightmare scenario


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

cavedweller > wrote in news:6a07dabb-6fb7-4cdb-9057-
:

> On Jan 21, 1:15*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>
>>
>> Nope, not in this case. if they didn;t fly the airplane, the holes in
>> the bottom of the airplane would have been the least of their problems,
>> since they would have made significantly larger holes.
>>
>> Bertie
>
> ...at last, the magic words. "Fly the airplane". Good on ya, Bertie.
>
>

ell, it's obvious, even if you're only flying a hang glider...

Isn't it?

Bertie

[[email protected]]

On Jan 21, 12:18*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> wrote :
>
>
>
> > On Jan 20, 3:51*pm, wrote:
> >> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST), wrote:
> >> >Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>
> >> The manual states:
>
> >> At 2000 ft
>
> >> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
> >> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
> >> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
> >> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE
> >> MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.
>
> >> Poster
>
> > However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which takes
> > precedence? *Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight emergency.
> > Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise altitude
> > or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of events. *As a
> > PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on landing the
> > aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.
>
> > That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
> > fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone seems
> > to miss.
>
> Exactly.
>
> > I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show them to
> > have maintained situational awareness with the concomitant priority
> > management.
>
> I'd agree, it;'s hard to argue wiht success. Like many accidents of this
> sort, these gusy will have rewritten the book.
>
> Bertie

With all my arguments against worrying about the dip, er, 'ditch'
switch I wonder of what benefit it would truly be in any condition
other dead level calm? Ditching at see would (I would think) most
often occur in conditions that would tear up the aircraft sufficiently
to make 'the Switch' totally useless.

In this particular case it appears, from reading an article early on,
that one or more pax may have partially opened a rear door and allowed
water ingress and this, more than anything, contributed to the tail
down sinking.

It all comes down to basic necessities. I've had two high speed
parachute malfunctions and my first reaction was "what do I do to get
a chute open right f'ing now?" I didn't worry until after that
occurred as to wear I would land or what I would have for dinner. You
really have to experience something to realize the difference a 'real'
emergency will make in your focus. Failure to maintain that focus
results in the 'oh ****' moments.

[[email protected]]

On Jan 21, 12:09*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> Flydive > wrote :
>
> > wrote:
>
> >> Low priority compared to flying the plane, deadstick, in a congested
> >> urban environment.
>
> >> Or would you rather he spend time looking for a button on the panel?
>
> > Well it takes 3 seconds to flip the switch, you should know where is
> > located.
>
> > one pilot is flying the aircraft, the other one is assisting and going
> > through the checklist.
>
> Yep, and the checklists can lead you into a workd of trouble. There wasn't
> time. In this case, a relight checklist was really all they should have
> been interested in.
>
> Bertie

I'll bet they had it open to 'foie gras' - goose liver ala Turbine.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

wrote in
:


> With all my arguments against worrying about the dip, er, 'ditch'
> switch I wonder of what benefit it would truly be in any condition
> other dead level calm? Ditching at see would (I would think) most
> often occur in conditions that would tear up the aircraft sufficiently
> to make 'the Switch' totally useless.

Well, experience has certainly proven this to be the case!
>
> In this particular case it appears, from reading an article early on,
> that one or more pax may have partially opened a rear door and allowed
> water ingress and this, more than anything, contributed to the tail
> down sinking.

Yeh, makes sense.
>
> It all comes down to basic necessities. I've had two high speed
> parachute malfunctions and my first reaction was "what do I do to get
> a chute open right f'ing now?" I didn't worry until after that
> occurred as to wear I would land or what I would have for dinner. You
> really have to experience something to realize the difference a 'real'
> emergency will make in your focus. Failure to maintain that focus
> results in the 'oh ****' moments.


Well, exactly, Even in the sim when a mad situation is thrown up where
things are forgotten, such as checklist items, but the performance as whole
was exemplerary, the crew get kudos, not a kicking. It encourages the kind
of thinking that makes situations like this come out as they did.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

wrote in
:

> On Jan 21, 12:09*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>> Flydive > wrote :
>>
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >> Low priority compared to flying the plane, deadstick, in a
>> >> congested urban environment.
>>
>> >> Or would you rather he spend time looking for a button on the
>> >> panel?
>>
>> > Well it takes 3 seconds to flip the switch, you should know where
>> > is located.
>>
>> > one pilot is flying the aircraft, the other one is assisting and
>> > going through the checklist.
>>
>> Yep, and the checklists can lead you into a workd of trouble. There
>> wasn'
> t
>> time. In this case, a relight checklist was really all they should
>> have been interested in.
>>
>> Bertie
>
> I'll bet they had it open to 'foie gras' - goose liver ala Turbine.
>

hehe
Smells like hell when it goes down the core. They prolly didn;'t get to
smell it since it sounds like the engines stopped producing air for the
packs almost immediatly



Bertie

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> cavedweller > wrote in
> news:6a07dabb-6fb7-4cdb-9057-
> :
>
>> On Jan 21, 1:15 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Nope, not in this case. if they didn;t fly the airplane, the holes in
>>> the bottom of the airplane would have been the least of their problems,
>>> since they would have made significantly larger holes.
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>
>> ...at last, the magic words. "Fly the airplane". Good on ya, Bertie.
>>
>>
>
> ell, it's obvious, even if you're only flying a hang glider...
>
> Isn't it?
>
> Bertie

the only thing obvious here is you're a dumb ass wanna be.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> Flydive > wrote in :
>
>> wrote:
>>> On Jan 20, 3:51 pm, wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>>>> The manual states:
>>>>
>>>> At 2000 ft
>>>>
>>>> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
>>>> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
>>>> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
>>>> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE
>>>> MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.
>>>>
>>>> Poster
>>>
>>> However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which takes
>>> precedence? Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight emergency.
>>> Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise altitude
>>> or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of events. As a
>>> PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on landing
>>> the aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.
>>>
>>> That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
>>> fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone
>>> seems to miss.
>>>
>>> I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show them to
>>> have maintained situational awareness with the concomitant priority
>>> management.
>>>
>>
>> Again, there are 2 pilots in the cockpit, only one is steering the
>> aircraft. If the captain was flying the aircraft, what was the copilot
>> doing in those 7-8 minutes if he was not going through the emergency
>> checklist? What the use of a perfect water landing if then the
>> aircraft quickly fill with water because the ditching checklist has
>> not been done?
>>
>
> There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining waht the
> problem was.
> Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure. Immediate
> relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to assist in the relight.
> as they would have been too slow for a windmill start.
> Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav selections for the
> captain to look for a runway they could plunk it on.Then back to the
> relight drill. We're taught to keep trying that to the bitter end, BTW.
> They take a minute or so so he wouldn't have had time for more than one
> or two, and that would have been after the APU had fired up, say at
> abotu 1200'. A couple of calls to the cabin would have been tossed in
> their somewhere as well.
> The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist would
> have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not have.
> And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would have been no
> trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions they may or may
> not have accomplished in the time they had. But all of them would come
> ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching checklist.
>
>
>
> Bertie

save the bed time story, you're starting to rattle more than Dudley.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> wrote in
> :
>
>
>> With all my arguments against worrying about the dip, er, 'ditch'
>> switch I wonder of what benefit it would truly be in any condition
>> other dead level calm? Ditching at see would (I would think) most
>> often occur in conditions that would tear up the aircraft sufficiently
>> to make 'the Switch' totally useless.
>
> Well, experience has certainly proven this to be the case!
>>
>> In this particular case it appears, from reading an article early on,
>> that one or more pax may have partially opened a rear door and allowed
>> water ingress and this, more than anything, contributed to the tail
>> down sinking.
>
> Yeh, makes sense.
>>
>> It all comes down to basic necessities. I've had two high speed
>> parachute malfunctions and my first reaction was "what do I do to get
>> a chute open right f'ing now?" I didn't worry until after that
>> occurred as to wear I would land or what I would have for dinner. You
>> really have to experience something to realize the difference a 'real'
>> emergency will make in your focus. Failure to maintain that focus
>> results in the 'oh ****' moments.
>
>
> Well, exactly, Even in the sim when a mad situation is thrown up where
> things are forgotten, such as checklist items, but the performance as
> whole
> was exemplerary, the crew get kudos, not a kicking. It encourages the kind
> of thinking that makes situations like this come out as they did.
>
>
> Bertie
>

Are you drunk again?

[Maxwell[_2_]]

> wrote in message
...
On Jan 21, 12:18 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> wrote
> :
>
>
>
> > On Jan 20, 3:51 pm, wrote:
> >> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST), wrote:
> >> >Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>
> >> The manual states:
>
> >> At 2000 ft
>
> >> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
> >> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
> >> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
> >> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE
> >> MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.
>
> >> Poster
>
> > However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which takes
> > precedence? Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight emergency.
> > Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise altitude
> > or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of events. As a
> > PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on landing the
> > aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.
>
> > That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
> > fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone seems
> > to miss.
>
> Exactly.
>
> > I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show them to
> > have maintained situational awareness with the concomitant priority
> > management.
>
> I'd agree, it;'s hard to argue wiht success. Like many accidents of this
> sort, these gusy will have rewritten the book.
>
> Bertie

With all my arguments against worrying about the dip, er, 'ditch'
switch I wonder of what benefit it would truly be in any condition
other dead level calm? Ditching at see would (I would think) most
often occur in conditions that would tear up the aircraft sufficiently
to make 'the Switch' totally useless.

In this particular case it appears, from reading an article early on,
that one or more pax may have partially opened a rear door and allowed
water ingress and this, more than anything, contributed to the tail
down sinking.

It all comes down to basic necessities. I've had two high speed
parachute malfunctions and my first reaction was "what do I do to get
a chute open right f'ing now?" I didn't worry until after that
occurred as to wear I would land or what I would have for dinner. You
really have to experience something to realize the difference a 'real'
emergency will make in your focus. Failure to maintain that focus
results in the 'oh ****' moments.

-------------------------------------------

Nice fantasy........

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> wrote in
> :
>
>> On Jan 21, 12:09 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>>> Flydive > wrote :
>>>
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>> >> Low priority compared to flying the plane, deadstick, in a
>>> >> congested urban environment.
>>>
>>> >> Or would you rather he spend time looking for a button on the
>>> >> panel?
>>>
>>> > Well it takes 3 seconds to flip the switch, you should know where
>>> > is located.
>>>
>>> > one pilot is flying the aircraft, the other one is assisting and
>>> > going through the checklist.
>>>
>>> Yep, and the checklists can lead you into a workd of trouble. There
>>> wasn'
>> t
>>> time. In this case, a relight checklist was really all they should
>>> have been interested in.
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>
>> I'll bet they had it open to 'foie gras' - goose liver ala Turbine.
>>
>
> hehe
> Smells like hell when it goes down the core. They prolly didn;'t get to
> smell it since it sounds like the engines stopped producing air for the
> packs almost immediatly
>
>
>
> Bertie
>

oh yeah,,prolly,, yeah

[Flydive]

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
> Flydive > wrote in :
>
>> wrote:
>>> On Jan 20, 10:11 am, Flydive > wrote:
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Low priority compared to flying the plane, deadstick, in a
> congested
>>>>> urban environment.
>>>>> Or would you rather he spend time looking for a button on the
> panel?
>>>> Well it takes 3 seconds to flip the switch, you should know where is
>>>> located.
>>>>
>>>> one pilot is flying the aircraft, the other one is assisting and
> going
>>>> through the checklist.
>>> Yep.
>>>
>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>>>
>>> One may assume that since it was not flipped it was not at the top of
>>> the list and thus was of a lower priority. Flying the airplane and
>>> only those steps necessary to (1) avoid obstacles while (2) setting
> up
>>> for landing are of high(est) priority.
>> The ditch switch is at the top of the ditching checklist and usually
> is
>> a memory item, if you are going to ditch I would say is a priority
> item.
>
>
> Only if you have time. Ditchig checklists don't have any memory items at
> all, and in fact Bus checklists, with most airlines, have very few
> memory drills. Lkikely the only memory checks are the engine fire drill
> and a pressurisations blowout, and those would have only the initial
> itiems on them.
>

Well, maybe the Airbus checklist doesn't have memory items, mine does,
the ditch switch is one of them. Other aircraft probably do too


>> Airliners have 2 pilots and usually only one of them is handling the
>> controls, the other one takes care of the emergency and assists the
>> flying pilot. You say setting up for landing, well if you are
> "landing"
>
> No, you tell him to do what you need him to do in the circumstance. In
> this case, the non handler was probably try to relight and telling the
> cabin and ATC waht was happening.

They just had multiple bird strikes, with most probably catastrophic
engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a relight in that
situation. I believe they did not communicate much with ATC, and that
task can be done by the flying pilot, no much overload to push the PTT
and say "we are going into the Hudson" as it seems they said. What part
of assisting does not agree with "you tell him to do what you need him
to do in the circumstance"?

>
>> in water the water, prepare the aircraft for ditching is part of it, a
>> priority.
>>
> Nope, not in this case. if they didn;t fly the airplane, the holes in
> the bottom of the airplane would have been the least of their problems,
> since they would have made significantly larger holes.
>

> Bertie

One of them was handling the aircraft and did a great job, the assisting
pilot was assisting and following the checklist, you just have to pick
the correct one.

[Flydive]

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

>
> There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining waht the
> problem was.
> Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure. Immediate
> relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to assist in the relight.
> as they would have been too slow for a windmill start.
> Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav selections for the
> captain to look for a runway they could plunk it on.Then back to the
> relight drill. We're taught to keep trying that to the bitter end, BTW.
> They take a minute or so so he wouldn't have had time for more than one
> or two, and that would have been after the APU had fired up, say at
> abotu 1200'. A couple of calls to the cabin would have been tossed in
> their somewhere as well.
> The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist would
> have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not have.
> And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would have been no
> trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions they may or may
> not have accomplished in the time they had. But all of them would come
> ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching checklist.
>
>
>
> Bertie


The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably catastrophic
engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a relight in that
situation.
Do not know who did the ATC call, but that can be handled by the flying
pilot.
There was no runway to look for, once they decided that TEB was too far,
and it seems that the decision to ditch was taken quite quickly, so no
really nav selections.
Once they decided to ditch because they figured that the engine would
not be restarted, then no more relight attempt.
If as you say they were going through the relight procedure, they would
already had the book in their hands, no need to pick it up, just had to
find the right procedure.
I do not know about the Airbus, but in a lot of aircraft ditching is
considered an emergency, once you decided to ditch that is the emergency
procedure you are following.

Again, maybe the Airbus is different, but for example on my aircraft the
ditch switch does more than "sealing" fuselage, it does:
-depressurizes the cabin (so you can open the doors)
-Shuts down the packs (so no risk of pressurization
-closes the outflow valves (so no water can get in.

Check list also calls for pulling the APU and engines fire handles, you
probably don't want to ditch with APU running (or engine you are still
trying to relight)

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

Flydive > wrote in :

> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>> Flydive > wrote in :
>>
>>> wrote:
>>>> On Jan 20, 10:11 am, Flydive > wrote:
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Low priority compared to flying the plane, deadstick, in a
>> congested
>>>>>> urban environment.
>>>>>> Or would you rather he spend time looking for a button on the
>> panel?
>>>>> Well it takes 3 seconds to flip the switch, you should know where
>>>>> is located.
>>>>>
>>>>> one pilot is flying the aircraft, the other one is assisting and
>> going
>>>>> through the checklist.
>>>> Yep.
>>>>
>>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>>>>
>>>> One may assume that since it was not flipped it was not at the top
>>>> of the list and thus was of a lower priority. Flying the airplane
>>>> and only those steps necessary to (1) avoid obstacles while (2)
>>>> setting
>> up
>>>> for landing are of high(est) priority.
>>> The ditch switch is at the top of the ditching checklist and usually
>> is
>>> a memory item, if you are going to ditch I would say is a priority
>> item.
>>
>>
>> Only if you have time. Ditchig checklists don't have any memory items
>> at all, and in fact Bus checklists, with most airlines, have very few
>> memory drills. Lkikely the only memory checks are the engine fire
>> drill and a pressurisations blowout, and those would have only the
>> initial itiems on them.
>>
>
> Well, maybe the Airbus checklist doesn't have memory items, mine does,
> the ditch switch is one of them. Other aircraft probably do too


Really? What airlane is that?
>
>
>>> Airliners have 2 pilots and usually only one of them is handling the
>>> controls, the other one takes care of the emergency and assists the
>>> flying pilot. You say setting up for landing, well if you are
>> "landing"
>>
>> No, you tell him to do what you need him to do in the circumstance.
>> In this case, the non handler was probably try to relight and telling
>> the cabin and ATC waht was happening.
>
> They just had multiple bird strikes, with most probably catastrophic
> engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a relight in that

I would

> situation. I believe they did not communicate much with ATC, and that
> task can be done by the flying pilot, no much overload to push the PTT
> and say "we are going into the Hudson" as it seems they said. What
> part of assisting does not agree with "you tell him to do what you
> need him to do in the circumstance"?

Good grief.


>
>>
>>> in water the water, prepare the aircraft for ditching is part of it,
>>> a priority.
>>>
>> Nope, not in this case. if they didn;t fly the airplane, the holes in
>> the bottom of the airplane would have been the least of their
>> problems, since they would have made significantly larger holes.
>>
>
>> Bertie
>
> One of them was handling the aircraft and did a great job, the
> assisting pilot was assisting and following the checklist, you just
> have to pick the correct one.
>

i have done.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

Flydive > wrote in :

> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>
>>
>> There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining waht
>> the problem was.
>> Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure.
>> Immediate relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to assist in
>> the relight. as they would have been too slow for a windmill start.
>> Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav selections for
>> the captain to look for a runway they could plunk it on.Then back to
>> the relight drill. We're taught to keep trying that to the bitter
>> end, BTW. They take a minute or so so he wouldn't have had time for
>> more than one or two, and that would have been after the APU had
>> fired up, say at abotu 1200'. A couple of calls to the cabin would
>> have been tossed in their somewhere as well.
>> The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist
>> would have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not
>> have. And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would have
>> been no trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions they
>> may or may not have accomplished in the time they had. But all of
>> them would come ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching checklist.
>>
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>
>
> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably
> catastrophic engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a
> relight in that situation.
> Do not know who did the ATC call, but that can be handled by the
> flying pilot.
> There was no runway to look for, once they decided that TEB was too
> far, and it seems that the decision to ditch was taken quite quickly,
> so no really nav selections.
> Once they decided to ditch because they figured that the engine would
> not be restarted, then no more relight attempt.
> If as you say they were going through the relight procedure, they
> would already had the book in their hands, no need to pick it up, just
> had to find the right procedure.
> I do not know about the Airbus, but in a lot of aircraft ditching is
> considered an emergency, once you decided to ditch that is the
> emergency procedure you are following.
>
> Again, maybe the Airbus is different, but for example on my aircraft
> the ditch switch does more than "sealing" fuselage, it does:
> -depressurizes the cabin (so you can open the doors)
> -Shuts down the packs (so no risk of pressurization
> -closes the outflow valves (so no water can get in.

Nope, it just closes the holes in the belly.

>
> Check list also calls for pulling the APU and engines fire handles,
> you probably don't want to ditch with APU running (or engine you are
> still trying to relight)
>

Well, maybe you should go and drive your airplane into the hudson and
show em how it's done.




Bertie

[Flydive]

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:


>> Well, maybe the Airbus checklist doesn't have memory items, mine does,
>> the ditch switch is one of them. Other aircraft probably do too
>
>
> Really? What airlane is that?
>>

Bombardier Global Express

>>>> Airliners have 2 pilots and usually only one of them is handling the
>>>> controls, the other one takes care of the emergency and assists the
>>>> flying pilot. You say setting up for landing, well if you are
>>> "landing"
>>>
>>> No, you tell him to do what you need him to do in the circumstance.
>>> In this case, the non handler was probably try to relight and telling
>>> the cabin and ATC waht was happening.
>> They just had multiple bird strikes, with most probably catastrophic
>> engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a relight in that
>
> I would
>
>> situation. I believe they did not communicate much with ATC, and that
>> task can be done by the flying pilot, no much overload to push the PTT
>> and say "we are going into the Hudson" as it seems they said. What
>> part of assisting does not agree with "you tell him to do what you
>> need him to do in the circumstance"?
>
> Good grief.


Ok, maybe you have the transcript with a lengthy communication between
the Airbus and the ATC, is not what I heard, mind to share?
You are really unable to push the PTT and tell something to ATC while
flying the aircraft.
>

> >>> Bertie
>> One of them was handling the aircraft and did a great job, the
>> assisting pilot was assisting and following the checklist, you just
>> have to pick the correct one.
>>
>
> i have done.
>
>
> Bertie
>

Right the catastrophic engines faillure restarting procedure till water
touch down checklist

[Flydive]

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

>>
>> Again, maybe the Airbus is different, but for example on my aircraft
>> the ditch switch does more than "sealing" fuselage, it does:
>> -depressurizes the cabin (so you can open the doors)
>> -Shuts down the packs (so no risk of pressurization
>> -closes the outflow valves (so no water can get in.
>
> Nope, it just closes the holes in the belly.
>

As I said probably the Airbus is different, on other aircraft the switch
does a bit more.


>> Check list also calls for pulling the APU and engines fire handles,
>> you probably don't want to ditch with APU running (or engine you are
>> still trying to relight)
>>
>
> Well, maybe you should go and drive your airplane into the hudson and
> show em how it's done.
>
>
>
>
> Bertie
>
>
>
Never said I would have done a better job, and personally I prefer to
complete the flight to the destination airport rather than go into the
water, we were discussing about the ditch switch and if to flip it or not.


If the emergency check list calls for it is probably a good idea to do
it, then if you prefer the creative way, well is up to you.

I agree they did a great job, at the end everybody got out alive. That
doesn't mean that we cannot talk about what could have been differently.

You for example would have been trying to restart your engines after a
probable catastrophic failure till the end.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Flydive > wrote in :

> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>
>
>>> Well, maybe the Airbus checklist doesn't have memory items, mine
does,
>>> the ditch switch is one of them. Other aircraft probably do too
>>
>>
>> Really? What airlane is that?
>>>
>
> Bombardier Global Express

Oh God a Barbie jet.


>
>>>>> Airliners have 2 pilots and usually only one of them is handling
the
>>>>> controls, the other one takes care of the emergency and assists
the
>>>>> flying pilot. You say setting up for landing, well if you are
>>>> "landing"
>>>>
>>>> No, you tell him to do what you need him to do in the circumstance.
>>>> In this case, the non handler was probably try to relight and
telling
>>>> the cabin and ATC waht was happening.
>>> They just had multiple bird strikes, with most probably catastrophic
>>> engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a relight in that
>>
>> I would
>>
>>> situation. I believe they did not communicate much with ATC, and
that
>>> task can be done by the flying pilot, no much overload to push the
PTT
>>> and say "we are going into the Hudson" as it seems they said. What
>>> part of assisting does not agree with "you tell him to do what you
>>> need him to do in the circumstance"?
>>
>> Good grief.
>
>
> Ok, maybe you have the transcript with a lengthy communication between
> the Airbus and the ATC, is not what I heard, mind to share?
> You are really unable to push the PTT and tell something to ATC while
> flying the aircraft.
>>
>
>> >>> Bertie
>>> One of them was handling the aircraft and did a great job, the
>>> assisting pilot was assisting and following the checklist, you just
>>> have to pick the correct one.
>>>
>>
>> i have done.
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>>
>
> Right the catastrophic engines faillure restarting procedure till
water
> touch down checklist


OK, let me explain this to you one last time.


When the situation is outside of traing and time is short, the checklist
goes out the window. End of story. The reason we do so much training is
that when something happens, the training is what takes over. Since we
don;'t train for a double engine failure after takeoff in a built up
area, there is no procedure and it is up to the commander to cobble
something together in the time available. Your continued whining that
the checklist is that important demonstrates inexperience or idiocy.
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume the former.






Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Flydive > wrote in :

> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>
>>>
>>> Again, maybe the Airbus is different, but for example on my aircraft
>>> the ditch switch does more than "sealing" fuselage, it does:
>>> -depressurizes the cabin (so you can open the doors)
>>> -Shuts down the packs (so no risk of pressurization
>>> -closes the outflow valves (so no water can get in.
>>
>> Nope, it just closes the holes in the belly.
>>
>
> As I said probably the Airbus is different, on other aircraft the
> switch does a bit more.
>
>
>>> Check list also calls for pulling the APU and engines fire handles,
>>> you probably don't want to ditch with APU running (or engine you are
>>> still trying to relight)
>>>
>>
>> Well, maybe you should go and drive your airplane into the hudson and
>> show em how it's done.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>>
>>
>>
> Never said I would have done a better job, and personally I prefer to
> complete the flight to the destination airport rather than go into the
> water, we were discussing about the ditch switch and if to flip it or
> not.


No, you're not. You're second guessing the crew.

>
>
> If the emergency check list calls for it is probably a good idea to do
> it, then if you prefer the creative way, well is up to you.
>
> I agree they did a great job, at the end everybody got out alive. That
> doesn't mean that we cannot talk about what could have been
> differently.
>
> You for example would have been trying to restart your engines after a
> probable catastrophic failure till the end.



Yep.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> cavedweller > wrote in
>> news:6a07dabb-6fb7-4cdb-9057-
>> :
>>
>>> On Jan 21, 1:15 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Nope, not in this case. if they didn;t fly the airplane, the holes
>>>> in the bottom of the airplane would have been the least of their
>>>> problems, since they would have made significantly larger holes.
>>>>
>>>> Bertie
>>>
>>> ...at last, the magic words. "Fly the airplane". Good on ya,
>>> Bertie.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> ell, it's obvious, even if you're only flying a hang glider...
>>
>> Isn't it?
>>
>> Bertie
>
> the only thing obvious here is you're a dumb ass wanna be.



Bwawahwhahwhahw!

Oh ouch wannabe boi



Bertie

[Flydive]

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

> Oh God a Barbie jet.

Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are the real pilot, the
real McCoy., good for you.



> OK, let me explain this to you one last time.
>
>
> When the situation is outside of traing and time is short, the checklist
> goes out the window. End of story. The reason we do so much training is
> that when something happens, the training is what takes over. Since we
> don;'t train for a double engine failure after takeoff in a built up
> area, there is no procedure and it is up to the commander to cobble
> something together in the time available. Your continued whining that
> the checklist is that important demonstrates inexperience or idiocy.
> I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume the former.
>

>
> Bertie

Well you said that the non flying pilot was busy doing check list, now
you say no check list in a emergency, well ok.

But anyway I see you now reached your limit of a normal conversation and
you starting your usual name calling and insulting who has a different
opinion, as usual after a few posts.

Well, it's ok, I gave my opinion you gave yours, no need to continue.

See you on another thread, eventually.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> wrote in
>> news:ee6cc075-b399-4bf8-8b42-950a970cfdd0
@t39g2000prh.googlegroups.com
>> :
>>
>>
>>> With all my arguments against worrying about the dip, er, 'ditch'
>>> switch I wonder of what benefit it would truly be in any condition
>>> other dead level calm? Ditching at see would (I would think) most
>>> often occur in conditions that would tear up the aircraft
>>> sufficiently to make 'the Switch' totally useless.
>>
>> Well, experience has certainly proven this to be the case!
>>>
>>> In this particular case it appears, from reading an article early
>>> on, that one or more pax may have partially opened a rear door and
>>> allowed water ingress and this, more than anything, contributed to
>>> the tail down sinking.
>>
>> Yeh, makes sense.
>>>
>>> It all comes down to basic necessities. I've had two high speed
>>> parachute malfunctions and my first reaction was "what do I do to
>>> get a chute open right f'ing now?" I didn't worry until after that
>>> occurred as to wear I would land or what I would have for dinner.
>>> You really have to experience something to realize the difference a
>>> 'real' emergency will make in your focus. Failure to maintain that
>>> focus results in the 'oh ****' moments.
>>
>>
>> Well, exactly, Even in the sim when a mad situation is thrown up
>> where things are forgotten, such as checklist items, but the
>> performance as whole
>> was exemplerary, the crew get kudos, not a kicking. It encourages the
>> kind of thinking that makes situations like this come out as they
>> did.
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>>
>
> Are you drunk again?
>

Nope.

Is your wife beating you again?





Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Flydive > wrote in :
>>
>>> wrote:
>>>> On Jan 20, 3:51 pm, wrote:
>>>>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>>>>> The manual states:
>>>>>
>>>>> At 2000 ft
>>>>>
>>>>> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
>>>>> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
>>>>> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
>>>>> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE
>>>>> MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.
>>>>>
>>>>> Poster
>>>>
>>>> However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which takes
>>>> precedence? Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight emergency.
>>>> Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise altitude
>>>> or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of events. As a
>>>> PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on landing
>>>> the aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.
>>>>
>>>> That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
>>>> fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone
>>>> seems to miss.
>>>>
>>>> I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show them to
>>>> have maintained situational awareness with the concomitant priority
>>>> management.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Again, there are 2 pilots in the cockpit, only one is steering the
>>> aircraft. If the captain was flying the aircraft, what was the copilot
>>> doing in those 7-8 minutes if he was not going through the emergency
>>> checklist? What the use of a perfect water landing if then the
>>> aircraft quickly fill with water because the ditching checklist has
>>> not been done?
>>>
>>
>> There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining waht the
>> problem was.
>> Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure. Immediate
>> relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to assist in the relight.
>> as they would have been too slow for a windmill start.
>> Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav selections for the
>> captain to look for a runway they could plunk it on.Then back to the
>> relight drill. We're taught to keep trying that to the bitter end, BTW.
>> They take a minute or so so he wouldn't have had time for more than one
>> or two, and that would have been after the APU had fired up, say at
>> abotu 1200'. A couple of calls to the cabin would have been tossed in
>> their somewhere as well.
>> The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist would
>> have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not have.
>> And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would have been no
>> trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions they may or may
>> not have accomplished in the time they had. But all of them would come
>> ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching checklist.
>>
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>
> save the bed time story, you're starting to rattle more than Dudley.
>

Yeh, right wannabe boi.

Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

Flydive > wrote in :

> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>
>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>
> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are the real pilot, the
> real McCoy., good for you.
>

Nope I fly little airplanes too.

>
>
> > OK, let me explain this to you one last time.
>>
>>
>> When the situation is outside of traing and time is short, the
>> checklist goes out the window. End of story. The reason we do so much
>> training is that when something happens, the training is what takes
>> over. Since we don;'t train for a double engine failure after takeoff
>> in a built up area, there is no procedure and it is up to the
>> commander to cobble something together in the time available. Your
>> continued whining that the checklist is that important demonstrates
>> inexperience or idiocy. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and
>> assume the former.
>>
>
>>
>> Bertie
>
> Well you said that the non flying pilot was busy doing check list, now
> you say no check list in a emergency, well ok.

Nope, I didn't say that.

>
> But anyway I see you now reached your limit of a normal conversation
> and you starting your usual name calling and insulting who has a
> different opinion, as usual after a few posts.


You call waht you were doing normal conversation? I see.
>
> Well, it's ok, I gave my opinion you gave yours, no need to continue.
>
> See you on another thread, eventually.



Prolly.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> wrote in
>> news:13e6162f-07b7-424d-8b0d-0a34f68bda06
@l42g2000yqe.googlegroups.com:
>>
>>> On Jan 21, 12:09 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>>>> Flydive > wrote innews:4975f799_7
@news.bluewin.ch:
>>>>
>>>> > wrote:
>>>>
>>>> >> Low priority compared to flying the plane, deadstick, in a
>>>> >> congested urban environment.
>>>>
>>>> >> Or would you rather he spend time looking for a button on the
>>>> >> panel?
>>>>
>>>> > Well it takes 3 seconds to flip the switch, you should know where
>>>> > is located.
>>>>
>>>> > one pilot is flying the aircraft, the other one is assisting and
>>>> > going through the checklist.
>>>>
>>>> Yep, and the checklists can lead you into a workd of trouble. There
>>>> wasn'
>>> t
>>>> time. In this case, a relight checklist was really all they should
>>>> have been interested in.
>>>>
>>>> Bertie
>>>
>>> I'll bet they had it open to 'foie gras' - goose liver ala Turbine.
>>>
>>
>> hehe
>> Smells like hell when it goes down the core. They prolly didn;'t get
to
>> smell it since it sounds like the engines stopped producing air for
the
>> packs almost immediatly
>>
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>>
>
> oh yeah,,prolly,, yeah
>
>
Well, yes maxie..

Do tel why you would think otherwise..

Bertie

[Rich Ahrens[_2_]]

on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably catastrophic
> engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a relight in that
> situation.

Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday the NTSB
was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing, based on
interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit recorder.

From Saturday's NYT:

“My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the standard
phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.

“Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.

With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply,
Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from falling out
of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving through a
three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both the engines.

[[email protected]]

On Jan 21, 2:29*pm, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in .com...
>
>
>
> > Flydive > wrote :
>
> >> wrote:
> >>> On Jan 20, 3:51 pm, wrote:
> >>>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
> >>>> The manual states:
>
> >>>> At 2000 ft
>
> >>>> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
> >>>> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
> >>>> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
> >>>> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE
> >>>> MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11 body angle and minimum ROD.
>
> >>>> Poster
>
> >>> However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which takes
> >>> precedence? *Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight emergency..
> >>> Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise altitude
> >>> or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of events. *As a
> >>> PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on landing
> >>> the aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.
>
> >>> That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
> >>> fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone
> >>> seems to miss.
>
> >>> I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show them to
> >>> have maintained situational awareness with the concomitant priority
> >>> management.
>
> >> Again, there are 2 pilots in the cockpit, only one is steering the
> >> aircraft. If the captain was flying the aircraft, what was the copilot
> >> doing in those 7-8 minutes if he was not going through the emergency
> >> checklist? What the use of a perfect water landing if then the
> >> aircraft quickly fill with water because the ditching checklist has
> >> not been done?
>
> > There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining waht the
> > problem was.
> > Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure. Immediate
> > relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to assist in the relight..
> > as they would have been too slow for a windmill start.
> > Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav selections for the
> > captain to look for a runway they could plunk it on.Then back to the
> > relight drill. We're taught to keep trying that to the bitter end, BTW.
> > They take a minute or so so he wouldn't have had time for more than one
> > or two, and that would have been after the APU had fired up, say at
> > abotu 1200'. *A couple of calls to the cabin would have been tossed in
> > their somewhere as well.
> > The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist would
> > have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not have.
> > And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would have been no
> > trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions they may or may
> > not have accomplished in the time they had. But all of them would come
> > ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching checklist.
>
> > Bertie
>
> save the bed time story, you're starting to rattle more than Dudley.

Speaking of rattle how's your syphilitic cough doing these days?

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

wrote in
:

> On Jan 21, 2:29*pm, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:
>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in
>> messagenews:gl7pc2$93i
> ...
>>
>>
>>
>> > Flydive > wrote
>> > :
>>
>> >> wrote:
>> >>> On Jan 20, 3:51 pm, wrote:
>> >>>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
>> >>>> wrote:
>> >>>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>> >>>> The manual states:
>>
>> >>>> At 2000 ft
>>
>> >>>> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
>> >>>> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
>> >>>> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
>> >>>> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN
>> >>>> ONE MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11 body angle and minimum
>> >>>> ROD.
>>
>> >>>> Poster
>>
>> >>> However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which
>> >>> takes precedence? *Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight
>> >>> emergency
> .
>> >>> Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise
>> >>> altitude or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of
>> >>> events. *As
> a
>> >>> PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on
>> >>> landing the aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.
>>
>> >>> That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
>> >>> fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone
>> >>> seems to miss.
>>
>> >>> I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show
>> >>> them to have maintained situational awareness with the
>> >>> concomitant priority management.
>>
>> >> Again, there are 2 pilots in the cockpit, only one is steering the
>> >> aircraft. If the captain was flying the aircraft, what was the
>> >> copilot doing in those 7-8 minutes if he was not going through the
>> >> emergency checklist? What the use of a perfect water landing if
>> >> then the aircraft quickly fill with water because the ditching
>> >> checklist has not been done?
>>
>> > There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining
>> > waht th
> e
>> > problem was.
>> > Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure.
>> > Immediate relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to assist
>> > in the relight
> .
>> > as they would have been too slow for a windmill start.
>> > Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav selections
>> > for th
> e
>> > captain to look for a runway they could plunk it on.Then back to
>> > the relight drill. We're taught to keep trying that to the bitter
>> > end, BTW. They take a minute or so so he wouldn't have had time for
>> > more than one or two, and that would have been after the APU had
>> > fired up, say at abotu 1200'. *A couple of calls to the cabin would
>> > have been tossed i
> n
>> > their somewhere as well.
>> > The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist
>> > would have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not
>> > have. And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would have
>> > been no trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions
>> > they may or ma
> y
>> > not have accomplished in the time they had. But all of them would
>> > come ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching checklist.
>>
>> > Bertie
>>
>> save the bed time story, you're starting to rattle more than Dudley.
>
> Speaking of rattle how's your syphilitic cough doing these days?
>

Ewww.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

Rich Ahrens > wrote in news:4977f644$0$92352
:

> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably catastrophic
>> engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a relight in that
>> situation.
>
> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday the NTSB
> was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing, based on
> interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit recorder.
>
> From Saturday's NYT:
>
> “My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the standard
> phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>
> “Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.
>
> With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply,
> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from falling out
> of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving through a
> three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both the engines.


Well, WTF else woul you do? You're face with a probable catastrophic
ditching or maybe getting enough thrust to nurse an airplane to a
runway....


Bertie

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Flydive" > wrote in message
...

You are arguing with the functional equivalent of a Japanese radio.

He doesn't even possess the ability to realize he is wrong.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :
>
>>
>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Flydive > wrote in :
>>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> On Jan 20, 3:51 pm, wrote:
>>>>>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>>>>>> The manual states:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At 2000 ft
>>>>>>
>>>>>> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
>>>>>> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
>>>>>> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
>>>>>> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE
>>>>>> MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Poster
>>>>>
>>>>> However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which takes
>>>>> precedence? Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight emergency.
>>>>> Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise altitude
>>>>> or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of events. As a
>>>>> PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on landing
>>>>> the aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.
>>>>>
>>>>> That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
>>>>> fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone
>>>>> seems to miss.
>>>>>
>>>>> I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show them to
>>>>> have maintained situational awareness with the concomitant priority
>>>>> management.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Again, there are 2 pilots in the cockpit, only one is steering the
>>>> aircraft. If the captain was flying the aircraft, what was the copilot
>>>> doing in those 7-8 minutes if he was not going through the emergency
>>>> checklist? What the use of a perfect water landing if then the
>>>> aircraft quickly fill with water because the ditching checklist has
>>>> not been done?
>>>>
>>>
>>> There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining waht the
>>> problem was.
>>> Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure. Immediate
>>> relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to assist in the relight.
>>> as they would have been too slow for a windmill start.
>>> Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav selections for the
>>> captain to look for a runway they could plunk it on.Then back to the
>>> relight drill. We're taught to keep trying that to the bitter end, BTW.
>>> They take a minute or so so he wouldn't have had time for more than one
>>> or two, and that would have been after the APU had fired up, say at
>>> abotu 1200'. A couple of calls to the cabin would have been tossed in
>>> their somewhere as well.
>>> The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist would
>>> have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not have.
>>> And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would have been no
>>> trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions they may or may
>>> not have accomplished in the time they had. But all of them would come
>>> ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching checklist.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>
>> save the bed time story, you're starting to rattle more than Dudley.
>>
>
> Yeh, right wannabe boi.
>
> Bertie


Really, you're beginning to talk more **** than a Jap radio.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

> wrote in message
...
On Jan 21, 2:29 pm, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in
> .com...
>
>
>
> > Flydive > wrote :
>
> >> wrote:
> >>> On Jan 20, 3:51 pm, wrote:
> >>>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
> >>>> The manual states:
>
> >>>> At 2000 ft
>
> >>>> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
> >>>> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
> >>>> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
> >>>> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE
> >>>> MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11 body angle and minimum ROD.
>
> >>>> Poster
>
> >>> However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which takes
> >>> precedence? Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight emergency.
> >>> Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise altitude
> >>> or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of events. As a
> >>> PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on landing
> >>> the aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.
>
> >>> That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
> >>> fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone
> >>> seems to miss.
>
> >>> I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show them to
> >>> have maintained situational awareness with the concomitant priority
> >>> management.
>
> >> Again, there are 2 pilots in the cockpit, only one is steering the
> >> aircraft. If the captain was flying the aircraft, what was the copilot
> >> doing in those 7-8 minutes if he was not going through the emergency
> >> checklist? What the use of a perfect water landing if then the
> >> aircraft quickly fill with water because the ditching checklist has
> >> not been done?
>
> > There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining waht the
> > problem was.
> > Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure. Immediate
> > relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to assist in the relight.
> > as they would have been too slow for a windmill start.
> > Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav selections for the
> > captain to look for a runway they could plunk it on.Then back to the
> > relight drill. We're taught to keep trying that to the bitter end, BTW.
> > They take a minute or so so he wouldn't have had time for more than one
> > or two, and that would have been after the APU had fired up, say at
> > abotu 1200'. A couple of calls to the cabin would have been tossed in
> > their somewhere as well.
> > The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist would
> > have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not have.
> > And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would have been no
> > trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions they may or may
> > not have accomplished in the time they had. But all of them would come
> > ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching checklist.
>
> > Bertie
>
> save the bed time story, you're starting to rattle more than Dudley.

Speaking of rattle how's your syphilitic cough doing these days?

------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, so, did your wife ever get better?

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> wrote in
> :
>
>> On Jan 21, 2:29 pm, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:
>>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in
>>> messagenews:gl7pc2$93i
>> ...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > Flydive > wrote
>>> > :
>>>
>>> >> wrote:
>>> >>> On Jan 20, 3:51 pm, wrote:
>>> >>>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
>>> >>>> wrote:
>>> >>>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>>> >>>> The manual states:
>>>
>>> >>>> At 2000 ft
>>>
>>> >>>> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
>>> >>>> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
>>> >>>> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
>>> >>>> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN
>>> >>>> ONE MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11 body angle and minimum
>>> >>>> ROD.
>>>
>>> >>>> Poster
>>>
>>> >>> However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which
>>> >>> takes precedence? Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight
>>> >>> emergency
>> .
>>> >>> Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise
>>> >>> altitude or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of
>>> >>> events. As
>> a
>>> >>> PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on
>>> >>> landing the aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.
>>>
>>> >>> That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
>>> >>> fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone
>>> >>> seems to miss.
>>>
>>> >>> I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show
>>> >>> them to have maintained situational awareness with the
>>> >>> concomitant priority management.
>>>
>>> >> Again, there are 2 pilots in the cockpit, only one is steering the
>>> >> aircraft. If the captain was flying the aircraft, what was the
>>> >> copilot doing in those 7-8 minutes if he was not going through the
>>> >> emergency checklist? What the use of a perfect water landing if
>>> >> then the aircraft quickly fill with water because the ditching
>>> >> checklist has not been done?
>>>
>>> > There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining
>>> > waht th
>> e
>>> > problem was.
>>> > Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure.
>>> > Immediate relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to assist
>>> > in the relight
>> .
>>> > as they would have been too slow for a windmill start.
>>> > Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav selections
>>> > for th
>> e
>>> > captain to look for a runway they could plunk it on.Then back to
>>> > the relight drill. We're taught to keep trying that to the bitter
>>> > end, BTW. They take a minute or so so he wouldn't have had time for
>>> > more than one or two, and that would have been after the APU had
>>> > fired up, say at abotu 1200'. A couple of calls to the cabin would
>>> > have been tossed i
>> n
>>> > their somewhere as well.
>>> > The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist
>>> > would have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not
>>> > have. And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would have
>>> > been no trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions
>>> > they may or ma
>> y
>>> > not have accomplished in the time they had. But all of them would
>>> > come ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching checklist.
>>>
>>> > Bertie
>>>
>>> save the bed time story, you're starting to rattle more than Dudley.
>>
>> Speaking of rattle how's your syphilitic cough doing these days?
>>
>
> Ewww.
>
>
> Bertie

Bertie the echo puppet.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> Flydive > wrote in :
>
>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining waht
>>> the problem was.
>>> Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure.
>>> Immediate relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to assist in
>>> the relight. as they would have been too slow for a windmill start.
>>> Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav selections for
>>> the captain to look for a runway they could plunk it on.Then back to
>>> the relight drill. We're taught to keep trying that to the bitter
>>> end, BTW. They take a minute or so so he wouldn't have had time for
>>> more than one or two, and that would have been after the APU had
>>> fired up, say at abotu 1200'. A couple of calls to the cabin would
>>> have been tossed in their somewhere as well.
>>> The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist
>>> would have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not
>>> have. And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would have
>>> been no trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions they
>>> may or may not have accomplished in the time they had. But all of
>>> them would come ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching checklist.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>
>>
>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably
>> catastrophic engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a
>> relight in that situation.
>> Do not know who did the ATC call, but that can be handled by the
>> flying pilot.
>> There was no runway to look for, once they decided that TEB was too
>> far, and it seems that the decision to ditch was taken quite quickly,
>> so no really nav selections.
>> Once they decided to ditch because they figured that the engine would
>> not be restarted, then no more relight attempt.
>> If as you say they were going through the relight procedure, they
>> would already had the book in their hands, no need to pick it up, just
>> had to find the right procedure.
>> I do not know about the Airbus, but in a lot of aircraft ditching is
>> considered an emergency, once you decided to ditch that is the
>> emergency procedure you are following.
>>
>> Again, maybe the Airbus is different, but for example on my aircraft
>> the ditch switch does more than "sealing" fuselage, it does:
>> -depressurizes the cabin (so you can open the doors)
>> -Shuts down the packs (so no risk of pressurization
>> -closes the outflow valves (so no water can get in.
>
> Nope, it just closes the holes in the belly.
>
>>
>> Check list also calls for pulling the APU and engines fire handles,
>> you probably don't want to ditch with APU running (or engine you are
>> still trying to relight)
>>
>
> Well, maybe you should go and drive your airplane into the hudson and
> show em how it's done.
>
>
>
>
> Bertie
>
>
>

Maybe you should learn to fly something other than your desk.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> Flydive > wrote in :
>
>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>
>>>>
>>>> Again, maybe the Airbus is different, but for example on my aircraft
>>>> the ditch switch does more than "sealing" fuselage, it does:
>>>> -depressurizes the cabin (so you can open the doors)
>>>> -Shuts down the packs (so no risk of pressurization
>>>> -closes the outflow valves (so no water can get in.
>>>
>>> Nope, it just closes the holes in the belly.
>>>
>>
>> As I said probably the Airbus is different, on other aircraft the
>> switch does a bit more.
>>
>>
>>>> Check list also calls for pulling the APU and engines fire handles,
>>>> you probably don't want to ditch with APU running (or engine you are
>>>> still trying to relight)
>>>>
>>>
>>> Well, maybe you should go and drive your airplane into the hudson and
>>> show em how it's done.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> Never said I would have done a better job, and personally I prefer to
>> complete the flight to the destination airport rather than go into the
>> water, we were discussing about the ditch switch and if to flip it or
>> not.
>
>
> No, you're not. You're second guessing the crew.
>
>>
>>
>> If the emergency check list calls for it is probably a good idea to do
>> it, then if you prefer the creative way, well is up to you.
>>
>> I agree they did a great job, at the end everybody got out alive. That
>> doesn't mean that we cannot talk about what could have been
>> differently.
>>
>> You for example would have been trying to restart your engines after a
>> probable catastrophic failure till the end.
>
>
>
> Yep.
>
>
> Bertie
>

From the poster child for second guessing others. Did you think you held the
copyrights?

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
. net...
> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably catastrophic
>> engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a relight in that
>> situation.
>
> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday the NTSB
> was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing, based on
> interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit recorder.
>
> From Saturday's NYT:
>
> “My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the standard
> phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>
> “Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.
>
> With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply, Captain
> Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from falling out of the
> sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving through a three-page
> checklist of procedures for restarting both the engines.

Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> Rich Ahrens > wrote in news:4977f644$0$92352
> :
>
>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably catastrophic
>>> engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a relight in that
>>> situation.
>>
>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday the NTSB
>> was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing, based on
>> interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit recorder.
>>
>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>
>> “My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the standard
>> phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>
>> “Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.
>>
>> With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply,
>> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from falling out
>> of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving through a
>> three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both the engines.
>
>
> Well, WTF else woul you do? You're face with a probable catastrophic
> ditching or maybe getting enough thrust to nurse an airplane to a
> runway....
>
>
> Bertie

No, WTF, how the hell would you know?

[[email protected]]

On Jan 22, 10:02*pm, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:
> > wrote in message
>
> ...
> On Jan 21, 2:29 pm, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:
>
>
>
> > "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in
> > .com...
>
> > > Flydive > wrote :
>
> > >> wrote:
> > >>> On Jan 20, 3:51 pm, wrote:
> > >>>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
> > >>>> wrote:
> > >>>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
> > >>>> The manual states:
>
> > >>>> At 2000 ft
>
> > >>>> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
> > >>>> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
> > >>>> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
> > >>>> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE
> > >>>> MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11 body angle and minimum ROD.
>
> > >>>> Poster
>
> > >>> However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which takes
> > >>> precedence? Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight emergency.
> > >>> Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at cruise altitude
> > >>> or with only *one* emergency rather than a sequence of events. As a
> > >>> PAX I would rather know that the crew are concentrating on landing
> > >>> the aircraft (ditching) as gently as possible.
>
> > >>> That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
> > >>> fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone
> > >>> seems to miss.
>
> > >>> I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show them to
> > >>> have maintained situational awareness with the concomitant priority
> > >>> management.
>
> > >> Again, there are 2 pilots in the cockpit, only one is steering the
> > >> aircraft. If the captain was flying the aircraft, what was the copilot
> > >> doing in those 7-8 minutes if he was not going through the emergency
> > >> checklist? What the use of a perfect water landing if then the
> > >> aircraft quickly fill with water because the ditching checklist has
> > >> not been done?
>
> > > There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining waht the
> > > problem was.
> > > Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure. Immediate
> > > relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to assist in the relight.
> > > as they would have been too slow for a windmill start.
> > > Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav selections for the
> > > captain to look for a runway they could plunk it on.Then back to the
> > > relight drill. We're taught to keep trying that to the bitter end, BTW.
> > > They take a minute or so so he wouldn't have had time for more than one
> > > or two, and that would have been after the APU had fired up, say at
> > > abotu 1200'. A couple of calls to the cabin would have been tossed in
> > > their somewhere as well.
> > > The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist would
> > > have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not have.
> > > And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would have been no
> > > trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions they may or may
> > > not have accomplished in the time they had. But all of them would come
> > > ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching checklist.
>
> > > Bertie
>
> > save the bed time story, you're starting to rattle more than Dudley.
>
> Speaking of rattle how's your syphilitic cough doing these days?
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> So, so, did your wife ever get better?

* JANUARY 23, 2009, 3:29 A.M. ET

First Embryonic Stem-Cell Trial Gets Approval From the FDA

Mx'y, see? It may not be too late for you to grow a brain.

[Rich Ahrens[_2_]]

on 1/22/09 10:06 PM Maxwell said the following:
> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
> . net...
>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably catastrophic
>>> engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a relight in that
>>> situation.
>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday the NTSB
>> was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing, based on
>> interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit recorder.
>>
>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>
>> “My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the standard
>> phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>
>> “Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.
>>
>> With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply, Captain
>> Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from falling out of the
>> sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving through a three-page
>> checklist of procedures for restarting both the engines.
>
> Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.

Nope. Laughing my ass at how he's wiping the floor with you and how
you're too thick to realize it.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

Rich Ahrens > wrote in
. net:

> on 1/22/09 10:06 PM Maxwell said the following:
>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>> . net...
>>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably
>>>> catastrophic engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a
>>>> relight in that situation.
>>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday the
>>> NTSB was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing, based
>>> on interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit
>>> recorder.
>>>
>>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>>
>>> “My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the standard
>>> phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>>
>>> “Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.
>>>
>>> With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply,
>>> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from falling
>>> out of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving through a
>>> three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both the engines.
>>
>> Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.
>
> Nope. Laughing my ass at how he's wiping the floor with you and how
> you're too thick to realize it.
>
>
>
>

More like wiping the toilet with him, keeping in mind his golden shower
fetish...

Bertie

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :
>
>>
>> "Flydive" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>> You are arguing with the functional equivalent of a Japanese radio.
>>
>> He doesn't even possess the ability to realize he is wrong.
>>
>
> Yeh, do tell know nothing boi
>
>
> Bertie

Truth hurts dumb ass. Just like you twisted insistence on answering every
post, even to post arguments totally unrelated to the topic at hand.

You are obsessed with yourself. Enjoy, I find it a constant source of
entertainment.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
> :
>
>>
>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>> Flydive > wrote in
>>>>> :
>>>>>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Jan 20, 3:51 pm, wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>>>>>>>> The manual states:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> At 2000 ft
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
>>>>>>>> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
>>>>>>>> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
>>>>>>>> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN
>>>>>>>> ONE MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum
>>>>>>>> ROD.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Poster
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which
>>>>>>> takes precedence? Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight
>>>>>>> emergency. Quite a bit different from a situation that begins at
>>>>>>> cruise altitude or with only *one* emergency rather than a
>>>>>>> sequence of events. As a PAX I would rather know that the crew
>>>>>>> are concentrating on landing the aircraft (ditching) as gently as
>>>>>>> possible.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
>>>>>>> fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one everyone
>>>>>>> seems to miss.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show
>>>>>>> them to have maintained situational awareness with the
>>>>>>> concomitant priority management.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Again, there are 2 pilots in the cockpit, only one is steering the
>>>>>> aircraft. If the captain was flying the aircraft, what was the
>>>>>> copilot doing in those 7-8 minutes if he was not going through the
>>>>>> emergency checklist? What the use of a perfect water landing if
>>>>>> then the aircraft quickly fill with water because the ditching
>>>>>> checklist has not been done?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining
>>>>> waht the problem was.
>>>>> Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure.
>>>>> Immediate relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to assist
>>>>> in the relight. as they would have been too slow for a windmill
>>>>> start. Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav
>>>>> selections for the captain to look for a runway they could plunk it
>>>>> on.Then back to the relight drill. We're taught to keep trying that
>>>>> to the bitter end, BTW. They take a minute or so so he wouldn't
>>>>> have had time for more than one or two, and that would have been
>>>>> after the APU had fired up, say at abotu 1200'. A couple of calls
>>>>> to the cabin would have been tossed in their somewhere as well.
>>>>> The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist
>>>>> would have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not
>>>>> have. And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would have
>>>>> been no trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions
>>>>> they may or may not have accomplished in the time they had. But all
>>>>> of them would come ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching
>>>>> checklist.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Bertie
>>>>
>>>> save the bed time story, you're starting to rattle more than Dudley.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Yeh, right wannabe boi.
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>
>>
>> Really, you're beginning to talk more **** than a Jap radio.
>
> Well, any radio is going to talk **** in OKie, wannabe boi.
> Bertie

1

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in news:DCbel.4460$k57.1851
> @newsfe09.iad:
your syphilitic cough doing these days?
>>>>
>>>
>>> Ewww.
>>>
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>
>> Bertie the echo puppet.
>>
>>
> Maxwell, the zero.
>
>
> Bertie

Yeah, like that's related.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

> wrote in message
...

>
> So, so, did your wife ever get better?

* JANUARY 23, 2009, 3:29 A.M. ET

First Embryonic Stem-Cell Trial Gets Approval From the FDA

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Maybe there is hope for her yet!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
>>
> Make up your mind Maxie, you insinuated that this was not correct in
> your last post..
>
> Bertie

Sure I did putz, enjoy your delusion.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :
>
>>
>> Maybe you should learn to fly something other than your desk.
>>
>
> I have Maxie...
>
>
> Bertie

B

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Because I fly airplanes like that for a living Maxie, how abotu you?
>
>
> Bertie
>

Prove it. You fly noting but a desk.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
> :
>
>>
>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>> . net...
>>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably
>>>> catastrophic engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a
>>>> relight in that situation.
>>>
>>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday the
>>> NTSB was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing, based
>>> on interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit recorder.
>>>
>>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>>
>>> “My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the standard
>>> phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>>
>>> “Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.
>>>
>>> With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply,
>>> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from falling
>>> out of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving through a
>>> three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both the engines.
>>
>> Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.
>>
>>
> Bwawhahwha
> As if you left any rooom for that, Maxie..
>
> Admit it You Luuuuuurve me!
>
> Mwuuahw!
>
>
> Bertie

There you go, cover for your sock puppet.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
. net...
> on 1/22/09 10:06 PM Maxwell said the following:
>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>> . net...
>>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably catastrophic
>>>> engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a relight in that
>>>> situation.
>>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday the NTSB
>>> was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing, based on
>>> interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit recorder.
>>>
>>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>>
>>> “My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the standard
>>> phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>>
>>> “Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.
>>>
>>> With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply,
>>> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from falling out
>>> of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving through a
>>> three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both the engines.
>>
>> Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.
>
> Nope. Laughing my ass at how he's wiping the floor with you and how you're
> too thick to realize it.
>

Still as stupid and obsessed with Gertie as ever. Good job retard.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> Rich Ahrens > wrote in
> . net:
>
>> on 1/22/09 10:06 PM Maxwell said the following:
>>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>>> . net...
>>>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably
>>>>> catastrophic engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a
>>>>> relight in that situation.
>>>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday the
>>>> NTSB was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing, based
>>>> on interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit
>>>> recorder.
>>>>
>>>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>>>
>>>> “My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the standard
>>>> phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>>>
>>>> “Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.
>>>>
>>>> With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply,
>>>> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from falling
>>>> out of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving through a
>>>> three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both the engines.
>>>
>>> Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.
>>
>> Nope. Laughing my ass at how he's wiping the floor with you and how
>> you're too thick to realize it.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> More like wiping the toilet with him, keeping in mind his golden shower
> fetish...
>
> Bertie

C

[Mike]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in message
...
>
> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
> . net...
>> on 1/22/09 10:06 PM Maxwell said the following:
>>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>>> . net...
>>>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably
>>>>> catastrophic engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a
>>>>> relight in that situation.
>>>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday the
>>>> NTSB was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing, based on
>>>> interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit recorder.
>>>>
>>>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>>>
>>>> "My aircraft," he announced to his first officer, using the standard
>>>> phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>>>
>>>> "Your aircraft," Mr. Skiles responded.
>>>>
>>>> With little thrust, and with the plane's airspeed falling sharply,
>>>> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from falling
>>>> out of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving through a
>>>> three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both the engines.
>>>
>>> Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.
>>
>> Nope. Laughing my ass at how he's wiping the floor with you and how
>> you're too thick to realize it.
>>
>
> Still as stupid and obsessed with Gertie as ever. Good job retard.

.....sez Bertie's groupie, Skidder.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Mike" <nospam @ aol.com> wrote in
:

> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>> . net...
>>> on 1/22/09 10:06 PM Maxwell said the following:
>>>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>>>> . net...
>>>>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>>>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably
>>>>>> catastrophic engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a
>>>>>> relight in that situation.
>>>>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday
>>>>> the NTSB was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing,
>>>>> based on interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit
>>>>> recorder.
>>>>>
>>>>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>>>>
>>>>> "My aircraft," he announced to his first officer, using the
>>>>> standard phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>>>>
>>>>> "Your aircraft," Mr. Skiles responded.
>>>>>
>>>>> With little thrust, and with the plane's airspeed falling sharply,
>>>>> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from
>>>>> falling out of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving
>>>>> through a three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both
>>>>> the engines.
>>>>
>>>> Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.
>>>
>>> Nope. Laughing my ass at how he's wiping the floor with you and how
>>> you're too thick to realize it.
>>>
>>
>> Still as stupid and obsessed with Gertie as ever. Good job retard.
>
> ....sez Bertie's groupie, Skidder.
>
>
>

I cherish him.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
:

>
> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
> . net...
>> on 1/22/09 10:06 PM Maxwell said the following:
>>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>>> . net...
>>>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably
>>>>> catastrophic engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a
>>>>> relight in that situation.
>>>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday the
>>>> NTSB was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing, based
>>>> on interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit
>>>> recorder.
>>>>
>>>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>>>
>>>> “My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the
>>>> standard phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>>>
>>>> “Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.
>>>>
>>>> With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply,
>>>> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from
>>>> falling out of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving
>>>> through a three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both
>>>> the engines.
>>>
>>> Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.
>>
>> Nope. Laughing my ass at how he's wiping the floor with you and how
>> you're too thick to realize it.
>>
>
> Still as stupid and obsessed with Gertie as ever. Good job retard.
>
>
>



Awwww, multiple lames..

And all off the mark..


Good job retard.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Mike" <nospam @ aol.com> wrote in
:

> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>> . net...
>>> on 1/22/09 10:06 PM Maxwell said the following:
>>>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>>>> . net...
>>>>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>>>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably
>>>>>> catastrophic engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a
>>>>>> relight in that situation.
>>>>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday
>>>>> the NTSB was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing,
>>>>> based on interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit
>>>>> recorder.
>>>>>
>>>>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>>>>
>>>>> "My aircraft," he announced to his first officer, using the
>>>>> standard phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>>>>
>>>>> "Your aircraft," Mr. Skiles responded.
>>>>>
>>>>> With little thrust, and with the plane's airspeed falling sharply,
>>>>> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from
>>>>> falling out of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving
>>>>> through a three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both
>>>>> the engines.
>>>>
>>>> Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.
>>>
>>> Nope. Laughing my ass at how he's wiping the floor with you and how
>>> you're too thick to realize it.
>>>
>>
>> Still as stupid and obsessed with Gertie as ever. Good job retard.
>
> ....sez Bertie's groupie, Skidder.
>
>
>

I cherish him.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
>> :
>>
>>>
>>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>>> . net...
>>>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably
>>>>> catastrophic engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a
>>>>> relight in that situation.
>>>>
>>>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday the
>>>> NTSB was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing, based
>>>> on interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit
recorder.
>>>>
>>>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>>>
>>>> “My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the
standard
>>>> phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>>>
>>>> “Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.
>>>>
>>>> With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply,
>>>> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from
falling
>>>> out of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving through a
>>>> three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both the engines.
>>>
>>> Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.
>>>
>>>
>> Bwawhahwha
>> As if you left any rooom for that, Maxie..
>>
>> Admit it You Luuuuuurve me!
>>
>> Mwuuahw!
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>
> There you go, cover for your sock puppet.
>
>
>
>

Back to sock puppet idiocy

Way to go wannabe boy1


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>>
>> Because I fly airplanes like that for a living Maxie, how abotu you?
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>>
>
> Prove it. You fly noting but a desk.
>


You first Maxie..


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :
>>
>>>
>>> Maybe you should learn to fly something other than your desk.
>>>
>>
>> I have Maxie...
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>
> B
>
>
>

QRQQREEEEEEEEEWERTY!




Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>>>
>> Make up your mind Maxie, you insinuated that this was not correct in
>> your last post..
>>
>> Bertie
>
> Sure I did putz, enjoy your delusion.
>
>

Thansk for the confirmation, maxine.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
:

>
> > wrote in message
> .
> ..
>
>>
>> So, so, did your wife ever get better?
>
> * JANUARY 23, 2009, 3:29 A.M. ET
>
> First Embryonic Stem-Cell Trial Gets Approval From the FDA
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> Maybe there is hope for her yet!!!!!!!!!!!!


Wow , dazzling tstuf there maxie.



Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in news:DCbel.4460$k57.1851
>> @newsfe09.iad:
> your syphilitic cough doing these days?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Ewww.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Bertie
>>>
>>> Bertie the echo puppet.
>>>
>>>
>> Maxwell, the zero.
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>
> Yeah, like that's related.
>
>
>

Yeh, like that's a glass of prune juice


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in news:sWGel.3207$2o3.2362
@newsfe10.iad:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Rich Ahrens > wrote in
>> . net:
>>
>>> on 1/22/09 10:06 PM Maxwell said the following:
>>>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>>>> . net...
>>>>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>>>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably
>>>>>> catastrophic engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a
>>>>>> relight in that situation.
>>>>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday
the
>>>>> NTSB was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing,
based
>>>>> on interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit
>>>>> recorder.
>>>>>
>>>>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>>>>
>>>>> “My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the
standard
>>>>> phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>>>>
>>>>> “Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.
>>>>>
>>>>> With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply,
>>>>> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from
falling
>>>>> out of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving through
a
>>>>> three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both the
engines.
>>>>
>>>> Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.
>>>
>>> Nope. Laughing my ass at how he's wiping the floor with you and how
>>> you're too thick to realize it.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> More like wiping the toilet with him, keeping in mind his golden
shower
>> fetish...
>>
>> Bertie
>
> C
>
>
>

QQQQQ


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in news:5OGel.63683$1k1.25544
@newsfe14.iad:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
>> :
>>
>>>
>>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>>>> ...
>>>>>> Flydive > wrote in
>>>>>> :
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Jan 20, 3:51 pm, wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this
switch?
>>>>>>>>> The manual states:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> At 2000 ft
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
>>>>>>>>> ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
>>>>>>>>> P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
>>>>>>>>> P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN
>>>>>>>>> ONE MINUTE" Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and
minimum
>>>>>>>>> ROD.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Poster
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> However if you're also working an inflight engine unstart which
>>>>>>>> takes precedence? Clarification: two engine unstart w/inflight
>>>>>>>> emergency. Quite a bit different from a situation that begins
at
>>>>>>>> cruise altitude or with only *one* emergency rather than a
>>>>>>>> sequence of events. As a PAX I would rather know that the crew
>>>>>>>> are concentrating on landing the aircraft (ditching) as gently
as
>>>>>>>> possible.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That silly switch won't do a thing to save the buoyancy if the
>>>>>>>> fuselage is fractured by a rough ditching...a point one
everyone
>>>>>>>> seems to miss.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I would hazard (grin) a guess that the final review will show
>>>>>>>> them to have maintained situational awareness with the
>>>>>>>> concomitant priority management.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Again, there are 2 pilots in the cockpit, only one is steering
the
>>>>>>> aircraft. If the captain was flying the aircraft, what was the
>>>>>>> copilot doing in those 7-8 minutes if he was not going through
the
>>>>>>> emergency checklist? What the use of a perfect water landing if
>>>>>>> then the aircraft quickly fill with water because the ditching
>>>>>>> checklist has not been done?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There were dozens of things he would be doing. One, determining
>>>>>> waht the problem was.
>>>>>> Then, dealing with the immediate problem, an engine failure.
>>>>>> Immediate relight attempt. Probably the APU was fired up to
assist
>>>>>> in the relight. as they would have been too slow for a windmill
>>>>>> start. Then a quick call to ATC and probalby a couple of nav
>>>>>> selections for the captain to look for a runway they could plunk
it
>>>>>> on.Then back to the relight drill. We're taught to keep trying
that
>>>>>> to the bitter end, BTW. They take a minute or so so he wouldn't
>>>>>> have had time for more than one or two, and that would have been
>>>>>> after the APU had fired up, say at abotu 1200'. A couple of
calls
>>>>>> to the cabin would have been tossed in their somewhere as well.
>>>>>> The act of picking up the book and finding the ditching checklist
>>>>>> would have taken a good 20-30 seconds...Time they simply did not
>>>>>> have. And this scenario is not done in the sim, so there would
have
>>>>>> been no trigger for it. BTW, I'm beign generous with the actions
>>>>>> they may or may not have accomplished in the time they had. But
all
>>>>>> of them would come ahead of doing a "nice to do " ditching
>>>>>> checklist.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bertie
>>>>>
>>>>> save the bed time story, you're starting to rattle more than
Dudley.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yeh, right wannabe boi.
>>>>
>>>> Bertie
>>>
>>>
>>> Really, you're beginning to talk more **** than a Jap radio.
>>
>> Well, any radio is going to talk **** in OKie, wannabe boi.
>> Bertie
>
> 1
>
>
>
>

2!

Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
>> :
>>
>>>
>>> "Flydive" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>
>>> You are arguing with the functional equivalent of a Japanese radio.
>>>
>>> He doesn't even possess the ability to realize he is wrong.
>>>
>>
>> Yeh, do tell know nothing boi
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>
> Truth hurts dumb ass. Just like you twisted insistence on answering
> every post, even to post arguments totally unrelated to the topic at
> hand.
>

Moi? Nope, just your's fjukkktard.


> You are obsessed with yourself. Enjoy, I find it a constant source of
> entertainment.
>
>

Of course you do.


Bertie

[[email protected]]

On Jan 24, 9:55*am, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:
> > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
>
>
> > So, so, did your wife ever get better?
>
> * * * JANUARY 23, 2009, 3:29 A.M. ET
>
> First Embryonic Stem-Cell Trial Gets Approval From the FDA
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Maybe there is hope for her yet!!!!!!!!!!!!

Interesting reply there Maximum, which voice in your head pooped out
that little tidbit?

And how many are in there? This would help explain your propensity
towards non-sequiturs; you're tired of losing arguments with yourself
and the frustration is expressed on the NG.

We all hope and pray you'll get better soon, whatever your sexual
orientation may be (today).

[[email protected]]

On Jan 21, 12:17*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> wrote :
>
> > On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST), wrote:
>
> >>Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>
> > The manual states:
>
> > At 2000 ft
>
> > CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
> > ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
> > P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
> > P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE MINUTE"
> > Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.
>
> Yep, and you have spent ag god couple of minutes diggin out the checklist
> and reading it out.
> Their rod would have been in the region of 1200 FPM, on average. *The
> priority woudl be a relight and loing for a place to land. Not reaidng the
> checklist.
>
> Bertie

Some are born to fly; some are born to fly a desk as an auditor and
checklist aficionado at the IRS.

The difficulty is in determining which are which before they get into
a cockpit...

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

wrote in
:

> On Jan 21, 12:17*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>> wrote :
>>
>> > On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >>Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>>
>> > The manual states:
>>
>> > At 2000 ft
>>
>> > CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
>> > ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
>> > P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
>> > P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE
>> > MINUT
> E"
>> > Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.
>>
>> Yep, and you have spent ag god couple of minutes diggin out the
>> checklist and reading it out.
>> Their rod would have been in the region of 1200 FPM, on average. *The
>> priority woudl be a relight and loing for a place to land. Not
>> reaidng th
> e
>> checklist.
>>
>> Bertie
>
> Some are born to fly; some are born to fly a desk as an auditor and
> checklist aficionado at the IRS.
>
> The difficulty is in determining which are which before they get into
> a cockpit...
>

It's not all that hard, really!
The sim sorts the whea from the chaff in most cases.

Bertie

[[email protected]]

On Jan 26, 10:37*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> wrote :
>
>
>
> > On Jan 21, 12:17*pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> >> wrote :
>
> >> > On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
> >> > wrote:
>
> >> >>Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>
> >> > The manual states:
>
> >> > At 2000 ft
>
> >> > CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
> >> > ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
> >> > P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
> >> > P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE
> >> > MINUT
> > E"
> >> > Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.
>
> >> Yep, and you have spent ag god couple of minutes diggin out the
> >> checklist and reading it out.
> >> Their rod would have been in the region of 1200 FPM, on average. *The
> >> priority woudl be a relight and loing for a place to land. Not
> >> reaidng th
> > e
> >> checklist.
>
> >> Bertie
>
> > Some are born to fly; some are born to fly a desk as an auditor and
> > checklist aficionado at the IRS.
>
> > The difficulty is in determining which are which before they get into
> > a cockpit...
>
> It's not all that hard, really!
> The sim sorts the whea from the chaff in most cases.
>
> Bertie

I would hope this to be the case.
BTW, to bring up an ugly subject, I gave the scenario a go in MS FS
using a 737 because I was too lazy to go look for an airbus. It got
awfully quiet at 3400' when I shut off both engines. Teterboro is
doable but in the sim at least there are a lot of broadcast antennae
in the area I hadn't considered...and since the runways at Laguardia
and Teterboro are parallel you have to fly an sweeping "S"...this was
not fun. The Hudson landing though was very nice however. Too bad
the sim thought it to be a crash, touchdown on the water (15 deg
flaps) was at 135 indicated. I wonder what it was for 1549.

[Tech Support]

On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 18:15:02 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip
> wrote:

>Flydive > wrote in :
>
>> wrote:
>>> On Jan 20, 10:11 am, Flydive > wrote:
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Low priority compared to flying the plane, deadstick, in a
>congested
>>>>> urban environment.
>>>>> Or would you rather he spend time looking for a button on the
>panel?
>>>> Well it takes 3 seconds to flip the switch, you should know where is
>>>> located.
>>>>
>>>> one pilot is flying the aircraft, the other one is assisting and
>going
>>>> through the checklist.
>>>
>>> Yep.
>>>
>>> Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>>>
>>> One may assume that since it was not flipped it was not at the top of
>>> the list and thus was of a lower priority. Flying the airplane and
>>> only those steps necessary to (1) avoid obstacles while (2) setting
>up
>>> for landing are of high(est) priority.
>>
>> The ditch switch is at the top of the ditching checklist and usually
>is
>> a memory item, if you are going to ditch I would say is a priority
>item.
>
>
>Only if you have time. Ditchig checklists don't have any memory items at
>all, and in fact Bus checklists, with most airlines, have very few
>memory drills. Lkikely the only memory checks are the engine fire drill
>and a pressurisations blowout, and those would have only the initial
>itiems on them.
>
>>
>> Airliners have 2 pilots and usually only one of them is handling the
>> controls, the other one takes care of the emergency and assists the
>> flying pilot. You say setting up for landing, well if you are
>"landing"
>
>No, you tell him to do what you need him to do in the circumstance. In
>this case, the non handler was probably try to relight and telling the
>cabin and ATC waht was happening.
>
>> in water the water, prepare the aircraft for ditching is part of it, a
>> priority.
>>
>Nope, not in this case. if they didn;t fly the airplane, the holes in
>the bottom of the airplane would have been the least of their problems,
>since they would have made significantly larger holes.
>********************************************

Bertie

Isn't there a saying "Fly the airplane to the crash site" or something
similar. Excellent advice and many lives have been saved doing that.
A controlled crash increases your odds of survival many times.

Big John

[Maxwell[_2_]]

<Tech Support> wrote in message
...

>
> Bertie
>
> Isn't there a saying "Fly the airplane to the crash site" or something
> similar. Excellent advice and many lives have been saved doing that.
> A controlled crash increases your odds of survival many times.
>
> Big John
>
>

As opposed to what?
Not flying the aircraft to the crash site, and having an uncontrolled crash.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

> wrote in message
...

I would hope this to be the case.
BTW, to bring up an ugly subject, I gave the scenario a go in MS FS
using a 737 because I was too lazy to go look for an airbus. It got
awfully quiet at 3400' when I shut off both engines. Teterboro is
doable but in the sim at least there are a lot of broadcast antennae
in the area I hadn't considered...and since the runways at Laguardia
and Teterboro are parallel you have to fly an sweeping "S"...this was
not fun. The Hudson landing though was very nice however. Too bad
the sim thought it to be a crash, touchdown on the water (15 deg
flaps) was at 135 indicated. I wonder what it was for 1549.

-----------------------------------------------------

What a dumb ass. You sound just like Mx.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> wrote in
> :
>
>> On Jan 21, 12:17 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>>> wrote :
>>>
>>> > On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:28:27 -0800 (PST),
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>> >>Where on the checklist is the instruction to flip this switch?
>>>
>>> > The manual states:
>>>
>>> > At 2000 ft
>>>
>>> > CABIN PRESS MODE SEL.............................Check AUTO
>>> > ENG 1 & 2 BLEED, APU BLEED.......................OFF
>>> > P/B DITCHING.....................................ON
>>> > P/A............................................."TOUCHDOWN IN ONE
>>> > MINUT
>> E"
>>> > Aim for an impact with an 11° body angle and minimum ROD.
>>>
>>> Yep, and you have spent ag god couple of minutes diggin out the
>>> checklist and reading it out.
>>> Their rod would have been in the region of 1200 FPM, on average. The
>>> priority woudl be a relight and loing for a place to land. Not
>>> reaidng th
>> e
>>> checklist.
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>
>> Some are born to fly; some are born to fly a desk as an auditor and
>> checklist aficionado at the IRS.
>>
>> The difficulty is in determining which are which before they get into
>> a cockpit...
>>
>
> It's not all that hard, really!
> The sim sorts the whea from the chaff in most cases.
>
> Bertie

Is that right, wanna be Chaffy boi?

You're pathetic.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Flydive" > wrote in message
...
> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>
>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>
> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are the real pilot, the real
> McCoy., good for you.
>
>
>
> > OK, let me explain this to you one last time.
>>
>>
>> When the situation is outside of traing and time is short, the checklist
>> goes out the window. End of story. The reason we do so much training is
>> that when something happens, the training is what takes over. Since we
>> don;'t train for a double engine failure after takeoff in a built up
>> area, there is no procedure and it is up to the commander to cobble
>> something together in the time available. Your continued whining that the
>> checklist is that important demonstrates inexperience or idiocy. I'll
>> give you the benefit of the doubt and assume the former.
>
>>
>> Bertie
>
> Well you said that the non flying pilot was busy doing check list, now you
> say no check list in a emergency, well ok.
>
> But anyway I see you now reached your limit of a normal conversation and
> you starting your usual name calling and insulting who has a different
> opinion, as usual after a few posts.
>
> Well, it's ok, I gave my opinion you gave yours, no need to continue.
>
> See you on another thread, eventually.
>

He always talks out of both sides of his mouth/ass. I seriously doubt he is
really a pilot. Just watch real carefully, over time you will see the holes
in his nonsense.

[Rich Ahrens[_2_]]

on 1/24/09 9:59 AM Maxwell said the following:
> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
> . net...
>> on 1/22/09 10:06 PM Maxwell said the following:
>>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>>> . net...
>>>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably catastrophic
>>>>> engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a relight in that
>>>>> situation.
>>>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday the NTSB
>>>> was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing, based on
>>>> interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit recorder.
>>>>
>>>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>>>
>>>> “My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the standard
>>>> phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>>>
>>>> “Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.
>>>>
>>>> With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply,
>>>> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from falling out
>>>> of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving through a
>>>> three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both the engines.
>>> Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.
>> Nope. Laughing my ass at how he's wiping the floor with you and how you're
>> too thick to realize it.
>>
>
> Still as stupid and obsessed with Gertie as ever. Good job retard.

If ever a post *begged* for a IKYABWAI...

[Edwin Lester]

"Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
ouse.com...

>> Still as stupid and obsessed with Gertie as ever. Good job retard.
>
> If ever a post *begged* for a IKYABWAI...
>

Chapping your lips on Gertie's ass again, uh.

Brother mikey mouth will get jealous. You know how protective he is of
daddy.

[Tech Support]

Sorry Bertie

My post was in support of the 'good' statements you have made about
flying.

Should have recoginized that posting in a troll thread would not be
accepted as was intended.

Fly safe.

Big John

****************************************


On Wed, 28 Jan 2009 10:01:39 -0600, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:

>
><Tech Support> wrote in message
...
>
>>
>> Bertie
>>
>> Isn't there a saying "Fly the airplane to the crash site" or something
>> similar. Excellent advice and many lives have been saved doing that.
>> A controlled crash increases your odds of survival many times.
>>
>> Big John
>>
>>
>
>As opposed to what?
>Not flying the aircraft to the crash site, and having an uncontrolled crash.
>
>

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "Flydive" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>
>>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>>
>> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are the real pilot, the
>> real McCoy., good for you.
>>
>>
>>
>> > OK, let me explain this to you one last time.
>>>
>>>
>>> When the situation is outside of traing and time is short, the
>>> checklist goes out the window. End of story. The reason we do so
>>> much training is that when something happens, the training is what
>>> takes over. Since we don;'t train for a double engine failure after
>>> takeoff in a built up area, there is no procedure and it is up to
>>> the commander to cobble something together in the time available.
>>> Your continued whining that the checklist is that important
>>> demonstrates inexperience or idiocy. I'll give you the benefit of
>>> the doubt and assume the former.
>>
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>
>> Well you said that the non flying pilot was busy doing check list,
>> now you say no check list in a emergency, well ok.
>>
>> But anyway I see you now reached your limit of a normal conversation
>> and you starting your usual name calling and insulting who has a
>> different opinion, as usual after a few posts.
>>
>> Well, it's ok, I gave my opinion you gave yours, no need to continue.
>>
>> See you on another thread, eventually.
>>
>
> He always talks out of both sides of his mouth/ass. I seriously doubt
> he is really a pilot. Just watch real carefully, over time you will
> see the holes in his nonsense.
>


Why don;' tyou point some out, maxie?


Go on..

Bertie
>

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

Rich Ahrens > wrote in
ouse.com:

> on 1/24/09 9:59 AM Maxwell said the following:
>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>> . net...
>>> on 1/22/09 10:06 PM Maxwell said the following:
>>>> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
>>>> . net...
>>>>> on 1/21/09 2:40 PM Flydive said the following:
>>>>>> The problem was multiple bird strikes, with most probably
>>>>>> catastrophic engine failure, I don't think you are going to try a
>>>>>> relight in that situation.
>>>>> Have you been following along at all? As early as last Saturday
>>>>> the NTSB was reporting that that is exactly what they were doing,
>>>>> based on interviews with the flight crew backed up by the cockpit
>>>>> recorder.
>>>>>
>>>>> From Saturday's NYT:
>>>>>
>>>>> “My aircraft,” he announced to his first officer, using the
>>>>> standard phrasing and protocol drilled into airline crews.
>>>>>
>>>>> “Your aircraft,” Mr. Skiles responded.
>>>>>
>>>>> With little thrust, and with the plane’s airspeed falling sharply,
>>>>> Captain Sullenberger lowered the nose to keep his plane from
>>>>> falling out of the sky. And he set his co-pilot to work at moving
>>>>> through a three-page checklist of procedures for restarting both
>>>>> the engines.
>>>> Hey Bich, long time. Still shadowing your hero ButtLipp I see.
>>> Nope. Laughing my ass at how he's wiping the floor with you and how
>>> you're too thick to realize it.
>>>
>>
>> Still as stupid and obsessed with Gertie as ever. Good job retard.
>
> If ever a post *begged* for a IKYABWAI...
>


And yet the irony will be completely lost on him and he'll post it
again.



Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Edwin Lester" > wrote in news:49813f98$0$31206
:

>
> "Rich Ahrens" > wrote in message
> ouse.com...
>
>>> Still as stupid and obsessed with Gertie as ever. Good job retard.
>>
>> If ever a post *begged* for a IKYABWAI...
>>
>
> Chapping your lips on Gertie's ass again, uh.
>
> Brother mikey mouth will get jealous. You know how protective he is of
> daddy.
>
>
>



Awww, sockpuppet time again, eh Maxie?



Delicious!



Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> <Tech Support> wrote in message
> ...
>
>>
>> Bertie
>>
>> Isn't there a saying "Fly the airplane to the crash site" or
>> something similar. Excellent advice and many lives have been saved
>> doing that. A controlled crash increases your odds of survival many
>> times.
>>
>> Big John
>>
>>
>
> As opposed to what?
> Not flying the aircraft to the crash site, and having an uncontrolled
> crash.
>
>
>
>
You're an idiot, aintcha maxie?



Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> > wrote in message
> ...
>
> I would hope this to be the case.
> BTW, to bring up an ugly subject, I gave the scenario a go in MS FS
> using a 737 because I was too lazy to go look for an airbus. It got
> awfully quiet at 3400' when I shut off both engines. Teterboro is
> doable but in the sim at least there are a lot of broadcast antennae
> in the area I hadn't considered...and since the runways at Laguardia
> and Teterboro are parallel you have to fly an sweeping "S"...this was
> not fun. The Hudson landing though was very nice however. Too bad
> the sim thought it to be a crash, touchdown on the water (15 deg
> flaps) was at 135 indicated. I wonder what it was for 1549.
>
> -----------------------------------------------------
>
> What a dumb ass. You sound just like Mx.
>

What a fjuktard, you sound just like maxie.


Bertie
>

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Tech Support <> wrote in
:

> Sorry Bertie
>
> My post was in support of the 'good' statements you have made about
> flying.
>
> Should have recoginized that posting in a troll thread would not be
> accepted as was intended.
>
> Fly safe.
>
> Big John

Thanks BJ Well, you could always killfile maxie.


Bertie
>

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> Tech Support <> wrote in
> :
>
>> Sorry Bertie
>>
>> My post was in support of the 'good' statements you have made about
>> flying.
>>
>> Should have recoginized that posting in a troll thread would not be
>> accepted as was intended.
>>
>> Fly safe.
>>
>> Big John
>
> Thanks BJ Well, you could always killfile maxie.
>
>
> Bertie
>>
>

Cool, go get mikey and bichy, and make it a 4 way!!!

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...

>
>
> Why don;' tyou point some out, maxie?
>
>
> Go on..
>
> Bertie
>>
>

Too much fun watching you trip on your crank, and I bet I'm not the only one
noticing.

[=z=]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :
>
>>
>> "Flydive" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>
>>>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>>>
>>> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are the real pilot, the
>>> real McCoy., good for you.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > OK, let me explain this to you one last time.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> When the situation is outside of traing and time is short, the
>>>> checklist goes out the window. End of story. The reason we do so
>>>> much training is that when something happens, the training is what
>>>> takes over. Since we don;'t train for a double engine failure after
>>>> takeoff in a built up area, there is no procedure and it is up to
>>>> the commander to cobble something together in the time available.
>>>> Your continued whining that the checklist is that important
>>>> demonstrates inexperience or idiocy. I'll give you the benefit of
>>>> the doubt and assume the former.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Bertie
>>>
>>> Well you said that the non flying pilot was busy doing check list,
>>> now you say no check list in a emergency, well ok.
>>>
>>> But anyway I see you now reached your limit of a normal conversation
>>> and you starting your usual name calling and insulting who has a
>>> different opinion, as usual after a few posts.
>>>
>>> Well, it's ok, I gave my opinion you gave yours, no need to continue.
>>>
>>> See you on another thread, eventually.
>>>
>>
>> He always talks out of both sides of his mouth/ass. I seriously doubt
>> he is really a pilot. Just watch real carefully, over time you will
>> see the holes in his nonsense.
>>
>
>
> Why don;' tyou point some out, maxie?
>
>
> Go on..
>
> Bertie
>>
> who gives a "flying ****" anyway...go run around the living room with your
> replica of a 1942 p-51 mustang and have a ****ing orgasm...then
> accidentally fly it into the toilet, with you in it...

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in news:73ugl.46174$Ew6.23518
@newsfe22.iad:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Tech Support <> wrote in
>> :
>>
>>> Sorry Bertie
>>>
>>> My post was in support of the 'good' statements you have made about
>>> flying.
>>>
>>> Should have recoginized that posting in a troll thread would not be
>>> accepted as was intended.
>>>
>>> Fly safe.
>>>
>>> Big John
>>
>> Thanks BJ Well, you could always killfile maxie.
>>
>>
>> Bertie
>>>
>>
>
> Cool, go get mikey and bichy, and make it a 4 way!!!

Awww, gay lames.

How.. predictable.

ANd they say so much about you too Maxie!

Thanks for sharin.

Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"=z=" > wrote in
:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
>> :
>>
>>>
>>> "Flydive" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>>>>
>>>> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are the real pilot,
>>>> the real McCoy., good for you.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> > OK, let me explain this to you one last time.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> When the situation is outside of traing and time is short, the
>>>>> checklist goes out the window. End of story. The reason we do so
>>>>> much training is that when something happens, the training is what
>>>>> takes over. Since we don;'t train for a double engine failure
>>>>> after takeoff in a built up area, there is no procedure and it is
>>>>> up to the commander to cobble something together in the time
>>>>> available. Your continued whining that the checklist is that
>>>>> important demonstrates inexperience or idiocy. I'll give you the
>>>>> benefit of the doubt and assume the former.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Bertie
>>>>
>>>> Well you said that the non flying pilot was busy doing check list,
>>>> now you say no check list in a emergency, well ok.
>>>>
>>>> But anyway I see you now reached your limit of a normal
>>>> conversation and you starting your usual name calling and insulting
>>>> who has a different opinion, as usual after a few posts.
>>>>
>>>> Well, it's ok, I gave my opinion you gave yours, no need to
>>>> continue.
>>>>
>>>> See you on another thread, eventually.
>>>>
>>>
>>> He always talks out of both sides of his mouth/ass. I seriously
>>> doubt he is really a pilot. Just watch real carefully, over time you
>>> will see the holes in his nonsense.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Why don;' tyou point some out, maxie?
>>
>>
>> Go on..
>>
>> Bertie
>>>
>> who gives a "flying ****" anyway...go run around the living room with
>> your replica of a 1942 p-51 mustang and have a ****ing orgasm...then
>> accidentally fly it into the toilet, with you in it...

Wow, I sense issues.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>
>>
>> Why don;' tyou point some out, maxie?
>>
>>
>> Go on..
>>
>> Bertie
>>>
>>
>
> Too much fun watching you trip on your crank, and I bet I'm not the
> only one noticing.


Yes, there's a vertiable army of ya.

Bwawhahwhahw!

Bertie

[=z=]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> "=z=" > wrote in
> :
>
>>
>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
>>> :
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Flydive" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are the real pilot,
>>>>> the real McCoy., good for you.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> > OK, let me explain this to you one last time.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When the situation is outside of traing and time is short, the
>>>>>> checklist goes out the window. End of story. The reason we do so
>>>>>> much training is that when something happens, the training is what
>>>>>> takes over. Since we don;'t train for a double engine failure
>>>>>> after takeoff in a built up area, there is no procedure and it is
>>>>>> up to the commander to cobble something together in the time
>>>>>> available. Your continued whining that the checklist is that
>>>>>> important demonstrates inexperience or idiocy. I'll give you the
>>>>>> benefit of the doubt and assume the former.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bertie
>>>>>
>>>>> Well you said that the non flying pilot was busy doing check list,
>>>>> now you say no check list in a emergency, well ok.
>>>>>
>>>>> But anyway I see you now reached your limit of a normal
>>>>> conversation and you starting your usual name calling and insulting
>>>>> who has a different opinion, as usual after a few posts.
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, it's ok, I gave my opinion you gave yours, no need to
>>>>> continue.
>>>>>
>>>>> See you on another thread, eventually.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> He always talks out of both sides of his mouth/ass. I seriously
>>>> doubt he is really a pilot. Just watch real carefully, over time you
>>>> will see the holes in his nonsense.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Why don;' tyou point some out, maxie?
>>>
>>>
>>> Go on..
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>>>
>>> who gives a "flying ****" anyway...go run around the living room with
>>> your replica of a 1942 p-51 mustang and have a ****ing orgasm...then
>>> accidentally fly it into the toilet, with you in it...
>
> Wow, I sense issues.
>
>
> issues? you mean like when the clinic told you that your junks got
> herpes?...wazzup dog... 8 )

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>>
>>
>> Too much fun watching you trip on your crank, and I bet I'm not the
>> only one noticing.
>
>
> Yes, there's a vertiable army of ya.
>
> Bwawhahwhahw!
>
> Bertie
>

I guess you're too stupid, or obsessed with your twisted perception of
yourself - to realize no one except a small hand full of local dick heads
ever respond to your posts.

Not to mention 95% of your posts go totally unanswered, even by the few
local dick heads.

What or you smoking, snorting or shooting up? Must be some really good ****,
because you even top Mx in your perceptions of your own self worth and
abilities. At least he knows what he is not.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"=z=" > wrote in news:7TTgl.198$O8.80
@bignews8.bellsouth.net:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "=z=" > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>>
>>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
>>>> :
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Flydive" > wrote in message
>>>>> ...
>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are the real pilot,
>>>>>> the real McCoy., good for you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> > OK, let me explain this to you one last time.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> When the situation is outside of traing and time is short, the
>>>>>>> checklist goes out the window. End of story. The reason we do so
>>>>>>> much training is that when something happens, the training is
what
>>>>>>> takes over. Since we don;'t train for a double engine failure
>>>>>>> after takeoff in a built up area, there is no procedure and it
is
>>>>>>> up to the commander to cobble something together in the time
>>>>>>> available. Your continued whining that the checklist is that
>>>>>>> important demonstrates inexperience or idiocy. I'll give you the
>>>>>>> benefit of the doubt and assume the former.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bertie
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Well you said that the non flying pilot was busy doing check
list,
>>>>>> now you say no check list in a emergency, well ok.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But anyway I see you now reached your limit of a normal
>>>>>> conversation and you starting your usual name calling and
insulting
>>>>>> who has a different opinion, as usual after a few posts.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Well, it's ok, I gave my opinion you gave yours, no need to
>>>>>> continue.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> See you on another thread, eventually.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> He always talks out of both sides of his mouth/ass. I seriously
>>>>> doubt he is really a pilot. Just watch real carefully, over time
you
>>>>> will see the holes in his nonsense.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Why don;' tyou point some out, maxie?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Go on..
>>>>
>>>> Bertie
>>>>>
>>>> who gives a "flying ****" anyway...go run around the living room
with
>>>> your replica of a 1942 p-51 mustang and have a ****ing
orgasm...then
>>>> accidentally fly it into the toilet, with you in it...
>>
>> Wow, I sense issues.
>>
>>
>> issues? you mean like when the clinic told you that your junks got
>> herpes?...wazzup dog... 8 )
>
>
>



Yes, that must have been it. yawn




Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>>>
>>>
>>> Too much fun watching you trip on your crank, and I bet I'm not the
>>> only one noticing.
>>
>>
>> Yes, there's a vertiable army of ya.
>>
>> Bwawhahwhahw!
>>
>> Bertie
>>
>
> I guess you're too stupid, or obsessed with your twisted perception of
> yourself - to realize no one except a small hand full of local dick
> heads ever respond to your posts.
>

Only need one dickhead responding maxie.



> Not to mention 95% of your posts go totally unanswered, even by the
> few local dick heads.


Actually, none of them go unanswered, maxie. YOu answera all of them

hadn't niticed?
>
> What or you smoking, snorting or shooting up

Must be some really good
> ****, because you even top Mx in your perceptions of your own self
> worth and abilities. At least he knows what he is not.
>


I'm high on k00ks, maxie high on k00ks.



Bertie
>



>

[=z=]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> "=z=" > wrote in news:7TTgl.198$O8.80
> @bignews8.bellsouth.net:
>
>>
>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> "=z=" > wrote in
>>> :
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
>>>>> :
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Flydive" > wrote in message
>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are the real pilot,
>>>>>>> the real McCoy., good for you.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> > OK, let me explain this to you one last time.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> When the situation is outside of traing and time is short, the
>>>>>>>> checklist goes out the window. End of story. The reason we do so
>>>>>>>> much training is that when something happens, the training is
> what
>>>>>>>> takes over. Since we don;'t train for a double engine failure
>>>>>>>> after takeoff in a built up area, there is no procedure and it
> is
>>>>>>>> up to the commander to cobble something together in the time
>>>>>>>> available. Your continued whining that the checklist is that
>>>>>>>> important demonstrates inexperience or idiocy. I'll give you the
>>>>>>>> benefit of the doubt and assume the former.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Bertie
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Well you said that the non flying pilot was busy doing check
> list,
>>>>>>> now you say no check list in a emergency, well ok.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But anyway I see you now reached your limit of a normal
>>>>>>> conversation and you starting your usual name calling and
> insulting
>>>>>>> who has a different opinion, as usual after a few posts.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Well, it's ok, I gave my opinion you gave yours, no need to
>>>>>>> continue.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> See you on another thread, eventually.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> He always talks out of both sides of his mouth/ass. I seriously
>>>>>> doubt he is really a pilot. Just watch real carefully, over time
> you
>>>>>> will see the holes in his nonsense.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Why don;' tyou point some out, maxie?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Go on..
>>>>>
>>>>> Bertie
>>>>>>
>>>>> who gives a "flying ****" anyway...go run around the living room
> with
>>>>> your replica of a 1942 p-51 mustang and have a ****ing
> orgasm...then
>>>>> accidentally fly it into the toilet, with you in it...
>>>
>>> Wow, I sense issues.
>>>
>>>
>>> issues? you mean like when the clinic told you that your junks got
>>> herpes?...wazzup dog... 8 )
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> Yes, that must have been it. yawn
>
> Bertie
>
> yea, i remembrer when i had my first beer too....don't feel bad....

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"ah" > wrote in message
anews.com...
> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>> ah > wrote in news:49842b2f$0$35412
>> :
>>
>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>> ah > wrote in
>>>> anews.com:
>>>>
>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:4980fc5d$0$35426
>>>>>> :
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497e7132$0$35409
>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497c49da$0$72722
>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497bbfc5$0$57681
>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:4977ffae$0$35394
>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:4977e7b8$0$35424
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Flydive > wrote in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> real
>>>>>>>>>> pilot,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the real McCoy., good for you.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Nope I fly little airplanes too.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Everyone need a little prop.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, of course.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No surprise there, really.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Goes without saying.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> PYP!
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> GDG!
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure I like your tone.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure i like your balance.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure I like your pitch.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Maybe, but my volume has often been awarded top marks.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I've heard.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Did you really used to run a parts re-licensing Ponzi thing?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I ran several as well as a discount liver transplant service.
>>>>>
>>>>> I always liked the Liver business . . . 75% of the product could
>>>>> spoil, and you'd still make a profit!
>>>>
>>>> ANd the regenerate. You coudl start a little farm
>>>
>>> GOod lord, Man!
>>>
>>> I take it you've never had to personally feed a liver, let alone fund
>> the
>>> expense . . . ?
>>
>> Burgers, made from cats and dogs form the spca, of course.
>
> Follows function . . . I know what you mean.
>
>>
>> Been done for years at Burger King.
>
> You a vegetarian, Bert?
> --
> ah

Certainly not, he's a **** eater.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"=z=" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "=z=" > wrote in news:7TTgl.198$O8.80
>> @bignews8.bellsouth.net:
>>
>>>
>>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> "=z=" > wrote in
>>>> :
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>>>> ...
>>>>>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
>>>>>> :
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "Flydive" > wrote in message
>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are the real pilot,
>>>>>>>> the real McCoy., good for you.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> > OK, let me explain this to you one last time.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> When the situation is outside of traing and time is short, the
>>>>>>>>> checklist goes out the window. End of story. The reason we do so
>>>>>>>>> much training is that when something happens, the training is
>> what
>>>>>>>>> takes over. Since we don;'t train for a double engine failure
>>>>>>>>> after takeoff in a built up area, there is no procedure and it
>> is
>>>>>>>>> up to the commander to cobble something together in the time
>>>>>>>>> available. Your continued whining that the checklist is that
>>>>>>>>> important demonstrates inexperience or idiocy. I'll give you the
>>>>>>>>> benefit of the doubt and assume the former.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Bertie
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Well you said that the non flying pilot was busy doing check
>> list,
>>>>>>>> now you say no check list in a emergency, well ok.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But anyway I see you now reached your limit of a normal
>>>>>>>> conversation and you starting your usual name calling and
>> insulting
>>>>>>>> who has a different opinion, as usual after a few posts.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Well, it's ok, I gave my opinion you gave yours, no need to
>>>>>>>> continue.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> See you on another thread, eventually.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> He always talks out of both sides of his mouth/ass. I seriously
>>>>>>> doubt he is really a pilot. Just watch real carefully, over time
>> you
>>>>>>> will see the holes in his nonsense.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why don;' tyou point some out, maxie?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Go on..
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bertie
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> who gives a "flying ****" anyway...go run around the living room
>> with
>>>>>> your replica of a 1942 p-51 mustang and have a ****ing
>> orgasm...then
>>>>>> accidentally fly it into the toilet, with you in it...
>>>>
>>>> Wow, I sense issues.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> issues? you mean like when the clinic told you that your junks got
>>>> herpes?...wazzup dog... 8 )
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Yes, that must have been it. yawn
>>
>> Bertie
>>
>> yea, i remembrer when i had my first beer too....don't feel bad....
>
>

Actually, he's nothing more interesting than a common retard.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "ah" > wrote in message
> anews.com...
>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>> ah > wrote in news:49842b2f$0$35412
>>> :
>>>
>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>> ah > wrote in
>>>>> anews.com:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:4980fc5d$0$35426
>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497e7132$0$35409
>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497c49da$0$72722
>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497bbfc5$0$57681
>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:4977ffae$0$35394
>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:4977e7b8$0
$35424
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Flydive > wrote in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are
the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> real
>>>>>>>>>>> pilot,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the real McCoy., good for you.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Nope I fly little airplanes too.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Everyone need a little prop.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, of course.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No surprise there, really.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Goes without saying.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PYP!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> GDG!
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure I like your tone.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure i like your balance.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure I like your pitch.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Maybe, but my volume has often been awarded top marks.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've heard.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Did you really used to run a parts re-licensing Ponzi thing?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I ran several as well as a discount liver transplant service.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I always liked the Liver business . . . 75% of the product could
>>>>>> spoil, and you'd still make a profit!
>>>>>
>>>>> ANd the regenerate. You coudl start a little farm
>>>>
>>>> GOod lord, Man!
>>>>
>>>> I take it you've never had to personally feed a liver, let alone
fund
>>> the
>>>> expense . . . ?
>>>
>>> Burgers, made from cats and dogs form the spca, of course.
>>
>> Follows function . . . I know what you mean.
>>
>>>
>>> Been done for years at Burger King.
>>
>> You a vegetarian, Bert?
>> --
>> ah
>
> Certainly not, he's a **** eater.

Well I ate you for breakfast, so... you might have a point !

Tell me this maxi, do you evne see it coming when you set yourself up
for a whack like that ?



Bertie

[Maxwell[_2_]]

"Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
...
> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :
>
>>
>> "ah" > wrote in message
>> anews.com...
>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>> ah > wrote in news:49842b2f$0$35412
>>>> :
>>>>
>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>> ah > wrote in
>>>>>> anews.com:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:4980fc5d$0$35426
>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497e7132$0$35409
>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497c49da$0$72722
>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497bbfc5$0$57681
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:4977ffae$0$35394
>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:4977e7b8$0
> $35424
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Flydive > wrote in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are
> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> real
>>>>>>>>>>>> pilot,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the real McCoy., good for you.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Nope I fly little airplanes too.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Everyone need a little prop.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, of course.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No surprise there, really.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Goes without saying.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PYP!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> GDG!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure I like your tone.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure i like your balance.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure I like your pitch.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Maybe, but my volume has often been awarded top marks.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I've heard.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Did you really used to run a parts re-licensing Ponzi thing?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I ran several as well as a discount liver transplant service.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I always liked the Liver business . . . 75% of the product could
>>>>>>> spoil, and you'd still make a profit!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ANd the regenerate. You coudl start a little farm
>>>>>
>>>>> GOod lord, Man!
>>>>>
>>>>> I take it you've never had to personally feed a liver, let alone
> fund
>>>> the
>>>>> expense . . . ?
>>>>
>>>> Burgers, made from cats and dogs form the spca, of course.
>>>
>>> Follows function . . . I know what you mean.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Been done for years at Burger King.
>>>
>>> You a vegetarian, Bert?
>>> --
>>> ah
>>
>> Certainly not, he's a **** eater.
>
> Well I ate you for breakfast, so... you might have a point !
>
> Tell me this maxi, do you evne see it coming when you set yourself up
> for a whack like that ?
>

What, for you to confess that you ate me this morning?

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "=z=" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> "=z=" > wrote in news:7TTgl.198$O8.80
>>> @bignews8.bellsouth.net:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>> "=z=" > wrote in
>>>>> :
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Flydive" > wrote in message
>>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are the real
pilot,
>>>>>>>>> the real McCoy., good for you.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> > OK, let me explain this to you one last time.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> When the situation is outside of traing and time is short,
the
>>>>>>>>>> checklist goes out the window. End of story. The reason we do
so
>>>>>>>>>> much training is that when something happens, the training is
>>> what
>>>>>>>>>> takes over. Since we don;'t train for a double engine failure
>>>>>>>>>> after takeoff in a built up area, there is no procedure and
it
>>> is
>>>>>>>>>> up to the commander to cobble something together in the time
>>>>>>>>>> available. Your continued whining that the checklist is that
>>>>>>>>>> important demonstrates inexperience or idiocy. I'll give you
the
>>>>>>>>>> benefit of the doubt and assume the former.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Bertie
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Well you said that the non flying pilot was busy doing check
>>> list,
>>>>>>>>> now you say no check list in a emergency, well ok.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> But anyway I see you now reached your limit of a normal
>>>>>>>>> conversation and you starting your usual name calling and
>>> insulting
>>>>>>>>> who has a different opinion, as usual after a few posts.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Well, it's ok, I gave my opinion you gave yours, no need to
>>>>>>>>> continue.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> See you on another thread, eventually.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> He always talks out of both sides of his mouth/ass. I seriously
>>>>>>>> doubt he is really a pilot. Just watch real carefully, over
time
>>> you
>>>>>>>> will see the holes in his nonsense.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why don;' tyou point some out, maxie?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Go on..
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bertie
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> who gives a "flying ****" anyway...go run around the living room
>>> with
>>>>>>> your replica of a 1942 p-51 mustang and have a ****ing
>>> orgasm...then
>>>>>>> accidentally fly it into the toilet, with you in it...
>>>>>
>>>>> Wow, I sense issues.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> issues? you mean like when the clinic told you that your junks got
>>>>> herpes?...wazzup dog... 8 )
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, that must have been it. yawn
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>>
>>> yea, i remembrer when i had my first beer too....don't feel bad....
>>
>>
>
> Actually, he's nothing more interesting than a common retard.


And lamer and almer and lamer and lamer..


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in news:Y07hl.960$uw7.149
@newsfe01.iad:
>>
>>>
>>> "ah" > wrote in message
>>> anews.com...
>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>> ah > wrote in news:49842b2f$0$35412
>>>>> :
>>>>>
>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>> ah > wrote in
>>>>>>> anews.com:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:4980fc5d$0$35426
>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497e7132$0$35409
>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497c49da$0$72722
>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497bbfc5$0
$57681
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:4977ffae$0$35394
>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:4977e7b8$0
>> $35424
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Flydive > wrote in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are
>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> real
>>>>>>>>>>>>> pilot,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the real McCoy., good for you.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Nope I fly little airplanes too.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Everyone need a little prop.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, of course.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No surprise there, really.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Goes without saying.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PYP!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> GDG!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure I like your tone.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure i like your balance.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure I like your pitch.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Maybe, but my volume has often been awarded top marks.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I've heard.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Did you really used to run a parts re-licensing Ponzi thing?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I ran several as well as a discount liver transplant service.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I always liked the Liver business . . . 75% of the product
could
>>>>>>>> spoil, and you'd still make a profit!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ANd the regenerate. You coudl start a little farm
>>>>>>
>>>>>> GOod lord, Man!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I take it you've never had to personally feed a liver, let alone
>> fund
>>>>> the
>>>>>> expense . . . ?
>>>>>
>>>>> Burgers, made from cats and dogs form the spca, of course.
>>>>
>>>> Follows function . . . I know what you mean.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Been done for years at Burger King.
>>>>
>>>> You a vegetarian, Bert?
>>>> --
>>>> ah
>>>
>>> Certainly not, he's a **** eater.
>>
>> Well I ate you for breakfast, so... you might have a point !
>>
>> Tell me this maxi, do you evne see it coming when you set yourself up
>> for a whack like that ?
>>
>
> What, for you to confess that you ate me this morning?
>

Yep.


whoosh




Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in
:

>
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>>>
>>>
>>> Too much fun watching you trip on your crank, and I bet I'm not the
>>> only one noticing.
>>
>>
>> Yes, there's a vertiable army of ya.
>>
>> Bwawhahwhahw!
>>
>> Bertie
>>
>
> I guess you're too stupid, or obsessed with your twisted perception of
> yourself - to realize no one except a small hand full of local dick
> heads ever respond to your posts.
>
> Not to mention 95% of your posts go totally unanswered, even by the
> few local dick heads.
>
> What or you smoking, snorting or shooting up? Must be some really good
> ****, because you even top Mx in your perceptions of your own self
> worth and abilities. At least he knows what he is not.
>


Uh yeh, righ tmaxie.

Good one.


You really got me on th eropes again.

Bertie

[[email protected]]

On Jan 31, 9:19*am, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>
>
>
> >> Too much fun watching you trip on your crank, and I bet I'm not the
> >> only one noticing.
>
> > Yes, there's a vertiable army of ya.
>
> > Bwawhahwhahw!
>
> > Bertie
>
> I guess you're too stupid, or obsessed with your twisted perception of
> yourself - to realize no one except a small hand full of local dick heads
> ever respond to your posts.
>
> Not to mention 95% of your posts go totally unanswered, even by the few
> local dick heads.
>
> What or you smoking, snorting or shooting up? Must be some really good ****,
> because you even top Mx in your perceptions of your own self worth and
> abilities. At least he knows what he is not.

You appear to be the majority of responders, oh bear of little brain.
Run the stats sometime and verify for yourself.
Maxie- the sound of one hand wanking.

[Maxwell[_2_]]

> wrote in message
...
On Jan 31, 9:19 am, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:
> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>
>
>
> >> Too much fun watching you trip on your crank, and I bet I'm not the
> >> only one noticing.
>
> > Yes, there's a vertiable army of ya.
>
> > Bwawhahwhahw!
>
> > Bertie
>
> I guess you're too stupid, or obsessed with your twisted perception of
> yourself - to realize no one except a small hand full of local dick heads
> ever respond to your posts.
>
> Not to mention 95% of your posts go totally unanswered, even by the few
> local dick heads.
>
> What or you smoking, snorting or shooting up? Must be some really good
> ****,
> because you even top Mx in your perceptions of your own self worth and
> abilities. At least he knows what he is not.

You appear to be the majority of responders, oh bear of little brain.
Run the stats sometime and verify for yourself.
Maxie- the sound of one hand wanking.

---------------------------------------------------------------

Only if you are a desperate as Gertie, to call my posts a response.
Sargie - at least you can suck and type at the same time.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

wrote in
:

> On Jan 31, 9:19*am, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:
>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>
>>
>>
>> >> Too much fun watching you trip on your crank, and I bet I'm not
>> >> the only one noticing.
>>
>> > Yes, there's a vertiable army of ya.
>>
>> > Bwawhahwhahw!
>>
>> > Bertie
>>
>> I guess you're too stupid, or obsessed with your twisted perception
>> of yourself - to realize no one except a small hand full of local
>> dick heads ever respond to your posts.
>>
>> Not to mention 95% of your posts go totally unanswered, even by the
>> few local dick heads.
>>
>> What or you smoking, snorting or shooting up? Must be some really
>> good sh
> it,
>> because you even top Mx in your perceptions of your own self worth
>> and abilities. At least he knows what he is not.
>
> You appear to be the majority of responders, oh bear of little brain.
> Run the stats sometime and verify for yourself.
> Maxie- the sound of one hand wanking.
>
Keyboard!

Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> > wrote in message
> news:04b492f8-5301-4129-8d0f-
..
> . On Jan 31, 9:19 am, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:
>> "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>>
>>
>>
>> >> Too much fun watching you trip on your crank, and I bet I'm not
>> >> the only one noticing.
>>
>> > Yes, there's a vertiable army of ya.
>>
>> > Bwawhahwhahw!
>>
>> > Bertie
>>
>> I guess you're too stupid, or obsessed with your twisted perception
>> of yourself - to realize no one except a small hand full of local
>> dick heads ever respond to your posts.
>>
>> Not to mention 95% of your posts go totally unanswered, even by the
>> few local dick heads.
>>
>> What or you smoking, snorting or shooting up? Must be some really
>> good ****,
>> because you even top Mx in your perceptions of your own self worth
>> and abilities. At least he knows what he is not.
>
> You appear to be the majority of responders, oh bear of little brain.
> Run the stats sometime and verify for yourself.
> Maxie- the sound of one hand wanking.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Only if you are a desperate as Gertie, to call my posts a response.


Yeh, what are they then okie boi?



> Sargie - at least you can suck and type at the same time.





Goood grief.

Bertie

[[email protected]]

On Feb 2, 7:21*am, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:
> > wrote in message
>
> ...
> On Jan 31, 9:19 am, "Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote:
>
>
>
> > "Bertie the Bunyip" > wrote in message
>
> > >> Too much fun watching you trip on your crank, and I bet I'm not the
> > >> only one noticing.
>
> > > Yes, there's a vertiable army of ya.
>
> > > Bwawhahwhahw!
>
> > > Bertie
>
> > I guess you're too stupid, or obsessed with your twisted perception of
> > yourself - to realize no one except a small hand full of local dick heads
> > ever respond to your posts.
>
> > Not to mention 95% of your posts go totally unanswered, even by the few
> > local dick heads.
>
> > What or you smoking, snorting or shooting up? Must be some really good
> > ****,
> > because you even top Mx in your perceptions of your own self worth and
> > abilities. At least he knows what he is not.
>
> You appear to be the majority of responders, oh bear of little brain.
> Run the stats sometime and verify for yourself.
> Maxie- the sound of one hand wanking.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Only if you are a desperate as Gertie, to call my posts a response.

You remind me of Prez Clinton trying to redefine what is is. (Here's
a hint: did you hit 'Reply'? If you did then it's a response. Is
that clear enough?)

At least you're more amusing than he was, in a sad lonely by the light
of a guttering candle and a bottle of cheap wine kind of way.

[Bertie the Bunyip[_28_]]

"Maxwell" <#$$9#@%%%.^^^> wrote in :

>
> "ah" > wrote in message
> anews.com...
>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>> ah > wrote in news:49842b2f$0$35412
>>> :
>>>
>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>> ah > wrote in
>>>>> anews.com:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:4980fc5d$0$35426
>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497e7132$0$35409
>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497c49da$0$72722
>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:497bbfc5$0$57681
>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:4977ffae$0$35394
>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ah > wrote in news:4977e7b8$0
$35424
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Flydive > wrote in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh God a Barbie jet.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yea, ok, I see you fly the big big jets, you are
the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> real
>>>>>>>>>>> pilot,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the real McCoy., good for you.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Nope I fly little airplanes too.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Everyone need a little prop.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, of course.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No surprise there, really.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Goes without saying.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PYP!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> GDG!
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure I like your tone.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure i like your balance.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure I like your pitch.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Maybe, but my volume has often been awarded top marks.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've heard.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Did you really used to run a parts re-licensing Ponzi thing?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I ran several as well as a discount liver transplant service.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I always liked the Liver business . . . 75% of the product could
>>>>>> spoil, and you'd still make a profit!
>>>>>
>>>>> ANd the regenerate. You coudl start a little farm
>>>>
>>>> GOod lord, Man!
>>>>
>>>> I take it you've never had to personally feed a liver, let alone
fund
>>> the
>>>> expense . . . ?
>>>
>>> Burgers, made from cats and dogs form the spca, of course.
>>
>> Follows function . . . I know what you mean.
>>
>>>
>>> Been done for years at Burger King.
>>
>> You a vegetarian, Bert?
>> --
>> ah
>
> Certainly not, he's a **** eater.
>

Laaaame.



Bertie