Badwater Bill's Memorial Service

[John Ammeter]

For those of you that are near to Las Vegas....

The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary
6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm
(702-464-8470) (800-542-2902)


Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008
near Parowan, Utah. His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the
accident.

Oyster and I are coming down for the service and will be staying at the
Texas Station Friday, Saturday and Sunday nights. Anyone wishing to
hoist a drink in Billy's honor and memory is welcome to join us either
in the bar or our room.

Ed Sullivan, if you're still alive, come on over...

Jim Campbell, you're welcome to hoist one for Billy, too...

O'Ring, I know you're coming... get a room near us so we don't have to
travel that far after too many drinks, ok??

Tommy, maybe you ought to get a room so you can toss off a few for
Billy, too....

Jarvis, if you can find your way to the America's... we'll be waiting
for you to join us...

John "Anteater" Ammeter

[Morgans[_2_]]

"John Ammeter" > wrote
>
> The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary 6701
> N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm (702-464-8470)
> (800-542-2902)
>
>
> Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008 near
> Parowan, Utah. His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the accident.
>
> Oyster and I are coming down for the service and will be staying at the Texas
> Station Friday, Saturday and Sunday nights. Anyone wishing to hoist a drink
> in Billy's honor and memory is welcome to join us either in the bar or our
> room.

In memory of Bill, I realize this is probably not the time or place to go into
any kind of detailed (or any) answer, but for those of us that know of Bill only
through this group, I am still left wondering.

Is it known what caused the fateful crash? Perhaps a different thread, or wait
until later, but it was a bit of a shaker, to know someone as experienced as
Bill lost it, and perhaps there is something else for us all to learn from it
all.

And, also, I never heard how Janice is doing? I hope she has recovered from her
physical trauma, at least.

Sincerely wondering,
Jim in NC

[John Ammeter]

Jim,

I sent you a private email. If I didn't get the right address for you,
try emailing me by removing the "123" from my address here.

John

Morgans wrote:
>
> "John Ammeter" > wrote
>>
>> The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm
>> Mortuary 6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm
>> (702-464-8470) (800-542-2902)
>>
>>
>> Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008
>> near Parowan, Utah. His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the
>> accident.
>>
>> Oyster and I are coming down for the service and will be staying at
>> the Texas Station Friday, Saturday and Sunday nights. Anyone wishing
>> to hoist a drink in Billy's honor and memory is welcome to join us
>> either in the bar or our room.
>
> In memory of Bill, I realize this is probably not the time or place to
> go into any kind of detailed (or any) answer, but for those of us that
> know of Bill only through this group, I am still left wondering.
>
> Is it known what caused the fateful crash? Perhaps a different thread,
> or wait until later, but it was a bit of a shaker, to know someone as
> experienced as Bill lost it, and perhaps there is something else for us
> all to learn from it all.
>
> And, also, I never heard how Janice is doing? I hope she has recovered
> from her physical trauma, at least.
>
> Sincerely wondering,
> Jim in NC

[RogerN]

"John Ammeter" > wrote in message
news:cO2dnWwn7PqpnlrUnZ2dnUVZ_q_inZ2d@cablespeedmi .com...
> For those of you that are near to Las Vegas....
>
> The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary
> 6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm (702-464-8470)
> (800-542-2902)
>
>
> Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008 near
> Parowan, Utah. His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the accident.
>
> Oyster and I are coming down for the service and will be staying at the
> Texas Station Friday, Saturday and Sunday nights. Anyone wishing to hoist
> a drink in Billy's honor and memory is welcome to join us either in the
> bar or our room.
>
> Ed Sullivan, if you're still alive, come on over...
>
> Jim Campbell, you're welcome to hoist one for Billy, too...
>
> O'Ring, I know you're coming... get a room near us so we don't have to
> travel that far after too many drinks, ok??
>
> Tommy, maybe you ought to get a room so you can toss off a few for Billy,
> too....
>
> Jarvis, if you can find your way to the America's... we'll be waiting for
> you to join us...
>
> John "Anteater" Ammeter

I haven't been reading this newsgroup for years and just learned of BWB's
accident and death tonight. In the posts I've read years ago from him I
came to the opinion that he'd trash a poster considering them a worthless
piece of crap, but if that same poster was in trouble he'd go out of his way
and spend his own time and money to help someone out. He seemed to like to
mix it up on the newsgroup but if there ever was a serious problem I think
he had it in his heart to help. I guess another way to say it, I saw
through his grumpy old ******* act and saw a good hearted man. I read some
posts from back in October and unfortunately some didn't see through his
act.

RogerN

[John Ammeter]

Roger,

You've described Bill Phillips to a "T"... I know he paid for the
travel expenses of someone (not named, of course) to Pinckneyville one
year.

Oyster and I visited him once and the first night he brought out 4 beef
roasts... told us these were our steaks for that nights dinner. It took
almost an hour to cook them on the BBQ.

The next night he had 15 pounds of King Crab legs for us... four of us
at the dinner table. Before that I'd have said no one could put too
much crab in front of me.. that I could eat and eat crab.. he proved me
wrong. His story was that he'd got a "bargain" on the crab. A year or
two later we were talking about it and he confessed he'd paid dearly for
the crab but he'd wanted to "treat" us..

That was Billy... he was generous to his friends... he would,
literally, do anything for you if you needed help. But, if you tried to
take advantage of him he'd do his damnedest to put you down and show you
for the mooch you were... some people earned his disgust... and he
wasn't one to hold back with his opinion.

Like I posted before... a few of us will be at the Texas Station
Saturday night. Anyone that would like to join us in toasting Badwater
Bill, the biggest Asshole that ever walked the Earth and flew through
the skies... leave a message for me at the hotel. I'm sure you can
leave a message on my room phone. I'd give my cell phone number but I'm
afraid some numbnut would take advantage of that...

John

RogerN wrote:
> "John Ammeter" > wrote in message
> news:cO2dnWwn7PqpnlrUnZ2dnUVZ_q_inZ2d@cablespeedmi .com...
>> For those of you that are near to Las Vegas....
>>
>> The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary
>> 6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm (702-464-8470)
>> (800-542-2902)
>>
>>
>> Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008 near
>> Parowan, Utah. His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the accident.
>>
>> Oyster and I are coming down for the service and will be staying at the
>> Texas Station Friday, Saturday and Sunday nights. Anyone wishing to hoist
>> a drink in Billy's honor and memory is welcome to join us either in the
>> bar or our room.
>>
>> Ed Sullivan, if you're still alive, come on over...
>>
>> Jim Campbell, you're welcome to hoist one for Billy, too...
>>
>> O'Ring, I know you're coming... get a room near us so we don't have to
>> travel that far after too many drinks, ok??
>>
>> Tommy, maybe you ought to get a room so you can toss off a few for Billy,
>> too....
>>
>> Jarvis, if you can find your way to the America's... we'll be waiting for
>> you to join us...
>>
>> John "Anteater" Ammeter
>
> I haven't been reading this newsgroup for years and just learned of BWB's
> accident and death tonight. In the posts I've read years ago from him I
> came to the opinion that he'd trash a poster considering them a worthless
> piece of crap, but if that same poster was in trouble he'd go out of his way
> and spend his own time and money to help someone out. He seemed to like to
> mix it up on the newsgroup but if there ever was a serious problem I think
> he had it in his heart to help. I guess another way to say it, I saw
> through his grumpy old ******* act and saw a good hearted man. I read some
> posts from back in October and unfortunately some didn't see through his
> act.
>
> RogerN
>
>

[Dan Camper]

On Mon, 23 Mar 2009 19:05:45 -0700, John Ammeter wrote:

> Anyone that would like to join us in toasting Badwater
> Bill, the biggest Asshole that ever walked the Earth and flew through
> the skies... l

May I?

Question: Why is it when someone croaks there is always a "if you were
his friend" story? My bet is if it rains, no one will show for the
asshole's funeral.
--
http://tr.im/1f9p

[jan olieslagers[_2_]]

Dan Camper schreef:
> On Mon, 23 Mar 2009 19:05:45 -0700, John Ammeter wrote:
>
>> Anyone that would like to join us in toasting Badwater
>> Bill, the biggest Asshole that ever walked the Earth and flew through
>> the skies... l
>
> May I?

No.
Ploink.

[cavelamb[_2_]]

Dan Camper wrote:
> On Mon, 23 Mar 2009 19:05:45 -0700, John Ammeter wrote:
>
>> Anyone that would like to join us in toasting Badwater
>> Bill, the biggest Asshole that ever walked the Earth and flew through
>> the skies... l
>
> May I?
>
> Question: Why is it when someone croaks there is always a "if you were
> his friend" story? My bet is if it rains, no one will show for the
> asshole's funeral.

I guess you didn't know him...

[ທ້າວໃຂ່ມືດ]

On Mar 22, 11:34*pm, John Ammeter >
wrote:
> For those of you that are near to Las Vegas....
>
> The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary
> 6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm
> (702-464-8470) (800-542-2902)
>
> Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008
> near Parowan, Utah. *His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the
> accident.
>
> Oyster and I are coming down for the service and will be staying at the
> Texas Station Friday, Saturday and Sunday nights. *Anyone wishing to
> hoist a drink in Billy's honor and memory is welcome to join us either
> in the bar or our room.
>
> Ed Sullivan, if you're still alive, come on over...
>
> Jim Campbell, you're welcome to hoist one for Billy, too...
>
> O'Ring, I know you're coming... get a room near us so we don't have to
> travel that far after too many drinks, ok??
>
> Tommy, maybe you ought to get a room so you can toss off a few for
> Billy, too....
>
> Jarvis, if you can find your way to the America's... we'll be waiting
> for you to join us...
>
> John "Anteater" Ammeter

Thanks for the heads up John.

Monk

[Monk]

On Mar 22, 11:34*pm, John Ammeter >
wrote:
> For those of you that are near to Las Vegas....
>
> The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary
> 6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm
> (702-464-8470) (800-542-2902)
>
> Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008
> near Parowan, Utah. *His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the
> accident.
>
> Oyster and I are coming down for the service and will be staying at the
> Texas Station Friday, Saturday and Sunday nights. *Anyone wishing to
> hoist a drink in Billy's honor and memory is welcome to join us either
> in the bar or our room.
>
> Ed Sullivan, if you're still alive, come on over...
>
> Jim Campbell, you're welcome to hoist one for Billy, too...
>
> O'Ring, I know you're coming... get a room near us so we don't have to
> travel that far after too many drinks, ok??
>
> Tommy, maybe you ought to get a room so you can toss off a few for
> Billy, too....
>
> Jarvis, if you can find your way to the America's... we'll be waiting
> for you to join us...
>
> John "Anteater" Ammeter

Thanks for the heads up John.

Monk

[Peter Dohm]

"Dan Camper" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 23 Mar 2009 19:05:45 -0700, John Ammeter wrote:
>
>> Anyone that would like to join us in toasting Badwater
>> Bill, the biggest Asshole that ever walked the Earth and flew through
>> the skies... l
>
> May I?
>
> Question: Why is it when someone croaks there is always a "if you were
> his friend" story? My bet is if it rains, no one will show for the
> asshole's funeral.
> --
> http://tr.im/1f9p


Bill was clearly one of those people that I wish I could have known and his
usual usenet personality was a rather transparent put-on.

[Steve Foley[_4_]]

"John Ammeter" > wrote in message
news:cO2dnWwn7PqpnlrUnZ2dnUVZ_q_inZ2d@cablespeedmi .com...

> Anyone wishing to hoist a drink in Billy's honor and memory is welcome to
> join us either in the bar or our room.

I will certainly join you in hoisting a drink in BWB's memory, but it will
have to be from a few thousand miles away.

4pm EDT.

[John Ammeter]

It's the thought that counts...

John "Anteater"

Steve Foley wrote:
> "John Ammeter" > wrote in message
> news:cO2dnWwn7PqpnlrUnZ2dnUVZ_q_inZ2d@cablespeedmi .com...
>
>> Anyone wishing to hoist a drink in Billy's honor and memory is welcome to
>> join us either in the bar or our room.
>
> I will certainly join you in hoisting a drink in BWB's memory, but it will
> have to be from a few thousand miles away.
>
> 4pm EDT.
>
>

[Stealth Pilot[_2_]]

On Sun, 22 Mar 2009 20:34:02 -0700, John Ammeter
> wrote:

>For those of you that are near to Las Vegas....
>
>The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary
>6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm
>(702-464-8470) (800-542-2902)
>
>
>Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008
>near Parowan, Utah. His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the
>accident.
>

Bill was a rascally ol' good cookie. no doubt about it.

what's happened to boom boom? she ok?

Stealth Pilot

[Monk]

On Mar 25, 11:36*am, Stealth Pilot >
wrote:
> On Sun, 22 Mar 2009 20:34:02 -0700, John Ammeter
>
> > wrote:
> >For those of you that are near to Las Vegas....
>
> >The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary
> >6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm
> >(702-464-8470) (800-542-2902)
>
> >Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008
> >near Parowan, Utah. *His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the
> >accident.
>
> Bill was a rascally ol' good cookie. no doubt about it.
>
> what's happened to boom boom? she ok?
>
> Stealth Pilot

I was wondering about that as well. I was also wondering if she was
able to give an account of the accident yet.

Monk

[Stealth Pilot[_2_]]

On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 10:30:48 -0700 (PDT), Monk >
wrote:

>On Mar 25, 11:36*am, Stealth Pilot >
>wrote:
>> On Sun, 22 Mar 2009 20:34:02 -0700, John Ammeter
>>
>> > wrote:
>> >For those of you that are near to Las Vegas....
>>
>> >The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary
>> >6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm
>> >(702-464-8470) (800-542-2902)
>>
>> >Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008
>> >near Parowan, Utah. *His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the
>> >accident.
>>
>> Bill was a rascally ol' good cookie. no doubt about it.
>>
>> what's happened to boom boom? she ok?
>>
>> Stealth Pilot
>
>I was wondering about that as well. I was also wondering if she was
>able to give an account of the accident yet.
>
>Monk

a bump on the head will more than likely lead to some amnesia at that
point.
dont push her to remember the traumatic events that led to her hubby
buying the farm.
it will be kinder for her to forget.

Stealth Pilot
( in a rare moment of compassion :-) )

[Dan Camper]

On Tue, 24 Mar 2009 16:19:07 -0500, cavelamb wrote:

> Dan Camper wrote:
>> On Mon, 23 Mar 2009 19:05:45 -0700, John Ammeter wrote:
>>
>>> Anyone that would like to join us in toasting Badwater
>>> Bill, the biggest Asshole that ever walked the Earth and flew through
>>> the skies... l
>>
>> May I?
>>
>> Question: Why is it when someone croaks there is always a "if you were
>> his friend" story? My bet is if it rains, no one will show for the
>> asshole's funeral.
>
> I guess you didn't know him...

An asshole is an asshole.
--
http://tr.im/1f9p

[Ron Wanttaja]

Stealth Pilot wrote:

>> I was wondering about that as well. I was also wondering if she was
>> able to give an account of the accident yet.
>
> a bump on the head will more than likely lead to some amnesia at that
> point. dont push her to remember the traumatic events that led to her hubby
> buying the farm.it will be kinder for her to forget.

Unfortunately, without her, we'll never know what happened. The NTSB
preliminary report says observers saw clothing and other objects coming
off/out of the airplane soon after takeoff. This implies the canopy had
opened.

This has happened to other Lancair owners, and they claimed the airplane
was still flyable. Yet a nearly-identical Lancair accident occurred at
Sun-N-Fun earlier that year. One witness saw the pilot having trouble
closing the canopy before takeoff. After takeoff, objects floated down.
Another witness saw the plane after takeoff...the canopy was moving up
and down as if the pilot was trying to re-lock it.

Was the airplane in Florida unflyable...or was the pilot distracted by
trying to re-latch the canopy? We'll never really know, since the pilot
died in the crash and there was no passenger in this case.

Had Bill encountered canopy latching problems before? A downwind
takeoff with winds gusting to 20 knots implies that he might have been
in a hurry and not latched it properly. But if he'd had canopy problems
before, it's less likely the NTSB will attribute the accident to a
faulty preflight.

Was Bill wrestling with an uncontrollable airplane? Or was he
concentrating on trying to get the canopy closed instead of flying the
plane? Or did the blast of wind throw an object into his face, covering
his eyes and disorienting him? Or did the engine quit, with Bill
deliberately popping the canopy to keep from getting trapped in the cockpit?

Janice is the only one that could know.

Ron Wanttaja

[Stealth Pilot[_2_]]

On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 20:16:14 -0700, Ron Wanttaja
> wrote:

>Stealth Pilot wrote:
>
>>> I was wondering about that as well. I was also wondering if she was
>>> able to give an account of the accident yet.
>>
>> a bump on the head will more than likely lead to some amnesia at that
>> point. dont push her to remember the traumatic events that led to her hubby
>> buying the farm.it will be kinder for her to forget.
>
>Unfortunately, without her, we'll never know what happened. The NTSB
>preliminary report says observers saw clothing and other objects coming
>off/out of the airplane soon after takeoff. This implies the canopy had
>opened.
>
>This has happened to other Lancair owners, and they claimed the airplane
>was still flyable. Yet a nearly-identical Lancair accident occurred at
>Sun-N-Fun earlier that year. One witness saw the pilot having trouble
>closing the canopy before takeoff. After takeoff, objects floated down.
> Another witness saw the plane after takeoff...the canopy was moving up
>and down as if the pilot was trying to re-lock it.
>
>Was the airplane in Florida unflyable...or was the pilot distracted by
>trying to re-latch the canopy? We'll never really know, since the pilot
>died in the crash and there was no passenger in this case.
>
>Had Bill encountered canopy latching problems before? A downwind
>takeoff with winds gusting to 20 knots implies that he might have been
>in a hurry and not latched it properly. But if he'd had canopy problems
>before, it's less likely the NTSB will attribute the accident to a
>faulty preflight.
>
>Was Bill wrestling with an uncontrollable airplane? Or was he
>concentrating on trying to get the canopy closed instead of flying the
>plane? Or did the blast of wind throw an object into his face, covering
>his eyes and disorienting him? Or did the engine quit, with Bill
>deliberately popping the canopy to keep from getting trapped in the cockpit?
>
>Janice is the only one that could know.
>
>Ron Wanttaja
>

be gentle on her.

look it isnt rocket science.

canopies like on the corby starlet,most jodels and the Thorp T18 that
have a fixed front piece and a slide back bubble are the safest
because an unlatch in flight means nothing. they just fly shut.they
can be flown with the canopy all the way back if desired.

canopies that hinge sideways will blanket the wing if they come open
and a crash is almost inevitable.

canopies that hinge forward wont be latchable in flight because of the
lift generated (about 10% of total lift) easily overpowers any human
attempt to pull it back in position.

canopies that hinge backwards will just be blown away but may take the
pilots head off as they depart the aircraft.

some homebuilts have less than optimal design features but that is
part of the character of them.
every single homebuilt is different and lessons from one are seldom
transferrable to another.

from my perspective who cares what the NTSB attributes the crash to.
Bill wont care. It wont bring him back. It wont stop people making
poor design choices in homebuilts.

as I say be gentle on Janice. she is grieving the loss.

Stealth Pilot

[John Ammeter]

She was in the airplane and suffered severe injuries... spent almost
three months in the ICU, hospital, recovery center, etc...

She has no memory of the accident or the day of the accident.

John

Stealth Pilot wrote:
> On Sun, 22 Mar 2009 20:34:02 -0700, John Ammeter
> > wrote:
>
>> For those of you that are near to Las Vegas....
>>
>> The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary
>> 6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm
>> (702-464-8470) (800-542-2902)
>>
>>
>> Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008
>> near Parowan, Utah. His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the
>> accident.
>>
>
> Bill was a rascally ol' good cookie. no doubt about it.
>
> what's happened to boom boom? she ok?
>
> Stealth Pilot

[John Ammeter]

Dan Camper wrote:
> On Tue, 24 Mar 2009 16:19:07 -0500, cavelamb wrote:
>
>> Dan Camper wrote:
>>> On Mon, 23 Mar 2009 19:05:45 -0700, John Ammeter wrote:
>>>
>>>> Anyone that would like to join us in toasting Badwater
>>>> Bill, the biggest Asshole that ever walked the Earth and flew through
>>>> the skies... l
>>> May I?
>>>
>>> Question: Why is it when someone croaks there is always a "if you were
>>> his friend" story? My bet is if it rains, no one will show for the
>>> asshole's funeral.
>> I guess you didn't know him...
>
> An asshole is an asshole.
And I certainly recognize one right here... Bill "acted" like an
asshole as his persona... you, obviously, are an asshole... Your Mother
didn't much of a job raising you... too bad....

[Jim Logajan]

Stealth Pilot > wrote:
> canopies that hinge backwards will just be blown away but may take the
> pilots head off as they depart the aircraft.

Wouldn't the hinge also have to fail for the canopy to strike the occupants
of the cockpit? Otherwise I'm not sure how the geometry of the situation
would cause any part of the canopy to enter the cockpit to strike anyone in
it.

(I could see how such a canopy's hinge would fail eventually and causing
rudder damage.)

[cavelamb himself[_5_]]

Jim Logajan wrote:
> Stealth Pilot > wrote:
>> canopies that hinge backwards will just be blown away but may take the
>> pilots head off as they depart the aircraft.
>
> Wouldn't the hinge also have to fail for the canopy to strike the occupants
> of the cockpit? Otherwise I'm not sure how the geometry of the situation
> would cause any part of the canopy to enter the cockpit to strike anyone in
> it.
>
> (I could see how such a canopy's hinge would fail eventually and causing
> rudder damage.)

or undies wrapped around his head?

It had to be something pretty distracting.

[Morgans[_2_]]

"Stealth Pilot" > wrote

> from my perspective who cares what the NTSB attributes the crash to.
> Bill wont care. It wont bring him back. It wont stop people making
> poor design choices in homebuilts.
>
> as I say be gentle on Janice. she is grieving the loss.

All great truisms.

All humans are curious. They just want to know. Like you say, it won't bring
Bill back.

I agree about not pushing Janice. She has been through a lot, and has a lot to
work through in the future.

Even though she does not remember anything from the crash, months or years down
the road, she may start to remember glimpses of the crash. On the other hand,
she may not.

For now, those close to her just have to take care of her the best way they know
how.

You all lift one for me. I'll lift one from afar.
--
Jim in NC

[Ron Wanttaja]

Stealth Pilot wrote:

> some homebuilts have less than optimal design features but that is
> part of the character of them.
> every single homebuilt is different and lessons from one are seldom
> transferrable to another.
>
> from my perspective who cares what the NTSB attributes the crash to.
> Bill wont care. It wont bring him back. It wont stop people making
> poor design choices in homebuilts.

I respect your attitude, but I do not share it.

For one thing, the Lancair Legacy is not a "one-of." There are over 100
of them in the US registry alone. Bill had a "hired gun" build the
Lancair; the man built at least three of them (in addition to at least
one other type).

So I think it's important that the current Legacy owners know whether
there's a design flaw in the canopy latch. I think it's important for
owners of the hired gun's other aircraft to know whether their builder
had trouble getting the latch to work right.

Almost fourteen years ago, Steve Wittman and his wife were killed in the
crash of his O&O special. The accident resulted from his use of a mix
of covering processes (Poly-fiber fabric attached with nitrate dope).

Just *two weeks* ago, that accident was referenced in a Fly Baby mailing
list discussion of covering and painting processes.

About ten years ago, a very respected local homebuilder was killed. He
died because he didn't tighten a nut.

Every time I take a wrench to my airplane, I think of him and how even
the best can make mistakes.

So the lessons *do* get learned...but we need to do the research that
reveals the truths. If we learn nothing from this accident, then Bill's
death was a total waste.

Ron Wanttaja

[Stealth Pilot[_2_]]

On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 23:19:55 -0700, Ron Wanttaja
> wrote:

>Stealth Pilot wrote:
>
>> some homebuilts have less than optimal design features but that is
>> part of the character of them.
>> every single homebuilt is different and lessons from one are seldom
>> transferrable to another.
>>
>> from my perspective who cares what the NTSB attributes the crash to.
>> Bill wont care. It wont bring him back. It wont stop people making
>> poor design choices in homebuilts.
>
>I respect your attitude, but I do not share it.
>
>For one thing, the Lancair Legacy is not a "one-of." There are over 100
>of them in the US registry alone. Bill had a "hired gun" build the
>Lancair; the man built at least three of them (in addition to at least
>one other type).
>
>So I think it's important that the current Legacy owners know whether
>there's a design flaw in the canopy latch. I think it's important for
>owners of the hired gun's other aircraft to know whether their builder
>had trouble getting the latch to work right.
>
>Almost fourteen years ago, Steve Wittman and his wife were killed in the
>crash of his O&O special. The accident resulted from his use of a mix
>of covering processes (Poly-fiber fabric attached with nitrate dope).
>
>Just *two weeks* ago, that accident was referenced in a Fly Baby mailing
>list discussion of covering and painting processes.
>
>About ten years ago, a very respected local homebuilder was killed. He
>died because he didn't tighten a nut.
>
>Every time I take a wrench to my airplane, I think of him and how even
>the best can make mistakes.
>
>So the lessons *do* get learned...but we need to do the research that
>reveals the truths. If we learn nothing from this accident, then Bill's
>death was a total waste.
>
>Ron Wanttaja

we actually dont disagree Ron. Just be kind to Janice when it is done.
she is not a machine and she can be damaged by the memories.
if finding the facts is painful for her then desist.
surely a builder of an aircraft can assess the suitability of the
latch on his aircraft for himself. builders usually have some nouse.

Stealth Pilot

[tom c[_3_]]

"John Ammeter" > wrote in message
news:cO2dnWwn7PqpnlrUnZ2dnUVZ_q_inZ2d@cablespeedmi .com...
>
> Tommy, maybe you ought to get a room so you can toss off a few for Billy,
> too....
>
Vegas has a desginated driver service. I'll be there.

[ທ້າວໃຂ່ມືດ]

On Mar 26, 12:34*am, John Ammeter >
wrote:
> She was in the airplane and suffered severe injuries... spent almost
> three months in the ICU, hospital, recovery center, etc...
>
> She has no memory of the accident or the day of the accident.
>
> John
>
> Stealth Pilot wrote:
> > On Sun, 22 Mar 2009 20:34:02 -0700, John Ammeter
> > > wrote:
>
> >> For those of you that are near to Las Vegas....
>
> >> The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary
> >> 6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm
> >> (702-464-8470) (800-542-2902)
>
> >> Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008
> >> near Parowan, Utah. *His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the
> >> accident.
>
> > Bill was a rascally ol' good cookie. no doubt about it.
>
> > what's happened to boom boom? she ok?
>
> > Stealth Pilot

Is she up and about and able to do things yet John or is she still
under care.

Monk

[John Ammeter]

Great, Tom... looking forward to seeing you again.

John

tom c wrote:
> "John Ammeter" > wrote in message
> news:cO2dnWwn7PqpnlrUnZ2dnUVZ_q_inZ2d@cablespeedmi .com...
>> Tommy, maybe you ought to get a room so you can toss off a few for Billy,
>> too....
>>
> Vegas has a desginated driver service. I'll be there.
>
>
>
>

[Monk]

On Mar 26, 12:34*am, John Ammeter >
wrote:
> She was in the airplane and suffered severe injuries... spent almost
> three months in the ICU, hospital, recovery center, etc...
>
> She has no memory of the accident or the day of the accident.
>
> John
>


Is she up and about and able to do things yet John or is she still
under care.

Monk

[John Ammeter]

?????????? wrote:
> On Mar 26, 12:34 am, John Ammeter >
> wrote:
>> She was in the airplane and suffered severe injuries... spent almost
>> three months in the ICU, hospital, recovery center, etc...
>>
>> She has no memory of the accident or the day of the accident.
>>
>> John
>>
>> Stealth Pilot wrote:
>>> On Sun, 22 Mar 2009 20:34:02 -0700, John Ammeter
>>> > wrote:
>>>> For those of you that are near to Las Vegas....
>>>> The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary
>>>> 6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm
>>>> (702-464-8470) (800-542-2902)
>>>> Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008
>>>> near Parowan, Utah. His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the
>>>> accident.
>>> Bill was a rascally ol' good cookie. no doubt about it.
>>> what's happened to boom boom? she ok?
>>> Stealth Pilot
>
> Is she up and about and able to do things yet John or is she still
> under care.
>
> Monk


She returned about a month ago to their home in Las Vegas. Still has
some medical procedures yet to be done.

John

[Monk]

On Mar 27, 7:23*pm, John Ammeter >
wrote:
> ?????????? wrote:
> > On Mar 26, 12:34 am, John Ammeter >
> > wrote:
> >> She was in the airplane and suffered severe injuries... spent almost
> >> three months in the ICU, hospital, recovery center, etc...
>
> >> She has no memory of the accident or the day of the accident.
>
> >> John
>
> >> Stealth Pilot wrote:
> >>> On Sun, 22 Mar 2009 20:34:02 -0700, John Ammeter
> >>> > wrote:
> >>>> For those of you that are near to Las Vegas....
> >>>> The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary
> >>>> 6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm
> >>>> (702-464-8470) (800-542-2902)
> >>>> Bill died in the crash of his homebuilt airplane on October 18, 2008
> >>>> near Parowan, Utah. *His wife, Janice, was severely injured in the
> >>>> accident.
> >>> Bill was a rascally ol' good cookie. no doubt about it.
> >>> what's happened to boom boom? she ok?
> >>> Stealth Pilot
>
> > Is she up and about and able to do things yet John or is she still
> > under care.
>
> > Monk
>
> She returned about a month ago to their home in Las Vegas. *Still has
> some medical procedures yet to be done.
>
> John

Thanks John.

Monk

[RST Engineering]

Will one or more of you privileged few take pictures and post them (Honeck's
site?) so that those of us prevented from hoisting in person can do so
vicariously?

Thanks,

Jim

--
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought
without accepting it."
--Aristotle


"John Ammeter" > wrote in message
news:cO2dnWwn7PqpnlrUnZ2dnUVZ_q_inZ2d@cablespeedmi .com...
> For those of you that are near to Las Vegas....
>
> The memorial service for Bill is April 18th (Saturday) at Palm Mortuary
> 6701 N. Jones Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89131 starting at 1:00pm (702-464-8470)
> (800-542-2902)

[Dan Camper]

On Tue, 24 Mar 2009 22:00:26 -0400, Peter Dohm wrote:

> "Dan Camper" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Mon, 23 Mar 2009 19:05:45 -0700, John Ammeter wrote:
>>
>>> Anyone that would like to join us in toasting Badwater
>>> Bill, the biggest Asshole that ever walked the Earth and flew through
>>> the skies... l
>>
>> May I?
>>
>> Question: Why is it when someone croaks there is always a "if you were
>> his friend" story? My bet is if it rains, no one will show for the
>> asshole's funeral.
>> --
>> http://tr.im/1f9p
>
> Bill was clearly one of those people that I wish I could have known and his
> usual usenet personality was a rather transparent put-on.

Then why is everyone calling him an asshole?
--
http://tr.im/1f9p

[Beauciphus]

"Dan Camper" > wrote in message
...

> Then why is everyone calling him an asshole?

In Bill's case, being an asshole was a minor flaw in his character.

In your case, being an asshole is all you've got to offer.

[Don Lewis]

"Beauciphus" > wrote in message
...
> "Dan Camper" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>> Then why is everyone calling him an asshole?
>
> In Bill's case, being an asshole was a minor flaw in his character.
>
> In your case, being an asshole is all you've got to offer.

WELL SAID !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Dan Camper]

On Wed, 25 Mar 2009 21:37:22 -0700, John Ammeter wrote:

> Dan Camper wrote:
>> On Tue, 24 Mar 2009 16:19:07 -0500, cavelamb wrote:
>>
>>> Dan Camper wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 23 Mar 2009 19:05:45 -0700, John Ammeter wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Anyone that would like to join us in toasting Badwater
>>>>> Bill, the biggest Asshole that ever walked the Earth and flew through
>>>>> the skies... l
>>>> May I?
>>>>
>>>> Question: Why is it when someone croaks there is always a "if you were
>>>> his friend" story? My bet is if it rains, no one will show for the
>>>> asshole's funeral.
>>> I guess you didn't know him...
>>
>> An asshole is an asshole.
> And I certainly recognize one right here... Bill "acted" like an
> asshole as his persona... you, obviously, are an asshole... Your Mother
> didn't much of a job raising you... too bad....

No, I'm only an asshole on Usenet.

Just like Asshole Bill.

Which makes you an AssClown got falsely accusing me. AssClown.
--
http://tr.im/1f9p

[Dan Camper]

On Sat, 28 Mar 2009 18:45:17 GMT, Beauciphus wrote:

> "Dan Camper" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>> Then why is everyone calling him an asshole?
>
> In Bill's case, being an asshole was a minor flaw in his character.
>
> In your case, being an asshole is all you've got to offer.

Oh no, I'm a double asshole with a Christian heart. Just like dead ole
Billy, the Asshole.
--
http://tr.im/1f9p

[Dan Camper]

On Sat, 28 Mar 2009 13:50:59 -0500, Don Lewis wrote:

> "Beauciphus" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Dan Camper" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>> Then why is everyone calling him an asshole?
>>
>> In Bill's case, being an asshole was a minor flaw in his character.
>>
>> In your case, being an asshole is all you've got to offer.
>
> WELL SAID !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

*CAPS ARE 4 QUUERS!*
--
http://tr.im/1f9p

[RST Engineering]

Did Maniac change names and move over to this ng?

Jim

--
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought
without accepting it."
--Aristotle



"Dan Camper" > wrote in message
...


>
> No, I'm only an asshole on Usenet.
>
> Just like Asshole Bill.
>
> Which makes you an AssClown got falsely accusing me. AssClown.
> --
> http://tr.im/1f9p

[tom c[_3_]]

"Dan Camper" > wrote in message
...
>
> Oh no, I'm a double asshole with a Christian heart. Just like dead ole
> Billy, the Asshole.
> --
> http://tr.im/1f9p

The difference is BWB was worth knowing and having as a friend and mentor.

tom c

[Morgans[_2_]]

"RST Engineering" > wrote in message
...
> Did Maniac change names and move over to this ng?
>
> Jim

No, I think this is an all new twerp.
--
Jim in NC

[Bob Fry]

>>>>> "RST" == RST Engineering > writes:

RST> Did Maniac change names and move over to this ng? Jim

Takes one to know one, huh Jimbo.
--
When you give food to the poor, they call you a saint. When you ask
why the poor have no food, they call you a communist.
~ Archbishop Helder Camara

[RST Engineering]

How about a postflight briefing on the Saturday night gig?

Jim

[John Ammeter]

As long as there's a designated sober person to record the events...
gotta find someone to wear the BWB buck teeth... and to have their bed
short sheeted... anyone up for a good BWAHAAAAHAAAA!!!??

John "anteater"....

RST Engineering wrote:
> How about a postflight briefing on the Saturday night gig?
>
> Jim
>
>

[Ed]

On Sun, 22 Mar 2009 20:34:02 -0700, John Ammeter
> wrote:


>
>Ed Sullivan, if you're still alive, come on over...
>
John, I won't be able to make it. I have an inescapable prior
committment. Hoist a dozen or so for me for my favorite curmudgeon.

[jl]

On Mar 26, 12:37*am, John Ammeter >
wrote:
>

I raise a toast to BWB, but John Antpeter and OR Seals are windbags.
Did charlatan O-ring ever learn how to do fabric heat-smoothing?
ROFLMAO!

[Steve Foley]

"jl" > wrote in message
...
On Mar 26, 12:37 am, John Ammeter >
wrote:
>

>I raise a toast to BWB,

I'll drink to Bill as well