Any Ballistic Recovery Chute Users?

[Ian]

I would be very interested, for professional reasons, to hear from
anyone who has used a ballistic recovery chute in a glider.

Ian

[Gregg Ballou]

At 00:14 04 April 2009, Ian wrote:
>I would be very interested, for professional reasons, to hear
from
>anyone who has used a ballistic recovery chute in a glider.
>
>Ian
>
Only one I've heard of was the sparrowhawk that broke during
highspeed flight testing. I believe the ballistic chute
attachments failed and the pilot used a regular parachute.
Story was in Soaring sometime in the last couple of years.

[Uncle Fuzzy]

On Apr 3, 6:00*pm, Gregg Ballou > wrote:
> At 00:14 04 April 2009, Ian wrote:>I would be very interested, for professional reasons, to hear
> from
> >anyone who has used a ballistic recovery chute in a glider.
>
> >Ian
>
> Only one I've heard of was the sparrowhawk that broke during
> highspeed flight testing. * I believe the ballistic chute
> attachments failed and the pilot used a regular parachute. *
> Story was in Soaring sometime in the last couple of years.

August '08 article in Soaring magazine "Lord, if You're Up There" was
written about that incident. Also read
http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Archive/Rec/rec.aviation.soaring/2008-08/msg00364.html

[Mark Jardini]

Apis Bee is sold with ballistic recovery as standard equipment. It has
a lower powered engine for German regulations than the Apis M. It is
available as an option on the M model. I have not heard of it being
used. I have not seen reference to the testing either....

Mark
Apis M 821AC

[ventus2[_2_]]

You may want to also contact Hanko Streifeneder who fitted the ballistic
chute to the Discus for purposes of testing and certification.
http://www.streifly.de/gesamtrettungssystem-e.htm

or their home page
http://www.streifly.de/home-e.htm

[Jim Logajan]

Ian > wrote:
> I would be very interested, for professional reasons, to hear from
> anyone who has used a ballistic recovery chute in a glider.

By "used" do you mean has one installed in their glider, or had to deploy
one due to an inflight emergency? I'm assuming the latter.

[Mike Bamberg]

On Apr 5, 2:58*pm, Jim Logajan > wrote:
> Ian > wrote:
> > I would be very interested, for professional reasons, to hear from
> > anyone who has used a ballistic recovery chute in a glider.
>
> By "used" do you mean has one installed in their glider, or had to deploy
> one due to an inflight emergency? I'm assuming the latter.


There has been at least one installed in an HP-16:

http://www.soaridaho.com/Schreder/HP-16/N8DC/BRS/BRS_in_HP-16.htm

[Jim Logajan]

Mike Bamberg > wrote:
> On Apr 5, 2:58*pm, Jim Logajan > wrote:
>> Ian > wrote:
>> > I would be very interested, for professional reasons, to hear from
>> > anyone who has used a ballistic recovery chute in a glider.
>>
>> By "used" do you mean has one installed in their glider, or had to
>> deploy one due to an inflight emergency? I'm assuming the latter.
>
>
> There has been at least one installed in an HP-16:
>
> http://www.soaridaho.com/Schreder/HP-16/N8DC/BRS/BRS_in_HP-16.htm

BRS, the most well known U.S. vendor of such chutes, keeps a list of "lives
saved" here:

http://brsparachutes.com/files/Documents/Lives-Saved.pdf

I see some hang gliders listed where BRS chutes were deployed, but I didn't
see any conventional gliders listed (but I'm not that familiar with model
names, so may have overlooked them.) My own search of the U.S. NTSB
database yielded two accidents where the aircraft had ballistic chutes
that proved of no value due to circumstances of the accidents - accident
IDs SEA04FA111 and DFW07LA006:

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20040625X00871&key=1
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20061030X01573&key=1

(The latter accident has already been mentioned.)

If one includes motorgliders, then all the Pipistrel and Lambada
motorgliders have ballistic chutes available either as standard equipment
or options, depending on the model:

http://www.mcp.com.au/pipistrel-usa/
http://www.urbanairusa.com/

[Martin Gregorie[_4_]]

On Sun, 05 Apr 2009 19:57:25 -0700, Mike Bamberg wrote:

> On Apr 5, 2:58Â*pm, Jim Logajan > wrote:
>> Ian > wrote:
>> > I would be very interested, for professional reasons, to hear from
>> > anyone who has used a ballistic recovery chute in a glider.
>>
>> By "used" do you mean has one installed in their glider, or had to
>> deploy one due to an inflight emergency? I'm assuming the latter.
>
>
> There has been at least one installed in an HP-16:
>
> http://www.soaridaho.com/Schreder/HP-16/N8DC/BRS/BRS_in_HP-16.htm

Is it just me or is that BRS set up likely to fail on deployment?

I notice that the parachute risers pass round round the front of the
angle extrusion carrying the shoulder straps without, apparently, any
protection to stop the metal edge from cutting the webbing.


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

[The Real Doctor]

On 5 Apr, 22:58, Jim Logajan > wrote:
> Ian > wrote:
> > I would be very interested, for professional reasons, to hear from
> > anyone who has used a ballistic recovery chute in a glider.
>
> By "used" do you mean has one installed in their glider, or had to deploy
> one due to an inflight emergency? I'm assuming the latter.

Yup, the latter. Someone who has actually pressed the Big Red Button.

Ian

[Jim Logajan]

The Real Doctor > wrote:
> On 5 Apr, 22:58, Jim Logajan > wrote:
>> Ian > wrote:
>> > I would be very interested, for professional reasons, to hear from
>> > anyone who has used a ballistic recovery chute in a glider.
>>
>> By "used" do you mean has one installed in their glider, or had to
>> deploy one due to an inflight emergency? I'm assuming the latter.
>
> Yup, the latter. Someone who has actually pressed the Big Red Button.

Actually I think you have to pull a handle with about 35 lbs of force. ;-)

[Darryl Ramm]

On Apr 5, 8:27*pm, Jim Logajan > wrote:
> Mike Bamberg > wrote:
> > On Apr 5, 2:58*pm, Jim Logajan > wrote:
> >> Ian > wrote:
> >> > I would be very interested, for professional reasons, to hear from
> >> > anyone who has used a ballistic recovery chute in a glider.
>
> >> By "used" do you mean has one installed in their glider, or had to
> >> deploy one due to an inflight emergency? I'm assuming the latter.
>
> > There has been at least one installed in an HP-16:
>
> >http://www.soaridaho.com/Schreder/HP-16/N8DC/BRS/BRS_in_HP-16.htm
>
> BRS, the most well known U.S. vendor of such chutes, keeps a list of "lives
> saved" here:
>
> http://brsparachutes.com/files/Documents/Lives-Saved.pdf
>
> I see some hang gliders listed where BRS chutes were deployed, but I didn't
> see any conventional gliders listed (but I'm not that familiar with model
> names, so may have overlooked them.) My own search of the U.S. NTSB
> database yielded two accidents *where the aircraft had ballistic chutes
> that proved of no value due to circumstances of the accidents - accident
> IDs SEA04FA111 and DFW07LA006:
>
> http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20040625X00871&key=1http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20061030X01573&key=1
>
> (The latter accident has already been mentioned.)
>
> If one includes motorgliders, then all the Pipistrel and Lambada
> motorgliders have ballistic chutes available either as standard equipment
> or options, depending on the model:
>
> http://www.mcp.com.au/pipistrel-usa/http://www.urbanairusa.com/

I suspect there are several more. Examples include -

Failure to activate BRS in a spin...
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20020502X00613

BRS failure due to activation at excessive speed (likely loss of
control due to icing in IMC).
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20050222X00211
http://www.flyingmag.com/accidents/790/unknown-icing-conditions.html
(This accident is pretty horrible and the whole issue of flight into
know icing, the capability of the TKS system in the Cirrus etc. got
widely discussed because of this. In hindsight the (lack of) icing
forecast provided to the pilot was just awful).

I think BRS systems are pretty impressive and the goal here should be
to understand the capabilities of a BRS system, and the need to be
willing to use it under appropriate situations. So please also focus
on the lives saved/success stories.

And I also hope people read the Windward Owl in-flight failure and
what that glider had been through in the test program as an
endorsement of the capability of that impressive Sparrowhawk glider on
which the Owl is based, when pushed well beyond its design limits.


Darryl

[The Real Doctor]

On 6 Apr, 17:26, Jim Logajan > wrote:
> The Real Doctor > wrote:

> > Yup, the latter. Someone who has actually pressed the Big Red Button.
>
> Actually I think you have to pull a handle with about 35 lbs of force. ;-)

I'm disappointed. Next you'll be telling me that it doesn't have a big
digital countdown. LEDs, of course.

Ian

[The Real Doctor]

On 6 Apr, 18:23, Darryl Ramm > wrote:

> I think BRS systems are pretty impressive and the goal here should be
> to understand the capabilities of a BRS system, and the need to be
> willing to use it under appropriate situations. So please also focus
> on the lives saved/success stories.

That is very much the intention of the work for which I am interested
in this. I'm sorry to be opaque, but will happily explain just what's
going on to anyone who cares to email and ask!

Ian