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-   -   Busted TFR, what to expect? (http://www.aviationbanter.com/showthread.php?t=38212)

bob May 25th 06 12:35 AM

Busted TFR, what to expect?
 
Seems I busted a VIP TFR Monday near Sacramento (VP Cheney was in town
raising money for a couple of congressmen). On landing at my
destination I was asked by the airport manager to call an ATC number,
who got my info and said they would forward it to the local FSDO as a
"pilot deviation". I'm not disputing that I indeed was ignorant of the
TFR and violated it.

So what can I expect? I've already figured out that the Secret Service
isn't going to arrest me. My biggest concern is what it will do to my
insurance costs when I renew next year. Should I bother filing the
NASA ASRS form? Since I'm a PP-ASEL and flying is a hobby, I don't
otherwise care a lot if my license is suspended for a time or I end up
with a record.


Dave Stadt May 25th 06 12:55 AM

Busted TFR, what to expect?
 

"bob" wrote in message
oups.com...
Seems I busted a VIP TFR Monday near Sacramento (VP Cheney was in town
raising money for a couple of congressmen). On landing at my
destination I was asked by the airport manager to call an ATC number,
who got my info and said they would forward it to the local FSDO as a
"pilot deviation". I'm not disputing that I indeed was ignorant of the
TFR and violated it.

So what can I expect? I've already figured out that the Secret Service
isn't going to arrest me. My biggest concern is what it will do to my
insurance costs when I renew next year. Should I bother filing the
NASA ASRS form? Since I'm a PP-ASEL and flying is a hobby, I don't
otherwise care a lot if my license is suspended for a time or I end up
with a record.


Definitely fill out a NASA report. The couple of people I know that have
busted TFRs (President not VP) have had nothing done other than a couple of
questions. I don't see how insurance companies could care, you didn't cost
them anything.




John Doe May 25th 06 01:59 AM

Busted TFR, what to expect?
 

"bob" wrote in message
oups.com...
Seems I busted a VIP TFR Monday near Sacramento (VP Cheney was in town
raising money for a couple of congressmen). On landing at my
destination I was asked by the airport manager to call an ATC number,
who got my info and said they would forward it to the local FSDO as a
"pilot deviation". I'm not disputing that I indeed was ignorant of the
TFR and violated it.

So what can I expect? I've already figured out that the Secret Service
isn't going to arrest me. My biggest concern is what it will do to my
insurance costs when I renew next year. Should I bother filing the
NASA ASRS form? Since I'm a PP-ASEL and flying is a hobby, I don't
otherwise care a lot if my license is suspended for a time or I end up
with a record.


I had my first experience with a VIP TFR last weekend. Bush was in town and
I had gotten an email from AOPA notifying me of the TFR in my area. I
thought that was awesome that I got advance notice through email.

Anyway, I do my normal flight planning and sure enough, the TFR is active
over the top of my non-towered airfield.

I go out to the airfield, and for some strange reason, I kind of expected
the FBO to have posted something, somewhere, that there was an active TFR
over the top of this airfield, but nope, nothing. I'm not even sure anyone
at the FBO knew it was there.

I was just slightly suprised. So for all the pilots out there who don't
religously check the NOTAMS immediately before takeoff, you can all too
easily be bitten by a TFR.

Had my airfield been 2nm closer to the event, I would have been within the
restricted airspace and could have facen the worst case reprocutions if I
busted the airspace.

Luckily, I've learned to check NOTAMS prior to every flight, and following
the procedures, the TFR didn't delay me at all in getting on my way.




Bob Fry May 25th 06 02:54 AM

Busted TFR, what to expect?
 
"JD" == John Doe writes:

JD I had my first experience with a VIP TFR last weekend. Bush
JD was in town and I had gotten an email from AOPA notifying me
JD of the TFR in my area.

Bush was in Sacto a few weeks ago and I too got the AOPA notification
by email. Because of that, and checking the extent of that TFR, I
decided not to risk it and simply didn't fly that weekend.

But for the TFR I violated, I didn't get a notice from AOPA. Why, I'm
not sure. And the local newspaper had nothing about Cheney's visit
until afterwards so I didn't know he was in town.

JD Luckily, I've learned to check NOTAMS prior to every flight,
JD and following the procedures, the TFR didn't delay me at all
JD in getting on my way.

I rarely check NOTAMS or get a briefing for local VFR flights, and
quite honestly I doubt I'll change my habits. The FAA should
recognize that using NOTAMs alone are not enough. Maybe they should
take email addresses and locations from pilots (kinda like AOPA) and
send notices when a TFR is going to pop up in a given area.

Maybe they could reserve a frequency just to broadcast important area
NOTAMs. Pilots would get in the habit of checking it before takeoff
and during flight. Maybe area NOTAMs could be added on to AWOS
broadcasts. Something?


Jon A May 25th 06 02:57 AM

Busted TFR, what to expect?
 
Your punishment is to go dove hunting with Cheney next year. That'll
teach ya!

On 24 May 2006 16:35:39 -0700, "bob" wrote:

Seems I busted a VIP TFR Monday near Sacramento (VP Cheney was in town
raising money for a couple of congressmen). On landing at my
destination I was asked by the airport manager to call an ATC number,
who got my info and said they would forward it to the local FSDO as a
"pilot deviation". I'm not disputing that I indeed was ignorant of the
TFR and violated it.

So what can I expect? I've already figured out that the Secret Service
isn't going to arrest me. My biggest concern is what it will do to my
insurance costs when I renew next year. Should I bother filing the
NASA ASRS form? Since I'm a PP-ASEL and flying is a hobby, I don't
otherwise care a lot if my license is suspended for a time or I end up
with a record.



Roy Smith May 25th 06 03:07 AM

Busted TFR, what to expect?
 
In article , Bob Fry
wrote:

I rarely check NOTAMS or get a briefing for local VFR flights, and
quite honestly I doubt I'll change my habits. The FAA should
recognize that using NOTAMs alone are not enough.


There are lots of problems with the notam system. Still, it is the
official way the FAA notifies pilots of things like TFRs. If you're going
to stick your head in the sand and say you're not going to check for
notams, you deserve what you get when you bust a TFR.

Jerry May 25th 06 03:21 AM

Busted TFR, what to expect?
 
I usually check this FAA web page to see if there is a local TFR.

http://tfr.faa.gov/tfr_map_ims/html/index.html

Jerry in NC


"Bob Fry" wrote in message
...
"JD" == John Doe writes:


JD I had my first experience with a VIP TFR last weekend. Bush
JD was in town and I had gotten an email from AOPA notifying me
JD of the TFR in my area.

Bush was in Sacto a few weeks ago and I too got the AOPA notification
by email. Because of that, and checking the extent of that TFR, I
decided not to risk it and simply didn't fly that weekend.

But for the TFR I violated, I didn't get a notice from AOPA. Why, I'm
not sure. And the local newspaper had nothing about Cheney's visit
until afterwards so I didn't know he was in town.

JD Luckily, I've learned to check NOTAMS prior to every flight,
JD and following the procedures, the TFR didn't delay me at all
JD in getting on my way.

I rarely check NOTAMS or get a briefing for local VFR flights, and
quite honestly I doubt I'll change my habits. The FAA should
recognize that using NOTAMs alone are not enough. Maybe they should
take email addresses and locations from pilots (kinda like AOPA) and
send notices when a TFR is going to pop up in a given area.

Maybe they could reserve a frequency just to broadcast important area
NOTAMs. Pilots would get in the habit of checking it before takeoff
and during flight. Maybe area NOTAMs could be added on to AWOS
broadcasts. Something?




Peter R. May 25th 06 03:28 AM

Busted TFR, what to expect?
 
Bob Fry wrote:

snip
Maybe they could reserve a frequency just to broadcast important area
NOTAMs. Pilots would get in the habit of checking it before takeoff
and during flight.


If a pilot cannot get in the habit of checking NOTAMs and TFRs before local
VFR flights using the current methods, what makes you think these same
pilots would get in the habit of checking a frequency for them?

--
Peter

Jonathan Goodish May 25th 06 03:40 AM

Busted TFR, what to expect?
 
In article .com,
"bob" wrote:

Seems I busted a VIP TFR Monday near Sacramento (VP Cheney was in town
raising money for a couple of congressmen). On landing at my
destination I was asked by the airport manager to call an ATC number,
who got my info and said they would forward it to the local FSDO as a
"pilot deviation". I'm not disputing that I indeed was ignorant of the
TFR and violated it.

So what can I expect? I've already figured out that the Secret Service
isn't going to arrest me. My biggest concern is what it will do to my
insurance costs when I renew next year. Should I bother filing the
NASA ASRS form? Since I'm a PP-ASEL and flying is a hobby, I don't
otherwise care a lot if my license is suspended for a time or I end up
with a record.



My advice would be to check the FAA's graphic TFR list at
http://tfr.faa.gov/tfr2/list.html prior to every flight.

If you can't (or won't) do that, I'm not sure what to tell you. It's
super easy. If your habits don't change, chances are that you will
continue to bust TFRs, and doing so may eventually result in more
serious consequences.



JKG

Robert M. Gary May 25th 06 03:56 AM

Busted TFR, what to expect?
 
My student was flying that day too. I didn't get an email from AOPA and
there was nothing in the paper. However the ATIS (SAC) reported the
airport was closed.



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