Michael wrote:
Dave Butler wrote

My question above was directed to a poster who seemed to be expressing an
opinion based on no experience.


I've never owned a leased-back plane. Until fairly recently, I've
never had a root canal done either. However, I know quite a few
people who have owned leasebacks. I also know quite a few people who
had root canals done. Interestingly, my impression of what it was
like to get a root canal wasn't really changed much by having one -
the impression I got from my friends was pretty accurate. It was
painful and expensive, as are most root canals, and to be avoided if
possible. Much the same applies to leasebacks.


With a leaseback, you are whatever the terms of the lease say you are.
If you don't like the terms of the lease, don't sign it.


True but disingenuous. You are highly unlikely to get favorable
terms.

I don't take kindly to being called disingenuous. Let's elevate this discussion
above name-calling, OK? You've made a lot of valuable contributions to this
group, Michael, but calling people disingenuous because they don't agree with
your position is not a positive contribution.

I stand by my position. You're not likely to get favorable terms if you just
accept the terms that are offered. You're free to negotiate any terms you like.
If you don't get what you want, you are free to walk away.


The reality is that there isn't much (if any) money to be made in
airplane rental.

Quite true.

The money is made by selling fuel, maintenance,
tiedown/hangar space, and maybe instruction. The rental airplanes are
just there to keep the business going.


The advantage might be that you gain experience in aircraft ownership
while reducing your out-of-pocket expense.


Untrue. The only experience in aircraft ownership you will gain is
the experience of writing checks.

....and this is based on your experience of -no- leasebacks?

You will be paying huge money for
insurance that allows rental. This can easily double or triple your
fixed costs.

That's why you collect rent for the use of your aircraft. Assuming, of course,
that your lease contract requires -you- to pay for the insurance.

Of course that means the plane has to keep flying to
generate revenue, and that means you can't wait until you have time to
fix it yourself. The result is that you don't actually learn to fix
anything - which is the most important part of gaining experience in
aircraft ownership.

.... in your opinion.



Heck, it's even possible to come out financially ahead.


I suppose it might be possible. I've never seen it happen.

I've seen the occasional mechanic who did all or almost all his own
maintenance come out ahead - by assuming his time was worth nothing.
I have NEVER seen a first-time owner come out ahead on a leaseback.


My point is not that it's impossible to have a good experience with a
leaseback - but anyone who has to ask about it on the net is not going
to have a good experience, and that's certain.

.... in your opinion.