wrote:



Cessna "Airport B tower, this is Cessna 123, 2000 off of airport A, 10
miles North, inbound landing with kilo"

Tower "Roger, Cessna, you will be number 2 for runway 21R, follow
Cherokee traffic at your 11 O'Clock, you also have Cherokee traffic
transitioning at your 2 O'Clock, and Skyhawk traffic inbound on the ILS
for the parallel. Maintain visual separation."

All is fine except for the maintain visual separation part. That makes
no sense, even if you did have all the aircraft is sight.



Tower "Cessna, what are you doing out there?"

Cessna "Tower, that Cherokee isn't making much progress, we're making a
couple 360s for spacing"

Very bad on the Cessna's part.


Tower (in a nasty tone) "Negative Cessna! You're following the wrong
Cherokee. You need my permission before making any maneuvers like
that. If you are inbound, you need to be a direct heading *to* my
airport. You can't be doing that kind of stuff without telling me."

The controller should have made sure the Cessna was following the right
aircraft but he's right about the 360's. Cessna pilot should have
called before starting manuvers like that.



[pause]

Cessna "Tower, I was following the Cherokee that was at my 11. Sorry
if I got the wrong one. But sir, I am VFR, *outside* of your
airspace...if I feel the need to do a 360 to maintain safe spacing,
that's exactly what I will do...I'm outside of your airspace. I don't
need your permission to do *anything* until I enter it. Turning 210 for
landing now"

He's technically right but practically wrong.


I also told him that it usually wasn't a good idea to have an
altercation like that on the radio. That if the pilot wanted to talk to
the controller about that, he should have waited until he was on the
ground, and called the tower and asked to speak with a supervisor.


Probably no supervisor at the tower except the tower manager himself.
It would be a good idea to call him and give him the time and let him
listen to the tapes and tell you what he thinks. If this is a recurring
problem ask for a meeting with the manager. If he won't give you one go
over his head to the nearest FAA tower and ask the same thing.


I
also told him that the other CFI 'probably' should have told the
controller what he was doing as a matter of 'courtesy',

More for safety than courtesy.


and that if he
wasn't absolutely sure which Cherokee to follow, he should have told
the controller that he'd remain outside of his airspace until the tower
told him the traffic was clear, and then turn in.

Always ask if you're not sure.




Plus, it isnt a good
idea to alienate the ATC guys in your own area....they can make life
'interesting' sometimes.

Yep, we do that.