"Toņo" wrote in message
...
Blanche wrote:
And what happens if the engine conks out? Where do you land? How do you
land?
Maybe he should also take glider lessons, mountain survival, parachuting,
and aerobatics prior to the flight. I mean, those disciplines have just
as much relevance if not more should a forced landing be immanent.
How does a knowledge of mountain flying help you to land with and engine
out? And how would that differ from any other no-engine landing?
About the only thing I could think of would be to try to estimate winds
and direction based on terrain features. Read Sparky's book and you have
some theory to work off of but, really....do you think that this would
sufficiently arm you for an encounter with the winds in the mountains? If
you do then you have never flown *in* the mountains!
As far as *where* you land...you land wherever you can; as in
non-mountainous terrain.
And when that happens, all of a sudden you need to worry about
mountain waves, density altitude, valley winds, etc. Calculate
glide distance from 16K and tell me where & how you're going to
land.
Well...if you know how far you can glide at 1000 ft you can multiply by
sixteen. But that calculation would only give you the no-wind theoretical
distance. It also something every pilot should know regardless of whether
they are in the mountains or not.
And, come on! Are you really going to pull out the ole' whiz wheel and
think about "...density altitude, valley winds, etc." when you are
dead-sticking it to a suitable landing site? Generally, you *might* have
one place to land that is suitable and you can bet your gold-plated E6B
you'll take it regardless of the "density altitude".
I have always considered mountain flying to be flying *in* the mountains
and the things that concern a mountain pilot to be at or below the peaks.
Is this incorrect?
yes.
Really? And minus the engine out scenario, you think the guy cruising
over the peaks at 16-19,000 ft is in need of *mountain flying* skills?
That ain't *mountain flying* in my book...neither is it in
Sparký's.(Which, I agree, is a great book!)
Sorry, but I respectfully disagree.
Antonio
Yes and well said. I have lived and flown in mountianous terrain for almost
as long as I have been flying. Like Peter R's proposed trip, I am mostly
flying "over the mountains" from one real airport to another. You don't
need "mountain flying'" instruction to do this kind of flying, you need some
common sense and weather awareness and you have to recognize your
limitations and the limitations of your equipment. If you are going to be
flying into backcountry airstrips in ID where you are actually flying "in
and amongst" the mountains you need more awareness and mountain flying
training can be benificial. If you are going to be landing on "one way"
strips or operating on skiis then training becomes a necessity.
Flying accidents in the mountains usually involve a lot of risk taking or
improper IFR procedures. It is not the mountains themselves that cause the
problem, they just provide the unforgiving terrain that makes the outcome
fatal. When pilots take off with high winds at ridge level, IMC or
thunderstorms in low performance aircraft they have no "outs". They can't
climb to smooth air, they can't control the airplane the turbulence and they
hit something. Some simply take off on a perfect day at a density altitude
beyond the airplane capibility and crash into the first trees off the end of
the runway. Many "mountain" accidents are caused by improper IFR
proceedure. There is an approach into Butte, MT that has a turn at the VOR.
A few miles away there is a mountain with several wrecked airplanes on it
that didn't make the turn. None of these things applies to Peter R's flight
from one paved airport to another in a turbocharged Bonanza flying in day
VMC unless he feels the need to operate over gross weight.
All the focus on landing in the mountains after and engine failure baffles
me. I know of exactly one meadow suitable for landing a high performance
single in the Sierra. A pilot with 2000hrs of flying time over the Sierra
flying charter at 12-14,000' (lower than I fly) says that there are, in
fact, two such meadows. Unless you are flying a Super Cub type airplane,
you can pretty much forget about walking away from an engine out "landing"
in the Sierra.
Mike
MU-2 for flying "over" the mountains
Helio Courier H295 for flying "in" the mountains.
|