I agrre with most of this except the exceed VNe bit.
The damger from exceeding VNe is flutter and flutter
WILL break the aircraft. I think the last paragraph
is the only option.

The only time a pilot (test pilots excepted) is likely
to experience a spin in a big wing aeroplane is if
it happens accidentally. Non aerobatic means no deliberate
spinning (in the UK anyway) which means there is no
opportunity to practice. Makes prevention and early
recognition even more vital.

At 16:00 24 June 2005, Bill Gribble wrote:
Stefan writes
Wrong. Neither of the two would have done any damage.
They broke the
glider by doing both things at the same time.

No. With the Spanish tragedy the pilots didn't open
the airbrakes but
the P1 broke the wings by pulling back too hard. Presumably
it wasn't
necessarily Vne that broke the wings but excessive
load (pulling back
too hard in a panic) once past maximum maneuvouring
speed? Given the
P1's self-confessed lack of currency in spin-training
(paraphrased from
memory; 'did it once twenty years ago and swore never
again') is it fair
to say that without the panic from an unpractised situation
the spin and
resulting dive recovery might not have broken the wings?
Limiting your
spin recovery to just pulling back hard is going to
have unfortunate
consequences which ever way it turns out. That said,
it was a terrible
thing to happen and my heart really does go out to
the pilot and his
family.

The Minden tragedy involved opened airbrakes which
in turn contributed
to breaking the wing. Still from pulling back too hard,
but in quite
different circumstances where 'too hard' might not
have been so apparent
because of the reduction in wing area and thus perceived
wing-loading.
But had the airbrakes not been out the wing might have
sustained the
load. Though Vne may then have been passed.

So it would seem the answer is to not open the airbrakes
but respect the
yellow band on your ASI when loading the aircraft with
g. Even if this
means passing through Vne?

Or, if you do open the airbrakes in a last ditch attempt
to avoid
breaching Vne be even more respectful with the loading
when pulling out
of the dive. But, between the devil and the deep blue
sea you're better
off not having stepped out onto the gunwale in the
first place


--
Bill Gribble
http://www.scapegoatsanon.demon.co.uk
- Learn from the mistakes of others.
- You won't live long enough to make all of them yourself.