"Robert M. Gary" wrote:
As a CFI I've flown around wx with non-IFR pilots on many occasions.
Its amazing how far some VFR pilots push themselves once they are in
the air. I think because they don't see wx that often they don't
realize how quick things can go South.

It is amazing, isn't it?

I remember a flight I did with a private pilot maybe a year ago. As I
recall, this was his 2nd or 3rd flight with me, working on passing a BFR.
He wasn't instrument rated and exhibited marginal VFR skills.

I try to impress on my students that I want to see them display PIC
decision making capability. In particular, I tell them that THEY will make
the go/no-go decision based on weather, not me. Sometimes that means we
launch into conditions that don't make a lot of sense for them, but I like
to give them a bit of rope.

It was a cruddy VFR day. I don't remember it exactly, but something like
030 OVC 020 SCT 6SM sounds about right, and forecast to get worse later in
the day. Legal VFR, but not the kind of weather I'd like to see a VFR-only
pilot leave the pattern. I gave him his rope and he took it.

We were working on pilotage. I had him fly us from OXC (Oxford, CT) to 44N
(Sky Acres, NY). For those not familiar with the area, this is about a 30
mile flight with some small hills you need to get over. I had him pull out
a sectional and show me the route. We talked about cloud ceilings and
terrain heights. I dropped as many hints as I could think of and still
couldn't ignite a spark of recognition about how close those two nunmbers
were. So, off we went.

As we got closer to the hills, I pointed out that I could see them in the
distance and their tops looked about at our altitude. I practically had to
hit him over the head with a clue-by-four to get him to climb a little.
Then I started asking him questions like "What kind of airspace are we in?"
How much below the clouds do we need to be to be legal?" "How close do you
think we are to those clouds?" I kept getting vague answers. Finally, I
pointed out the side window and said, "Do you see that little cloud off our
wingtip? Doesn't it look like it's *below* our altitude"? "Do you think
this is smart what we're doing?" I still couldn't get anything useful out
of him.

The mind boggles.

And, no, I didn't sign him off.