View Single Post
  #12  
Old January 6th 07, 02:31 PM posted to rec.aviation.ifr
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 46
Default Implications of.....keeping the speed up

Just to clarify, I have no moving map, so no depiction of class D C B.
Hence my inquiry on whether it's normal for pilots to have out class
B and low level charts. To clarify, this was flown in hi airspace,
and yes we had our hi enroute out, but it is of little help.

Re check in real time:
I presume you mean as I said by tuning in the ewr vor and monitoring
radials and dme.

Re plan in advance, it's just not always possible. This was a quick
trip, filed from Southern Ontario Canada, no prefered route available,
and the one we chose to file was from CYYZ. No surprise, we didn't
get the route we expected, with CLE centre re routing/vectoring us
enroute. then via vectors (NY) for the arrival. So.... descending 60
west of TEB at 6000 feet at 250 kias, did I break the max 200 kias
within 4 nm and 2500 AGL? I've no idea, perhaps. Hence my inquiry on
how others handle this situation.

Re not knowing how close I am to controlled airspace:
I'd think this is mostly class E airspace I'm in, and is controlled,
isn't it? And I know exactly where I am; I'm 59 dme from the TEB dme,
on the 275 radial. And I'm just setting up my fms for the ils 06 Teb,
so I know the XYZ IF is bearing ABC degress for DEF miles. I just
don't know the distance before I enter the EWR class B airspace. And
nor do I know whether in fact, due to altitude changes, I may end up
under it. Note I'm not saying I can't find out, I just didn't have a
low chart out at this point.

See a few comments further below

If you have RNAV capability and moving maps (like a GPS unit), you
don't need to, since your instruments will show you the controlled
airspaces and tell you if you are within them. If you don't have
that, you might or might not have time to check in real time,
You can also plan your flight in advance and check all of these
details so that you will know where you are at all times without
having to check charts in flight. If you have no idea at all how
close you are to controlled airspace, you need to work on your
navigation and planning skills before you go anywhere near airports of
significant size.


Secondly, if this is reference the elevation of the primary airport,
who really continuously looks up airport elevations as they go (and
airports may be 3 or 4000 msl west of Teb in the appalachians I
presume) adds 2500, and ensures they are above this altitude.


It's above the ground below you. And some areas are quite flat. And
you may have a radar altimeter that lets you know how far you are
above the ground. If you are VFR, you may be able to judge your
altitude well enough by visual means alone.

West of Teb is not that flat. And my altimeter comes alive at 2000
agl. And often IMC.

Further, if I'm descended early into TEB, as expected for an arrival
into the NE, and am at 6000 msl 60 miles to the west, is atc really
expecting a sudden decrease to 200 this far out?


Why would it be sudden? If it comes as a surprise to you while you
are flying along, there's something wrong. And if you are flying below
2500 AGL, you're probably either in the military or you have a small
plane that can't do much better than 200 kts, anyway.


It's not a surprise to me, and perhaps sudden is too harsh a word.
Typically I descend below 10000 at 250 kias. When I want to slow to
200, if possible I aim to pull throttles to idle, and decrease the
descent rate. I'm thinking that since atc is vectoring me, the
planned separation from other aircraft may be reduced by my perhaps
unanticipated speed reduction that far out. Just a thought.

Well thanks for your inputs. I found them useful. I am 100% sure
that corporate pilots do NOT have low level charts out, nor Class B
charts on these trips. I gather from here that in order to ensure
these speed limits are followed, one needs both, plus perhaps a
sectional for the 2500 AGL limitation.

Thanks to Roy too for his response.
Stan